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Old 09-23-2020, 09:38 PM   #1501
Leo656
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Well, it apparently did make about 750 on a 175 budget, which I wasn't entirely aware of. So that's pretty good. It probably helped that they didn't spend much on it to start with, though. *I* thought it was alright but nothing special - it was Exactly The Movie I Thought It Would Be and nothing more or less - but I'm a bit surprised that it apparently did such good repeat business since so many people vocally hate it. By any reasonable estimate, a good number of those same people must have paid to see it more than once for it to draw such big money, so what's it say about them?

Either way, critics hated it and BoP bombed, so I'll stand by my point that risking their future on Harley Quinn movies is just as questionable as green-lighting JL2 would be, and probably more so. The only variable is that Quinn movies obviously cost less to make, but they're also not a proven draw and may have already worn out their welcome. BUT, that's the only thing from WB that we have written in stone at this point. We know more about their future plans for Harley movies than we do about Aquaman 2, which made a billion dollars. Crazy!
------------------

Off-topic but tangentially-related, but an interesting scenario is playing out on my FB. As a general rule, I post NOTHING about new movies, especially comic book movies, because for some reason that always brings people out and makes them all tribal and combative. My page is generally rather dormant; I don't post much, and in return people don't say much. There's almost never any kind of extended back-and-forth with anyone, and frankly I prefer it that way (especially since it's mostly Wrestling People and if I annoy the wrong person it could hurt my "career", such as it is).

So of COURSE I post the SR article about the reshoots, a friend and I speculate about what this might mean for JL2 if anything, and I immediately have people who haven't spoken to me in YEARS crawling out of the woodwork just to tell me how much Snyder sucks and what a mistake WB is making by spending any more time or money on Justice League. Like, we never converse about anything in public OR in private, we're probably only "friends" because we worked a show together once upon a time... but sure enough, say anything in a positive light about Zack Snyder's DC movies and you can set your watch to someone coming to bust your goddamn balls.

It's uncanny, and it's annoying, and I mostly only posted it at all as a "stooge test" to see if it would get this exact reaction. Sure enough, my faith in people to be sh*tty is always rewarded.

These people are nowhere to be found when I post about my Birthday, or my anniversary, or getting a booking, or anything. "You're excited about a Zack Snyder project? BRO, I know we haven't spoken in at least five years but PLEASE let me tell you why I think you're stupid!"

So endearing.
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Old 09-23-2020, 09:45 PM   #1502
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Your point seems to be that they should greenlight JL2 because "look at all this other stupid **** they've done". I mean, it sounds nice, but I can't actually get behind it.

And this is apparently my new sermon, but WB today is much different than WB two years ago. They are still greenlighting a lot of different projects, but they are actually following through with them now. It's a different team at the top. The last crew was corrupt as ****, with what they did to the JL production in order to serve themselves. Awful executives who's faults shouldn't weigh on the new team.
I think the push for Harley was already in motion plus that rendition of the chatacter is popular, despite the crappy movies.

Yeah, people are really odd about Snyder. His work is so polarizing. People seem to lash out at it in an almost defensive way sometimes.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:00 PM   #1503
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The Snyder cut on HBO Max would have to generate earth-shakingly goodwill, ratings (and/or subscriptions) for WB to consider giving Snyder the keys to JL2. I could see it happening but sheesh, we're talking moving mountains kind of stuff, the impact it's going to need to have. And even then, it'd just be this side thing... they wouldn't make Snyder the architect of the DCEU again or anything.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:01 PM   #1504
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HAH. I remember when everyone said there was zero chance of this happening.

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...vill-reshoots/

Shooting starts next month. Might take a week or so to complete. Cavill, Affleck, Gal, and Ray Fisher are all coming back to do more scenes.

F*ck it, man, just greenlight "Justice League 2" already and let things wrap up the way they were supposed to. They're already in balls-deep and have no firm long-term plans except for 80 Harley Quinn movies and "something" with The Rock as Black Adam, "eventually". If they're in for a penny, they're in for a pound already.

Who knows. Things that were "impossible" 6 months ago are now either Very Likely or Actually Happening depending on which case. At this point, I definitely wouldn't be shocked if at some point between now and May, someone at WB comes out and says, "Yeah, f*ck it, JL2 is back on." I mean, why not? At THIS point, there's no good reason NOT to.

Anyways yeah this is exciting.
Wow.

I'd say no way this sets up a Justice League 2, but before the HBO Max announcement, I said there was no way we'd ever see a Snyder Cut.

Holy $hit. Bring it on! Bring back Snyder... controversial beats boring for me every damn time.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:05 PM   #1505
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Aqua: It's really not as simple as all that by itself, but yes, I do think that if they're gonna book four Shazam-related movies before even shooting one just because "We have The Rock!", promise a dozen Quinn movies even AFTER the most recent one completely tanks, and go all-in on 98-lb Twilight Batman, as well as court people like Nic Cage and Val Kilmer to film very expensive cameos in what's supposedly a Flash movie, then sure, I think they can absolutely put the script, costumes, and cast they've already paid for to good use. They were already committed to making JL2 until they weren't. It would be a waste NOT to do it, when starting over would cost them twice as much money, twice as much time, and twice as much hassle.

You're often saying "Logically, this..." and "Financially, that..." when it comes to predicting what they Will, Won't, or Should Do, and all I'm saying is, whether it's the management team of This Year, Two Years Ago or Ten Years Ago or even Twenty Years Ago, what never changes at WB is 1. They'll throw money at the wind without ever seeing a hint of profit and end up with nothing to show for it, that's nothing new to them, and 2. They change their minds with every single passing cloud. And that's why you CAN'T even go there with "Logically This" and "Financially That". WB doesn't operate on logic; not now, not last year, not ANY year. Obviously they LOVE to make money, but again: This is the same company that once paid Tim Burton $20 million to NOT direct a Superman movie. Nah'mean?

All I'm saying is, if it's REALLY about dollars and cents - And it's not that simple, but let's pretend it is - then JL2 makes MORE sense than any alternative. A reboot would cost twice as much and likewise would have no promise whatsoever of getting any better reaction. They can HOPE, but they don't know.

That's all I'm saying. But no, it's not JUST about "They do a bunch of other dumb sh*t too." Partly that. All that definitely doesn't HURT my argument one bit. Again, we'll just have to see.


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The Snyder cut on HBO Max would have to generate earth-shakingly goodwill, ratings (and/or subscriptions) for WB to consider giving Snyder the keys to JL2. I could see it happening but sheesh, we're talking moving mountains kind of stuff, the impact it's going to need to have. And even then, it'd just be this side thing... they wouldn't make Snyder the architect of the DCEU again or anything.
You also said there was zero chance at all of them doing new footage on this movie. More than once.

SO HUH.

Again... We Shall See. Nobody knows a damn thing at this point. Less than we ever did, in fact.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:10 PM   #1506
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You also said there was zero chance at all of them doing new footage on this movie. More than once.
Wait, they are? Where was that said? I thought they confirmed and reconfirmed that they would not be doing additional shoots for it?

If by "new footage" you mean finishing unfinished or uncomposited shots, or "new footage" in that we're seeing 90% a new movie... then yeah.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:27 PM   #1507
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Wait, they are? Where was that said? I thought they confirmed and reconfirmed that they would not be doing additional shoots for it?

If by "new footage" you mean finishing unfinished or uncomposited shots, or "new footage" in that we're seeing 90% a new movie... then yeah.
https://www.ign.com/articles/the-sny...k-henry-cavill

THR reports that stars Henry Cavill, Ben Affleck, Gal Gadot, and Ray Fisher are all participating in the reshoots. With production lasting only a week, it's unlikely these reshoots will dramatically alter the plot or structure of Snyder's version of Justice League. Rather, it's more likely these shots will be used to flesh out existing scenes, add new lines of dialogue and help Snyder transform his movie into a four-part limited series.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:30 PM   #1508
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https://www.ign.com/articles/the-sny...k-henry-cavill

THR reports that stars Henry Cavill, Ben Affleck, Gal Gadot, and Ray Fisher are all participating in the reshoots. With production lasting only a week, it's unlikely these reshoots will dramatically alter the plot or structure of Snyder's version of Justice League. Rather, it's more likely these shots will be used to flesh out existing scenes, add new lines of dialogue and help Snyder transform his movie into a four-part limited series.
Huh, fair enough. I had no idea.

A week is pretty substantial. You can get a lot done in a week, with the right prep.
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Old 09-23-2020, 10:35 PM   #1509
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And this is apparently my new sermon, but WB today is much different than WB two years ago. They are still greenlighting a lot of different projects, but they are actually following through with them now. It's a different team at the top. The last crew was corrupt as ****, with what they did to the JL production in order to serve themselves. Awful executives who's faults shouldn't weigh on the new team.
I think the push for Harley was already in motion
What exactly have they followed through on?

So far, post Justice League, we've only seen Joker, Birds of Prey, Shazam!, Aquaman, and (almost there) Wonder Woman 2.

The Suicide Squad and The Batman with Matt Reeves are also going to happen, because we've seen footage, but anything else they've announced... how is that different than anything they'd previously announced, like The Flash, Cyborg, Green Lantern(s), Nightwing, Batgirl, Booster Gold and Blue Beetle, and probably others I'm forgetting?

Oh, and Amazons and The Trench?

It looks to me like WB hasn't changed that much. They're still throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what sticks.
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Old 09-24-2020, 08:57 AM   #1510
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Aqua: It's really not as simple as all that by itself, but yes, I do think that if they're gonna book four Shazam-related movies before even shooting one just because "We have The Rock!", promise a dozen Quinn movies even AFTER the most recent one completely tanks, and go all-in on 98-lb Twilight Batman, as well as court people like Nic Cage and Val Kilmer to film very expensive cameos in what's supposedly a Flash movie, then sure, I think they can absolutely put the script, costumes, and cast they've already paid for to good use. They were already committed to making JL2 until they weren't. It would be a waste NOT to do it, when starting over would cost them twice as much money, twice as much time, and twice as much hassle.

You're often saying "Logically, this..." and "Financially, that..." when it comes to predicting what they Will, Won't, or Should Do, and all I'm saying is, whether it's the management team of This Year, Two Years Ago or Ten Years Ago or even Twenty Years Ago, what never changes at WB is 1. They'll throw money at the wind without ever seeing a hint of profit and end up with nothing to show for it, that's nothing new to them, and 2. They change their minds with every single passing cloud. And that's why you CAN'T even go there with "Logically This" and "Financially That". WB doesn't operate on logic; not now, not last year, not ANY year. Obviously they LOVE to make money, but again: This is the same company that once paid Tim Burton $20 million to NOT direct a Superman movie. Nah'mean?

All I'm saying is, if it's REALLY about dollars and cents - And it's not that simple, but let's pretend it is - then JL2 makes MORE sense than any alternative. A reboot would cost twice as much and likewise would have no promise whatsoever of getting any better reaction. They can HOPE, but they don't know.

That's all I'm saying. But no, it's not JUST about "They do a bunch of other dumb sh*t too." Partly that. All that definitely doesn't HURT my argument one bit. Again, we'll just have to see.
But let's be real: current WB didn't greenlight a bunch of Harley movies after Bird of Prey failed. That has not happened. It isn't reality.
And again, current WB didn't greenlight four Shazam-related movies. That isn't reality either.
They've announced one Shazam sequel and the Black Adam movie. They'd be fools to not bring Dwayne Johnson into the DCEU movie. That is a savvy decision because the movie will be a hit. It is guaranteed success in a way Justice League 2 is certainly not.

And even if current WB did do those things - which they did not, and I won't hold them to other people's management decisions, I still can't get behind that one stupid decision should lead to another. At some point, the stupidity has to stop, and it has been slowing down dramatically. You can see that in the lack of movie announcements, compared to what was happening a few years ago when management was announcing every movie under the sun:

Cyborg, Batwoman by Joss whedon, HQ + Joker movie, Green Lantern, Justice League Dark, Blue Beetle, you name it... all movies that were said to be in production soon that never happened. Current WB is not doing that. The way the former mgmt treated Zack Snyder and the entire production team who put their hard work into Justice League only to have it blown to smithereens so they could get a bonus...You just aren't seeing that level of malfeasance anymore. In fact, current management are the ones who are responsible for resurrecting this project, my man. If you want to hold their feet to the fire when they are the ones saving the project that the former team cancelled, it seems backwards to me.
I think just by watching DC's recent Fandome event, you get an idea for the care they are putting into the DC universe right now. It's a different ballgame. There are frustrations to be had and it's not all perfect, but it's certainly a world away from the former management.

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What exactly have they followed through on?

So far, post Justice League, we've only seen Joker, Birds of Prey, Shazam!, Aquaman, and (almost there) Wonder Woman 2.

The Suicide Squad and The Batman with Matt Reeves are also going to happen, because we've seen footage, but anything else they've announced... how is that different than anything they'd previously announced, like The Flash, Cyborg, Green Lantern(s), Nightwing, Batgirl, Booster Gold and Blue Beetle, and probably others I'm forgetting?

Oh, and Amazons and The Trench?

It looks to me like WB hasn't changed that much. They're still throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what sticks.
See above. I highlighted some of the ways I feel that current WB management is acting way differently than the former management. Furthermore, I'd add that projects like Flashpoint and Black Adam that were in limbo for years and years at the former management and were probably never going to happen. Now, things are finally moving forward on those projects. Former mgmt drove out Ben Affleck, current mgmt brought him back. Just tossing a few more logs on the fire.

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Old 09-24-2020, 10:48 AM   #1511
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I guess? Just for Rock fans I suppose. I don't know enough about Black Adam that his story will be a huge hit regardless who plays him. Like what villain would he even face? I don't get why he gets his own movie and isn't just the villain of Shazam 2.
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Old 09-24-2020, 10:57 AM   #1512
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It's because he's a proven box office slam. People love him, generally speaking. He seems to be passionate about it as well.

That said, I know next no nothing about the character, so your guess is as good as mine. I don't think that matters much though. Marvel has proven that you can sell audiences on characters they didn't know about. In my post, I used him as a comparison to JL2 because I think it's a more surefire success than JL2 would be. That comes down to production price, critical reception, box office, etc.
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Old 09-24-2020, 11:23 AM   #1513
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Oh, Rock is perfect for Black Adam. I despise the guy in general, but some things just fit.

That said... I can $ee why he'd have hi$ own Black Adam $olo movie - e$pecially because he'$ too expen$ive to "merely" be the villain in $omeone el$e'$ movie - but at the same time, it's rather redundant. All it's gonna do, is make the audience cheer for him during the "Shazam vs. Black Adam" movie despite the fact that he's supposed to be the heel. Especially if they do the whole arc with Isis being murdered and everything. My fear is that they're going to play him as way too sympathetic and "bad-ass" in his own movie, and then when he takes on Billy Batson the audience will be cheering for the wrong guy.

I mean, they could go full-on into the comics and show him being totally ruthless and literally tearing people in half and murdering entire countries with his own two hands, and that would be nice... but even then, I'm afraid of people cheering him. I mean, people cheered when Thomas Wayne got shot in "Joker", it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility. People cry when Superman or Batman kills anyone on-screen, but otherwise if you rip someone in half at the waist in an action movie it makes you the good guy by default.

Like everything else, we'll see what happens. I just don't think it's gonna come off as intended when we finally get to the big slugfest movie.

Also, just for the sake of argument but Rock's had a few tepid releases, same as Will Smith or anyone else. It definitely helps that he's on another upswing right now but he's by no means whatsoever a guaranteed hit. I don't predict that the movies he's in as Black Adam will do poorly, I expect them to do quite well as that's what my gut says, I'm just saying, "There's many a slip twixt a cup and a lip".
----------

I forgot to mention earlier, the theory that Zack's cut of JL on HBO Max will include stuff originally meant for JL2 to tie everything off is entirely plausible and I can definitely see that happening. It's not what I'd prefer, because there was way too much planned for JL2 for all of it to be crunched into a coda for this one, but sure, I can see them doing that just to give JL a sense of being more complete and less of a prologue. Like I could see Darkseid showing up at the very end and them besting him in a brief but definitive battle. It wouldn't quite feel right, I don't think, but I can definitely see that being the case. Especially if they're shooting more footage.

But I also kinda don't see that, because even though I don't know how long this was the plan for but I somehow doubt the reshoots will be incredibly substantial. Henry and Ben would need more than three weeks to get into proper "costume shape", so I think more than anything the new shots will be close-ups and talking head stuff. Connective tissue.

But, we don't know, and that's the exciting part. This was good Birthday news either way.
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Old 09-24-2020, 01:36 PM   #1514
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Oh, Rock is perfect for Black Adam.
He's fine, but... eh, not quite what I'd see for the part. But nobody else I know of quite fits the bill. You'd want like a... 6'4" Persian guy with thick eyebrows and big muscles.

I'm curious... has Whedon even done a single interview about JL since it came out?
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Old 09-24-2020, 02:56 PM   #1516
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Hope you had some fun on your bday Leo.

Yeah, Rock isn't bulletproof. Baywatch did poorly despite his charm. Not sure how that Skyscraper film did.

So apparently Cavill said he isn't doing reshoots. You can't help but wonder after getting him to even support this effort was like pulling teeth. I wonder what the story is there. I might be projecting but I feel like his quote is coming across as "this thing isn't a big deal. Whatever." My perception could be off, idk.

Edit: Ah, Zarius covered it.
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Old 09-24-2020, 04:36 PM   #1517
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Could be as simple as, Superman wasn't in any of the new material/new or extended scenes Snyder had in mind and wasn't even asked. I'm pretty sure Superman isn't even in a lot of this version of the movie.
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Old 09-24-2020, 05:36 PM   #1518
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Zack Snyder's 'Justice League' Reshoots Will Reportedly Cost Around $70 Million https://bit.ly/304ZN4A

Yikes what a waste of money
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Old 09-24-2020, 05:41 PM   #1519
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False/bad reporting, multiple articles have already said the entire process of completing the movie was $70 million including the reshoots. NOT that the reshoots themselves cost $70 million.
-------

As for your editorial comment, this isn't me being a dick but I can't help but wonder why you spend so much time reading/posting news about a thing you outspokenly hate. It's none of my business, it's just something I noticed long ago.

Like, I vehemently hate most Marvel movies, and I may occasionally chime in with a quip or a jab but I don't, like, constantly post news links about stuff having to do with them, on account of I won't watch most of what they make regardless and therefore I don't feel like it's worth the energy. Nah'mean?

I'unno, it's a free country, I just think it's odd is all.
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Hope you had some fun on your bday Leo.
Almost missed that. Thanks. This year I didn't wake up in a jail cell, so it's light years ahead of last year's by default!
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Old 09-24-2020, 08:15 PM   #1520
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False/bad reporting, multiple articles have already said the entire process of completing the movie was $70 million including the reshoots. NOT that the reshoots themselves cost $70 million.
-------

As for your editorial comment, this isn't me being a dick but I can't help but wonder why you spend so much time reading/posting news about a thing you outspokenly hate. It's none of my business, it's just something I noticed long ago.

Like, I vehemently hate most Marvel movies, and I may occasionally chime in with a quip or a jab but I don't, like, constantly post news links about stuff having to do with them, on account of I won't watch most of what they make regardless and therefore I don't feel like it's worth the energy. Nah'mean?

I'unno, it's a free country, I just think it's odd is all.
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Almost missed that. Thanks. This year I didn't wake up in a jail cell, so it's light years ahead of last year's by default!
Naw this year you woke up with Steph McMahon sitting on your face. While the misses films it.
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