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Old 07-12-2019, 05:25 PM   #1
hypered1
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IDW: volume 5 or not volume 5?

So I haven't seen this discussed on here, but I've seen the IDW run sometimes referred to as 'Volume V / 5' as if it continues from the Mirage/ Image run. I personally don't agree with this line of thought (it's a totally new storyline) but I was curious as to what everyone thinks of this suggestion.
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Old 07-12-2019, 05:40 PM   #2
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It is by no means Volume 5. The only series' referred to in that format are the respective chunks that represented Mirage's overall continuity.

IDW, like Archie, or Dreamwave, is just it's own thing.
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Old 07-12-2019, 05:41 PM   #3
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Rich will disagree but in no way, shape or form is this TMNT Vol. 5. Whole different universe and there was even a couple of new issues of Vol. 4 that came out simultaneously to the IDW series. And hell, Vol. 4 isn't even technically cancelled, or over... Peter could drop 3 issues at Christmas for all we know.
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Old 07-12-2019, 05:42 PM   #4
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If we're going by the logic that it's a book published in the USA simply under the title "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" without anything like "Adventures", "Tales of" or "Universe" attached, then IDW's TMNT would actually be the sixth series with that title.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 1984) 62 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 1993) 13 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Image 1996) 23 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 2001) 32 issues (possibly more coming but it's unlikely).
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Dreamwave 2003) 7 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (IDW 2011) 100+ issues.

So technically, you could call this series "Volume 6", if you really wanted. But like others have said, it's not a continuation of anything which makes that terminology a bit unfitting (though in-universe it's impled that the IDW-verse might be a be split timeline from the Mirage world that has been further screwed up due to patching up after a bunch of reckless time travel). I don't like the "Volume" terminology myself because it gets confusing wheter you're talking about the issue numbering or the trade numbering.

If you really feel like you need an easy way to differentiate the book from any previous iteration, I might suggest you simply call it "IDW TMNT". And if IDW ends up rebooting or simply starting over with a new issue 1, then it might be best to call it "TMNT 2011".
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Old 07-12-2019, 05:48 PM   #5
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Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 2001) 32 issues (possibly more coming but it's unlikely).
The title of Vol. 4 is technically "TMNT: Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles." But who cares.
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Old 07-12-2019, 11:32 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
Rich will disagree but in no way, shape or form is this TMNT Vol. 5. Whole different universe and there was even a couple of new issues of Vol. 4 that came out simultaneously to the IDW series. And hell, Vol. 4 isn't even technically cancelled, or over... Peter could drop 3 issues at Christmas for all we know.
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Originally Posted by neatoman View Post
If we're going by the logic that it's a book published in the USA simply under the title "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" without anything like "Adventures", "Tales of" or "Universe" attached, then IDW's TMNT would actually be the sixth series with that title.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 1984) 62 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 1993) 13 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Image 1996) 23 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Mirage 2001) 32 issues (possibly more coming but it's unlikely).
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (Dreamwave 2003) 7 issues.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (IDW 2011) 100+ issues.

So technically, you could call this series "Volume 6", if you really wanted. But like others have said, it's not a continuation of anything which makes that terminology a bit unfitting (though in-universe it's impled that the IDW-verse might be a be split timeline from the Mirage world that has been further screwed up due to patching up after a bunch of reckless time travel). I don't like the "Volume" terminology myself because it gets confusing wheter you're talking about the issue numbering or the trade numbering.
In my opinion, trying to label the the six main TMNT iterations (Mirage, Mirage, Image, Dreamwave, Mirage, IDW) with a numbered Volume designation based on storyline continuation, universe, or content is much too subjective. Whether the content of a series is or isn't TMNT "canon" can differ from one person to the next. I really can't disagree with most of the arguments for or against certain iterations of the Turtles' comics being included / excluded from the "Volume" numbering designation based on storyline alone.

Most (if not all) of my arguments for the IDW series being "Volume 5" has to do with categorization in a database from the title. Strictly in terms of ordering of the six main TMNT series', I do agree that the IDW series isn't fifth and should not really be Volume 5 but instead Volume 6. So, why didn't I label the IDW series as Volume 6?

When you have a single publisher (the same publisher...Mirage), it's easy to label a new series of "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" (subsequent to the previous) a new Volume (Volume 2, 3, etc.). However, when different publishers come into the mix, it can muddy the waters. A "TMNT" series under a new publisher could easily become branded as a new Volume 1, as happened with the Dreamwave series. But, because the Image TMNT series had already earned the Volume 3 designation when the Dreamwave series came out, that's when I think things started to get tricky for categorization and numbering of TMNT "Volumes."

The Image series being known as Volume 3 and then the Dreamwave series being branded as a reboot "Volume 1"...those are the things that threw everything off in terms of database categorization. Given the Dreamwave series self-labeled itself as "Volume 1" instead of just naturally becoming "Volume 4" (since it was the fourth series), it actually became the second "Volume 1" for "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles." That (and storyline) essentially separated itself from the two previous Mirage volumes (1 & 2) and Image volume (3) strictly in terms of categorization. In addition, the Dreamwave series lasted only 7 issues and so it's kind of an anomaly in terms of both categorization and story line. When Mirage's next TMNT series came out after the unsuccessful Dreamwave series, it quickly became known as Volume 4; this was clearly because TMNT fans wanted to ignore or forget the Dreamwave series even happened AND because the Dreamwave series was self-labeled as Volume 1 - easy to just ignore as a "Volume" number). So, when the IDW series was added, the next logical "Volume" number (strictly in terms of numbering) was "Volume 5." Naming it "Volume 6" when no "Volume 5" existed seemed much too confusing. And that's why the IDW series became "Volume 5." If IDW were to stop the current "TMNT" series and then re-launch with a new series (a new #1), then that series would become "Volume 6."

I hope all this makes sense. I don't disagree with any of the arguments for the IDW series being Vol. 6 or even being "IDW TMNT" or whatever else. But, factually speaking, it's simply the fifth "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" ongoing series that didn't "self-brand" itself with a "Volume" designation. Had the Dreamwave series not branded itself "Volume 1" then the current IDW TMNT series would have been "Volume 6" in my database and the TMNT volume widely known as "Volume 4" would have actually been "Volume 5."
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Old 07-13-2019, 08:06 AM   #7
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Ok, so we all seem to be coming from the same perspective and to be honest I think it was Rich's site that I first saw the Vol 5 tag being used for the IDW series and other places have probably mimicked this at a later date.
That being said the Dreamwave run definitely doesn't count as it's based on the 2003 tv series much like the Archie comic originated with the 1987 cartoon.
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Old 07-13-2019, 02:16 PM   #8
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Different continuities are not the same volumes, it's not that complicated.
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Old 07-13-2019, 02:25 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
Different continuities are not the same volumes, it's not that complicated.
Out of curiosity, is this how you would classify the Volumes of the six TMNT titles?

- Mirage - TMNT Volume 1
- Mirage - TMNT Volume 2
- Image - TMNT Volume 3
- Dreamwave - TMNT Volume 1
- Mirage - TMNT Volume 4
- IDW - TMNT Volume 1
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Old 07-13-2019, 03:11 PM   #10
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Yeah what? That's like saying the PD movies are parts 5 and 6 of the 1990 plus 2009 films.
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:36 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by rich View Post
Out of curiosity, is this how you would classify the Volumes of the six TMNT titles?

- Mirage - TMNT Volume 1
- Mirage - TMNT Volume 2
- Image - TMNT Volume 3
- Dreamwave - TMNT Volume 1
- Mirage - TMNT Volume 4
- IDW - TMNT Volume 1
Yeah, that's basically the system I use.
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:41 PM   #12
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Yeah what? That's like saying the PD movies are parts 5 and 6 of the 1990 plus 2009 films.
When you say PD movies I assume you mean the Michael Bay films? A little off topic, but from what I've heard the three 1990's films (and possibly the 2007 CGI film) precede 'The Next Mutation' series.
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Old 07-13-2019, 07:25 PM   #13
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I dunno. I see the volume number just literally meaning "we started this **** over again for a new number 1"... vol #, issue 1...

Call it vol 5 or vol 6, its the sixth new series of tmnt.... ��*♂️
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Old 07-13-2019, 09:10 PM   #14
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When you say PD movies I assume you mean the Michael Bay films? A little off topic, but from what I've heard the three 1990's films (and possibly the 2007 CGI film) precede 'The Next Mutation' series.

I do mean that and yeah technically Eastman wanted them to, but it doesn't make sense because Shredder and many other things are inconsistent.
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