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Old 12-07-2022, 01:20 AM   #381
Leo656
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Now that the dust is settled, it's official: WB is gonna lose between $100-200 million on "The Great Course-Correction Movie". The movie they went to great lengths to convince us would be "the saving grace of the DCEU" is perhaps its most high-profile failure. Consider that BoP and the Squad sequel did very badly, but nobody expected big returns on those movies. THIS was touted as the DC movie that was finally gonna win everyone over, establish brand confidence among critics and fans, and finally set a firm and stable course for the future, and... nope.

I've said it before and I'll say it a million times: As divisive as Snyder's movies were, at least they made Actual Profit. BvS may have a dismal RT score and may in fact be THE most "love it or hate it" movie in all of movies period, not just super-hero fare, but at least there's not $200 million of red ink stuck to it. It's actually one of the most financially-successful DC movies of all time, factoring in discs and such. So somebody liked it.

But lest we forget, the current state of the DCEU is ALL because WB demanded that BvS make about $1.1 billion and it "only" made a little under 900 mil. Still profitable, still plenty of toys sold, altogether a very successful piece of business for WB even if the reviews were scathing. BUT, "not good enough", they dumped both Baby and Bathwater and they've been floundering ever since. Wonder Woman and Aquaman did okay but that feels like forever ago, now, and more recently WB would KILL for one of their DCEU movies to "just" scrape under 900 mil. That "failure" that started all of their woes in the first place is a result they would do anything to replicate, now. When goddamn "Shazam!" with its honestly crummy box office take is considered a "success" as far as the DCEU, you really gotta wonder what the hell these people grade by. For the last 5 years it seems like they settle for, "Well, we barely made money (or lost a ton of it) BUT the reviews in Entertainment Weekly weren't so bad!"

I don't see Flash or Aquaman 2 doing huge business either, frankly. More and more, it's like "They REALLY should have just let Zack do his thing" seems like the best-case scenario. I mean even if it had failed, it'd all be over and done with by now and we'd be looking at the hard reboot and a clean slate. And if it had gotten over with people in the long run, then even better. As it is, pushing him out seems like a worse mistake every day because it's clear as a bell they really have no ultimate plan or vision for this sh*t. All WB knows how to do is react, and then OVER react.

All the hoopla about "James Gunn is gonna save the DCEU!", and so far we have a Blue Beetle poster and some more whispers about Spielberg doing Blackhawks. Yawn. It's still ultimately WB in charge, and it's still a giant f*cking mess of their own making over there.
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Old 12-07-2022, 06:27 AM   #382
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Even if this was a great movie, the reason it bombed is because literally nobody cares or even knows who Black Adam is. And The Rock cast as him obviously doesn't hold as much star power as he used to.

Instead of DC making sure movies for their top heroes work, they keep making movies about characters nobody in the real world even knows. The Blue Beetle movie is going to bomb just as bad too, even if the movie itself turns out good.
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Old 12-07-2022, 09:43 AM   #383
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Well to James Gunn's credit he did remove DC's "Gorilla Limit". So.... you know.
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Old 12-07-2022, 09:49 AM   #384
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All the hoopla about "James Gunn is gonna save the DCEU!", and so far we have a Blue Beetle poster and some more whispers about Spielberg doing Blackhawks. Yawn. It's still ultimately WB in charge, and it's still a giant f*cking mess of their own making over there.
James Gunn hasn't had a chance to do anything yet. He's simply helping past projects reach completion while he plans for the future.

As for it still being WB in charge - yes and no. David Zaslav is upending the entire operation they had going on, from the looks of things. It's a new approach.

Generally speaking, WB has been very reactionary, but that's in part due to the constant changes in leadership. But with Zaslav at the top now, he should be able to reign that in a little, especially with Gunn in the big chair - a guy who clearly has a plan and a vision (which, no, I don't think is going to be full on dick-jokes by any stretch).
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Old 12-07-2022, 06:24 PM   #385
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Dwayne Johnson
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Waited to confirm with financiers before I shared this excellent #BlackAdam news - our film will PROFIT between $52M-$72M.
Fact.
At almost $400M worldwide we are building our new franchise step by step (first Captain America did $370M) for the DC future.

https://twitter.com/TheRock/status/1600589666683846656
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Old 12-07-2022, 11:38 PM   #386
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The reports are conflicting. I don't buy Rock's tweet, sounds like spin.

Reports are coming out that since Black Adam failed, WB is back in "hard reboot" mode. Aquaman 2 will be allegedly be used to close off the DCEU once and for all, after which the entire franchise will be given a total reboot. Every single actor will be recast and things will start over from Zero.

This directly clashes with the reports that Black Adam 2 is on the fast track and Hawkman as well... but what is MORE likely, in all honesty, considering the movie lost a fortune (no matter WHAT Dwayne says)?

Supposedly there will be a "major announcement" next week to let everyone know once and for all what the DC plan is, so there's no more confusion or mixed signals. Smart money says it's the "hard reboot" announcement.

Ah well.
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Old 12-08-2022, 07:28 AM   #387
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The reports are conflicting. I don't buy Rock's tweet, sounds like spin.

Reports are coming out that since Black Adam failed, WB is back in "hard reboot" mode. Aquaman 2 will be allegedly be used to close off the DCEU once and for all, after which the entire franchise will be given a total reboot. Every single actor will be recast and things will start over from Zero.

This directly clashes with the reports that Black Adam 2 is on the fast track and Hawkman as well... but what is MORE likely, in all honesty, considering the movie lost a fortune (no matter WHAT Dwayne says)?

Supposedly there will be a "major announcement" next week to let everyone know once and for all what the DC plan is, so there's no more confusion or mixed signals. Smart money says it's the "hard reboot" announcement.

Ah well.
Also, Variety removed the mention of BA2 and a Hawkman spin-off from their article. Must have been shut down by Gunn, possibly behind the scenes to help them save face. He’s been shutting down rumors hardcore since he took the job.
He put a few grifters in their place on Twitter and it was glorious to watch.

I think it’s pretty clear to see The Rock was trying to make a power play, and was leveraging the Snyder fandom and Cavill to make that happen. It didn’t really work.

I’m thinking Rock had to fight very hard for Cavill, and when it didn’t bring the film to even break even, the studio decided “eff it, let’s reboot.”

If that is the case, it would be very presumptuous of Cavill though. He’s out there saying “I’m back, I’m back.” I’ve gotta think he will play Superman again at least once, but who knows at this point. I’d think even with a reboot, you could do some multiverse shenanigans to give the guy his due. Will be extremely interesting and kinda sad if that cameo was his last appearance. Hard to imagine. Cavill is just hard to place a bead on. He tends to be vague when discussing Superman, he turns down a lot of cameos, he didn’t seem to love Zack’s vision, rumors (I stress the word) are that he’s difficult to work with. So who knows.
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Old 12-08-2022, 12:20 PM   #388
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Also, Variety removed the mention of BA2 and a Hawkman spin-off from their article. Must have been shut down by Gunn, possibly behind the scenes to help them save face. He’s been shutting down rumors hardcore since he took the job.
He put a few grifters in their place on Twitter and it was glorious to watch.

I think it’s pretty clear to see The Rock was trying to make a power play, and was leveraging the Snyder fandom and Cavill to make that happen. It didn’t really work.

I’m thinking Rock had to fight very hard for Cavill, and when it didn’t bring the film to even break even, the studio decided “eff it, let’s reboot.”

If that is the case, it would be very presumptuous of Cavill though. He’s out there saying “I’m back, I’m back.” I’ve gotta think he will play Superman again at least once, but who knows at this point. I’d think even with a reboot, you could do some multiverse shenanigans to give the guy his due. Will be extremely interesting and kinda sad if that cameo was his last appearance. Hard to imagine. Cavill is just hard to place a bead on. He tends to be vague when discussing Superman, he turns down a lot of cameos, he didn’t seem to love Zack’s vision, rumors (I stress the word) are that he’s difficult to work with. So who knows.
Shoulda just done Man of Steel 2 way back then before all the crossover business. Bad enough they had to put Batman in the sequel, where now all the press was more concerned about who will play the new Batman rather than anything related to Superman, then they cram in Doomsday and Wonder Woman AND hints of the other heroes existing too.
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Old 12-08-2022, 12:43 PM   #389
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Shoulda just done Man of Steel 2 way back then before all the crossover business. Bad enough they had to put Batman in the sequel, where now all the press was more concerned about who will play the new Batman rather than anything related to Superman, then they cram in Doomsday and Wonder Woman AND hints of the other heroes existing too.
Hard to imagine due to butterfly effect, but it sounds better than what they did, to me.

A hypothetical Man of Steel 2 sounds awesome, and it allows Ben Affleck some time to develop his vision, without having to prepare for the role so soon.
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Old 12-08-2022, 12:49 PM   #390
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James Gunn
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So. As for the story yesterday in the Hollywood Reporter, some of it is true, some of it is half-true, some of it is not true, & some of it we haven’t decided yet whether it’s true or not.
10:27 AM · Dec 8, 2022


Although this first month at DC has been fruitful, building the next ten years of story takes time & we’re still just beginning.

Peter & I chose to helm DC Studios knowing we were coming into a fractious environment, both in the stories being told & in the audience itself & there would be an unavoidable transitional period as we moved into telling a cohesive story across film, TV, animation, and gaming.



But, in the end, the drawbacks of that transitional period were dwarfed by the creative possibilities & the opportunity to build upon what has worked in DC so far & to help rectify what has not.


We know we are not going to make every single person happy every step of the way, but we can promise everything we do is done in the service of the STORY & in the service of the DC CHARACTERS we know you cherish and we have cherished our whole lives.



As for more answers about the future of the DCU, I will sadly have to ask you to wait. We are giving these characters & the stories the time & attention they deserve & we ourselves still have a lot more questions to ask & answer.
from Gunn's twitter
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Old 12-13-2022, 11:03 PM   #391
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The more Gunn talks about things the more I'm getting worried, honestly. I hope we get some actual good news soon. The "announcement" about Cavill is back and a new Superman movie is coming was like the only good, exciting news to come out about the DCEU in many years now. And now that might be pulled away? It'd be fine and enough for now if they just reassured people with a quick, "Yes, Cavill's our guy, yes he's going to be headlining a new Superman movie. No, we haven't figured out what exactly that's going to resemble."

I also don't like the way Gunn is handling fans, en masse. I'm already seeing a lot of "Oh, you're probably typing this from your mom's basement!" type stuff from him in response to posts that aren't even that bad or rude. The same exact stuff you'd hear from the whole cast of Ghostbusters 2016 and its defenders everyday when that came out and the reactions started coming in.

I admit, though, if it does turn out that there was absolutely no real deal with Cavill to do a new Superman movie or anything, and he solo announced something that wasn't actually happening while knowing that new heads hadn't even started yet and would of course have their own ideas about things... eh... that kind of paints Cavill in a certain light. And not a good one. Even if it was a calculated power play to try and force the hands of whoever took over afterward... not good.

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Old 12-13-2022, 11:40 PM   #392
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I also don't like the way Gunn is handling fans, en masse. I'm already seeing a lot of "Oh, you're probably typing this from your mom's basement!" type stuff from him in response to posts that aren't even that bad or rude.
Statistically, he's probably not wrong.
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Old 12-14-2022, 03:28 AM   #393
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I don't see the ten year plan sticking at all. Warner wants instantanious results, fans want instantaneous results. They completely lack the patience of Marvel and it's fanbase.
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Old 12-17-2022, 08:03 AM   #394
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Dwayne has unfollowed Warner and DC on social media

https://twitter.com/homeofdcu/status...in%3Fpage%3D16
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Old 12-17-2022, 08:23 AM   #395
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So, what MCU character is he gonna play?

I bet he feels like a real dope. A week ago he was on Twitter bragging about "$50 million profit for Black Adam! Sequel and Hawkman spin-off are Go!" a f*cking hour before word came out that everything was cancelled. "Wanted to wait and get confirmation from the financiers"... Buddy, you don't need a meteorologist to tell you it's raining sh*t if it's already up to your neck. Take your hundreds of millions and go buy a clue. Also, bragging about "$50 million profit" in the first place - a lie, first of all; after marketing budgets, they lost a TON on that movie - was super pathetic, considering that's the Movie Money equivalent of about t'ree-fitty. Dude was bragging about finding some change under the sofa cushions, an hour before he got publicly fired.

I mean, it sucks, and it's too bad, but it's Dwayne, so whatever, f*ck him. I AM glad he tried with getting Cavill back, sincerely. But I am also glad I don't have to be grateful to him anymore, either.

WB needed his clout much more than he needed them, though. At the rate they're going, forget a "10-year plan", at the rate they're alienating people in the industry in 5 years or less nobody in Hollywood will want to go near WB, especially not the DC Films division. Everyone comes away with just the worst stories and terrible experiences. No wonder they can't find any writer or director for Superman. "Come make DC movies for us! We treat you like sh*t, throw you under the bus, blame you for every shortfall while taking full credit for any and all success you may fall into! It's awesome!"

Like, okay, "money", sure, but... secret is out, now, it's a terrible place to work and other studios pay more, with better treatment. It's like when people ask me if I'd ever want to go to WWE and I answer sincerely "No, not ever," and they swear I'm lying, that I'd go for the money. And I tell them, a bunch of my friends worked there, they all have horror stories, I don't get on a plane anyways and frankly I don't need the money in exchange for ALL the bullsh*t it entails. Money isn't everything, and there's no point in working where people treat you like sh*t.

"Our 10-Year DC Plan! Year One... see if ANYONE in Hollywood won't hang up immediately when they hear the words 'DC Movie'."

F*ck 'em.
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Old 12-17-2022, 10:40 AM   #396
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Obviously this is only the planning stage for Gunn, but so far all of this has yielded a dismal feeling towards the DCU - like any good will for them is just G-O-N-E-. I also think it's very opportunistic of Gunn to be placed in the position of orchestration that he has been put it, and then he "announces" that HE is working on the next Superman script. My feelings on that are that he is supposed to be organizing the course of action and he should've assigned someone to the next Superman script.

It just feels like a drunk-with-power so I'll get my name on as much as I can in the new-order situation. Just doesn't feel or look good.

Although as to the Black Adam part of this, it also feels that Dwayne Johnson went in like "savior primadonna" as well. He made a movie about a character that nobody was going to care about while throwing veiled shade at the I.P. that his character should've been in. It's like - "dude you are talking about changing the balance of power in a Universe that is failing Superman of all people and you are going on like you are playing the role of a character like Superman." It came off as all ego instead of earnest enthusiasm. I dunno.
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Old 12-17-2022, 10:43 AM   #397
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So you’re mad at WB for severing their relationship with the Rock after his movie lost them money?

That’s what you do when something fails. Especially if you’re the new head of the studio and had nothing to do with the project. Can’t blame Gunn for WB’s past.
I think Gunn will bring in a lot of talent. People want to work with him. Filmmakers feel they can trust another filmmaker way more than a “suit”.
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Old 12-17-2022, 01:42 PM   #398
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Makes me wonder. Maybe the Rock and his shared agent with Cavill really did think that WB would call off the search for a Feige if Black Adam did gangbusters. But why would WB simultaneously tell Cavill to announce his new Superman movie?

I hope we get some Tweets with the Rock calling Gunn a jabroni.

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Old 12-17-2022, 02:20 PM   #399
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I agree with others who say that WB actively ruining their reputation with that shitshow. I understand, that they have money to offer, but why anyone would work with them long-term, if they change their plans on yearly basis and can change their decisions in the span of several months. Its not like you conduct business or create long-term contracts.

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I think Gunn will bring in a lot of talent. People want to work with him. Filmmakers feel they can trust another filmmaker way more than a “suit”.
Like Snyder did? And what had happened with those talents?
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Old 12-17-2022, 02:34 PM   #400
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I think the DCU is in good hands, They need to start fresh with new faces playing these characters, And make these characters more relatable, Its part of what the MCU made so successful, They made its character very likable and memorable, This is something DCU needs.

It will be interesting what they will do with the Flash, Aquaman, and Shazam for the DCU.
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