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View Poll Results: Should Razhar and Tokka appear more?
Yes 15 50.00%
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Old 04-10-2017, 02:34 PM   #41
CyberCubed
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I also meant IDW's Mondo Gecko too, and he's been well received with people saying, "I'm glad he's back" when he first appeared.

I mean I realize the only main reason we all still like these characters is because of our nostalgia for the original show, Archie comics, and the toys and videogames, but even then you still see more love for old characters than the newly created ones. Outside of Old Hob and maybe Tiger Claw and Fishface, none of the other majorly new IDW/Nick characters are all that popular.
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Old 04-10-2017, 03:08 PM   #42
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My idea for Tokka and Razhar in the next incarnation of tmnt would be a darker and more tragic take on the characters, a blend of the Secret of the Ooze and Fred Wolf versions. So while Bebop and Rocksteady are known in tmnt as goofy henchmen, Razhar and Tokka are the sympathetic ones.

They both start out as a wolf cub and a baby snapping turtle who are taken in by the foot early on for experiments. They are mutated early on in their life, but are subject to vicious experiments designed to turn them into super soldiers. As a result, both of the mutants (especially Tokka) have suffered from developmental disorders which causes their speech to be stunted and slurred, often only communicating in grunts and cries.

When they have grown into semi-adults, the two are forced to fight the turtles by the Shredder for his own gain. However, both are naturally docile and scared and don't want to fight the turtles despite their enormous physical strength. As a result of their failures, the shredder punishes them brutally and this causes Razhar especially to snap and escape the foot with his younger "brother".

Both mutants then spend their days hiding out in the streets, being shunned by humanity wherever they go, only having each other for friends. Razhar is especially overprotective of Tokka due to the relatively higher abuse that he endured in comparison to Razhar due to his lower intelligence. Whenever, they both encounter the turtles, their first instinct is to fight them because they have learned to associate the turtles with the horrific abuse that they endured at the hands of the Shredder.

Eventually however, both slowly learn to comprehend human language and develop speech over the course of the story, becoming more intelligent. It is only time that their newfound reasoning faculties lead them to learn more about the turtles in order to kill them. However, when they learn that the turtles are outcasts as well and on a quest for good, they have a change of heart and ally themselves with the turtles, vowing to help take down the Shredder together.

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Old 04-10-2017, 03:26 PM   #43
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I don't know, wouldn't it just be better to have them be monsters rather than try to make them more intelligent?
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Old 04-10-2017, 03:29 PM   #44
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I don't know, wouldn't it just be better to have them be monsters rather than try to make them more intelligent?
They could be both. Savage brutes who can't speak and express themselves but still have feelings. They could learn how to slowly speak over time, but only learn the basics by the end since in the idea in my post, their development has been damaged by their harsh upbringing by the shredder.

Make them intelligent enough so you can understand their feelings and they are relatable but not so intelligent so that the audience still feels sympathetic for them due to their disabilities. Basically a cross between their depiction in SOTO and that one episode of the OT.
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Old 04-10-2017, 04:30 PM   #45
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I like the version of Razhar and Tokka that were in the Fred Wolf series, they were a little more intelligent, and Razhar was trying to protect his friend Tokka, When they were attacked by the Turtles.

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Old 04-11-2017, 08:42 PM   #46
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I just feel bad because we never saw Tokka reunite with Rahzar afterwards.

I always found it interesting that Tokka is basically what a real mutant turtle would look like. Our guys have always looked basically like weird faced bald humans with shells. Tokka was full on realistic non-cute mutant turtle.
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Old 04-12-2017, 12:41 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Coola Yagami View Post
I just feel bad because we never saw Tokka reunite with Rahzar afterwards.

I always found it interesting that Tokka is basically what a real mutant turtle would look like. Our guys have always looked basically like weird faced bald humans with shells. Tokka was full on realistic non-cute mutant turtle.
Kinda like the "Soul's Winter" Turtles.

And, I don't mind seeing Tokka and Rahzar reappear in future versions. They're no worse than a lot of the other C-List Mutants that have made comebacks lately.
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Old 04-12-2017, 02:49 PM   #48
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And, I don't mind seeing Tokka and Rahzar reappear in future versions. They're no worse than a lot of the other C-List Mutants that have made comebacks lately.
Kinda agree with this. If people lose their minds over seeing Muckman, Mutagen Man, Wyrm, Scumbug, etc...again....there's no problem with Rahzar/Tokka reappearing.
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Old 04-12-2017, 03:16 PM   #49
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Kinda agree with this. If people lose their minds over seeing Muckman, Mutagen Man, Wyrm, Scumbug, etc...again....there's no problem with Rahzar/Tokka reappearing.
At the end of the day, it's all nostalgia and action figures.
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Old 04-12-2017, 03:18 PM   #50
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At the end of the day, it's all nostalgia and action figures.
I won't argue that, but still almost every major animal was made a mutant back in the 80's/90's, so it's hard to think of new mutant characters.

It's kind of the same reason people were disappointed Bludgeon wasn't Armaggon. You introduce a mutant shark and not use one people liked since the Archie era? Granted since Bludgeon is a hammerhead shark and Armaggon is a great white shark, it gives IDW some leeway to still introduced him somewhere down the road.
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Old 04-12-2017, 03:19 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy View Post
At the end of the day, it's all nostalgia and action figures.
So they're forcing it to be.
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Old 04-12-2017, 03:51 PM   #52
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Razhar was so well done in a single episode and his and Tokka's relationship. I would like to see more of that! The problem is how can Tokka be unique to Slash and be justified.

I would like to see a list of A list mutants and B list mutants after CKD's mention.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:11 PM   #53
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They're awesome designs so yeah I love seeing them. |
They're not really used too much either when they appear which is fine since it makes their appearances special.

With the exception of the CG show. Dogpound mutating into Rahzar was terrible and only done to please fans. Dogpound was awesome and one of the few original characters that was great in the beginning and yet they transform him into a character we love but he's not that character either? Way to mess things up on both characters.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:15 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87 View Post
Razhar was so well done in a single episode and his and Tokka's relationship. I would like to see more of that! The problem is how can Tokka be unique to Slash and be justified.

I would like to see a list of A list mutants and B list mutants after CKD's mention.
I'd say, if such a list were to be created, A and B lists wouldn't cover everything. You have characters such as Fishface and Dogpound, for example, who started off strong and unique but faded to background lackeys over the course of a season or two.

They STARTED as A-list, but degraded down to B-list. Whereas, say, Mona Lisa is firmly B-list. And Bebop and Rocksteady and Slash are absolutely A-list.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:17 PM   #55
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With the exception of the CG show. Dogpound mutating into Rahzar was terrible and only done to please fans. Dogpound was awesome and one of the few original characters that was great in the beginning and yet they transform him into a character we love but he's not that character either? Way to mess things up on both characters.
Are you kidding? Dogpound's design was awful, and Rahzar was a much needed improvement. Besides his personality didn't change between mutation so it's the same character.

Also why do you keep saying, "not that character?" All Rahzar is, is basically a wolf. He had no backstory prior to the Nick cartoon.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:28 PM   #56
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Razhar still has no backstory as he was renamed Razhar in name only.

As for A-list, would it consists of just five characters? Bebop, Rocksteady, Slash, Leatherhead, and Baxter Stockman when depicted as a mutant fly might make up the A list. You might have an A- category with the likes of Old Hob and Mondo Gecko.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:35 PM   #57
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Are you kidding? Dogpound's design was awful, and Rahzar was a much needed improvement. Besides his personality didn't change between mutation so it's the same character.

Also why do you keep saying, "not that character?" All Rahzar is, is basically a wolf. He had no backstory prior to the Nick cartoon.
Dogpound's design was awesome EXCEPT for the fact that it was lopsided and asymmetrical.

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Razhar still has no backstory as he was renamed Razhar in name only.

As for A-list, would it consists of just five characters? Bebop, Rocksteady, Slash, Leatherhead, and Baxter Stockman when depicted as a mutant fly might make up the A list. You might have an A- category with the likes of Old Hob and Mondo Gecko.
I wouldn't list Baxter; he's not always a mutant (courtesy of Mirage, 4Kids, and IDW).

A-List? Off the top of my head: Rocksteady, Bebop, Slash, Leatherhead. I'd also add Old Hob and Tiger Claw to that list, because although they're exclusive to a single iteration, they've been stand-out fan favorites AND they haven't been downgraded to background cannon fodder.
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Old 04-12-2017, 09:37 PM   #58
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Razhar still has no backstory as he was renamed Razhar in name only..
???

Rahzar used to be nothing but a wolf mutated for Shredder in the second movie. In his original cartoon appearance he had no backstory and was just a random mutant who lived in the wild.

Nick's Rahzar has an actual backstory (Chris Bradford), has a personality, actually works for Shredder beyond being a "dumb feral mutant" and had a role in the series. Take off the nostalgia glasses, Nick's Rahzar is the best version of the character to date.
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Old 04-12-2017, 10:03 PM   #59
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???

Rahzar used to be nothing but a wolf mutated for Shredder in the second movie. In his original cartoon appearance he had no backstory and was just a random mutant who lived in the wild.

Nick's Rahzar has an actual backstory (Chris Bradford), has a personality, actually works for Shredder beyond being a "dumb feral mutant" and had a role in the series. Take off the nostalgia glasses, Nick's Rahzar is the best version of the character to date.
I prefer the original origin where he was just a normal wolf mutated, Not really a fan of the Nick version, since its just in name only.
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Old 04-12-2017, 10:10 PM   #60
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I prefer the original origin where he was just a normal wolf mutated, Not really a fan of the Nick version, since its just in name only.
Exactly. There was no need to turn an already established character into Rahzar all of a sudden. There's nothing wrong with Rahzar being a feral wolf monster that could have eventually developed his own character, kinda like Slash actually.

Hell, what would have happened if they mutated Shredder, Hun, or some other pre-established character into Slash just for 'LOL nostalgia!' just for the hell of it.

Actually this version of Rahzar was such a sleek skeletal design that had ninja speed.... they might as well have call him Wolfesbane or some other name other than naming him after a slow lumbering wolf mutant was known more for his strength than his speed.
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