El Mayimbe Of Latino Review Apparently Has The TMNT Script - Page 5

Bob · 07-28-2012, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raphroehler2003

Here's what I don't understand...Kevin Eastman is talking about having fight scenes like The Raid: Redemption and Fist of Legend...

How...I repeat HOW...can you do that in a script that has Bebop, Rocksteady, and Krang?

That'd be like if the 80's turtles cartoon had the violence from the movie Heavy Metal...it's not a mix that makes sense...

I assume the Foot and Shredder will be in the film, too. That's where all the martial arts will come from.

Ramboraph4life aka Matt · 07-28-2012, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob

I assume the Foot and Shredder will be in the film, too. That's where all the martial arts will come from.

So you'd have hardcore fight scenes (like The Raid had) but then turn around and have Krang & The Technodrome? The tone would be kinda all over the place.

The seriousness of a fight b/t the turtles and the Foot mixed with the 80's cartoon stuff of Krang/Bebop/Rocksteady doesn't seem like it'd work tone-wise.

Cryomancer · 07-28-2012, 07:48 PM

Just because they come from a humorous show doesn't mean they have to be humorous characters.

*Leo656* · 07-29-2012, 05:44 AM

In truth, the way movies work vs. other types of fiction or storytelling, you almost have to have Bebop and Rocksteady, or some kind of analog, in place to present a credible physical threat to the Turtles. The Foot aren't enough at all; ninjas in movies have been useless, faceless cannon fodder since the 70s. Guys in black footsie pajamas can NOT do the bulk of the action and fight scenes in a major motion picture, they're not a credible threat to a quartet of giant reptiles doing spin kicks. They're visually boring, and on film they're historically inept.

I mean yeah, it worked with the first movie *basically*, but even in that one these "highly-skilled warriors" were just more meat for the grinder. The only credible threat we were shown was, not coincidentally, the most visually-arresting villain with action figure potential.

I think adding Bebop and Rocksteady could up the potential for exciting fight scenes in the movie 1000%, as long as they weren't played *just* for laughs. I think that's what bugs people the most about them, they're stupid. They look freakin' creepy as hell, if they were played sadistic, sinister, or just bat-sh*t crazy, they'd be A-List villains. It'd be like the Turtles trying to fight a tag-team of Banes, without the intellect but with all the brute force. I'd LOVE to see that, honestly. And they're a better fit for a movie than "Random Ninja #27.

I cite as further evidence "Superman II"; I think it's a kinda dumb movie overall, especially compared to the first one (or The Donner Cut) but it's many people's favorite based solely on the fight with Zod and the Phantom Zone villains. See also, many fans' complaint towards "Superman Returns" that "Superman didn't even hit anyone", compared to X-Men 3, released around the same time, which made lots of money despite being generally awful, short on logic but heavy on fight scenes.

The lesson we take away from this in relation to movies is, "People like to see people/things fight similar people/things." If Bebop and Rocksteady are in the movie, it may lose points for faithfulness to the source material, but I predict it will also make lots of money. Which is equally important.

*Galactus* · 07-29-2012, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo656

In truth, the way movies work vs. other types of fiction or storytelling, you almost have to have Bebop and Rocksteady, or some kind of analog, in place to present a credible physical threat to the Turtles. The Foot aren't enough at all; ninjas in movies have been useless, faceless cannon fodder since the 70s. Guys in black footsie pajamas can NOT do the bulk of the action and fight scenes in a major motion picture, they're not a credible threat to a quartet of giant reptiles doing spin kicks. They're visually boring, and on film they're historically inept.

I mean yeah, it worked with the first movie *basically*, but even in that one these "highly-skilled warriors" were just more meat for the grinder. The only credible threat we were shown was, not coincidentally, the most visually-arresting villain with action figure potential.

I think adding Bebop and Rocksteady could up the potential for exciting fight scenes in the movie 1000%, as long as they weren't played *just* for laughs. I think that's what bugs people the most about them, they're stupid. They look freakin' creepy as hell, if they were played sadistic, sinister, or just bat-sh*t crazy, they'd be A-List villains. It'd be like the Turtles trying to fight a tag-team of Banes, without the intellect but with all the brute force. I'd LOVE to see that, honestly. And they're a better fit for a movie than "Random Ninja #27.

I cite as further evidence "Superman II"; I think it's a kinda dumb movie overall, especially compared to the first one (or The Donner Cut) but it's many people's favorite based solely on the fight with Zod and the Phantom Zone villains. See also, many fans' complaint towards "Superman Returns" that "Superman didn't even hit anyone", compared to X-Men 3, released around the same time, which made lots of money despite being generally awful, short on logic but heavy on fight scenes.

The lesson we take away from this in relation to movies is, "People like to see people/things fight similar people/things." If Bebop and Rocksteady are in the movie, it may lose points for faithfulness to the source material, but I predict it will also make lots of money. Which is equally important.

As you pointed out the first movie did well enough with faceless Foot Ninja which also had Tatsu and built up to The Shredder.

The second movie spent most of it's time setting up two mutants that we got two very unsatisfying fights with. Now I would trust that a modern movie could deliver a better a TMNT vs mutant fight but at the end the mutants be they Tokka and Rahzar, Bebop and Rocksteady or Dogpound and Fishface I would wager would still be unsatisying. Particularly if it was the Fred Wolf characters, they arn't going to kill off poor Bebop & Rocky

What would those 30 years old that arn't going to watch the movie think.

It's not that the idea of introducing other mutants is necessarily a bad one but rather one that I feel is bigger risk to telling a good story. Get the basics right with the first movie and then we can talk about Krang, Groundchuck anc co.

*Leo656* · 07-29-2012, 11:20 PM

Hah, story. Awesome.

Nah, it's a toy commercial, bro. The first flick is as grounded as we're ever gonna see with TMNT. And it's also been done, too.

They know what they're doing. It may not be the movie everyone wants to see, although some people might, but they're going to take every step they can to make it bring in money. That very likely means big fights with other mutants with action figure potential. I'll be kinda shocked if we don't get that.

Bob · 07-30-2012, 10:17 AM

^ I do agree with a lot of what you’ve said here and in the other thread.

This film obviously isn’t going to be cheap. For Paramount to delay its release in order to get the budget down (I don't believe it was completely down to them "not liking the script"), it means that they’re probably still going to end up spending a lot on it once it finally hits production. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if, by that time, they don’t end up spending what they originally were going to spend before they shut it down.

As a result of all that they have to make sure they deliver a film that will get as many bums on seats as possible, and not just cheeks belonging to TMNT fans. Got to ask yourself, what kinds of films have been doing well in the last few years? I can think of the Transformers films, (nearly all) superhero films and fantasy films. I just don’t think a “street level” TMNT movie like the first film would be received well by a modern audience. They’ve shown (domestically and, probably more importantly in this day and age, abroad) that they like sci-fi and fantasy and big action. All the Fred Wolfe subject matter gives the makers an ideal opportunity to fill the film with all that crowd-pleasing stuff, but at the same time keeping it a TMNT film.

Also, I fully expect a 3D film. I will actually be shocked if its not.

*Xav* · 07-31-2012, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo656

The lesson we take away from this in relation to movies is, "People like to see people/things fight similar people/things." If Bebop and Rocksteady are in the movie, it may lose points for faithfulness to the source material, but I predict it will also make lots of money. Which is equally important.

What would be similar to the Turtles would be other skilled ninjas, not a couple of dumb idiots who can't hit anything with their laser guns. Actually what would be most like them would be the Dark Turtles. If you think somehow adding more mutants will add more money, than please explain how the first film made more money than the second?

*Leo656* · 08-01-2012, 07:08 AM

Entirely because everything about the first film was made with care, while the second was a cash-in rush job. It had nothing to do with content or villains, it was that they made a bad second film overall. However, I'm pretty sure if Bebop and Rocksteady had been used instead of Tokkah and Rahzar, it would have made even more money, even if every other second of the story was the same. People bitch to this day about Bebop & Rocksteady not being in that.

Keep in mind very few people actually care about the actual "Ninja" part of "Ninja Turtles", and the Turtles' fighting methods usually come across as more "slapstick" than "skilled ninjas" anyway. It's a sci-fi action/comedy they're making, not a sequel to Kung Fu, I doubt they're going to be all accurate and stuff with the fight scenes. Plus, most importantly, the movie needs to have characters for toys to make kids pester their parents for. It's How It Works.

I don't think Bebop and Rocksteady should be done the way they were in the cartoon, I think a more feral/savage take would be more appropriate for a film, and also more credible than an army of ninjas just running into the Turtles to get beat up. I wanna see the guys sweat a bit before they get to Shredder. I wanna see Bebop and Rocksteady all roided out, savage, and able to shrug off any single thing the Turtles can throw. They should be proportionately huge compared to the Turtles, jacked up, feral, and it should take a combined effort to take either one of them down. That's how I'd see it done.

I'm not saying DON'T have the Foot be in the movie, I just think there needs to be an escalation of threat as the film goes on. Ex: The Turtles thrash the Foot convincingly, Shredder unleashes Bebop and Rocksteady, and when they can't get the job done Shredder resorts to taking the Turtles on himself. It's a pretty natural arc for an action film. It could work just as well if they saved any mutant villains for a sequel, but I highly doubt they've committed to a sequel at this point since they can't even figure out what *this* movie is yet. So I think it's more likely they'll cram everything they can think of into the first one.

*Panda_Kahn_fan* · 08-01-2012, 09:31 AM

Personally, I think it would be a good idea to use krang s the main villian first. The Shredder and the foot being the first villian has aready been done in the first live action film, and the general public who remember that film might see it as a rehash. You don't need to keep reguritating the plot for TMNT vol 1, number #1 over and over again in diffrent ways as your first story every time there is a reeboot!

Use krang as the main baddie, have him make mutants like rocksteady and bebop to serve him and fight the turtles. Hint at shredder when splinter tells the flaskback story that explains who they know ninjitsu, then save him for the sequel, like the nolan batman films did with the joker. Have rocksteady and bebop survive when krang and the other mutants are defeated/destroyed, and join Shrdder in the sequel.

*Slap-Happy* · 08-10-2012, 11:37 PM

Interesting tweet from a few days ago.

*zkarlette* · 08-11-2012, 12:45 AM

I think he is playing with our feelings...

**Jester** · 08-11-2012, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zkarlette

I think he is playing with our feelings...

What's it say? I can't see it from here...

EDIT: Nevermind...

Quote:

Originally Posted by that guy

So TMNT co-creator Kevin Eastman thinks they knocked the script out of the park, huh? Oh really? Um, well, sorry sir, I strongly disagree!

*Powder* · 08-11-2012, 02:03 AM

A. That guy is a dick.
B. What he has isn't even current as of now, right?

**Jester** · 08-11-2012, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Powder

A. That guy is a dick.
B. What he has isn't even current as of now, right?

Not sure. Do love how cryptic he's being...lording his "knowledge" over us all. Almost makes you think he's speaking out of his posterior, a'la Ace Ventura.

Bob · 08-11-2012, 09:20 AM

He does come across like an egomaniacal jock. I’ve been looking at his Twitter page for the past month or so and I’ve lost a lot of respect for him in that time. I do believe that he has got the script, as he’s posted numerous script reviews in the past. I just don’t know why he’s continuously dangling a carrot in front of the donkey, though. It does seem like he’s doing it on purpose, all because of his apparent narcissism. Yeah, he’s not really the kind of person I would freely socialise with. This isn’t an eighty thousand word thesis. It’s a script review. You could knock one up in an hour.

Also, taking into account Eastman’s latest comments, El Mayimbe clearly has a pretty old draft, a draft that’s probably had a lot of work done to it over the past eight weeks since the “shut down”.

07-28-2012, 07:48 PM	#83
Cryomancer Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 1,090	Just because they come from a humorous show doesn't mean they have to be humorous characters. __________________ Final Boss of translation group Opentrain. We do videogame comics and TMNT stuff. http://opentrain.theyear199x.org/

07-29-2012, 05:44 AM	#84
Leo656 The Franchise Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,696	In truth, the way movies work vs. other types of fiction or storytelling, you almost have to have Bebop and Rocksteady, or some kind of analog, in place to present a credible physical threat to the Turtles. The Foot aren't enough at all; ninjas in movies have been useless, faceless cannon fodder since the 70s. Guys in black footsie pajamas can NOT do the bulk of the action and fight scenes in a major motion picture, they're not a credible threat to a quartet of giant reptiles doing spin kicks. They're visually boring, and on film they're historically inept. I mean yeah, it worked with the first movie basically, but even in that one these "highly-skilled warriors" were just more meat for the grinder. The only credible threat we were shown was, not coincidentally, the most visually-arresting villain with action figure potential. I think adding Bebop and Rocksteady could up the potential for exciting fight scenes in the movie 1000%, as long as they weren't played just for laughs. I think that's what bugs people the most about them, they're stupid. They look freakin' creepy as hell, if they were played sadistic, sinister, or just bat-sht crazy, they'd be A-List villains. It'd be like the Turtles trying to fight a tag-team of Banes, without the intellect but with all the brute force. I'd LOVE to see that, honestly. And they're a better fit for a movie than "Random Ninja #27. I cite as further evidence "Superman II"; I think it's a kinda dumb movie overall, especially compared to the first one (or The Donner Cut) but it's many people's favorite based solely on the fight with Zod and the Phantom Zone villains. See also, many fans' complaint towards "Superman Returns" that "Superman didn't even hit anyone", compared to X-Men 3, released around the same time, which made lots of money despite being generally awful, short on logic but heavy on fight scenes. The lesson we take away from this in relation to movies is, "People like to see people/things fight similar people/things." If Bebop and Rocksteady are in the movie, it may lose points for faithfulness to the source material, but I predict it will also make lots of money. Which is equally important. __________________ "I left some words quite far from here to be a short reminder... I laid them out in stone, in case they need to last forever..." "But hey... I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know."* nWo Tech: The Official Thread Poison of the Technodrome Forums https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr...awnHgDz1ceDcfA https://theroxxshow.blogspot.com/

07-29-2012, 11:20 PM	#86
Leo656 The Franchise Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,696	Hah, story. Awesome. Nah, it's a toy commercial, bro. The first flick is as grounded as we're ever gonna see with TMNT. And it's also been done, too. They know what they're doing. It may not be the movie everyone wants to see, although some people might, but they're going to take every step they can to make it bring in money. That very likely means big fights with other mutants with action figure potential. I'll be kinda shocked if we don't get that. __________________ "I left some words quite far from here to be a short reminder... I laid them out in stone, in case they need to last forever..." "But hey... I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know." nWo Tech: The Official Thread Poison of the Technodrome Forums https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr...awnHgDz1ceDcfA https://theroxxshow.blogspot.com/

07-30-2012, 10:17 AM	#87
Bob Stone Warrior Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: UK, England Posts: 546	^ I do agree with a lot of what you’ve said here and in the other thread. This film obviously isn’t going to be cheap. For Paramount to delay its release in order to get the budget down (I don't believe it was completely down to them "not liking the script"), it means that they’re probably still going to end up spending a lot on it once it finally hits production. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if, by that time, they don’t end up spending what they originally were going to spend before they shut it down. As a result of all that they have to make sure they deliver a film that will get as many bums on seats as possible, and not just cheeks belonging to TMNT fans. Got to ask yourself, what kinds of films have been doing well in the last few years? I can think of the Transformers films, (nearly all) superhero films and fantasy films. I just don’t think a “street level” TMNT movie like the first film would be received well by a modern audience. They’ve shown (domestically and, probably more importantly in this day and age, abroad) that they like sci-fi and fantasy and big action. All the Fred Wolfe subject matter gives the makers an ideal opportunity to fill the film with all that crowd-pleasing stuff, but at the same time keeping it a TMNT film. Also, I fully expect a 3D film. I will actually be shocked if its not. Last edited by Bob; 07-30-2012 at 10:23 AM.

08-01-2012, 07:08 AM	#89
Leo656 The Franchise Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: nWo Country Posts: 27,696	Entirely because everything about the first film was made with care, while the second was a cash-in rush job. It had nothing to do with content or villains, it was that they made a bad second film overall. However, I'm pretty sure if Bebop and Rocksteady had been used instead of Tokkah and Rahzar, it would have made even more money, even if every other second of the story was the same. People bitch to this day about Bebop & Rocksteady not being in that. Keep in mind very few people actually care about the actual "Ninja" part of "Ninja Turtles", and the Turtles' fighting methods usually come across as more "slapstick" than "skilled ninjas" anyway. It's a sci-fi action/comedy they're making, not a sequel to Kung Fu, I doubt they're going to be all accurate and stuff with the fight scenes. Plus, most importantly, the movie needs to have characters for toys to make kids pester their parents for. It's How It Works. I don't think Bebop and Rocksteady should be done the way they were in the cartoon, I think a more feral/savage take would be more appropriate for a film, and also more credible than an army of ninjas just running into the Turtles to get beat up. I wanna see the guys sweat a bit before they get to Shredder. I wanna see Bebop and Rocksteady all roided out, savage, and able to shrug off any single thing the Turtles can throw. They should be proportionately huge compared to the Turtles, jacked up, feral, and it should take a combined effort to take either one of them down. That's how I'd see it done. I'm not saying DON'T have the Foot be in the movie, I just think there needs to be an escalation of threat as the film goes on. Ex: The Turtles thrash the Foot convincingly, Shredder unleashes Bebop and Rocksteady, and when they can't get the job done Shredder resorts to taking the Turtles on himself. It's a pretty natural arc for an action film. It could work just as well if they saved any mutant villains for a sequel, but I highly doubt they've committed to a sequel at this point since they can't even figure out what this movie is yet. So I think it's more likely they'll cram everything they can think of into the first one. __________________ "I left some words quite far from here to be a short reminder... I laid them out in stone, in case they need to last forever..." "But hey... I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know." nWo Tech: The Official Thread Poison of the Technodrome Forums https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxr...awnHgDz1ceDcfA https://theroxxshow.blogspot.com/

08-01-2012, 09:31 AM	#90
Panda_Kahn_fan Mad Scientist Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,715	Personally, I think it would be a good idea to use krang s the main villian first. The Shredder and the foot being the first villian has aready been done in the first live action film, and the general public who remember that film might see it as a rehash. You don't need to keep reguritating the plot for TMNT vol 1, number #1 over and over again in diffrent ways as your first story every time there is a reeboot! Use krang as the main baddie, have him make mutants like rocksteady and bebop to serve him and fight the turtles. Hint at shredder when splinter tells the flaskback story that explains who they know ninjitsu, then save him for the sequel, like the nolan batman films did with the joker. Have rocksteady and bebop survive when krang and the other mutants are defeated/destroyed, and join Shrdder in the sequel. __________________ My TMNT fanfic: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/1266176...n-a-Half-Shell IDW is the best version of TMNT If they make a TMNT reboot movie retelling the shredder battle/origin, I won't buy a ticket. Last edited by Panda_Kahn_fan; 08-01-2012 at 09:45 AM.

08-10-2012, 11:37 PM	#91
Slap-Happy Bad Boy Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,911	Interesting tweet from a few days ago.

08-11-2012, 12:45 AM	#92
zkarlette Fashionably late Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: CA Posts: 4,146	I think he is playing with our feelings... __________________ "If only we'd stop trying to be happy, we could have a pretty good time" E.W

08-11-2012, 02:03 AM	#94
Powder So tired of this place Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Shell Ri La Posts: 26,809	A. That guy is a dick. B. What he has isn't even current as of now, right? __________________ I'm convinced that none of you have ever experienced joy

08-11-2012, 09:20 AM	#96
Bob Stone Warrior Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: UK, England Posts: 546	He does come across like an egomaniacal jock. I’ve been looking at his Twitter page for the past month or so and I’ve lost a lot of respect for him in that time. I do believe that he has got the script, as he’s posted numerous script reviews in the past. I just don’t know why he’s continuously dangling a carrot in front of the donkey, though. It does seem like he’s doing it on purpose, all because of his apparent narcissism. Yeah, he’s not really the kind of person I would freely socialise with. This isn’t an eighty thousand word thesis. It’s a script review. You could knock one up in an hour. Also, taking into account Eastman’s latest comments, El Mayimbe clearly has a pretty old draft, a draft that’s probably had a lot of work done to it over the past eight weeks since the “shut down”.