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Old 09-12-2019, 07:13 AM   #41
LeotheLateBloomer
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Imo, the issue lies in what the show is trying to do, and its general concept and vision is just being unappealing for a TMNT cartoon; mystic weapons, new and uninteresting characters, silly and awkward jokes, Raph being a buffoonish leader. This show is obviously aimed towards a younger audience which they've outright said and there's nothing inherently wrong with that. The 11 minute format does indeed work for the stories they're trying to tell but for me, most of them aren't interesting. I've enjoyed shows like Sonic Boom and even the new DC Superhero Girls TV show and I get more of a kick out of those.

Whenever this show comes back from a hiatus, I've already dropped it due to lack of interest. This show just isn't for me and I'm just not interested in seeing another wacky version of the turtles because it's the last thing this property needs, in my eyes.
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Old 09-12-2019, 09:56 AM   #42
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Imo, the issue lies in what the show is trying to do, and its general concept and vision is just being unappealing for a TMNT cartoon; mystic weapons, new and uninteresting characters, silly and awkward jokes, Raph being a buffoonish leader. This show is obviously aimed towards a younger audience which they've outright said and there's nothing inherently wrong with that. The 11 minute format does indeed work for the stories they're trying to tell but for me, most of them aren't interesting. I've enjoyed shows like Sonic Boom and even the new DC Superhero Girls TV show and I get more of a kick out of those.

Whenever this show comes back from a hiatus, I've already dropped it due to lack of interest. This show just isn't for me and I'm just not interested in seeing another wacky version of the turtles because it's the last thing this property needs, in my eyes.
At every business I've ever worked at there has been people who are the "change crowd". And change is necessary, if not always good. Except that in most occasions these people are clearly virtue signaling for change - they are riding it for strange psychological or manipulative reasons rather than anything valid.....

This are the "throw any **** at the wall to see what sticks" people. They lack real creativity so they hide behind a poor version of an original idea and they usually only wind up with a wall covered in ****.

That's how I view the showrunners of this new show. They "changed" for yuppie, groupthink, "look at me, I'm an agent of change" reasons. And the result was this show.

I think I watched one, maybe two episodes. Couldn't stand it.
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Old 09-12-2019, 09:59 AM   #43
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This show just isn't for me
It was never intended to be.
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Old 09-12-2019, 10:15 AM   #44
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That's how I view the showrunners of this new show. They "changed" for yuppie, groupthink, "look at me, I'm an agent of change" reasons. And the result was this show.

I think I watched one, maybe two episodes. Couldn't stand it.
yep.

I barely got through the pilot. I didn't need to see anymore. (and I say this as someone who enjoys a little of Teen Titans Go once in a while. I never saw that series as too serious to begin with)

If Rob Wasn't so involved in this series, it'd be getting alot more criticism from me.

I can't help but wonder if that's why they thought to bring him in to voice direct, being official turtle ambassador.
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Old 09-14-2019, 05:23 AM   #45
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Currently I’m deployed and when I was talking to my 7 year old daughter the other day she said “I don’t like these new turtles, I miss the old ones” To me, when a child says that it’s realky saying something about the series. while I myself haven’t seen any episodes from rise, I have no intentions to do so. I just haven’t been with this series since the designs were revealed. Thankfully we now have Pluto TV and can watch all of the 2003 and 2012 episodes
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Old 09-17-2019, 09:19 AM   #46
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This show does have an audience. It's just....nobody in here.

I remember being a kid, when a show I liked got a "new look." I totally hated it. But then I just grew to like it. That's how a lot of things are. You hate it but because it isn't going away your tastes adapt.

I WANT my tastes to adapt to this show but won't... and I don't know why! I guess if the OT cartoon had come out today I'd probably not like it. Most of my love for the OT is nostalgia based? Possibly.

Though I still feel that when this show feels like it, Rise is easily the best animated turtles cartoon when it comes down to fights. My main problem with this show is all of the turtles are Mikey so Mikey doesn't stand out. And there is no straight man. I'm just not gelling with this "Nothing matters and nothing is taken seriously" nature of Rise. Not saying that the show has to be dark. What I mean is every character treats their circumstances like a crappy joke they have to tell. So if they don't care about what is happening then why should I?

My tastes have just changed so while I feel this was fine for the 80s, a turtles show shouldn't be constant jokes all the time. Heck even the OT turtles wasn't that.

I'm going to shill Mao Mao as a better example of episodic light hearted fun with low stakes.

BUT AAANNNYWAY...I would strongly suggest looking outside of this place if you do happen to like Rise. Rise has fans. But very few of them are here.
And I swear to God that isn't some kind of threat or "We don't like u types here." kind of thing, I'm just being honest. This forum is dying because new people who want to get in can't even get in.

Edit: I just had an epiphany. The reason Mao Mao is better than Rise is because the three main characters have different personalities. In Rise all 4 turtles are basically the same. As much as I tend to crap on Leo for being boring (tho his 2k12 version is my favorite). A show like Mao Mao demonstrates how it is entirely possible to have your stick in the mud no nonsense character still be fun, backed up by two friend characters who are also different personality wise. The jokes are more natural when the main cast don't all act the same way. Conflict is funny!
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Old 09-17-2019, 01:36 PM   #47
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Well said and agree with much of it.

Another point imo is that the 80s Turtles benefited not just from being the first cartoon, but they were also a product of their time. A good part of the tone and style of that series is because of their time period. And even then, when times changed it tried to adapt to it in those last few seasons. Does it look goofy today, sure, but at least it feels genuine.

'Rise,' however, doesn't feel genuine to me, rather it just feels like it's trying too hard to be a certain way, rather than just trying to be good. It is partly in a way also a product of it's time, fair enough, in an age where too many cartoons try so hard to be stupid, weird and/or eccentric... and that's just not appealing to see with TMNT. It's just sad instead; Nick shoehorning them in there to be too much like everything else. Too much influence by a cartoon trend that is fast getting old. (Cripe, even Spongebob, goofy as it always was, is picking up some of that stupid stuff in these later seasons and making the shift more obvious.)

I mean, on the rare occasion that they actually touch on the overall plot and get a little more serious, sometimes it edges into being half decent. And... then it forgets that entirely and goes back to episodes with little more substance than watching the Turtles watch paint dry. Too many of them just leave me feel like, "Welp, there's that one. Next."

We were sold this whole theme of the mystic stuff, a hidden underground city, this pet of April's that is still an complete mystery (why?), etc... and the series isn't even owning it. I'm not overly big on the mystic direction, but geezus, at least OWN what you supposedly wanted to be and BE it.

As a die hard and glutton for punishment, though, I still check it out and just keep waiting for more eps that end feeling like they were worth the time given to watch it, and keep waiting and hoping for it to get better to some extent... Not with an in vain hope that it's going to turn into a superior predecessor, but at least, like I said, own the supposed theme of the mystic city stuff, not a theme of "just how absurd can they act" in eps that wouldn't matter if they were skipped.


The personality stuff though, as mentioned, has always been the part that bothered me most about this one. They don't all have to be Mikey in order to be funny and enjoyable. Different types of humor are a good thing. I always loved Leo's sense of humor in most cases in everything else before now. Infrequent, being the straight man and all, but when it happens it feels all the more genuine and good. Him acting and treated as some dummy is just so disappointingly out of character.

How the hell did we go from noble, stoic depictions of him to, well, this...


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Old 09-17-2019, 10:15 PM   #48
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I mean, we all knew the show wasn't gonna be serious, and not just character-wise but overall story structure-wise an story arc-wise. But most people here tried their darnest to make it some sort of lore deep super intense don't-miss-an-episode-cause-you'll-miss-an-important-clue story driven thing. It's not. It's just not.

The whole premise with the underground city and magic weapons was just the opening premise so something would already stand out from the other shows, namely, all-new magical weapons. It just wasn't that kind of show, and it just wasn't 'for us', no matter how much some of us want it to be. It is what it is.
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Old 09-18-2019, 03:29 AM   #49
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Another point imo is that the 80s Turtles benefited not just from being the first cartoon, but they were also a product of their time. A good part of the tone and style of that series is because of their time period. And even then, when times changed it tried to adapt to it in those last few seasons. Does it look goofy today, sure, but at least it feels genuine.
That, and also the OT was what started the Turtle Fandom off. Yes, there were the comic books and they had their following, but the OT is what kicked off everything. And while that series did have it's serious moment and arcs, it was largely a slapstick humor show aimed at kids.

Future incarnations have given us serious turtles in the 2k3, and serious turtles who are free to be teenagers and just not take things seriously in the 2k12.

Rise feels like it's trying to recreate the humor of the OT but incorporate it into the current age. Which unfortunately does hurt the story because it's like we have "Wacky adventure...Wacky adventure...wacky adventure...then serious plot followed by five wacky adventures." The serious plots at least have the luxury of being full 20-minute episodes. But the 11-minute episodes seem to hurt the story because they are sacrificing the story they should be following for cheap laughs. They do have plots that center on random silliness between the brothers, and those work as 11-minute episodes. But there are other episodes where things could have been longer because it could have had character development for all a character or all the characters. Or maybe a lesson one or all of the turtles need to learn over the course of the episode. But those lessons are instead ignored or rushed because they need to bring together the conflict and resolution in the 11 minute time frame.

Take the episode Mrs. Cuddles, for example, Raph automatically knows she's evil but it's never explained how he knew she was evil.

That easily could have been explained by having the turtles watching the show April's involved with. Then at one point, Raph notices Mrs. Cuddles leering up at the camera like she's looking directly into his soul but everyone else doesn't see it or even notice it. Raph could then try to point that out, which causes his brothers and April to tease him about being scared of a "Cute little bunny rabbit" And then as a way of pranking Raph, April is convinced to bring the puppet to the lair next visit.

There is also the problem with the villain, while TMNT always has had a large villain roster. They do focus largely on the villains they are supposed to focus on, namely the Shredder and Krang, or Shredder and the Kraang in the 2k12 version.

This version of the series introduces a new villain named Barron Draxum. However, we don't learn enough about him to really understand his role or motivation as a villain. Having John Cena voice him means that he's only going to be available for a limited number of episodes since he is a celebrity voice. Which only hurts his character, if he's going to be the main big bad of this season at the very least. Because that means he's not given the focus he's supposed to be given as a new major villain. While not all episodes will center around him or need to, there is still going to need a could 3/4 of a season to establish why he's the Turtles main enemy before the Shredder is introduced.

Understandably, not all incarnations of the Turtles have to start out with the Turtles and the Shredder encountering each other. They easily could have had the Turtles fight another villain such as the Foot Lieutenant and Foot Brute by themselves all the while offering hints the Shredder is looming on the horizon. Which is something we have in this series as we see the Foot Clan obtaining parts of the Shredder's armor.

Yet, Draxom has been introduced in this series as the big bad of the season. Aside from creating the Turtles and wanting to mutate the city with his Oozesquitos we don't really much reason for him to exist in this show. Particularly since there are other villains who are just as dangerous as the Shredder that havw yet to be used in the show lore such as Null for example.


The only thing that is really motivating Draxum now is that he is going to be given the Shredder's Armor because reasons. It's likely he's meant to be a vessel for the Shredder's spirit. Even if that was the case, the Foot Clan summon Draxum from out of nowhere by the Foot Clan even though they never encountered him before then. So how could they be certain he's the one who is destined to become the Shredder's vessel?
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Old 09-18-2019, 09:53 AM   #50
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I would strongly suggest looking outside of this place if you do happen to like Rise. Rise has fans. But very few of them are here.
I'm sure there are... some kind of fans out there avidly discussing it. Somewhere. Though it's hard to imagine large numbers of sound-minded people above the age of 13 actually going back and forth in meaningful discourse about such a show. What would you even talk about? "That was SO COOL the way Leo did that wacky thing and we heard that sound effect in that one ten minute episode, amirite?"

It would seem an exercise in... masochism? No?
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Old 09-18-2019, 10:36 AM   #51
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I look forward to a day when there is hopefully a series that actually generates decent episode discussion again. I just hope it happens before I'm old.





One of the plot holes in the basic foundation of it that I'm not understanding why it even still exists and could have been touched on/resolved a while ago is Mayhem's story.

We have no idea what this creature really even is, or his origin other than assuming he came from that mystic city. Does he have a previous owner? IS this creature a pet-like animal to begin with? Somehow he got wrapped up in this thing with Draxum, but we have no idea why or how other than he was on the run from him. And there really seems to be a forgotten and unknown person/being involved here who is the one who tied that vial around Mayhem's neck.


Sure, I'm probably giving it "too much thought" for a show that just wants to be simple and dumb and mostly stick to pointless one-shot episodes. But as I said, the thing with Mayhem is kind of part of the basic foundation of the thing to start with, being there from the start and all. It's like leaving the lair out of a series and just being like, Oh well, they live somewhere, but lets never bother seeing it.

Maybe it'll gone back to it after Shredder actually manages to get involved, though the would-be Mayhem story seems more of a Draxum arc thing...
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Old 09-18-2019, 10:55 AM   #52
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Outside of this forum, I have my YouTube channel for 2003 related stuff and I interact with some fans there, but I always come here because I feel there is a sense of authority, and it's easier to share and keep track of things. I don't really have a problem with social media, but I don't think it's designed well for archiving and frequently accessing resources like on a traditional website due to the massive amount of new posts being made everyday from people all over the world.
It's for that reason why I joined this forum.

Ever since rediscovering TMNT, I went out and searched for every thing I could find on the franchise and I found this forum.

On "Rise" in general I have much difficulty taking the series seriously but since I started working my new fan comic "A Weird world" which is a Rise/2012 crossover, I decided to have some fun with it.
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Old 09-18-2019, 12:55 PM   #53
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I'm sure there are... some kind of fans out there avidly discussing it. Somewhere. Though it's hard to imagine large numbers of sound-minded people above the age of 13 actually going back and forth in meaningful discourse about such a show. What would you even talk about? "That was SO COOL the way Leo did that wacky thing and we heard that sound effect in that one ten minute episode, amirite?"

It would seem an exercise in... masochism? No?

To be damnably honest most fan discourse I see is on tumblr. Or an actual Rise discord (I forgot the name but its a tmnt discord mostly for Rise fans. If you want to know what it is I can find it and tell anyone curious)

Most discourse is about how gay the turtles are. Sexuality headcanons. April being 'fierce'....worst but not least this pervasive idea that Rise Splinter is a "good" dad. But mostly its about how gay- coded the turtles are.

Also @ The Great Saiyaman Do you draw often? You're pretty good!
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Old 09-18-2019, 12:58 PM   #54
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We get it, Saiyaman, you make fan art. Stop pimping it in every GD thread.
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Old 09-18-2019, 01:01 PM   #55
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Hi Powder.

Go away Powder.
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Old 09-18-2019, 03:01 PM   #56
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Most discourse is about how gay the turtles are. Sexuality headcanons.
*sigh* Isn't it all anymore...

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worst but not least this pervasive idea that Rise Splinter is a "good" dad.
Whaa? Either they must be reading into it what they want, or they've got pretty poor judgement of what even a vaguely decent parent looks like. It's off putting enough all on it's own that he dehumanizes them, so to speak, by calling them by their designated colors and not their names. It's a wonder they even have names and know what they are. Other Splinters that were always a rat manage to be far better fathers than this previously human one.
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Old 09-18-2019, 03:11 PM   #57
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To be damnably honest most fan discourse I see is on tumblr. Or an actual Rise discord (I forgot the name but its a tmnt discord mostly for Rise fans. If you want to know what it is I can find it and tell anyone curious)

Most discourse is about how gay the turtles are. Sexuality headcanons. April being 'fierce'....worst but not least this pervasive idea that Rise Splinter is a "good" dad. But mostly its about how gay- coded the turtles are.
So basically... no sound-minded discourse, then.
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Old 09-18-2019, 04:08 PM   #58
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Most discourse is about how gay the turtles are. Sexuality headcanons. April being 'fierce'....worst but not least this pervasive idea that Rise Splinter is a "good" dad. But mostly its about how gay- coded the turtles are.
thats about all that matters to the tumbler crowd.

Fun fact - I had no idea there where 'secret coded gay messages' in he-man until I hit the internet. I just thought it was afun/goofy action adventure series with good heart.

Silly me. guess I needed my tin foil hat.
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Old 09-18-2019, 05:29 PM   #59
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thats about all that matters to the tumbler crowd.

Fun fact - I had no idea there where 'secret coded gay messages' in he-man until I hit the internet. I just thought it was afun/goofy action adventure series with good heart.

Silly me. guess I needed my tin foil hat.
To be fair, I feel like the Turtles geta bit more gay every series. But yeah there's nothing to talk about or analyze in a 10 minute show.
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Old 09-18-2019, 08:13 PM   #60
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thats about all that matters to the tumbler crowd.

Fun fact - I had no idea there where 'secret coded gay messages' in he-man until I hit the internet. I just thought it was afun/goofy action adventure series with good heart.

Silly me. guess I needed my tin foil hat.
Last I heard some or several of the writers of he man and she ra were gay. So I'm not surprised.
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