01-31-2019, 11:08 PM | #461 | |
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The goodwill of the franchise pretty much lands squarely on the first entry. If it's too far off the mark the first time, people won't come back. Even though OOTS had Bebop, Rocksteady, and Krang - you're still stuck with 9 feet tall superpowered bulletproof mutants clowning around with Megan Fox who learned ninjitsu from a coffee table book. The first movie rubbed alot of people the wrong way, and in my opinion, rightfully so. |
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01-31-2019, 11:14 PM | #462 |
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I don't remember it being "universally" panned.
I remember many, many viewers AND critics opining that, while by no means a "good movie", the first BayTurtles movie was "exactly the right amount of stupid as TMNT is supposed to be," and meaning it in a positive way. Granted, I did and do want to throttle those people, but nevertheless, that's what they said. "It's stupid, like TMNT's always been stupid. So if you're stupid, and you like stupid things, it's just stupid enough for you, stupid. It's not good but it's what it should be." Obviously the overall temperature has turned by NOW, but I remember a lot of enthusiasm at the time, although it was damning with faint praise to say the least.
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01-31-2019, 11:35 PM | #463 |
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I think you're remembering wrong, homie. What you're describing is more the reception of Out of the Shadows. The "buzz" around the first movie was almost all negative. It all started with the whole being aliens thing and they never recovered from there. Even now it sits at 22% on RT with a 51% audience score. Hardly a passing grade.
It has it's fans, sure - what doesn't? - but by and large nobody really liked it. |
01-31-2019, 11:54 PM | #464 |
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02-01-2019, 12:07 AM | #465 |
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Yeah, but most people liked the first one anyways so it's a moot point.
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02-01-2019, 01:29 AM | #466 | |
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But I vividly remember seeing and being told that I was foolish for wanting a good movie way before we heard anything about Bebop and Rocksteady. Not to mention, this forum was overwhelmed with "fans" from the jump, while people like me were constantly on the defensive for pointing out what was wrong with it, or where the filmmakers had flat-out lied about this or that. Some of them were undoubtedly plants but many of them are still here, and have no problem explaining why they think it's great. I mean, yeah obviously most critics gave it poor marks but that was to be expected, the movies weren't for them. I do know that there was already a vocal chorus of "This is Just Fine, stop taking things seriously" going back to the first one, and they all just got way louder for the second one. Anyways, no, I could introduce you to people who even think the first one was great. I can't in good conscience call anything "universally" anything if I personally encounter the exact opposite phenomenon on a regular basis, even if it's almost certainly true-ish. I can't call what I don't see. I do agree in general, though, that most people with any taste at all probably didn't care for it, but they also probably didn't watch it, or only did so because it was their job. People who went into it willingly tend to have a much higher opinion of both movies, I've noticed. Be it lowered expectations or something else entirely, a lot of people got exactly what they wanted and they don't mind telling you about it. I think what puts me in the minority is that the second one seemed worse.
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02-04-2019, 10:51 PM | #467 |
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I don't really buy that critics will always give TMNT bad reviews. In the past few years there's been a huge increase in critics lauding the kind of movies that would previously have confounded them.
The reason for this is that a new generation of movie critics have come into the profession that are of the age to "get" comic book movies and have gotten into prominent positions for their nerd cred since basically that's the dominant genre by far. If there's any point in history that TMNT wouldn't just be instantly be written of as trash it's now; it just has to be a good TMNT movie. True, audiences tend to be more forgiving than critics. For me the friends that I went to see the 2014 movie didn't care for it but didn't think it was quite the travesty I did but kinda liked the snow chase scene. One thing that stuck out to me is that they all "could see what they were going for" but didn't quite get there. I found that attitude much more prevalent with movie apologists online. While a lot of stuff like Eric Sachs and learning ninjitsu from a book was garbage it's fair to say not every idea the movie put forward was bad but they were certainly executed badly. I think a lot of people the movie's defenders could see that and were "willing" the movie series to do better with these ideas. Plus a lot of these people saw things that just were not there. I had tons of conversations both here and other boards with people who were convinced Splinter's comment about not remembering anything prior to being in the lab meant we were going to get Hamato Yoshi and Oroku Saki backstory in some way, the comment about the mutagen being from space was clearly to set up that Shredder had some connection to Krang and whole mythology was subtly being laid out. They knew the first movie wasn't the best but now they've ironed out the problems the sequel will redeem all this promise. In many ways it reminded me how DCEU fans were (sorry Leo) with some being denial (critics are all paid off by Disney) and others grudgingly acknowledging that while the Snyder ones were not good somehow, someway it will all work with next Snyder DC movie and then the next. Y'know I wonder if that somehow factored in to Out Of The Shadows failure. If you to some degree were optimistic about this new vision of TMNT and the mythology you thought was being built and you see that sequel goes a complete 180 and jettisons all that and is just a movie for kids you might give up on it too. Last edited by Galactus; 02-04-2019 at 11:00 PM. |
02-27-2019, 09:35 AM | #468 | |
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03-05-2019, 11:55 AM | #469 |
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I know it's going to make me look a bit biased, but they should really use the 1990 movie as a main inspiration. Don't have a TMNT be about saving the world. Have it low key. Have the Turtles stop a crime wave. The Turtles to me have always worked best when they, for example, take down an entire crime ring, and no one outside of it knows about it.
Have the Turtles have that brotherly bond that's important for their type of characters. Also, don't have them 6 foot tall, hulking behemoths that look like they can easily smash a truck door open with their bare fists (because if they can do that, who needs stuff like Bo Staffs and Swords?). Hvae a more traditional look, while also doing some twists on the look to better differentiate them (like the 2012 show) But most importantly, write a good script. Learn from your previous mistakes
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03-05-2019, 12:16 PM | #470 |
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Good script. Go back to the Mirage comics and start again, but modernized to 2019.
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03-05-2019, 12:23 PM | #471 | |
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I don't mind the world saving stuff, they've done it plenty enough, but it would be nice IF somehow it was good enough to garner it a whole bunch of sequels and save the world saving for much later, keeping it simple in early films and letting them grow into a larger role as time goes on. |
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03-05-2019, 12:43 PM | #472 | ||
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03-05-2019, 04:10 PM | #473 |
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With an actual, physical "script" becoming less and less important in modern "blockbuster" filmmaking - indeed, the vast majority of these things either shoot with NO script, or, only the barest summary of one - you guys sure have a lot of hope.
And make no mistake, for as expensive as any TMNT movie will have to be, they're definitely going to keep pushing them as slightly-smaller versions of the bigger CBMs - heavy on spectacle and SFX. Which means, most likely, they're NOT going to sit down and write a story A-to-Z - even if the logistics of basic storytelling demand it. No, what they're going to keep doing is, imagine a spectacular "set piece" like the snow chase in the first BayTurtles movie, and then retrofit the entire film around that one expensive bit. That's how these movies are made nowadays, and that's what's going to happen with every TMNT movie going forward. Script? HAH! How quaint. Don't hold your breath.
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03-05-2019, 04:52 PM | #474 |
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I feel like the best we can reasonably hope for, at this point, is a quality family friendly action film. Something like "How to Train your Dragon", "Big Hero 6", or, hell, maybe even Spider-Verse, when it comes to tone and quality. Watch Lorde and Miller take an interest the franchise.
Of course, I'd rather have something inspired by the Mirage or IDW comics. I'd do terrible things for a great film based on the books. But the above description, to me, is sort of a middle-ground that I could truly appreciate, if done well. |
03-16-2019, 06:33 AM | #475 |
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03-16-2019, 11:52 AM | #476 |
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03-17-2019, 09:03 PM | #477 |
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03-17-2019, 09:36 PM | #478 |
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03-28-2019, 08:22 AM | #479 |
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I'm not hopeful. I'll judge based on the first teaser/trailer, but I'm not looking forward to it
Morbid curiosity is probably more what I'd use Also, I'm sick of the general public thinking 'You have to have Shredder, he's the main TMNT Villain, and it wouldn't work without him' Since the 80s show, that has kinda been the case, but it doesn't have to be.
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03-28-2019, 09:49 AM | #480 |
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TMNT doesn't even need a "main villain." Ignore those morons.
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