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Old 10-16-2018, 06:23 PM   #41
Andrew NDB
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How long did you watch wrestling for? Most people who grew up watching the Attitude Era/Monday Night Wars called it quits when Rock and Austin left
From like 1998 to 2003ish? Maybe 2004? It wasn't long after Wrestlemania XIX, which I attended in Seattle. Hell of a card. Austin-Rock III, HHH-Booker T, Hulk Hogan-McMahon, Lesner-Angle. Badass.

Then, just like that, all of a sudden... Stone Cold is gone (that was his last match that I watched!), The Rock is gone, Angle is gone, Lesner is gone, and it was just no longer worth watching at all.

I tried to keep up a little bit longer but it was just too goofy and I found that I was just watching out of loyalty, seeing how the existing wrestlers would evolve. But I realized that loyalty wasn't really being rewarded with anything, so that was that.

Every once in a while I'll watch a "big event." Like whenever the Rock comes back.
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Old 10-16-2018, 06:28 PM   #42
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From like 1998 to 2003ish? Maybe 2004? It wasn't long after Wrestlemania XIX, which I attended in Seattle. Hell of a card. Austin-Rock III, HHH-Booker T, Hulk Hogan-McMahon, Lesner-Angle. Badass.

Then, just like that, all of a sudden... Stone Cold is gone (that was his last match that I watched!), The Rock is gone, Angle is gone, Lesner is gone, and it was just no longer worth watching at all.

I tried to keep up a little bit longer but it was just too goofy and I found that I was just watching out of loyalty, seeing how the existing wrestlers would evolve. But I realized that loyalty wasn't really being rewarded with anything, so that was that.

Every once in a while I'll watch a "big event." Like whenever the Rock comes back.
That WM was good but drew a pretty lousy buyrate. I dunno why.

Angle only left in 2006 to TNA. He left for a few months in 2003 after 19 I think. Lesnar left in 2004.

That happens t most wrestling fans. they get burned out and their favourites start leaving or retiring. I got burnt out of WWE in 2008 and took a sabbatical form it until I came back in 2010. Then I quit watching ti again in 2011-2012 and only been checking in once in a while.
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Old 10-16-2018, 06:43 PM   #43
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Sells like a sniper victim though
THIS IS THE SH*T, MAN!!!

Jesus, he's terrible. Like, as a wrestler, just the goddamn dirt worst. Once it turned 1998, and it became obvious he actually wasn't going to get any better and was just gonna skate by on his promos - which aren't even funny - I gave up. Meanwhile, said promos were all predicated on calling people gay, "tranny", "hermaphrodite", etc. etc., which again, not only isn't funny, but it's "cheap heat". Sh*t, I can get on the mic and call you a f****t, and of course people will react. That's not a skill, anyone can do it. Everyone else was told, "No, you can't; only Dwayne gets to call people f*****s, because he's charming."

Then there's how he washed out of college football, and only got a spot in wrestling because his Daddy had some dirt on Vince. Nepotism's always fun. And then, there's the time when he was playing college ball and he choked out a female sideline reporter for asking a question he didn't like. They kind of swept that story under the rug, but again, for those who missed it: He once legit choked a woman for "getting smart" with him after he lost a sportsball game. Fantastic role model. "Charming".

I understand why people who don't have anything to do with wrestling like him - if you like sh*t movies - but if you DO know wrestling, it's fairly easy to recognize how awful he is at it. Well, it helps to be trained, or you may not see certain things. I work with a lot of guys who kinda like him in general, but the consensus amongst "experts" is that his actual ring work was the drizzling sh*ts. Moves too fast, throws sissy-slap "punches", flops around like a goddamn fish, doesn't leave any room for crowd reactions, terrible ring positioning, and has the WORST finish in history. He's f*cking AWFUL. Luckily, he has perfect teeth and that really goes a long way. Plus, y'know... the roids. That helps. I do understand, if you never trained, you might not "see" some of it. But he's like the WORST guy to ever get so famous off of his pathetic, abysmal ring work.

Whenever anyone who sucks at everything they do "fails upwards", it's annoying. When you fail upwards SO FAR that you could literally execute a busload of orphans and people would still love you, it's infuriating. I mean, in a reasonable society, people would at the least call him out on that stuff like, y'know, choking a woman or getting himself famous SOLELY by calling people "gay", "tranny", and "hermaphrodite", but... well, we all know Outrage is selective, and that if we've already committed to liking someone, we really don't care if they're sh*tty.

It just bugs me that we're all so BLATANT about it.

Anyway, F*ck that guy. Can't stand him, never could, never will.
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Old 10-16-2018, 06:53 PM   #44
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The best Rock was Corporate Rock, imo. Then around 2001-2002 he began talking too fast and with no flow.

Yes, a lot of his material was lousy, but he had good delivery, unlike Cena.

Thing is, for a guy who made fun of people on the mic he sure lost a lot. I dunno how that didn't hurt him more. If you're gonna call people a worthless piece of monkey poo, a hermaphrodite, etc. you better beat them.

The Rock was kinda hated by the IWC back then. Lucky for him, the IWC wasn't that big at the time.

He has some cool catchphrases, though. As repetitive as they are.

He improved a bit on the mic around 2003 or so when he was about to leave. Building the third act between him and Austin.
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Old 10-16-2018, 08:37 PM   #45
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You know I just realized how that I have never seen Andrew make a thread about Right wing outrage, I don't know if he was living under a rock when conservatives were burning their shoes in protest for Colin Kaepernick being the face of Nike.
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Old 10-16-2018, 08:43 PM   #46
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You know I just realized how that I have never seen Andrew make a thread about Right wing outrage, I don't know if he was living under a rock when conservatives were burning their shoes in protest for Colin Kaepernick being the face of Nike.
I'm pretty sure there was a thread about that and he commented on it. I can't remember if he was the author of the thread, though.
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Old 10-16-2018, 10:08 PM   #47
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Thing is, for a guy who made fun of people on the mic he sure lost a lot. I dunno how that didn't hurt him more. If you're gonna call people a worthless piece of monkey poo, a hermaphrodite, etc. you better beat them.
That's really the thing. Without patting myself on the back, I'm generally known as a "promo guy". I've done a lot of seminars with guys like Joel Gertner, Kevin Kelly, etc., and they've all loved my work. There's nuance to cutting a good promo. There's "rules". Obviously people who don't know what they're looking at wouldn't get it, but if you do, well... It matters.

You can't just outright sh*t on someone, for starters. Rule #1: If you call a guy a worthless piece of sh*t, and you lose, then what are you? And if you win... So? All you did was beat a worthless piece of sh*t.

Aside from that, cracking on anyone for their race or sexual orientation is the ultimate Cheap Heat. It's juvenile. Doesn't make you look good at all.

There's other stuff you shouldn't do, like say "I'm gonna rip your head off" or whatever, Because obviously you won't, but Dwayne never really did that. Mostly just "I'm awesome and you suck because you're worthless and gay." That's his whole act!

These rules were in place back then, too, but he had Special Privilege. Kinda like how nowadays, the WWE scouts at a seminar will be all, "Obviously John Cena makes a lot of money, but don't do what he does, it's a special circumstance and we're well aware he's terrible."
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Old 10-16-2018, 10:37 PM   #48
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So?

As long as the animal isn't harmed, I don't really see any issues with people getting something extra visiting the zoo, be it friends or relatives of the zoo employees or celebrities.

My dad knows the guy who used to be in charge of the tigers and reptile section of the zoo where I live, and we had a family trip where our family friend let us inside the feeding area for the tigers used by employees and we got to be in the same room as the first baby tiger they had when it was up for check-up. And we got to hold various snakes that the zoo was safekeeping after being confiscated from smugglers, some jack wagon tried to smuggle a freaking anaconda and got caught and now we got pictures of my dad giving it kisses while it's draped over his shoulders.
This sounds like a cool experience and memory you have. And I get your point - except for the "so" part. It's "so" because the most likely scenario for the special treatment is because the guy is an actor. I am a big fan of the Rock and have been basically since The Rundown made me believe he was going to save action flicks as I knew them. But that's no reason for others to grant exaggerated privilege. Although obviously I think this falls more on the ethics of the zoo involved than it does the Rock. If I got to play with the seals, I'd happily take the experience as well.

See?

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Oh, you. You're just not trying hard enough.

I've been hating him for over 20 years without a break and I'm not even half tired. In fact, once you commit to it, it gets easier.

Although it helps that he's just the sh*ts at f*cking eeeeeeeeeverything.
Dude your commentary here is HYSTERICAL! LOL!

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Apparently in this day and age "outrage" is 5 people with an instagram complaining about something, meanwhile this is the first time Im hearing about it
This! Perfect. This really encapsulates what I think of the media calling things "outrage" and so on. They'll show a closeup of a bunch of weirdos wearing fluffy costumes of woman's body parts and call it a woman's rally, and through media coverage the average will think there's thousands of people in an outcry.

But then the camera pulls out, or there is an accidental wide-angle shot and you realize that the giant protest of people wearing foam body parts of women is like 12 weirdos standing in the street.

Last edited by IMJ; 10-16-2018 at 11:03 PM.
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Old 10-16-2018, 10:48 PM   #49
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That's really the thing. Without patting myself on the back, I'm generally known as a "promo guy". I've done a lot of seminars with guys like Joel Gertner, Kevin Kelly, etc., and they've all loved my work. There's nuance to cutting a good promo. There's "rules". Obviously people who don't know what they're looking at wouldn't get it, but if you do, well... It matters.

You can't just outright sh*t on someone, for starters. Rule #1: If you call a guy a worthless piece of sh*t, and you lose, then what are you? And if you win... So? All you did was beat a worthless piece of sh*t.

Aside from that, cracking on anyone for their race or sexual orientation is the ultimate Cheap Heat. It's juvenile. Doesn't make you look good at all.

There's other stuff you shouldn't do, like say "I'm gonna rip your head off" or whatever, Because obviously you won't, but Dwayne never really did that. Mostly just "I'm awesome and you suck because you're worthless and gay." That's his whole act!

These rules were in place back then, too, but he had Special Privilege. Kinda like how nowadays, the WWE scouts at a seminar will be all, "Obviously John Cena makes a lot of money, but don't do what he does, it's a special circumstance and we're well aware he's terrible."
Cnea also used to call his opponents "gay" and their valets "sluts". If WWE had remained TV-14 he'd still be doing that nowadays.

Tbh a lot of the criticisms Cena gets are similar to those smarks used to make about The Rock back in the day. Smarks do rate Cena's a better wrestler, though, sadly. At least even the biggest Rock fans can admit he wasn't a very technically sound wrestler. But I've seen smarks claim Cena is a pretty good wrestler nowadays. I don't rate him as low as you do, but no way am I gonna call him a good wrestler, let alone a great one.

Anyway, I'd take The Rock over John Cena any day.
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Old 10-17-2018, 01:25 AM   #50
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Nonsense. It's like begrudging gangsta rap of the 1990s for saying f***** and such. It was just a part of the time. Do we really want to judge what people said in the 1950s by today's standards? People are a product of their time and act accordingly.
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Old 10-17-2018, 09:29 AM   #51
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Nonsense. It's like begrudging gangsta rap of the 1990s for saying f***** and such. It was just a part of the time. Do we really want to judge what people said in the 1950s by today's standards? People are a product of their time and act accordingly.
I was a teenager when Cena was using such insults and I didn't find them appealing. It's not that I and other kids at school wouldn't say such things, but Cena was just too corny and fake for me to buy into his act.
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Old 10-17-2018, 04:23 PM   #52
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The moral ultimately being: There are Rules of Conduct, but if enough women and kids like you, then those rules don't apply to you.

True of Dwayne, true of Cena. Both worthless at their chosen craft. Both beloved by snot-pickers and horny housewives. Probably okay to hang out with, but who cares? They still get paid millions to be terrible at what they're paid to do.

Cena's take-home in 2015 was around $25 million, according to what Gerald Brisco told me. Probably more now. There's a LOT of people with zero taste out there.

Shame.
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Old 10-17-2018, 05:41 PM   #53
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Rock does have a reputation for being a cool guy irl. No idea about Cena.
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