06-19-2020, 06:31 AM | #61 | |
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Quote:
Fred Wolf, Archie:
IDW
Nick
Second PD movie:
Rise
That's basically it. Generally speaking, Mirage has the simplest rules, IDW has the most complex and Nick has the least amount of rules (pretty much none). |
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06-19-2020, 08:07 AM | #62 | |
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Maybe that could have been an explanation for what happened to Mutagen Man. Bacteria doesn't exactly provide much to go on for a new physical form. But then every mutated creature should have turned into that. lol Although COVID-Antman as a villain sounds like a good pandemic themed superhero movie. Gotta stop that evil super Also, if Donnie tinkers with the same mutagen for a minute it could turn Turtles into humans. (So... human DNA required...? Ancient humans? ) Last edited by IndigoErth; 06-19-2020 at 08:13 AM. |
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06-19-2020, 09:14 PM | #63 |
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The way the second PD movie described it was so stupid my brain hurt as I watched the movie. I think even the 2012 cartoon's logic wasn't that bad. how does one human have ancestral rhino genes and another have ancestral warthog genes....just...no.
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06-19-2020, 09:51 PM | #64 |
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I can genuinely go both ways on this issue and it's all been said already but I do feel that all this discussion and debate does highlight how important it is for new versions of the property not to skip the origin.
Like there is important stuff that needs to be laid down for TMNT to work like how the mutagen works, what is it's purpose etc. Whether Splinter is Yoshi's pet or Yoshi himself may seem trivial but it does fundamentally alter his relationship with their primary antagonist. Jumping in and sorting out the details later may seem lime a good idea to jump to the good stuff but we Nederland the basics nailed down first. |
06-19-2020, 09:58 PM | #65 |
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Makes me laugh to be honest, because it sounds like it was written by someone who hasn't a single clue how evolution works. Like they did just two seconds of "research" on it and landed on a creationist site's wacky and wholly inaccurate "explanation" on that "theory" they reject.
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06-20-2020, 01:05 AM | #66 | |
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Then I would have bought Bebop and Rocksteady's transformation at lot easier rather than saying that they somehow possess Rino or Warthog genes. |
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06-20-2020, 07:26 AM | #67 |
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The second PD movie is easily the worst depiction of the mutagen ever. FW and Nick might have inconsistant results across the board the point of almost having no rules, but at least I can the necessary building blocks are present so you can see the logic. Makes no sense why it would make a chicken brain bigger when it otherwise targets the entire body, why it would make a cat into a pile of ice cream when it otherwise operates on DNA or why it would turn a car into a monster when it's... not a living being and has no DNA to work with. But at least I can say that a brain, ice cream and a car are present in those instances. There is no way in hell that a human being has enough DNA in common with a Rhino to become a Rhino monster.
All they had to do was have Krang say "mix in DNA to make it work" and then depict Baxter add in "Rhino" and "Warthog" vials to the mixture. That's all they had to do in order to not be entirely retarded. |
06-20-2020, 07:46 AM | #68 |
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What's very telling, at least to me, is the fact that based on what we've seen, we the audience are clearly not expected to give a sh*t about any of this stuff, when most of us clearly do. But we're obviously not supposed to, because they're so haphazard with their presentation of the subject of "ooze"/mutagen that no two out of a half-dozen or more disparate versions of the sh*t in over 30 years work the same at all. Based on how inconsistent it is, one could assume that, in the minds of the writers, it's the least important thing in the entire story, when clearly to many of us who read and view that is not the case at all.
I mean, no TMNT writer on any book, movie or TV show has ever come out and said "Don't worry about it, it's Magic", but that's clearly how they look at it when they write the stories.
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06-20-2020, 08:28 AM | #69 | |
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Now, does that mean they can do whatever the hell they want with it? I think so. I don't think the ooze is supposed to have much meaning beyond, oh, it transformed our terrible terrapins and lowly lil' rat vermin into humanoid ninjas. I think consistency isn't important in relation to ALL the incarnations, as long as its function makes sense for a particular story/incarnation. |
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06-20-2020, 08:53 AM | #70 |
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Oh, my mistake, then. That definitely indeed sounds like he just said "It's Magic."
Ah well. I can't say I'm surprised.
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06-20-2020, 09:45 AM | #71 |
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I don't really care about the origins of mutagen but its very important for the way it works to make sense. Otherwise you could just say mutagen is Phoenix Down and bring people back from the dead. And on that note I suspect its best to keep what it can do very limited. At least for more "mature" versions of tmnt story telling.
Like okay yeah if you want to sell toys then that mutagen is going to be an elixir of bullsh*t and miracles. But personally I don't want it to behave that way. |
06-20-2020, 09:52 AM | #72 | |
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06-20-2020, 10:33 AM | #73 | |
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Aaahahaha! I want this on a TMNT shirt. A fabulously self aware one done for humor. Last edited by IndigoErth; 06-20-2020 at 10:39 AM. |
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06-20-2020, 10:11 PM | #74 |
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Not like they made a remake recently or anything.
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06-21-2020, 02:10 AM | #75 |
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Phoenix Down have been a revival potion in other incarnations of final fantasy such as 8, 9, 10, X2, and 12 so it's more of a reference to the final fantasy franchise in general, not just 7.
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06-21-2020, 07:43 AM | #76 | |
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Although, to be fair, Magic also comes with some expecations (see "magic systems") but I don't see much in terms of self-contradiction when it comes to this particular area. Even if there was, you can still go with the idea that the humanoids are aliens or cryptids. |
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06-21-2020, 08:38 AM | #77 |
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Jagwar's origins are... interesting.
It's all a work. What really happened with Juntarra was more like that scene near the end of "Clerks II", just with a jaguar instead of a donkey. But of course she's not gonna tell her KID that's how he was conceived. Man, that must've been one crazy Yom Kippur.
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06-23-2020, 03:04 PM | #78 |
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My preference is for Splinter to have originated as an ordinary rat, rather than as Hamato Yoshi. However, I thought that the original cartoon handled him originating as Yoshi very well.
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06-23-2020, 03:22 PM | #79 | |
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Anyway, I did remember there is a story in which Splinter allows himself to get possessed by a ghost who explicitly has the power to transfer centuries of martial arts experience into other people. Don't think that's inteded to be a factor in his abilities, but it's worth consideration. Spoiler:
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06-23-2020, 04:18 PM | #80 | |
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