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Old 01-18-2019, 08:18 PM   #21
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It's not about changing the minds of us old-timers... it's more making so much "positive" noise about the product they're shilling, that our opinions become drowned out so the casuals will ignore us and just hear their FAKE positivity.

Watch closely as it'll probably happen again. A bunch of them joined the board last time and immediately befriended each other (you know, within their profiles) and then would swarm anyone saying bad things about 2016 and 2014 before it.
My favorite were the ones who insisted upon Lies being Truth even after the truth had been exposed.

For example, we know for a fact, thanks to both the novelization of the first PD film as well as the Japanese guy who got tapped to play Shredder at the last minute, that Sachs was originally Shredder, that's the movie they filmed, and the stuff with "Oroku Saki" was a last-minute reshoot patch job, shot in a single room in a couple of hours. Those are Facts.

The plants nonetheless insisted that "Nope! Shredder was always gonna be Japanese! Eric Sachs was simply a brilliant bit of misdirection to keep you all guessing!" Right. Clearly, pissing off the entire audience six months in advance by leaking a terrible idea like "Eric Sachs" was just so... Everyone would be pleasantly surprised when it wasn't that, I guess? That doesn't even make sense, PLUS, as I mentioned, the cat was completely out of the bag by then. "Nope! They fooled you all!"

People can like or dislike whatever they want, but lies are not acceptable.
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Old 01-18-2019, 09:14 PM   #22
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My favorite were the ones who insisted upon Lies being Truth even after the truth had been exposed.

For example, we know for a fact, thanks to both the novelization of the first PD film as well as the Japanese guy who got tapped to play Shredder at the last minute, that Sachs was originally Shredder, that's the movie they filmed, and the stuff with "Oroku Saki" was a last-minute reshoot patch job, shot in a single room in a couple of hours. Those are Facts.

The plants nonetheless insisted that "Nope! Shredder was always gonna be Japanese! Eric Sachs was simply a brilliant bit of misdirection to keep you all guessing!" Right. Clearly, pissing off the entire audience six months in advance by leaking a terrible idea like "Eric Sachs" was just so... Everyone would be pleasantly surprised when it wasn't that, I guess? That doesn't even make sense, PLUS, as I mentioned, the cat was completely out of the bag by then. "Nope! They fooled you all!"

People can like or dislike whatever they want, but lies are not acceptable.
That's the only instance where I felt like they listened to the fans. The fan backlash against a White Shredder was so big that they probably were afraid it'd hurt their movie and did that as a last minute decision of some sort. That being said, TMNT is not as big as Batman, Superman, etc., are, so most of the mass media and the North American crowd didn't really care... or was even aware of Eric Sachs. So I dunno how Eric Sachs as Shredder would have hurt them much. The movie still turned out to be garbage, but it could have been EVEN worse.

And as a few others said above, Megan Fox was hardly the worst thing about those movies, which is true... and REALLY says something about the quality of said movies. That's what's sad.

Fun fact, I had a convo with a guy about the movie at the time who wasn't a TMNT fan or ever watched it. He basically told me "well, are you really surprised by Megan Fox playing April, anyway? It's a TMNT movie. Were you expecting a great actress to play her?"

This was one guy's insight, but I think this quote above really speaks about the credibility and relevance the TMNT brand has in the eyes of the majority of the audience.
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Old 01-18-2019, 09:27 PM   #23
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I mean, I'm not a plant. I was just excited at the idea of seeing TMNT on the big screen for the first time In my life. I was 14. But looking back on the movies now -- I can judge them objectively and yea, they are pretty bad.
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Old 01-18-2019, 09:41 PM   #24
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Prowler: True. I'm publicly on record from the beginning that "Anyone can play April". Maybe that's mean, but it really doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter because her character is such a general non-entity. Too many conflicting versions, too many discrepancies, upon which no two fans can agree. Aside from "female companion", there's no constant to April. What's her backstory? Her family? Her upbringing? Her career? What does she even look like, and how old is she, anyway? She's never the same character twice, and nothing about one version is reconcilable with another. Everyone knows her name, but if you ask five people who she is, you get five different answers. Anyone trying to make a movie with her in it already has their work cut out for them, way before they try and cast anyone. By that point, they're probably exhausted. "Just get whatsername and we'll dye her hair."

It's one of many reasons why I dislike all the different, conflicting TMNT universes that we've accumulated. There's way too many, and it's gotten way out of hand when you have 8 different versions of ONE character, and they all have zero in common past the name. How do you decide what's "important" enough to put in the movies, which ideally are going to be seen by many more people and thus become the most familiar version of the character for an entire generation? It needn't be so complicated.

But it is, and since April is pretty much a blank slate outside of, "hangs out with the Turtles", it really doesn't matter who plays her, one version is as good as any other at this point. Cast Megan Fox or Beyonce or Amber Heard, and they're equally "appropriate" depending on whatever they wanna do.

It definitely should not be that way, but that's where we are now. Based on what I have seen, I will agree that Megan Fox was definitely not the worst thing but it's also disappointing to realize that her being in the movie was probably the only reason it got made. She shouldn't have been there, but again, it really doesn't matter.

I don't like that, but it is what it is.
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Old 01-18-2019, 09:52 PM   #25
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Prowler: True. I'm publicly on record from the beginning that "Anyone can play April". Maybe that's mean, but it really doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter because her character is such a general non-entity. Too many conflicting versions, too many discrepancies, upon which no two fans can agree. Aside from "female companion", there's no constant to April. What's her backstory? Her family? Her upbringing? Her career? What does she even look like, and how old is she, anyway? She's never the same character twice, and nothing about one version is reconcilable with another. Everyone knows her name, but if you ask five people who she is, you get five different answers. Anyone trying to make a movie with her in it already has their work cut out for them, way before they try and cast anyone. By that point, they're probably exhausted. "Just get whatsername and we'll dye her hair."

It's one of many reasons why I dislike all the different, conflicting TMNT universes that we've accumulated. There's way too many, and it's gotten way out of hand when you have 8 different versions of ONE character, and they all have zero in common past the name. How do you decide what's "important" enough to put in the movies, which ideally are going to be seen by many more people and thus become the most familiar version of the character for an entire generation? It needn't be so complicated.

But it is, and since April is pretty much a blank slate outside of, "hangs out with the Turtles", it really doesn't matter who plays her, one version is as good as any other at this point. Cast Megan Fox or Beyonce or Amber Heard, and they're equally "appropriate" depending on whatever they wanna do.

It definitely should not be that way, but that's where we are now. Based on what I have seen, I will agree that Megan Fox was definitely not the worst thing but it's also disappointing to realize that her being in the movie was probably the only reason it got made. She shouldn't have been there, but again, it really doesn't matter.

I don't like that, but it is what it is.
She's definitely the most famous actress to have ever played April. Perhaps Judith Hoag and Paige Turco were rather big names in their prime, but, despite me being no huge movie buff, I'm pretty sure neither was ever as big as Megan Fox was in her prime. So yes, in that sense, she was important when it came to selling tickets. But then again, so was Michael Bay. Even if his movies are hardly masterpieces, a lot of people like them and everyone knows what to expect when a movie is directed or produced by him.

Tbh, I've never had an issue with April in the FW series. Her character fit the series fine, as did in the original movie trilogy. I've only read about 20 Mirage issues so far, so can't say much. In the 2k3 series she didn't appear as much as in the FW series. She was nice and all, but after some episodes of her being the "first ever human friend the turtles make", I felt like she wasn't anything special anymore. At least in the FW series she's definitely the most important ally of the Turtles and Splinter. That's enough of a purpose, imo.

Making April a kid is an idea I've never liked. And turning her into a token minority character was dumb as even dumber. Sadly, that's he idea of Hollywood and the American entertainment industry nowadays. Making characters black or gay in order to make them more interesting, as if being one of those things automatically makes a character more interesting and well-written.
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Old 01-18-2019, 10:12 PM   #26
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T'were it me, I would just stick to the original cartoon April as a foundation, since that's the most familiar version to the general public, but she'd have more than one outfit. I've always figured that having a friend like her in such a position was extremely advantageous to them, insofar as she's ideally placed to skew any reports of their existence and misdirect people away from them, as well as help them obtain information and access which they may not have been able to obtain on their own.

Basically, the way she was presented in the 1990 film is just fine with me. I may have cast a slightly hotter actress, but she was fine, and the portrayal itself was just about perfect in my opinion.

I'm well aware she was a scientist or whatever in Mirage, but that never thrilled me too much for some reason. I don't even remember if her occupation remained important, after the first couple stories.
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Old 01-18-2019, 10:16 PM   #27
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T'were it me, I would just stick to the original cartoon April as a foundation, since that's the most familiar version to the general public, but she'd have more than one outfit. I've always figured that having a friend like her in such a position was extremely advantageous to them, insofar as she's ideally placed to skew any reports of their existence and misdirect people away from them, as well as help them obtain information and access which they may not have been able to obtain on their own.

Basically, the way she was presented in the 1990 film is just fine with me. I may have cast a slightly hotter actress, but she was fine, and the portrayal itself was just about perfect in my opinion.

I'm well aware she was a scientist or whatever in Mirage, but that never thrilled me too much for some reason. I don't even remember if her occupation remained important, after the first couple stories.
Exactly. It was the closest they had to having friends in a high place.

Yeah, once she lost her job at Baxter's company she began managing the Antique Store, wasn't it? No idea if she ever went back to working as a scientist again or not. Haven't read much of Mirage yet.

And besides, they already have a scientist/engineer in the group: Donatello. So it's not like they're lacking in that department. That being said, in 2k3 and Mirage they manage to avoid overexposure much easier.
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Old 01-24-2019, 11:48 AM   #28
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As far as I'm concerned, anyone with a join date of 2014 or 2016 who returns from the void to talk up the new movie has a scarlet letter on them.
I could see why you would think that - but in my case, even as long time fan of the Turtles, I really come on these boards just to discuss the new movies. (new storylines, new designs, new direction overall makes for interesting back and forths)

I have little interest in the cartoons, so I rarely participate in the conversations. And while I revisit the comics from time to time, its not enough in my eyes to meaningfully participate on those conversations.

In short, the new movie just give us 'less active' members (who arent plants) just something new to talk about.
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Old 01-24-2019, 01:38 PM   #29
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How long until the PD plants come back?
They will arrive in about 10 months ...
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Old 01-29-2019, 12:51 PM   #30
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I mean, I'm not a plant. I was just excited at the idea of seeing TMNT on the big screen for the first time In my life. I was 14. But looking back on the movies now -- I can judge them objectively and yea, they are pretty bad.
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Old 01-29-2019, 01:02 PM   #31
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Sure are a $hit-ton of new and "new" faces cropping up in the last month or so.

Coincidence, maybe? Surely?
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Old 01-29-2019, 01:41 PM   #32
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Sure are a $hit-ton of new and "new" faces cropping up in the last month or so.

Coincidence, maybe? Surely?
Very, very suspect. Seems like they've evolved somewhat since the last time around... they're acting "natural" earlier so as not to arouse suspicion when it's time to defend the new movie. Perhaps the idea may even be to activate them earlier, so as to try and move goodwill back to Platinum Dunes sooner rather than later. In a way. Like a bunch of new faced PLANTS come and all say, "Yeahhhh... the first two PD movies were bad, I guess, but THIS one looks AWESOME!!!"

I'm onto them.
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Old 02-03-2019, 10:12 PM   #33
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I'm still here lol haven't post in a while mostly cuz there's nothing new to talk about worth discussing.

And hell yeah when new info come out I'll likely come here because that's what this place is for and

Just cuz people liked the PD turtle doesn't make them plants and the fact that you're so egotistical to think you're some how more of a true fan then someone (especially with your track record Andrew) it pretty ridiculous.

Y'all who think your better can suck it lol.

Fans have every right to enjoy what they want and if they want to talk positively about it then so be it

Like I'm some how less of a fan, cuz I like something you don't GTFO with your crap

Some people left because this place became a toxic sespool and alot of the fans of the movie found more receptive outlet.
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Old 02-03-2019, 10:24 PM   #34
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haven't post in a while mostly cuz there's nothing new to talk about worth discussing.
I sincerely wish more people adopted this philosophy.

Thank you for being a role model.
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By the way, nothing's changed. If you don't agree with majority opinion, they're in fact allowed to scream in your ear what an idiot you are. There's a whole other thread about it.

I don't like BayTurtles, but I've worn out that record. But I feel obligated to tell you, anyone who doesn't subscribe to popular opinion... this board is not for them. Just in case you've thought about becoming a regular presence again.

I wouldn't.
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Old 02-03-2019, 10:43 PM   #35
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I honestly rather have a few plants then scare away anyone who feels under the gun because they are new and enjoy the PD films.

I mean, I make up my own mind anyway, so having a few plants around a place as dead as this doesn't seem like such a big deal to me.

I just think we should be careful about pointing the finger.
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Old 02-03-2019, 11:56 PM   #36
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Well, my beef isn't specifically with anyone who has genuine enthusiasm for a product that "Consensus" has decided is "bad". I sincerely mean it when I say, "People can like what they like." I just think it helps if they can support their opinion a little bit beyond "feelings." "This is good because...", or, "This is bad because..."

"I feel this way because I just do..." Ehhhh, I'm not gonna try and change their minds but I'm not gonna listen to them, either.

I happen to agree with "Consensus" in the case of these films, but I more than anyone knows these peoples' pain. I am, if nothing else, the KING of "Unpopular Opinion", and I'm aware of that. Everything I could ever say about these two films, I've probably said it enough. Unless I'm asked, I'm probably gonna look forward more than back, and anything said about them will probably only be used to support a prediction about the next one.

But some people absolutely were paid to come in here to cheerlead and rabble-rouse. And, they often tried to refute Facts about the movie with flat-out lies, which I can't abide, ever. Liars burn in goddamn Hell. Zero tolerance. Just a quirk that I have. Hopefully nobody will try and defend liars, or the act of lying, to me. But anyway.

The people who came in here to shill a product and try to skew the conversation in their direction... that really shouldn't be tolerated. I can't remember names but there were plenty who were very transparent, and as Andrew and others have pointed out, most of them vanished the second the movie was out, or shortly after.

Guys like sam are just enthusiastic, and that's fine. But I'm definitely opposed to having people from "corporate" come in here and try and "brainwash" people. I'm not convinced that it does little harm.

The larger problem with the forum isn't even about plants, and what the appropriate response to them is; it's that regardless of what the popular opinion is on any given topic from cartoons to movies to politics, if you don't agree with it, you're shouted down and run off, anyway. You don't have to be a plant, you just have to say, out loud, that you like any unpopular thing, and it's like blood in the water. This place is very heavily weighted towards "Only Consensus Is Correct" in recent years, and if we're sincere about not running people off in general, then we need to find a broader vocabulary with which to disagree. I've been saying that for at least the last ten years.

People who like the PD movies absolutely have the right to post their opinions on this forum, but I question why they would even bother. Sadism? A thirst for public abuse? Do they like being called names and having their intelligence insulted? I don't get it. I personally can choose to respect their opinion going forward, but most people here ain't me.

They're gonna get made fun of, and they're gonna get yelled at, and they're gonna have a bad time. I don't see the point.
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Old 02-04-2019, 01:08 PM   #37
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Well, my beef isn't specifically with anyone who has genuine enthusiasm for a product that "Consensus" has decided is "bad". I sincerely mean it when I say, "People can like what they like." I just think it helps if they can support their opinion a little bit beyond "feelings." "This is good because...", or, "This is bad because..."

"I feel this way because I just do..." Ehhhh, I'm not gonna try and change their minds but I'm not gonna listen to them, either.

I happen to agree with "Consensus" in the case of these films, but I more than anyone knows these peoples' pain. I am, if nothing else, the KING of "Unpopular Opinion", and I'm aware of that. Everything I could ever say about these two films, I've probably said it enough. Unless I'm asked, I'm probably gonna look forward more than back, and anything said about them will probably only be used to support a prediction about the next one.

But some people absolutely were paid to come in here to cheerlead and rabble-rouse. And, they often tried to refute Facts about the movie with flat-out lies, which I can't abide, ever. Liars burn in goddamn Hell. Zero tolerance. Just a quirk that I have. Hopefully nobody will try and defend liars, or the act of lying, to me. But anyway.

The people who came in here to shill a product and try to skew the conversation in their direction... that really shouldn't be tolerated. I can't remember names but there were plenty who were very transparent, and as Andrew and others have pointed out, most of them vanished the second the movie was out, or shortly after.

Guys like sam are just enthusiastic, and that's fine. But I'm definitely opposed to having people from "corporate" come in here and try and "brainwash" people. I'm not convinced that it does little harm.

The larger problem with the forum isn't even about plants, and what the appropriate response to them is; it's that regardless of what the popular opinion is on any given topic from cartoons to movies to politics, if you don't agree with it, you're shouted down and run off, anyway. You don't have to be a plant, you just have to say, out loud, that you like any unpopular thing, and it's like blood in the water. This place is very heavily weighted towards "Only Consensus Is Correct" in recent years, and if we're sincere about not running people off in general, then we need to find a broader vocabulary with which to disagree. I've been saying that for at least the last ten years.

People who like the PD movies absolutely have the right to post their opinions on this forum, but I question why they would even bother. Sadism? A thirst for public abuse? Do they like being called names and having their intelligence insulted? I don't get it. I personally can choose to respect their opinion going forward, but most people here ain't me.

They're gonna get made fun of, and they're gonna get yelled at, and they're gonna have a bad time. I don't see the point.
Thank you this is pretty much how I feel, alot of users were seriously forced to leave sure to their opinions just for trying to have an easy fun conversation about something they enjoy. They were belittled since like pudding reacted with think skin and venom and it got him kicked,

And regardless of how you feel about the product that sucks for people to be passed that way, it wasn't even just well this is the internet have think skin it was your wrong your stupid your a terrible person for enjoying the. That's a shame.

And hell yes I'm excited to see another tmnt sure I hope it made so most people can enjoy but everyone know you can't please everyone

If I made spelling words I will come back and edit at work and not supposed to be on my phone...
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Old 02-04-2019, 04:20 PM   #38
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I sincerely wish more people adopted this philosophy.

Thank you for being a role model.
----------

By the way, nothing's changed. If you don't agree with majority opinion, they're in fact allowed to scream in your ear what an idiot you are. There's a whole other thread about it.

I don't like BayTurtles, but I've worn out that record. But I feel obligated to tell you, anyone who doesn't subscribe to popular opinion... this board is not for them. Just in case you've thought about becoming a regular presence again.

I wouldn't.
Wait, there's a sizable number of Bayturtle fans? I'm kind of surprised. I watched the first movie and the characters were wholly unmemorable. The only thing I remember was poison gas and Shredder being a giant robot for no particular reason.

Oh, and that a bunch of New Yorkers were eating Pizza Hut or something, which in a movie about 6 foot tall mutant turtles was still the hardest part to believe.
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Old 02-04-2019, 04:56 PM   #39
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If there was anything sizeable, that second film wouldn't have bombed.


The Turtles themselves are mostly okay in my book at this point. (Mostly.) Leo eventually won me over as I knew he probably would, esp via OotS where they were all far better characters and not the hallow depictions they were in the first (that first one just made me depressed after seeing it ), but as for the movies themselves there is no excuse...
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Old 02-04-2019, 05:09 PM   #40
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Oh, and that a bunch of New Yorkers were eating Pizza Hut or something, which in a movie about 6 foot tall mutant turtles was still the hardest part to believe.
Talk about bangin' the f*ckin' nail, brother. Even someone living in a sewer would know better. Jeebus.
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