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Donny
09-07-2014, 08:23 AM
Since they choose to rewrite the script in the 11th hour resulting in Sachs not being the Shredder afterall, I feel that they need to use the character wisely in sequels, to avoid Sachs being a unimportant figure without any bigger purpose. I liked the idea of Shredder being the big puppetmaster in the shadows, and can for that reason sort of accept that the character was not explored more in order to make him more mystical, and use that to get deeper into the character in the next movie. However, since this clearly wasnīt the original idea, I feel that the script ended up a bit scattered, and it was obvious how the movie could have been much better if they did not decide to make such a big chance rushed in the last minute, and even though I liked the guy who played Shredder and prefer the Japanese version, the movie would probably have been better with Sachs as Shredder. Therefore, I feel that they need to validate the inclusion of Sachs in the universe by develop him in the next sequel. What do you think his role will be? Do you think he will appear at all? I have two ideas for him:

1) Maybe they could use the story from the 2k3 toon, where Bishop makes a super soldier which then turns into the rat king. Shredder could make similar experiments on Sachs with the mutagen, which in the end could turn Sachs into Rat King. By doing this they can also take advantage of his established connection to Splinter.

2) Sachs could be an utrom trying to earn money to get back home to his home planet. This might be a bit trickier to do than the rat king, but utroms on the big screen would also be awesome if done right.

chrisdude
09-07-2014, 08:42 AM
I don't think he's really been outed for what he really is. He could stay in his role as the head of Sachs Industries, a public figure who can cover for The Foot, and Shredder's protege/right-hand man. Doesn't have to be a major role. I sort of doubt they would shape the sequel around making his character work by turning him into a classic villain.

I would like to see an Utrom connection, though. Because there are Utroms in his mural, and I'm not going to let that go.

neatoman
09-07-2014, 09:15 AM
Utrom Sacks? In that case I guess he's lying about his background then, which of course he would have to. If he is an Utrom though I think he would mostly likely be Krang.

Oh you know what? If he's an utrom that means he would be able to get a new android body, he could be like a shapeshifter villain who comes back under a number of disguises.

chrisdude
09-07-2014, 09:44 AM
He could just know Utroms, and his story could be true. I'd like to think the cure for the poison back in Japan was Utrom, and that the modern ooze that they were working with is of Utrom origin, as well.

Some consider it a throwaway gag, but young April's line about the ooze being from space may have some truth to it. The way it was shot, that could've been a very easy thing to edit out.

Between that line and the mural, I don't think it's a coincidence. I bet Utroms are totally on the table.

RaphaelinSTL
09-07-2014, 09:55 AM
Makes me wonder if Sachs would even return at all honestly. I think Vernon knocking him out cold might be the last we'd ever see of the character. He was designed and created to be the Shredder and that was changed at the last minute so he could just be a stereotypical "evil scientist for money" type. I'm sure Fitchner wasn't thrilled. I know he said he signed a "three picture deal", but how often have we really heard that phrase come up?

I honestly think we've seen the last of Eric Sachs in this movie universe.

Bitsy83
09-07-2014, 09:59 AM
.....I thought he died? Wasn't the lab on fire or the building explode or something like that? I can't really remember what happened after his confrontation with April. Well, I hope he died or he gets the Johnny Cage treatment like in "Mortal Kombat: Annihilation" and dies in the first five minutes. Really didn't like his character.

I'm gonna piss people off, but I would've preferred him being Shredder than the whole reshoot editing you know happened after it was announced.

RaphaelinSTL
09-07-2014, 10:10 AM
.....I thought he died? Wasn't the lab on fire or the building explode or something like that? I can't really remember what happened after his confrontation with April. Well, I hope he died or he gets the Johnny Cage treatment like in "Mortal Kombat: Annihilation" and dies in the first five minutes. Really didn't like his character.

I'm gonna piss people off, but I would've preferred him being Shredder than the whole reshoot editing you know happened after it was announced.

While I'm not really looking forward to a sequel, since it's inevitable...I would be fine with that being the last of Sachs as well. No need to bring him back.

I think what's frustrating is that you clearly see the lack of confidence the film has in just this part alone. Instead of actually understanding the reasoning why fans had such a backlash as to why they preferred an asian Shredder, they just thrown in nameless, scared, spooky asian man in the shadows and just make him Shredder.

While it might not have been my favorite interpretation of Shredder if they would've gone with the Sachs as Shred notion...I could've appreciated the film a little more.

Donny
09-07-2014, 10:17 AM
Utrom Sacks? In that case I guess he's lying about his background then, which of course he would have to. If he is an Utrom though I think he would mostly likely be Krang.

Oh you know what? If he's an utrom that means he would be able to get a new android body, he could be like a shapeshifter villain who comes back under a number of disguises.

It does not have to be a big lie. He could be an utrom whose ship crashed in Japan, and was helped by Shredder to get on his feet again in return for access to the mutagen and utrom technology (hence the improved suit). I really doubt that they will evolve his role in that direction though. It would either be very cool or it could end up being an excuse for using his character due to the contracts and lead to a messy and untrustworthy story. Nevertheless, all that last minute editing could make it more difficult for the studio to make the next movie.


I think what's frustrating is that you clearly see the lack of confidence the film has in just this part alone. Instead of actually understanding the reasoning why fans had such a backlash as to why they preferred an asian Shredder, they just thrown in nameless, scared, spooky asian man in the shadows and just make him Shredder.

While it might not have been my favorite interpretation of Shredder if they would've gone with the Sachs as Shred notion...I could've appreciated the film a little more.

I canīt help feel the same way and it is really a shame. Minor things could have made a big difference for the overall quality of this movie. I can appreciate it for what it is; it was an entertaining movie, and I actually like the turtles themselves, and April also, but it always ends with a "but"....

Coola Yagami
09-07-2014, 10:37 AM
The main issue is, Sachs has no business being in the movie. I remember before everyone was hoping Sachs was gonna be some kind of 'fake Shredder' so that at the end the 'real Shredder' would step in, hinting for a sequel... but who would want to waste the first movie with a fake Shredder? I know Batman Begins ended with a Joker teaser, but at least Batman faces Rahs and Scarecrow, both actual Batman villains in the movie. They didn't have him fight some lame wannabe clown and then end it with the 'real Joker' announcing he's going to Gotham to 'show them how it's done'.

IMO have Sachs executed by Shredder in the opening scene. Get rid of the character. And at the same time, said scene will show that Shredder means business and has very low tolerance for failure.

RaphaelinSTL
09-07-2014, 10:49 AM
The main issue is, Sachs has no business being in the movie. I remember before everyone was hoping Sachs was gonna be some kind of 'fake Shredder' so that at the end the 'real Shredder' would step in, hinting for a sequel... but who would want to waste the first movie with a fake Shredder? I know Batman Begins ended with a Joker teaser, but at least Batman faces Rahs and Scarecrow, both actual Batman villains in the movie. They didn't have him fight some lame wannabe clown and then end it with the 'real Joker' announcing he's going to Gotham to 'show them how it's done'

Well wasn't that what Ducard was for the fake Ra's Al Ghul at the beginning of BB? Essentially they tricked Bruce Wayne into thinking Ken Wantabe's character was the actual leader of the League of Shadows before Ducard reveals his true identity at Wayne's party. Now I'm not saying that TMNT 2014 would've handled that kind of switch cleverly as nothing in this movie really showcases any creativity really, but that is an interesting notion to think of.

I'm with you though, if they rewrote Shredder all together...Sachs has no real purpose to be in this film and therefore should not return for any future films within this cooky universe.

JonesyKitty
09-07-2014, 12:41 PM
He could just know I bet Utroms are totally on the table.
Sorry couldn't help this one.
http://i1370.photobucket.com/albums/ag271/tmntfan1984/2070464-utroms_zpswm8a8due.jpeg (http://s1370.photobucket.com/user/tmntfan1984/media/2070464-utroms_zpswm8a8due.jpeg.html)

.....I thought he died? Wasn't the lab on fire or the building explode or something like that?
honestly I was thinking there would be an after credit scene where it woild show the inside of the building fire and Sacks' body would open up and an utrom would crawl out. They could probably do it in the sequel by starting the film where the first one ended, show the Turtle Van pull out and cut to the burnt up lab.

Donnieangelo
09-07-2014, 12:53 PM
Sorry couldn't help this one.
http://i1370.photobucket.com/albums/ag271/tmntfan1984/2070464-utroms_zpswm8a8due.jpeg (http://s1370.photobucket.com/user/tmntfan1984/media/2070464-utroms_zpswm8a8due.jpeg.html)


honestly I was thinking there would be an after credit scene where it woild show the inside of the building fire and Sacks' body would open up and an utrom would crawl out. They could probably do it in the sequel by starting the film where the first one ended, show the Turtle Van pull out and cut to the burnt up lab.
Heh, they are drinking from straws!

Coola Yagami
09-07-2014, 01:23 PM
Well wasn't that what Ducard was for the fake Ra's Al Ghul at the beginning of BB? Essentially they tricked Bruce Wayne into thinking Ken Wantabe's character was the actual leader of the League of Shadows before Ducard reveals his true identity at Wayne's party. Now I'm not saying that TMNT 2014 would've handled that kind of switch cleverly as nothing in this movie really showcases any creativity really, but that is an interesting notion to think of.

I'm with you though, if they rewrote Shredder all together...Sachs has no real purpose to be in this film and therefore should not return for any future films within this cooky universe.

True but Rahs still returned near the end of the movie with enough screen time to be a memorable part of it. Bruce didn't face that random bald guy for the whole movie and have Liam hint he would step in the post credits scene. Plus.... he kinda wasn't fooling anybody since Liam looked JUST LIKE Rahs Al Ghul...

Fans were speculating the TMNT movie would have ShredSachs for the ENTIRE movie and have a hint of 'a real asian Shredder' near the very end. Like I said, it woulda been a waste of time since we had to sit through a full movie of a fake.

slingtheory
09-07-2014, 07:57 PM
I'm not really sure they can salvage his character now that he's not shredder. With the role he plays in shredders organization for all intents and purposes he might as well just be baxter stockman. They should've just changed his name in the reshoots if they planned to keep him around but I guess that would've made it too obvious.

Puddinpop
09-08-2014, 08:13 AM
Wow lol. No one here knows the what, when and why going on behind the scenes. But the way some expand on ASSUMPTION with this attitude of " I was there.. I know what happened " is entertaining to say the least. There are a lot of things they can do with this Sack's character. He had plenty of " business " being in the film. As for why and when they " changed " Shredder to a Japanese guy? No one knows yet. There are just to many variables involved. The Japanese guy did his job and he did it well. We just needed more of him. After working out all the kinks I believe there is plenty of potential for this sequel. But hey.. around here.. wild assumptions and exaggeration is all to common lol.

He could just know Utroms, and his story could be true. I'd like to think the cure for the poison back in Japan was Utrom, and that the modern ooze that they were working with is of Utrom origin, as well.

Some consider it a throwaway gag, but young April's line about the ooze being from space may have some truth to it. The way it was shot, that could've been a very easy thing to edit out.

Between that line and the mural, I don't think it's a coincidence. I bet Utroms are totally on the table.

Yea.. I agree. My ears perked up when I heard her say that about the ooze being from outer space. They could def. capitalize on that. And the mural also. I also don't think its a coincidence. They all said they want to go that rout so.. cheers. I hope they do

Coola Yagami
09-08-2014, 12:50 PM
Sachs was meant to be shredder and now he's not. That's a fact. Anything they do with him will be considered a change since now they have a shredder to do it with. Sachs outlived his usefulness. He's basically Baxter with a different name.

RaphaelinSTL
09-08-2014, 12:53 PM
Sachs was meant to be shredder and now he's not. That's a fact. Anything they do with him will be considered a change since now they have a shredder to do it with. Sachs outlived his usefulness. He's basically Baxter with a different name.

This.

His character served no genuine purpose other than to be westernized version of the Shredder that they quickly changed to save their asses from bad PR. By the end of the film, he's just as forgetful as this whole movie was.

Leo656
09-08-2014, 01:17 PM
Sachs is apparently also Shredder in every single spin-off media from books to video games. So there's that.

But hey, could it be some massive cover-up to keep a "secret" that isn't especially secret nor worth keeping? I mean, what about all those scenes that were shot that indicated the movie had an entirely different plot not that long ago? Those scenes the guys from Latino Review were on hand to see, including Foot Soldiers being injected with mutagen to create Super Soldiers? All of that was clearly just false footage shot to deceive people beforehand, because the final film's story was so mind-blowing, it would melt people's faces if they knew in advance just how awesome what they had planned for us was going to be. Clearly.

Or, y'know... deductive reasoning. A person could simply look at the overwhelming evidence and come to the conclusion that a bunch of hasty changes were made at the 11th hour, since that's fairly common in movie-making. But... but that would mean.... that would mean the people making this movie had no idea what they were doing or why...

No, it can't be that the PD guys are hacks. It's gotta be the conspiracy thing.

RaphaelinSTL
09-08-2014, 01:25 PM
Sachs is apparently also Shredder in every single spin-off media from books to video games. So there's that.

But hey, could it be some massive cover-up to keep a "secret" that isn't especially secret nor worth keeping? I mean, what about all those scenes that were shot that indicated the movie had an entirely different plot not that long ago? Those scenes the guys from Latino Review were on hand to see, including Foot Soldiers being injected with mutagen to create Super Soldiers? All of that was clearly just false footage shot to deceive people beforehand, because the final film's story was so mind-blowing, it would melt people's faces if they knew in advance just how awesome what they had planned for us was going to be. Clearly.

Or, y'know... deductive reasoning. A person could simply look at the overwhelming evidence and come to the conclusion that a bunch of hasty changes were made at the 11th hour, since that's fairly common in movie-making. But... but that would mean.... that would mean the people making this movie had no idea what they were doing or why...

No, it can't be that the PD guys are hacks. It's gotta be the conspiracy thing.

Someone give this man a medal!

Leo656
09-08-2014, 01:29 PM
Chewie didn't get one, I wouldn't feel right about it.

Andrew NDB
09-08-2014, 01:35 PM
Ugh. Why don't they just call the sequel: "TMNT 2: 90 minutes of us Trying to Repair the Damage from ****ing Up the Last One."

Coola Yagami
09-08-2014, 04:19 PM
Ugh. Why don't they just call the sequel: "TMNT 2: 90 minutes of us Trying to Repair the Damage from ****ing Up the Last One."

Exactly. QFT.

Autbot_Benz
09-08-2014, 04:22 PM
seriously we are still complaining about this movie:roll:

RaphaelinSTL
09-08-2014, 04:28 PM
seriously we are still complaining about this movie:roll:

Yeah, because fans of a franchise aren't allowed to have opinions or talk about things they liked or didn't like in a forum about said franchise. :trolleye:

slingtheory
09-08-2014, 06:26 PM
Ugh. Why don't they just call the sequel: "TMNT 2: 90 minutes of us Trying to Repair the Damage from ****ing Up the Last One."

I think they may already have settled on TMNT 2: We Added the Technodrome so We Know You'll see it Regardless of it Having the Same Problems as the Last One. :P

Coola Yagami
09-08-2014, 06:28 PM
seriously we are still complaining about this movie:roll:

You expected everyone that hated it to suddenly change their minds? Some of us actually wanted a good tmnt movie.

Coola Yagami
09-08-2014, 06:30 PM
I think they may already have settled on TMNT 2: We Added the Technodrome so We Know You'll see it Regardless of it Having the Same Problems as the Last One. :P

Just like this movie ruined everything but 'hey, pizza and cowabunga!' I expect the sequel to be even worse but 'hey bebop and rocksteady'. I'd say Technodrome for part 3. Something will have to save that last one.

ranger_scout
09-08-2014, 08:40 PM
I think Saks should be Krang in the sequels.

Puddinpop
09-09-2014, 12:28 AM
seriously we are still complaining about this movie:roll:

Yep lol. Some things never change. For some.. their ego's are to big to allow them to move on. But to instead think of their opinions as general facts and hold this mentality that everyone that thinks differently must be out of their minds lol. Some cant help but to stick around and complain about Shredder being Japanese now after months of complaining about white Shredder :lol:. This production never had a chance with some of these kids. Anyone clear enough to point out the fact that some people just love to complain regardless and act like they know the what when where and how and then expand on these " opinions/assumptions " like they are facts will quickly be chastised by the same group of arrogant, opinionated narrow minded " know it alls". This isn't even about the movie for some folks around here. It's about ego.. it's about the unwavering need to shove their views and tastes down the throats of others until they give up and swallow. It's about getting the last word. Even if it means writing one massive post after another like it somehow makes your argument more valid. News flash.. it doesn't. I think it's probably a need to feel significant and important in any way shape or form online to those that couldn't possibly know any better. Sad.. This unquenchable need to feel validated. Truth is.. No matter how many long drawn out posts they write.. No matter how many ways you try to twist it.. This is all opinion based discussion and speculation. Period

If your " opinion " is that this movie wasn't any good then that is just that .. your opinion. And should be viewed as such. The movie was by no means a flop. It actually did well. It has a green lit sequel. NO ONE owes anybody an apology or explanation. I hope this production learned that trying to please everyone was a pointless mistake. I hope this production stays focused this time and does exactly what they want to do. Writes the script they want to write. Takes this TMNT trilogy in any direction they see fit. Bc they paid their dues and have earned the right to. And just bc a few of you hated what was put forth doesn't change that. Viacom makes the call. Not you. I really admire how Liebesman said if he didnt end up getting the job for TMNT 2 he'd still shoot a TMNT film and put it up on Youtube.. Rather than sitting behind a computer screen complaining about someone else's work like he could do better. I think a lot of people could learn a thing or two from him lol. Actions speak way louder than empty words.

As for Sacks.. They could do a lot with his character. They could keep him as the human millionair industrialist helping Shredder.. or better yet.. Krang. They could actually make Sacks an Utrom/Krang. They can leave Japanese Shredder out and have Sacks and Krang assault NYC with a Technodrome that he built with his millions.. with Baxter Stockman.. or Bebop and Rocksteady.. There are a lot of fun exciting things they could do with Sacks. Some are so quick to just dismiss everything as a failure before a friggin script is even written and will spend the next two years of their lives trying to invalidate it. Imo.. that's pretty sad lol

Autbot_Benz
09-09-2014, 12:50 AM
Yep lol. Some things never change. For some.. their ego's are to big to allow them to move on. But to instead think of their opinions as general facts and hold this mentality that everyone that thinks differently must be out of their minds lol. Some cant help but to stick around and complain about Shredder being Japanese now after months of complaining about white Shredder :lol:. This production never had a chance will some of these kids. Anyone clear enough to point out the fact that some people just love to complain regardless and act like they know the what when where and how and then expand on these " opinions/assumptions " like they are facts will quickly be chastised by the same group of arrogant, opinionated narrow minded " know it alls". This isn't even about the movie for some folks around here. It's about ego.. it's about the unwavering need to shove their views and tastes down the throats of others until they give up and swallow. It's about getting the last word. Even if it means writing one massive post after another like it somehow makes your argument more valid. News flash.. it doesn't. I think it's probably a need to feel significant and important in any way shape or form online to those that couldn't possibly know any better. Sad.. This unquenchable need to feel validated. Truth is.. No matter how many long drawn out posts they write.. No matter how many ways you try to twist it.. This is all opinion based discussion and speculation. Period

If your " opinion " is that this movie wasn't any good then that is just that .. your opinion. And should be viewed as such. The movie was by no means a flop. It actually did well. It has a green lit sequel. NO ONE owes anybody an apology or explanation. I hope this production learned that trying to please everyone was a pointless mistake. I hope this production stays focused this time and does exactly what they want to do. Writes the script they want to write. Takes this TMNT trilogy in any direction they see fit. Bc they paid their dues and have earned the right to. And just bc a few of you hated what was put forth doesn't change that. Viacom makes the call. Not you. I really admire how Liebesman said if he didnt end up getting the job for TMNT 2 he'd still shoot a TMNT film and put it up on Youtube.. Rather than sitting behind a computer screen complaining about someone else's work like he could do better. I think a lot of people could learn a thing or two from him lol. Actions speak way louder than empty words.

As for Sacks.. They could do a lot with his character. They could keep him as the human million air industrialist helping Shredder.. or better yet.. Krang. They could actually make Sacks an Utrom/Krang. They can leave Japanese Shredder out and have Sacks and Krang assault NYC with a Technodrome that he built with his millions.. with Baxter Stockman.. or Bebop and Rocksteady.. There are a lot of fun exciting things they could do with Sacks. Some are so quick to just dismiss everything as a failure before a friggin script is even written and will spend the next two years of their lives trying to invalidate it. Imo.. that's pretty sad lol

I agree with you 100 percent.

RaphaelinSTL
09-09-2014, 12:51 AM
Yep lol. Some things never change. For some.. their ego's are to big to allow them to move on. But to instead think of their opinions as general facts and hold this mentality that everyone that thinks differently must be out of their minds lol. Some cant help but to stick around and complain about Shredder being Japanese now after months of complaining about white Shredder :lol:. This production never had a chance will some of these kids. Anyone clear enough to point out the fact that some people just love to complain regardless and act like they know the what when where and how and then expand on these " opinions/assumptions " like they are facts will quickly be chastised by the same group of arrogant, opinionated narrow minded " know it alls". This isn't even about the movie for some folks around here. It's about ego.. it's about the unwavering need to shove their views and tastes down the throats of others until they give up and swallow. It's about getting the last word. Even if it means writing one massive post after another like it somehow makes your argument more valid. News flash.. it doesn't. I think it's probably a need to feel significant and important in any way shape or form online to those that couldn't possibly know any better. Sad.. This unquenchable need to feel validated. Truth is.. No matter how many long drawn out posts they write.. No matter how many ways you try to twist it.. This is all opinion based discussion and speculation. Period

If your " opinion " is that this movie wasn't any good then that is just that .. your opinion. And should be viewed as such. The movie was by no means a flop. It actually did well. It has a green lit sequel. NO ONE owes anybody an apology or explanation. I hope this production learned that trying to please everyone was a pointless mistake. I hope this production stays focused this time and does exactly what they want to do. Writes the script they want to write. Takes this TMNT trilogy in any direction they see fit. Bc they paid their dues and have earned the right to. And just bc a few of you hated what was put forth doesn't change that. Viacom makes the call. Not you. I really admire how Liebesman said if he didnt end up getting the job for TMNT 2 he'd still shoot a TMNT film and put it up on Youtube.. Rather than sitting behind a computer screen complaining about someone else's work like he could do better. I think a lot of people could learn a thing or two from him lol. Actions speak way louder than empty words.

Wow, a long winded ego driven complaint about people complaining.

Sure, why not.

I do find it funny that those of us who have legitimate criticism on the film discuss what we find wrong with the film itself while most of the defenders of the film just criticize the film's critics. It's that whole "I'm rubber and you're glue" defense.

Puddinpop
09-09-2014, 01:49 AM
Wow, a long winded ego driven complaint about people complaining.

Sure, why not.

I do find it funny that those of us who have legitimate criticism on the film discuss what we find wrong with the film itself while most of the defenders of the film just criticize the film's critics. It's that whole "I'm rubber and you're glue" defense.

Ego drivin huh?
Well.. aren't you doing the same thing by complaining about me complaining about complainers? Talk about calling the kettle black bud :lol:

Us " defenders " have said plenty about what we enjoyed regarding this movie. But you've only been here like a month so i wont hold you to knowing that. Just read the review thread.. if you havent yet. We don't owe you any explanation. There is no right or wrong with opinion based discussion. Just bc folks like you sit here 24 hours a day and repeat the same complaints over and over and over and over again doesn't mean we have to cancel our lives and sit here repeating ourselves or as you like to put it " defend " why we enjoyed this movie to make you feel better or more validated about your own opinions. Some of us have better things to do. We saw the movie.. enjoyed it " a majority of us here on the Drome ", and now stop in once in a while to see if there is any fresh new discussion or news on a sequel but no.. it's the same boring discussion of how they " got scared and tried to change everything and they had no business making a movie and how the sequel has no potential and will fail blah blah blah".
People cannot except the fact that others.. even " most " dare i say.. enjoyed the film. That is why people keep making the same " like or dislike the new movie " poll over and over again expecting a different result bc they cannot except that they are not a majority.
If you think we haven't " defended " our reasons for liking this film.. for months now then you frankly haven't been paying any attention.

DarkLightDragon
09-09-2014, 06:29 AM
Wow, a long winded ego driven complaint about people complaining.

Sure, why not.

I do find it funny that those of us who have legitimate criticism on the film discuss what we find wrong with the film itself while most of the defenders of the film just criticize the film's critics. It's that whole "I'm rubber and you're glue" defense.

And it's one of the reasons why I can never treat this forum seriously.:trolleye:

Coola Yagami
09-09-2014, 08:41 AM
Yep lol. Some things never change. For some.. their ego's are to big to allow them to move on. But to instead think of their opinions as general facts and hold this mentality that everyone that thinks differently must be out of their minds lol. Some cant help but to stick around and complain about Shredder being Japanese now after months of complaining about white Shredder :lol:. This production never had a chance with some of these kids. Anyone clear enough to point out the fact that some people just love to complain regardless and act like they know the what when where and how and then expand on these " opinions/assumptions " like they are facts will quickly be chastised by the same group of arrogant, opinionated narrow minded " know it alls". This isn't even about the movie for some folks around here. It's about ego.. it's about the unwavering need to shove their views and tastes down the throats of others until they give up and swallow. It's about getting the last word. Even if it means writing one massive post after another like it somehow makes your argument more valid. News flash.. it doesn't. I think it's probably a need to feel significant and important in any way shape or form online to those that couldn't possibly know any better. Sad.. This unquenchable need to feel validated. Truth is.. No matter how many long drawn out posts they write.. No matter how many ways you try to twist it.. This is all opinion based discussion and speculation. Period

If your " opinion " is that this movie wasn't any good then that is just that .. your opinion. And should be viewed as such. The movie was by no means a flop. It actually did well. It has a green lit sequel. NO ONE owes anybody an apology or explanation. I hope this production learned that trying to please everyone was a pointless mistake. I hope this production stays focused this time and does exactly what they want to do. Writes the script they want to write. Takes this TMNT trilogy in any direction they see fit. Bc they paid their dues and have earned the right to. And just bc a few of you hated what was put forth doesn't change that. Viacom makes the call. Not you. I really admire how Liebesman said if he didnt end up getting the job for TMNT 2 he'd still shoot a TMNT film and put it up on Youtube.. Rather than sitting behind a computer screen complaining about someone else's work like he could do better. I think a lot of people could learn a thing or two from him lol. Actions speak way louder than empty words.

As for Sacks.. They could do a lot with his character. They could keep him as the human millionair industrialist helping Shredder.. or better yet.. Krang. They could actually make Sacks an Utrom/Krang. They can leave Japanese Shredder out and have Sacks and Krang assault NYC with a Technodrome that he built with his millions.. with Baxter Stockman.. or Bebop and Rocksteady.. There are a lot of fun exciting things they could do with Sacks. Some are so quick to just dismiss everything as a failure before a friggin script is even written and will spend the next two years of their lives trying to invalidate it. Imo.. that's pretty sad lol

tl;dr same ol ego-driven drivel. Not everyone liked the movie just because it has the tmnt label slapped on it.

I do appreciate the hard work that went into this, but that still doesn't excuse the end product. In fact it wasn't even their fault. They were just following the orders of the director and script writers. Most of the blame should fall on them.

I doubt you care if the people behind the Catwoman movie paid their dues. The biggest Catwoman fans still wouldn't buy it. Same applies here. I'm not buying this one either.

RaphaelinSTL
09-09-2014, 09:27 AM
Ego drivin huh?
Well.. aren't you doing the same thing by complaining about me complaining about complainers? Talk about calling the kettle black bud :lol:

No, not at all actually. I'm simply bringing up the notion that your novelization of a post comes across as more butt-hurt more so than a logical argument with someone who disagrees with your point of view.

Us " defenders " have said plenty about what we enjoyed regarding this movie. But you've only been here like a month so i wont hold you to knowing that. Just read the review thread.. if you havent yet. We don't owe you any explanation. There is no right or wrong with opinion based discussion. Just bc folks like you sit here 24 hours a day and repeat the same complaints over and over and over and over again doesn't mean we have to cancel our lives and sit here repeating ourselves or as you like to put it " defend " why we enjoyed this movie to make you feel better or more validated about your own opinions. Some of us have better things to do. We saw the movie.. enjoyed it " a majority of us here on the Drome ", and now stop in once in a while to see if there is any fresh new discussion or news on a sequel but no.. it's the same boring discussion of how they " got scared and tried to change everything and they had no business making a movie and how the sequel has no potential and will fail blah blah blah".
People cannot except the fact that others.. even " most " dare i say.. enjoyed the film. That is why people keep making the same " like or dislike the new movie " poll over and over again expecting a different result bc they cannot except that they are not a majority.
If you think we haven't " defended " our reasons for liking this film.. for months now then you frankly haven't been paying any attention.

I was in your boat when I joined as someone who was a supporter of the film. I got behind the goofy designs, I was liking how the action was presented to me and I was more than willing to get immersed into the world it created for me....but as a TMNT in a world of consistently solid Marvel films, it's hard for me to get behind this final product. I wasn't someone who thought this was destined to fail months before the film came out, I WANTED a good TMNT film because god knows this generation deserves one...but in my opinion, we just simply got a flawed product.

I'm willing to hear you out. Please enlighten me why you feel that a rush script change to Sachs character in the film only enhances it when the video game tie in, visual history book and many other adaptations from this film clearly have Eric in the Shredder role. If you don't agree with my points, let's get a discussion going....don't pander me being passionate about my love for TMNT and having discussions with like minded fans wanting competent movies. If you have a problem with our opinions on why we didn't like it, don't get offended by how we feel and then just come back with "well, it's already been said...we don't need to repeat ourselves." Your defense is weak and just makes your opinion even weaker.

tl;dr same ol ego-driven drivel. Not everyone liked the movie just because it has the tmnt label slapped on it.

I do appreciate the hard work that went into this, but that still doesn't excuse the end product. In fact it wasn't even their fault. They were just following the orders of the director and script writers. Most of the blame should fall on them.

I doubt you care if the people behind the Catwoman movie paid their dues. The biggest Catwoman fans still wouldn't buy it. Same applies here. I'm not buying this one either.

Exactly.

Andrew NDB
09-09-2014, 11:53 AM
I think they may already have settled on TMNT 2: We Added the Technodrome so We Know You'll see it Regardless of it Having the Same Problems as the Last One. :P

And Bebop. And Rocksteady. And Krang. And still probably no actual ninja fighting.

Xiewin
09-09-2014, 12:11 PM
I was in your boat when I joined as someone who was a supporter of the film. I got behind the goofy designs, I was liking how the action was presented to me and I was more than willing to get immersed into the world it created for me....but as a TMNT in a world of consistently solid Marvel films, it's hard for me to get behind this final product. I wasn't someone who thought this was destined to fail months before the film came out, I WANTED a good TMNT film because god knows this generation deserves one...but in my opinion, we just simply got a flawed product.

I'm willing to hear you out. Please enlighten me why you feel that a rush script change to Sachs character in the film only enhances it when the video game tie in, visual history book and many other adaptations from this film clearly have Eric in the Shredder role. If you don't agree with my points, let's get a discussion going....don't pander me being passionate about my love for TMNT and having discussions with like minded fans wanting competent movies. If you have a problem with our opinions on why we didn't like it, don't get offended by how we feel and then just come back with "well, it's already been said...we don't need to repeat ourselves." Your defense is weak and just makes your opinion even weaker.

Same situation with me; I was really looking forward to this film. I liked all the trailers and I adored the designs.

Well that all changed until I actually saw it.

RaphaelinSTL
09-09-2014, 12:23 PM
Same situation with me; I was really looking forward to this film. I liked all the trailers, I adored the designs, and I really liked the new idea of them being created as heros.

Well that all changed until I actually saw it.

Yeah, the sad thing is I WANTED to like this thing but I just couldn't walk out of the theater and convince myself that I enjoyed what I had just seen.

My anticipation was growing the weeks prior to it's release and I went out and bought the Raphael and Shredder movie figures. I might not have LOVED the designs but I got over my dislike of them for sure. Before the movie, there were things that were bothering me in the trailers TV spots and I had fears that a Shredder wouldn't be fully developed, they would be overly strong to point of being Hulk-lite and that Michelangelo's "fun" personality would be intensified to the point where he was obnoxious, creepy and annoying. Unfortunately, that all seemed to come into play. Now every time I see Puddinpop's signature, all I can think of is these Turtles that "ain't my Turtles" staring into the deep, empty void that was the enjoyment that was had while watching this film.

This is why I don't think there's a need for Sachs in any future films, let this movie be it's own thing and just continue adventures with these unfortunate interpretations. As a TMNT fan, I'll for sure check it out...but they won't get my money the next time around.

Leo656
09-09-2014, 12:51 PM
More than anything, I'm a little annoyed at people trying to steal my gimmick. Not for nothin', but most people just aren't as good at the whole "TL; DR" posting style that I've perfected. I mean, I appreciate the effort, but nobody asked for permission or anything and they just don't do it right, generally.

Harumph.

Coola Yagami
09-09-2014, 01:16 PM
More than anything, I'm a little annoyed at people trying to steal my gimmick. Not for nothin', but most people just aren't as good at the whole "TL; DR" posting style that I've perfected. I mean, I appreciate the effort, but nobody asked for permission or anything and they just don't do it right, generally.

Harumph.

Your stuff is entertaining to read though. Plus you back your facts and know a lot about how Hollywood works. It's not just hate for the sake of hate.

zodiac brave
09-09-2014, 02:05 PM
jesus christ...

:roll:

Candy Kappa
09-09-2014, 02:19 PM
Sacks outplayed his role in the movie, he revealed he killed Mr. O'Neil, and met his end. I'd rather much have Baxter, since he actually was in the movie, be the figure head of the company, maybe try to clean up Sacks mess and save some company face.

Bitsy83
09-09-2014, 06:01 PM
Sacks outplayed his role in the movie, he revealed he killed Mr. O'Neil, and met his end. I'd rather much have Baxter, since he actually was in the movie, be the figure head of the company, maybe try to clean up Sacks mess and save some company face.

I'm still going on my theory that Baxter had known about Kraang and was secretly helping him behind Sachs' and O'Neil's backs. I also have this theory that if the Utroms try to take over the world, that somehow they're going to...I dunno, MERGE the two dimensions so that this world becomes the new Dimension X.

......c'mon, you know you've heard stupider plots.

Galactus
09-09-2014, 09:36 PM
Honestly I seen Fichtner in a few things and thought he was decent but the positive reaction to his casting even by those who otherwise disliked the idea of a white Shredder on the basis of what a great actor he is I assumed I must have missed him in stuff that showed off his talent.

After seeing him in TMNT I still feel I've missed him in stuff that showed his talent. He's okay throughout most of the movie until the scene were he's explaining his plan to the caged turtles - it seems really off and then when he's brandishing the gun at April and Vern is the body language and delivery just seem weird.

To be generous I'll assume it's the writing but to be honest if he's not the Shredder he really doesn't have a role in a sequel. I've never gotten the appeal of making him Krang or an Utrom or similar alien creature. I think it's best just let this character lie.

Coola Yagami
09-09-2014, 09:41 PM
Honestly I seen Fichtner in a few things and thought he was decent but the positive reaction to his casting even by those who otherwise disliked the idea of a white Shredder on the basis of what a great actor he is I assumed I must have missed him in stuff that showed off his talent.

After seeing him in TMNT I still feel I've missed him in stuff that showed his talent. He's okay throughout most of the movie until the scene were he's explaining his plan to the caged turtles - it seems really off and then when he's brandishing the to April and Vern is the body language and delivery just seem weird.

To be generous I'll assume it's the writing but to be honest if he's not the Shredder he really doesn't have a role in a sequel. I've never gotten the appeal of making him Krang or an Utrom or similar alien creature. I think it's best just let this character lie.

Exactly. Everyone seems so intent on making him this and that just to keep him around. Why bother? Cut him loose and put the focus on actual tmnt characters. Hell, Sachs felt more developed than the turtles themselves. That's all kinda of wrong already.

chrisdude
09-09-2014, 09:48 PM
My assumption is that his three movie deal still counts for something, and they wouldn't just kick him off of two movies because of some last-minute rewrites. Weren't people saying he's Bay's pal, after all?

RaphaelinSTL
09-09-2014, 09:52 PM
My assumption is that his three movie deal still counts for something, and they wouldn't just kick him off of two movies because of some last-minute rewrites. Weren't people saying he's Bay's pal, after all?

Well you know how movie deals go sometimes, even though he says he's signed a three movie deal...that could've very well changed.

I mean, he did agree to this movie with the assumption he was playing Shredder after all. We'll have to wait and see.

sdp
09-09-2014, 10:01 PM
I just hope they do something with him, if not I'd be pretty mad and it'd make the first movie look worse retroactively.

Leo656
09-09-2014, 10:11 PM
Yeah, just for example the whole "Superman Returns" cast were all signed on for a trilogy, and for a solid four years that was the plan, until one day a few guys at WB switched offices and priorities changed. Stuff happens. Often abruptly. Sometimes for no reason.

IF for any reason they didn't make sequels to TMNT after all, or in the case they did make sequels but decided not to bring Fichtner's character back, all it would really mean, most likely, is that Fichtner would owe two more movies to Platinum Dunes before a certain amount of years went by. That's what happens most times. Otherwise, they'd just settle up with him for X amount of dollars and call the whole thing even, which also happens.

Let's not forget, they could have his character out of the picture but still appear in flashback scenes throughout the next two movies. That's pretty likely if you think about it.

There's also a slim outside chance Platinum Dunes could take another look at the receipts a year from now and decide to not do sequels after all. It's not likely, but it could happen. Literally hundreds of movies are "absolutely definitely" going to happen "within the next two years or so", and from Bill and Ted 3 to the second film in the Friday the 13th reboot series and a million others, we're still waitin'. If that unlikely scenario went down, everybody involved would more or less just get paid to go do something else. That's the biz.

Literally a hundred things could happen. My predicted scenario is, they do the sequel, Sacks is killed off or whatever, but still appears in flashbacks for the second film (and the third if there is one). They put a lot of work into forcing his character into things just to sh*tcan it all. That's what I see as being most likely: Off the table as an active character, but having a big hand in past events that are directly impacting the story in the present-time. Kinda like how Ra's was only in "Batman Begins" but everything that happened across three movies was more or less because of him. That's what I see them doing.

chrisdude
09-09-2014, 10:29 PM
It may be a pipe dream, but I would like to see the Shredder sit the next one out. If they used Stockman or Krang as the villain, it would make sense to keep Sachs heavily involved. But the way they do comic book movies, I have no reason to think they wouldn't pile on the villains and involve Shredder, no matter what.

Coola Yagami
09-09-2014, 11:00 PM
It may be a pipe dream, but I would like to see the Shredder sit the next one out. If they used Stockman or Krang as the villain, it would make sense to keep Sachs heavily involved. But the way they do comic book movies, I have no reason to think they wouldn't pile on the villains and involve Shredder, no matter what.

True but giving the movie to Baxter or Krang kinda gives even less of a reason for him to be in it. They don't need him. Baxter could easily take over and call Sach's company Stocktronics.

I just don't get why everyone is so overly concerned about Fitchner? There's even a topic or two of wanting Megan replaced as someone else to play April, but Sachs? Oh no, we MUST simply have him in the sequel. It's nonsense.

slingtheory
09-10-2014, 12:20 AM
True but giving the movie to Baxter or Krang kinda gives even less of a reason for him to be in it. They don't need him. Baxter could easily take over and call Sach's company Stocktronics. this is where id want them to go. Sack's role in this universe is basically the same as stockmans anyway. Why bother with a random original character when there's an established iconic one who serves the same purpose that you can use instead.

chrisdude
09-10-2014, 05:54 AM
True but giving the movie to Baxter or Krang kinda gives even less of a reason for him to be in it. They don't need him. Baxter could easily take over and call Sach's company Stocktronics.

I just don't get why everyone is so overly concerned about Fitchner? There's even a topic or two of wanting Megan replaced as someone else to play April, but Sachs? Oh no, we MUST simply have him in the sequel. It's nonsense.Baxter work(s) for Sachs, and Sachs experiments on the ooze that may be from Dimension X. It's reasonable to think he would be involved in Baxter or Krang plot.

Plus, it's a fair question. This actor was supposed to play the central villain in a trilogy. Now his role has changed. We don't have a ton to speculate about, but I think this is an interesting question. I don't see any reason to think Megan Fox will be replaced, but this could really go either way.

Coola Yagami
09-10-2014, 05:59 AM
Baxter work(s) for Sachs, and Sachs experiments on the ooze that may be from Dimension X. It's reasonable to think he would be involved in Baxter or Krang plot.

Plus, it's a fair question. This actor was supposed to play the central villain in a trilogy. Now his role has changed. We don't have a ton to speculate about, but I think this is an interesting question. I don't see any reason to think Megan Fox will be replaced, but this could really go either way.



I'm wondering. Was Megan also signed up to be April for the trilogy?

Donny
09-11-2014, 04:57 AM
this is where id want them to go. Sack's role in this universe is basically the same as stockmans anyway. Why bother with a random original character when there's an established iconic one who serves the same purpose that you can use instead.

I agree that the two characters are pretty similar, and I was really bummed that Baxter really wasnīt a part of the movie. However, I can appreciate if they add a new character and Sachs was a nice character. But as said, they need to evolve the character in order to keep him in the sequels, or else he could easily end up being a boring an pointless character. I would have been happy if they just sticked to the plot about creating super soldiers, and Baxter could be working directly under Sachs, who would work under Shredder in creating the super soldiers. It wasnīt necessary to add another purpose for Sachs being interested in the mutagen just because he no longer was Shredder, which just ruined part of the plot. He could simply just be working under Shredder. This could be a nice way to have introduced Baxter in the first movie in order for him to take over the company, as Coola Yagami suggested. It would be nice to see Baxter "loosing in" in the sequel, gradually being more and more mad turning him into the dangerous villain he is. But they of course donīt need Sachs for this to happen in the next movie, unless the plot includes Baxter killing Sachs or turning him into something else with the mutagen.

Candy Kappa
09-11-2014, 05:24 AM
since Baxter Stockman was in the movie, blink and you'll miss him though. Sacks was pretty pointless from the start.