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Old 04-29-2017, 09:07 AM   #81
Monte Williams
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Originally Posted by Tetsu Deinonychus View Post
That brings up another TMNT issue I have (with almost every version), the Turtles (especially Leo) using their actual deadly weapons in sparring matches. Leo should be using a wooden sword or a bamboo shinai so as not to accidentally kill his brothers during training, yet aside from him having one in Mirage Return to NY, and having a shinai in one FW episode, he's using shown hitting his brothers with his actual swords in sparring matches.
Yeah, I was watching a recent Nick episode wherein they were sparring, and Leo swings his swords with full strength, then the screen cuts to some sort of pattern to convey impact, and then it shows his sparring opponent(s) flying across the room.

I mean, it's talking turtles; I don't need realism.

But I couldn't help thinking, "How do you swing a sword at someone hard enough to send them flying across the room... and not cut them?"
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Old 04-29-2017, 10:07 AM   #82
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I guess making a bokken or a shinai model was too expensive XD
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Old 04-29-2017, 10:37 AM   #83
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I remember eps of 2K3 where Shredder would 'slice' the screen and the turtles would just fly back as if they got punched or bitchsmacked. Even if it's a punch, there's no way shredder can punch you with his bladed hand without stabbing you.

A similar 2012 ep had Xever run at someone with his knives, which again had the character 'punched away'.

But you're right. The turtles in any version shouldn't spar with their real weapons.
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Old 04-29-2017, 11:24 AM   #84
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I remember eps of 2K3 where Shredder would 'slice' the screen and the turtles would just fly back as if they got punched or bitchsmacked. Even if it's a punch, there's no way shredder can punch you with his bladed hand without stabbing you.
Ha ha, yeah, they still do that kind of thing in the Nick series.
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Old 04-29-2017, 03:08 PM   #85
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Agree about the swords. Has bugged me a long while. Esp when 2012 goes no holds barred in the dojo. At the very least they could altered the model and coloration a little and hinted that they're a different set of dull swords for training.
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Old 04-29-2017, 07:10 PM   #86
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When I would play with the action figures as a kid, my main sources of TMNT media were the original cartoon, video games, movies, and Archie Comics. With that in mind, my Turtles, when playing, only killed their opponents when I would have them act out some huge final showdown.

I guess you could say it's sort of like the Nick series where the Turtles were only out for blood a few times overall, but even then it's a kids' show so they have to be creative with how they make it work.

Nowadays, though, I don't have a one definitive "my Turtles" in my head as much as I used to. So, it honestly depends on what kind of story is being told as to whether or not in makes sense for them to kill their opponents. I guess the same could be said for the Mirage Turtles in general. Though they're more strict about not killing, it's not off the table for the IDW Turtles, either.
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Old 05-01-2017, 08:31 AM   #87
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"My" turtles do kill when necessary but, as in the Mirage comics, they are a bit traumatized from being child soldiers and eventually tone it down.
When you phrase it like that it seems really f**ked up which it is, let's be honest here.

They're like thirteen in #1 when they're sent to kill Shredder and in Return to New York, they're fifteen when they dispose of his body after decapitating him.
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Old 05-01-2017, 10:09 AM   #88
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When you phrase it like that it seems really f**ked up which it is, let's be honest here.

They're like thirteen in #1 when they're sent to kill Shredder and in Return to New York, they're fifteen when they dispose of his body after decapitating him.
A-yup.
I would love some quiet stories that explored this more.
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Old 05-04-2017, 12:14 PM   #89
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Is it Thursday already?
It's good in know in your old age you still remember what day of the week it is.

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They're not humans. They're mutant freaks raised in a sewer to one day kill a man. Their "psychological well-being" was never a consideration.

They're not heroes. Not supposed to be, anyway.
I never said they were humans, I said they had a moral code, they know right from wrong. They're crimefighters but not heroes and yes from a psychological point of view I still think killing someone would affect them. As I said before I like to be optimistic but I doubt the Turtles would have remained popular all these years if every person, alien or mutant they met they tried to kill in combat.

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So the question is really just "Do you accept that the turtles are killers?", isn't it? The answer is still the same, they're killers regardless wheter or not someone likes and/or knows about it.
In your opinion.

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They sure willingly take up a heroic role if they feel called to serve a greater good on occasion... Though not in a "superhero" way, and I'd rather that term not applied to them. More that they were able to do something to help a situation and chose to, even if they didn't have to get involved.
Exactly! That's what I'm trying to say to Andrew.

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*tisk* You know people aren't allowed to have those.
Wow wow hang on. I always assumed neatoman and Andrew's opinions are always the correct ones because it's theirs. Now you're telling me we can have opinions?
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Old 05-04-2017, 01:26 PM   #90
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Wow wow hang on. I always assumed neatoman and Andrew's opinions are always the correct ones because it's theirs. Now you're telling me we can have opinions?
Wah? Nooo... that can't be it. lol

Some people be like:
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Old 05-06-2017, 11:30 PM   #91
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At the time, right after the sale, Kevin Eastman was very, very keen on godfathering new TMNT comics. That maxi-series would have been the ground level of it. Basically... a new action-oriented Mirage TMNT Vol. 5, but set way earlier. When the Boom! thing didn't happen he was shepherded to IDW, who was already cooking up their stuff. He's actually old friends with the IDW CEO. He got in the door there and basically settled for that arrangement.
What are the chances of Kevin buying the property off of Viacom? Yeah I know it would cost a ton of money but still.
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Old 05-06-2017, 11:47 PM   #92
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What are the chances of Kevin buying the property off of Viacom? Yeah I know it would cost a ton of money but still.
Chances are 0. He doesn't have money remotely like that, not even anywhere in the same stratosphere.
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Old 05-06-2017, 11:54 PM   #93
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Chances are 0. He doesn't have money remotely like that, not even anywhere in the same stratosphere.
Yeah, and it's not like Viacom would want to sell it in the first place. They obviously intended to milk this franchise for everything they can get out of it.
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Old 05-07-2017, 08:32 PM   #94
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Agree about the swords. Has bugged me a long while. Esp when 2012 goes no holds barred in the dojo. At the very least they could altered the model and coloration a little and hinted that they're a different set of dull swords for training.
I also agree about the swords.
Unfortunately, if they had a scene with wooden swords, I would buy an extra set of Leo and Raph figures with brown weapons.

The turtles I picture are from Mirage and I do think of them as killers.
In the Nicktoon, I was taken aback when Mikey committed Jovaxian genocide, and then they destroyed possibly sentient robot and bugs. If they ate what they killed, I would probably not mind.
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Old 05-08-2017, 06:39 AM   #95
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Yes, the Turtles are killers because that's what they're trained to do. And while I agree that they would try their best not to kill the average mugger or street thug, sometimes killing them is unavoidable when you're fighting for your life and the lives of others. These guys are in a war and so it's inevitable that they will kill. I liked how in the Nick show, they stressed that they were in a war and subtly stated that it had to end with death.
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Old 05-11-2017, 12:03 PM   #96
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In my personal imagination, my Turtles do kill but only if it is necessary.
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Old 05-12-2017, 06:14 PM   #97
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I've read they have a "no kill policy" in the IDW comics. What's up with that?
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Old 05-13-2017, 01:03 AM   #98
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I've read they have a "no kill policy" in the IDW comics. What's up with that?
It's more of a Nickelodeon policy. If Nick let them, IDW would have them kill.
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Old 05-13-2017, 03:01 AM   #99
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IDW's reprints of Mirage Studios material even have this weird disclaimer where it says they were made decades ago and shouldn't be seen as representing modern values or those of any company currently involved. It's pretty bizarre.
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Old 05-13-2017, 05:13 AM   #100
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For me, it's more a matter of which turtle is more willing to kill if he had to, not if all of them as a whole are killers.

So, in regards to my personal vision on their position as potential killers.

...It's Leonardo. Leonardo is the most willing to kill. He's embraced Splinter's teachings much more than the others and that's part of why Splinter put him in charge.

Raphael follows behind him and believes that it should be done as justice, with a side of following Splinter's teachings. He probably has killed a street thug or two, but might not be aware of it.

Michelangelo is the third most willing, not through any reasoning of his own, but because he thinks his older brothers know best. Though, he also sees reason in Donatello's philosophy and so he has some trouble making up his own mind.

Which puts Donatello dead last in the willingness list. He's Leonardo's opposite, more embracing of the modern world and skeptical of Splinter's philosophies, especially the ones pertaining to revenge killing. His thing with 'Ninja honor' is basically "It's 20xx not 1650, even the Ban don't get up to this sh*t!"
So, in a way, Donatello would be the rebel in my vision, not Raphael.
(But if he had to, say if his life was in danger, yes he would, but he very much wishes he could tell Leonardo where he can stick his acceptance of Revenge Killing philosophies)

When it comes down to the idea of all four turtles as hardened edgelord killers...I like it as much as I like that Utroms are intrinsically 100% pacifistic models of angelic morality who would rather abandon their possessions and run to another planet than get involved in military conflicts.

I don't. Especially since the turtles would be middle schoolers at the youngest and high school sophomores at the oldest, age wise.
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