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Panda_Kahn_fan
08-12-2014, 01:38 PM
You know, it occurs to me, with Baxter Stockman and Casey Jones possibly being characters for TMNT 2, it occours to me that the characters of Eric Sachs and Vernon are now redundant (with april playing off of Casey after this in the Sequel) Now, I know this would probably send a few fans in an uproar, but maybe instead of killing them off, there are two certain classic mutants many fan want to see in this movie series.

Maybe already developed characters could be mutated instead of staying around and being redundant, maybe even a former friend who betrays the Turtles and april because he's mad about his car being blown up and April ignoring him in favor of the newly arrived casey... and an adopted son of the foot clan who failed his master, and is looking to redeem himself.

I know most of you would hate this idea of turning those two into two classic OT characters even before it was posted, but given how much this version has already changed from other versions, I was just saying... :lol:

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-12-2014, 01:41 PM
To set up bebop and rocksteady as mutants in the sequel, I think that it would have been nice if the tmnt 2014 movie version of them were punks that became members of the foot. They should have had them in this movie as members of the foot but maskless and briefly teased, man, I think I would have seriously marked out had it happened. Just seeing them look very much like their ot counter parts in human form.

Warhorse
08-12-2014, 03:39 PM
I really think they should kill off Vern. Make him the Rachel of the TMNT series that could not be saved, no matter how hard they tried. Or better yet, like April's dad did, he destroys himself to save the Turtles and April.

Then, comes Casey Jones, to avenge his brother!

Slade
08-12-2014, 03:42 PM
Thought they said cousins?

Xiewin
08-12-2014, 03:42 PM
Get rid of Vern and Sacks, and expand on the more interesting characters like Karai, Oroku Saki, and Hamato Yoshi.

CyberCubed
08-12-2014, 04:03 PM
William Fitcher signed on for a 3 movie deal, so he'll be back.

Joey Kamikaze
08-12-2014, 04:06 PM
One of the major problems with this movie is that by splitting Sachs and Shredder into two characters during post-production, they made one of the villains completely unnecessary and disposable... and it's not Sachs.

You could cut Shredder out of this movie and it wouldn't make much difference. Shredder doesn't have a relationship with any of the characters, not even Splinter, outside fighting them a couple times in order to advance Sachs' plot (and it doesn't matter how much bad post-film fanfic you try to spin otherwise). This is a TMNT universe where the profoundly personal rivalry between the Turtle family and Shredder's Foot that ties into their origin in all previous universes doesn't exist. Regardless of whether Shredder is supposed to be Sachs' "master," he comes across as a lackey. It's like if you made a movie where the Joker was just some hired thug that showed up in fight scenes while Batman chases around some generic villain the director made up for that movie.

No, it's Sachs these turtles have their main beef with--Sachs who created them, Sachs who threatened April, Sachs who will have a personal vendetta against them going forward. Everything meaningful about Shredder as a character outside his appearance has been shifted over to Sachs for this movie and presumably the sequels moving forward. So if you're going to make a sequel to this movie, you might as well just toss out Shredder after the first one because he has jack **** to do with the story. Instead we have Generic White Superscience Terrorist #213452 as the lead villain.

IndigoErth
08-12-2014, 04:14 PM
I could be ok with it if Eric Sachs takes over as "the new Shredder" in part 2 if they were to play it off right. And Vern is... busy... out of town.

Little iffy of bringing in too many new additions too quick though. The more characters there are the less screen time that may go to the Turtles... (Granted I'd be happy even just to watch a movie of them being home and just fussing and carrying on and doing their usual thing there. lol)

beeshaw
08-12-2014, 04:34 PM
(Granted I'd be happy even just to watch a movie of them being home and just fussing and carrying on and doing their usual thing there. lol)

START THE PETITION!!! :tcool:

Andrew NDB
08-12-2014, 04:34 PM
This is a TMNT universe where [i]the profoundly personal rivalry between the Turtle family and Shredder's Foot that ties into their origin in all previous universes doesn't exist

Yup, the biggest thing about the TMNT that intrigues me. The sad, self-perpetuating circle of vengeance that comes to define their lives.

Gone.

Venom
08-12-2014, 04:47 PM
Yup, the biggest thing about the TMNT that intrigues me. The sad, self-perpetuating circle of vengeance that comes to define their lives.

Gone.

Until we learn in the sequel about Splinter and the Turtles being reincarnations of Saki's old brother-in-arms turned foe, Hamato Yoshi, and Yoshi's sons, whom he killed over 500 years ago!

Panda_Kahn_fan
08-12-2014, 05:03 PM
One of the major problems with this movie is that by splitting Sachs and Shredder into two characters during post-production, they made one of the villains completely unnecessary and disposable... and it's not Sachs.

You could cut Shredder out of this movie and it wouldn't make much difference. Shredder doesn't have a relationship with any of the characters, not even Splinter, outside fighting them a couple times in order to advance Sachs' plot (and it doesn't matter how much bad post-film fanfic you try to spin otherwise). This is a TMNT universe where the profoundly personal rivalry between the Turtle family and Shredder's Foot that ties into their origin in all previous universes doesn't exist. Regardless of whether Shredder is supposed to be Sachs' "master," he comes across as a lackey. It's like if you made a movie where the Joker was just some hired thug that showed up in fight scenes while Batman chases around some generic villain the director made up for that movie.

No, it's Sachs these turtles have their main beef with--Sachs who created them, Sachs who threatened April, Sachs who will have a personal vendetta against them going forward. Everything meaningful about Shredder as a character outside his appearance has been shifted over to Sachs for this movie and presumably the sequels moving forward. So if you're going to make a sequel to this movie, you might as well just toss out Shredder after the first one because he has jack **** to do with the story. Instead we have Generic White Superscience Terrorist #213452 as the lead villain.

Yet I'm betting Shredder remains the villian, gets more development, and Sachs drifts into the background as the lackey from here on out.They canged it last minute, and they're not changing it back. I know Fitchner and Arnett aren't going anywhere, I ws just suggesting what could be done with them so they're not just background wallpaper. Impossible for it to happen, though.


And yep, I'd put my money on the reicarnation angle brining the personal feud back into things, though.

Coola Yagami
08-12-2014, 05:16 PM
I doubt it. And if they add it now it would still feel fake and tacked on. They wanted to avoid the personal feud for whatever reason in this movie, they're not gonna suddenly shift gears now.

This movie sucked. A sequel won't change the fact that this movie sucked. Even if the sequel is more of a REAL tmnt movie I'm gonna pretend this one never existed.

snooz
08-12-2014, 05:49 PM
If they are smart, they will turn Sacks into Rat King, which is who he should have been in the first place. I would LOVE to see Rat King in the next movie. When I first heard that he was cast, for the short time that his character was unknown.. I was hoping that he would be Rat King. I was thinking they may go the way of Batman Begins and not use the biggest villain in the franchise for the first movie...

They can still redeem themselves! Turn Sacks into Rat King!!

Warhorse
08-12-2014, 10:09 PM
I could be ok with it if Eric Sachs takes over as "the new Shredder" in part 2 if they were to play it off right. And Vern is... busy... out of town.

Little iffy of bringing in too many new additions too quick though. The more characters there are the less screen time that may go to the Turtles... (Granted I'd be happy even just to watch a movie of them being home and just fussing and carrying on and doing their usual thing there. lol)

This! And the fact that Liebersman wants to now do a story with Dimension X, that's going to cost a lot of production money to get that on film, so that means the Turtles will probably get the shaft on that one.

And I agree, I want to see the Turtles just hanging around at home first before the action starts. As much sh!t Bay gets, at least his movies do have some down time to get to know the characters. The Rock, Pearl Harbor, The Island, Bad Boys 1 and 2 (come on, the backyard BBQ and the boyfriend scene was great) and the first Transformers all had down time moments so you could get to know the characters before the action kicked into gear. Sadly, I think this new movie had a good 20 to 30 minutes shaved from it, heck, it even had a lot of Raphael scenes cut, which could have been some character building scenes.

Ninjinister
08-12-2014, 11:28 PM
If they are smart, they will turn Sacks into Rat King, which is who he should have been in the first place. I would LOVE to see Rat King in the next movie. When I first heard that he was cast, for the short time that his character was unknown.. I was hoping that he would be Rat King. I was thinking they may go the way of Batman Begins and not use the biggest villain in the franchise for the first movie...

They can still redeem themselves! Turn Sacks into Rat King!!

I... I like this idea.

I really think they should kill off Vern. Make him the Rachel of the TMNT series that could not be saved, no matter how hard they tried. Or better yet, like April's dad did, he destroys himself to save the Turtles and April.

Then, comes Casey Jones, to avenge his brother!

Who the boop is Rachel?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-12-2014, 11:49 PM
Dimension X wouldn't cost much if wasn't used a little too much in the movie.

Candy Kappa
08-13-2014, 01:39 AM
Who the boop is Rachel?

There is a Rachel in Dark Knight, could be referencing her. At least she is the one who comes to my mind reading the post.

Coola Yagami
08-13-2014, 06:40 AM
This movie's writing is so bad, expect the sequel to start with April and Vernon already dating for whatever reason.

Shark_Blade
08-13-2014, 08:35 AM
William Fitcher signed on for a 3 movie deal, so he'll be back.

That doesn't mean he is guaranteed to return. It's only that he's obligated to film the movies IF they need him.

If not, bye bye Sacks.

Lou 500
08-13-2014, 10:19 AM
William Fichtner for Rat King, please! I'm still attached to the idea of a fallen Sachs being forced to live like the Turtles - it might create an opening for him being redeemed, actually. But first he'll fight, utilizing the power of vermin to exact vengeance.

I'm thinking they could also introduce the Purple Dragons as a side arc (they choose to call it Pāpuru Tatsu to make it sound less like a gay bar - Mikey makes a crack about this to Hunter, only to be burned by being asked "Do you frequent such clubs?") Hmm, might be too silly though. I basically got this plot in my head of Mikey sneaking off to a skating compeition hosted by them and being caught. However, being captured and held prisoner has already been featured in the first film so it feels too repetitive.

Andrew NDB
08-13-2014, 10:33 AM
Dimension X wouldn't cost much if wasn't used a little too much in the movie.

It would cost a lot of dignity.

Warhorse
08-13-2014, 03:34 PM
There is a Rachel in Dark Knight, could be referencing her. At least she is the one who comes to my mind reading the post.

Yes, that's exactly who I was referencing. It's a good way to show what can happen when the hero does fail.

Xav
08-13-2014, 10:26 PM
William Fichtner for Rat King, please! I'm still attached to the idea of a fallen Sachs being forced to live like the Turtles - it might create an opening for him being redeemed, actually. But first he'll fight, utilizing the power of vermin to exact vengeance.

I'm thinking they could also introduce the Purple Dragons as a side arc (they choose to call it Pāpuru Tatsu to make it sound less like a gay bar - Mikey makes a crack about this to Hunter, only to be burned by being asked "Do you frequent such clubs?") Hmm, might be too silly though. I basically got this plot in my head of Mikey sneaking off to a skating compeition hosted by them and being caught. However, being captured and held prisoner has already been featured in the first film so it feels too repetitive.Why not make him Krang? Also who is Hunter?

IndigoErth
08-13-2014, 11:11 PM
Why not make him Krang?
Or unknowingly controlled by Krang (also controlling Shredder), and sometime in the third movie he's either destroyed or breaks free of Krang's control and becomes an unlikely ally.

Artist
08-15-2014, 02:21 AM
Easy way to fix the origin with a 15 min clip. Open in feudal japan. Yoshi riding a horse to a home that is on fire. In front of the home you see 2 foot ninja confront Yoshi. He fights them off and kills them. You see 4 children and a woman yelling for help. Yoshi goes to burst the door open to rescue his family, and Saki is standing right behind him, "you have betrayed the foot for the last time Yoshi." A slash from Saki's sword, with a first person view of Yoshi looking up at Saki, before it blurs out. Then you see a first person view of Splinter waking up in terror, while the turtles come rushing in to see what is wrong. He says, " I remember our past my sons." Tells them a story of who they are and how he had to betray the foot to protect an alien race known as the utroms from being discovered. Ties up why the japanese influence, learning ninjutsu so quickly, and brings in the utroms. Sacks can become krang who stole some ooze from the good utroms. He and Shredder made a pact in feudal japan. Shredder can have planet earth to rule, and Krang has humans to build his technodrome to take over the galaxy. The turtles need to stop that from happening with a new friend, Casey Jones. Standing in the way are 2 new mutants Bebop and Rocksteady that sacks creates. Vern decides not to pick up Aprils phone calls and just live life. That is how I would play it.

jenna
08-15-2014, 03:51 PM
Yup, the biggest thing about the TMNT that intrigues me. The sad, self-perpetuating circle of vengeance that comes to define their lives.



I can't even begin to articulate how much I want a movie which really delves into this aspect.

Warhorse
08-15-2014, 08:43 PM
I can't even begin to articulate how much I want a movie which really delves into this aspect.

As long as the movies are being made with little kids in mind, I doubt we'll see these dark themes contemplated on screen. If they were to actually focus with a more teenage crowd, then perhaps we will get it.

IndigoErth
08-15-2014, 09:21 PM
Assuming there's more than two in this lineup, just let them turn darker as time gone on maybe...?

They may have made it clear in this one that they're still teens, but they never did say an actual age. For all we know by the time the sequel comes around they've hit 20 and they can move on to 'more serious' film making... lol I wish. (Cuz any of that really makes sense when it's fictional, but whatever. lol)

Warhorse
08-15-2014, 09:53 PM
Assuming there's more than two in this lineup, just let them turn darker as time gone on maybe...?

They may have made it clear in this one that they're still teens, but they never did say an actual age. For all we know by the time the sequel comes around they've hit 20 and they can move on to 'more serious' film making... lol I wish. (Cuz any of that really makes sense when it's fictional, but whatever. lol)

Didn't April's camera or news clipping say something about 1999, and if we are to assume the movie in it's current setting is 2014, then that would make the Turtles roughly 15 years.