Official Episode Discussion S5 Ep 03: Heart of Evil

[LeotheLateBloomer]

Originally Posted by TigerClaw

Donnie wanting vengeance seems out of character for him, I would understand if it were Raph, But Donnie? He isnt the type that would hold a grudge.

I don't think it's completely out of character. I honestly like that Don has an aggressive side. It shows that he can be as deadly as his brothers.

[IndigoErth]

I kinda wish that Donnie thing was hinting at some kind of upcoming arc for him, were the series not ending.

[Meliwen]

Originally Posted by victory_angel

I believe Donnie's behavior was more fear based rather then anger based. They had lost Splinter already that was a huge impact already. So knowing Vizioso had it out for them was what triggered Donnie into pulling a Raph, because he didn't want to lose anyone else he cared about to senseless violence and hatred.

I like this explanation.

But this goes back to the one thing I was a bit disappointed about these episodes. We aren't seeing how the turtles fare after Splinter's death, we're just seeing how Leo fares. I like how Leo feels over burdened with his responsibilities, but that doesn't mean the show has to focus on him without even just one sentence about how the others are doing. If Splinter's death is a reason for Donnie's outburst, if he's afraid of losing his other family members too, then just one mention in the episodes before this, or even this one, would have really helped bring it into perspective.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

^I agree. Leo going from the loss of his dear father and having to take charge of his family to excited to watch Space Heroes again that quickly is head-scratching. With his brothers especially, it's like nothing ever happened after the finale.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by LeotheLateBloomer

^I agree. Leo going from the loss of his dear father and having to take charge of his family to excited to watch Space Heroes again that quickly is head-scratching. With his brothers especially, it's like nothing ever happened after the finale.

Have you never been depressed before? You hyperfocus on the things that make you happy. Hell, it's why many of us are here.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

For me, it takes a while to get over a death in the family. I'd like to cherish all the good times I had with them before I can even move on and do the things that make me happy.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by LeotheLateBloomer

^I agree. Leo going from the loss of his dear father and having to take charge of his family to excited to watch Space Heroes again that quickly is head-scratching. With his brothers especially, it's like nothing ever happened after the finale.

It's not explicitly stated yet

Spoiler:

Tigerclaw does say several months have passed since the Shredders death

but it is implied that quite a bit of time has happened since Splinter and Shredders deaths. The others have commented that being the head of the family has been a hard burden on Leo.

Also everyone deals with grief in their own way, it's not always immediate. For example I had a friend who was a younger pseudo-sister to me. She passed away at the age of 21 in 2009. When I was informed of her death I didn't greive for her right away. I was largely in shock and I would find myself looking at my AOL messenger as though hoping she would pop up online and say "you are such a dork, I can't believe you actually thought I was dead." I didn't actually break down and cry until a few days later.

With my father it took me years before I actually gave into grief I felt when he abandoned me. Don't get me wrong I love my dad, but I still hate him for who he is and what he's done.

As for Leo himself he strikes me as a Deal with the Task at hand and deal with problems later. The task at hand was to prevent the Shredder from being resurrected. And to do that they had to prevent the heart from falling into the Foot Clans hands. But I do agree that more could be done with the problem that was Donatello in that episode. Such as maybe have Leo grumble "Donnie, what is wrong with you?" Somewhere between the the set up and climax of the story.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

I see. Thanks for explaining this.

[IndigoErth]

Eh, cut Leo a little slack. His teacher and father expected him to take full lead if he, Splinter, was no longer around and Leo is not going to want to betray or fail his father's expectations. And of course it came to pass, while he's still rather young, with siblings to watch over and worry for their well being and survival of in a world that would want to and think little of killing them. (Not to mention a likewise orphaned adoptive sister to worry about.) If this series was capable of more depth, it's a wonder he doesn't become overwhelmed by the stress at some point and have a break down.

No wonder he'd eagerly get into a little distraction via a second series of a cartoon he loves. It at least gives him a short period of giving his mind a rest from everything else, which is understandable.

I can say from experience that I've done both... I've laid around depressed for a long period after a loss, with no interest in much of anything. On the other hand, after the last hard loss of my father, I started out feeling that way, but the Turtles gave me reason to smile and something to feel good about.


Sure, "Leo is right" is going to happen still, and possibly more, because he's got even more reason to be hyper vigilant in what's going on around them and making decisions. Not that the others aren't and can't be right and Leo should definitely hear them out, but its understandable that he's going to be quicker now to put his foot down. Dad can't come help anymore; no one is on the other end of the cheese phone.

[Powder]

Originally Posted by LeotheLateBloomer

For me, it takes a while to get over a death in the family. I'd like to cherish all the good times I had with them before I can even move on and do the things that make me happy.

Nobody said he was over it. But most people use the things they love to mask the pain, so, yeah...

[THGhost]

Good episode. Didn't think they'd get Shredder's heart so soon.

When is Kavaxas gonna pull a Starscream and betray Tiger Claw? I can feel it coming.

[Dust]

Originally Posted by THGhost

Good episode. Didn't think they'd get Shredder's heart so soon.

When is Kavaxas gonna pull a Starscream and betray Tiger Claw? I can feel it coming.

Well, the arc is only 4 episodes long so I'm assuming next episode. Same reason as to how they got Shredder's heart so fast. I prefer this way though, less filler required, more time for different stories despite the season being smaller.

[THGhost]

Originally Posted by Dust

Well, the arc is only 4 episodes long so I'm assuming next episode. Same reason as to how they got Shredder's heart so fast. I prefer this way though, less filler required, more time for different stories despite the season being smaller.

True. True. I got the feeling that Kavaxas was going to betray Tiger Claw in this episode, he seemed at breaking point. So it's highly likely it'll happen next episode.

[MCLeo28]

I also got this impression and believed it was foreshadowed quite a bit. Even Kavaxus's devious smirk when Tiger Claw questioned Kavaxus's interest in Shredder's resurrection seemed to hint that Kavaxus would betray him eventually.

I still wonder what happens to Fishface in the midst of all of this because he is not present in the sneak-peak for the final episode and we're even told that there would be a rematch between Fishface and Raphael at some point. Perhaps Fishface lives on and gets defeated once and for all by Raphael?

[Vicky82]

Originally Posted by MCLeo28

I also got this impression and believed it was foreshadowed quite a bit. Even Kavaxus's devious smirk when Tiger Claw questioned Kavaxus's interest in Shredder's resurrection seemed to hint that Kavaxus would betray him eventually.

I still wonder what happens to Fishface in the midst of all of this because he is not present in the sneak-peak for the final episode and we're even told that there would be a rematch between Fishface and Raphael at some point. Perhaps Fishface lives on and gets defeated once and for all by Raphael?

As I've already seen End Times, don't expect anything big to happen to Fishface.

[THGhost]

Originally Posted by Vicky82

As I've already seen End Times

Korea? Again?

[MCLeo28]

Originally Posted by Vicky82

As I've already seen End Times, don't expect anything big to happen to Fishface.

Yeah, I didn't catch your post when I made my response.

My response was more in reference to Fishface being seen in the distant future since obviously there isn't enough room to fit in Fishface's vendetta.

[ssjup81]

Originally Posted by THGhost

Korea? Again?

The DVD release that had the last few eps of season 4 and the first four of season 5. I saw the eps already tooabout two or three weeks ago.

[Vicky82]

Originally Posted by THGhost

Korea? Again?

No, the new DVD came out in America and it had the 4 latest episodes on it, so 3 episodes (The Forgotten Swordsman, Heart of Evil and End Times) were already seen before they aired on TV.

[PApagreg]

You know, another thing I found weird was when Donnie first confronted Vizisio he takes the heart, but instead of striking him in any way he turns his back on him and does a victory pose. That seems very weird to me considering how in the beginning episode we see Donnie gunning for the mob boss but he doesn't take a chance to so much as hit him, its like if Kurapika from HXH captured a spider but instead of hitting him/her he did the Can-Can