[WebLurker]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

It's not gone well. A lot of them have made ageist comments towards Dan Jurgens (writer of Lois and Clark as well as Action Comics), and some have said pretty unsavoury things about the concept of the superkid Jon. It's even spilled over into hatred for the new Superwoman title because DC bait and switched the audience with promises of a N52 Lois-led book only to kill her off and replace her with Lana in the debut issue.

Weird. For some reason, I kind of thought that the original Lois and Clark miniseries was well-received. I wouldn't blame anyone for being annoyed by the Superwoman surprise, though. I wonder if DC should've been upfront that Lana was going to be the star?

Course, with both N52 Superman and Lois Lane buying the farm (probably just to allow the older versions of the characters to replace them), I can understand that N52 Superman fans may be seeing DC Rebirth the way we see OMD.

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

These people are pretty much a minority group though, given not many people cared about N52 Superman to begin with.

Kind of interesting that comic book companies like to do major overhauls and reinventions, given that the readers who buy the stuff rarely seem to like them.

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

The Superman books have been outselling the Spider-Man books by a considerable margin, always making the top ten.

For reference, are we talking about the flagship Superman series or the franchise in general, and from how far back are we going back to track better sales?

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

I reckon they could just make Parker Industries it's own alternate world and still go with RYV being the main one.

When you say "RYV being the main one," are you suggesting that the RYV Parkers get ported over to 616, like DC is doing with Superman, or something else, like the RYV series just becomes the flagship Spidey comic, even if it stays in the RYV universe?

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Alternate Spider-Man books always sell big. Spider-Girl was an alternate book (though it had more legit claim as a natural continuation than anything in 616 does presently) and went twelve years...and Peter was barely Spider-Man in that!

They do sell better? For some reason, I was under the impression that Spider-Girl's (and Ultimate Spider-Man's) success and long runs were exceptions, and that they usually didn't do as well as the main titles.

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

I just remembered ASM wasn't even in the top twenty in August, so yeah, there's that also.

Is that normal lately, or is that kind of a sudden jump?

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

I actually think the decision to put RYV forward has everything to do with how badly Slott's run is doing, not just because the original series was a success (and keep in mind, back when the first RYV series came out, it was pretty much the main Spider-Man book while the 616 volume took a summer break before relaunching).

Maybe. It will be interesting to see if RYV can hold its own when it's not the only game in town. If it hopefully sells well, I'd really like to hear what the OMD defenders have to say, given that good vs. poor sales is a favored argument of theirs.)

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Marvel do not disclose digital sales either, but I've heard some rumblings about that too. ASM is in trouble, and a "stealth pilot" like RYV is required to see if the audience for the marriage can probably save it down the line.

Since Marvel has been so resistant to the idea of a married Spider-Man and jumped through so many hoops to be rid of it, wouldn't they be more likely to try and find a solution that fits within the single Spider-Man setting?

Originally Posted by MsMarvelDuckie

Considering how many readers jumped ship after it was axed Id say it's a good bet. I was right in the middle of the whole fiasco, and trust me, it WASN'T pretty. Those of us who were Modding those forums were overwhelmed by the massive amount of posts that got extremely vitriolic. If you guys think THIS place gets bad, you should have seen the height of the OMD rebellion. It was nasty. Fans went so far as to threaten hunting down Quesada (I really don't blame them) burn copies of the comic, riot, march on Marvel, etc.... I can't even remember how many forum members either left orvwere banned, butvit was in the dozens on both counts. There was so much anger at the time that when the boards crashed for several days shortly after the BND reboot, many members simply never came back once they were back up. I still had Mod status about two years later even after having barely posted for over a year (they changed the format and that killed the forums entirely) but it hardly mattered because they were nearly dead by that point. OMD did FAR more damage to Marvel than just one book. It killed a lot of the trust people had in the company, and few of tbe later decisions from the editorial staff helped matters.

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

I was in the trenches also. Dan Slott and Steven Wacker ended up joining the CrawlSpace forums for a while when BND started to take questions and hype up the project, only to be met with a slew of angry fans who wouldn't stop needling them about OMD. Neither took it well at all and Slott slowly transformed into the public relations nightmare he continues to be on forums today.

Slott requested his membership on the forum be terminated (which it was), and he remained a fixture on CBR's threads, where he, I and others who agreed with me exchanged "pleasantries" from time to time.

Wacker hung around the crawl space and actually started TROLLING people, he would up causing so much trouble for himself that the Crawl Space mods actually banned him. It was embarrassing.

I only learned about OMD after the fact, so I kind of missed out of the initial backlash. I still don't really understand the point of the reboot (but, to be fair, I was introduced to Spider-Man in the early 2000s through the movies, so, from my perspective, Peter and MJ being a couple -- married or otherwise -- is hardwired into the mythos and unmovable as the origin story itself and was/is one of the better elements of the franchise).

I find it really ironic that the most popular Spider-Man iterations seem to be the ones that actually focus on that relationship. RYV 1 got praise from everyone, including a lot of post-OMD fans. Ultimate Spider-Man (which granted, could only show Peter and MJ as high school sweethearts, albeit showing that they were going to be partners for the rest of their lives, confirmed in their final scene), was a hit throughout its entire run. Spider-Man Loves Mary Jane and Spider-Girl were critical successes. The marriage/relationship doesn't really seem to be the hobble we've been told it was.

I don't think Slott is the best writer for the franchise and tends to cyberbully people, but I do think that some fans cross the line when interacting with him and treat him in ways no one deserves. At worst, Slott's a mediocre Spider-Man writer in a dark era for the comic who's immature online.