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Old 07-12-2017, 11:46 AM   #21
GoldMutant
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Because he's Batman.... or "The Goddamn Batman" for a certain incarnation.
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Old 07-17-2017, 06:40 AM   #22
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I'm not sure I'm seeing it. The movies are great, but the Christian Bale Batman could barely even fight off dogs. If the "BATMAN CAN DO ANYTHING" thing was born around then, it wasn't because of anything that happened in those movies.
Pretty much this!

"Batman has no limits."
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:19 PM   #23
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I've read a couple of Batman comics (Hush, Under the Red Hood, Long Halloween) and when Batman is in his own comic book, by himself, we don't see much that side of him.

He seems to be characterized this way when working with the Justice League, or other super-heroes.
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Old 07-18-2017, 02:02 PM   #24
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I felt they got him right in the Animated Series but I'm the minority that says even TAS has flaws.
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Old 09-30-2017, 10:55 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Avenger View Post
I've read a couple of Batman comics (Hush, Under the Red Hood, Long Halloween) and when Batman is in his own comic book, by himself, we don't see much that side of him.

He seems to be characterized this way when working with the Justice League, or other super-heroes.
I think they feel the need to establish that he can stand on the same level with beings like Superman/Green Lantern/etc. despite not having "actual" superpowers.

But, at this point it's been well established that he can and does stand toe-to-toe with them, and his array of gadgets, martial arts techniques, detective skills, and scientific know-how basically count as super-powers anyway. There's really no need to keep drilling into our heads that he's on the same level. We already know.

And, it's getting to where he's not just "as good" as powered heroes, he's "better". I have no problem with Batman being able to beat Superman, when the two have a fight (I prefer them getting along, though). But, I have a problem with Batman always beating Superman when they fight.

Anyway, I think the seed was planted back in Miller's "Dark Knight Returns", but Andrew's probably right that Morrison's JLA run cemented it in.

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Batman's been overcompensating for decades, it's nothing new. If anything the Nolan movies tried to humanize the God King of Mary Sues.
I'd give the title "God King of Mary Sues" to Wolverine actually.
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Old 09-30-2017, 11:18 AM   #26
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I'd give the title "God King of Mary Sues" to Wolverine actually.
Wolverine might be over-powered, but he's not a Sue.
Sue's are the best at all things. Wolvie's just the best at what he does.
While Bruce Wayne is super rich, handsome, and the most eligible bachelor in Gotham City...if not the US, Wolverine is a short, stocky, Canadian guy without so much as a pot to piss in.

He might be overpowered, but he's not a Sue.
Same goes for Deadpool.
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:17 PM   #27
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No complaints about Deadpool.

But, I don't think it gets much more sue-ish than Wolverine's ridiculously complicated "mysterious origin" story. He's hundreds of years old, but he doesn't remember any of it, and he's been in every war, oh and he's also a samurai for some reason (despite not being Japanese), and he's been experimented on to get a metal skeleton, and he's been a part of essentially, every Marvel Superhero team (even though he's supposed to be a "loner"), even the Fantastic Four.

He's a different kind of Mary Sue than Batman (more of an "Angsty Sue", though Batman might qualify too), but I would say he takes the cake over all.

Though, we are talking superheroes. I guess a little bit of Sue-ness is part of the genre. The real problem, I think is the way DC and Marvel over-promote these characters to pander to their fanbases. Does Batman really have to appear in every DC comic, and does Wolverine have to appear in every Marvel?
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:36 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Tetsu Deinonychus View Post
No complaints about Deadpool.

But, I don't think it gets much more sue-ish than Wolverine's ridiculously complicated "mysterious origin" story. He's hundreds of years old, but he doesn't remember any of it,
How is tha Mary sue-ish

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and he's been in every war, oh and he's also a samurai for some reason (despite not being Japanese),
The dude has enhance strength, stamina, speed, reflexes, senses, and healing factor why would't he join a few wars here and there also there has been examples of white and black samurai in history.

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and he's been experimented on to get a metal skeleton, and he's been a part of essentially, every Marvel Superhero team (even though he's supposed to be a "loner"), even the Fantastic Four.
So, Spiderman has been in every superhero team but he isn't a Mary sue.

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He's a different kind of Mary Sue than Batman (more of an "Angsty Sue", though Batman might qualify too), but I would say he takes the cake over all.

Though, we are talking superheroes. I guess a little bit of Sue-ness is part of the genre. The real problem, I think is the way DC and Marvel over-promote these characters to pander to their fanbases. Does Batman really have to appear in every DC comic, and does Wolverine have to appear in every Marvel?
Again not really while Wolverine is a good fighter and strategist but hes far from the best in the MU. Batman meanwhile not only knows every martial art but has an in depth knowledge to every science discipline known to man, hell give Wolverine some credit if the problem is a math equation or science problem he would be screwed, Batman meanwhile would figure it out in under 5 seconds.
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Old 10-08-2017, 07:03 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Tetsu Deinonychus View Post
No complaints about Deadpool.

But, I don't think it gets much more sue-ish than Wolverine's ridiculously complicated "mysterious origin" story. He's hundreds of years old, but he doesn't remember any of it, and he's been in every war, oh and he's also a samurai for some reason (despite not being Japanese), and he's been experimented on to get a metal skeleton, and he's been a part of essentially, every Marvel Superhero team (even though he's supposed to be a "loner"), even the Fantastic Four.

He's a different kind of Mary Sue than Batman (more of an "Angsty Sue", though Batman might qualify too), but I would say he takes the cake over all.

Though, we are talking superheroes. I guess a little bit of Sue-ness is part of the genre. The real problem, I think is the way DC and Marvel over-promote these characters to pander to their fanbases. Does Batman really have to appear in every DC comic, and does Wolverine have to appear in every Marvel?

Wolverine LIVED in Japan for several years and had samurai training during that time. Also the only teams he has been part of were the X-Men, X-Force, Avengers and maybe one or two others. All at different times (Except X-Men and Avengers. Those were concurrent.) Yes his powers are a bit over the top at times but he has never had the over-blown Sueishness that Bats does.
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Old 10-10-2017, 02:31 PM   #30
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I've been reading the first few issues of Justice League International (circa 1987 or so), and Batman as portrayed in that comic fells a Green Lantern (Guy Gardner) with one punch.

Maybe this trend came after how he was portrayed in The Dark Knight Returns, which would have been published the year before?
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Old 10-10-2017, 02:43 PM   #31
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I'm perfectly fine with blaming Frank Miller for this phenomenon.
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A lot just get older and older and angrier and angrier, all the while waiting for the world to bend to their whim, never, ever really being satisfied with any of the "victories" achieved at large and wondering why no one outside of whatever construct bubble they've placed themself [sic] (look, I did it!) in wants to mess with them.
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