The Technodrome Forums

Go Back   The Technodrome Forums > General Forums > General Discussion > Current Events

Notices

View Poll Results: Banning of transgender people from the military
I am for it 3 16.67%
I am for it, as long as it makes the military more effective 0 0%
I am against it 7 38.89%
I am vehemently against it 7 38.89%
I would like to know more data 1 5.56%
Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-31-2017, 11:32 PM   #21
sdp
<<raver>>
 
sdp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: MO
Posts: 5,792
Can we just ban every gender/people from the military?
__________________
@0sdp
TMNT articles @ MiscRave.com
sdp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2017, 11:46 PM   #22
PApagreg
Mad Scientist
 
PApagreg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,027
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdp View Post
Can we just ban every gender/people from the military?
I'm personally happy with cutting the military budget in half but that can work too.

Spoiler:
I was joking with the latter
__________________
PApagreg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 12:33 AM   #23
sdp
<<raver>>
 
sdp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: MO
Posts: 5,792
No. Ban everyone from the military.

__________________
@0sdp
TMNT articles @ MiscRave.com
sdp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:17 PM   #24
BubblyShell22
Leo-holic
 
BubblyShell22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16,913
We need the military to survive because they're the ones protecting us so that we're safe. I may not condone the transgender lifestyle, but I do feel that if someone of that lifestyle wants to serve their country, they should be allowed to do so. Trump is just like any other politician who says one thing and then does another. He said that he was for the transgender community and would protect the rights of the LGBT community and then he goes and says this. He's no different than any other politician out there.

This is why I don't vote, people. You can't trust any of these politicians no matter what they say.
__________________
"A warrior who never fails, never learns."-The Ancient One.

"Embrace your inner a**holiness."-Mr. Anderson.
BubblyShell22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:27 PM   #25
Andrew NDB
Weed Whacker
 
Andrew NDB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Auburn, WA
Posts: 12,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by BubblyShell22 View Post
We need the military to survive because they're the ones protecting us so that we're safe. I may not condone the transgender lifestyle, but I do feel that if someone of that lifestyle wants to serve their country, they should be allowed to do so.
Though to be fair, serving in the Armed Forces isn't and has never been a "right" of any sort.
Andrew NDB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:37 PM   #26
Redeemer
Technodrome Technician
 
Redeemer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: third earth
Posts: 4,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
Though to be fair, serving in the Armed Forces isn't and has never been a "right" of any sort.
I have to agree. The first thing they told us at meps was that this is a "job interview" No matter how good of a soldier you could become if there is something wrong or abnormal (past injury, genetic defect ex:diabetes) they will not take you.

It is not a right to join the military its a privilege. That being said I don't agree with banning transgender people completely from the military. I would get why they would not want them on the frontline, but from the entire military? The only reason I could think from the entire military is if transgenders have to constantly take chemicals (Estrogen/Testosterone).
Regardless it is quite a quagmire.
__________________
GT:Reedeamer
THE TECHNODROME REDESIGN 2015
http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=51594
Redeemer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:43 PM   #27
BubblyShell22
Leo-holic
 
BubblyShell22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Indiana
Posts: 16,913
You both have a point but they shouldn't be banned from serving their country if they want to do so. That would be like banning a black person from the military because of their race or banning someone for their religion or lack of religion.
__________________
"A warrior who never fails, never learns."-The Ancient One.

"Embrace your inner a**holiness."-Mr. Anderson.
BubblyShell22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:54 PM   #28
dl316bh
Hench Mutant
 
dl316bh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
Though to be fair, serving in the Armed Forces isn't and has never been a "right" of any sort.
It's a volunteer military, though, so I find the idea of turning away able bodied people who want to serve and could do their job well for a reason like being transgender downright silly and counterproductive. There were excuses for segregation of blacks in the armed forces up until the 1950's, once upon a time, as well as the more recent discrimination of gays in the military. Eventually, the old ways died off. Didn't exactly hurt us.
__________________
dl316bh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:56 PM   #29
Andrew NDB
Weed Whacker
 
Andrew NDB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Auburn, WA
Posts: 12,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by dl316bh View Post
It's a volunteer military, though
Not precisely. I couldn't join any Armed Forces right now if I wanted to.
Andrew NDB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 04:57 PM   #30
dl316bh
Hench Mutant
 
dl316bh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
Not precisely. I couldn't join any Armed Forces right now if I wanted to.
Well, okay, you're right on that, it's not entirely open. They can disqualify you for age and serious health issues, of course. But you get my point.
__________________
dl316bh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 05:01 PM   #31
plastroncafe
PerfectlyTunedFightEngine
 
plastroncafe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: The Upsidedown
Posts: 6,717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
Not precisely. I couldn't join any Armed Forces right now if I wanted to.
Yes precisely.
You could still volunteer, that doesn't mean they're required to take you.
__________________
------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike Spiegel View Post
So your wants and needs as a fan should outweigh everyone else's?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
A lot just get older and older and angrier and angrier, all the while waiting for the world to bend to their whim, never, ever really being satisfied with any of the "victories" achieved at large and wondering why no one outside of whatever construct bubble they've placed themself [sic] (look, I did it!) in wants to mess with them.
plastroncafe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 05:11 PM   #32
Redeemer
Technodrome Technician
 
Redeemer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: third earth
Posts: 4,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by BubblyShell22 View Post
You both have a point but they shouldn't be banned from serving their country if they want to do so. That would be like banning a black person from the military because of their race or banning someone for their religion or lack of religion.
They actually ban people for certain beliefs already. White Supremacist/ Black Panther ect....

Like I said before I think they have an argument for ban on the ground of chemical dependency as I mentioned before.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dl316bh View Post
It's a volunteer military, though, so I find the idea of turning away able bodied people who want to serve and could do their job well for a reason like being transgender downright silly and counterproductive. There were excuses for segregation of blacks in the armed forces up until the 1950's, once upon a time, as well as the more recent discrimination of gays in the military. Eventually, the old ways died off. Didn't exactly hurt us.
I never understood the banning of the gay community at all. As I said before if a transgender person is reliant on chemical for transition or to maintain a certain look then I understand the ban bc it is a chemical dependency, but I have no experience with transgender transition and what they have to do after. I assume they would have to constantly take testosterone and estrogen for the rest of their life, but I maybe wrong which is why I could understand a ban, but to ban them for any other reason is stupid.
__________________
GT:Reedeamer
THE TECHNODROME REDESIGN 2015
http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=51594
Redeemer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 08:29 PM   #33
ProactiveMan
Spooky ghost
 
ProactiveMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 2,001
I think anyone who wants in should have the opportunity to try. Not to say everyone gets in, but some of the blanket bans don't make sense to me. I know two people who tried to join in their early 20s and were turned away because they had a history of asthma. Neither one was still asthmatic, but the rule said no one who had asthma could join the army. It struck me as silly, because both of these guys were very fit and athletic.
ProactiveMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2017, 08:36 PM   #34
Utrommaniac
It only took 30 years
 
Utrommaniac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Texas, US
Posts: 3,221
I don't think "chemical dependency" will matter when it comes to non-soldiers, or anyone who isn't working out in the field. That would probably make up a very, very tiny percentage.

And even then, I think at least a few of those might be willing to put a hold on transitioning for at least a little while. That being an even smaller percentage or that tiny percentage.

But rather than making assumptions, maybe we should look into how trans people actually served in the military and learn from their experiences?
__________________
Utrommaniac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2017, 04:16 PM   #35
Redeemer
Technodrome Technician
 
Redeemer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: third earth
Posts: 4,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProactiveMan View Post
I think anyone who wants in should have the opportunity to try. Not to say everyone gets in, but some of the blanket bans don't make sense to me. I know two people who tried to join in their early 20s and were turned away because they had a history of asthma. Neither one was still asthmatic, but the rule said no one who had asthma could join the army. It struck me as silly, because both of these guys were very fit and athletic.
That sucks, but if they have a history of Asthma then they may have another Asthma occurrence in Basic which is why they are no allowed in. It sucks to hear, but your friends should have told the recruiters they were misdiagnosed. Also for childhood Asthma you might be able to get a waiver if the individual has not had Asthma symptoms for years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Utrommaniac View Post
I don't think "chemical dependency" will matter when it comes to non-soldiers, or anyone who isn't working out in the field. That would probably make up a very, very tiny percentage.

And even then, I think at least a few of those might be willing to put a hold on transitioning for at least a little while. That being an even smaller percentage or that tiny percentage.

But rather than making assumptions, maybe we should look into how trans people actually served in the military and learn from their experiences?
Unfortunately people with diabetes cannot join either, if you are diagnosed with ADHD you cannot join either. If you rely on a chemical at all whats so ever you cannot join and I assume that bc of the strict restrictions of drugs on bases.
__________________
GT:Reedeamer
THE TECHNODROME REDESIGN 2015
http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=51594
Redeemer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2017, 04:22 PM   #36
Andrew NDB
Weed Whacker
 
Andrew NDB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Auburn, WA
Posts: 12,035
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redeemer View Post
Unfortunately people with diabetes cannot join either, if you are diagnosed with ADHD you cannot join either. If you rely on a chemical at all whats so ever you cannot join and I assume that bc of the strict restrictions of drugs on bases.
Yeah, or maybe you're stuck out somewhere, pinned down for days, possibly weeks and you can't get your meds. Probably those kinds of situations aren't good for anybody.
Andrew NDB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2017, 10:51 PM   #37
ProactiveMan
Spooky ghost
 
ProactiveMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 2,001
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redeemer View Post
That sucks, but if they have a history of Asthma then they may have another Asthma occurrence in Basic which is why they are no allowed in. It sucks to hear, but your friends should have told the recruiters they were misdiagnosed. Also for childhood Asthma you might be able to get a waiver if the individual has not had Asthma symptoms for years.
Makes sense. S'funny, one of them tried to join the police force that same year. He passed all the physicals and fitness requirements, but washed out of the psych evaluation every time because he kept getting speeding tickets between attempts. Apparently they grill you really hard about stuff like that along the lines of 'why you don't think you have to obey the law?!' I guess he didn't have a convincing answer.
ProactiveMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2017, 04:24 PM   #38
eskater
Foot Soldier
 
eskater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 146
Speaking as someone who remembers the repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't tell", I can say not a lot of people on the ground in the Marine Infantry didn't really care all that much.
Having said that I do remember when they wanted to start integrating women in the infantry there being (and to some extent is) a HUGE controversy over that....so I do think this would be some sort of quasi-extent of even that issue honestly (even though I personally feel that is a non-issue as well).
I think it's safe to say that most people on this forum would probably be against the ban (for the record so am I) but having several old buddies who are or were in combat orientated units I can tell you they aren't so keen to change and are especially not keen to civilians telling them how their units should be ran or integrated.
Friend once told me that ultimately every job in the Corps is orientated to one thing and anything that interferes with that is a non-issue. The cost argument is weak at best, and any person who thinks the diagnosis of "gender dysphoria" or that "they're confused argument" is legit I challenge them to post not just an "article" but several scientific ones that we may read to be properly informed and even then I'll be skeptical just because I know the DSM-5 can be a bit of a mess sometimes. But coming as someone that understands the warrior mindset of those men I get why
Gen. Mattis had this brought up and he deflected by leaving 6 months for he himself to make a decision about it....and now even Gen. Dunford is saying he's gonna wait until he gets a proper directive from the White House. So the message I get from them is that, it's not an issue.
The only issue I see is an orange puppet sticking his two cents into an issue he knows little about, and the culture (especially in combat related units) having an issue with people (who are already serving) possibly threatening their masochistic culture.
If this was a real issue (transgender people in the military that is) it would have been brought up awhile ago....like possibly when they repealed DADT.
__________________
Fortuna Favet Fortibus
eskater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2017, 04:39 PM   #39
eskater
Foot Soldier
 
eskater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Utrommaniac View Post
I don't think "chemical dependency" will matter when it comes to non-soldiers, or anyone who isn't working out in the field. That would probably make up a very, very tiny percentage.

And even then, I think at least a few of those might be willing to put a hold on transitioning for at least a little while. That being an even smaller percentage or that tiny percentage.

But rather than making assumptions, maybe we should look into how trans people actually served in the military and learn from their experiences?
I don't even think "chemical dependency" is something that would be that much of an issue in garrison at least. I know people with all types of mental disabilities that make them rely on meds, the only time it'll come up is if they are ever called up for a deployment and even then I think more on combat deployments honestly. I imagine most transgender people who have served would give a similar answer honestly.
This whole "controversy of transgenders in the military" is really a non-issue for me.
__________________
Fortuna Favet Fortibus
eskater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2017, 09:00 PM   #40
mrmaczaps
Mad Scientist
 
mrmaczaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,544
The military, in every portion of it, is like that line from the first MJB movie: only the best of the best fof the best. People who have any kind of illmess, sickness cannot and should not serve. Transgenderism still falls into the mentally unfit for duty. You join the military, its about the military and not you or your needs. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or one. It has zero to do with anything else. Top of the line skils. Top of the line standards. No time off for endless sensitivity training. You join to become part of a machine to do one of two things, kill or be killed for your country. Feelings are irrelevant.
__________________
Mr Maczaps
Mr Maczaps Comics
Mr Maczaps: The Collection
Mr Maczaps Comics on Facebook
Shellback on Facebook
Turtle Power Entertainment

Email me at: mrmaczapscomics@gmail.com

Looking for: SNES TMNT and any other video games. Also Movie Star Mikey giant nunchucks! Two! CHEAP! *not buying right now, but plenty to trade* #damntumor

Buy from MyComicShop.com
mrmaczaps is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.