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View Full Version : Official Episode Discussion S4 Ep 18: Mutant Gangland


Vicky82
09-04-2016, 03:12 AM
https://66.media.tumblr.com/5e1feebe5978bffc05ac84f5ff9124c1/tumblr_ocy7p2PZG91ts0huyo1_500.jpg

Don Vizioso's gang tracks the Turtles with a bunch of anti-mutant weapons.

The Mutanimals are back.

Why does Raph quit the team?

Why are they trying to hurt Donnie?

The episode is now up on I Tunes.

Vicky82
09-04-2016, 04:25 AM
Awesome episode, it was intense. It did feel more of a filler than last weeks episode though.

It looks like Pidgeon Pete won't be returning, I wonder if there's been a problem with his voice actor or IDW told Nick not to use him anymore.

Last week a had a theory (I posted it on Tumblr, not here) that Splinter may be killed off soon because he seemed to help with the turtles fear and weaknesses. In Broken Foot he had to talk to Leo about the bad things about going solo and keeping it a secret. Last week he was helping Raph's fear.

In this episode it looks like Splinter's death is being foreshadowed because he was saying to the turtles that he won't be around for long and he's worried about there weaknesses and still need to mature.

MarsicornYT
09-04-2016, 04:58 AM
Yeah, I thought that was an awesome episode. It was kind of a filler, but it still linked back to the City at War plot because they were trying to take over because Shredders 'gone.' Loved Leatherhead's booyakasha at the end. And seeing how this second half of the season is going so far (going really good), if they do kill off Splinter it's going to be even sadder than the last time.

ToTheNines
09-04-2016, 05:23 AM
I've been singing "Mutant Gangland" to the tune of Baba O'Riley by The Who all weekend lol. Psyched for 11.

Mugen_Jin18
09-04-2016, 05:32 AM
Awesome episode, it was intense. It did feel more of a filler than last weeks episode though.

It looks like Pidgeon Pete won't be returning, I wonder if there's been a problem with his voice actor or IDW told Nick not to use him anymore.

Last week a had a theory (I posted it on Tumblr, not here) that Splinter may be killed off soon because he seemed to help with the turtles fear and weaknesses. In Broken Foot he had to talk to Leo about the bad things about going solo and keeping it a secret. Last week he was helping Raph's fear.

In this episode it looks like Splinter's death is being foreshadowed because he was saying to the turtles that he won't be around for long and he's worried about there weaknesses and still need to mature.

I don't think they will kill Splinter again.

I think Super Shredder kills Karai during their all out war & in season 5 the turtles go on a mystic/spiritual journey to the underworld or somewhere like that, to bring Karai back to life. That's where they meet kavaxas(or however you spell it) in the process. Or maybe April is the one who dies...

Powder
09-04-2016, 07:35 AM
Dare I say best episode of the season...? YES! Everything I want in a TMNT episode right here. Action, gut-busting laughs, high-octane violence, mafia goons, Rist & Feldman reunited, it goes on. Leonardo was drinking Ramune! :tlol: No over the top April/Karai powers, just pure awesome from the mutants we know & love, facing ideal foes. Mutanimals aside, it felt a bit like Mirage in tone. Wonderful array of voice talent.

It was sooooo good. I haven't been feeling the last few episodes too much, but my hype level is back at 100% now.

The Happy One
09-04-2016, 07:52 AM
Dare I say best episode of the season...? YES! Everything I want in a TMNT episode right here. Action, gut-busting laughs, high-octane violence, mafia goons, Rist & Feldman reunited, it goes on. Leonardo was drinking Ramune! :tlol: No over the top April/Karai powers, just pure awesome from the mutants we know & love, facing ideal foes. Mutanimals aside, it felt a bit like Mirage in tone. Wonderful array of voice talent.

It was sooooo good. I haven't been feeling the last few episodes too much, but my hype level is back at 100% now.

Wow that good?! Now these next two hours will be the worst wait...

Quick question though...did this involve Shredder at all...like did he hire these dudes or is it just like the City at War free for all thing? :D

Powder
09-04-2016, 07:55 AM
That's just my opinion, mind you. I'd hate for someone to get their hopes up only to be disappointed as we may share different tastes. But yeah I have nothing to complain about whatsoever. Mad good.

It's all mafia stuff right now. No sign of Shredder or his affiliates in this episode.

Vicky82
09-04-2016, 07:55 AM
Wow that good?! Now these next two hours will be the worst wait...

Quick question though...did this involve Shredder at all...like did he hire these dudes or is it just like the City at War free for all thing? :D

He wasn't in the episode and he didn't hire them. The mafia knew he had disappeared and they are trying to take over New York as well.

MarsicornYT
09-04-2016, 08:12 AM
I wonder if Pigeon Pete actually died or just left the team. The mutanimals seemed pretty sad, but I hope we get a full explanation down the track.
And sorry just wanted to make sure for anyone who hasn't seen the episode yet.

Vicky82
09-04-2016, 08:24 AM
The way they said it

"We don't talk about Pigeon Pete"

He probably just left the team but in real life they probably had problems with his voice actor or maybe there been problems between IDW and Nick and IDW didn't want Nick to use him anymore but i'm betting it's problems with his voice actor.

ctt4lfecw
09-04-2016, 10:12 AM
So funny, I guess Pidgeon Pete had contract issues lol

Juanita27
09-04-2016, 10:13 AM
Why is it Raph can act childish but when Donnie fights fire with fire Splinter reprimands Donnie? I might just be being defensive bc don is my fav :)

Amd this is at least the second time Splinter brings up Donnie's intelligence (think the other episode was one of the mutagen man one's), which I think is a low blow- he is just a teenager, so just because he is a genius he shouldn't be held to a higher standard...he will make mistakes.....Splinter in turn should have praised him for apologizing to Raph

TigerClaw
09-04-2016, 10:21 AM
hah, a pee joke from Mondo Gecko.

TigerClaw
09-04-2016, 10:23 AM
The way they said it

"We don't talk about Pigeon Pete"

He probably just left the team but in real life they probably had problems with his voice actor or maybe there been problems between IDW and Nick and IDW didn't want Nick to use him anymore but i'm betting it's problems with his voice actor.
That's something that can be fixed by getting another voice actor.

NinjaMan
09-04-2016, 10:25 AM
Raph with the Rampage Jackson move. Makes me wonder if Pete was killed the way they responded.

Vicky82
09-04-2016, 10:28 AM
That's something that can be fixed by getting another voice actor.

Yeah but as he was only in 4 episodes and he's not that popular, maybe the right thing to do was write him out of the show.

If it been a character who's been in more episodes and a lot more popular then they probably would have gotten a new voice actor.

They would have to explain the voice change as well.

Aaronardo
09-04-2016, 10:33 AM
To quote Donnie from this episode: "That turned out so much better than expected."

Every single joke and plot point worked incredibly well this episode. Not a single dull or groan-worthy moment. The plot was actually quite strong this time around and the characters were all nicely in character, with a healthy dosage of bickering. I don't normally like this humorless Splinter, but he felt necessary for this particular episode.

This honestly felt like an older episode, it was so tightly written and well-done. Without any doubts, best episode of the show since Tale of the Yokai. So happy about that you have no idea. Booyakasha.

TigerClaw
09-04-2016, 10:34 AM
It was a good episode, plenty of action, the Mutanimals are back sans Pigeon Pete, that one bad guy that sounds like Stallone.

and Mondo Gecko needed to pee so bad. :tlol:

ObiWanFan4life
09-04-2016, 10:36 AM
To quote Donnie from this episode: "That turned out so much better than expected."

Every single joke and plot point worked incredibly well this episode. Not a single dull or groan-worthy moment. The plot was actually quite strong this time around and the characters were all nicely in character, with a healthy dosage of bickering. I don't normally like this humorless Splinter, but he felt necessary for this particular episode.

This honestly felt like an older episode, it was so tightly written and well-done. Without any doubts, best episode of the show since Tale of the Yokai. So happy about that you have no idea. Booyakasha.

Indeed. I also like how the violence doesn't feel so watered down here. It actually looks like the turtles are down for killing these guys.

myconius
09-04-2016, 10:48 AM
i've been absolutely loving the new direction and tone of Season 4 !!!
hard to believe its part of the the same Season as 'Turtles in Space'.
getting excited about this series again. :)

NinjaMan
09-04-2016, 10:49 AM
The way splinter was talking was making me sad. Best episode of the season.

ToTheNines
09-04-2016, 10:53 AM
Dare I say best episode of the season...? YES! Everything I want in a TMNT episode right here. Action, gut-busting laughs, high-octane violence, mafia goons, Rist & Feldman reunited, it goes on. Leonardo was drinking Ramune! :tlol: No over the top April/Karai powers, just pure awesome from the mutants we know & love, facing ideal foes. Mutanimals aside, it felt a bit like Mirage in tone. Wonderful array of voice talent.

It was sooooo good. I haven't been feeling the last few episodes too much, but my hype level is back at 100% now.

I feel the same! The pacing finally felt natural, too. It had been so rushed and jumbled for so long.

Anyone catch the Dr. Feral reference? Hope he shows up, it'd be so cool to have a Palladium character in the show.

I feel like an old Naughty Dog employee works on the show now lol. The Hammer (funny Stallone pastiche) looked like he was rocking an N. Gin suit from Crash Bandicoot, and Vizioso totally reminded me of Krew in his little hover thingy.

2K3
09-04-2016, 11:00 AM
Gotta say, that was a fun episode; couldn't help but noticed the resemblance to a X-Men/ Gargoyles: Goliath Chronicles Episode (Heck the goons kinda reminded me of the Quarrymen as well!)

1) I'm all for Mondo Gecko replacing Pigeon Pete; just wish they had a better explanation that just "We don't talk 'bout Pigeon Pete anymore".
2) The battle formation Rockwell, Leatherhead and Slash made reminded me of the "Flight Formation" from "Sonic Heroes" (please tell me you can see it).
3) Looking forward to seeing more of Don Vizioso and his mafia. They make a good "3rd group" to the Foot Clan and Purple Dragons.

Ninturtle
09-04-2016, 11:00 AM
This episode was mediocre to me, none of the jokes landed to me and Don Visiosos chair was way too goofy. I liked seeing the Mutanimals again and I like how Petes death was implied but the rest of the episode was just alright.
Edit: Splinter was also great in this episode.

PApagreg
09-04-2016, 11:04 AM
huh this episode seems to be getting a lot of praise, time to be the turd in the punch bowl I guess

Pros: Good fight scenes, Inclusion of human enemies, and an interesting plot

Cons: Why do we need another episode of "Raph being angry and leaving the team" I agree with Donnie get a new song and dance, Why does this episode have lesson why could't it be "The mob is making anti mutagen weapons so we are going to sabotage their whole operation" with no lesson at the end, it feels as if this show can't have an episode without some lesson. Also why is Mondo Gecko here, the others would be better off making a wallet out of him or eating him. Why did Leo decide to confront the Don face to face instead of getting him when he doesn't have his guards on him not really ninja like, seriously even Spiderman would know getting the boss alone would be a good idea. Also why does every scene we have with the Don hes stuffing his face, okay we get it he's fat its not really funny or interesting.

2/5 for this episode

The Happy One
09-04-2016, 11:08 AM
That's just my opinion, mind you. I'd hate for someone to get their hopes up only to be disappointed as we may share different tastes. But yeah I have nothing to complain about whatsoever. Mad good.

It's all mafia stuff right now. No sign of Shredder or his affiliates in this episode.

Well you didn't get my hopes up for nothing! This episode was great!!:D Lots of action true to this series right from the beginning and enough humor to keep it going, too!

The dialogue was great, especially when it came to Raph.

And the new characters were flawless!

GoldMutant
09-04-2016, 11:08 AM
Hm... much better than expected indeed. One of the best this season, but it's still not saying much.

Credit where credit is due, Vizioso's gang was entertaining. Makes me wonder why they weren't fully utilized more due to having Brian Bloom for so long on the cast with the television characters. Special mention though to The Hammer, especially due to mutants needing to go extinct:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLEfuPAZ0F8

The action knows when to cut at the proper times, making it feel much darker in terms of story, especially when Rockwell sends some of the gang down onto a car. Only minor complaint here is just how Hammer was defeated; not as silly as Tiger Claw hit by the Dragon's Tail, but I kinda hoped for a different method of victory. For what it was though, the action is the episode's strong point yet again outside character. Not as good as City at War for me, but still relatively solid.

Speaking of character though, they all work... almost. The group bounces off each other well in the first lair scene, there's moments of foreshadowing (Pete's dead? Splinter dying again?), ultimately the characters work well. Todd Casey does a good job in terms of comedy while keeping the drama up, give him another episode to write please. However, there is two characters I don't feel he nailed perfectly.

Where I'm not impressed by him is Raphael yet again. He wasn't that bad mind you, but am I the only one who felt he was too angry again? It felt too much like Clash of the Mutanimals; no, not the out of character anger, but too similar in what happens. We get a cold scene of the Mutanimals fighting someone without reason, then switch to the lair where Raph is angry, commence the plot from that anger. Although here it's better due to the characterizations, especially Don's fake crying, it still feels the same personally, except it's Don Vizioso instead of Shredder in the center.

Personally, I didn't fully like Mondo here either. If he was taken in by the Mutanimals for his "skills," why didn't they train him based on his last appearances, especially Annihilation: Earth!? I get Mondo is in over his head like Timothy was prior to mutation, but shouldn't he be trained? It's the third time he got his tail kicked and it's a bit irritating (though the snow angel and Rist... :tlol:). Not fully bad, just not my forte.

Lastly, for "anti-mutant weapons," why didn't they do damage to Leatherhead in the final fight compared to Don and Raph? Seems weird due to the synopsis.

It's solidly paced all the way through regardless, but it seems weird for this to be here so late in the series. Obviously for Vizioso to claim NYC for himself with Shredder down (for now... :twink:), but otherwise I do feel it could've been executed in season 3 too. Overall, decent episode; now then, give us more of the mafia.

6 out of 10 as my final rating as of now.

NinjaMan
09-04-2016, 11:10 AM
Really like how the mutanimals are like extended family members to the turtles. Hope they show up for an all out battle against the foot. Also makes me wonder if splinter and shredder will both die at the end of this season.

Bitsy83
09-04-2016, 11:40 AM
Huh. Interesting episode.

Well, of COURSE we get a Sly Stallone-esque character. It's always him, Arnold Schwartzenager, or Clint Eastwood when they're impersonating tough guys (Bruce Lee not included).

It's nice to see their addressing the "Mutants aren't welcomed" angle, but I hope they go more into it. This Doc Fallon (I think that was the name) has definitely piqued my interest. He'll probably be the Bishop of this show...or a total ripoff of Frankenstein or the Reanimator. (Oh, GOD I hope they don't go the Reanimator route. I still get nightmares about the head...)

Man, Donnie has just NOT been doing well this season, has he? Are they trying to do issue #44 very vaguely or what? And having him shiver like that in the hotel just seemed....a BIT OOC. I mean, I know Donnie's not the strongest dude on the team, but I'd like to think he'd stare death in the face a little bit more than that. Unless that was Mondo shaking them both.

And Raph getting mad.

And quitting.

And blaming Leo for being too soft.

Again.

:tconfuse:

Ok, I'm going on a VERY small rant here, but I want you guys to know I still like this show and I do want it to last at least one more season (if Nick doesn't milk it too dry), but Raph really needs better character development stories. I know a lot of people hate her, but I felt Mona Lisa kinda helps him with that. He was willing to choose the pacifistic route on Thalos 3 when he tried to make an alliance with her and Sal Commander. He just acts calmer when he's around her. Also, when she declared her love for him, it gave him the confidence he needed. I'm tired of just seeing Raph mad or scared. It's nice to see him concerned, calm, and thinking things through and those only seem to happen when she's around. So if the rumors are true and she'll either appear at the end of season 4 or beginning of season 5, I hope we see some better Raph stories.

There's really not much else to say but I hope they continue the mutant outcast story, I want to see Doc Fallon, and we don't get any repeats with Raph. Though that last one's a pretty tall order...

Jephael
09-04-2016, 11:44 AM
I really loved Splinter's lesson about making amends before it's too late. I wish more people would take that message to heart, not just here on the internet but in real life as well. Somebody mentioned earlier that he was a little too harsh with Donatello for picking a fight with Raphael in the beginning of the episode, but Splinter made a valuable point. You don't stoke the fire with gasoline.

TMNTInsighter
09-04-2016, 11:58 AM
I'm giving this episode a C (3 out of 5 stars) and it actually kind of pains me to do that b/c the Mutanimals are always a welcome sight. After all, if the turtles are Splinter's legacy, then the Mutanimals are theirs. They also have interesting backstories, work pretty well as their own team, and are good counterparts of the turtles themselves. Todd Casey has also been one of this series' best writers along with Sebastian Montes being the director of many of my favorite episodes. But in this episode they just couldn't figure out where they wanted to go. While the "Insecta Trifecta" also got a C, it did so because it was a non serious episode that didn't need to do much to overcome its shortcomings. This one was supposed to be a serious episode and it didn't do enough to overcome its own shortcomings and that's always the bigger disappointment:

"Bad poets borrow. Good poets steal." It's an old quote by poet and author TS Elliott which is perhaps the most relevant quote in these days of unoriginality in the entertainment world. What he basically meant was that what a bad artist is unable to disguise as belonging to somebody else, a good artist makes his own. One look at Raph's conflict with his family and we know they're borrowing from episodes such as "Turtle Temper" and (more relevantly) "TGTB&CJ", and "Slash and Destroy." There's also a nice little throwback to SRMF5 that drove the episode "Mutagen Man Unleashed" which, with regards to the title character, was also revisited when the loss of one Mutanimal was shrewdly noted by Michelangelo and dismissed shockingly by the leader of the team itself. Along with the outrageous shtick the Vizioso gang provides later, this has all the markings of another episode that shouldn't be taken seriously until they throw in the half-baked attempt at a story regarding discrimination.
Now, let's just pretend for a moment that "Casey Jones vs. the Underworld", which was a beautiful marriage of the realistic and the fantastical mind you, didn't happen, and thus the Vizioso gang willingly let in and put up (somewhat) well with a batch of worse mutants than our group of protagonists. Even then, this story of discrimination doesn't go very far; and in this author's honest opinion is both a good and bad thing.
Now maybe it's just me, but I don't think discrimination makes for very satisfying entertainment. It is an important subject in our world, the motivations however aren't well understood, and the politics surrounding it have become increasingly murky to navigate (especially these days when the claim can be made in just about any situation). And perhaps I should have been born in the Jim Crow days to understand it, but the motives usually displayed (whether by fictional or nonfictional entertainment) are wan and as stupidly unilluminating as Cobra Commander's lust for world domination. Even worse, something so serious as this becomes cheap when treated melodramatically, whether by the political pundits on MSNBC or the more tiresome stories in the X-Men franchise. Nor can I feel, that this is the type of issue that can successfully be explored and resolved in the pat and stiff way that the action genre requires. Shredder's occasional contention and rocky relationship with his mutant henchmen is at least colored by his undisguised egomania which can give that relationship a compelling luster if explored enough. But Vizioso's mob just comes off as an out of left field group of cardboard haters which subtract from the credibility of their characters and their cause in this episode. Neither is the Don himself a very interesting adversary, somewhere in between the competently handled Kingpin and leaning more towards the unlikeable likes of The Blob and Batman TAS Boss Biggis.
Stories like that were never part of the problem in the early days for the Ninja Turtles, largely because they followed the Stewart-Fonda Solution: just don't talk about it. The stories in either the comics or the television series' knew what they had and knew they didn't need much to make them click. Good characterizations wrapped around a genuinely emotional (and sometimes inventive/creative) story was all they needed and they didn't get bogged down in social or political commentary (again check the X-Men). That's why the Ninja Turtles have been able to stand on their own feet for all these years, even if they are often overshadowed by the excellent marketing of Marvel's and DC's own creations.
In the end, this was a middle some episode that couldn't figure out the tone it wanted to establish nor how far it wanted to push the story it wanted to tell. There are some moments of indecision, even peril, but those are nullified by both the over-the-top schtick (the "No Mutants Allowed" sign, anti-mutant weapons, the Don's outrageous flying chair, and a reference to the cargo loader in "Aliens" for example) and the fact that no one is forced to make any hard decisions with regards to this apparent anti-mutant plot they're trapped in. With all these things offsetting each other, is it no surprise that this half-baked episode deserves anything more than a half rating?

snake
09-04-2016, 12:31 PM
Great episode. I'm shocked at how violent this one was. Loved it though :lol:

Was Dr. Feral a reference to something?

drgon78
09-04-2016, 12:38 PM
Good episode, not great, though Raph being a drama queen again is getting old.

ToTheNines
09-04-2016, 12:48 PM
Great episode. I'm shocked at how violent this one was. Loved it though :lol:

Was Dr. Feral a reference to something?

Yeah, from the old Palladium RP books.

Autbot_Benz
09-04-2016, 01:03 PM
The Gangster that sounds like Sylvester Stallone is awesome. I also loved Rockwell saying Great Scott like doc brown.

CyberCubed
09-04-2016, 01:05 PM
This was a great episode, and its why I always love gangster stories in TMNT. Having them hunt mutants was also a great idea since Bishop is an Utrom in this version. The gangster designs and parodies were also quite fun.

Also anyone notice the fight scenes in this episode in particular were really well choreographed? It wasn't just generic kicking and throwing, there were actually some really good scenes in this episode, reminded me of the fight scenes from the better episodes of the 2k3 series. I also loved Don Visioso's flying chair.

Mondo Gecko was great to have back too, although I do wish he could fight properly. All in all a well done action episode, we definitely need more gangsters in TMNT.

NinjaMan
09-04-2016, 01:17 PM
http://i.imgur.com/lX2BsTz.jpg

matteso586
09-04-2016, 01:41 PM
1) My theory: Pigeon Pete migrated south.

2) Does anyone think that Vizioso has a point during his conversation with Leo, Mikey, Leatherhead, Slash, and Rockwell?

3) Who is this Doc Feral?

The Happy One
09-04-2016, 01:48 PM
Man, Donnie has just NOT been doing well this season, has he? Are they trying to do issue #44 very vaguely or what? And having him shiver like that in the hotel just seemed....a BIT OOC. I mean, I know Donnie's not the strongest dude on the team, but I'd like to think he'd stare death in the face a little bit more than that. Unless that was Mondo shaking them both.

And Raph getting mad.

And quitting.

And blaming Leo for being too soft.

Again.

:tconfuse:



I totally agree with you on Don.

I don't know if they're planning on doing something drastic with him or if it's just a continuous tactic they like to use to write him out or...??? But while I did enjoy this episode very much I did pick that up.

Donnie should be able to hold his own in battle. And while they did use tranqs I feel like the writers collectively have this idea that Don is sort of invalid- and only fights as good as his brothers when it counts. I may just be talking nonsense here but, gosh, even with Raph?

Like it fit this episode. His anger. It fits because he's seeing the danger (esp. after reading Tmnt Universe I see Raph in even a better light) and he wants to end it while they can. Train harder. Fight better. Protect. It's in his nature and they played on it well.

But...they didn't have to include the whole 'Leo being soft' trope. That's just repetition.

But for this episode I saw no huge problem with it, since they didn't rely too heavily on his beef with Leo as leader aa much as it did on his burning desire to be better, stronger and faster in the fight. .

I just hope they fix this with Donatello tho...he's got a lot of potential, plot wise. His characterization is pretty good...but there's still something off about it.

Autbot_Benz
09-04-2016, 01:52 PM
I still want those lazy bums at Playmates to make another monkey brains figure with his helmet and arm pads. so badly.:x

ToTheNines
09-04-2016, 01:57 PM
3) Who is this Doc Feral?

Let's see...


Anyone catch the Dr. Feral reference? Hope he shows up, it'd be so cool to have a Palladium character in the show.

Yeah, from the old Palladium RP books.

thundermaster612
09-04-2016, 03:33 PM
This was a great episode. It was a bit more darker than normal but I guess that's what happens whenever Slash is in an episode. They should've had a punchline thing where Raph finds a gang member with a pickaxe so he beats him and takes it and goes up to the Dirk Savage-esque character with his mech and says "Hey Hammer! Meet Pickaxe!"
I gonna either assume they just don't like Pete so their not talking about him, he migrated, or he's in the same place as Kurtzman. The way they said that they don't talk about him didn't sound too serious along with their reactions and them brushing it off easily. Also it appears that Don's minions are a little bit better than Foot Soldiers. Overall just a really good episode.

Also it was nice to get a break from the whole Shredder thing, I wouldn't mind seeing Splinter die off again. No offense but hopefully for good this time, I like Splinter a lot but him dying again would add so much more

CyberCubed
09-04-2016, 03:48 PM
You know I'm surprised so many people didn't realize "Hammer" was a parody of Sylvester Stallone. The way he talked and his face was a dead giveaway.

Groverman62
09-04-2016, 03:57 PM
Did anyone else think that Slash sounded weird here. Like he was really raspy

ninja-zero
09-04-2016, 04:29 PM
Wonder if throughout this season, the whole city will learn about the turtles' existence.

lonewarrior20
09-04-2016, 04:43 PM
i thought it was ok. i'm pretty sure this is the one of stallones they parodied for hammer.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-FAQeDhiHOQ0/T58WXy-Bv4I/AAAAAAAAMTY/yK31rmq2NP0/s1600/stallone-cobra.jpg

Jephael
09-04-2016, 04:46 PM
Did anyone else think that Slash sounded weird here. Like he was really raspy

Maybe Corey Feldman had a bad cold during recording or something.

BubblyShell22
09-04-2016, 05:12 PM
Awesome episode. My theory about Pete is that he left the team since that was a theme of the episode with Raph leaving. Loved the scene with Leo and Raph sparring as well as the gang villains. I thought The Hammer was a parody of both Stallone and Scott Hall since he did the toothpick thing and he said, "Hey, yo!" which was one of Hall's catchphrases. Either way, I liked him. I also liked Splinter's lesson and though I don't feel that he will die in the series itself, it's still a reality that he will die someday and the Turtles will have to go on alone as a family so it's best not to hold grudges. Loved seeing Mondo there too. Overall, a pretty good episode.

Vicky82
09-04-2016, 05:18 PM
Does anyone know who voiced Hammer.

Aaronardo
09-04-2016, 06:08 PM
I see a lot of rants about Raph being angry in this episode. While I agree it's a pretty tired plot-point, it's still miles better than Raph not having a personality at all like it's been recently. EVERYONE was in character this episode. I'll take that even if we need to recycle another character plot to get it.

CyberCubed
09-04-2016, 06:14 PM
I see a lot of rants about Raph being angry in this episode. While I agree it's a pretty tired plot-point, it's still miles better than Raph not having a personality at all like it's been recently. EVERYONE was in character this episode. I'll take that even if we need to recycle another character plot to get it.

Raphael had plenty of personality in all recent episodes.

IndigoErth
09-04-2016, 06:42 PM
Pretty good one, glad to have watched it on tv for once. The Raph is mad and "quits" bit again, huh? Even the other characters are commenting on how common this is now... lol Sure, his tantrums are redundant, but he's a sassy, pissy little bugger as it is, he wouldn't otherwise be Raph and people would complain about him being too soft.

I really liked Splinters talk with them, about needing to mature and that nothing lasts forever, including family. Kind of spooky him talking about that... Hope they don't kill him off.

Than again, given his own past, maybe it just comes from his own hard lesson in life. Loss of his wife by death, loss of his adoptive brother to becoming the Shredder, his daughter is still lost to him in some way and the child/person she would have been was lost to the influence of Shredder raising her.


Only negative to me on this one... I could just still really really do without the whole "lets retract our limbs into our shells" thing. Cartoons may have a lot of tolerable illogical things, but that part just goes a bit far and creeps me out to be honest; seeing as how it neither works that way nor should work for them and looks weird on the outside. Just how large of an abdominal cavity do they have that is now crammed full of their arms and legs? *cringe*

And one of baddie goons up on the bed too like that... Awkward. Seriously, Donnie should have kicked him in the face instead. Agree they're making him too wimpy.

victory_angel
09-04-2016, 06:56 PM
Let's see...

Dr. Feral is essentially this guy.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/tmnt/images/f/fb/Dr._Victor_Oban_Feral.png/revision/latest?cb=20150823210133

Dr. Victor Falco is loosely based off this guy.
Quoted from Turtlepedia: Feral is an extremely intelligent, polite and respectful in tone. He's a genuinely nice and benevolent person—to humans. He uses his great wealth and scientific prowess to benefit mankind.

Feral's villainy comes in his dismissive attitude towards the rights of animals, including sentient mutant animals, even those he himself has mutated and made intelligent. He is intensely interested in mutant animals, and will secretly imprison any he comes across in his underground laboratory, and vivisect those that he suspects will further his scientific interest. Those he does not vivisect, he keeps alive because of their usefulness to him—Karl the mutant rabbit and Igor the mutant rat have been kept alive as slaves assisting him in his secret laboratory. Feral maintains a polite tone to all mutant animals, even though he does not respect their rights as individuals.

The only animal Feral treats with love and affection is his former pet Otto Rattus, a mutant rat he has extensively surgically modified to appear human, and who accompanies him in public as his chauffeur and bodyguard.

Feral is such a charming personality that he commands the utmost respect and reverence as a public figure in the human community. Even police are usually willing to bend the law for his convenience. This makes him all the more dangerous to mutant characters who try to evade him.

Feral never personally commits any crimes that can be traced to him. He leaves all the criminal activity to his servants

Ursalink
09-04-2016, 07:01 PM
really don't like Splinter's mentions about him not being with the Turtles forever and stuff in today's episode. I mean, he's right, but after what happened at the end of Season 3, I don't want Splinter to be killed or die again. I prefer to think of this as simply foreshadowing the end of the series.

I mean, I could imagine this for the end of the season: The Turtles fight against the Shredder in his Super-Shredder's form, in their ultimate battle. As usual, everything is left to a match between Shredder and Splinter; and the fight is so intense that it seems both of them perish in their final battle. (Probably as a symbol that they are both doomed to an eternal war while they live). However, there's no sign of their bodies, leaving open the door for them to be alive.

I can imagine that, in the next/probably last season, the Turtles will then start to be trained by the Ancient One (you know, from the 2003's series). The Turtles and his allies will then surely start to be trained in the most mystic arts of Ninjitsu; and by the end of the season, we will see Splinter and Shredder alive once more. Since this could be possibly the last season of the series, the final battle will finally bring the end of the Shredder, as the Turtles reunites with their father and start a new chapter of their lives.

Autbot_Benz
09-04-2016, 07:12 PM
Does anyone know who voiced Hammer.

It says Eric Bauza voiced Hammer also Tom Kenny didn't voice Pete it was AJ Buckley

ctt4lfecw
09-04-2016, 07:12 PM
Raph had some nice fighting moments in this one.

Powder
09-04-2016, 07:13 PM
It says Eric Bauza voiced Hammer also Tom Kenny didn't voice Pete it was AJ Buckley

That was definitely Tom. Buckley does/did Pete.

Aaronardo
09-04-2016, 07:18 PM
Raphael had plenty of personality in all recent episodes.

Name one time in a non Raph-centric episode where Raph has gotten even the slightest bit angry in Season 4.

The Happy One
09-04-2016, 07:39 PM
Name one time in a non Raph-centric episode where Raph has gotten even the slightest bit angry in Season 4.

Facts bro. He literally was so mellowed out this past season it made me slightly uneasy :lol:

matteso586
09-04-2016, 07:41 PM
Dr. Feral is essentially this guy.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/tmnt/images/f/fb/Dr._Victor_Oban_Feral.png/revision/latest?cb=20150823210133

Dr. Victor Falco is loosely based off this guy.

You made it sound like you're theorizing that Doc Feral is just an alias.

Ninjinister
09-04-2016, 08:21 PM
People who complain about Raph not "learning his lesson" about his temper obviously have never known anyone with anger issues.

Ioz
09-04-2016, 08:26 PM
I wonder if they wrote Pigeon Pete off because Playmates decided not to make his toy. He was kind of a lame character, but I would have liked more than a passing comment to explain him being gone.

Powder
09-04-2016, 08:29 PM
I wonder if they wrote Pigeon Pete off because Playmates decided not to make his toy. He was kind of a lame character, but I would have liked more than a passing comment to explain him being gone.

Well he was/is supposed to have a Half Shell Heroes figure at least. Probably cancelled by now...

VaughnMichael
09-04-2016, 08:29 PM
Loved the episode though I'm bummed that the Hammer wasn't Dirk Savage.
But the Doc Feral reference more than made up for it.
I really hope he shows up in the show!

CyberCubed
09-04-2016, 08:59 PM
I wonder if they wrote Pigeon Pete off because Playmates decided not to make his toy. He was kind of a lame character, but I would have liked more than a passing comment to explain him being gone.

Yes, because the Nick writers are really going to drop a character because of Playmates.

Chaotix12345
09-04-2016, 09:38 PM
Could be because they're planning on having Wingnut and Screwloose join them eventually and having three nutty flyers on the team at once is overkill.

ranger_scout
09-04-2016, 11:21 PM
I think by now Raph should really control his temper. Yes I know being hot-headed is part of his personality and that can be very hard to let go, but he doesn't realize that consequences that result from it.

CyberCubed
09-05-2016, 01:02 AM
I think by now Raph should really control his temper. Yes I know being hot-headed is part of his personality and that can be very hard to let go, but he doesn't realize that consequences that result from it.

See: Every other version of Raphael ever.

shredder orokusaki
09-05-2016, 02:00 AM
Grr!! Those idiots gangsters! They failed me again! Grrrrrr!!!!! That fat idiot Don Viozo is totaly useless. He dosent do anything else than eating!!!

ToTheNines
09-05-2016, 04:43 AM
I bet you're fat.

Wildcat
09-05-2016, 05:46 AM
Funny how all the gangsters in the restaurant scene missed every shot at basically point-blank range.

No, the monkey guy (forgot his name) did not telekinetic all of them away. It's clear the shots flew off like normal except the ones they obviously showed him stopping.

It just reminded how the Mythbusters did that Star Wars thing with the guns. That old cliche that the good guys always seem to be able to dodge lasers.

There was 3 or 4 gunmen firing automatic weapons in a small restaurant and yet still could not land a hit. As if they were doing it on purpose. Not 1. It's funny given the situation.

thundermaster612
09-05-2016, 06:40 AM
Could be because they're planning on having Wingnut and Screwloose join them eventually and having three nutty flyers on the team at once is overkill.

WN and SL joining reminds me of that cancelled Mutanimals spinoff from the 80s. Also wasn't Muckman supposed to be part of them?

neatoman
09-05-2016, 06:40 AM
So is Pidgeon Pete dead or did they kick him off the team because between him and Mondo, they had too many incompetents?

Powder
09-05-2016, 07:05 AM
WN and SL joining reminds me of that cancelled Mutanimals spinoff from the 80s. Also wasn't Muckman supposed to be part of them?

The two were a part of the original Mutanimals, yo. As for Muckman, no, I don't believe he was to be a part of the animated series. Scumbug & Wyrm were, though, & there was a villain made out of plumber related fodder so perhaps he's who you're thinking of.

LeotheLateBloomer
09-05-2016, 07:23 AM
That was a pretty damn good episode! Seeing mobsters in a TMNT episode is always a fun time for me. I loved that it was Donnie to go find Raph although I felt Splinter was a little too harsh on him. Donnie drinking juice reminded me of when did that in OotS. I loved where he Mondo Gecko was pretending to make a snow angel when he was knocked out.

Definitely my favorite episode of the season.

I can't remember if Slash or Mondo Gecko appeared in the Archie comics or the FW toon first, though.

ToTheNines
09-05-2016, 07:37 AM
Slash was FW first, Mondo was Archie first. Pretty sure they both were toys before either though.

MikeandRaph87
09-05-2016, 09:02 AM
There has been discussion about Pigeon Pete being absent from the group,but remember the group grew from four to six with Muckman in addition to Mondo Gecko. So where was Muckman?

Vicky82
09-05-2016, 09:08 AM
There has been discussion about Pigeon Pete being absent from the group,but remember the group grew from four to six with Muckman in addition to Mondo Gecko. So where was Muckman?

There was no indication that Muckman joined the Mutanimals, yes we saw him with them in season 3 final and Earth's Last Stand but he was there to help the Turtles. He hadn't actually joined them.

And anyway Mondo Gecko joined them after Earth's Last Stand not before.

ToTheNines
09-05-2016, 09:26 AM
Just realized the Fulci twins are also Tarantino references (aside from the obvious Lucio Fulci gag). Their first names are Vic and Vinny, like the Vega Brothers from Reservoir Dogs and Pulp Fiction.

IndigoErth
09-05-2016, 10:24 AM
I think by now Raph should really control his temper. Yes I know being hot-headed is part of his personality and that can be very hard to let go, but he doesn't realize that consequences that result from it.
Agree he should be at least grasping the fact of the consequences by now. At the same time...those sort of personalities sometimes know it full well but just don't give a damn about the consequences while in that mood. Maybe he's that sort, or simply always holding a false belief that it won't pan out the same "this time."

snake
09-05-2016, 10:25 AM
Just realized the Fulci twins are also Tarantino references (aside from the obvious Lucio Fulci gag). Their first names are Vic and Vinny, like the Vega Brothers from Reservoir Dogs and Pulp Fiction.

Holy sh*t. I didn't even think of that during the episode! Good catch man! :lol:

LeotheLateBloomer
09-05-2016, 11:00 AM
See: Every other version of Raphael ever.

They seem to want Raph to not be Raph.

ssjup81
09-05-2016, 11:11 AM
That was a pretty damn good episode! Seeing mobsters in a TMNT episode is always a fun time for me. I loved that it was Donnie to go find Raph although I felt Splinter was a little too harsh on him. Donnie drinking juice reminded me of when did that in OotS. I loved where he Mondo Gecko was pretending to make a snow angel when he was knocked out.

Definitely my favorite episode of the season.

I can't remember if Slash or Mondo Gecko appeared in the Archie comics or the FW toon first, though.As mentioned both were in the OT, although Mondo Gecko was in the Archie comics first.

For the OT, Slash was Bebop's pet turtle. He kept it secret though for obvious reasons (this is another reason why I always preferred Bebop to Rocksteady). Forgot how he was mutated. He was pretty childlike and dumb and only wanted a palm tree (he had one in his bowl and liked lying under it I think). He ended up sent out into space. When he returned, he beat up Donatello and easily outsmarted him due to gaining a lot of intelligence. Forgot how the ep ended.

With Mondo Gecko, he started off as a Gecko. He was apparently with the turtles and was picked up by some gangster and he taught Mondo Gecko how to be a thief. Michelangelo was having repressed dreams about someone else being there before they were mutated. Lame origin story, IMO. He was obviously set up to be Michelangelo's friend but he was only in two episodes.

TigerClaw
09-05-2016, 11:18 AM
That was a pretty damn good episode! Seeing mobsters in a TMNT episode is always a fun time for me. I loved that it was Donnie to go find Raph although I felt Splinter was a little too harsh on him. Donnie drinking juice reminded me of when did that in OotS. I loved where he Mondo Gecko was pretending to make a snow angel when he was knocked out.

Definitely my favorite episode of the season.

I can't remember if Slash or Mondo Gecko appeared in the Archie comics or the FW toon first, though.
Mondo Gecko first appeared in the Archie comics and was a human turned mutant, the 80s cartoon changed his origin completely.

The Nick version kind of stays true to the Archie comics version.

LeotheLateBloomer
09-05-2016, 12:20 PM
As mentioned both were in the OT, although Mondo Gecko was in the Archie comics first.

For the OT, Slash was Bebop's pet turtle. He kept it secret though for obvious reasons (this is another reason why I always preferred Bebop to Rocksteady). Forgot how he was mutated. He was pretty childlike and dumb and only wanted a palm tree (he had one in his bowl and liked lying under it I think). He ended up sent out into space. When he returned, he beat up Donatello and easily outsmarted him due to gaining a lot of intelligence. Forgot how the ep ended.

With Mondo Gecko, he started off as a Gecko. He was apparently with the turtles and was picked up by some gangster and he taught Mondo Gecko how to be a thief. Michelangelo was having repressed dreams about someone else being there before they were mutated. Lame origin story, IMO. He was obviously set up to be Michelangelo's friend but he was only in two episodes.

I do indeed know of both Mondo and Slash appearing in both Archie and the FW toon. I just didn't know who appeared in what first. Did Wingnut and Screwloose also appeared in Archie first?

CyberCubed
09-05-2016, 12:24 PM
I do indeed know of both Mondo and Slash appearing in both Archie and the FW toon. I just didn't know who appeared in what first. Did Wingnut and Screwloose also appeared in Archie first?

Yes since they appeared in the first year of the Archie run. They didn't appear in the original cartoon till Season 5.

Lil Karai
09-05-2016, 12:57 PM
Great end to a really fun season!

MikeandRaph87
09-05-2016, 12:59 PM
Slash first appeared in October 1990's debut airing of Slash: The Evil Turtle from Dimension X. His figure came out that Fall as well. Slash debuted in Archie's TMNT Adventures in August 1991.

Mondo Gecko did appear in Archie's TMNT Adventures first as he debuted in #18 out March 1991. His figure and toy debuted in the Fall of 1991 when Michelangelo Meets Mondo Gecko debut airing came in September.

Wingnut and Screwloose debuted together in Archie's TMNT Adventures#8 in February 1990 while Wingnut and Screwloose did not debut in the show until September 1991 in Zach and The Alien Invaders over a year and a half later.

Powder
09-05-2016, 03:24 PM
Great end to a really fun season!

Eh? We still have like 6 or 7 to go.

JH24
09-05-2016, 03:51 PM
This episode was...meh, don't really know how to describe it. It had a lot of good elements so I should have liked this episode. But what dragged it down for me was Raph throwing a tantrum, again, and going out on his own, again. How many times are they going recycle this storyline? The episode was built on a cheap plot device to get everything going. And it really ruined my enjoyment.


The scene with Splinter and him reminding the turtles he might not always be around was interesting though.

Toadtrooper
09-05-2016, 03:57 PM
I'm a little disappointed they didn't upgrade Mondo. Motorcycle body armor and an upgraded board would make him more effective in combat.

Having Mondo launch a missile into civilians wasn't the best scene to write in, either. Sure, accidental, but he still did it and could have killed somebody.

Speaking of killing, Rockwell totally painted the pavement with three guys. Sure, off-screen, but you don't just walk away from a multi-story fall.

The episode kind of worked, but there's still an uneven tone between funny and violent. Like they want to quip like Spider-Man but don't understand why Spider-Man's quips work in their context.

THGhost
09-05-2016, 06:33 PM
Go5wle3_G5k


The Mutanimals are back! But "We don't talk about Pigeon Pete" apparently. :P
Lampshading that Raph is leaving the team was great.
Splinter's quip about Donnie putting out fires with gasoline... was anyone reminded of this? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpdHMaccjw4)
Loving the Turtles' stealth.
"Look at me now, look at me now!"
Attack Sequence G was pretty rad.
Dr. Rockwell is so OP.
That ending :lol:


Can we please get to Super Shredder now? :P

TigerClaw
09-05-2016, 06:38 PM
Go5wle3_G5k


The Mutanimals are back! But "We don't talk about Pigeon Pete" apparently. :P
Lampshading that Raph is leaving the team was great.
Splinter's quip about Donnie putting out fires with gasoline... was anyone reminded of this? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpdHMaccjw4)
Loving the Turtles' stealth.
"Look at me now, look at me now!"
Attack Sequence G was pretty rad.
Dr. Rockwell is so OP.
That ending :lol:

Mondo Gecko getting captured, and has to pee so badly.

THGhost
09-05-2016, 07:37 PM
Mondo Gecko getting captured, and has to pee so badly.

That would have been an interesting thing to... see? Hear? :P

lonewarrior20
09-05-2016, 08:05 PM
Mondo Gecko getting captured, and has to pee so badly.

i can't help it. i gotta make the joke.

you could say he had to drain the lizard.

Powder
09-05-2016, 08:09 PM
Can we stop this "filler" meme?

LeotheLateBloomer
09-05-2016, 08:23 PM
I'm not a fan of the term "filler". Don't a lot of comic book cartoons have these type of episodes?

TigerClaw
09-05-2016, 08:24 PM
i can't help it. i gotta make the joke.

you could say he had to drain the lizard.
I like how the show tries to be very subtle with its dick jokes, 1st TigerClaw and now Mondo Gecko. :tlol:

snake
09-05-2016, 08:26 PM
Can we stop this "filler" meme?

Seconded for truth

No episode is a filler in a western cartoon. Just because it doesn't contribute to the main plot, doesn't mean it's "filler".

The term filler means that it's only there to take up time as the source material is to close to the show. There is no source material in question here, so nothing can be considered filler.

That being said, I wish some of the one off episodes were a written a little better. I liked Wyrn though. In my top 10 season 4 episodes fo sho

ToTheNines
09-05-2016, 08:32 PM
How was TigerClaw's subtle?

NinjaPug
09-05-2016, 08:45 PM
And how is saying you have to pee a dick joke?

TigerClaw
09-05-2016, 08:50 PM
How was TigerClaw's subtle?
Getting kicked in the balls and Donnie saying. "Right in the fur patch."

NinjaPug
09-05-2016, 08:52 PM
That is the opposite of subtle

TigerClaw
09-05-2016, 08:57 PM
Brandon Auman posted an instagram regarding Pigeon Pete.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BJ_aqwBgWrI/?hl=en

Where is he? Where is Pigeon Pete?? Theories anyone? Reposted from @irmamcgee Art belongs to @chimyen #tmnt #tmnt2012 #teenagemutantninjaturtles #pigeonpete

https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/sh0.08/e35/p640x640/14156478_562000374001323_1926310046_n.jpg?ig_cache _key=MTMzMjkwMTMwMTcxNzEzNDAyNA%3D%3D.2

ToTheNines
09-05-2016, 09:09 PM
And how is saying you have to pee a dick joke?

Cuz u whiz outta ur dick

Getting kicked in the balls and Donnie saying. "Right in the fur patch."

...

Ninjinister
09-05-2016, 09:18 PM
i can't help it. i gotta make the joke.

you could say he had to drain the lizard.

I appreciated that. Thank you. :lol:

Seconded for truth

I was gonna say something in agreement but then I had a moment of recollection and did a search, and realized that I already did. Twice. So I'mma just quote myself. Twice.

I hate ascribing "filler" on any show that's not a 1:1 adaptation usually. Like for example, most anime are based directly on a manga but throw in multiple episodes that aren't based on stories in the book. But with something like Turtles... nothing is really filler. Just because something doesn't connect to the larger storyline(s) aren't filler. That's be like calling a day in your life where you just went to the mall and ate a giant pretzel filler because it didn't advance your career or education.

Back in the day when I used to be heavily into anime, filler was used exclusively for episodes that were placed in between episodes or story arcs adapted from the book, to allow the manga to catch up to their pace, else they be entirely overtaken. Although it was sometimes used in a derogatory manner, the term was far from it by default.

These days it seems to be used as an exclusively negative term referring to any story of any medium that isn't specifically made to move the plot of the current story arc forward. And you're right, "filler" in that sense is what the TMNT is pretty much built upon. Many of Mirage's most well-known stories, as well as a massive bulk of the '87 show's episodes, would fit this definition.

THGhost
09-05-2016, 09:48 PM
Can we stop this "filler" meme?

Okay. :P

Seriously though. "Meme"? Filler exists in Western Animation, people. Hell, it exists in live-action too.

i can't help it. i gotta make the joke.

you could say he had to drain the lizard.

:lol:

CyberCubed
09-05-2016, 10:16 PM
Applying the word filler to a TMNT cartoon is pointless. Its like you people don't even know what TMNT is supposed to be about. :lol:

TMNT is about ANYTHING. Any adventure, any villain, any action oriented episode. There is no set storyline for TMNT other than Shredder being the main villain.

THGhost
09-05-2016, 10:35 PM
Applying the word filler to a TMNT cartoon is pointless. Its like you people don't even know what TMNT is supposed to be about. :lol:

TMNT is about ANYTHING. Any adventure, any villain, any action oriented episode. There is no set storyline for TMNT other than Shredder being the main villain.

I guess you're right, Cubed. But where was Shredder in this episode again? J/k ;)

Meliwen
09-05-2016, 10:53 PM
This episode was...meh, don't really know how to describe it. It had a lot of good elements so I should have liked this episode. But what dragged it down for me was Raph throwing a tantrum, again, and going out on his own, again. How many times are they going recycle this storyline? The episode was built on a cheap plot device to get everything going. And it really ruined my enjoyment.
Yeah, I like angry Raph, but here his anger just felt really contrived. I just wish the episode gave me a reason to be invested in Raph's anger, because "Raph's been becoming hostile since he feels the others have slacked off, which has been scaring Leo that he's pulling away from the team," as an explanation just makes me feel like I've missed something, especially since he's been pretty mellow the past two seasons.


The scene with Splinter and him reminding the turtles he might not always be around was interesting though.
It does feel like it's buildup to a death. Of the main team, Splinter is really the only one that makes sense if they were to make it permanent.

Ultimately though, I really liked this episode. Poor Donnie needs a break.

victory_angel
09-05-2016, 11:43 PM
Yeah, I like angry Raph, but here his anger just felt really contrived. I just wish the episode gave me a reason to be invested in Raph's anger, because "Raph's been becoming hostile since he feels the others have slacked off, which has been scaring Leo that he's pulling away from the team," as an explanation just makes me feel like I've missed something, especially since he's been pretty mellow the past two seasons.


I think it's more with the situation they are in and the stresses that come with it. The City is in all out gang war between The Foot Clan, Karai and her new and improved Foot Clan, and the rest of the scum of the city. And the Turtles, mutanimals, and the innocent humans of the city are caught in the crossfire.

So Raphael was expressing frustration on how he's being held back by his family and the restrictions that are involved with the more Spiritual side of Ninjitsu. But as people have stated it's hard to take something seriously when we have seen the same problem over and over time and time again. Heck, when Raph was commenting that the kid brothers of the team weren't taking their training seriously and it pans over to Mikey playing with his phone and Donnie drinking from a juice box to prove Raph's point. I feel contextually it was more like they weren't taking Raph seriously.

As Donnie translates:

Wha wha wha
I'm a big baby
Everyone loves Leo
I quit.
Seriously, it's old.


But Splinter's point of Donnie seeing the fire and adding to it was poignant. After all, they all have their frustrations with the war in the city and with each other. Raph has notably been a bully to his younger brothers for years. So Donnie has reason to feel irritated when Raph busts the juice box he's drinking from, but sinking to Raph's level isn't the best course of action.

Darth Knuckles
09-06-2016, 02:12 AM
I really liked this episode a lot. It was a bit more simple of one and it seemed like just a regular troublesome day for the turtles, but I found it refreshing for that very same reason. Only this time it was with Don Vizioso and his mafia gang. Being a mob boss episode reminded me of the good episodes they did like this in the original cartoon too. I liked a more Raph centered episode as well. His anger and him leaving the team reminded me of the Nightwatcher again, which is the second reference to him in three episodes.

Having Mondo join The Mighty Mutanimals is fine by me since I grew up reading the Archie Comics. I enjoyed his humor through out but I feel like he does need to be more of a trained fighter by the next time we see him. Having Pigeon Pete be mysteriously gone made me think at first about (SPOILERS!) how the Mutanimals died in the Archie Comics and that maybe they would kill off Pete since he isn't an essential character. But with Brandon Auman's instagram post, maybe Cudley kidnapped him to go wrestle some where perhaps?

Splinter's speech at the end did seem very emotional and important to not just the series but in real life too which is always a welcomed thing to me in a cartoon. I hope to see more Don Vizioso as well as other gang leaders in the future too.

zipper
09-06-2016, 11:05 AM
I really enjoyed the episode a lot and it reminded me of the first season (BIG plus). Sure, there were things I could criticize, but this is the kind of episode I like.

Out of curiosity though, am I the only one who noticed Leo holding a katana and yet there were two on his back? Don't have the time to read through all the comments, so I'm sorry if that was already brought up.

THGhost
09-06-2016, 11:08 AM
Out of curiosity though, am I the only one who noticed Leo holding a katana and yet there were two on his back? Don't have the time to read through all the comments, so I'm sorry if that was already brought up.

I like when this happens. Not sure if it's meant to be a nod to the 80s cartoon, where it happened all the time, or a genuine oversight on Nick's part.

Meliwen
09-06-2016, 05:37 PM
I think it's more with the situation they are in and the stresses that come with it. The City is in all out gang war between The Foot Clan, Karai and her new and improved Foot Clan, and the rest of the scum of the city. And the Turtles, mutanimals, and the innocent humans of the city are caught in the crossfire.

It does make sense in context for the show, and in that sense it's fine. I think it's nicer though if we can see directly why Raph's so angry, rather than have the show tell us about the things that happened off screen, like Raph being more hostile, Leo feeling like he's pulling away, and the others slacking off or not slacking off. So basically I wish they had showed us and not just told us. It just feels more engaging and meaningful then.

Turtle-X
09-06-2016, 11:32 PM
man, what a stinker. i didn't enjoy this ep at all.

CyberCubed
09-07-2016, 01:34 AM
man, what a stinker. i didn't enjoy this ep at all.

Really? What do you want out of TMNT then? This was a fun episode with human villains for once (not a single mutant villain), and with great action scenes, funny moments for Mondo, and a good Raph centric episode.

This is why we can't have nice things.

ToTheNines
09-07-2016, 04:36 AM
Really? What do you want out of TMNT then? This was a fun episode with human villains for once (not a single mutant villain), and with great action scenes, funny moments for Mondo, and a good Raph centric episode.

This is why we can't have nice things.

You're so annoying. Let the dude have an opinion.

THGhost
09-07-2016, 08:05 AM
Let's hear them out if they want to explain why. What didn't you enjoy about this episode, Turtle-X?

Mona_Lisa
09-07-2016, 02:47 PM
Okay, I know I am a lurker but I HAVE to reply here. I love Raph above all other turtles.
This is my favorite Raph episode yet! Not that he has not had good moments but this episode in my opinion nailed what I love about the guy!
Yes Raph got angry again, but he was stressed that the others wasn't taking their training serious enough. Raph is a protector. He loves and cares for his family!
Yet he is high strung. He got upset for a good reason, allowed anger to take control and it got a bit counter productive.
Donnie on the other had was just putting gas on a fire. I completely agree with splinter.

Why is it Raph can act childish but when Donnie fights fire with fire Splinter reprimands Donnie? I might just be being defensive bc don is my fav :)

And this is at least the second time Splinter brings up Donnie's intelligence (think the other episode was one of the mutagen man one's), which I think is a low blow- he is just a teenager, so just because he is a genius he shouldn't be held to a higher standard...he will make mistakes.....Splinter in turn should have praised him for apologizing to Raph

I get that Donnie is a teenager here, but if Splinter Doesn't correct Don, how will the guy learn? It is a parents job to correct and guide the children.
Did we even see Donnie truly apologize to Raph? He was remorseful after being scolded, but I didn't see him apologize to Raphs face.
Although, I'm not sure he got a proper chance either.
I liked Raphs character here, the only thing wrong with this episode is Donnie was a little mishandled IMO.
Glad Pigeon Pete is gone, I would however like some back story. I hated his character though!

TigerClaw
09-07-2016, 03:33 PM
Okay, I know I am a lurker but I HAVE to reply here. I love Raph above all other turtles.
This is my favorite Raph episode yet! Not that he has not had good moments but this episode in my opinion nailed what I love about the guy!
Yes Raph got angry again, but he was stressed that the others wasn't taking their training serious enough. Raph is a protector. He loves and cares for his family!
Yet he is high strung. He got upset for a good reason, allowed anger to take control and it got a bit counter productive.
Donnie on the other had was just putting gas on a fire. I completely agree with splinter.



I get that Donnie is a teenager here, but if Splinter Doesn't correct Don, how will the guy learn? It is a parents job to correct and guide the children.
Did we even see Donnie truly apologize to Raph? He was remorseful after being scolded, but I didn't see him apologize to Raphs face.
Although, I'm not sure he got a proper chance either.
I liked Raphs character here, the only thing wrong with this episode is Donnie was a little mishandled IMO.
Glad Pigeon Pete is gone, I would however like some back story. I hated his character though!
Raph tends to get angry a lot, but if Mona Lisa were around, he probably be a lot more calmer.

Penst0ck
09-07-2016, 04:47 PM
I can't help but feel Donnie's little comment on Mona Lisa was a spark to a rising tiff between him and Raph. It's just weird coincidence that two episodes in a row Don is the one to push Raph into an outburst and not Leo

and then;

Leo's apology to Raph at the end seemed to be taken full heartedly.

For Don's Raph just kinda gave a "Whatever man."

Meliwen
09-07-2016, 05:05 PM
I get that Donnie is a teenager here, but if Splinter Doesn't correct Don, how will the guy learn? It is a parents job to correct and guide the children.
Did we even see Donnie truly apologize to Raph? He was remorseful after being scolded, but I didn't see him apologize to Raphs face.
Although, I'm not sure he got a proper chance either.
I liked Raphs character here, the only thing wrong with this episode is Donnie was a little mishandled IMO.

Donnie seemed to genuinely want to apologize to Raph before he went out to look for him, and then he finally got to apologize at the end.


Leo's apology to Raph at the end seemed to be taken full heartedly.

For Don's Raph just kinda gave a "Whatever man."
For that reason I think it would've been nice if Donnie had been allowed to apologize first, and then Leo could have come up and Raph could've shrugged it off then. Donnie's apology was more important in this episode, so it's a shame it was brushed aside. Raph saying that it was making him feel weird seemed like he accepted the apology, so personally I don't think he was brushing aside Donnie as much as he was brushing aside the level of sappiness he was feeling.

Unless of course the writers are building up to something. But I have doubts.

MikeandRaph87
09-07-2016, 05:38 PM
I did a little research about Pigeon Pete and it is easy to see the voice actor A.J. Buckley being unavailable at the time it was in development. The time frame this episode was likely developed was when he became a new father. That could be the reason. Sometimes voice actors are replaced and other times left out of episodes when not available. Just an educated guess. They could easily say he wondered off one day and the others did not trust he could take care of himself. Then one day Pete shows up again and that is all there is to it. Buckley is available and it si an easy explanation not too out of character for Pigeon Pete.

Ashwolf
09-07-2016, 06:09 PM
did anyone else get a impression of a good genes story possibly coming up? with how don vizioso wanted to know more about mutant physiology or whatever, i think its likely that he comes up with a serum to destroy mutants from the inside out

MikeandRaph87
09-07-2016, 06:30 PM
did anyone else get a impression of a good genes story possibly coming up? with how don vizioso wanted to know more about mutant physiology or whatever, i think its likely that he comes up with a serum to destroy mutants from the inside out

Which would be the key to Shredder's defeat.

THGhost
09-08-2016, 05:41 PM
I guess Turtle-X didn't feel like sharing why he thought this episode was a stinker. :P

aliena
09-09-2016, 04:55 PM
Really great episode. It felt like the old writers were back together again. Sure, Raph is back with the angry issues, but he's been calm a lot lately. Probably because of being in space and Mona. But why did we never get the story of how he got the chip in his shell yet? I thought it was going to happen, guess not.

I feel that Splinter knows something, it's almost like he has cancer and has yet to sit them down and tell them that he's dying. Either that or he knows he'll have to fight Shredder to the death. Something is definitely up with that.

I'm surprised Pigeon Pete didn't die way sooner. He can't fight or really do anything worthwhile. Poor guy. Maybe he found a mate and they had like a whole nest of babies and now he's tied down to a family. Most single men would see that as a sad way to go. LOL

ToTheNines
09-09-2016, 04:57 PM
I guess Turtle-X didn't feel like sharing why he thought this episode was a stinker. :P

He'll probably never come back because cubed is so annoying.

snake
09-09-2016, 04:58 PM
He'll probably never come back because cubed is so annoying.

Turtle-X is Ciro

ToTheNines
09-09-2016, 05:01 PM
Oh my god... lol'ing too hard.

ssjup81
09-09-2016, 06:54 PM
I never did get around to giving my opinion on this episode, but I really, really liked it. Also, imo, Raph's anger felt 100% justified, but then again, I'm one of the ones who never had a problem with Raph getting angry and storming off since it's not overly done (imo).

There's a lot of crap going on in the city at the moment and Raph, being the impatient one, seems to want to be prepared for anything that may come their way. In a way, he's reminding me of a student who does all of his work, while his classmates are still working on it, while he wants to move on to the next thing to gain more knowledge, only replace knowledge, with fighting style. So yeah, to an extent, I really got where Raph was coming from. I wonder if Raph is going to get pushed to the point of going all vigilante like in the 2007 movie.

The part where Raph said that they weren't taking their training seriously, and they panned over to Mikey and Donnie...I just laughed. I've always liked gags like that. Ironic humor.

Anyway, Raph takes training seriously. Even during the North Hampton arc, it was obvious that Raph was the one in charge of training while Leo was out and he was even doing so after Leo was up and about. During that time, I also noticed that being out in the country, he was much calmer. Seems the countryside and Mona Lisa keep him calm and levelheaded.

Oh and adding on...I do feel something is definitely going to happen regarding Donnie. It's just...weird and for the past couple of eps, he's been the one to annoy or bother Raph. That can't be a coincidence. Donnie was also out of commission for a while. I dunno...just feels like something is going to happen... Oh well.

Okay, back to this episode. I loved the fighting between Raph and Leo while they were sparring. Nice wrestling moves. Actually, it was reminding me of a match...but I just couldn't put my finger on where I'd seen it before. Maybe Brock Lesnar or something...who knows.

The Mutanimals, as always, were a treat to see, but the "We don't talk about Pigeon Pete" thing had me going, "Um...what?" Wouldn't it be hilarious, in an ironic sense, if Pigeon Pete became like a crime lord or something? Okay, no that won't happen, but man. lol I figured he wasn't there because his voice actor wasn't around or either they already reached their budget since they were using so many characters already. Oh and speaking of the Mutanimals, at least I care about them in this version. In the Archie comics, they were just...boring, imo. With the exception of Slash, when the others were killed out, I wasn't overly emotional or as upset as I probably should've been. Yeah it was sad, but their characters just weren't interesting to me there.

The fight scenes in this episode were great and, I'm pretty sure quite a few of those henchmen were killed off. I mean, Dr. Monkey (yeah, I call him this lol), threw those guys from off of the roof of the apartment building or hotel or whatever. Unless they were androids or robots, I doubt they survived that. This just felt like a real, aggressive battle between the Turtles and Mutanimals vs Visioso's gang and I'm glad we have a human antagonist now too. This feels like it just may lead us to something given what was mentioned this episode...hopefully.

So yeah, fun episode for me, liked Visioso's gang, liked the Sylvester Stallone wannabe dude....so yeah. lol

Sucks we're going into a hiatus yet again. -_-

Turtle-X
09-10-2016, 04:36 AM
I guess Turtle-X didn't feel like sharing why he thought this episode was a stinker.

sorry, i don't check the forum all that often.

Let's hear them out if they want to explain why. What didn't you enjoy about this episode, Turtle-X?

it just felt like an excuse to do a bunch Godfather tropes that we've seen hundreds of times in other media. i like the Mutanimals but i felt they were underused in this episode.

miru
09-10-2016, 09:46 PM
Really great episode. It felt like the old writers were back together again. Sure, Raph is back with the angry issues, but he's been calm a lot lately. Probably because of being in space and Mona. But why did we never get the story of how he got the chip in his shell yet? I thought it was going to happen, guess not.

I feel that Splinter knows something, it's almost like he has cancer and has yet to sit them down and tell them that he's dying. Either that or he knows he'll have to fight Shredder to the death. Something is definitely up with that.

I'm surprised Pigeon Pete didn't die way sooner. He can't fight or really do anything worthwhile. Poor guy. Maybe he found a mate and they had like a whole nest of babies and now he's tied down to a family. Most single men would see that as a sad way to go. LOL

I agree with all this.

This episode did have that Mirage feeling to me. I liked Visioso's flying Egg-O-Matic. Time to crib from your rival who cribbed from you. It's not like he's doing well...

Also, this must be the start of the humans vs mutants storyline.

Mini-Turtle
09-10-2016, 11:33 PM
I never did get around to giving my opinion on this episode, but I really, really liked it. Also, imo, Raph's anger felt 100% justified, but then again, I'm one of the ones who never had a problem with Raph getting angry and storming off since it's not overly done (imo).

There's a lot of crap going on in the city at the moment and Raph, being the impatient one, seems to want to be prepared for anything that may come their way. In a way, he's reminding me of a student who does all of his work, while his classmates are still working on it, while he wants to move on to the next thing to gain more knowledge, only replace knowledge, with fighting style. So yeah, to an extent, I really got where Raph was coming from. I wonder if Raph is going to get pushed to the point of going all vigilante like in the 2007 movie.

The part where Raph said that they weren't taking their training seriously, and they panned over to Mikey and Donnie...I just laughed. I've always liked gags like that. Ironic humor.

Anyway, Raph takes training seriously. Even during the North Hampton arc, it was obvious that Raph was the one in charge of training while Leo was out and he was even doing so after Leo was up and about. During that time, I also noticed that being out in the country, he was much calmer. Seems the countryside and Mona Lisa keep him calm and levelheaded.

Oh and adding on...I do feel something is definitely going to happen regarding Donnie. It's just...weird and for the past couple of eps, he's been the one to annoy or bother Raph. That can't be a coincidence. Donnie was also out of commission for a while. I dunno...just feels like something is going to happen... Oh well.

Okay, back to this episode. I loved the fighting between Raph and Leo while they were sparring. Nice wrestling moves. Actually, it was reminding me of a match...but I just couldn't put my finger on where I'd seen it before. Maybe Brock Lesnar or something...who knows.

The Mutanimals, as always, were a treat to see, but the "We don't talk about Pigeon Pete" thing had me going, "Um...what?" Wouldn't it be hilarious, in an ironic sense, if Pigeon Pete became like a crime lord or something? Okay, no that won't happen, but man. lol I figured he wasn't there because his voice actor wasn't around or either they already reached their budget since they were using so many characters already. Oh and speaking of the Mutanimals, at least I care about them in this version. In the Archie comics, they were just...boring, imo. With the exception of Slash, when the others were killed out, I wasn't overly emotional or as upset as I probably should've been. Yeah it was sad, but their characters just weren't interesting to me there.

The fight scenes in this episode were great and, I'm pretty sure quite a few of those henchmen were killed off. I mean, Dr. Monkey (yeah, I call him this lol), threw those guys from off of the roof of the apartment building or hotel or whatever. Unless they were androids or robots, I doubt they survived that. This just felt like a real, aggressive battle between the Turtles and Mutanimals vs Visioso's gang and I'm glad we have a human antagonist now too. This feels like it just may lead us to something given what was mentioned this episode...hopefully.

So yeah, fun episode for me, liked Visioso's gang, liked the Sylvester Stallone wannabe dude....so yeah. lol

Sucks we're going into a hiatus yet again. -_-
Assuming Vizioso remains human. Wouldn't be at all surprised if his malfunctioning chair lands him in a vat of Mutagen and he becomes Titanus or The Globfather.

Nasubionna
09-11-2016, 02:56 PM
I enjoyed this one pretty well. Personally like the turtles best when they’re fighting basically regular baddies in the city, and growing and developing and struggling in their interpersonal relationships with one another. Always nice to see the Mutanimals back (and I can’t say I’m too sorry to see Pigeon Pete go…. sorry, Pete), the fight scenes were great, the Sylvester Stallone send-up was funny, and I loved Splinter imparting valuable wisdom to the turts, and to the audience. Mondo Gecko was less annoying to me this time out, and I actually felt really bad for the little dude when he had to pee while he was a hostage, LOL!
All in all, great episode, I really liked it. More like this, please!

Splinter the boss
09-14-2016, 06:53 PM
What is it with Raph, seriously? Acting like this even after vision quest.
I don't know what happened to Pete but the way Leatherhead and Slash reacted was funny.
Don Vizioso's bizarre, who holds a giant sausage in battle, how do his subordinates hold him in high regard?

Jephael
09-15-2016, 05:04 PM
What is it with Raph, seriously? Acting like this even after vision quest.

Maybe he's bipolar or something. I've worked with guys like that recently... one minute they've got their heads on straight, the next they flip out.

Sabacooza
09-15-2016, 05:13 PM
A lack of real direction and consistency with all parties involved will do that to a show and said characters.

Splinter the boss
09-16-2016, 02:17 PM
Maybe he's bipolar or something. I've worked with guys like that recently... one minute they've got their heads on straight, the next they flip out.
:lol::lol::lol: I just laughed at this so hard.

Jephael
09-16-2016, 10:29 PM
Hey I meant to mention this earlier. Did anybody notice in that short montage of Don Vizioso's anti-mutant empire that Napoleon Bonafrog was hanging alongside the TMNT? That was kinda random, especially considering we haven't really seen him since his premiere appearance over a season ago.

BubblyShell22
09-17-2016, 09:22 AM
No, I didn't notice that, but if I catch the ep again, I will definitely check it out and see if I can spot him.