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Old 06-04-2014, 11:40 AM   #101
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But that's the thing. There is no evidence.

There's no evidence this movie will do well, it's all based on assumptions, speculation, and hope. And there's no evidence this movie will do horrible, it's all based on assumptions, speculation, and hope.

We can't know either way, until we get facts. And the only fact there will be is the end result of the movie. We can't know the facts until the movie is out. We can't know for sure if this movie will fail. That goes for both sides.

Even though I'm trying to stay positive about this movie, I don't want to pick sides here, but I think Puddinpop was responding in the same tone and type of manner as TrickOrTreater. I think it's one-sided if your only accusing Puddinpop of being 'overly-confident and/or rude'. Same goes, in this case, for someone only blaming TrickOrTreator for the same behavior.
I was replying to one person directly, but it wasn't aimed at just that person, if that makes sense? Just to a general trend I've noticed - the "This movie's going to make ALL/NONE OF the money, that's a fact, wait and see! " kind of comments are pretty obnoxious and ridiculous. Because you're right - there is no way to know that for sure yet.

It's totally fair to speculate, or to have your own predictions/hopes or ideas of how it'll play out. And to be fair, there is some aspect of "evidence" to this, even if it's unproven in this case specifically - people can analyze trends, make comparisons, get in-depth with box office statistics, etc. There's already evidence that August releases perform at a much lower level than June/July movies, so there is some evidence that suggests how high this movie can potentially reach - even though there could always be some surprises.

I've got my own predictions, but I'm not trying to say I'll be right, necessarily. I just think that folks getting too "fanboyish" or arrogant about their personal hopes/predictions and trying to pass them off as a fact or a foregone conclusion tends to make things get more heated and hostile than they should. None of us know how this is going to pan out for sure, so let's just keep things in perspective.
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Old 06-04-2014, 01:47 PM   #102
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When was Heath Ledger ever considered a bad actor?
10 thing i hatd about you and after up until Broke back, thing is actors have to find their niche Even great actors weren't always "great"
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Nope. He was considered quite a good actor and even received an Academy Award nomination for his role in Brokeback Mountain.

Lots of versatility, lots of range.
yes but he wasn't always considered great, he found his niche, same with Ben he was considered a bad actor early in his career. plenty of other actors a well
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Old 06-04-2014, 01:53 PM   #103
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RamboRaph, I have a question for you. Not one to flame an argument, I just want to know? If, in the next trailer, they show martial arts, if they show the turtles together, as brothers, and/or interacting together, will you be satisfied?
You misunderstood me. I've already given up on the film. That's why I voted 'never seeing the film' on another thread. So no, I won't be seeing the next trailer.

The only reason I responded is because someone was spouting off that it was just 'blind hate'. And I was setting the record straight that for a lot of folks, it wasn't just 'blind hate from the very start of production'.

If you look looooong ago in my posts, you'll see that when I first heard about the film, I was actually excited for it! Because I like a lot of Michael Bay productions (The Island, Bad Boys 1 & 2, The Rock). And I actually loved the director's Darkness Falls and Battle: Los Angeles movies. So, those who said 'well, you hated it from the beginning' don't know what they are talking about. It's right here on the forums...waaaay back, mind you. But it's still on here.

Now, if the teasers had done their job and were great...if the marketing did its' job and said 'yep, it's a must see'...if the designs were actually Cool to me in order to go 'Now that is Awesome'...if the casting actually had made me excited instead of dread (and yes samxsteal, I've seen Fichtner in many films and I never cared for him in any of them. Still don't like the guy)...if the makers just 'spoon-fed me' as some people would say it, and just tell us 'hey, the Turtles ARE the stars of the movie. Don't worry'....then I'd give it a chance.

I've seen enough Red Flags to build a bridge. And I'm sorry, but there is no reason for me to give this a chance.

'then why are you on here?' Because certain people tell me not to, and I'm incredibly stubborn and incredibly opinionated. Pretty much it.
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Old 06-04-2014, 03:38 PM   #104
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... I just realised that Volt was referring to Shredder being Ch'rell... for some reason I thought he was talking about the ethnicity of his robot suit. DERP.

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My complaints with the casting of Megan Fox at the time was how she's been used in any film she's ever been in. I felt it would be a disservice to the character of April. Then there's the other actresses who were passed over that I felt fit the character better. (Anna Kendrick, Elizabeth Olsen, and another I can't recall off the top of my head). I will say she was much more likable in This is 40 despite playing a very similar character to everything she's ever done.

We all know that Michael Bay isn't directing, but Liebesman has come out and said that Bay has been heavily involved with the production of the film. As for Spielberg and Transformers, we have him to blame for the focus on the human characters instead of the titular characters.
I agree with a lot of this - I feel that the character of April deserves more than to be just eye candy. There are plenty of actresses out there who are hot and who have a better acting range than Megan Fox. I'm not saying that I've never gone to see a movie just to perve on one of the actors they've cast - hell, Rose McGowan being in Conan was the only reason I saw the damn thing - but I feel that to give a Turtles film that treatment is, again, doing the character of April a disservice.

For the sake of comparing apples with apples and oranges with oranges, I look at it this way:

1. Liebesman has directed 5 features besides Turtles, only one of which I've watched. Of that one, I didn't enjoy it. The remainder of his films, I have zero interest in.
2. Applebaum, Nemec and Daugherty haven't written anything that I've enjoyed.
3. Of the 24 films that Bay has produced (which are currently out), I've watched 9. Of those, I've enjoyed 2.
4. Of the 9 other producers and executive producers associated with this project, the only production work in their catalogue (specifically, Denis L Stewart) which I've enjoyed that isn't also on Bay's production list is Friday the 13th: A New Beginning and The Mask.

Now I'm not saying that the powers that be should've come to my house and asked my opinion/approval on every person they decided to attach to this project. I'm just saying that there's a precedent for me not really being into the most of the movies that any of these people are attached to, and once again, were it not a Turtles film, I wouldn't be giving the film a second thought.
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Old 06-04-2014, 04:42 PM   #105
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1. Liebesman has directed 5 features besides Turtles, only one of which I've watched. Of that one, I didn't enjoy it. The remainder of his films, I have zero interest in.
2. Applebaum, Nemec and Daugherty haven't written anything that I've enjoyed.
3. Of the 24 films that Bay has produced (which are currently out), I've watched 9. Of those, I've enjoyed 2.
4. Of the 9 other producers and executive producers associated with this project, the only production work in their catalogue (specifically, Denis L Stewart) which I've enjoyed that isn't also on Bay's production list is Friday the 13th: A New Beginning and The Mask.

Now I'm not saying that the powers that be should've come to my house and asked my opinion/approval on every person they decided to attach to this project. I'm just saying that there's a precedent for me not really being into the most of the movies that any of these people are attached to, and once again, were it not a Turtles film, I wouldn't be giving the film a second thought.
My view is very similar to yours. I've yet to watch a Liebesman directed film, Battle: Los Angeles was probably the only film he has directed that gained my interest, until I saw the second trailer and reviews, to which I never bothered to go out of my way.

It surprises me that Liebesman was given such a loved property to be responsible for with such a limited background and success, I would like to know what it is he did to get the job.

As for Michael Bay, I may have liked some of his films for their action back in the day (Armageddon, The Rock etc.), but over time, as I've grown up, I've become more aware of my issues regarding his method to tell a story, or lack thereof. When Transformers came along, it had a lot of hype around it and initially did very well due to reigniting interest for a loved property, the buzz was highly positive, but I can't see the same love for TMNT, despite also being a loved childhood property. The execution for this project has not been as well handled in my opinion, but the name of the property should be enough to generate enough money to cover the budget at the box office.
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:11 PM   #106
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It surprises me that Liebesman was given such a loved property to be responsible for with such a limited background and success, I would like to know what it is he did to get the job.
I'm more surprised that he's basically been welcomed with open arms. Considering his track record.

As far as how he got the job, he's in the Platinum Dunes wheelhouse. They threw it to whoever would take it.
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:45 PM   #107
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I'd argue the reverse is also true, but y'know what? I don't see the point in complaining about that. It just adds to the hostility here. People have their opinions and they're entitled to express them. The only reason so much fighting breaks out here is that some posters get rude and combative about others' opinions, like they're looking for an argument. Ahem.



1. I think this is a perfectly fair complaint - I want actors cast for their ability, not solely for their looks. There were reports saying they had met with several very capable, appropriate choices for the role (Anna Kendrick among them, sigh...), and they went with what was easily the weakest option, talent-wise. That raises a lot of valid questions about the creative decisions they're making and what those will mean for the final product.

2. What is this claim based on? Can you back that up? Personally, I can count the number of Michael Bay movies I've seen on one hand, and the last one I saw (Transformers in 2007) was so bad that I've avoided his movies ever since.

3. Yes. I hate the clothes/accessories, but I hate the overall "look"/physiology of the Turtles just as much. I don't like their height, their extremely muscular body types, their facial features, their high shells, or their plastron abs. I think they're terrible designs on every level.

4. The 2K3 Shredder was an alien, but he was also Japanese. He took on the identity of Oroku Saki and lived his public life for hundreds of years as a Japanese man. He was essentially an immigrant to Japan, who adopted the culture and lived that way far longer than any natural human lifespan. He wasn't born Japanese, no, but it was a part of his identity.

Also: he was not the only Shredder in that series, nor was he the first. The original Shredder, the real Oroku Saki, was a Japanese man from the feudal era. The third Shredder, Karai, was a Japanese woman. Japanese heritage played a key role in every version of the character.



He asked for evidence. That's not evidence; that's hopefulness. Which is fine, but all anyone really has right now is speculation, so maybe let's all not get overly-confident and/or rude about it, hey?
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I'd argue the reverse is also true, but y'know what? I don't see the point in complaining about that. It just adds to the hostility here. People have their opinions and they're entitled to express them. The only reason so much fighting breaks out here is that some posters get rude and combative about others' opinions, like they're looking for an argument. Ahem.
Ya know you're right.. There's no point in complaining about a LOT of the crap that gets brought up, but don't act like there isn't plenty of blame to go around. It's just as ridiculous for some to sit here and point the finger at one side, and there are plenty of posters being overly pessimistic and rude but yet you have an issue with people being "overly confident"? This stupid back and forth civil war is so obstinately juvenile it's exhausting. People keep demanding the same crap for more fight footage and more "proof" and more "explanation" even before release every single day and then a second later claim that they will never see it in the first place so what is the point of that besides coming here and just telling others that what they think or predict is absolute rubbish. This is not what movies are made for.. people fighting back and forth speculating to the point of attacking people they don't even know. They are made for people to enjoy them, leave their problems at the door, shut their brains off and relax. But instead it's nothing but an egotistical opinion pushing contest that goes on for months and months. Nothing will change.. unfortunately

And I'll be as overly confident as I so do please bud And im not being "rude" I just used his own word. But I understand that you guys all stick together like a junior high school click.. I wont be "rude" to Trick anymore ok? I apologize. I guess I'm the only one being rude around here for no reason Your right.. it's ALL speculation.. that is why I can't wait for August to come and watch the TMNT kick some ass and succeed again despite these cynical pessimistic folks that routed for it's failure. I'm tired of it. It's going to taste sooo good

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Old 06-04-2014, 05:59 PM   #108
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Anyways.. Two girls on Facebook are now claiming that they just saw a new TV spot with Donny and Mikey charging Shredder. A thirty second TV spot on Nickelodeon


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Old 06-04-2014, 05:59 PM   #109
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Anyways.. Two girls on Facebook are now claiming that they just saw a new TV spot with Donny and Mikey charging Shredder. A thirty second TV spot. Has anyone else seen this? or are they pulling everyone's leg. Supposedly it was on Nickelodeon
Right here

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Old 06-04-2014, 06:03 PM   #110
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Right here

.....holy **** I guess his blades are retractable

They've gotta stop with the Mikey joke though.. Please

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Old 06-04-2014, 07:18 PM   #111
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Ya know you're right.. There's no point in complaining about a LOT of the crap that gets brought up, but don't act like there isn't plenty of blame to go around. It's just as ridiculous for some to sit here and point the finger at one side, and there are plenty of posters being overly pessimistic and rude but yet you have an issue with people being "overly confident"? This stupid back and forth civil war is so obstinately juvenile it's exhausting.
Read my posts in this thread - I specifically acknowledged it was coming from both sides, so I don't know why you seem to think I'm pointing the finger at one side or you specifically.

But...

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And I'll be as overly confident as I so do please bud And im not being "rude" I just used his own word. But I understand that you guys all stick together like a junior high school click.. I wont be "rude" to Trick anymore ok? I apologize. I guess I'm the only one being rude around here for no reason Your right.. it's ALL speculation.. that is why I can't wait for August to come and watch the TMNT kick some ass and succeed again despite these cynical pessimistic folks that routed for it's failure. I'm tired of it. It's going to taste sooo good
http://www.digital-polyphony.com/francosogood.gif
This is exactly the kind of combative, condescending attitude that's getting suuuper tiresome around here, so I'm gonna let you peace out to the ignore list for now.

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Right here

...so Mecha-Shredder it is. I want to see if someone can actually count all the blades. Like a jelly bean contest!
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:24 PM   #112
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Read my posts in this thread - I specifically acknowledged it was coming from both sides, so I don't know why you seem to think I'm pointing the finger at one side or you specifically.
Persecution complex.

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...so Mecha-Shredder it is. I want to see if someone can actually count all the blades. Like a jelly bean contest!
In silhouette he looks like a giant metal 3 toed sloth.

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Old 06-04-2014, 07:27 PM   #113
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Read my posts in this thread - I specifically acknowledged it was coming from both sides, so I don't know why you seem to think I'm pointing the finger at one side or you specifically.

But...



This is exactly the kind of combative, condescending attitude that's getting suuuper tiresome around here, so I'm gonna let you peace out to the ignore list for now.



...so Mecha-Shredder it is. I want to see if someone can actually count all the blades. Like a jelly bean contest!
Perfect.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:32 PM   #114
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Man, Shredder looks so goofy. I wouldn't be surprised if Michael Bay has Shredder wear a 8-inch codpiece to make him even more stupid-looking.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:34 PM   #115
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Man, Shredder looks so goofy. I wouldn't be surprised if Michael Bay has Shredder wear a 8-inch codpiece to make him even more stupid-looking.
Swiss Army Shredder.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:56 PM   #116
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I don't see a top knot on his head. Ill bet he is close to how he looks in the TMNT history book. Shredder looks menacing
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Old 06-04-2014, 08:02 PM   #117
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Right here

Geez, I get that he's called the Shredder, but that's one too many blades.
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Old 06-04-2014, 08:03 PM   #118
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I don't see a top knot on his head. Ill bet he is close to how he looks in the TMNT history book. Shredder looks menacing
Nope.

Spoiler:
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Old 06-04-2014, 08:04 PM   #119
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Tons of people will go for nostalgia alone. If this is a success, it sure didn't come from the marketing department.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:08 PM   #120
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10 thing i hatd about you and after up until Broke back, thing is actors have to find their niche Even great actors weren't always "great"

yes but he wasn't always considered great, he found his niche, same with Ben he was considered a bad actor early in his career. plenty of other actors a well
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...y_Heath_Ledger

It's really just not true. He was nominated for awards well before Brokeback. There's a difference between not exclusively being in Oscar bait when you're young and having no discernible acting skills other than pouting, sticking your chest out, and fainting.

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Right here

So the shot of Shredder's blades coming out and maybe a half second more of Michelangelo and Donatello and the rest is old footage?
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