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Old 03-22-2017, 02:40 PM   #101
neatoman
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Why was Shredder able to betray Hothead in the end?

By the way should we assume they're done with Rahzar and Fishface now? One went to hell and the other decided to return to his old life (despite being a mutant fish). Tiger Claw just decided bury the hatchet off screen, Bebop and Rocksteady ran off, so it's possible they're out as well.

Or will all or most of them just come back anyway?
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Old 03-22-2017, 02:44 PM   #102
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" I really did meet Megan Fox on that rooftop yo" Mikey

I loved that

Also the turtles have proton packs now
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Old 03-22-2017, 02:52 PM   #103
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Why was Shredder able to betray Hothead in the end?

By the way should we assume they're done with Rahzar and Fishface now? One went to hell and the other decided to return to his old life (despite being a mutant fish). Tiger Claw just decided bury the hatchet off screen, Bebop and Rocksteady ran off, so it's possible they're out as well.

Or will all or most of them just come back anyway?
Yeah Rahzar has gone to hell.
Shredder and Kavaxas gone to hell
Tatsu dead
The Hammer and other Mafia goons dead.
Might see Fishface again but doubtful
Might see Tiger Claw again
I think we will see Bebop and Rocksteady again, maybe they will be involved in the 2nd crossover.
As Baxter wasn't in these episodes, I doubt we will see him again.
Vizioso and some of his mafia goons gone to jail so doubt we will see them again

So you know it's the last season when they are killing and getting rid off characters
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:01 PM   #104
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Those episodes sound amazing. It really feels they're going all out.

What led Tigerclaw to make a truce with the turtles? Is he still technically an enemy and/or did the turtles accept the truce?
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:11 PM   #105
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Those episodes sound amazing. It really feels they're going all out.

What led Tigerclaw to make a truce with the turtles? Is he still technically an enemy and/or did the turtles accept the truce?
Leatherhead announced Tiger Claw called a truce then took off. The TMNT were shocked and indicate they accept.
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:13 PM   #106
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Wow! I just watched all 3 episodes back-to-back and they were amazing! Along with Scroll of the Demodragon, these 4 episodes sort of felt like a mini-season by itself; in fact I'd say End Times did have a season finale feel to it!

I'm really glad season 5 is gonna be done in this 7 story arcs format. There will probably be no filler eps at all, all episodes within an arc just flow continuously without interruptions. Hopefully the next 6 stories are delivered in a similar fashion as well.

Mikey really got to shine in these episodes, especially the last one. I don't recall any dumb moment of him either, and I got a pretty good laugh out of the Megan Fox joke (his expression nailed it for me)

Some parts of these episodes are unbelievably dark for a "kids' show". Both Tatsu and The Hammer (the Stallone lookalike) were killed on-screen and their corpses were shown just lying on the ground with horrible faces... and in the following ep they came back as ghosts along with countless number of skeleton spirits seems like they just don't care much about on-screen deaths anymore since Splinter and Shredder were also killed on-screen previously.

Speaking of Splinter, his final closure was done really well too. There wasn't really enough time (and proper setting) to do so in Requiem/Owari so it's great that they had a proper closure at the end of this arc, with the final goodbyes and all.

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Donnie has a point where he's about to kill Vizioso. Leo see's what his brother is about to do and yells "Donnie, don't lose sight of who you are!" At that moment Donnie catches sight of his reflection in the blade of his naginata and what he sees is a crazed and manic look on his face that resembles something akin to the Shredder. And that scares him into realizing that if he takes Vizioso's life, he would be destroying himself as well as everything he stands for and holds dear.
And we get to witness one of the angriest, scariest-looking Donnie in this particular shot:

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Old 03-22-2017, 03:19 PM   #107
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The Deaths of Tatsu and the Hammer and there horrible faces, remind me The Ring movies corpses

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And we get to witness one of the angriest, scariest-looking Donnie in this particular shot:

http://i.imgur.com/EeocFbV.jpg
He's possessed
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:24 PM   #108
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The Deaths of Tatsu and the Hammer and there horrible faces, remind me The Ring movies corpses
Sounds exciting!
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:22 PM   #109
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And we get to witness one of the angriest, scariest-looking Donnie in this particular shot:

http://i.imgur.com/EeocFbV.jpg
I admit that this episode didn't play out as I thought it would, but I did like the Leo/ Donnie bonding moments.

Though I did find Raph commenting that he thought Donnie acting irrational was an improvement. Raph knows from personal experience that anger and impulsive decisions lead to people particularly loved ones. So while the "You should get ticked off more often." Is a plausible appreciation. Don acting out while they are trying to stop their old enemy from being reserected is not the time to say "wow, I like this Donnie"

If Donnie did carry out his intention on killing Vizioso, the worst thing that would happen is Donnie would be proving they were the monsters Vizioso thought they were. Which may not seem like much, but that leaves the Twins and while Vizioso may himself not be missed as a person. The fulchi twins could make it clear that if these Turtles can kill Vizioso while he is defenseless what's to stop em from killing someone innocent like someone's kids. Make it look like Vizioso was a martyr for a cause

The Turtles won't lose complete trust in Donatello, but he would still have to prove he deserves their trust.

Leo will be greatly disappointed and aside from lecturing Donnie in the Dojo about his priorities he will also demand to know how Donnie intends to prove this occurrence will not be a repeated. And he has every right to bench him from missions until he realizes what danger he has placed upon their family.

April and Mikey will also be disappointed in Donnie and points out that she knows he's better then this.

Raph and Casey maybe Karai may say good riddens about Vizioso but even they can't ignore that Donnie just handed Kavaxas the keys to the Shredders revival
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Old 03-22-2017, 06:38 PM   #110
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He only resurrected Shredder (undead) and Rahzar.

Ho Chan, Tatsu, Splinter were spirits. Kavaxas opened up the spirit realm or whatever it's called and they came out of it. (actually Splinter didn't come out of it, he just appeared).
So in other words, Ho Chan's role felt too small, and James Hong only had a few small lines? ... Wait a minute! I thought Ho Chan is trapped in a dagur, not in the spirit realm.

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Old 03-22-2017, 09:54 PM   #111
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Great bunch of episodes, Hothead was a cool villain and Tatsu. End Times felt like it could have been a 2 parter though. I think we'll see Fishface again "I've been looking forward to this rematch Raphael'' he didn't say in those episodes.
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:59 PM   #112
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H
o
l
y

s
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t

Season 5 is easily the best. Wowwwww. Just WOW.

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Wow...can I just say, I've always enjoyed this series, but third time seems like it could well be "the charm". FW had Red Sky, 4Kids had Fast Forward and Back to the Sewers, both had some great parts to it, but Tales seem to blow them out of the water easily!
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Just finished. Can't believe how much awesome they squeezed into these episodes. Everything was on point. And the body count was outrageous lol. They're getting away with so much, I can't believe it. Vizoso even busted out a slur. God damn shame the show is ending. This is looking to be the best season yet!
Real talk.

& Tatsu was SO FRIGGIN' COOL.
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Old 03-22-2017, 10:16 PM   #113
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Shredder's statement about how "We don't belong here, Demon!" and also his mention about feeling like he has been gone for millennia interests me.

In the Shinto apparently when you enter death you become nothing more than a wandering shade

I've looked into Buddhist versions of hell and they are like Dante's inferno on steroids. Even the journey to the underworld is not a pleasant journey.

Just to get to the underworld the departed soul is dragged off on seven-day journey by three ogres. Along the journey the corruption of the mortal world manifests itself in the form of swords that pierce the body.

The souls of the departed are also attacked by birds that peck at their eyes and skin, and also they have to climb a mountain covered in thorns that is supposed to be a manifestation of the greed they had in life.

Then finally they arrive at the Sanzu River, and meet the first of five judges that will determine their placement in the afterlife.

I know anime like Dragon Ball Z and Yu Yu Hakusho have the dead character meet Enma Dioh first because after all he is lord of the underworld. However, Enma is actually the fifth judge and there are two other judges after him, but at that point your placement is determined so they are just finalizing your journey.

Before crossing the Sanzu River one must be judged on deaths they have caused. Even bugs and animals (Hunted and harvested) are added to this list

Then they cross the Sanzu (essentially the river Styx) which is another seven day journey. And depending on your judgment you either walk across a bridge, wade through a point of the river that is shallow and fordable, and for the wicked souls...they have to swim through snake filled rapids.

When they reach the other side the deceased soul has it's clothing taken by two Oni that hang them on a tree branch (if the soul doesn't have clothing the oni flay off the souls skin and does the same thing they do with the clothes) and the amount the branches bend under the weight of the clothing determines how much sin a person held in life.

After this the dead soul meets the second judge who judges them on how much they have stolen.

There are other horrifying stuff that happens to the deceased soul as they visit the other judges, but I won't list them here. But some of the things that happen is the soul is forced to swim across a bay of boiling foul smelling liquid. And they have to cross a blasted landscape while being pelted by balls of red hot iron that falls from the sky.

21 days after death a soul encounters the 3rd judge who judges them on their lust.

28 days after death the soul is judges on the weight of the lies they have told in life.

Each of these four judges if they find you wicked enough will send you to hell immediately without further recourse.

Finally 35 days after death, a soul meets Enma Dioh who shows them a large mirror where they see their former life reflected back at them and they see their sins and transgressions clearly laid out. He looks at their previous judgments and determines which of the six realms they are sent to.

42 days after death the soul meets with another judge who decides the location of each soul

49 days after death is the last judge and a souls last chance to avoid hell as he determines the remaining conditions of a souls rebirth.

Splinter's was likely placed in heaven, he is no saint but most of what he has done in life was with good intention. And his parting with his family was peaceful as he has the final chance to tell his family he loves them and he's proud of them. I doubt Splinter will appear to the Turtles again, and if he does it would because there is a need for it.

Shredder I would believe was sent to one of the 16 hells. However, when he is resurrected he does comment he is cold so it's possible he could have been sent to one of the eight great hells.

A person who is sent to hell isn't eternally damned, there are 3-6 opportunities to seek clemency, these opportunities occur

100 days after death
1 year after death
2 years after death
6 years after death
12 years after death
and 32 years after death.

Shredder mentions he's been gone for millennia, but Tiger Claw says he's actually been dead several months. So let's say this is roughly 100 days after death.

Each of the hells has a different life span of punishment. However, time flows differently in each one. For example, in the lightest of the great hells, a soul is trapped there for 500 years. One day there is 50 years on earth. So the place Shredder was sent was likely a place so painful that it makes the one minute feel like an eternity.

I'm not going to list off the different hells because any of them could be where Shredder resides. Though I feel his last act where he says "We do not belong in this world, Demon!" Sounded like an attempt towards some atonement from his punishment. Since Tiger Claw did wonder if Shredder was brought back at all, or was merely just a puppet for Kavaxas. But after Kavaxas betrays TC, Shredder says "You were right, he is my master now." Indicating his actions up until that point were not his own.
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Old 03-23-2017, 12:43 PM   #114
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I managed to see the other three episodes on the DVD. So I have some things to say.

1) When Mikey commanded Kavaxas to return everything to normal, does that mean the Foot Cultists are human again?

2) I knew that resurrected Rahzar being more aggressive is a bad sign of what's to come. And I mean some changes in personality as a side effect of resurrection.

3) Maybe End Times would be a bit better if it has silent cameos of ghost versions of Kraang Prime, Rat King, Mozar, Dregg, and perhaps Zog.

4) Shredder's resurrection reminds me of Tengu Shredder from the 2003 series.

5) Wasn't Ho Chan supposed to be trapped in a dagger? Unless said dagger was also a portal out of the spirit realm for that sorcerer.
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Old 03-23-2017, 12:53 PM   #115
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Does anyone else think its possible Razhar possibly survived and climbed back up after falling into the abyss? It would be interesting to see more of him since he's now enemies with Tiger Claw.
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:22 PM   #116
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Does anyone else think its possible Razhar possibly survived and climbed back up after falling into the abyss? It would be interesting to see more of him since he's now enemies with Tiger Claw.
Well they've never been bosom buddies anyway. At one point Rahzar/Chris Bradford was Shredder's right hand man and he's had to watch that role being passed to Karai and Tiger Claw, neither of which were above using their position to treat him like a lesser person.

I don't know if he would deliberately seek TC out for a fight though, he's always seemed quite intimidated when they're together. The power balance isn't exactly 50/50 is it?
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:42 PM   #117
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Quoted from Matteso586
1) When Mikey commanded Kavaxas to return everything to normal, does that mean the Foot Cultists are human again?

2) I knew that resurrected Rahzar being more aggressive is a bad sign of what's to come. And I mean some changes in personality as a side effect of resurrection.

3) Maybe End Times would be a bit better if it has silent cameos of ghost versions of Kraang Prime, Rat King, Mozar, Dregg, and perhaps Zog.

4) Shredder's resurrection reminds me of Tengu Shredder from the 2003 series.

5) Wasn't Ho Chan supposed to be trapped in a dagger? Unless said dagger was also a portal out of the spirit realm for that sorcerer.
I really have to agree. Don't get me wrong, I really like the direction these episodes are going in - with much more dramatic and slightly darker material, but with episode 3 especially I just found it very frustrating for having some really odd plot holes.

As Matteso pointed out - what about the Foot cultists? They confirm they're humans forcibly mutated but don't seem to do anything about them (worse, they allow a truce that could potentially see them continue to 'recruit'). Seems a little uncomfortably open ended there...

And Matteso's 2nd point especially stands out - I really HOPE that there is some kind of end game plan here with implications for Don and his resurrection by April - because otherwise his sudden intense desire for revenge seems frankly.... out of character. I'd understand that kind of reaction from Raph to a degree, but for Don to get to that stage doesn't make sense to me in the context. If Visiozo had been the one who had injured Mikey that badly, or if he'd directly threatened April I could understand it better, but as it was.... there just didn't seem enough justification for his murderous rage.

Plus - did Don actually break someones neck on screen? Was I the only one to notice that as he infiltrates Visiozo's safe house?

If there is some kind of 'end plan' for a corrupted Don of some description, it might also explain why Don has been unusually less protective of April in the recent episodes (notably when Kavaxas threatens to eat her).

And I really dont know what Ho Chan was doing there except as a 'remember me!' cameo.


Edit:

This sounds a lot like I'm grumbling and didn't like the episodes. That isn't true - The animation is superb, the action has been largely excellent, there's been good humour, good lines and good character moments. Its just those points above really bugged me
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:12 PM   #118
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Ok time to give my full thoughts on all 3 episodes, this is gonna be long:

1. Firstly, it felt so good to be able to watch all 4 episodes of season 5s 1st arc back to back like a movie, especially since I already watched the season 4 finale back in December when it aired in Korea so this was definetly a big treat.

2. Kavaxas was just an awesome villain. Great design, backstory and who could forget that voice?

3. I was confused as to the origin of the cult members at first but I'm glad they gave them a creative backstory that involved the events of the season 4 finale. Also, kudos to the writers for giving the homeless man a major plot point.

4. I never expected Tatsu from the original movie would ever appear in another version but I was wrong. Even though he appeared and died in the same episode, I would be lying if I said he didn't leave a mark. He was pretty intimidating to be honest.

5. I like how Karai cares about the legacy of the foot even after she's no longer an ally of shredder. It shows that the foot goes beyond just being Shredder's evil clan.

6. I thought Razhar would've survived being submerged somehow but I was wrong. It was funny to see him fear Tatsu and I was pretty shocked when he turned on Tiger Claw even though Shredder was merely the puppet of Kavaxas. I guess Kavaxas had influence of Razhar as well. Unlike Shredder though, who went back to hell, I wish Razhar comes back. It doesn't feel right for Razhar to be dead and Fishface casually going on vacation.

7. The Heart of evil was a fun episode and showed the angry side of Donnie I was always wanted to see. Ever since the OT, I was fascinated with Donnie's distrust towards humanity and his hatred of those who are prejduced against mutants. It was a blast seeing Nick Donnie go through that in his grudge against Don Vizioso.

8. Seeing Kavaxas secret disloyalty to Tiger Claw slowly build up till the point where he betrays him via Zombie Shredder was interesting. Speaking of Zombie Shredder, man he looked horrific and lifeless (zombie after all). Merely a puppet for Kavaxas to rule the world and it seemed being in hell for so long sucked every bit of personality out of him, leaving him as a heartless monster.

9. The end ghostbusters-esque fight was alot of fun. I'm happy they saved it for the end and didnt force it throughout the whole episode. It was cool seeing the ghosts of Tatsu, Splinter and even Ho Chan. Just pure epic everywhere.

10. The ending with Splinter hugging Karai and saying goodbye to everyone was very touching. It felt very natural and appropriate since he died quite abruptly in Requiem. It feels like the perfect closure for him and I doubt his ghost will ever come back but that's all ok, since his wisdom will live on forever and we'll even get to see him in a flashback episode with baby turtles.

11. Also, Tiger Claw called on a truce with the turtles? Id certainly like to see where that goes. Does he reconcile with Alopex, does he betray them? What about Razhar, Fishface, Bebop, Rocksteady and Baxter Stockman? I guess time will tell and we can only speculate till then.

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Old 03-23-2017, 05:09 PM   #119
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I agree with everyone's sentiments about this being the best season of NickTurtles yet, possibly the best of any turtle series (possibly). The new format with these "Tales" has allowed for a more cinematic quality, and more exposition and character development. Whereas before it seemed like they would have to cram so much in a less then 30min episode. It also allows the plot not to be stretched over a whole season. If they had still stuck to the same format we probably wouldn't have had the episode "End Times" till the season finale, with several other episodes with one-time plots in-between.

I Think overall having these 4 episodes together makes for a more enjoyable viewing experience. I can't wait to see what the other "Tales" hold!
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:53 PM   #120
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I was hoping when tiger claw asked kavaxas to bring back chris bradford he would actually bring back chris bradford and not razar or dog pound.

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