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ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-20-2014, 11:01 PM
Now that we have had a taste of this new movie version of tmnt, which of you guys will be skipping the sequel as of right now?

Autbot_Benz
08-20-2014, 11:04 PM
Now that we have had a taste of this new movie version of tmnt, which of you guys will be skipping the sequel as of right now?

50% of this forum will :lol:

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-20-2014, 11:07 PM
50% of this forum will :lol:

The people who didn't like the first one may as well because we are going to get more of the same. No matter what.

Autbot_Benz
08-20-2014, 11:09 PM
The people who didn't like the first one may as well because we are going to get more of the same. No matter what.

that's who I meant.

turtle1237
08-20-2014, 11:09 PM
Sure, why not.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-20-2014, 11:14 PM
that's who I meant.

I know. :P

Davetello
08-21-2014, 12:03 AM
I will still watch it because it's the turtles. I consume everything I possibly can, even if it has a reputation for being rubbish. I think the Archie comics are the only serious part of the franchise I haven't consumed at least partially (other than the odd video game), and I plan to rectify that soon.

I think it's important to approach these things with an open-mind, even when you feel trepidation because you expect it to be sh!t. It's worth giving everything a go, at least.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 12:19 AM
It should come down to what you value and what is being offered to you. Not just those, but a correlation and sufficientness.

Davetello
08-21-2014, 12:25 AM
It comes down to what you value and what is being offered to you. Not just those, but a correlation and sufficientness.

That's true. I certainly see the logic in not settling for a half-arsed product, and for trying to maintain standards. Also, the paradox of choice dictates that so much competes for our free time that we are sort of obligated to fill it only with quality entertainment.

However, as most of us are in love with the turtles, I feel we can be more forgiving of the iterations where it lacks quality than we would of some other franchise. If you get what I mean. Others might say the opposite - that because the turtles matter so much to us we should be extremely hard on it and demand only the very best. It can work both ways.

I just feel compelled to take in as much turtles as I can - even the bad stuff. In saying that, I won't be watching this film again until October at the earliest.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 12:42 AM
That's true. I certainly see the logic in not settling for a half-arsed product, and for trying to maintain standards. Also, the paradox of choice dictates that so much competes for our free time that we are sort of obligated to fill it only with quality entertainment.

However, as most of us are in love with the turtles, I feel we can be more forgiving of the iterations where it lacks quality than we would of some other franchise. If you get what I mean. Others might say the opposite - that because the turtles matter so much to us we should be extremely hard on it and demand only the very best. It can work both ways.

I just feel compelled to take in as much turtles as I can - even the bad stuff. In saying that, I won't be watching this film again until October at the earliest.

You are talking about the kind of b.s. where people who deride this movie praise movies that has the same style as this? The style I speak of is generic. In terms of story (being simplistic, uninteresting because of the arc part of it), characters' personalities, and character moments (their verbal communication, their actions that requires no verbal communication). And let us not forget that thing known as character development, the lightness of it.

THGhost
08-21-2014, 11:44 AM
Hopefully the first movie will actually get released in the UK before the sequel arrives. ;)

TigerClaw
08-21-2014, 12:04 PM
I'm looking forward to the Sequel, There are things they can fix in the Sequel, I'm sure the Writers and Producers are reading all the Fan Feedback for the 1st one, And will improve on some of the issues with the sequel.

Donaterro
08-21-2014, 12:12 PM
I'm looking forward to the Sequel, There are things they can fix in the Sequel, I'm sure the Writers and Producers are reading all the Fan Feedback for the 1st one, And will improve on some of the issues with the sequel.

No, everyone already got paid. They don't give a crap about how bad the movie was.

turtlefanforever
08-21-2014, 12:17 PM
i'll admit eventually i'll end up watching it in some capacity but its an easy pass for me. Unless they make major changes in the designs and take it seriously which they won't.

RaphaelinSTL
08-21-2014, 12:25 PM
No, everyone already got paid. They don't give a crap about how bad the movie was.

This.

Basically Platinum Dunes has been rewarded with putting together a film with such minimal effort that it's ridiculous to think they'll try and put something that flows much better in regards to plot, character development and creativity. I hate to think of it in this capacity but looks how the Transformers movies continued to be weaker films as the series went on. With Bay's team involved, it's so sad to think of the TMNT film franchise following a similar pattern.

I'll do what I can to snag sneak preview tickets to TMNT 2 when it comes out in two years, that way....if I truly think the series is getting worse I won't have to lose sleep over giving my hard earned money to a sinking ship.

IndigoErth
08-21-2014, 12:29 PM
Little soon to decide that isn't it... Some may choose to boycott this variation entirely and that is their choice. Personally I will decide much closer to the release date depending on what they seem to have done with it, and esp if they have listened to feedback and improved on some things.

Thread sounds sorta like it's meant to bait/call out/start arguments over a new movie far sooner than necessary. It should probably be kept in mind that sequels often do not match or beat the first one (in terms of looking at this set on it's own and not comparing to the original films), even if someone is utterly in love with this one does not mean they necessarily will be just as much with the next...

TigerClaw
08-21-2014, 12:32 PM
Little soon to decide that isn't it... Some may choose to boycott this variation entirely and that is their choice. Personally I will decide much closer to the release date depending on what they seem to have done with it, and esp if they have listened to feedback and improved on some things.

Thread sounds sorta like it's meant to bait/call out/start arguments over a new movie far sooner than necessary. It should probably be kept in mind that sequels often do not match or beat the first one (in terms of looking at this set as it's own and not comparing to the original films), even if someone is utterly in love with this one does not mean they necessarily will be just as much with the next...
Yeah and I do believe they listen to the Fans, Remember all the trouble the 1st film went through with the different scripts and so on, They changed all that stuff after hearing a lot of negative feedback, And then the film became what it was, Which I have no problems with.

For the sequel, I have a feeling they'll closely listen to a lot of feedback from the fans, Particularly the issues some have in regards of the screen time for the the Turtles. Who knows, Perhaps the sequel will have a lot more screen time for all the Turtles then April, Since the 1st was an Origin Story, They can go from there and the sequel could entirely focus on the Turtles.

chrisdude
08-21-2014, 01:06 PM
They did massive rewrites and reshoots based on fan reactions. You can fault these guys for a lot of things, but you can't say that they don't care what we think. They're absolutely listening to us.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 01:08 PM
Little soon to decide that isn't it... Some may choose to boycott this variation entirely and that is their choice. Personally I will decide much closer to the release date depending on what they seem to have done with it, and esp if they have listened to feedback and improved on some things.

Thread sounds sorta like it's meant to bait/call out/start arguments over a new movie far sooner than necessary. It should probably be kept in mind that sequels often do not match or beat the first one (in terms of looking at this set on it's own and not comparing to the original films), even if someone is utterly in love with this one does not mean they necessarily will be just as much with the next...

It is, but you know what? these kind of people exist. So why not?

They did massive rewrites and reshoots based on fan reactions. You can fault these guys for a lot of things, but you can't say that they don't care what we think. They're absolutely listening to us.

You're damn right, people think they don't care. How do the really picky tmnt fans expect to get a tmnt movie they want when all of them want something different?

RaphaelinSTL
08-21-2014, 01:17 PM
It is, but you know what? these kind of people exist. So why not?

Your damn right, people keep ignoring the fact that they did listen to us.

Yeah but that's just them playing PR and trying to cover their asses really.

Fans wanted a none-white washed and asian Shredder...so they gave us that, but Shredder has no real character arc or motivation throughout the film as the Shredder role was clearly supposed to be given to Eric Sachs. It's like they're listening, but they're not getting what we're saying.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 01:32 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's normal for shredder to have no character arc. He's a bad guy, as for having no motivation? He did have one, I think your problem is that his motivation was poor.

chrisdude
08-21-2014, 01:39 PM
Yeah but that's just them playing PR and trying to cover their asses really.

Fans wanted a none-white washed and asian Shredder...so they gave us that, but Shredder has no real character arc or motivation throughout the film as the Shredder role was clearly supposed to be given to Eric Sachs. It's like they're listening, but they're not getting what we're saying.Or, like they're listening, but they were already deep in production. :ohwell:
We know that the turtles were aliens from Dimension X just before Michael Bay said "alien," and everyone freaked. And they changed that. That was a huge change that would shift the future of the franchise. Even I was saying, back then, that they wouldn't drop the alien aspect because it was probably integral to their sequel plans.

Maybe it's CYA, and maybe they actually care. We can't really know. But we do know they listen.

RaphaelinSTL
08-21-2014, 01:40 PM
As far as I am concerned, it's normal for shredder to have no character arc. He's a bad guy, as for having no motivation? He did have one, I think your problem is that his motivation was poor.

I can kind of see what you're getting at, but that's just more problems with the writing and script too.

Shredder is quoted as saying he wants the Foot to be fully established as much more than just mere myth....or something along those lines. However, the Foot seems to be doing pretty well for itself as they're making national news for their terrorists antics and they've got a successful businessman in Erich Sachs condemning them.

Eh?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 01:46 PM
I will be honest, although I like shredder, I think that he has always been not just a classic sort of villain but a really typical kind of one as well. His outfit and ninja side aside. I think this version of shredder is the most dedicated one when it comes to the live action tmnt movies.

chrisdude
08-21-2014, 01:51 PM
The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers from bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling and character development if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

RaphaelinSTL
08-21-2014, 01:51 PM
I will be honest, although I like shredder, I think that he has always been not just a classic sort of villain but a really typical kind of one as well. His outfit and ninja side aside.

I can see your point.

I mean besides just his cartoon side where he was bent on world domination all the time, the 1990 movie and Mirage series really paints a better picture on who I always envisioned the Shredder to be.

The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

Agreed. Although I might not have dug the story and the changes, I could appreciate the film much more by taking it for what it's worth and the studio being confident in the unique and original story it's trying to tell...as opposed to pandering to fans.

DioLeo451
08-21-2014, 01:55 PM
I'll go see it but just try not to get as hyped this time keep my expectations low

snake
08-21-2014, 01:56 PM
I'll see it because I know nothing will top the first one in how bad it was.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 02:02 PM
What I like about the ot shredder is that he wasn't just a ninja, he was scientific and knew about alien technology. I admire his fighting spirit, every time he failed he kept coming.

Leo656
08-21-2014, 02:19 PM
I honestly think it goes both ways as far as the studio goes. They do think they "know better", but are well aware of how fan backlash can sink a licensed property quicker than anything. So they make a few token changes to placate the more vocal people, but do it in such a half-hearted way that it entirely misses the point.

They get the "What" but not the "Why", basically. They know what we want to see, because we flat-out tell them, but completely misunderstand the reasons why some of those things are important, like Shredder being Japanese for example. It's not because, "Well, he's always Japanese", it's because the backstory has always been supremely relevant to the larger story. They failed to grasp the nuance in that, so their effort amounts to little more than pasted-on fan service.

It's not that they completely don't care, because obviously they're paying attention. But people working in Hollywood have a certain type of arrogance that doesn't allow them to admit that they may have been completely off-base with their approach to a project. So they try and have it both ways and often the end result is something that doesn't fully satisfy anyone.

TigerClaw
08-21-2014, 02:26 PM
I honestly think it goes both ways as far as the studio goes. They do think they "know better", but are well aware of how fan backlash can sink a licensed property quicker than anything. So they make a few token changes to placate the more vocal people, but do it in such a half-hearted way that it entirely misses the point.

They get the "What" but not the "Why", basically. They know what we want to see, because we flat-out tell them, but completely misunderstand the reasons why some of those things are important, like Shredder being Japanese for example. It's not because, "Well, he's always Japanese", it's because the backstory has always been supremely relevant to the larger story. They failed to grasp the nuance in that, so their effort amounts to little more than pasted-on fan service.

It's not that they completely don't care, because obviously they're paying attention. But people working in Hollywood have a certain type of arrogance that doesn't allow them to admit that they may have been completely off-base with their approach to a project. So they try and have it both ways and often the end result is something that doesn't fully satisfy anyone.
There is also that side where people involve in the movies, want complete creative control of what you see on screen, Sometimes the Studios would have clashes with the producer and the director, if what they came up with, wasn't what the studio wanted.

Leo656
08-21-2014, 02:38 PM
Oh lord, you're tellin' me. I've studied way too much about the hundreds of failed Superman and Batman movies over the last two decades, for example, so believe me, I know. It's awful to know for a fact that even the worst of those movies were pretty much miles better than almost anything we almost got. All because one producer thinks Superman shouldn't fly, or this other producer thinks a mechanic named Big Al is a suitable replacement for Alfred, or that a super-hero movie just isn't complete until the hero fights a giant robot spider in the third act, regardless if it makes any kind of story sense, and all the while, the studio is in the background screaming, "We don't care about the story, damn it, write whatever, nobody cares, kids are stupid... just make this sh*t look like a toy commercial so we can sell some goddamn plastic!"

I've seen enough to know I've seen too much. :ohwell:

Galactus
08-21-2014, 07:38 PM
The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers from bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling and character development if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

I'd say "bending over backwards to please the fans" is pushing it more than a little. They made some token changes in an attempt to please (or should it be appease) the fans and yes the movie seemingly suffers because of it.

Bending over backwards would be if they'd done a bigger changes. At very least doing a li'l bit of research into what they were doing to make sure the changes they were making really would please the fans. They were halfhearted efforts at best.

As to whether I'd see a sequel?

After curiosity getting the better of me I broke down and watched this one and it was much worse than I thought given everything I've read.

To me it's certainly a sub par TMNT movie in every regard bar the FX (definitely the worst in the franchise and given the quality of every movie after the first that's saying something) but it just fails as a movie in itself.

Now some of that I believe you can put down to the constant changes and hope that if the makers start off on the right track this time it wouldn't go down the same way however it's weird that they couldn't make a halfway decent product out of what they had, I'd actually be embarrassed to have let this out in it's current form.

Also I think they've lost a lot of credibility with me (not they had much to begin with) where were the Raid style action sequences they promised? Certainly the seemed to be a minimal focus on martial arts in general? Didn't they promise the turtles would be the focus? Didn't they keep teasing that a theme would be the turtles alienation from the surface world? Where the hell was that? True some of the above could be a case of ending up on the cutting room floor but a lot it seems they straight up lied about. Why should I trust them?

One tip I'll give them that I think fans will appreciate is be more open about the movie during the production. Don't promise it's good show us why it will be good, otherwise I'm going to assume it's garbage.

NinjaPug
08-21-2014, 09:48 PM
Are you just trying to instigate **** with this thread?

chrisdude
08-21-2014, 10:23 PM
This feels like when they rebooted Star Trek, except this time, I'm on the happy side.

"Where's the social commentary? Where's the naval battle style? Why does it just focus on Kirk and Spock?

I also don't think adding Saki is a token change.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-21-2014, 10:33 PM
Are you just trying to instigate **** with this thread?

No. What you're seeing is a figment from your mind. :D

Warhorse
08-21-2014, 10:51 PM
The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers from bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling and character development if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

Yeah, they should of just kept with the story, and then at the end, show the real Shredder, in Japan, not pleased with some loser impersonating him in NYC. That's what I would have done.

turtlefanforever
08-21-2014, 11:09 PM
The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers from bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling and character development if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

the original script was crap too

samxsteal
08-21-2014, 11:24 PM
the original script was crap too

NO an Older draft was crap there is no proof that Blue door was Even close to the final draft of a script.
One scene maybe

Galactus
08-22-2014, 03:53 AM
NO an Older draft was crap there is no proof that Blue door was Even close to the final draft of a script.
One scene maybe

There's a whole lot in the movie from leaked script. Far more than one scene.

Not to mwntion they were still trying to justify their intention to make the turtlees and Shredder aliens at comic con. Doesn't instill me with a whole lot of confidence for a sequel.

samxsteal
08-22-2014, 07:04 AM
There's a whole lot in the movie from leaked script. Far more than one scene.

Not to mwntion they were still trying to justify their intention to make the turtlees and Shredder aliens at comic con. Doesn't instill me with a whole lot of confidence for a sequel.

Good for you. I'm even more excited for the sequel with the basics already finished it's just leaves room for a lot more development for the movie the designs are finished so there toner they can spend on properly building the movie story and plot. I just hope they can keep the leaks from happening this time so we don't have to here all the people crying and then try to make them happy by changing it.

massakre
08-22-2014, 08:07 AM
I TRULY believe the sequel will have vast improvements over the first one. This is just my opinion and its based solely off of the fan/critic reaction to the first movie as well as the OBVIOUS last min script changes that gave us a diff movie than was intended.

Bry
08-22-2014, 08:12 AM
The great irony of this film is that it actually suffers from bending over backwards to please the fans. You can't have perfect storytelling and character development if you're rewriting during and after shooting.

If they hadn't rewritten and backtracked after every online PR disaster we probably would have gotten that Alien Ninja Turtles movie - and it would have gone over with audiences like a wet fart.

Sorry to say, but creatively this movie was pretty much doomed from jump street. They went into it so wrong-headed there was no way they were gonna get it right in the eleventh hour. They tried to backtrack and course-correct as much as they could, but it was just too late to wind up with anything but a mess.

Unfortunately, the same people who made this movie the mess it is are in charge of the sequel, so... yeah, you can count me out. I'm actually angry I wasted two hours going to see it, even though I got in free, so there's no way I'll make that mistake twice.

I honestly think it goes both ways as far as the studio goes. They do think they "know better", but are well aware of how fan backlash can sink a licensed property quicker than anything. So they make a few token changes to placate the more vocal people, but do it in such a half-hearted way that it entirely misses the point.

They get the "What" but not the "Why", basically. They know what we want to see, because we flat-out tell them, but completely misunderstand the reasons why some of those things are important, like Shredder being Japanese for example. It's not because, "Well, he's always Japanese", it's because the backstory has always been supremely relevant to the larger story. They failed to grasp the nuance in that, so their effort amounts to little more than pasted-on fan service.

It's not that they completely don't care, because obviously they're paying attention. But people working in Hollywood have a certain type of arrogance that doesn't allow them to admit that they may have been completely off-base with their approach to a project. So they try and have it both ways and often the end result is something that doesn't fully satisfy anyone.

What he said.

Galactus
08-22-2014, 10:50 AM
Good for you. I'm even more excited for the sequel with the basics already finished it's just leaves room for a lot more development for the movie the designs are finished so there toner they can spend on properly building the movie story and plot. I just hope they can keep the leaks from happening this time so we don't have to here all the people crying and then try to make them happy by changing it.

I literally have no idea how that is a relevant response to what I said.

In the spirit of further conversation though I'll say there wouldn't be a problem with leaks if they are open and released details and talked publicly about the production the way people involved in other major movies do.

Also as you've said ad nauseam we don't know for certain that they changed anything. While it seems very obvious they did I'm surprised to see you say this, it now seems to be used as an excuse to overlook some pretty big flaws.

I'd say there's problems with this movie that have nothing to do with changing the identity of Shredder and while the movie might have flowed better had they stuck with Sacks as the one in the armor I have zero interest in seeing a TMNT series with some generic business man as the villain (I don't have much of interest in a series with Shredder as the only big villain either but I'm sure this will happen and you could argue the character needs redeeming from this poor showing). I'd also point out they wouldn't have to change anything if they are on the right track from the beginning but from the same team as that Blue Door script I don't hold out much hope.

fridaynightdestination
08-22-2014, 11:47 AM
You guys do realize that not everyone here hates the movie. Not everyone here like it either, but some people like it, I am one of them. I'll be seeing the sequel for sure :D

samxsteal
08-22-2014, 01:49 PM
I TRULY believe the sequel will have vast improvements over the first one. This is just my opinion and its based solely off of the fan/critic reaction to the first movie as well as the OBVIOUS last min script changes that gave us a diff movie than was intended. I think they will Knock this next one out of the park With most holes in the story being open in a way to easily fill, and Character and plot point finished they dont have to start from scratch Character designs are done likely on many we haven't seen yet Remember Casey, BB&RS, And krang were supposed to be in this first movie there designs are likely completed at least in the concept stage which take so long so they can take the time to focus on Narrative.

IDK i see so much potential for the next movie it gets me excited I loved the first one i cant wait for the second one ^_^


You guys do realize that not everyone here hates the movie. Not everyone here like it either, but some people like it, I am one of them. I'll be seeing the sequel for sure :D

Pretty sure they couldn't care Less -_- Every one should hate this movie vehemently, other wise they're sheep

chrisdude
08-22-2014, 02:55 PM
My list of objections to The Blue Door is rather short. As much as I love this movie, I would've been cool with them not changing it quite so much.

IndigoErth
08-22-2014, 03:07 PM
Pretty sure they couldn't care Less
Well that much is pretty much true. To be fair it goes both ways. I dunno if people are expecting a reward for liking it, or hating it. Stating like or hate outside the context of sharing a related opinion/view on something about it, with the like or hate being the entirety of their statement (excluding threads exclusively asking for such), just kind of leaves me thinking "Ok, and..? Good for you." Not to sound like a jerk or anything...

RaphaelinSTL
08-22-2014, 03:14 PM
Unfortunately, the same people who made this movie the mess it is are in charge of the sequel, so... yeah, you can count me out. I'm actually angry I wasted two hours going to see it, even though I got in free, so there's no way I'll make that mistake twice.

Dude. I hear ya. I think about this movie sometimes and I get the same kind of feeling every now and then.

Oh and apparently there's an interview up with the film maker's in where they discuss more about a possible sequel.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/teenage_mutant_ninja_turtles/news/?a=106443

Well I would love to see Bebop and Rocksteady go at it with the Turtles. I just think that everything that this movie, the movie we just made everything about it and how fun it is.I just think it would be unbelievable to see those two sets of characters go at each other and I think Bebop and Rocksteady also bring such comedy to the movie. You know, that’s what we’re trying to do, just make it a really fun family film and I would love to see those two guys try and hunt down the Turtles. It would be a lot of fun.

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/rightclick5ave/27235625/7222/7222_original.gif

Reading more of that interview makes me sad, hopefully this thing finds a way to get pushed back and cancelled.

Warhorse
08-22-2014, 03:43 PM
So, can we see an increase or decrease in the production budget?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 03:43 PM
I am just in time for another session of taking the new movie version of tmnt very seriously, yay. :roll:

chrisdude
08-22-2014, 03:51 PM
Pretty much any successful movie is expected to make more in the sequel. The movie floats around for a couple years and the fanbase grows, and more people care by the time the second movie comes out. The budget should go up, purely by virtue of being a successful film. Even an unexpectedly bad sequel tends to outgross the original, so they almost can't go wrong.

The Stryker
08-22-2014, 04:29 PM
I thought the first was a lot of fun.

Can't wait to see another one. Especially since they're so heavily talking about adding my two favorite villains.

Galactus
08-22-2014, 04:45 PM
Pretty much any successful movie is expected to make more in the sequel. The movie floats around for a couple years and the fanbase grows, and more people care by the time the second movie comes out. The budget should go up, purely by virtue of being a successful film. Even an unexpectedly bad sequel tends to outgross the original, so they almost can't go wrong.

The idea that a sequel out grosses the original is a fairly modern convention. Traditionally sequels made progressively less apart from a few anomalies.

A lot of people have said that this movie has opened with similar figures to Thor and Captain America: The First Avenger but the generally feeling from those movies was positive whereas TMNT has been a lot more divisive.

What TMNT does have going for it is the morbid curiosity that the next one will be different especially as they're going to go with fan favorite characters, Of course that's were it personally falls down for me.

You guys do realize that not everyone here hates the movie. Not everyone here like it either, but some people like it, I am one of them. I'll be seeing the sequel for sure :D

Has anyone said that they think everyone here hates the movie?

I may question the validity of a few people (I think most people know what I mean by this ;)) but I'm sure that there are fans that genuinely liked it but then when I see a lot of those same names are the ones that have previously expressed the sentiment that it's exciting just to have a big live action TMNT movie then that kinda says something.

If I'm coming across even more negative than I usually am it's that curiosity got the better of me and I actually watched the movie and even with reading everything about it I was still shocked by things and went away very disappointed.

Don't get me wrong I know this movie wasn't aimed at people like me but it should have been...in the sense that it should have been aimed at the broadest audience possible.

Leibesman has said more than once that he wanted this movie to be so that even people who no knowledge or love for the franchise to be able to understand but it relies very heavily on prior knowledge to understand a very shoddily put together story. Would anyone appreciate the origin if they didn't already like the franchise - hell even fans that liked this movie have expressed that they hope it gets expanded on the sequel, would anyone get why April and the turtles would bond so fast despite hardly knowing each other if it wasn't for previously versions that set it up better, would anyone understand the whole Shredder thing and his scheme? I don't anyone really gets that regardless. Why would anyone with no love for the franchise sit through a very dull 20 + minutes of an April O'Neil movie to get to the turtles?

I did seek out a thread talking about things I would like to see in a sequel and started typing away but it suddenly hit me if they're going to have Casey I'd love for his back story from Tales of the TMNT in there but I realized if they have Hun he'd just be there like Karai was. As a fan I feel very alienated.

Now I'm one fan and I know Bay, Leibesman and co couldn't give a **** but I know I'm not alone in feeling this way - so yeah no sequel for me unless they can show us that they give a crap this time.

Leolead
08-22-2014, 04:51 PM
You guys do realize that not everyone here hates the movie. Not everyone here like it either, but some people like it, I am one of them. I'll be seeing the sequel for sure :D
Me too! :D :thumbsup:

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 05:00 PM
A part of me wishes that the writers or liebesman were on this site. But just to see how people would react and what they say.

Xiewin
08-22-2014, 05:02 PM
I wonder why PD, especially Liebesman, lied so much about this movie. I feel like I can't trust these people's words anymore. I'm trying to get excited for the sequel, but it's almost getting impossible for me to do so. They all claim to be such big fans, but why would they make April the main focus of the movie, cut out a ton of character development for the turtles, or forcibly make the movie under a 100 minutes long? I wonder, will they at least try to fix the glaring problems that were in the first movie and apply it to the second, or will they just get lazy and use the same formula because apparently people will see it anyways.

A part of me wishes that the writers or liebesman were on this site. But just to see how people would react and what they say.

I wish they would try to get suggestions or answer questions from normal fans, but I doubt they would do that since apparently they think they're to good for that.

Leolead
08-22-2014, 05:04 PM
I wonder why PD, especially Liebesman, lied so much about this movie. I feel like I can't trust these people's words anymore. I'm trying to get excited for the sequel, but it's almost getting impossible for me to do so. They all claim to be such big fans, but why would they make April the main focus of the movie, cut out a ton of character development for the turtles, or forcibly make the movie under a 100 minutes long? I wonder, will they at least try to fix the glaring problems that were in the first movie and apply it to the second, or will they just get lazy and use the same formula because apparently people will see it anyways.
Sad but true.

Why was April the main focus?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 05:06 PM
I wonder why PD, especially Liebesman, lied so much about this movie. I feel like I can't trust these people's words anymore. I'm trying to get excited for the sequel, but it's almost getting impossible for me to do so. They all claim to be such big fans, but why would they make April the main focus of the movie, cut out a ton of character development for the turtles, or forcibly make the movie under a 100 minutes long? I wonder, will they at least try to fix the glaring problems that were in the first movie and apply it to the second, or will they just get lazy and use the same formula because apparently people will see it anyways.

1. Honestly? No.
2. Um, the only turtle stuff that got cut out involved raph, none of the other turtles.

I feel as if the people who didn't like the movie much are letting their disapproval of it...well it's like it's the reason behind them saying baseless things about it.

Xiewin
08-22-2014, 05:10 PM
Sad but true.

Why was April the main focus?

My guess is because they used the bluedoor script as a blueprint for the re-written story.

1. Honestly? No.
2. Um, the only turtle stuff that got cut out involved raph, none of the other turtles.

You sure? Wasn't there a cut scene where the turtles were talking with each other after meeting April for the first time? you know When the Visual History book showed a piece of the script. Or in the BTS where the turtles were in a dojo sitting all together, and another where they were all sitting together at a table, including the tour of the lair where you see Leo and Raph training in the background? Just little things like that I was really looking forward too, all which were not found in the movie. I was also looking forward to the scene where Raph was teaching April how to use Sai's. I feel like they cut too much out in order for the movie to under 100 minutes.

I feel as if the people who didn't like the movie much are letting their disapproval of it...well it's like it's the reason behind them saying baseless things about it.

Really? I'm basing this off of actual pictures, bts, and footage that wasn't in the movie I didn't just make all this up. There were alot of things that Liebesman and his crew promised that were going to be in the film, but I didn't see any of that :/

IndigoErth
08-22-2014, 05:24 PM
2. Um, the only turtle stuff that got cut out involved raph, none of the other turtles.
How do we know... For all we are aware there could still be other stuff that didn't make it in that we simply never knew about.

People who didn't like like the movie for the most part are letting their disapproval make them state baseless and hollow statements.
I assure you that is capable of happening on either side. Some angry nostalgia glasses and some lovestruck rose colored glasses are equally as thick.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 05:29 PM
How do we know... For all we are aware there could still be other stuff that didn't make it in that we simply never knew about.


I assure you that is capable of happening on either side. Some angry nostalgia glasses and some lovestruck rose colored glasses are equally as thick.

If there was we would have known about it by now, there would have been proof. Eh, they still look like the dominant bunch from the looks of it.

chrisdude
08-22-2014, 05:31 PM
The idea that a sequel out grosses the original is a fairly modern convention. Traditionally sequels made progressively less apart from a few anomalies.

A lot of people have said that this movie has opened with similar figures to Thor and Captain America: The First Avenger but the generally feeling from those movies was positive whereas TMNT has been a lot more divisive.

What TMNT does have going for it is the morbid curiosity that the next one will be different especially as they're going to go with fan favorite characters, Of course that's were it personally falls down for me.The movie is divisive here, sure. But I certainly haven't gotten that impression elsewhere. My friends liked it. I haven't actually talked to anyone who was disappointed...

Xiewin
08-22-2014, 05:31 PM
If there was we would have known about it by now. Eh, they still look like the dominant bunch from the looks of it.

ehh..I wouldn't be so sure of that.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 05:35 PM
Or we would have known about it before the movie was released.

Bry
08-22-2014, 05:47 PM
Dude. I hear ya. I think about this movie sometimes and I get the same kind of feeling every now and then.

Oh and apparently there's an interview up with the film maker's in where they discuss more about a possible sequel.

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/teenage_mutant_ninja_turtles/news/?a=106443


Well I would love to see Bebop and Rocksteady go at it with the Turtles. I just think that everything that this movie, the movie we just made everything about it and how fun it is.I just think it would be unbelievable to see those two sets of characters go at each other and I think Bebop and Rocksteady also bring such comedy to the movie. You know, that’s what we’re trying to do, just make it a really fun family film and I would love to see those two guys try and hunt down the Turtles. It would be a lot of fun.

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/rightclick5ave/27235625/7222/7222_original.gif

Reading more of that interview makes me sad, hopefully this thing finds a way to get pushed back and cancelled.

And that tells me everything I need to know. It's gonna be another bad, stupid movie, because they don't care about making something that even tries for anything deeper, or even something that makes a bit of sense. Big, dumb "fun". That's it.

And sure, "dumb fun" has a place. But you can do that and give the story some redeeming qualities. You can do that in a well-written movie that makes sense, has actual characters and even has a bit of a "point" or a message. Kids' movies do that all the time, but these guys don't care about any of that, at all. They've set the bar so low you could trip over it.

It's the "turn your brain off" argument. I can't get behind that. People turn their brains off too often as it is - give me something entertaining that actually has some meaning and some themes I can think about. Something that makes me feel something from a place of genuine emotion. If you're expecting me hand over my hard-earned money and clap and cheer because Mikey farted and made a boner joke and then something exploded... no, guys. No. Try harder. I'm not rewarding that. I don't know why anyone would. We need higher standards.

RaphaelinSTL
08-22-2014, 05:59 PM
And that tells me everything I need to know. It's gonna be another bad, stupid movie, because they don't care about making something that even tries for anything deeper, or even something that makes a bit of sense. Big, dumb "fun". That's it.

And sure, "dumb fun" has a place. But you can do that and give the story some redeeming qualities. You can do that in a well-written movie that makes sense, has actual characters and even has a bit of a "point" or a message. Kids' movies do that all the time, but these guys don't care about any of that, at all. They've set the bar so low you could trip over it.

It's the "turn your brain off" argument. I can't get behind that. People turn their brains off too often as it is - give me something entertaining that actually has some meaning and some themes I can think about. Something that makes me feel something from a place of genuine emotion. If you're expecting me hand over my hard-earned money and clap and cheer because Mikey farted and made a boner joke and then something exploded... no, guys. No. Try harder. I'm not rewarding that. I don't know why anyone would. We need higher standards.

Exactly. It's one track mind entertainment, there should be something more substantial to it.

Xiewin
08-22-2014, 06:03 PM
And that tells me everything I need to know. It's gonna be another bad, stupid movie, because they don't care about making something that even tries for anything deeper, or even something that makes a bit of sense. Big, dumb "fun". That's it.

And sure, "dumb fun" has a place. But you can do that and give the story some redeeming qualities. You can do that in a well-written movie that makes sense, has actual characters and even has a bit of a "point" or a message. Kids' movies do that all the time, but these guys don't care about any of that, at all. They've set the bar so low you could trip over it.

It's the "turn your brain off" argument. I can't get behind that. People turn their brains off too often as it is - give me something entertaining that actually has some meaning and some themes I can think about. Something that makes me feel something from a place of genuine emotion. If you're expecting me hand over my hard-earned money and clap and cheer because Mikey farted and made a boner joke and then something exploded... no, guys. No. Try harder. I'm not rewarding that. I don't know why anyone would. We need higher standards.

Still figuring out why would anyone who was involved in this movie be proud of it. Not saying that no one can like it for what it is, but wouldn't you like to see something better overall?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 06:08 PM
The movie has themes and a message.

Bry
08-22-2014, 06:10 PM
I admit, "don't burn down your place of employment while you and your child are inside" is a pretty good message.

"If you're already super rich, don't hatch inane evil schemes to murder innocent people in order to somehow get richer" holds up too.

"Don't try to poison everyone in New York City or else Will Arnett will knock you out" is iffy.

"If your kids like Gwen Stefani, you should teach them martial arts"? That might be the best one, now that I think about it.

RaphaelinSTL
08-22-2014, 06:27 PM
The movie has themes and a message.

I don't know man, it's forced and not organic though. You don't get enough time with the characters to believe the ham-fisted attempts of themes of "family."

They have to keep pushing it in your face as opposed to letting the story give you a sense of it. I mean come on, the Turtles have a spray painted sign of "family?" Pretty hokey.

It's why Raph's big speech at the end of the film holds no weight.

Bry
08-22-2014, 06:31 PM
"If you are Will Arnett, William Fichtner or Academy Award-winner Whoopi Goldberg, you should ask to read the script before signing a contract." That's the message that's going to resonate for years to come.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 06:38 PM
I don't know man, it's forced and not organic though. You don't get enough time with the characters to believe the ham-fisted attempts of themes of "family."

They have to keep pushing it in your face as opposed to letting the story give you a sense of it. I mean come on, the Turtles have a spray painted sign of "family?" Pretty hokey.

It's why Raph's big speech at the end of the film holds no weight.

1. Organic? As in simple? What's forced and not organic?
2. Ham-fisted? Subjective.
3. Spray painted sign that says family? So what? That is a strange criticism. Hokey as in what? Being old fashioned? Very silly? Sentimental? That is nothing, there could have been a lot of group photos of the turtles and splinter all over their place.

Galactus
08-22-2014, 06:55 PM
The movie is divisive here, sure. But I certainly haven't gotten that impression elsewhere. My friends liked it. I haven't actually talked to anyone who was disappointed...

I think the movie is divisive all over. Putting aside the professional reviews some of which were from people who class themselves as fans, or even internet personalities like Andre the Black Nerd or Nostalgia Critic it's pretty obvious looking around that a lot of people (for whatever reasons) didn't like it to go along with all those that did.

I'd also point out the audience for this isn't that sizable. Sure it's a #1 box office "hit" but you'd think that a TMNT movie in an age were Transformers is making billions should be attracting more people at least enough to have made it's budget back by now. I think it's safe to assume that people that are choosing to stay away is because what they've seen they didn't care for.

The movie has themes and a message.

Like?

Still figuring out why would anyone who was involved in this movie be proud of it. Not saying that no one can like it for what it is, but wouldn't you like to see something better overall?

Well they're not going to come out and say that the movie was a mess really.

Even so I feel some sympathy that even while saying he feels to be the "right" thing in what fans want to hear he can't help saying the "wrong" thing. That interview seems to a be a good example - there has often been a debate whether the movies should follow Mirage or Fred Wolf and almost always fans of the latter argue that Bebop & Rocksteady could work in a modern context if they were more akin to the first season snarling beasts but it seems Leibesman feels he later season bunglers is what fans want.

Strangely I think Bebop and Rocksteady could work well in the Michael Bay style if like the first season of the show however it makes you think how they'd contrast with the hulk-like turtles.

I'm not sure Kevin Eastman's artwork should really be an inspiration for the designs. Stuff like the Next Mutation designs and the like aren't what fans or anyone wants to see. I love Bodycount but in the same way as I love All Star Batman and Robin.

I hope he is sincerely in looking at other characters but really look. Not just still images but root out what's good and why it's considered good. Simply putting a character like Karai and have her doing nothing is not fanservice or conducive to making a good movie for anyone. I realize plowing through cartoons and comics of something called Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles is daunting task but it's his job and the fact that these characters and their story have had a thirty year nostalgia grip on the public is because there was something there - find it. Don't just rely on the gimmicks like pizza and surfer slang.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 07:06 PM
I am not going to get into what they are, I feel embarrassed. But not for myself.

Galactus
08-22-2014, 07:09 PM
I am not going to get into what they are, I feel embarrassed. But not for myself.

So nothing then?

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 07:12 PM
So nothing then?

The fact that you and bry need someone to point out what they are is painful to me. That is why I feel embarrassed and would rather not mention them.

Xiewin
08-22-2014, 07:18 PM
Well they're not going to come out and say that the movie was a mess really.

Even so I feel some sympathy that even while saying he feels to be the "right" thing in what fans want to hear he can't help saying the "wrong" thing. That interview seems to a be a good example - there has often been a debate whether the movies should follow Mirage or Fred Wolf and almost always fans of the latter argue that Bebop & Rocksteady could work in a modern context if they were more akin to the first season snarling beasts but it seems Leibesman feels he later season bunglers is what fans want.

Strangely I think Bebop and Rocksteady could work well in the Michael Bay style if like the first season of the show however it makes you think how they'd contrast with the hulk-like turtles.

I'm not sure Kevin Eastman's artwork should really be an inspiration for the designs. Stuff like the Next Mutation designs and the like aren't what fans or anyone wants to see. I love Bodycount but in the same way as I love All Star Batman and Robin.

I hope he is sincere in looking at other characters but really look. Not just still images but root out what's good and why it's considered good. Simply putting a character like Karai and have her doing nothing is not fanservice or conducive to making a good movie for anyone. I realize plowing through cartoons and comics of something called Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles is daunting task but it's his job and the fact that these characters and their story have had a thirty year nostalgia grip on the public is because there was something there - find it. Don't just rely on the gimmicks like pizza and surfer slang.

If Liebesman does return, I really hope that he and the other producers listen to criticism surrounding the first film. I'm pretty worried that they might come out with a pretty messy story again because they know people will still see it regardless. I have a feeling that they probably won't even care enough to improve anything, as long as this movie makes money they'll keep using the same formula over and over again (Though I hope they prove me wrong), similar to the Transformer movies. PD has a history of taking classic stories of horror films from the 80's and creating these bland shamless knockoffs with a little homage to the original. They haven't really improved at all over the years, so it's a bit hard for me to believe that they would try to the make this sequel anymore better than the first. I can't think of one movie that I liked from this company.

Galactus
08-22-2014, 07:20 PM
The fact that you and bry need someone to point out what they are is painful to me. That is why I feel embarrassed and would rather not mention them.

Indulge us. Maybe we need to have these themes and messages pointed out to us to appreciate the movie.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-22-2014, 07:26 PM
Indulge us. Maybe we need to have these themes and messages pointed out to us to appreciate the movie.

If you guys want to know then I will have to know what your definition of message and theme is. First.

The True Shredder
08-22-2014, 07:41 PM
If you guys want to know then I will have to know what your definition of message and theme is. First.

Ever heard of a dictionary? Look it up sometime. The definition is under those words.

chrisdude
08-22-2014, 07:42 PM
This is like an awkward scene out of The Office. :ohwell:

Bry
08-22-2014, 07:49 PM
Ha ha ha oh my god.

*heavy sigh*

Okay. Moving on, then.

IndigoErth
08-22-2014, 07:50 PM
http://38.media.tumblr.com/89f73abceef0f9283ab72d9aefe2f432/tumblr_mztaaqG48e1s6zpepo1_400.gif

TheSkeletonMan939
08-22-2014, 07:52 PM
Nahh, I think I'll skip number two unless the trailers are beyond amazing.

RaphaelinSTL
08-22-2014, 08:13 PM
If you guys want to know then I will have to know what your definition of message and theme is. First.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-bwSxy7Jnx74/U6iyV650OFI/AAAAAAAAdiM/q286hC-ImWk/w426-h237/computer-smash-other-guys-Mark-Wahlberg-angry.gif

Leo656
08-22-2014, 11:18 PM
And that tells me everything I need to know. It's gonna be another bad, stupid movie, because they don't care about making something that even tries for anything deeper, or even something that makes a bit of sense. Big, dumb "fun". That's it.

And sure, "dumb fun" has a place. But you can do that and give the story some redeeming qualities. You can do that in a well-written movie that makes sense, has actual characters and even has a bit of a "point" or a message. Kids' movies do that all the time, but these guys don't care about any of that, at all. They've set the bar so low you could trip over it.

It's the "turn your brain off" argument. I can't get behind that. People turn their brains off too often as it is - give me something entertaining that actually has some meaning and some themes I can think about. Something that makes me feel something from a place of genuine emotion. If you're expecting me hand over my hard-earned money and clap and cheer because Mikey farted and made a boner joke and then something exploded... no, guys. No. Try harder. I'm not rewarding that. I don't know why anyone would. We need higher standards.

Holy sh*t, that was beautiful. Bravo, man.

I'm partial to what Harold Ramis once said, myself... something to the effect of the "shut your brain off" argument being "insulting", and "Why wouldn't you want to think? Why not just shoot yourself in the head?" I miss that guy.

"Higher standards necessary", indeed. If people swallow pablum and applaud it, then it's all they'll ever get.

Warhorse
08-23-2014, 12:48 AM
I wonder why PD, especially Liebesman, lied so much about this movie. I feel like I can't trust these people's words anymore. I'm trying to get excited for the sequel, but it's almost getting impossible for me to do so. They all claim to be such big fans, but why would they make April the main focus of the movie, cut out a ton of character development for the turtles, or forcibly make the movie under a 100 minutes long? I wonder, will they at least try to fix the glaring problems that were in the first movie and apply it to the second, or will they just get lazy and use the same formula because apparently people will see it anyways. .

It's not Liebersman's or PD lies I don't care about, it's Kevin Eastman's lies that hold more weight for me. He was promising a totally different movie than I felt we got. But then again, he himself might have seen a more rough cut movie that still had all of the additional scenes in it, making it a more cohesive film. But now, whenever he says something is awesome, I'm not going to get my hopes up.

Leo656
08-23-2014, 01:02 AM
I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

Warhorse
08-23-2014, 01:54 AM
I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

Don't feel bad for me because I think he is literally throwing his mind under the buss. But, like I said, he might have seen something totally different, maybe he was there when they were filming The Raid like scenes and thought they would look wicked in the film. Maybe there was more character scenes or something more coherent in the storytelling before the 100 minute minimum threshold started to chop up scenes. Heck, Eastman's cameo was part of the chopping block, so it goes to show how much the producers cared about one of the creators. Granted, both Eastman and Laird have been awfully silent since the movie has come out.

Leo656
08-23-2014, 01:59 AM
It's possible. One of the dudes from Latino Review was on set for some of the filming and he saw a ton of stuff filmed that never made it into the final cut. A scene of April using a sai to fight off Foot soldiers was one of the more notable things.

I think some of Eastman's claims were someplace in between hopeful exaggeration and flat-out lies, though. Ain't mad at him, but still, it's kind of a shame, because some people do believe in him and I can imagine more than a few being let down.

Candy Kappa
08-23-2014, 02:04 AM
I've yet to see the first PD movie, but I'd imagine I won't see the second one either in the cinema unless they do a complete 180 turn and make something that doesn't look like a slow motion car crash.

Warhorse
08-23-2014, 02:07 AM
I'm just curious, are they going to increase the budget for the next one, or slash it? When 5 of the main stars are pure CGI, which can eat into a budget real fast, is now going to be sharing screen time with other possible CGI characters like Bebop, Rocksteady and anything to do with the technodrome, a bigger budget is inevitable. But the movie looks like it's going to barely break even as it is now.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-23-2014, 02:12 AM
I've yet to see the first PD movie, but I'd imagine I won't see the second one either in the cinema unless they do a complete 180 turn and make something that doesn't look like a slow motion car crash.

Sure thing skip. :roll:

chrisdude
08-23-2014, 05:07 AM
According to Box Office Mojo, it's already profitable. I think people are forgetting the international numbers.

Candy Kappa
08-23-2014, 05:50 AM
Sure thing skip. :roll:

It is, Bub.

Bry
08-23-2014, 07:19 AM
Holy sh*t, that was beautiful. Bravo, man.

I'm partial to what Harold Ramis once said, myself... something to the effect of the "shut your brain off" argument being "insulting", and "Why wouldn't you want to think? Why not just shoot yourself in the head?" I miss that guy.

"Higher standards necessary", indeed. If people swallow pablum and applaud it, then it's all they'll ever get.

http://media.giphy.com/media/VGHtpsS3UJNRK/giphy.gif

You and I are on the same page here for sure. And hey, bonus points for the Ramis quote. Found the full quote here (http://somecamerunning.typepad.com/some_came_running/2014/02/harold-ramis-1944-2014.html), and man, he totally got it. He is sorely missed.

And that's the thing - you can have dumb fun, you can have a bunch of it, but you need something more there. Something smart or emotionally-real thing to say underneath. Y'know? A genuine point. Something you can think about and analyze a little. Anything.

It's not Liebersman's or PD lies I don't care about, it's Kevin Eastman's lies that hold more weight for me. He was promising a totally different movie than I felt we got. But then again, he himself might have seen a more rough cut movie that still had all of the additional scenes in it, making it a more cohesive film. But now, whenever he says something is awesome, I'm not going to get my hopes up.

I mean, we may never know for sure what he was basing that on, but Eastman's always been super positive about the property. I love the guy, and I could never be "mad" at him, but I definitely take his claims about this stuff with a grain of salt. He's basically a Nick employee at this point, so he's invested in it doing well. More power to him, but I don't necessarily agree with him or find him objective about this stuff all the time.

Sure thing skip. :roll:

Ever find that dictionary?

RaphaelinSTL
08-23-2014, 08:53 AM
I kinda don't feel bad for people who feel burned by Eastman, though. I always said from the beginning, his main role in "assisting" the production was mostly PR shilling, because that's how it always goes in these kinds of movies when they bring one of the creators in as a "consultant", and that people shouldn't get too excited by him saying it's awesome because him saying that is exactly why his check has so many zeroes in it. He's also said bad TMNT stuff was awesome before, many times.

I'm sure he's a nice guy, maybe even a great guy, but he's still a "worker", so what's he gonna say? "Well, I'unno, not everyone is gonna like it..."? Why would they pay him for that? Of course he was gonna say everything was great, that's the job. Duh.

I'unno, I've never been completely on board with what either Eastman or Laird have to say about TMNT. They both seem like they only had the magic when they worked together, and that separately neither one of them really knows how to make TMNT work right. I don't really listen to either of 'em.

Did you check out the recent AMA he did on Reddit a couple weeks I believe? He was still really selling this movie and called it his favorite adaptation next to the 1990 film in which a lot of people were basically letting him know "Hey, you don't have to lie and do PR for us....we know it's bad."

I mean if he actually likes this, so be it....but Eastman seems like a guy with a little bit more taste than that. I know Eastman was apparently there a lot with the production team, but it's not Eastman had any say in the filming. They've might showed him a scene or two or a design but it's not like anything negative Kevin said would drastically change production....even though that seemed to be the case with the re-shoots and the fan backlash.

Laird seemed like he had a decent grasp on things at time, I actually enjoyed his 2001 TMNT Mirage run and I need to pick some of those up again.

Warhorse
08-23-2014, 10:04 AM
According to Box Office Mojo, it's already profitable. I think people are forgetting the international numbers.

Unless you are in the 400 million range, international numbers mean sh!t. Studios get 50% or less of the monies earned OS. In the USA, they get about 80% to 100% of the gross within the first 2 to 3 weeks, and then after that, the percentages start to dwindle every week there after. That is why a movie to break even has to make TWICE it's budget back in domestic alone. Rarely does the OS market save a movie, unless, like I said, it's making more than 400 million. The Turtles have to be making 250 million to get it's budget back. Case in point. The Lone Ranger, production budget 215 million. WW gross, 260+ million, Dom 89 million/OS171 million, and it's considered a colossal box office failure. In fairness, TMNT is at least performing strongly domestically, but don't count on the OS markets to help it out.

ScrewtheMirageTMNT
08-24-2014, 12:11 PM
It is, Bub.

No, that is crazy talk.