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Old 10-04-2017, 12:54 AM   #1
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Leo and the Mutagen

I know that the whole "mutagen turning the turtles into humans" subplot was awful but how did you feel about Leo preventing Don from telling their brothers about the whole thing?

On one hand, I understand that Leo was trying his hardest to "keep the team unified" as Splinter hoped he will but on the other hand, I can't help but feel that it was wrong to not have faith or trust in his brothers. I feel that Raph was less hurt about not being able to turn into someone people won't fear of and more so that his brother would hide something from him. It's very conflicting and one of the reasons I felt it was handled piss-poorly. I just really disliked how they handled Leo in this film.

Last edited by LeotheLateBloomer; 10-04-2017 at 01:42 AM.
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:15 AM   #2
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Maybe he had a line of dialogue that contradicts this (my memory of this movie is probably a bit spotty) but I'd just assumed he meant hold off until later. You know, sort out the Krang/Shredder stuff first, then deal with it. It was a lot to think about, heavy/distracting questions that'd fog their heads on the battlefield & at home.
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:27 AM   #3
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Leo was very adamant that they didn't need to turn into humans, cause they're turtles and that's what they are. It felt like someone saw the X-Men movies and tried to emulate the Rogue and Storm dialogue about the Mutant Cure, and it just fell flat on its face just like the "Mikey being sad about being called a monster" scene.

Leo's a dick for wanting to keep it a secret, though. But Raph is a even bigger dick as he shatters the purple ooze canister before Mikey gets a say in the matter, the Turtle who wanted it the most. Raph was just pissy for Leo holding back information.
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Old 10-04-2017, 12:38 PM   #4
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Imo... just gut reaction in the face of more important things going on, as well as his own fears.

He was already unhappy with their performance as a team, already bummed out and taken a bit of a hit to the confidence and his fears of failure since Shredder got away from them...and then rat dad is telling him that as long as you keep everyone together you'll always succeed.

Now enter Donnie all excited like, "Hey Leo! Here's a thing that can threaten to tear the family apart! Which of course to you sounds like failure and a danger to the family. Isn't that great??"

Broken family, failure to keep the family together as dad is depending on him to do, and due to difference of opinion, it, if his brothers did go and become human, makes him helpless in being able to be the good big brother who feels it is his duty to watch over them and ensure they're safety in a world they've been conditioned to see as a big dangerous place for them to be out in... (They're still young, after all.)

SHOULD everyone have the right to at least talk about it, daydream the "what-ifs," even if not seriously discussed? Sure. Even Leo never even got to express, later on, his own reservations and rejection of it. (It's not like the other three shouldn't have to hear him out as well.) But this wasn't a thing that needed to be taken advantage of right then and there, it probably could have waited, rather than Mikey and Raph act rashly on it and decide it's more important right now than everything else going on.

And then when they should have finally been able to take a breather and relax after the world is saved, instead of just talking about it... it's still treated as a "now or never" thing and Raph just ups and throws it, hypocritically being the one who actually ends all possibly.

Leo is wrong for not wanting to allow at least just casual discussion of it. Should have told them there are more important matters and save it for later. Valid reasons to stall and didn't use it. (And letting it be discussed doesn't mean it has to happen, buddy, nor that anyone has to agree.)

Donnie is wrong for not studying this stuff a LOT more, being a bit rash in assuming what it can do and foolishly coming into contact with it...and not taking Leo's likely perspective into consideration before just expecting him to be equally as exited about it, leading himself to disappointment when the excitement wasn't shared. (Felt bad for the guy, but come on...)

Mikey... typical younger sibling, wrong for spying and the inability to keep secrets. (Should have spoken to Leo and Donnie after overhearing, not sneaking around and getting a fight started.) Not to mention getting overblown ideas when they shouldn't have even been so certain about the stuff yet. He also is far too easily led by what Raph decides to do about it and shares the guilt.

Raph... way WAY too rash. Instead of pressing the issue later and insisting on discussion, possibly by using dad to force the floor open on that matter, he selfishly decides that it's a thing that needs to be focused on RIGHT NOW, screw more important matters, and risk putting Mikey's own well being into unnecessary risk because he wants to break into a police unite right this minute and causes all brothers to be outed to the police; not to mention get friends in big trouble. Then making the decision for the group in a worse way than Leo by breaking the damn thing... Never asking about Leo's reservations, never letting Mikey finally get to talk about it... And whatever further opinion Donnie would have (though he'd possibly, if reluctantly, trust Leo's perspective) Well done, Raph.

That said though, I'm still proud of Leo for wanting to stay true to himself, not wanting to, as he might see it, "cheat" in life and still play the cards he was dealt the best he can. (Besides... if the others all ran off and did it, even if he was tempted it's hard to see him wanting to abandon Master Splinter.)

Last edited by IndigoErth; 10-04-2017 at 12:47 PM.
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