Jim Lawson's Art

[Donnie]

Hey everyone...I say this very reluctantly, but I really do not care for Jim Lawson's Turtles. In a way, in my opinion, volume 4 took a hit by being drawn solely by Lawson (at least to my knowledge it was).

I know most here aren't going to agree, but I figured I would see if anybody else had the same opinion. I just think his Turtles are way too bulky and square. I much prefer the original E & L artwork from the first few issues. To me, they look the most like mutated Turtles in those issues...and maybe it's also because it's the original/source Turtles. I just love that art. But yeah, Jim Lawson, not so much. :ohwell:

[Jester]

It depends really. Early Lawson work can be great. Some of it, like his work in the Archie comics is hit or miss. By the time vol 4 came around...i couldn't stand his style. Not my cup of tea.

[Powder]

Man, I'm sick of everyone always ragging on Jim. If you don't like it, you don't like it.
Are his turtles a little too angluar for my preferance? Sure, but I still love them.
His style is unmatched, and that's why I like it. No one else draws like him.

[Venom]

[Insert typical response criticizing Jim's style]

[Begin objective view on Jim's style being unique, him being a great writer, and how I grew to appreciate it.]

[End with snarky retort about this being a tired subject.]

[Archon_Turtle]

[Insert typical response criticizing Jim's style]

[Begin objective view on Jim's style being unique, him being a great writer, and how I grew to appreciate it.]

[End with snarky retort about this being a tired subject.]

^^^^^^^^^ This.

[jaymq]

To be honest, until recently, I hadn't known there was anyone else who disliked his art. So, I don't understand why the comments complaining that people are voicing how they feel about Lawson's work. I've only seen a few people actually publicly voice their opinions. but...

It depends really. Early Lawson work can be great. Some of it, like his work in the Archie comics is hit or miss. By the time vol 4 came around...i couldn't stand his style. Not my cup of tea.

this is pretty much how I feel too.

[FearlessLeader]

To be honest, until recently, I hadn't known there was anyone else who disliked his art. So, I don't understand why the comments complaining that people are voicing how they feel about Lawson's work. I've only seen a few people actually publicly voice their opinions. but...


If you do a search I am certain you can find quiet a few topics on this subject, along with simply reading the letters page in the back of any volume 4 comic there is always at least one person complaining about Jim's style.

It at this point just feels like beating a dead horse. Some people like his style (like myself) some people don't. Neither side is going to change the others opinion and we just keep going around in this circle of the same people saying almost the same things.

*shrugs*

[Donnie]

It depends really. Early Lawson work can be great. Some of it, like his work in the Archie comics is hit or miss. By the time vol 4 came around...i couldn't stand his style. Not my cup of tea.

I agree! I did like some of his art in the earlier days.


So, I don't understand why the comments complaining that people are voicing how they feel about Lawson's work. I've only seen a few people actually publicly voice their opinions.

Yeah. This *is* a place to share opinions about the Turtles and their legacy, right? I mean, there was a recent "who is your favorite Turtle?" poll/thread, and I'll be darned if that isn't a common topic. My intention wasn't to start a debate between the two camps, I just wanted to hear some other opinions. But it comes with the territory, I suppose. I didn't see anything about this on page 1 of this sub-forum - sorry for not running a search. Didn't think it was a big deal.

[jaymq]

If you do a search I am certain you can find quiet a few topics on this subject, along with simply reading the letters page in the back of any volume 4 comic there is always at least one person complaining about Jim's style.

It at this point just feels like beating a dead horse. Some people like his style (like myself) some people don't. Neither side is going to change the others opinion and we just keep going around in this circle of the same people saying almost the same things.

*shrugs*

Maybe, I think I only recall one topic about it before this. As for the comics, I read the comics themselves, very rarely will I read comments section because more often than not, they don't interest me.

I can understand that, but there's always people coming into the fandom or the forum or may not have seen other topics about certain things... and I'm sure there are many other reasons why someone would start a topic about something that's 'been done'. It's not a rare thing.

Just find it a bit bothersome when someone posts in a thread only to proclaim their dislike for said thread. No one's being hurt by this topic, so there's really no point in advocating against it.

Annnd getting off my podium now...

[azrael]

I didnt like it at first (compared to other comics) but it grew on me it gave the tmnt their own universe. I enjoy his art people look like people different and not drop dead gorgeous with DDD breast sizes (which wouldnt bother me if it was like that in the real world). Its unique, edgy, and awesome.

[FearlessLeader]

Just find it a bit bothersome when someone posts in a thread only to proclaim their dislike for said thread. No one's being hurt by this topic, so there's really no point in advocating against it.

Annnd getting off my podium now...

Would you rather I come in here ranting my dislike for people not appreciating Jim's art? I could have, it would have been on topic and it would have accomplished nothing. I know because I have done just that in this topic at other times. It just leads to people fighting and getting annoyed with one another. I think a lot of us have seen that happen with this topic on here more so then maybe almost any other topic in the fandom and that is why people have bothered to say anything.

You're completely right it's not a rare thing for subjects to come up over and over again, in the infinite universe there are only so many topics we can cover before we start repeating ourselves.

At the same time people starting new topics have to accept that at times people will say things about repeating pass conversation to them. Search functions would not have been invented for forums otherwise.

[Slap-Happy]

The thing I hate most about Jim's turtles are those damn beaks.

[Powder]

The thing I hate most about Jim's turtles are those damn beaks.

As far as I can recall, the only the artists rendition of the turtles to have real beaks were Zulli's & Bodes, to an extent.

Whatcha talkin' about?

[discordiatookie]

I'm a mad Lawson fan, personally. I totally dig his style.

[ssjup81]

Wait, which comic did he do the art for again? ^^;

[Bjarni]

I loved all of his early TMNT work with Mirage, Tales and Volume 2. His writing in particular. But his artwork was also amazing.

I also liked his work with Archie and most, if not all of his work with Volume 4.
I thought some of his work in Volume 2 of Tales wasn't that good. Some of it seemed rushed, but whenever he was back on Volume 4, I liked his take on the Turtles.

But yeah, liked pretty much everything outside of some Tales of the TMNT Vol. 2 stuff. Including the new pin ups and short story in the Tales of the TMNT Vol. 1 Trade that Mirage released a couple of years back.

[Abnormal Freak]

I like Jim's art. A lot. One of my favorite comic book artists, and his comics look far more appealing to me than most current comics I've flipped through.

Of his Turtles stuff, I'd have to say I enjoy his Vol. 4 work the most. He drew pretty cartoony for Tales 1, more realistic for "City at War", and then did both simultaneously for Vol. 4. It's a really weird, unique fusion of realism and cartooniness with a liberal sprinkling of really great, technical textures.

If people don't like it, y'know, whatever. I just don't like the nasty comments by people saying they can draw better despite the fact they don't draw real well. :) I guarantee no such person can do something like this:

[Slap-Happy]

As far as I can recall, the only the artists rendition of the turtles to have real beaks were Zulli's & Bodes, to an extent.

Whatcha talkin' about?
Not really beaks as much as snouts. The front of their faces stick out a lot. It just bothers me for some reason.

[Donnie]

Not really beaks as much as snouts. The front of their faces stick out a lot. It just bothers me for some reason.

I know what you mean, it looks like blocks are placed below their masks.

[Oculus Orbus]

I absolutely love Jim Lawson's art, and I'm very glad he drew the turtles for so long.

[Ninja_Shoe_Repair]

Potato, potatoe. I think it's just "to each, it's own" kind of thing. I don't mind Jim's art at all. I don't know what the big deal with is Talbot's art is. I'm not a big fan of his but it just comes down to personal preference. The same with the Archie series. I hated the Milton Knight art as compared to the earlier art but it is what it is.

I think the universal agreement is that no one did it better than Eastman and Laird. It's a shame we only got the little we did considering the overall full run but I'm grateful for what we have of it.

[Donnie]

I think the universal agreement is that no one did it better than Eastman and Laird. It's a shame we only got the little we did considering the overall full run but I'm grateful for what we have of it.

100% agreed. Who was responsible for the early first couple of issues? Was that more Eastman's style than Laird's?

[Venom]

100% agreed. Who was responsible for the early first couple of issues? Was that more Eastman's style than Laird's?

It was a collaboration - they both had just as much input as the other. A lot of people don't really seem to grasp that notion, as it's rather unorthodox. They both plotted, drew, inked, etc.

[Bjarni]

It was a collaboration - they both had just as much input as the other. A lot of people don't really seem to grasp that notion, as it's rather unorthodox. They both plotted, drew, inked, etc.

This is exactly how I've been drawing comics for the last 10 years or so.

[Crobot91]

He's a great artist IMO.

[ToTheNines]

I actually like his style, but I don't like how plain the action is in his books. The fights aren't "choreographed" very well, and he tends to not do interesting things with the "camera angles".

And it's not really fair to judge Jim by his work after Mirage stopped using duo-tones. His volume 4 work looked great up until about issue 8 or 9, IIRC.

[Abnormal Freak]

It was a collaboration - they both had just as much input as the other. A lot of people don't really seem to grasp that notion, as it's rather unorthodox. They both plotted, drew, inked, etc.

Although Eastman did almost all of the layouts himself, with input from Laird whenever he was dissatisfied with a page or panel. I think the only of the initial collaborative issues that Laird had a heavy hand in layouting was #2, but even then it was only about half of the book (the first half, sans the opening splash which Eastman did).

[Toon]

Jim's one of the greats. Beautiful shapes, great use of line, so much energy. Love his Vol. 4 stuff.

[BoggleKng]

Jim is a nice, very personable, honest kind of guy. His artwork is nothing to shake a stick at..

[Donnie]

Jim is a nice, very personable, honest kind of guy. His artwork is nothing to shake a stick at..

Well, I made this thread because I don't like his art, I never said anything about his personality...I'm sure he's a great guy who cares a lot about the Turtles. However, I remain with the few that truly dislike his style come Volume 4: I do like his early work. But like it has been said, to each his or her own. I was in no way putting Jim Lawson as a person down, though. I hope nobody (BoggleKng) thought that was the case! I'm just not a fan of his artwork.

Abnormal, thanks for the info!

[Powder]

No one implied you thought little of him as a person.
Boggle (& others? Didn't read everything) just threw in some qualities of Jim that they like. It's hard not to.

[Donnie]

No one implied you thought little of him as a person.
Boggle (& others? Didn't read everything)

I'm sure that's the case, I just felt I had to put it out there being the thread starter and all.

Like I said, I do like his early work. And he is very talented. Just not my cup of tea in the later days.

[FearlessLeader]

Just out of curiosity Donny what do you think of Jim's writing?

Personally in my opinion I love the way he wrote Leo. There was always a subtle, thoughtful grace to the character that only Jim could give him in the pieces he wrote about Leonardo.

[Koi]

I have never been a fan of Jim Lawson's art. The only artists I have ever liked that so far that I have seen are and only have been Andres Ponce, Paul Harmon, Dario Brizuela, and Michael Dooney. I skim a lot more in comics without artists that I like, I also don't buy comics that don't have artists I like.

As Ninja Shoe Repair said already though, "to each, it's own".

[Powder]

Jim was definitely a great writer. While I didn't care for the brain thief, I've loved everything else he did.

[FearlessLeader]

Jim was definitely a great writer. While I didn't care for the brain thief, I've loved everything else he did.

Blind Sight to this day is one of my favorite things I have ever read period.

I also really loved earlier volume two but felt the ending of it suffered some when you can tell Jim had to speed up to finish off the storyline.

[ToTheNines]

I have never been a fan of Jim Lawson's art. The only artists I have ever liked that so far that I have seen are and only have been Andres Ponce, Paul Harmon, Dario Brizuela, and Michael Dooney. I skim a lot more in comics without artists that I like, I also don't buy comics that don't have artists I like.

You should look into A.C. Farley's work. He didn't do very many issues buy Vol. 1 # 43 is amazing. It's called "The Halls of Lost Legends"

Jim was definitely a great writer. While I didn't care for the brain thief, I've loved everything else he did.

I hated all of those "individual turtle" mini-series'. The only decent one was Michelangelo - The Thrid Kind

[Donnie]

Just out of curiosity Donny what do you think of Jim's writing?


I like it. :) I'd agree with you that he wrote Leo well, and I liked how he wrote Donny, too...I'm also a fan of "The Brain Thief" mini. I thought the plot was very fitting for a Donny solo series.

[Bjarni]

The only decent one was Michelangelo - The Thrid Kind
Nah man. Blind Sight was the BEST one.

[ToTheNines]

I'd also like to say that "The Burning Man" is by far Jim's best Tales Volume 2 issue. Love that one.

Also, I think Jim takes a lot of crap simply because of over exposure. He did every single issue of Volume 4 and about half of the Tales after Dan became the editor. Perhaps in smaller doses, more people would have appreciated him

Nah man. Blind Sight was the BEST one.

It started off well, but then went to total sh*t.

[FearlessLeader]

It started off well, but then went to total sh*t.

I respectfully disagree.

Different people like different things. I loved what Lawson did with the story, but I get that it might not have been every ones cup of tea! :tsmile:

[TristanHuwJones]

Tales #64 is the issue I'm proudest of. Jim knocked that COMPLETELY out of the park for me. I'd been wanting to work with Jim since #36 (which was originally going to be drawn by Jim, actually), and when the time came, it was probably the most excited I'd been since I started there. I really hope we see more of his work on the Turtles in the future.

[Vivi]

Whatever floats your boat, as they say. I like most styles, but I find Lawson's work to be a touchstone as it has been around for so long.

[Bjarni]

I'd also like to say that "The Burning Man" is by far Jim's best Tales Volume 2 issue. Love that one.
I loved Tristan's work on that story and while it was one of the better TMNT books and Lawson did a good job on it, I wasn't a fan of his Hun (even though it was just a cameo).

[Bjarni]

Jim Lawson's best Turtle work in my opinion is the entire Volume 2 run. It's beautiful to look at and the story was amazing.

[BoggleKng]

No one implied you thought little of him as a person.
Boggle (& others? Didn't read everything) just threw in some qualities of Jim that they like. It's hard not to.

I read most of it. I was just commenting.. My first post had nothing to do with artwork.. I can understand what Donny and other folks don't like... Jim's artwork has changed as the years have progressed.. in some ways, it has been good and others way not so good.

[AquaParade]

Hit or miss, for me. Some issues by Jim, I love. Others, not so much. Not an early work/late work thing for me.