Official Mutant Apocalypse Arc Discussion (SERIES FINALE)

[Powder]

Originally Posted by asfaloth12

Oh, I can think of plenty of reasons And I can think of a few reasons why it does not fit into canon. That's all I will say for now, in order to avoid going into "rant mode" and potentially starting an argument. There are some good posts on Tumblr, regarding this. People are being civil so far, and I will try my best not to disrupt that..too much.

Have all the fun you want with that, but it'll never be more than headcanon, yo.

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by Vegita-San

I also can't help but wonder if Nick always intended for 'the big blow out' to be the series finale..

but the crew being into serious stuff though they are, fought tooth and nail to get this extra set of episodes done as THEIR season finale?

What the hell are you talking about, Vegita-san? Season 5 had a 20 episode order to begin with. This arc were the last produced and written episodes of Season 5.

The 80's crossover wasn't even the second to last arc, the Usagi arc was. So I have no idea why the hell you keep saying Ciro and co, not whoever is scheduling the eps to air on TV, didn't always intend this to be the finale.

[Glitter Wand]

Personally, I think Leo's secondary mutation added more depth. He tried to save his family, but he got hit in the process. Seeing him nearly kill Raph was quite sad. Then again, he wasn't in his right mind. I feel his brothers put forth their best efforts to bring him back, especially Raph, since we don't see a lot of brotherly moments between them.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Originally Posted by Vegita-San

The Bomb clearly went off in NYC, yet it all seems they moved out west for some reason.

The Atlantic Ocean probably became the Atlantic Desert.

[Kit31]

Originally Posted by Glitter Wand

Personally, I think Leo's secondary mutation added more depth. He tried to save his family, but he got hit in the process. Seeing him nearly kill Raph was quite sad. Then again, he wasn't in his right mind. I feel his brothers put forth their best efforts to bring him back, especially Raph, since we don't see a lot of brotherly moments between them.

We might not see a lot of brotherly moments between Raph and Leo, but those two have a really deep connection. Look at all the times Raph saves Leo and vice versa. I think the brotherly dynamic between these two is the strongest between all the brothers. Leo also seems pretty close to Mikey, but the relationship between Leo and Raph is incredibly strong. You can tell how much they care about each other.

[IndigoErth]

So were the other characters we saw regular animals or humans to start with? I suspect they were regular animals, but... uh, but the species we saw were not native creatures to the U.S., so...???

Maybe they were zoo animals...? Or is the whole planet desert and the TMNT were in fact very far from home (and only coincidence they relocated each other after a many years)?




Agree with Leo and Raph. They're the typical sort of siblings that butt heads a lot and may not really 'get' each other a lot of the time (not to mention very competitive), but push come to shove they have each other's backs.

[Sabacooza]

Originally Posted by Glitter Wand

Personally, I think Leo's secondary mutation added more depth. He tried to save his family, but he got hit in the process. Seeing him nearly kill Raph was quite sad. Then again, he wasn't in his right mind. I feel his brothers put forth their best efforts to bring him back, especially Raph, since we don't see a lot of brotherly moments between them.

Don't forget the I love you part came full circle. First when Leo said it to Raph in Riddle of the Ancient Aeons and in the finale when Raph said it to Leo. That was a very cool moment and I'm glad they added that.

[Ninturtle]

Originally Posted by Tarris Vaal

Yeah Leo's new design was.... was really not good. I know he was meant to be a hulking monster and all but....

Still I actually quite like the rest of them. Took some getting used to, but all in all, they are decent character designs

I agree, I hated how he had such a humanoid physique and such a tiny head. Wish he looked more like Monster Don from 4 kids or Monster Raph from image. I think it would be cool to see artist on the drome redesign Leo.

[asfaloth12]

Originally Posted by Powder

Have all the fun you want with that, but it'll never be more than headcanon, yo.

Oh, I will . Here's the good thing: everybody can have their own headcanon regarding this arc (you can think of it as an the actual future vs just a possible future in the canon timeline vs alternate reality/timeline vs dream vs whatever).
One of the writers apparently said that the Season 4 finale/Kavaxas arc was the true ending. Everything else is just a side story. Take or leave what you want.

Originally Posted by Sabacooza

Don't forget the I love you part came full circle. First when Leo said it to Raph in Riddle of the Ancient Aeons and in the finale when Raph said it to Leo. That was a very cool moment and I'm glad they added that.

That was one of the good parts; very sweet. Sean Astin did a great job with this arc

[Chris]

I finally watched it yesterday (thanks to RedWorld) but didn't get chance to post my thoughts.

I'm a bit mixed on it.

As a stand alone arc (or "tale") about a possible future I think it was pretty good. But as the definitive future and series finale it just wasn't good enough.

Don definitely had the best future design (and was probably my favourite turtle in the arc as well). I loved robo Don!

Raph looked good once he had a shave (what the heck was that beard about lol!) He gave me a Dark Knight Returns vibe which really fit the old Raph character.

I wasn't the fondest of Mikey's design (again, hair? Why?!) but I loved the way he fought, so causal and effortless. I loved how this contrasted with Raph's much heavier and physical style. Their fighting styles fit their designs and builds which was a great touch.

Leo. Ugh. I hated what they did with Leo. It worked well enough I guess (the "I love you" moment was nice) but it was like I feared before the finale - turn one of the guys evil as a "surprise" twist rather than for legitimate character reasons. Given the whole thing was revealed and resolved in less than 5 minutes it just felt like it was purely done to be a shock reveal and didn't have the weight something like that needed to have. I'd rather Verminator Rex have been the main villain or have his master be whoever set off the bomb (giving us more info on that) and bring Leo in sooner (with Mikey maybe) or later (maybe as guardian of the oasis or something). They should have cut some of the chase scenes and given more time to the Leo story to give it the time it deserved to be told better.

The design work and world building was fantastic, it was great to see Chompy grown and Ice Cream Kitty going all out with the guns. Mira/Meera (how is it spelt?) was a good character but I can't help but feel for the series finale her screen time should have been given to April, Casey or Karai, in the present or in flashback, to give resolution to their story. Heck it would have been nice to see Bebop & Rocksteady or some of the other mutants again in this future as well, even if just as cameos in the mutant gangs.

Ultimately I guess I enjoyed it as a tale of a possible future but I don't like it as the future and I can totally understand why Nick wants the crossover arc to air as the finale. Owari or End Times both work better as finales than this, which is a shame. The future arc was the one I was looking forward to the most this season but it was ultimately the one that let me down the most. It certainly wasn't terrible, it just didn't live up to it's potential and didn't give too many important characters (April, Karai, Casey, arguably Leo) the resolution they deserved after 5 years.

Edit - Just want to say I loved the final For Kevin & Peter sketch, that was really neat.

[Sabacooza]

Originally Posted by asfaloth12

Sean Astin did a great job with this arc

Agreed. He really did.

[Aaronardo]

So, wait. Renet refers to the Turtles as heroes recognized as such in the future in Turtles in Time. Renet is a human, but all humans were destroyed in the mutagen bomb and the Turtles get more of a bittersweet ending than recognition for what they've done for the city, but it's not like they would anyway since all human civilization on Earth is completely wiped out.

So, it isn't that far-fetched to say this episode depicts an alternate timeline, then. Because if the previous episodes truly preceded this episode, then she wouldn't be present in the Monster Arc and Turtles In Time and Tale of the Yokai wouldn't have even happened. Or is there something I'm missing?

(Footnote: I don't know why people are fawning over that "I love you, bro," line. That bit was so awfully cheesy and with more time could've been done SO much better).

[Sabacooza]

Originally Posted by Aaronardo

I don't know why people are fawning over that "I love you, bro," line. That bit was so awfully cheesy and with more time could've been done SO much better).

What would you do differently?

[Faster and Cheaper]

Awesome. That ended up being better than I thought it would. Working on the first part I wasn't sure how it would all turn out, and my contract ended before I saw the other two teams finish their animation.

I'll post my thoughts on the three parter soon as well as funny tales of life behind the scenes soon. Hard to believe that I was finishing up this story just five months ago.

[Glitter Wand]

Since this is technically the series finale, I'm going to see it as a possible future. A downright dismal one, yes, but still probable.

[CyberCubed]

Is Renet even from our Earth? Or is it just humans living in some other dimension or planet? Kind of like how Star Wars has humans all over the galaxy not from Earth, etc. Just because she's human doesn't mean she's from Earth.

[Glitter Wand]

I think she's from an alternate, futuristic dimension.

[IndigoErth]

Originally Posted by Chris

maybe as guardian of the oasis or something

That's what I was initially thinking, that they'd get there and find that he's already there and has been there for years already. (Perhaps having helped build a new civilization there and busy passing on his martial arts training to another generation.)

Or he's there alongside a small population of humans who did survive, and he's picked up a Ghost of the Jungle lifestyle.

[Ashwolf]

Originally Posted by Kit31

There's so much hate for Leo's design. I personally didn't mind it TOO much. He reminded me a lot of Dark Leo in the 2003 series. The only thing that looked really weird to me about his design was his neck. I personally liked his head because he's always been adorable. Even after his brutal second mutation, I'm glad he still looks young-ish.

Also, I liked his role in the episode, but the Leo fangirl in me wishes he had a LOT more screen-time. I really think they should have had one more episode to finish things off.

So feel the same, I mean I feel bad about his 2nd mutation and wish it wasn't a perm thing but doesn't look that bad if u exclude his neck and how his skin looks so stretched and thin...

Originally Posted by asfaloth12

Oh, I can think of plenty of reasons And I can think of a few reasons why it does not fit into canon. That's all I will say for now, in order to avoid going into "rant mode" and potentially starting an argument. There are some good posts on Tumblr, regarding this. People are being civil so far, and I will try my best not to disrupt that..too much.


Love your icon by the way. I have fond memories of the Fred Wolf cartoon, and Leo did become my favorite turtle from that cartoon (it was Raphael for a while)


In fairness, I thought he looked a little better in the last shot. The face looked OK (all of the turtles had weird teeth, except for poor Donnie, of course). It just looked weird in comparison to the rest of his body. Made me think of a mini dinosaur, for some reason. At least he still has those blue eyes of his Maybe Donnie fixes him later on in that timeline/reality. He may need to if they believe Leo is at risk of going insane again. Plus, I'm curious as to how stable/healthy this double mutation is; those glowing veins look rather ominous. There may be good reason to attempt a de-mutation, other than for aesthetic reasons.

Honestly think the same cause of it being wayyyyyy 2 easy and the potential huge amount of mutagen that he was exposed 2, it would be highly likely that he slips back into it. Although that is if Donnie can build himself a new way of charging himself from scrap materials that he would have 2 refine the metals and so on himself before his battery ran out.

[CyberCubed]

I bet there are humans at oasis. Maybe april.