Should the Franchise Be Going In the Opposite Direction?

[miru]

I do wonder if the franchise should explore the trippy, somber feel of the original comics some more. Would be interesting to see something like ?Old Times? again.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by miru

I do wonder if the franchise should explore the trippy, somber feel of the original comics some more. Would be interesting to see something like ?Old Times? again.

Yeah, a million people on this forum feel the way you do. Most of the older TMNT fans are sick of all this childish crap.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by PizzaPower1985

Yeah, a million people on this forum feel the way you do. Most of the older TMNT fans are sick of all this childish crap.

Ninjas that can't kill. Goofy stuff. Toy-driven stuff. Blegh. I mean, I stopped caring when the sale happened but I can't start caring until there's a turnaround. But I doubt anyone up top cares about people like me, or the audience this could benefit. As in, people over the age of 5.

[Voltron]

Why should they? They'll make more money aiming at kids. This is how the free market works.

I don't think it would be a bad idea to have a kickstarter to see if we can't generate some more mature content for interested readers. It's a shame that portions of the fandom get left behind.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

Ninjas that can't kill. Goofy stuff. Toy-driven stuff. Blegh. I mean, I stopped caring when the sale happened but I can't start caring until there's a turnaround. But I doubt anyone up top cares about people like me, or the audience this could benefit. As in, people over the age of 5.

I agree completely. The frachise's return to greatness will definitely not happen on its current trajectory... I sometimes feel like writing a screenplay... it's on my agenda at some point... to show people exactly what I think TMNT should and could be, if we as fans and creators just abandon the "Nickelodeon mentality."

[Toxin45]

Originally Posted by PizzaPower1985

I agree completely. The frachise's return to greatness will definitely not happen on its current trajectory... I sometimes feel like writing a screenplay... it's on my agenda at some point... to show people exactly what I think TMNT should and could be, if we as fans and creators just abandon the "Nickelodeon mentality."

I mean mirage had some early installment weirdness. like volume 4 has not been completed and probaly never will be. We have the last ronin with laird and eastman doing this story.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by Toxin45

I mean mirage had some early installment weirdness. like volume 4 has not been completed and probaly never will be. We have the last ronin with laird and eastman doing this story.

Indeed. Mirage started doing the stories away from the focus of the main story... The art got cartoony around issue 16, and despite some good stories after issue 12 of volume 1, the story didn't really resume until Return to New York. Mirage is notorious for its weirdness and absurdity BUT when it's great it's F*CKING FANTASTIC.

If I were to write a film treatment it would be a very street level story... like an early Hong Kong flick or something... and if, in my wildest dreams, it ever got made would probably have to be shot in 16 mm to give it the low budget/gritty look.

I don't know...
As far as what TMNT is, what it should be or what it has become, it would be very difficult for me, or any professional filmmaker to top that first movie.

[Toxin45]

Originally Posted by PizzaPower1985

Indeed. Mirage started doing the stories away from the focus of the main story... The art got cartoony around issue 16, and despite some good stories after issue 12 of volume 1, the story didn't really resume until Return to New York. Mirage is notorious for its weirdness and absurdity BUT when it's great it's F*CKING FANTASTIC.

If I were to write a film treatment it would be a very street level story... like an early Hong Kong flick or something... and if, in my wildest dreams, it ever got made would probably have to be shot in 16 mm to give it the low budget/gritty look.

I don't know...
As far as what TMNT is, what it should be or what it has become, it would be very difficult for me, or any professional filmmaker to top that first movie.

Mirage volume 1 seemed to be the most remembered but volume 2,3and 4 were not as remembered along with both volumes of tales of the tmnt

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by Toxin45

Mirage volume 1 seemed to be the most remembered but volume 2,3and 4 were not as remembered along with both volumes of tales of the tmnt

Mirage Vol. 1 is the most remembered because issues 1-12, Return to New York, The River (3 part story), Sons of the Silent Age, Masks, Shades of Grey and City At War (and various issues of Tales Vol. 1) are the best things EVER to come out of Mirage. Vol. 2 didn't have much to recommend it except for Tales Vol. 2 and Volume 4 started late in franchise history and went unfinished so very few people either know it exists or care to check it out.

At the end of the day, when we boil it all down, when all is said and done, Mirage Vol. 1 will be THE THING to read and be remembered for.

[miru]

Originally Posted by PizzaPower1985

Mirage Vol. 1 is the most remembered because issues 1-12, Return to New York, The River (3 part story), Sons of the Silent Age, Masks, Shades of Grey and City At War (and various issues of Tales Vol. 1) are the best things EVER to come out of Mirage. Vol. 2 didn't have much to recommend it except for Tales Vol. 2 and Volume 4 started late in franchise history and went unfinished so very few people either know it exists or care to check it out.

At the end of the day, when we boil it all down, when all is said and done, Mirage Vol. 1 will be THE THING to read and be remembered for.

Indeed so. Tales Vol. 2 as well is great to go with it. Also, I feel like DanganRonpa captures a lot of that somber, dreamlike feel of Mirage.

[D-ray]

Sadly, the TMNT franchise has taken the "kids" route abit too much in recent year, making things too goofy.
It's impossible to ask something in a more "mature" way.

However, Batman vs TMNT was kinda mature (comparated to what has been seen in recent years) giving us a little hope for that kind of content.
Or even better, DC might buy the TMNT franchise again!
(It's a bit of a douche phrase, but I always hated how Nick treated the TMNT)

[AquaParade]

Viacom is seemingly afraid to risk what they have to obtain something greater. This could be an MCU-level property. If Guardians can do it, TMNT can. But they have to step out of the kiddie-pool and figure out how to make the turtles interesting again for our demographic.

I do get the feeling the reigns have been slowly loosening up, following the failure of "Out of the Shadows" and "Rise...". Diminishing returns on the kiddie-stuff. We'll see how mature "TLR" turns out to be, but Batman v TMNT was a good sign.
Viacom can cover the toddler base with Spongebob anyway...TMNT is a property that could cover a lot of untapped ground for them if they choose to take the leap. I suspect they are eyeing it out slowly.

[Leo656]

Originally Posted by Voltron

Why should they? They'll make more money aiming at kids. This is how the free market works.

I don't think the approach is paying off. We know that Nick made a ton of money the first couple of years - way more than they paid for the property - but things are decidedly in a downturn, now. "Rise" failed to draw a crowd, now the suits are floundering, wondering what to do... completely oblivious to all the 30- and 40-year olds who are willing to drop a car payment on eBay for TMNT toys.

The 5-year olds aren't the ones who spend money on this brand, their parents are. Kids go through fads, and right now TMNT is just one more fad rather than the "evergreen" property it's supposed to be. Because once those 5-year olds turn 10, there is NO reason for them to stick with the brand unless they want to get made fun of for liking "little kiddy crap", which no kid likes going through.

Also, you're misinterpreting how the "free market" actually works. You're supposed to simply put your products on the market and let the audience take what they want. They're NOT doing that. Rather, they're putting out ONE flavor of products and telling everyone who doesn't like it that they're no longer welcome to be part of the fanbase at all. Their approach is the OPPOSITE of what the free market would encourage. And it's incredibly shortsighted on their end.

They'll eventually hit the same issue Disney did with Star Wars where they kinda realize they screwed up, and they might even try to walk it back, but I'm not inclined to think so. They'll shelve it, allow NECA and Playmates to peddle toys, and then every ten years they'll just aim at a new crop of 5-year olds, and wonder why they can't "grow" the property and make even more money with it. Nick, as a rule, doesn't care about anyone too old to buy "Make Your Own Slime" kits. The wrong Evil Corporation bought the brand, and that's just the way it is.

Originally Posted by AquaParade

Viacom is seemingly afraid to risk what they have to obtain something greater. This could be an MCU-level property. If Guardians can do it, TMNT can. But they have to step out of the kiddie-pool and figure out how to make the turtles interesting again for our demographic.

Viacom can cover the toddler base with Spongebob anyway...TMNT is a property that could cover a lot of untapped ground for them if they choose to take the leap. I suspect they are eyeing it out slowly.

Well-spoken.

[miru]

I feel like that, for now (hopefully), the 2012 series is the peak of the franchise. It being as good at it was, even with the controversial rough patches and hanging plot threads, was likely a miracle.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by miru

I feel like that, for now (hopefully), the 2012 series is the peak of the franchise. It being as good at it was, even with the controversial rough patches and hanging plot threads, was likely a miracle.

Yeah, that kind of thing comes down to subjectivity and preference. The older fans are going to say the pinnacle or peak is the more serious stuff, the 1990 movie probably, while the younger fans will probably appreciate that 2012 show.

[sdp]

We don't have enough OT stuff, we need more OT. Season 11 retconning the red sky seasons, new video games of the OT, more OT merchandise (we're doing ok with this but we need more). New show based on the OT, and a new movie following the OT, first movie can be season 1, second movie Eye of Sarnath etc. Please, more OT Nick, I hope you're listening, we're in a drought right now, it makes me so mad how we the OT fans are being ignored hardcore at the moment.

[PizzaPower1985]

Originally Posted by sdp

We don't have enough OT stuff, we need more OT. Season 11 retconning the red sky seasons, new video games of the OT, more OT merchandise (we're doing ok with this but we need more). New show based on the OT, and a new movie following the OT, first movie can be season 1, second movie Eye of Sarnath etc. Please, more OT Nick, I hope you're listening, we're in a drought right now, it makes me so mad how we the OT fans are being ignored hardcore at the moment.

Everything has been largely based on the OT since Nickelodeon bought the franchise. The 2012 CGI cartoon, it's plots, tone and characters were greatly inspired by the OT series. The 2 newer live action films were took most of their ideas from the OT series. Most new toys are OT based as well. What more are you after?