No Konami collection?

[DevilSpooky]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I was gonna say. Only non-canon spin-off games from now on, it would appear. And "Metal Gear Survive" tanked pretty hard by all accounts. So "Metal Gear" is probably a dead brand. Kind of a shame, as I would have loved a sequel to ReVengeance if nothing else, but no Kojima = No Sale.

I do kinda feel bad for Konami, though; the current game marketplace has people only buying 2 or 3 "big" games every year, and if yours isn't one of those "big" franchises, there's no point staying in the business as you're not gonna make any money.

I imagine that even getting the rights sorted out to do a re-release of the old TMNT games would be nothing short of a nightmare at this point. They couldn't even market it without spending a bunch of money to "remaster" the old games first, since that's what everyone demands now. They'd never make back whatever they'd spend on that, plus legal fees and license negotiations, so it's ultimately pointless.

If it was a "straight" re-release bundle with no upgrades or anything, it's a long shot but possible. But given how everything MUST be given an HD coat of paint nowadays, it's a hard No Chance.

Thing is, they don't care, Pachinko and Mobile alone makes them more money then any game has ever given them, and they cost next to nothing to make so that's an added bonus. Like it or not Konami don't care about gaming anymore, not traditional gaming anyway...

[Leo656]

Oh I agree. Ultimately, you can't fault anyone for going where the money is.
It's just always tough to wrap my head around just how many people spend money on things that are so insipid.

Then again, it means that companies have simply found ways to get around gambling laws (and exploit peoples' gambling addictions) by creating "games" that function on the same principle as pulling a slot machine lever over and over again. So it's easy to see how it works in practice, and why they're so successful with it.

Shady as f*ck, but whattyagonnado?

[Ninjinister]

I feel like I should know the answer considering that I own 11,000 video game compilations, but I'm drawing a blank...

How often does a company go back and make a compilation of licensed games from 20 years ago? All I can think of is The Disney Afternoon Collection.

[Sumac]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I was gonna say. Only non-canon spin-off games from now on, it would appear. And "Metal Gear Survive" tanked pretty hard by all accounts. So "Metal Gear" is probably a dead brand. Kind of a shame, as I would have loved a sequel to ReVengeance if nothing else, but no Kojima = No Sale.

I do kinda feel bad for Konami, though; the current game marketplace has people only buying 2 or 3 "big" games every year, and if yours isn't one of those "big" franchises, there's no point staying in the business as you're not gonna make any money.

I imagine that even getting the rights sorted out to do a re-release of the old TMNT games would be nothing short of a nightmare at this point. They couldn't even market it without spending a bunch of money to "remaster" the old games first, since that's what everyone demands now. They'd never make back whatever they'd spend on that, plus legal fees and license negotiations, so it's ultimately pointless.

If it was a "straight" re-release bundle with no upgrades or anything, it's a long shot but possible. But given how everything MUST be given an HD coat of paint nowadays, it's a hard No Chance.

Not exactly - in the last year there were some collections released with the games in their original forms, like Disney Afternoon and MegaMan collections.

[DevilSpooky]

Originally Posted by Leo656

Oh I agree. Ultimately, you can't fault anyone for going where the money is.
It's just always tough to wrap my head around just how many people spend money on things that are so insipid.

Then again, it means that companies have simply found ways to get around gambling laws (and exploit peoples' gambling addictions) by creating "games" that function on the same principle as pulling a slot machine lever over and over again. So it's easy to see how it works in practice, and why they're so successful with it.

Shady as f*ck, but whattyagonnado?

That's why I like to believe the theory that Konami is run by the Yakuza now, it all makes perfect sense

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by Leo656

If it was a "straight" re-release bundle with no upgrades or anything, it's a long shot but possible. But given how everything MUST be given an HD coat of paint nowadays, it's a hard No Chance.

I'm pretty certain the Street Fighter collection released recently allowed you to play the original games without HD filters or such.

[Leo656]

I guess anything's possible, but again, investment vs. reward. Do enough "old school" fans really care enough about those games to make a compilation profitable, with or without remastering? I'unno, I'm not convinced. They haven't made any of the newer games profitable, even with the help of the younger crowd the new games are ostensibly marketed to. This seems like one of those cases where TMNT really isn't as popular as TMNT fans think it is. I'm fairly sure the last time a TMNT game actually turned a profit was at least 25 years ago.

Let's be honest, most people buying a TMNT compilation would mostly just be buying it for Turtles In Time, and that's a 20-minute game. Even with a few other short-ish games in the mix, it's hard to justify charging more than $20 for the bundle, and even then, how many sales can be expected? Not enough to cover the hassle, I'd wager.

They maybe could get away with doing straight ports, but I have a feeling that as a company, they'd feel the pressure to "update" the games so they could market them to the younger crowd. You simply couldn't get a modern-day 7-year old to ignore the pixelated graphics. And as mentioned, without a decent number of older AND younger fans buying it, it would be very difficult to turn a profit.

Don't get me wrong; HD remaster or no, I'd love a compilation because my NES is busted. I just don't see any scenario where it makes sense from a business perspective, and developers don't just make product to make people happy, there needs to be a financial incentive.

I think the biggest obstacle is the rights and licensing issues. That's a very big, very expensive hurdle to clear. If Konami actually had the license at present, now that's an entirely different conversation.

[pferreira]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I guess anything's possible, but again, investment vs. reward. Do enough "old school" fans really care enough about those games to make a compilation profitable, with or without remastering? I'unno, I'm not convinced. They haven't made any of the newer games profitable, even with the help of the younger crowd the new games are ostensibly marketed to. This seems like one of those cases where TMNT really isn't as popular as TMNT fans think it is. I'm fairly sure the last time a TMNT game actually turned a profit was at least 25 years ago.

Think about it this way: TMNT games in the past 15 years have had to be somewhat profitable otherwise they wouldn't have bothered to keep making them. I agree at the end of the day most of these have been licenced tie-ins for movies or TV shows but that's still pretty impressive. Nick has certainly done a fair bit with TMNT in digital video game form so there must be some interest.

[Prowler]

I honestly don't like any of the TMNT video games to the point of wanting a big collection of them. I only truly like the SNES version of Turtles in time and the original arcade game. SNES Tournament Fighters is good enough for a Street Fighter clone, but hardly one of my favourite fighting games either.

And, like others have said already, a TMNT games collection would probably sell poorly and not make the investment worth it. Let's face it, TMNT mostly draws as a cartoon or as a live action movie. And only one cartoon series and one of the movies were huge draws and classics that everyone is gonna remember forever. The highest selling TMNT game ever is the first ever NES game... and wanna take a guess why that turned off people from playing TMNT games ever again?

[DevilSpooky]

Originally Posted by Prowler

I honestly don't like any of the TMNT video games to the point of wanting a big collection of them. I only truly like the SNES version of Turtles in time and the original arcade game. SNES Tournament Fighters is good enough for a Street Fighter clone, but hardly one of my favourite fighting games either.

And, like others have said already, a TMNT games collection would probably sell poorly and not make the investment worth it. Let's face it, TMNT mostly draws as a cartoon or as a live action movie. And only one cartoon series and one of the movies were huge draws and classics that everyone is gonna remember forever. The highest selling TMNT game ever is the first ever NES game... and wanna take a guess why that turned off people from playing TMNT games ever again?

That's not really fair though, the first TMNT game was the best selling one because it was bundled with the NES, I'm pretty sure Turtles in Time would've been the best selling game otherwise.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by DevilSpooky

That's not really fair though, the first TMNT game was the best selling one because it was bundled with the NES, I'm pretty sure Turtles in Time would've been the best selling game otherwise.

Wait, it was bundled? I thought Super Mario Bros/Duck Hunt was the only game bundled with the NES? I mean, TMNT came out in 1989 already, while the NES is from 1985. I know in some places, such as in oru country, the NES only made it to the stores in like 1990, so maybe here it was bundled with TMNT? Come to think of it, the first two NES games my brother got as a kid were SMB1 and TMNT when he got his NES in 1990...

[Leo656]

I've never heard of that game being bundled with the NES, but it could have been a regional thing, I guess.

Either way, that wasn't why the first game was a huge seller; it's because "Turtlemania" was huge, we had nothing else, and like a lot of NES games, we were too young/starved for content to realize it wasn't actually very good. It was based on a thing we liked, so we bought it, and we played it, and we tricked ourselves into thinking it was anything but a hot mess, like those terrible Terminator and Simpsons games that came out around the same time.

I'm also a bit surprised to hear it was THE best-selling TMNT game, though. I would have bet on Turtles In Time, or maybe TMNT II: The Arcade game. ALL my friends had that one, but most didn't hang onto the first one, they either rented it and decided not to buy it, or gave it away once they got sick of it.

TMNT III was really great, I'm pissed it's not more fondly remembered. A case could be made for it being better than II or IV.

The SNES Tournament Fighters is better than SFII. "Tournament Fight"-me.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I've never heard of that game being bundled with the NES, but it could have been a regional thing, I guess.

Either way, that wasn't why the first game was a huge seller; it's because "Turtlemania" was huge, we had nothing else, and like a lot of NES games, we were too young/starved for content to realize it wasn't actually very good. It was based on a thing we liked, so we bought it, and we played it, and we tricked ourselves into thinking it was anything but a hot mess, like those terrible Terminator and Simpsons games that came out around the same time.

I'm also a bit surprised to hear it was THE best-selling TMNT game, though. I would have bet on Turtles In Time, or maybe TMNT II: The Arcade game. ALL my friends had that one, but most didn't hang onto the first one, they either rented it and decided not to buy it, or gave it away once they got sick of it.

TMNT III was really great, I'm pissed it's not more fondly remembered. A case could be made for it being better than II or IV.

The SNES Tournament Fighters is better than SFII. "Tournament Fight"-me.

I've always thought it was due to the Turtlemania factor too.

Manhattan Project is a pretty solid game, indeed. The Arcade game is better off being played not on the NES: That version is quite inferior due to the NES being much less powerful than the arcade.

Turtles in Time came out in 1992 already. TMNT wasn't as hot as it was in 1989-1990 anymore. It was starting to cool down. And the TF games didn't sell that well, I think.

SNES TF is better than the vanilla version of Street Fighter, but not better than Super Street Fighter II: Turbo. But it's a pretty good game for a SF clone, yes.

[Leo656]

But the NES version has a WHOLE EXTRA LEVEL!

I'unno, having played both quite a bit, and having the Arcade original on my Xbox 360 hard drive, they both have their charms. The Arcade original definitely looks and sounds much better, but kind of gets on my nerves for how quarter-munching irritating it can be, and how it's basically just "Flying Dropkick everything until You Win" with no need to use any other attacks (and often, other attacks will put you at a disadvantage).

I'll meet you in the middle on that TF/SF example. Seems totally fair. It's also probably THE best SFII clone, having played several of them. On any given day, though, I'm more apt to play TF than any of the versions of SFII, but that's just me.

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Leo656

But the NES version has a WHOLE EXTRA LEVEL!

I'unno, having played both quite a bit, and having the Arcade original on my Xbox 360 hard drive, they both have their charms. The Arcade original definitely looks and sounds much better, but kind of gets on my nerves for how quarter-munching irritating it can be, and how it's basically just "Flying Dropkick everything until You Win" with no need to use any other attacks (and often, other attacks will put you at a disadvantage).

I'll meet you in the middle on that TF/SF example. Seems totally fair. It's also probably THE best SFII clone, having played several of them. On any given day, though, I'm more apt to play TF than any of the versions of SFII, but that's just me.

Well, I dunno. SF can be tough but TF's difficulty feels more cheap to me. It's like the AI blocks 99% of the **** you throw at it regardless of the difficulty level you play the game in.

[Leo656]

I used to agree, but the more I played the easier I noticed it is to recognize the attack/defense patterns of each specific character. Put simply, some things Just Won't Work against certain guys. Some guys will ALWAYS block an aerial attack, or some guys you ALWAYS have to fight from a distance, others you ALWAYS have to get in close on, or ALWAYS use crouching attacks, or whatever.

It's a tricky game, don't get me wrong, but once you figure out a guy's pattern you feel like an idiot for ever losing to them. Still, always takes me a while to remember what works for whom, as I often go a long time without playing it. but then when I do, it's easy. Even Karai is stupid easy for a Final Secret Boss character, if you notice her tricks. Last time I played it, I beat her in one shot, two straight rounds. I've had a few Perfect rounds against her, too.

I think Cyber Shredder, Rat King, and Armaggon usually give me the most trouble until I remember the tricks. Rat King's the only guy I find to be consistently a pain.

But then, I mostly only play Leo, so it could be who you're using. Either way, nothing wrong with playing on lower difficulty to get used to everyone's attacks, then playing on higher difficulty to see the real ending. And having recently played it a few months ago, I gotta call out your exaggeration: On the lower settings, the CPU barely even attacks you until you face your Clone. Before that, everyone just lets you beat 'em to death.

It's definitely not harder than any of the SFII variants. No way.

[Prowler]

Perhaps I'll give it another try one of these days, then.

I gotta say, though, my favourite thing about the game is its OST. Also I really love its art. Would love a TMNT comic book with art similar to SNES TF.

[Leo656]

I'd dig that.

I always liked the Super Moves or whatever. Like Leo's "Millenium Wave". Very satisfying way to gain a victory. That was my favorite part. But everything you said was spot-on, as well. It's a good game, probably came out a year or two later than it should have, or it could've been huge. Y'know I still run into people who've never heard of it?

[Prowler]

Originally Posted by Leo656

I'd dig that.

I always liked the Super Moves or whatever. Like Leo's "Millenium Wave". Very satisfying way to gain a victory. That was my favorite part. But everything you said was spot-on, as well. It's a good game, probably came out a year or two later than it should have, or it could've been huge. Y'know I still run into people who've never heard of it?

It's kinda funny how it was released on 3 different consoles with a totally different version for each. But in 1993, the Turtlemania craze was already sinking fast. That was one year before Red Sky and the year the 3rd movie came out, after all.

[Leo656]

I was shocked it came out at all, I hadn't heard about it being made, I just saw a very strange commercial for it and was like "Ah, neat." Rented the SNES version and liked it a lot. Played the NES version at my friend's house, didn't care for it; although now that it's worth hundreds of dollars as a collector's item, I really wish I'd bought it anyway. Never played the Genesis version yet.

The magazines of the time only gave any props to the SNES version. Allegedly, the Genesis one is the one with the cheap, unforgiving AI and clunky controls, although it does have playable April and Casey Jones, so that's a plus. I still plan to get it one day, just not sure when.