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Old 09-13-2021, 03:01 PM   #1
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Shredder's inability to find the Turtles Lair

In the FW series, Shredder really wanted to find out the Turtles Lair and tried to do so several times but to no avail.

However, some other characters have managed to find it. Lotus Blossom, Zach, Chronos and The Rat King alone have done it. So how come Shredder and Krang couldn't with the technology they had? I mean, ZACH of all people, managed to find it.

The Rat King knowing of it in the Red Sky seasons and not telling Shredder about it is just strange. You'd think Shredder would have pressed him to tell the location.

Thoughts?
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Old 09-13-2021, 03:14 PM   #2
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Realistically New York's sewers are huge and the Turtles only live in one particular storm drain. It would make sense they're difficult to locate.
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Old 09-13-2021, 03:27 PM   #3
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The Old Switcheroo

He is there in The Old Switcheroo.
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Old 09-13-2021, 03:29 PM   #4
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By that analysis though, it would also make sense that Shredder could systematically find them....

I mean... he does have a foot army to comb the sewers and a living brain with super tech to create a search plan.
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Old 09-13-2021, 03:53 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Original TMNT Cartoon Fan View Post
He is there in The Old Switcheroo.
In Splinter's body. He had something covering his eyes the whole way to there. Meaning he didn't find it nor did he get to know how to get there.

He's also there in Cowabunga's Shredhead, but that's when his brain gets turned into Michelangelo's.
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Old 09-13-2021, 04:05 PM   #6
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In Splinter's body. He had something covering his eyes the whole way to there.
But not on his way back to the laboratory.
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Old 09-13-2021, 05:19 PM   #7
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But not on his way back to the laboratory.
I think he left in a hurry and didn’t remember where the lair was later. After all, it was shown he still didn’t know where it was in later episodes:

Pizza By The Shred: he needed an anchovy homing device to find it and ended up in the Rat King’s domain.

The Missing Map: he needed the map to find the lair, ended up on a wild goose chase.

Also Baxter Stockman found the lair in Return of the Fly.
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Old 09-13-2021, 09:39 PM   #8
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I think he left in a hurry and didn’t remember where the lair was later. After all, it was shown he still didn’t know where it was in later episodes:

Pizza By The Shred: he needed an anchovy homing device to find it and ended up in the Rat King’s domain.

The Missing Map: he needed the map to find the lair, ended up on a wild goose chase.

Also Baxter Stockman found the lair in Return of the Fly.
Oh I don't remember Baxter finding it.

Interesting how characters with much less technological means at their disposal were able to find the Turtles Lair while Shredder and Krang never managed to.

It's also surprising how April always seems to remember the way and never get lost.
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Old 09-13-2021, 09:46 PM   #9
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That's another thing. They always captured April to lure the Turtles into a trap, but never to try to get the info out of her of where the Turtles Lair was.

They even had April go after the Turtles while she was a mutant cat.... and never sent some Foot Soldiers or whatever to follow her.
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Old 09-13-2021, 09:49 PM   #10
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I guess if they let Shredder find the Lair they'd have to make the Turtles move to a different one and come up with a new design, and they didn't want to do that.
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Old 09-14-2021, 01:35 AM   #11
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Yeah, I try not to gripe about it too much but this is definitely one of those "The show was just pretty lazily-written" kinda things. In-story there's just no good explanation.
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Old 09-14-2021, 07:05 AM   #12
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In "Name That Toon" Shredder and Krang saw the turtles' lair from the view screen.
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Old 09-14-2021, 08:31 AM   #13
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Baxter only found it because he was between dimensions and it took months of searching. Probably why he wasn't at all concerned that the Technodrome was back on Earth again,

Another instance is The Making Of Metalhead. After Metalhead was defeated after acquiring the Turtles' ninja skills, there was an oil slick the villains used to track the Turtles and the new Metalhead alerted them, leading to a chase scene.
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Old 09-14-2021, 09:35 AM   #14
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You'd think with all the random cameras Shredder had monitoring the streets and the sewers of the city, that he'd have been able to triangulate the most likely locations!
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Old 09-14-2021, 09:43 AM   #15
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You'd think with all the random cameras Shredder had monitoring the streets and the sewers of the city, that he'd have been able to triangulate the most likely locations!
This is the sh*t, man. It's like how in some of the old He-Man cartoons, the bad guys have their magic portal thing that lets them just spy on whatever the heroes are doing... and conveniently, they never catch Adam changing into He-Man at any of those moments. Just for example.

Thundercats did that sh*t too. Lots of shows. The bad guys need to be omniscient so they can "make up" a brilliant plan on the spot by watching what the good guys are up to, but are also conveniently ignorant, blind, or stupid whenever the plot demands it.

Part of it is kinda forgivable, in that "Hey man, it's for little kids and they're not gonna think about that." On the other hand, watching some of this stuff as an adult can be tooth-grinding.
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Old 09-14-2021, 09:48 AM   #16
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I like how Rita's plans would vary between taking over Angel Grove, to wiping out the Power Rangers to 'awww Kimberly is working on a parade float, let's smash it and ruin her day!'

Rita Repulsa was literally the 'that's a real nice thing you got there, be a real shame if someone were to **** it up' meme before the meme existed.
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Old 09-14-2021, 04:42 PM   #17
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Shredder often did know were the lair was or had the means to locate it.

In the first season he knew were Yoshi was living in the sewers so he could plant the mutagen meant to...come to think of it what did he think was going to happen to Yoshi?

The Mousers easily located the lair. Either because Shredder had programmed them were to look or they could home in on a mutant rat.

He broadcast his ultimatum over the turtles TV so presumably was able to simply broadcast the signal straight to the lair.

I know the general fanon is that the turtles moved lairs to explain their differing designs in the first three seasons. Even if that's accurate in the second season opener Baxter kidnapped Splinter straight from the lair. Again he either knew were it was or was able home in on a mutant rat. The latter seems plausible considering the next episode he was able to build a device to locate the turtles themselves.

In the third season The Making of Metalhead, Metalhead was able to locate the lair. I guess Krang and Shredder were extremely shortsigted by not using the device or program that allowed the robot they themselves built to that themselves.
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Old 09-14-2021, 05:39 PM   #18
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Part of it is kinda forgivable, in that "Hey man, it's for little kids and they're not gonna think about that." On the other hand, watching some of this stuff as an adult can be tooth-grinding.


ahem

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Old 09-14-2021, 06:56 PM   #19
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If Shredder attacked the lair right away, there'd be no reason to have multiple seasons.
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Old 09-14-2021, 11:42 PM   #20
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I like how Rita's plans would vary between taking over Angel Grove, to wiping out the Power Rangers to 'awww Kimberly is working on a parade float, let's smash it and ruin her day!'
"What a wench"




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