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View Full Version : Was Eric Sachs originally meant to be The Shredder?


Leolead
08-12-2014, 09:43 AM
It's blantly obvious, I could have sworn William fitchner, said he was the Shredder at least multiple times.

I'm sorry but something didn't feel right.. every scene we got with Oroku, was filmed in the same area, maybe that's what they were reshooting.. it's even more obvious he was meant to be the Shredder, Especially the scene were he's wearing those Exo-Tony stark under suits (you know.. the kind you wear under a mech suit)

bottom line is, I think they backed out because the negative reaction.

joefsas
08-12-2014, 09:47 AM
bottom line is, I think they backed out because the negative reaction.

Pretty much. But will they ever admit it?

Prowler
08-12-2014, 09:56 AM
It is possible but I find it hard to believe that's actually what happened. One has to wonder what gave them the idea that making people believe that Shredder was gonna be white and renamed Eric Sachs/Colonel Schrader was a good marketing ploy. Although, it's only been confirmed a couple of weeks or so before the movie hit the theaters that Shredder was in fact Japanese, am I mistaken?

Some say the aliens angle was just a rumor taken out of context as well.This movie's development was an 'efing mess.

The Boston Ninja Turtle
08-12-2014, 10:08 AM
i wanna know when Sachs became Sacks

Powder
08-12-2014, 12:13 PM
There is NO chance he wasn't. It's soooooo clear he was gonna be Shredder. I'd bet on it.

tommyday
08-12-2014, 12:18 PM
I was just reading an article on Topless Robot about it.

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2014/08/was_new_tmnts_shredder_meant_to_be_a_white_guy.php

Andrew NDB
08-12-2014, 12:30 PM
There is NO chance he wasn't. It's soooooo clear he was gonna be Shredder. I'd bet on it.

It's not even debatable. It's a fact.

The Boston Ninja Turtle
08-12-2014, 12:33 PM
It's not even debatable. It's a fact.

it really is..interviews with Will himself confirm it..dont even let me start on the editing of the movie to avoid showing who actually is in the suit

snooz
08-12-2014, 01:48 PM
I am one of the people who enjoyed this movie, and I was willing to accept the new version of Shredder. After seeing the movie, I don't understand how anyone can really tell themselves they believe that Shredder wasn't a last minute change.

I wish they had stuck with what they had, rather than trying to please people who will never be happy. It did seem quite obvious to me that Sacks was originally Shredder. The change seemed to create a massive disconnect between Shredder and the rest of the characters. It is unfortunate. And on top of that, with Sacks no longer being Shredder, his character does seem a bit unnecessary. They tied it all in together in a reasonable fashion, but they should have just left him as Shredder.

There was no 'backlash' by the fans with this movie, and there would not have been one had they left their story alone. I've said many times before on this board, all of the hardcore fans around here need to realize that they are an extreme minority. Once upon a time, TMNT was one of the biggest brands in the world. All of the people who watched it back in the late 80's and early 90's are adults now, and most haven't watched anything TMNT related since that time. They will still go see this movie (they came out in strong numbers this past weekend), they don't give a **** if Shredder is Oroku Saki. If you survey'd the full theatres I would be willing to bet that 90% of the audience couldn't name Saki or Hamato Yoshi.

It's too bad, I would love a more traditional TMNT movie but some people need to get over this nonsense. It is almost certainly never going to happen, because TMNT is for CHILDREN. Perhaps the comic was a little more mature, but guess what... If it had never been turned into a cartoon, there is very little chance there would have ever been a TMNT movie. It would simply be an obscure comic book from the 80's. The comic is the original, but the silly cartoon is responsible for the worldwide success of TMNT.

Panda_Kahn_fan
08-12-2014, 01:54 PM
I think he was, and now we're left with a totally useless and redundant character in the form of Harry Sacks- er, I mean, Eric Sachs. :lol:

Anton Chigurh
08-12-2014, 02:56 PM
I think he was, and now we're left with a totally useless and redundant character in the form of Harry Sacks- er, I mean, Eric Sachs. :lol:

I agree but hopefully they could build off of it, like people have stated on here, like him become the Rat-king.

Xav
08-12-2014, 04:13 PM
It is possible but I find it hard to believe that's actually what happened. One has to wonder what gave them the idea that making people believe that Shredder was gonna be white and renamed Eric Sachs/Colonel Schrader was a good marketing ploy. Although, it's only been confirmed a couple of weeks or so before the movie hit the theaters that Shredder was in fact Japanese, am I mistaken?

Some say the aliens angle was just a rumor taken out of context as well.This movie's development was an 'efing mess.If it really was a marketing ploy like they claim than why the hell is Eric Sacks the Shredder in the video game than?

The alien angle wasn't a rumor taken out of context. We literally saw the script where they were aliens.

Coola Yagami
08-12-2014, 06:00 PM
I am one of the people who enjoyed this movie, and I was willing to accept the new version of Shredder. After seeing the movie, I don't understand how anyone can really tell themselves they believe that Shredder wasn't a last minute change.

I wish they had stuck with what they had, rather than trying to please people who will never be happy. It did seem quite obvious to me that Sacks was originally Shredder. The change seemed to create a massive disconnect between Shredder and the rest of the characters. It is unfortunate. And on top of that, with Sacks no longer being Shredder, his character does seem a bit unnecessary. They tied it all in together in a reasonable fashion, but they should have just left him as Shredder.

There was no 'backlash' by the fans with this movie, and there would not have been one had they left their story alone. I've said many times before on this board, all of the hardcore fans around here need to realize that they are an extreme minority. Once upon a time, TMNT was one of the biggest brands in the world. All of the people who watched it back in the late 80's and early 90's are adults now, and most haven't watched anything TMNT related since that time. They will still go see this movie (they came out in strong numbers this past weekend), they don't give a **** if Shredder is Oroku Saki. If you survey'd the full theatres I would be willing to bet that 90% of the audience couldn't name Saki or Hamato Yoshi.

It's too bad, I would love a more traditional TMNT movie but some people need to get over this nonsense. It is almost certainly never going to happen, because TMNT is for CHILDREN. Perhaps the comic was a little more mature, but guess what... If it had never been turned into a cartoon, there is very little chance there would have ever been a TMNT movie. It would simply be an obscure comic book from the 80's. The comic is the original, but the silly cartoon is responsible for the worldwide success of TMNT.

You're entitled to your opinion.... but why, if you consider yourself any kind of TMNT fan, would want all of these needless changes to make a movie about them good? Have you that little faith in it? Perhaps you're into the wrong series and TMNT isn't really your thing.


Yes, TMNT was childish and silly.... though what exactly about Shredder being asian from the get-go and the fued between Shredder and Splinter made the old series childish? Hell, the fued between the Shredder and Splinter drives the series (in the comics even after Shredder died) so why take that core element out? Might as well have Bruce's parents survive and make him become Batman for the hell of it.

And if the movie-goers don't know who Saki and Yoshi are.... it's the damn movie's job to do so, just like the movies introduced people to SHIELD, Steve Rogers, Tony Stark, and the Guardians of the Galaxy. There are people that still would have never heard of Bane because he was never in the Adam West show, that now know him because of the movie.

If the movie was messed up because they were forced to shoe-horn in extra scene of asian shredhead, then it's their own fault for screwing something most every tmnt fan knew knew so drastically. It's almost like having the Halle Berry Catwoman cram in some random scene saying her name is Selina and lived in Gotham, and have a random Bat cameo where you just see a shadow, in a weak attempt to tie it into the comics better... it would still suck due to how the rest of the movie was.

Even without the forced last minute scenes, the rest of the movie woulda been horrible anyway.

Leolead
08-12-2014, 07:37 PM
You're entitled to your opinion.... but why, if you consider yourself any kind of TMNT fan, would want all of these needless changes to make a movie about them good? Have you that little faith in it? Perhaps you're into the wrong series and TMNT isn't really your thing.


Yes, TMNT was childish and silly.... though what exactly about Shredder being asian from the get-go and the fued between Shredder and Splinter made the old series childish? Hell, the fued between the Shredder and Splinter drives the series (in the comics even after Shredder died) so why take that core element out? Might as well have Bruce's parents survive and make him become Batman for the hell of it.

And if the movie-goers don't know who Saki and Yoshi are.... it's the damn movie's job to do so, just like the movies introduced people to SHIELD, Steve Rogers, Tony Stark, and the Guardians of the Galaxy. There are people that still would have never heard of Bane because he was never in the Adam West show, that now know him because of the movie.

If the movie was messed up because they were forced to shoe-horn in extra scene of asian shredhead, then it's their own fault for screwing something most every tmnt fan knew knew so drastically. It's almost like having the Halle Berry Catwoman cram in some random scene saying her name is Selina and lived in Gotham, and have a random Bat cameo where you just see a shadow, in a weak attempt to tie it into the comics better... it would still suck due to how the rest of the movie was.

Even without the forced last minute scenes, the rest of the movie woulda been horrible anyway.
What? so if he was a TMNT purist, and wasted all his time on this forum even though he hated the movie, would that make him a true fan?

that does not define if your a true fan or not

Ninturtle
08-12-2014, 08:31 PM
I believe wiliam fichner voices shredder in the game

turtle1237
08-12-2014, 08:47 PM
Might was well be, since Sachs was pretty much the main villain.
Shredder didn't really do much expect fight the turtles.

Now had Baxter Stockman(Joke here) put on the helmet, and the spikes and became Shredder in the movie, I would have a hard time enjoying the movie. You cant make change for change stake. We all know who Shredder is suppose to be, a ninja underground God Father from Japan. If he was some geeky science dude, I would never had accepted it myself. I still enjoy the movie.

Coola Yagami
08-12-2014, 09:11 PM
What? so if he was a TMNT purist, and wasted all his time on this forum even though he hated the movie, would that make him a true fan?

that does not define if your a true fan or not

I'm not saying he is or is not a true fan. I'm just wondering what makes him a fan if he has so little faith in the thing he's a fan of.

It's like me saying, I'm a huge fan of Iron Man. But I would feel if they ever made a movie with him, he should be more middle class income, not a smartass ladies man, and like, instead of wearing a metal suit, should like... just take his brain out and put it inside a robot... that's the only way such a movie can work, and I'm the biggest fan.

No.

Coola Yagami
08-12-2014, 09:12 PM
Might was well be, since Sachs was pretty much the main villain.
Shredder didn't really do much expect fight the turtles.

Now had Baxter Stockman(Joke here) put on the helmet, and the spikes and became Shredder in the movie, I would have a hard time enjoying the movie. You cant make change for change stake. We all know who Shredder is suppose to be, a ninja underground God Father from Japan. If he was some geeky science dude, I would never had accepted it myself. I still enjoy the movie.

Shredder seemed more like Sach's hired muscle if you ask me...

turtle1237
08-12-2014, 09:29 PM
Shredder seemed more like Sach's hired muscle if you ask me...

Pretty much, yeah Shredder in lines may seem like the master, but Sach did created the plan and pretty much pull the strings. Shredder was pretty much just there for the ride.

Other major problem was the Shredder's defeat. I can lived with Splinter taking out Shredder in the first movie, it was amazing to see, Splinter coming in and saving his sons, Shredder's own ego of taking the Turtles down with him in the 2nd film was great to see. The Turtles were smarter than Shredder here, were Shredder pretty much lost his mind and sense after the first movie defeat imo.

But in in the 2014 who takes out Shredder? Leo? Don? Ralph? Mickey? Even Splinter? Nope, April O'Neil. I loved April as much as the next person, but she should not have been the person to take down Shredder. Shredder I think will never let that one be lived down.

sdp
08-12-2014, 09:29 PM
This thread should be "Would Sachs have been a more interesting character and/or made more sense to the plot if he had been Shredder?"

Now what do you guys think?

TMNT_2010
08-13-2014, 04:59 AM
It would certainly make more sense if he was. When Shredder shows up in the sewers you can hear the hatred in Splinter's voice when he says "Shredder" But he had no reason to hate him or even to even know who he was.

I'm guessing its a line that was recorded and they just went with it. It will be interesting to see if the truth about this movie's development ever comes to light because there has to be a reason for all the inconsistencies.

Coola Yagami
08-13-2014, 06:02 AM
Pretty much, yeah Shredder in lines may seem like the master, but Sach did created the plan and pretty much pull the strings. Shredder was pretty much just there for the ride.

Other major problem was the Shredder's defeat. I can lived with Splinter taking out Shredder in the first movie, it was amazing to see, Splinter coming in and saving his sons, Shredder's own ego of taking the Turtles down with him in the 2nd film was great to see. The Turtles were smarter than Shredder here, were Shredder pretty much lost his mind and sense after the first movie defeat imo.

But in in the 2014 who takes out Shredder? Leo? Don? Ralph? Mickey? Even Splinter? Nope, April O'Neil. I loved April as much as the next person, but she should not have been the person to take down Shredder. Shredder I think will never let that one be lived down.

Lmao movie shredder should have copied a page from Casey jones playbook and said 'yeah yeah Eric your plans are good and all.... But when do I get to break stuff?'

sethmartin
08-13-2014, 06:47 AM
I think the scene with Eric Sacks shooting at April and Vern was a reshoot as well. Either that or it was originally meant to happen at another time. Also Sacks dies even though Fichtner signed a 3 picture deal??? That's because we WAS the Shredder and they changed it. Sacks was the best and most interesting character in the whole film. What happened with Sacks being "Obsessed with the armor"? What happened to "We find out that Eric Sachs is someone else too." Yes most of the time when asked if he was the Shredder, Fichtner would say "I play a character named Eric Sacks" but there were a few occasions where he flat out said "Yes". They should have kept him as the Shredder. Now with a sequel announced already, I doubt that we'll ever get to see an original cut of the film. Also it was never confirmed that the Shredder is Oroku Saki. He's just some Asian guy.

Coola Yagami
08-13-2014, 06:52 AM
I think the scene with Eric Sacks shooting at April and Vern was a reshoot as well. Either that or it was originally meant to happen at another time. Also Sacks dies even though Fichtner signed a 3 picture deal??? That's because we WAS the Shredder and they changed it. Sacks was the best and most interesting character in the whole film. What happened with Sacks being "Obsessed with the armor"? What happened to "We find out that Eric Sachs is someone else too." Yes most of the time when asked if he was the Shredder, Fichtner would say "I play a character named Eric Sacks" but there were a few occasions where he flat out said "Yes". They should have kept him as the Shredder. Now with a sequel announced already, I doubt that we'll ever get to see an original cut of the film. Also it was never confirmed that the Shredder is Oroku Saki. He's just some Asian guy.

I don't think he died. He was just knocked out.

The original film would have been even worse. Unless Sachs original plan wasn't this stupid 'mutagen cures the plague' thing.

sethmartin
08-13-2014, 07:00 AM
They could have changed the plan. What happened to "That's what your father and I were trying to do, create heroes"? Or what about that one teaser trailer where Leo says "We were created as weapons"? Not even a mention of this in the final film. I think they cut it up so much to change Shredder, that they had to change the entire evil plan. When I watched the film, I noticed that every time Sacks mentions the Shredder, it's always a cut away shot where you don't actually see him say it. I think "Project Renaissance" was changed.

Coola Yagami
08-13-2014, 07:06 AM
They could have changed the plan. What happened to "That's what your father and I were trying to do, create heroes"? Or what about that one teaser trailer where Leo says "We were created as weapons"? Not even a mention of this in the final film. I think they cut it up so much to change Shredder, that they had to change the entire evil plan. When I watched the film, I noticed that every time Sacks mentions the Shredder, it's always a cut away shot where you don't actually see him say it. I think "Project Renaissance" was changed.

Still woulda been a hell of a screw up. The turtles were never created by Aprils dad and shredder to be weapons. It still would have been a horrible movie. If anything the original film would have been a lot worse.

CyberCubed
08-13-2014, 10:20 AM
The funny thing is Sachs had a role that would have been better suited to either Karai or Baxter Stockman now.

Instead we have this pointless Eric Sachs character over someone else. I can't help but realize we missed out on having a great Baxter role in a movie.

Panda_Kahn_fan
08-13-2014, 11:51 AM
The funny thing is Sachs had a role that would have been better suited to either Karai or Baxter Stockman now.

Instead we have this pointless Eric Sachs character over someone else. I can't help but realize we missed out on having a great Baxter role in a movie.

If this character's role would have been filled Baxter instead of 'Harry' Sachs, about 50% of this movie's problems would've been solved. Shredder wouldn't NEED much characterization because BAXTER'S the main villian of this film, and Shredder's the boss in the shadows, who will gets his chance to shine in the sequel.

There would still be other problems, but that would've been a big part of it. He i Baxter in all but name anyway.

Mellie
08-13-2014, 12:01 PM
If he was, I sort of wish they didn't change it.

I didn't want him to be Shredder himself, just a student of Shredder while he was in Japan. The robo suit would of made more sense then.

I think after the whole alien thing, they panicked. I would love so much to see all the unused footage they have.

Andrew NDB
08-13-2014, 12:06 PM
They could have changed the plan. What happened to "That's what your father and I were trying to do, create heroes"? Or what about that one teaser trailer where Leo says "We were created as weapons"? Not even a mention of this in the final film. I think they cut it up so much to change Shredder, that they had to change the entire evil plan. When I watched the film, I noticed that every time Sacks mentions the Shredder, it's always a cut away shot where you don't actually see him say it. I think "Project Renaissance" was changed.

I think that's probably dead on. And remember Finchtner talking about, "Yeah, I'm Shredder. And Shredder goes through a lot of changes in the movie." Apparently that was behind-the-scenes too.

Bry
08-13-2014, 12:53 PM
It would certainly make more sense if he was. When Shredder shows up in the sewers you can hear the hatred in Splinter's voice when he says "Shredder" But he had no reason to hate him or even to even know who he was.

I'm guessing its a line that was recorded and they just went with it. It will be interesting to see if the truth about this movie's development ever comes to light because there has to be a reason for all the inconsistencies.

That's the really bizarre part. When did Shaloub record his lines? And when did they do the reshoots that likely added "Saki"? Were the changes made so late in the game that there just wasn't time to change that line?

Maybe I'm just trying too hard to make sense of a plot that doesn't make much sense on any level anyway? :trazz:

I think the scene with Eric Sacks shooting at April and Vern was a reshoot as well.

Wouldn't surprise me at all. I recall that whole sequence feeling especially rushed and sloppy.

NinjaPug
08-13-2014, 06:55 PM
Plots that Change

Where do I talk about Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles? Do I talk about it here? They’re technically a comic book property and a megafranchise now that TMNT 2 is going to be a thing that happens.

So here’s my question as someone who hasn’t seen the film yet: does it seem like the movie’s plot changed halfway though?

Because when I was on set, I saw TCRI ooze being fed into a bunch of Ninja-looking Foot Clan thugs (NINJA looking, not Mercenary Masked). Also William Fichtner was The Shredder. He wasn’t working WITH Shredder he WAS Shredder. I also read that script called The Blue Door that was a horrible Turtles movie that had all the mutants as aliens from Dimension X. Basically, even when I asked what was being re-shot during TMNT 2014’s re-shoot period, I was just told that it was stuff Megan Fox couldn’t do earlier because of her pregnancy. However, I watched them shoot a scene from multiple angles where April fought some ninja with a sai and Will Arnett’s Vernon did some brawling too. With ninjas on gurneys all around.

When did they come up with the plot for this movie?

http://www.latino-review.com/news/marvelous-da7e-59-inhumans-aquaman-tmnt-and-asm2-plot-insanity

Bry
08-13-2014, 07:46 PM
http://www.latino-review.com/news/marvelous-da7e-59-inhumans-aquaman-tmnt-and-asm2-plot-insanity

I cannot wait for the in-depth behind-the-scenes articles about the production of this movie. Sounds like a complete train wreck from start to finish.

And it's getting a sequel!! Hahaha oh my god

Leo656
08-13-2014, 10:03 PM
So, that article more or less confirms what I suspected all along, that they kept what they could from the Blue Door script, more or less made up the rest on the fly, made it all up on the fly again at the last minute, threw it in a blender, and called it a movie. No full "script" or even basic idea of what the story was that they were trying to tell, because inside of a few months it went from being completely one thing into a completely different thing.

Nice. Nice. You know these guys shouldn't be making movies, right?

sdp
08-13-2014, 10:12 PM
You make it sound like it was a bad thing but sometimes things like this can turn out a better product like say Samurai Pizza Cats, and from what we know of the original version, this version we got was much better.

Leo656
08-13-2014, 10:29 PM
I think, based on how the entire project was planned and executed over the last three or so years, that the entire thing was flawed from the start, because it was in the hands of exactly the wrong type of people, and there was nothing they could have made that would have turned out "good".

These guys should not be working. The way they make films is bad, thus, they make bad films. Their catalog of work more or less proves that the approach they take to film making is fundamentally flawed and that they are incapable of producing anything of quality. With or without the last minute changes, the movie still would likely have been underwhelming, simply because the people involved don't know how to make a good movie at all, regardless.

Coola Yagami
08-13-2014, 11:55 PM
I think, based on how the entire project was planned and executed over the last three or so years, that the entire thing was flawed from the start, because it was in the hands of exactly the wrong type of people, and there was nothing they could have made that would have turned out "good".

These guys should not be working. The way they make films is bad, thus, they make bad films. Their catalog of work more or less proves that the approach they take to film making is fundamentally flawed and that they are incapable of producing anything of quality. With or without the last minute changes, the movie still would likely have been underwhelming, simply because the people involved don't know how to make a good movie at all, regardless.

Either that or they either don't know crap about the Turtles... or have so little faith in the franchise they're basing the movie on, that they felt the need to make a ka-zillion changes in order for it to sell.

The people on this forum that applaud this movie are basically proving these guys right.

Blips
08-14-2014, 12:07 AM
Am I crazy or does it sound like William Fichtner as Shredder at 1:03 in this French trailer? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjR4uHW1J_s)

Also, were these bits from the trailer in the final film?

April: Ninja Turtles?
April: These guys are heroes. People need to see this.

I’ve only seen the film once and it was in a theater filled with rowdy kids, so I don’t recall.

Andrew NDB
08-14-2014, 12:13 AM
So, that article more or less confirms what I suspected all along, that they kept what they could from the Blue Door script, more or less made up the rest on the fly, made it all up on the fly again at the last minute, threw it in a blender, and called it a movie. No full "script" or even basic idea of what the story was that they were trying to tell, because inside of a few months it went from being completely one thing into a completely different thing.

Nice. Nice. You know these guys shouldn't be making movies, right?

That sounds like a 100% accurate assessment of the situation, from where I sit.

It was never going to be a film. From the beginning, it was product.

Xiewin
08-14-2014, 12:31 AM
I still dont understand why nickelodeon choose a company like PD to produce the film in the first place. It's like they wanted the film to be s**t from the beginning.

Leo656
08-14-2014, 12:37 AM
I still dont understand why nickelodeon choose a company like PD to produce the film in the first place. It's like they wanted the film to be s**t from the beginning.

Honestly? If I had to take an educated guess, I'd say it was because Platinum Dunes promised the quickest turnaround with the lowest budget. The movie was a huge risk and Nick had barely acquired the property. They didn't want to commission a movie, then spend a ton of money on it, and five-to-eight years developing it and finally release it only to have it possibly under-perform. PD probably said they could have it out inside of three years for under a certain price, other companies probably said it would take longer or cost more, so Nick went with the company that brought with it the lowest amount of risk. Other "safe" moves included having Bay and Fox involved, knowing there was a built-in audience there.

"We can get it done quicker, and cheaper, than anyone else." That was probably the line that got Nick behind them.

Coola Yagami
08-14-2014, 12:45 AM
Honestly? If I had to take an educated guess, I'd say it was because Platinum Dunes promised the quickest turnaround with the lowest budget. The movie was a huge risk and Nick had barely acquired the property. They didn't want to commission a movie, then spend a ton of money on it, and five-to-eight years developing it and finally release it only to have it possibly under-perform. PD probably said they could have it out inside of three years for under a certain price, other companies probably said it would take longer or cost more, so Nick went with the company that brought with it the lowest amount of risk. Other "safe" moves included having Bay and Fox involved, knowing there was a built-in audience there.

"We can get it done quicker, and cheaper, than anyone else." That was probably the line that got Nick behind them.

Hey Leo, do you predict sales for this movie to drop drastically this weekend, or keep going strong? Word of mouth should have gotten around and spread like wildfire by now. I assume Expendables 3 will kick the crap out of it.

Leo656
08-14-2014, 12:52 AM
Oh, I'unno, I barely pay attention to that stuff, honestly. I know it started out strong but a lot of movies this year started hot but fell off fast, and a lot of stuff didn't meet predictions, so I don't know who could say, really.

Midnight Mutant
08-14-2014, 01:56 AM
You can tell he was. At first, I thought maybe they did it as a marketing ploy...but that's really risky to do after so much negative feedback from the alien thing.

When you watch it, it's so obvious Oroku Saki was slapped in.
1. No Shredder history
2. Oroku Saki would not need a mech suit, he's already bad ass with minimum armor. Sachs seems like he would need that armor more updated because he probably isn't as good
3. Saki would have heard April running up behind him in the 'Shredder vs Splinter' fight. This mistake seems more like a Sachs thing.
4. With how they show Saki being very close to his Japanese roots, I don't see him needing or wanting a military food clan, again that seems more 'rich business guy'.
5. It was pretty much Sachs' plan, that plan wouldn't be something Saki would care about, nor is it really honorable. Saki doesn't have a lot of honor, but he does have some and he has pride. I don't think that's how he would want to take over a city.
6. Saki has no reason to be in NY or want to take over NY. Sachs does.
7. How in the hell does Saki know Raph's name? He wasn't partaking in the experiments or the project and even if he knew the turtles were named after the artists, how does he know which is which? Sachs would know, because he knew the colors with the name.

I mean, you can just tell when you watch it. Saki/shredder felt like a henchmen but he was suppose to be the main villain. Sachs felt like the main villain but was suppose to be a henchmen. William also said he was the Shredder and talked about stunt doubles. I didn't see Sachs doing anything that required stunt doubles.

So to answer: Yes.

sethmartin
08-14-2014, 07:06 AM
Also, they never address him as Oroku Saki. They only call him "shredder" or "master shredder". I don't think it even is Oroku Saki. Just some Japanese dude.

CyberCubed
08-14-2014, 07:09 AM
Also, they never address him as Oroku Saki. They only call him "shredder" or "master shredder". I don't think it even is Oroku Saki. Just some Japanese dude.

Its obviously Oroku Saki since they made him Japanese. They didn't mention Yoshi so they had no reason to mention Saki.

Bry
08-14-2014, 07:40 AM
These guys should not be working. The way they make films is bad, thus, they make bad films. Their catalog of work more or less proves that the approach they take to film making is fundamentally flawed and that they are incapable of producing anything of quality. With or without the last minute changes, the movie still would likely have been underwhelming, simply because the people involved don't know how to make a good movie at all, regardless.

Hey, I'm 100% with you. They're terrible at their jobs and they make awful films. But audiences just keep throwing money at them anyway.

Folks get the filmmakers and films they deserve.

Lou 500
08-14-2014, 08:55 AM
That sounds like a 100% accurate assessment of the situation, from where I sit.

It was never going to be a film. From the beginning, it was product.

I think it's okay for it to be a product. It's just a poorly made product dressed up in fancy wrapping.

Coola Yagami
08-14-2014, 09:50 AM
Hey, I'm 100% with you. They're terrible at their jobs and they make awful films. But audiences just keep throwing money at them anyway.

Folks get the filmmakers and films they deserve.

Then we have people with the 'wait and see' attitude that allows this crap to happen. Mostly in this forum, with every new piece of info we were getting that just felt like a wrong step for any kind of tmnt movie, everyone had the 'wait and see' attitude. Now that the movie is out and it's horrible... People are still stick on the 'wait and see' for the sequel hoping it will clean up this mess.

No. Stop allowing crap like this to be made. How far down do the directors have to sink to wake people up that this movie sucked. Do they have to add Venus? Do they have to have Megan make out with mikey? Do they have to have shredder do an evil song and dance number? When will it cross the line that even the most rabid tmnt fan will say 'hell no' and admit they don't like this.

NinjaPug
08-14-2014, 10:58 AM
This was nothing but a money grab for Platinum Dunes. Why would they care about the story? They knew people would see it no matter what.

Lil Karai
08-14-2014, 11:13 AM
Page 185 of "TMNT, The Ultimate Visual History" confirms this theory. There is a page dedicated to the 2014 movie Shredder with pics of Eric Sachs. A couple notable exerpts from this page:

"April suspects there is more to Eric Sachs than meets the eye" (caption of a pic of Eric Sachs talking to April and wearing Shredder armored glove)

"Keeping with the classic Turtles vibe, it was announced that the Shredder would be returning, this time played by veteran character actor William Fichtner. The man behind the steel plated mask is Eric Sachs, which many TMNT fans may interpret as a westernized version of the character's original name "Oroku Saki". Fichtner was reluctant about the role at first, but his nephew and a compelling script convinced him to take on the Shredder's mantle."

The Boston Ninja Turtle
08-14-2014, 11:17 AM
"April suspects there is more to Eric Sachs than meets the eye"

robots in disguise?

Raven
08-14-2014, 02:09 PM
Any one claiming Sachs was never suppose to be shredder is clearly in denial. Most scenes involving him was really pushing the idea that he was going to be shredder.

Honestly, I wish they would have kept Sach as Shredder and revealed he was the American branch of the foot. Then at the end reveal Saki, the true Shredder.

That asian dude pretending to be Saki was pointless. His whole plan to bring victory back to the foot was meaningless. How did they loose in the first place? Why did they need to regain it?

Xav
08-14-2014, 04:30 PM
Am I crazy or does it sound like William Fichtner as Shredder at 1:03 in this French trailer? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjR4uHW1J_s)Yeah that does sound like him. That makes me wonder if other country's will get different cuts of the film? Like if the Chinese are offended by a Japanese villain, will they get the version of the film with Sacks as Shredder?

thebrownranger
08-14-2014, 06:05 PM
Of course Sachs was originally meant to be Shredder. Listen to William Fichtner's early interviews. And, remember the last minute reshoots? There's no way the idiots behind this film could hide that.

Galactus
08-14-2014, 06:11 PM
It strikes me that Bay and co really wanted a black ops military leader and were set for that no matter what.

What is weird is if they did a bit a digging they'd have seen an established fan favourite villain who fitted the bill perfectly Bishop. Even the idea that he wanted their blood for the mutagen fits with his agenda.

They could have even worked Shredder in somehow. There's any number of scenarios that you could work Oroku Saki in but I doubt anyone making this movie is bothered with anything that isn't from the Fred Wolf show.

Leo656
08-14-2014, 06:17 PM
Yeah, the cat from Latino Review said he saw Fox shooting fight scenes where she was fighting off Foot soldiers with a sai, and that was filmed way back during the original shoots. So the claim that they needed to re-shoot her doing stuff she couldn't/didn't do back then because of her pregnancy is a laughable, blatant lie. They were just in full-blown panic mode and needed a cover story for the real reason, that they were making major last-minute narrative changes.

Shameful.

Tuxedo Moroboshi
08-15-2014, 12:16 AM
This article confirms that he was supposed to be the Shredder originally. (http://www.slashfilm.com/tmnt-sequel-characters/)

For those that wanna just read the part where it's confirmed:
…when I was on set, I saw TCRI ooze being fed into a bunch of Ninja-looking Foot Clan thugs (NINJA looking, not Mercenary Masked). Also William Fichtner was The Shredder. He wasn’t working WITH Shredder, he WAS Shredder. … Basically, even when I asked what was being re-shot during TMNT 2014’s re-shoot period, I was just told that it was stuff Megan Fox couldn’t do earlier because of her pregnancy. However, I watched them shoot a scene from multiple angles where April fought some ninja with a sai and Will Arnett’s Vernon did some brawling too. With ninjas on gurneys all around.

neatoman
08-15-2014, 02:48 AM
I'm going to paraphrase Yahtzee;
How is that bear ******** in the woods these days?

THGhost
08-15-2014, 06:29 AM
Clearly he was meant to be. But fans moaning online made sure that never happened.

Bry
08-15-2014, 07:23 AM
This article confirms that he was supposed to be the Shredder originally. (http://www.slashfilm.com/tmnt-sequel-characters/)

For those that wanna just read the part where it's confirmed:

I don't get why they can't just be upfront about it. It was extremely obvious. Just own up to it and promise to do better next time and that might buy you a little faith from the fans. (I mean, not from me...)

But the folks behind this movie seem intent on telling all sorts of weird lies:

Jonathan Liebesman had a lot of the ideas in his head

KIDDING GUYS KIDDING :tgrin:

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 01:36 PM
That sounds like a 100% accurate assessment of the situation, from where I sit.

It was never going to be a film. From the beginning, it was product.

Seriously? That is the dumbest thing that I have ever heard during my tenure on this website. Sorry, but even the movies you hold dear are products.