Pro Wrestling Discussion

[Coola Yagami]

So does Lesnar need to retain at Summerslam or has he already broken Punk's record?

[AT-Man]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

So does Lesnar need to retain at Summerslam or has he already broken Punk's record?

According to wikipedia today is the day he tied Punk's record 434 days.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by AT-Man

According to wikipedia today is the day he tied Punk's record 434 days.

Just a day after Punk took a pummeling.

Maybe this is God's way of trolling Phil.

[dl316bh]

That's with the Universal championship, though. Punks record is with the WWE championship. They're not doing it with that anytime soon because it would take a year and a half to get the job done. It also means less because, regardless of title, Brocks defended the Universal belt, like, six times total in what will be close to a year and a half by Summerslam, two of those in the same month. Say what you want about the lackluster second half of Punks title reign, dude was always around with it and defending it about once a month, barring the month or so he had to let a minor injury heal.

If someone's gonna successfully cash in on Brock, I hope it's Finn. He deserves it the most.

I like Finn and I'm hoping he holds the title again at some point, but I'm waiting for him to really do something before I start looking for him to win any titles. I feel like he's been sort of fading into the background recently, killer IC title matches with Seth and others aside. Whether that's as a face or with a heel turn is fine with me, just do something with him, I guess. Give him a feud where he seems to feel something or invest in, rather than just smile and laugh it off.

I'd be interested in seeing him turn, though. Embrace a darker side of himself and bring back the demon as a thing he does, maybe re-contextualized through his heel character. He's only pulled out the Demon paint twice on the main roster, after all.

All that said, I won't be particularly upset if it is Finn that wins the briefcase. I just ask they do something with him before the cash-in. And man, just no with the "briefcase holder loses all the time". I don't know who gave Vince the idea that it makes the cash-in more surprising, but it doesn't.

[MikeandRaph87]

You know, WWE has not been promoting Brock held the universal title for xxx days. It seems like the company would or is the title in limbo and WWE does not know what to do with it? Roman should have just gotten in beforehand. Not because I am a fan of his, but because Brock holding the title has made it irrelevant with his lack of presence. This is worse than Hogan dropping a title to get it back IMHO.

[The Deadman]

Kane Says His Character Was Originally Meant For Only One Match
https://411mania.com/wrestling/kane-...ant-one-match/

[dl316bh]

Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87

You know, WWE has not been promoting Brock held the universal title for xxx days.

Yeah, that's part of why I think people are way overthinking the Punk record thing. We've seen what happens when WWE wants to erase a record from the books for petty reasons already. At least twice now. AJ Lee and Demolition, just off the top of my head. They talked up how close the records were to being broken for like two months beforehand both times, letting you know damn well they were breaking that record and implanting the new one in your brain through repetition. When WWE decides to get petty, they go all the way. I'm not sure Vince McMahon knows subtlety anymore, if he ever did.

Plus, I mean, it was a cool statistic and "longest WWE title reign since Hogans first" is a cool thing for sure, but it wasn't really a record anyway.

It seems like the company would or is the title in limbo and WWE does not know what to do with it? Roman should have just gotten in beforehand.

I think the idea was to get sympathy for Roman and hopefully turn the crowd around on him by giving him some good, high profile defeats. It's likely as simple as that. It's just that, like everything they've tried, it didn't work. I mean, Roman's really unique in this position. Let's not sleep on the fact that they've used tricks that have pulled crowds behind faces since long before even Hogan. Wrestlemania this year was unbelievably blatant. They set aside the no blood rule to go old school gutsy babyface, struggling through with a crimson mask but showing grit and heart against high odds. That trick's almost sure fire and it whiffed hard. Then there's the Greatest Royal Rumble, where Roman got "screwed" out of the title. It's been suggested to be a botch, but Roman getting off the cage wall so quick and how hard they've ridden that talking point suggests to me it was planned.

If they go with someone else at SummerSlam, all's well that ends well, but if they try the third Brock vs Roman match this year the whole thing has been pointless.

Not because I am a fan of his, but because Brock holding the title has made it irrelevant with his lack of presence.

Brock not being around is an issue that's plagued the title, but it hasn't truly become relevant yet for reasons other than just him. The Universal title hasn't really had a defining title run or signature classic title matches. Finn had it for a day before relinquishing due to injury, Kevin Owens had it for half a year but he wasn't exactly an effective champion during his run and Goldberg was a feel good transitional champion. I think they wanted Brock to be the first definitive champion, but it hasn't worked out partly because Brocks ring work these days is rather lazy and unexciting and because of the scattershot title defenses. As for the key matches, it's had only three in its history that you'd hold up; the inaugural title match, Brock and Goldbergs quick hoss fest and the fatal four way at last years SummerSlam.

This is worse than Hogan dropping a title to get it back IMHO.

If you're talking about Luger winning the title and dropping it back like a week later, let's not get hyperbolic. That nonsense was peak Hogan. Let the guy get the win, but immediately invalidate it and make him look like a goober. This was also during the period and title reign where Hogan defended almost as much as Brock. Big difference was Hogan was at least around more, even if he mostly just cut twenty minute closing promos saying the same basic stuff.

Kane Says His Character Was Originally Meant For Only One Match

Good call all around. Vince had a marketable wrestler with a gimmick that worked and Kane got a twenty one year - and counting - career out of it. Probably up there with one of the more successful gimmick changes in history, actually. He wasn't exactly going places before he got the Kane gimmick.

[Coola Yagami]

I think AJ was still fresh in people's minds when they had Nikki break her streak. I'm not even sure if WWE would even want to mention CM Punk's name when it comes time to break his record.

[MikeandRaph87]

https://www.cagesideseats.com/platfo...uper-show-down

WWE continues to reach a more global market as it did with Saudi Arabia. The Super Showdown in Melbourne featuring the main event of The Undertaker vs Triple H.

[ZariusTwo]

Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87

the main event of The Undertaker vs Triple H.

End of (another) era

[dl316bh]

The easiest thing in the world to do right now is have Braun come out and say "at SummerSlam, Brock Lesnar GETS THESE HANDS", win the Universal title clean at the show in front of a hype crowd, then move on with Braun having a great accolade under his belt that will help him.

So why am I afraid they're going to muddy the waters and have, like, another Brock vs Roman match where Braun cashes in on whoever wins?

Edit from after Raw: F***, they're doing exactly that.

I wish someone would come out one of these times and say to Roman "Bro, you're not the uncrowned anything, you're a failure, he pinned you clean twice and even if you won at the Greatest Royal Rumble it would have been a freak accident, making you a joke champion, so chill the hell out because you sound like a total joke".

[Coola Yagami]

Why waste time with multi person event to decide who faces Brock if we all know Roman will win and face Brock at Summerslam? Why waste everyone's time? Just announce he's the next contender and be done with it. Or have someone else win.

I mean c'mon! Extreme Rules isn't here yet and we already know its gonna be Reigns vs Lesnar at Summerslam.

[MikeandRaph87]

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

Why waste time with multi person event to decide who faces Brock if we all know Roman will win and face Brock at Summerslam? Why waste everyone's time? Just announce he's the next contender and be done with it. Or have someone else win.

I kept watching for Roman last night,but did not see him last night.

I read that his match against Mahal did not go over well. Was it just present fans don't for either wrestler?

[ZariusTwo]

Who's bright idea was it to give Ziggler the IC title?

[dl316bh]

Someone who very clearly hates us all.

I was annoyed about it last night, but how I feel as a whole depends on what happens with the title defense next week. If Seth takes it back and it's a story thing, like, "if you defend every week, sometimes you get caught", I can live with it. Especially if it's an angle where McIntyre decides Dolph is just dead weight who got lucky and murks him, since it seems like they're subtly teasing McIntyre realizing he doesn't need this guy. If not, they ended the best Intercontinental title reign they've had in a decade to hand it to a wrestler I feel is so irreparably damaged he can't really be rehabbed. Dude's not going to help keep the IC title feeling prestigious. He's arguably one of the worst multiple time IC title holders in the belts history.

Originally Posted by MikeandRaph87

I kept watching for Roman last night,but did not see him last night.

I read that his match against Mahal did not go over well. Was it just present fans don't for either wrestler?

Roman popped up to whine for a bit about being the "uncrowned Universal champion" and Bobby Lashley, bless him, he came out and he tried. He did his best to promo. But promo he could not. They really ought to just keep him quiet and kick ass if they want to do something with him. Actually, you could say that for both guys. Point is you didn't miss much. It happened somewhere in the middle of the show.

As for the match, Roman Reigns is a pariah at this point and his reactions are particularly bad this year, so it's no big shock. Having Mahal in there with him didn't help, though, but I think it only really left it so the crowd had no one to root for, which for that crowd is not a great idea. Add in that it was in Chicago, a city known for hating corporately manufactured "products" in wrestling with a zeal only old school ECW crowds matched, and I don't know why they booked the match at all. I guess you can't leave Roman off the card if you want to keep pretending he's the big star of your company, but they were practically begging for what happened.

--------------------

https://411mania.com/wrestling/wwe-releases-big-cass/

WELP

I don't know why this surprised me, but it did!

[ZariusTwo]

Wow, Vince has blocked ROH's MSG debut

http://www.ringsidenews.com/2018/06/...sg-debut-fall/

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by dl316bh

Someone who very clearly hates us all.

I was annoyed about it last night, but how I feel as a whole depends on what happens with the title defense next week. If Seth takes it back and it's a story thing, like, "if you defend every week, sometimes you get caught", I can live with it. Especially if it's an angle where McIntyre decides Dolph is just dead weight who got lucky and murks him, since it seems like they're subtly teasing McIntyre realizing he doesn't need this guy. If not, they ended the best Intercontinental title reign they've had in a decade to hand it to a wrestler I feel is so irreparably damaged he can't really be rehabbed. Dude's not going to help keep the IC title feeling prestigious. He's arguably one of the worst multiple time IC title holders in the belts history.


Roman popped up to whine for a bit about being the "uncrowned Universal champion" and Bobby Lashley, bless him, he came out and he tried. He did his best to promo. But promo he could not. They really ought to just keep him quiet and kick ass if they want to do something with him. Actually, you could say that for both guys. Point is you didn't miss much. It happened somewhere in the middle of the show.

As for the match, Roman Reigns is a pariah at this point and his reactions are particularly bad this year, so it's no big shock. Having Mahal in there with him didn't help, though, but I think it only really left it so the crowd had no one to root for, which for that crowd is not a great idea. Add in that it was in Chicago, a city known for hating corporately manufactured "products" in wrestling with a zeal only old school ECW crowds matched, and I don't know why they booked the match at all. I guess you can't leave Roman off the card if you want to keep pretending he's the big star of your company, but they were practically begging for what happened.

--------------------

https://411mania.com/wrestling/wwe-releases-big-cass/

WELP

I don't know why this surprised me, but it did!

I remember chants of 'This sucks!!' And the audience didn't even bother to do the yay/boo thing when Reigns and Mahal were trading punches. It was weird seeing them do that without a reaction.

[dl316bh]

Originally Posted by ZariusTwo

Wow, Vince has blocked ROH's MSG debut

http://www.ringsidenews.com/2018/06/...sg-debut-fall/

I think it's less "blocked" and more "Madison Square Garden got what they wanted, so they don't need RoH anymore". I figured from the start the whole thing was a ploy to get WWE to the table and get them to actually do things with the arena with, worst case, them simply opening up to others if they didn't get some concessions. They were talking about how unhappy they were WWE wasn't using them for anything during all their big PPV events. WWE has too much history in MSG with it being the "home arena" and I guess they knew that.

Which sucks for RoH, because they got caught in the middle, but if their lawyers are good they might be able to get a date out of it anyway or at least some compensation.

Originally Posted by Coola Yagami

I remember chants of 'This sucks!!' And the audience didn't even bother to do the yay/boo thing when Reigns and Mahal were trading punches. It was weird seeing them do that without a reaction.

So, I might as well ask you and everyone else this, since it's sort of come up.

Is it just me, or have Reigns matches and segments started getting really quiet?

Outside of Wrestlemania and Chicago, I feel like the crowds just aren't reacting much anymore. At first I thought it might have been because my TVs volume was too low, but I've been getting that impression too often for me to think it's coincidence. If so, are crowds finally falling into apathy and not reacting to him at all (worst case scenario for WWE)? Or are they just turning down crowd mics as a matter of course now?

[Coola Yagami]

Originally Posted by dl316bh

I think it's less "blocked" and more "Madison Square Garden got what they wanted, so they don't need RoH anymore". I figured from the start the whole thing was a ploy to get WWE to the table and get them to actually do things with the arena with, worst case, them simply opening up to others if they didn't get some concessions. They were talking about how unhappy they were WWE wasn't using them for anything during all their big PPV events. WWE has too much history in MSG with it being the "home arena" and I guess they knew that.

Which sucks for RoH, because they got caught in the middle, but if their lawyers are good they might be able to get a date out of it anyway or at least some compensation.


So, I might as well ask you and everyone else this, since it's sort of come up.

Is it just me, or have Reigns matches and segments started getting really quiet?

Outside of Wrestlemania and Chicago, I feel like the crowds just aren't reacting much anymore. At first I thought it might have been because my TVs volume was too low, but I've been getting that impression too often for me to think it's coincidence. If so, are crowds finally falling into apathy and not reacting to him at all (worst case scenario for WWE)? Or are they just turning down crowd mics as a matter of course now?

I kinda think WWE lowers the volume every time they boo Reigns heavily. That's why most of the time you'll notice the volume dip whenever his theme song hits.

[ZariusTwo]

Vader has passed away


https://twitter.com/itsvadertime/sta...47703418408960