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Old 08-21-2015, 01:32 PM   #101
CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy
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Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87 View Post
We have to agree to disagree about Two Face. He was not given enough screen time as Two Face. Just for two scenes worth and that was it. Disappointing. All that build and not much pay off. Similar to how Venom was done. One thing I always liked about Two Face was he was married yet throwing in this triangle with Bruce and Rachel may add to this particular take I missed the angle from the comics.

The Punisher is not Daredevil's enemy. They are on opposite ends of the philosophical debate over whether one should kill the enemy and if so is just as bad as one they are attempting to stop. Matt realized this in 3pisode 9 when he went after Kingpin for the sole reason to kill him. He changed his mind after the encounter and talk with Foggy. Some heroes have no problem with killing(Wolverine, Wonder Woman) and while others do (Batman, Spider-Man, Superman). So there will be conflict but not because of The Punisher being a villain, he is an anti-hero. In the comics Punisher debuted in the pages of Amazing Spider-Man#129 and like Kingpin after a few appearances tended to find his story mesh more with Daredevil.
I'll give you that as a character, "TwoFace" was barely in the movie. It was all Harvey Dent. For me, that's okay... he never interested me with his gimmicks in the comics; only time he was cool to me was "The Long Halloween", "Hush", and "One Year Later." It was AWESOME the way Great White Shark drove him back to being TwoFace... and Batman was a d!ck for not trusting Harvey.

I can't remember, but has it been confirmed or just rumored that Bullseye will be in Season 2?

The conflict of kill/no-kill is, for me, what makes me love Jason Todd as a character. I love seeing him fester hatred for Bruce allowing the Joker to live after killing him, because honestly, Jason is right. Joker should be killed. But this is comics, after all, and you can't kill off your rogues gallery... you'd eventually have nobody left but White Rabbit and the Tweedle Twins or other losers.
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Old 08-21-2015, 06:49 PM   #102
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I'll give you that as a character, "TwoFace" was barely in the movie. It was all Harvey Dent. For me, that's okay... he never interested me with his gimmicks in the comics; only time he was cool to me was "The Long Halloween", "Hush", and "One Year Later." It was AWESOME the way Great White Shark drove him back to being TwoFace... and Batman was a d!ck for not trusting Harvey.

I can't remember, but has it been confirmed or just rumored that Bullseye will be in Season 2?

The conflict of kill/no-kill is, for me, what makes me love Jason Todd as a character. I love seeing him fester hatred for Bruce allowing the Joker to live after killing him, because honestly, Jason is right. Joker should be killed. But this is comics, after all, and you can't kill off your rogues gallery... you'd eventually have nobody left but White Rabbit and the Tweedle Twins or other losers.
Bullseye is confirmed to appear, but actor is unclear at this point. Jason Satham was on talks for the role but backed out after out when reported Netflix wanted him for the role as he thought it gave him leverage for a bigger paycheck because of massive enthusiasm.

As for killing off The Joker, Batman could give the court a good enouhh case to put bim down insanity plea or not and if neccessary I am sure the governor can persuade state congress to create legislation to leglly put down The Clown Prince of Crime. Besides as good of character as he may be I am tired of him.

I would have liked the surgically repaired Harvey Dent to stay that way. It was a good concept and an unpredictable allly. Good Two Face stories can be found in Batman#234, 328-329, 440-442 along wirh what you previously mentioned.
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Old 08-21-2015, 08:54 PM   #103
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Bullseye is confirmed to appear, but actor is unclear at this point. Jason Satham was on talks for the role but backed out after out when reported Netflix wanted him for the role as he thought it gave him leverage for a bigger paycheck because of massive enthusiasm.
Oh, that's right! I completely forgot about all that. Yeah, Statham would've KILLED it as Bullseye. Season 2 is gonna be SICK.

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As for killing off The Joker, Batman could give the court a good enouhh case to put bim down insanity plea or not and if neccessary I am sure the governor can persuade state congress to create legislation to leglly put down The Clown Prince of Crime. Besides as good of character as he may be I am tired of him.
I love Joker when he's done right. Endgame was pretty cool, Death of the Family was also pretty cool... but for me, definitive Joker is "The Dark Knight."

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I would have liked the surgically repaired Harvey Dent to stay that way. It was a good concept and an unpredictable allly. Good Two Face stories can be found in Batman#234, 328-329, 440-442 along wirh what you previously mentioned.
Are those stories collected in any TPBs that you know of? That's how I read my comics. (TMNT excepted, because who can wait six months after "Attack on Technodrome"?)
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Old 08-21-2015, 09:58 PM   #104
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The conflict of kill/no-kill is, for me, what makes me love Jason Todd as a character. I love seeing him fester hatred for Bruce allowing the Joker to live after killing him, because honestly, Jason is right. Joker should be killed. But this is comics, after all, and you can't kill off your rogues gallery... you'd eventually have nobody left but White Rabbit and the Tweedle Twins or other losers.
And Superman could solve every problem on Earth, including homelessness, hunger, and disease, theoretically. Even Bruce Wayne himself, with literally ALL the money (seriously... if you really pay attention to the comics, he HAS to be as rich as half the planet's billionaires combined to be able to pull off everything he does), is kind of an idiot to waste it on his Batman-ing instead of using his wealth and status to attack the root causes of crime instead of just going out at night to beat up poor people. Y'know?

That's why you can't apply any kind of "real world" logic to super-heroes. It doesn't work. It's fantasy and should be treated as such. Batman letting Joker live so he can keep killing people makes Batman the bad guy. Clearly. That's why you're NOT supposed to actually have characters IN-STORY point out what a moron he is. It breaks the fiction. You can't have someone point out, "Hey, Superman! With your advanced technology and ability to see things at a sub-cellular level, you could single-handedly wipe out cancer!" because then he's forever an asshole for NOT doing that.

Capes-and-tights fiction is not the place to be squeezing in too many "deep" thoughts about morality or social justice. Nothing good comes of it. Jason Todd should not be pointing out to the reader how stupid and impotent the Batman character really is. Batman is the supposed hero of the book. There's a time for "deconstruction" and there's a time to realize who your audience is and that you're doing them a disservice if you sacrifice the very stuff that makes super-heroes "work" - the fact that it's pure, complete, totally impossible fantasy - for the sake of snarkily pointing out how none of it makes any sense when viewed through the lens of "reality".
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Old 08-21-2015, 10:23 PM   #105
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Oh, that's right! I completely forgot about all that. Yeah, Statham would've KILLED it as Bullseye. Season 2 is gonna be SICK.



I love Joker when he's done right. Endgame was pretty cool, Death of the Family was also pretty cool... but for me, definitive Joker is "The Dark Knight."



Are those stories collected in any TPBs that you know of? That's how I read my comics. (TMNT excepted, because who can wait six months after "Attack on Technodrome"?)

Yes, it is a missed opportunity. We can blame premature leaking on that one. Wait until the contract is signed then report greed or not.

Batman#440-442/New Teen Titans vol.2#60-61 is A Lonely Place of Dying that reunites Bruce and Dick and introduces Tim while Two Face strikes. Its in trade form, but honestly you can find each issue at the LCS for a dollar or two. Batman#234 is collected in various Neal Adams illustrated editions. Batman#328& 329 however is not unfortunately and is probably a favorite Two Face story. Its printed in 1981 and probably goes for $8-$12 dollars if its in Fine or better shape. It is worth the price to me considering I have a classic batman title run, but you probably do not. Still if you like Two Face I would get it. I can always recommend Batman related reads to you via PM or another thread.

As for trades I only read Spider-Man in trades since that is how I started reading the characters as I have all the ASM and PP,SSM collected in Marvel Essentials.

So who do we know will appear in Daredevil season 2?

Punisher
Elektra

Villains:
Mysterio
Stilt Man

Who else? I know another villain or two has been mentioned.
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Old 08-21-2015, 10:51 PM   #106
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Yes, it is a missed opportunity. We can blame premature leaking on that one. Wait until the contract is signed then report greed or not.

Batman#440-442/New Teen Titans vol.2#60-61 is A Lonely Place of Dying that reunites Bruce and Dick and introduces Tim while Two Face strikes. Its in trade form, but honestly you can find each issue at the LCS for a dollar or two. Batman#234 is collected in various Neal Adams illustrated editions. Batman#328& 329 however is not unfortunately and is probably a favorite Two Face story. Its printed in 1981 and probably goes for $8-$12 dollars if its in Fine or better shape. It is worth the price to me considering I have a classic batman title run, but you probably do not. Still if you like Two Face I would get it. I can always recommend Batman related reads to you via PM or another thread.

As for trades I only read Spider-Man in trades since that is how I started reading the characters as I have all the ASM and PP,SSM collected in Marvel Essentials.

So who do we know will appear in Daredevil season 2?

Punisher
Elektra

Villains:
Mysterio
Stilt Man

Who else? I know another villain or two has been mentioned.
I think what I'm most interested in are picking up the unresolved plot points from Season 1:

Who did Karen kill before and why?
What was Black Sky, why was he a child, and what was going to happen with him?
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Old 08-21-2015, 10:57 PM   #107
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I think what I'm most interested in are picking up the unresolved plot points from Season 1:

Who did Karen kill before and why?
What was Black Sky, why was he a child, and what was going to happen with him?
Black Sky, he was a suicide bomber and the mob was going to use it there advantage. Stick killed him to prevent further dead. Case closed right?

As for Karen's backstory, yes that is something I am interested in seeing as long as it does not follow the certain path that Frank Miller took her down and eventually brings her six feet lower than she should be. I wonder if The Owl will get involved considering his father being involved in Kingpin's underworld dealings and his father double crossing him for the greater good of Kingpin's own empire leading his demise. Not to mention if Kingpin finds out it was Karen who killed his only friend after Wesley kidnapped her of course.

Hope you look for the Two Face stories. If you are a fan of the character I doubt those three recommendations could let you down.
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Old 08-21-2015, 11:00 PM   #108
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And Superman could solve every problem on Earth, including homelessness, hunger, and disease, theoretically. Even Bruce Wayne himself, with literally ALL the money (seriously... if you really pay attention to the comics, he HAS to be as rich as half the planet's billionaires combined to be able to pull off everything he does), is kind of an idiot to waste it on his Batman-ing instead of using his wealth and status to attack the root causes of crime instead of just going out at night to beat up poor people. Y'know?

That's why you can't apply any kind of "real world" logic to super-heroes. It doesn't work. It's fantasy and should be treated as such. Batman letting Joker live so he can keep killing people makes Batman the bad guy. Clearly. That's why you're NOT supposed to actually have characters IN-STORY point out what a moron he is. It breaks the fiction. You can't have someone point out, "Hey, Superman! With your advanced technology and ability to see things at a sub-cellular level, you could single-handedly wipe out cancer!" because then he's forever an asshole for NOT doing that.

Capes-and-tights fiction is not the place to be squeezing in too many "deep" thoughts about morality or social justice. Nothing good comes of it. Jason Todd should not be pointing out to the reader how stupid and impotent the Batman character really is. Batman is the supposed hero of the book. There's a time for "deconstruction" and there's a time to realize who your audience is and that you're doing them a disservice if you sacrifice the very stuff that makes super-heroes "work" - the fact that it's pure, complete, totally impossible fantasy - for the sake of snarkily pointing out how none of it makes any sense when viewed through the lens of "reality".
Different types of storytelling for different audiences; myself, I like my fiction as close to reality as it can get. Some level of suspension of disbelief required always, but it's a lot easier understanding why Batman doesn't kill Joker in "The Dark Knight" than it is in "Under the Red Hood."
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Old 08-21-2015, 11:13 PM   #109
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I get what you're saying, but again, things that absolutely can't be satisfactorily resolved within the narrative of a fictional story need to be conveniently left off the table and not discussed, or else it unravels it. Since everyone reading the story knows beyond the shadow of a doubt that Batman will never kill the Joker, or any of his villains, because then they sell fewer lunchboxes (in addition to making the hero the bad guy), there's no reason to even bring it up within the context of the fictional story. Bringing it up actually breaks the suspension of disbelief, because it reminds you exactly WHY he won't: Because they have to sell toys with these characters and there has to be a perpetual status quo. We all know that, but it's positively stupid to point it out so blatantly. It's just the writer trying to point out how much smarter they are than the audience, frankly. "Isn't Batman stupid for never killing the bad guys?" "Yes. I've been trying to ignore it for 75 years worth of stories, actually, and just have some fun with this whole idea, but you keep pointing this stuff out for the sake of being 'realistic'."

It's just a bad way to write comic books, basically. It's not a matter of a "different audience", it's that super-hero stories in particular are about wish-fulfillment and escapism by their basic design, not about constructing entire storylines around pointing out how "unrealistic" they are. We get that it's implausible and silly; it's implicit, pointing it out just makes the writer look like a guy who resents his job and wishes he was doing something more "sophisticated". Guys like Chuck Austen, for example. F*****ck that guy.
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Old 08-21-2015, 11:29 PM   #110
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Black Sky, he was a suicide bomber and the mob was going to use it there advantage. Stick killed him to prevent further dead. Case closed right?
Yes, but he was some sort of MYSTICAL suicide bomber (I'm assuming). Was it poison, psychic, what? I really want to find out more... Season 2! Bring back the Hand!

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I get what you're saying, but again, things that absolutely can't be satisfactorily resolved within the narrative of a fictional story need to be conveniently left off the table and not discussed, or else it unravels it. Since everyone reading the story knows beyond the shadow of a doubt that Batman will never kill the Joker, or any of his villains, because then they sell fewer lunchboxes (in addition to making the hero the bad guy), there's no reason to even bring it up within the context of the fictional story. Bringing it up actually breaks the suspension of disbelief, because it reminds you exactly WHY he won't: Because they have to sell toys with these characters and there has to be a perpetual status quo. We all know that, but it's positively stupid to point it out so blatantly. It's just the writer trying to point out how much smarter they are than the audience, frankly. "Isn't Batman stupid for never killing the bad guys?" "Yes. I've been trying to ignore it for 75 years worth of stories, actually, and just have some fun with this whole idea, but you keep pointing this stuff out for the sake of being 'realistic'."

It's just a bad way to write comic books, basically. It's not a matter of a "different audience", it's that super-hero stories in particular are about wish-fulfillment and escapism by their basic design, not about constructing entire storylines around pointing out how "unrealistic" they are. We get that it's implausible and silly; it's implicit, pointing it out just makes the writer look like a guy who resents his job and wishes he was doing something more "sophisticated". Guys like Chuck Austen, for example. F*****ck that guy.
Yes, but it seems that in the last decade or more, audiences in general demand more realism in their stories. I know I do, and appreciate Nolan's work more than Burton's. In many cases, it resonates with us more. Not always, of course, but many times.
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Old 08-21-2015, 11:55 PM   #111
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They think they do. Truth is "the audience" generally doesn't know what it wants.

To wit: They claim they want "realism" in super-hero comics, but many of those exact same people will generally frown upon it in super-hero movies (Nolan's trilogy aside). Have we all noticed this, or just me? That's a rather odd contradiction happening collectively within the same faction of people, no? The opposite of what they claim to want actually makes more sense: To have more "realism" and grounding in a physical 3-dimensional space where things are actually happening in real life (and costing a ton of money to produce), and have more fantastical and whimsical stories take place within the pages of a comic book where the only "budget" is page count and imagination. Yet people always get confused, and demand super-hero comic books that are deconstructionist, down-to-Earth, and "real" (with people who fly, mind you), and super-hero movies like Marvel's that are unabashed fantasy and spectacle, while turning up their nose at something like BvS (and even some folks will say it about Nolan's films) dismissing it as "too gloomy", "no fun", and "missing the point of the characters and the medium".

They think they want "more realistic" super-hero fiction. Problem is most of them aren't sure about where it's appropriate to take that approach, because most people who read aren't also people who write. You can get away with it to a point in a certain medium, like Nolan's films for example, that are self-contained. You can't reasonably get all deconstructionist and meta-fictional in the context of a comic book where the stories never end and the entire point is to make people buy it each month. Pointing out to them how repetitive and pointless the entire story is, is the absolute LAST thing you want to be pointing out as a writer, in that position. "Look how silly it is that Batman keeps letting the Joker get away! He's responsible by proxy for every murder Joker's ever done!" "Hey, yeah, good point. This is stupid, I think I'll do something else with my time." As a writer you don't want to pull that thread, if your goal is to contribute to the ongoing narrative and not just to point out how clever you are compared to everyone who's handled that character before you got there.

It's funny, too, that all the people who are praised as being among the best at "realistic" super-hero fiction, like Miller and Moore, go out of their way to point out how that's NOT what they're doing, they're doing the exact opposite and deconstructing "Deconstructionism", and the people reading the books don't get it even then once it's explained to them. Then you get people who DO do "realism", like Azzarello, and you let them actually try and write super-heroes, and they're unquestionably terrible at it, because it's the exact opposite of the kind of stuff they actually write!

I'unno, man. A Reese's is a Reese's because it's got just the right amount of chocolate and peanut butter. Too far either way and you're not doing it right.
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Old 08-22-2015, 03:37 AM   #112
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Black Sky might be a In-human since Marvel is pushing for them on the big screen (gotta take the second best when there is no mutants ) Or, he might be some kind of half-demon, or a incarnation of The Beast since he was a rarity and it's hard to find more Black Skies.

Someone mentioned on a discussion forum about Black Sky, that It'll be explored more in the Iron Fist show, but I found no source.
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Old 08-22-2015, 11:40 AM   #113
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We have to agree to disagree about Two Face. He was not given enough screen time as Two Face. Just for two scenes worth and that was it. Disappointing. All that build and not much pay off. Similar to how Venom was done. One thing I always liked about Two Face was he was married yet throwing in this triangle with Bruce and Rachel may add to this particular take I missed the angle from the comics.

The Punisher is not Daredevil's enemy. They are on opposite ends of the philosophical debate over whether one should kill the enemy and if so is just as bad as one they are attempting to stop. Matt realized this in 3pisode 9 when he went after Kingpin for the sole reason to kill him. He changed his mind after the encounter and talk with Foggy. Some heroes have no problem with killing(Wolverine, Wonder Woman) and while others do (Batman, Spider-Man, Superman). So there will be conflict but not because of The Punisher being a villain, he is an anti-hero. In the comics Punisher debuted in the pages of Amazing Spider-Man#129 and like Kingpin after a few appearances tended to find his story mesh more with Daredevil.
Would you like to see Spider-Man as a guest on this show since he is back with Marvel Studios? maybe they should do an episode with Bruce Banner and do a recreation of Trial of the Incredible Hulk with Banner accused of hurting someone when Bullseye actually hurted someone but not the Hulk.
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Old 08-22-2015, 12:39 PM   #114
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Would you like to see Spider-Man as a guest on this show since he is back with Marvel Studios? maybe they should do an episode with Bruce Banner and do a recreation of Trial of the Incredible Hulk with Banner accused of hurting someone when Bullseye actually hurted someone but not the Hulk.
I would like that as we will see Mysterio a traditional Spider-Man villian of course the Kingpin connection. It makes alot of sense for him to. Will it happen? I doubt it. It will come down to the specifics of the contract agreement between Sony and Marvel.

Hey Jake,I left a reply for you over in your Denny O'Neil's Batman thread.
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Old 08-25-2015, 07:58 PM   #115
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Here is a better look at the season 2 costume.
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/08...d-suit-marvel/
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Old 08-26-2015, 01:10 AM   #116
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Looks different
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Old 08-26-2015, 07:24 PM   #117
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This could serve as inspiration of some of what we will see in the next season.
http://collider.com/best-daredevil-p...arvel-universe
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Old 08-27-2015, 11:25 AM   #118
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Darn, I was hoping he'd get his logo this season.
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Old 08-31-2015, 05:55 PM   #119
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Another bone on the currently filming season 2 of Daredevil. Such a long wait from when its filmed to when its released. They love to torture us with waiting...ugh.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/08/...r-matt-murdock
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Old 09-04-2015, 05:18 PM   #120
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Blake Tower, a NYC D.A. is said to be added to the Daredevil cast for season 2. From the way the article reads he is indirectly replacing Ben Urich as Daredevil's information source and will be made diverse. For those that are fan of the comic, who is this character and what has he done of note as a Daredevil supporting cast member?
http://www.cinemablend.com/televisio...n-2-83437.html
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Raphael: Sheesh, Mikey this ain't a cartoon!
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