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View Full Version : Do you think there will ever be a new cartoon that bombs or gets canceled quick?


CyberCubed
02-20-2017, 06:13 PM
As we all know, TMNT cartoons are highly successful. The original cartoon lasted 10 seasons and 193 episodes, the 2k3 series lasted 7 seasons and 156 episodes and a movie, and the Nick cartoon has lasted 5 seasons and 124 episodes and has some spinoff material like Half-Shell heroes.

But do you think we'll ever get a new TMNT cartoon that bombs? Something similar to Next Mutation in cartoon form...only lasts about 26 episodes or so before its canceled? DC and Marvel cartoons have a lot of quickly canceled shows that the networks killed early because of low ratings or toy sales, what if that happened to TMNT?

So far it's tradition for every TMNT cartoon to make over 100 episodes. Do you think that will ever change?

oldmanwinters
02-20-2017, 07:17 PM
I didn't think the 4Kids toon would last beyond the first season. I was pleasantly surprised.

Depends on how Nick wants to treat the franchise. Would they be all into a specific incarnation of a TV show or would they simply look at the property as something that can be rebooted frequently? Today's DC and Marvel animation properties are much quicker to reboot than they used to be back in the 90s. I can't even keep track of how many Batman cartoons have been on the air since The Batman.

Powder
02-20-2017, 10:28 PM
I dunno, but I'd be fine if we did get another short run series like TNM. It's always fun to have new iterations, even if they don't last very long.

CyberCubed
02-20-2017, 10:33 PM
Come to think of it even the TMNT comics go on forever. Mirage comics went on for 25+ years, and could theoretically still go on if PL ever goes back to them. Archie TMNT went on from 1988-1996...nearly a decade. IDW TMNT has already been going on 6 years and will likely go on for a decade or more.

Even the 3 mainline TMNT comic continuities go on for hundreds of issues and years. Archie TMNT has 100+ issues once you count all the specials and mini's along with the main ongoing, same for IDW TMNT.

Andrew NDB
02-20-2017, 11:13 PM
If they have no long-reaching ideas to grow the franchise into ways that can grow with its audience while still keeping things afloat at various age ranges, ala what made the first go-'round a far-reaching success... it's doomed to collect a cyclical pittance every 5-6 years off the latest crop of poor sap kids.

Sisyphus. Forever pushing up that boulder, and it falling back down. Pushing it back up again.

That's what I see. With increasingly diminishing returns (like the Star Trek: TNG episode with the clones that keep cloning themselves for generations until their whole race is basically literally breaking apart on a cellular level).

plastroncafe
02-20-2017, 11:19 PM
Wasn't it Sisyphus with the boulder?

Tantalus was the thirsty guy who stood in water he couldn't drink.
Kind of like TMNT fans who are surrounded by the 80s version, but thirst for something more.

Andrew NDB
02-20-2017, 11:21 PM
Wasn't it Sisyphus with the boulder?

Tantalus was the thirsty guy who stood in water he couldn't drink.
Kind of like TMNT fans who are surrounded by the 80s version, but thirst for something more.

Correct. Ur.

oldmanwinters
02-21-2017, 11:50 AM
That reminds me...
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a56/slimer2erasmus/Sisyphus_zpsiunieihx.gif (http://s9.photobucket.com/user/slimer2erasmus/media/Sisyphus_zpsiunieihx.gif.html)

neatoman
02-21-2017, 12:11 PM
Well if we replace "cartoon" with "TV show", we already got a bomb 20 years ago.

Andrew NDB
02-21-2017, 12:26 PM
Well if we replace "cartoon" with "TV show", we already got a bomb 20 years ago.

Not really. The ratings were solid, but it wasn't the giant phenomenon they were hoping it'd be. Since Saban didn't own TMNT they didn't like investing too much into it.

CyberCubed
02-21-2017, 12:34 PM
It probably didn't help matters the show came out in 1997, right after the original cartoon finally ended in the previous year and when the TMNT fad was completely dead.

Power Rangers was already killing TMNT back in 1993-1995. Even if Next Mutation continued, Pokemon would have absolutely destroyed it in 1998. Then came the anime craze in the U.S. and Dragonball Z and other anime became incredible popular, so american shows were put on the backburner for a while.

neatoman
02-21-2017, 01:31 PM
Not really. The ratings were solid, but it wasn't the giant phenomenon they were hoping it'd be. Since Saban didn't own TMNT they didn't like investing too much into it.

But it was still cancelled quickly, which is part of the question asked in the thread title. Regardless, it doesn't surprise me that Saban thought it was too expensive.

Who would have guessed writing all new stories, hiring stuntmen, special effects, making costumes and props would be more expensive than just clumsily chop out the action scenes from Zyuranger and fill the gaps with a juice bar?

pferreira
02-23-2017, 09:25 AM
But do you think we'll ever get a new TMNT cartoon that bombs? Something similar to Next Mutation in cartoon form...only lasts about 26 episodes or so before its canceled?

But it was still cancelled quickly, which is part of the question asked in the thread title. Regardless, it doesn't surprise me that Saban thought it was too expensive.Haven't you guys read the Turtles Visual History book that was released back in 2014? The reason Next Mutation was cancelled wasn't because of ratings. It was the highest rated show on the channel at the time outdoing Big Bad Beetleborgs and Power Rangers. According to Kevin Eastman Haim Saban wanted to get a bigger slice of the percentage from the second season and Eastman said no so Eastman cancelled the show after just that one season. That was the reason.

neatoman
02-23-2017, 10:40 AM
Haven't you guys read the Turtles Visual History book that was released back in 2014? The reason Next Mutation was cancelled wasn't because of ratings. It was the highest rated show on the channel at the time outdoing Big Bad Beetleborgs and Power Rangers. According to Kevin Eastman Haim Saban wanted to get a bigger slice of the percentage from the second season and Eastman said no so Eastman cancelled the show after just that one season. That was the reason.

But we were just talking about how it was cancelled after one season, we didn't really mention the ratings, just that the show wasn't seen as a worthwhile investment for Saban.

pferreira
03-02-2017, 10:28 AM
But we were just talking about how it was cancelled after one season, we didn't really mention the ratings, just that the show wasn't seen as a worthwhile investment for Saban.Oh right sorry. Just stating Saban wanted a bigger piece of the pie as they say when the show was successful but Eastman didn't allow it which is why he then took the show away from Saban.

turtlefanforever
03-02-2017, 03:44 PM
I could see it happening 2 series from now.

There seems to be a cycle with TMNT cartoons going from Good to bad/generally hated.

TMNT original series: Good
The Next Mutation: Generally hated
2k3 TMNT: Good
2012 TMNT: Bad, generally hated.

So the next series should be good following that trend but after that will be the failure.

snake
03-02-2017, 03:47 PM
2012 TMNT: Bad, generally hated.


[citation needed]

CyberCubed
03-02-2017, 04:53 PM
He's been trolling this forum for years about the Nick show, ignore him. Even if he personally doesn't like the show, he can't possibly be stupid enough to think the show is "generally hated" when it's fairly well liked and received on this and other forums as well as by kids.

Original TMNT Cartoon Fan
03-02-2017, 05:38 PM
I didn't think the 4Kids toon would last beyond the first season. I was pleasantly surprised.

I guess it was those who were fans of the 19871996 series who were now in their early-20's when the 20032009 series came. They experienced large childhood nostalgia at the time.

turtlefanforever
03-02-2017, 06:52 PM
He's been trolling this forum for years about the Nick show, ignore him. Even if he personally doesn't like the show, he can't possibly be stupid enough to think the show is "generally hated" when it's fairly well liked and received on this and other forums as well as by kids.

Just because someone has a different opinion than you doesnt make them a troll. Everybody i've met in real life and my experiences on forums is that the show is generally hated. Deal with it. Not like it's getting monster numbers right now so it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

snake
03-02-2017, 06:54 PM
Just because someone has a different opinion than you doesnt make them a troll. Everybody i've met in real life and my experiences on forums is that the show is generally hated. Deal with it. Not like it's getting monster numbers right now so it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

It's well liked by most folks here as well as the kids who made it financially successful enough to keep it afloat for 5 seasons, which is a lot for an action show these days.

Most "fans" you encounter IRL couldn't tell Donatello from Raphael.

CyberCubed
03-02-2017, 06:59 PM
Everybody i've met in real life and my experiences on forums is that the show is generally hated. Deal with it. Not like it's getting monster numbers right now so it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

The show has flat out been popular on all major online forums, or social media sites like tumblr where people watch the show. You can't possibly believe the show is "generally hated" do you even know what that means?

It's been a successful show to last over 5 seasons and 124 episodes when most cartoons barely make it to episode 52-65 before being canceled.

Cyndaquilfan123
03-02-2017, 08:15 PM
Just because someone has a different opinion than you doesnt make them a troll. Everybody i've met in real life and my experiences on forums is that the show is generally hated. Deal with it. Not like it's getting monster numbers right now so it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

Oh, sure..... Everyone you know in real life accounts for the entire population who has seen this show.

ToTheNines
03-02-2017, 08:17 PM
Just because someone has a different opinion than you doesnt make them a troll. Everybody i've met in real life and my experiences on forums is that the show is generally hated. Deal with it. Not like it's getting monster numbers right now so it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

You are so full of sh*t.

Ninjinister
03-02-2017, 08:52 PM
Just because someone has a different opinion than you doesnt make them a troll.

Correct. And you are clearly either the latter. This wasn't you delivering an opinion... you were pretending to state a fact. Plus you won't shut up about how you feel about the show, even in situations where it's not the topic of discussion.

it can't be that "well liked" or it wouldnt be ending.

Dude, everything ends except The Simpsons.

oldmanwinters
03-02-2017, 09:21 PM
Dude, everything ends except The Simpsons.

And Spongebob.

DisKosh
03-02-2017, 09:41 PM
The thing about the story idea is that it has vast amounts of potential. It can be sci-fi, fantasy, drama, urban crime fighting/solving, romance, horror, there is so much they could do.

What holds it back?
They usually return to the similar territory even when they adapt elements from the comics, we usually see the same elements adapted over and over again.
For instance, one of my colleagues said the show can't go on if they kill Shredder but when you look at the comics he's barely in them. In fact, the 'real' Shredder (aka Oroku Saki) dies in #1.

There are great characters who never make it into any adaptation e.g. Shadow, Professor Obligado, Radical etc.

If they want it to be a family show, why not make the turtles young adults i.e. late 20's and make Shadow around 8 or 9? I know there's a lot of flack surrounding kid characters but if the writers give them a rounded personality with interesting quirks and flaws it could work and it would be different.

They don't need to start every series with the origin story. You don't need to know where they came from to understand the story and it could be revealed through flashback.

In summary: if Nick wants to hire me, just contact me on here. :trazz:

CyberCubed
03-02-2017, 10:59 PM
Dude, everything ends except The Simpsons.

Yeah, it amazes me how delusional this guy is. Tell him to look at how short lived so many DC and Marvel cartoons are. Or any other various cartoons in general.

I'd love to know what world we live in where a show makes over 100+ episodes can be considered a failure in any stretch of the imagination.

pferreira
03-09-2017, 12:10 PM
It's been a successful show to last over 5 seasons and 124 episodes when most cartoons barely make it to episode 52-65 before being canceled.So could you clarify is the 2012 series ending due to dropping ratings or because they want to end the series?

CyberCubed
03-09-2017, 12:32 PM
So could you clarify is the 2012 series ending due to dropping ratings or because they want to end the series?

They had a 5 season goal from the start. Now that they reached it the likely want to try something different. Ratings decline of course but that's the same for any show in existence. Every TMNT cartoon got consistently lower ratings with each passing season.

neatoman
03-09-2017, 12:32 PM
So could you clarify is the 2012 series ending due to dropping ratings or because they want to end the series?

There's a reboot set to air right after it ends, so it might not really be either. More like it's ending to make way for another show to revitalise interest in the general brand, Nickelodeon seems to think TMNT is worth having around but the show is not.

Think of it as this, the franchise is a patient and a new show is like a flu shot. Make a new show and the franchise stays healthy, but you gotta do it again in a few years.

pferreira
03-16-2017, 10:56 AM
Ok thanks for that info guys, I agree I'm starting to come to the conclusion it was both planned to end and scheduled for a new series to take it's place. :)