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Old 03-15-2020, 06:55 AM   #21
Voltron
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Originally Posted by Andrew NDB View Post
I misspoke on natural selection, but you probably take my meaning. Nature is nothing but not evolutionary. Some funguses have evolved to eat plastics, certain animals have evolved to be naturally wary (or fond, conversely) of humans, etc., etc..
Granted, but you're way off on your premise. Humanity subverts nature a lot. We're pretty good at creating things that don't spontaneously form in great quantities. Plastics is one of them.

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Plastics have been around and in the ocean for a long time...
It's been around for a little less than 200 years. That's not enough time for an evolutionary response in a complex organism. Fungus? Microbes? Sure. Sea turtles? Unlikely.

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but when you have a species scarfing them down like their favorite meal... eh, what is the takeaway from that? Cut down on ocean pollution and plastics, of course and we should, but the plastics in it is never going to be "good." Maybe we can slow the increase, but not stop it or even reverse it. Coastal populations are spiraling everywhere and plastics are only going to be on the rise.
I'm going to stop you here and give you another chance to back track, because this is one of those arguments that may come back and bite you.

Saying sea turtles are stupid for eating plastic is really oversimplifying the matter. The plastic isn't something they'd be accustomed to right out the gate. They may learn it's dangerous over time, but that may take generations.

On the flip side, we're guilty of the same thing. It could so happen that one day you or someone you love accidentally ingests something later found to be detrimental to their health, God forbid lethal.

If that's the case, the argument you've made is relevant. You've consumed something unaware and possibly assured that it posed no threat. I'd say the consequences aren't with you, but with whoever failed to properly test product or substance.

That's how it goes with sea turtles. Humanity made a giant mess. It's our responsibility. Regardless of how you feel about environmental issues, there's no denying that we put it there. Since it wouldn't be there without us, it stands to reason that we are at least indirectly responsible for the fates of the sea turtles.

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Just... c'mon, sea turtles... stop eating plastics. Eh, maybe we can as united nations add something to plastics to make them taste "different"?
I can assure you that, were this an option, the US would never go for it. We shot down a UN resolution that would make it so buildings had to be handicapped accessible. If we aren't helping cripples, we aren't helping sea turtles, either.

In fact, it's one of the things I praise Trump for. He pulled us out of the TPP, which would have ceded our national sovereignty to international corporations. Really glad Obama didn't get his way on that one.
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Old 03-15-2020, 07:04 AM   #22
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This reminds me of the time when George Carlin was musing about how possibly the planet Earth only created human beings because it wanted for there to be plastic and simply didn't know how to produce it naturally, so it forced us to evolve so we could create it.

This was in the midst of a much broader point he was making about how in the big picture, "the planet" is going to be fine no matter what happens to us or any other species which comes and goes, as all species do and will, be it naturally or otherwise. But it was an amusing side rant, and this made me think of it.
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Old 03-15-2020, 10:46 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Voltron View Post
On the flip side, we're guilty of the same thing. It could so happen that one day you or someone you love accidentally ingests something later found to be detrimental to their health, God forbid lethal.

If that's the case, the argument you've made is relevant. You've consumed something unaware and possibly assured that it posed no threat. I'd say the consequences aren't with you, but with whoever failed to properly test product or substance.
Case in point, these so-called "forever chemicals" that don't really break down in the body and pretty much everyone has it in their blood stream after being exposed to them for decades and told all that time that the products that have them are fine. And like those sea turtles, we weren't really aware that it was bad, and still we'll probably just keep on exposing ourselves to it and partly because there is just so much of it.
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