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07-23-2017, 03:54 PM | #1 |
Big Blue Boy Scout
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: New Bark Town
Posts: 4,463
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Thoughts on Tengu Shredder?
What do you all think of Tengu Shredder?
I have mixed feelings about him. On the one hand, I like that the 2003 series gave us a human Oroku Saki after the Utrom Shredder was revealed to be Ch'rell, and I like his backstory, design and powers, not to mention his legacy. On the other hand, I prefer Utrom Shredder because of his history with the turtles and I think the Tengu Shredder stands out less when Ch'rell had been calling himself "The One true Shredder" throughout the series. |
07-23-2017, 04:36 PM | #2 |
Emperor
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 9,398
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Obvious retcon is obvious, that's the first thing that comes to mind for me. There wasn't really any implication in the first three season that Ch'rell was impersonating anyone, they did give enough hints in season 4 for it to still feel organic but it's pretty clear it was an afterthought.
As for the concept and excecution, it's fine. He is effectively just Ch'rell with a different origin and slightly different goals, which is weird considering how they made clear he wasn't Ch'rell (that mystic bond between the Shredders might explain it away but that's a poorly explained concept itself), "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss". He might be OP and season 5 had a rather insane climax because of that (Dragon transformations? I mean, really?), but I'm not against the idea in theory. As for the debatable human status? I don't care, Shredder was created to be starter villain to be killed off, he's not that deep or interesting in the first place. At this point most versions of Shredder have ended up with a questionable human status, who cares? It's not a big deal. |
07-23-2017, 04:52 PM | #3 | |
Big Blue Boy Scout
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: New Bark Town
Posts: 4,463
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07-23-2017, 05:07 PM | #4 |
Mouser
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Burque, New Mexico
Posts: 12
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I never was personally bothered knowing the Utrom Shredder was a Utrom. It added a whole layer of dimension to the character of the Shredder. The Tengu Shredder played a great role to it. It added more into the whole backstory of the Ninja Turtles.
Although I never liked the belittling of Utrom Shredder via means by the Tengu. How the Ninja Tribunal viewed him as a joke. Turtles Forever though redeemed this in my opinion. I found that Utrom Shredder is more of threat then the Tengu Shredder in terms of goals and aspirations. I prefer the idea of human Shredder, but the 2k3 series was so great it didn't matter. The Turtles connection/friction with this Shredder lacked for obvious reasons. The Lost Episodes came on around the time I was 8, and I initially thought the Utrom Shreder was back. I assumed he came back as zombie It took until Hun dissed Utrom Shredder to figure it out for me. |
07-23-2017, 05:19 PM | #5 |
Hench Mutant
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 447
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What I found interesting about his character was how articulate he was in his conversations. He always sounded cool and menacing to me when he spoke, even if he is a psychopathic villain with multiple intergalactic warrants on his head.
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07-23-2017, 05:21 PM | #6 |
Overlord
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 40,945
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It was great to see a human Shredder now reincarnated as a magical demon, and the fights with him and story wrapping up Season 5 were well done.
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07-24-2017, 01:43 PM | #7 |
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,831
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Continuity discrepancies aside, I absolutely loved it. The demon Shredder episodes brought a nice conclusion to the ongoing story that was the first five seasons.
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07-24-2017, 06:42 PM | #8 |
Mad Scientist
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Canada (This country is too peaceful, Something's up...)
Posts: 2,082
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It just made me glad there was a human Shredder
And he probably would've made Ch'rell look like a sheep.
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M.D.K. Maim! Destroy! Kill!!! "When my time comes, I wanna be buried face down, so those who don't like me can kiss my ass!" |
07-24-2017, 07:24 PM | #9 |
Big Blue Boy Scout
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: New Bark Town
Posts: 4,463
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Me too. There was an episode in Back to The Sewers I think where Tengu Shredder, Utrom Shredder and Cyber Shredder fought each other. It was pretty short, but it showed Utrom Shredder holding his own against the Tengu version which I found odd since Tengu Shredder is miles above his imposter when it comes to powers and abilities.
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07-25-2017, 04:57 AM | #10 |
Foot Soldier
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Cardiff
Posts: 192
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Personally I loved the Tengu Shredder (his demon/ human and dragon form)! I loved his sadistic sense of humor and how saw everything simply as a game.
I just wished he was foreshadowed earlier than Season 4; the Foot Mystics should have been established as a separate faction to Ch'rell earlier too in my opinion! |
07-27-2017, 10:24 PM | #11 |
Hench Mutant
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 476
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thought it was legit.
I liked the idea of having the turtles tied to feudal japan (via this way). |
07-28-2017, 01:20 PM | #12 |
Resident overthinker
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: what is going on..........
Posts: 5,318
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I think an issue that could have been solved is that Ch'rell could have been killed at TCRI, and the spirit of the Tengu Shredder reanimated the body and wore it as a host as a kind of vengeance for the stolen identity.
At that point, Ch'rell could have been the flawed Shredder who felt that he'd been treated with great injustice his entire life, while Tengu Shredder was just the "Bleh bleh bleh, must take over the things, because I'm evil!!" category that dragged down Ch'rell's capability as an interesting, flawed and possibly even tragic antagonist. So the entire time, Ch'rell would have been dead, but Tengu Shredder would have played the part of "Ch'rell" so well that no one was the wiser, including his own daughter, that is until things slowly start to get a little bit "off". Skip out on Ch'rell trying to return to space completely. The Utroms could come back initially to collect Leatherhead, but stay to help with the Tengu Shredder problem once it arises (and being the first to notice that something really weird was going on with "Ch'rell") and help Karai learn her father's history with a new perspective. She learns about how Mortu and Ch'rell had once been friends, how Ch'rell ultimately had to resort to being a criminal to survive, how he came to hate his people. Some enormous possibilities were missed with Ch'rell, and one of them was addressing that he was not spiritually at peace; freeing his body of the Tengu Shredder was one aspect of peace. This would also mean Karai learning the truth of his history and reexamining her sense of honor in a different direction than Leo wanted her to, then using that refound honor to bring peace to her father.
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