What would you have done with the characters?

[Groverman62]

I know a lot of people believe the characters were poorly handled, so what were things you would have liked done with them?

[CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy]

Originally Posted by Groverman62

I know a lot of people believe the characters were poorly handled, so what were things you would have liked done with them?

Not make Donnie a weakling who's good for nothing except his brain.

Not make Mikey an autistic spaz who's oh so incredibly "funny!"

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Not mutate so many just for the sake of mutating.

[victory_angel]

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

Not make Donnie a weakling who's good for nothing except his brain.

I don't know about Donnie being a weakling. He is strong in his own way, particularly when his brothers are not there to witness it. However, he is a different sort of fighter than the rest of his brothers which is where the main problem lies. Because he seems to fight that part of himself believing it would give his brothers a reason to reject him, so his weakness is more out a product of trying to be something he's not.

In the interactive comic book on the Nick Site, the Turtles are undergoing a Ninja Trial to earn the right to call themselves Ninja. Leo is the first to pass his trial, and his trial is obvious because it was just a lesson where he needed to learn to respect and use his brother's strengths.

Donnie is the second Turtle to pass his Ninja Trial. The flashback he has in his part of the trial, all the Turtles are going through an obstacle course. During the wall climb portion, all of the Turtles except Donnie are able to get to the top of the wall. Donnie then proceeds to get frustrated which causes Splinter to come up and ask if it was really the obstacle that was causing him such distress. Donnie then admits that he feels no matter how much he trains he can't keep up with his brothers. Splinter then anecdotally tells him, that just because his brothers do things one way doesn't mean that he needs to do the same.

In many ways, Donnie is what I call a Three C's characters.

His skills compliment Leo. Both of them are strong and capable on their own but are near unbeatable when they act in tandem.

Donnie is a counterpoint to Raph enabling the red-masked turtle to see that running blindly into a situation is not always the best solution. And Donnie to learn that stopping to think and plot out a solution is not always helpful in the thick of things.

And with Mikey, he is a contrast because Mikey is more spontaneous and spur of the moment. While Donnie is more prepare for what is ahead.

Mikey is the same as a compliment to Raph and a counterpoint to Leo.

I agree it was a shame the Pulverizer story couldn't be finished. Because there are off and on hints that Donnie's character was a pacifist, but for whatever reason didn't like that aspect of himself.

However, everything he creates is never with the intention of causing harm to his brothers or anyone. Even the weapons he builds killing isn't the intent. Disabling, hindering, or incapacitating, maybe but not killing.

With the Pulverizer story, he only offered to train the foolish boy because he was able to assess that what they told him didn't matter, he was going to put himself in danger no matter what. So he felt by training him in basic moves he would have more of a fighting chance at surviving against the Purple Dragons or whoever.

That is the approach a pacifist would have taken, regardless of how foolish the act would have been. And the episodes where Donnie is dealing with the Pulverizer start to bring the pacifists aspect to the surface.

What would have been a good add on to this is maybe having Donnie overhear Raph making a comment about he's glad none of them turned out to be pacifists because he would be ashamed to be related to such a useless person. In Raph's mind at least as far as season one and two, he sees pacifism and cowardice as pretty much the same thing because they are people who don't like to fight or be involved in battle.

In Donnie's mind, however, that would be like saying that if he was to reveal his pacifist nature to his brothers he would be seen as useless and not welcome on their team.

Season five implied Leo was aware his Second Brother may be a pacifist as he does yell "Donnie, don't lose sight of who you are!" in "Heart of Evil" And I wouldn't put it past him to have always known about this aspect in Donnie's personality, but just didn't realize it until they met Honeycutt. That could be one of the reasons Leo is as protective as he is when it comes to Donatello, there is even a vocal tone that he doesn't even use with Raph or Mikey it's always used whenever Donnie is in potential danger. Particularly when that potential danger is caused by one of his brothers.

[Andrew NDB]

On a Nickelodeon cartoon? Well what I would want to do with them would have to be filtered through that prism.

My whole premise would probably be akin to Palladium's "After the Bomb" universe. Ish. It's a few decades in the future and they're old (or they're a result of the bomb and young), there's lots of mutants for a very good reason, and we could get Game of Thrones-style (in a kids way) into all the hierarchies of mutants out there and the different politics therein. Like, there's a kingdom of knightly beavers in Oregon or something, who knows.

Otherwise on a TMNT kids show it has to be "w-w-we need to find a way to get mutagen out there everywhere, lots of mutants! Toys!" and they have to find hackneyed ways of doing that. I guess it's mosquitoes in the new show? I have no idea.

[Toxin45]

Originally Posted by Andrew NDB

On a Nickelodeon cartoon? Well what I would want to do with them would have to be filtered through that prism.

My whole premise would probably be akin to Palladium's "After the Bomb" universe. Ish. It's a few decades in the future and they're old (or they're a result of the bomb and young), there's lots of mutants for a very good reason, and we could get Game of Thrones-style (in a kids way) into all the hierarchies of mutants out there and the different politics therein. Like, there's a kingdom of knightly beavers in Oregon or something, who knows.

Otherwise on a TMNT kids show it has to be "w-w-we need to find a way to get mutagen out there everywhere, lots of mutants! Toys!" and they have to find hackneyed ways of doing that. I guess it's mosquitoes in the new show? I have no idea.

Oh it's way too late for a mirage comics adaption dude.

[Andrew NDB]

Originally Posted by Toxin45

Oh it's way too late for a mirage comics adaption dude.

Who on earth would expect that in a cartoon for little kids?

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by CylonsKlingonsDaleksOhMy

Not make Donnie a weakling who's good for nothing except his brain."

Don was never portrayed as weak in the show.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

Don was never portrayed as weak in the show.

You're right. He was definetly not as good as Leonardo and Raphael, but still wasn't a bad fighter by any means.

[newfan]

What would I change in the characters so far as them suiting this show goes? Not that much.
Maybe a little less mutations as mentioned already, there were few fully human people remaining, though Stockman ended up human again (even though he didn't want it, Fishface in the other hand would likely have)

Casey I might have adjusted to be less full of himself, found him annoying at times. Outside of that there were only one or 2 I didn't care for or had no feelings really either way.

Hun could have been used better, make the character a bit more challenging or involved. Especially if you are putting Bruce Lee's face on him but it isn't something I left being bothered by.

The turtle's personalities combined together well, they were supposed to be teens starting out as well as being trained ninjas who developed along the way. Besides comments from some about particular ones not being used more I wouldn't really change too much about the actual characters. Even though Leo said some painful lines to start it was part of his inexperienced excitement and it quickly went away while he was growing with the seriousness of what they were doing. Over all he was my favourite and I'm happy with how he was portrayed here.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Leonardo is always a Don Quixote character. Hard to change that.

[The Great Saiyaman]

Tough one...
One of the things I really dug about the series was how both the "Teenage" and "Ninja" aspects of the Turtles were handled. They behaved like teen boys who give each other a hard time, which is what teens do.

Leonardo.
- I probably would have made him a little less a Trekkie, the first season in particular could have done without his "Hero introductions." During the second part of the second season after Karai mutated we see him change into a very gloomy "How am I ever going to get this right again?" character, well yeah, losing your love interest in such a way is devastating but the episodes never showed how all consuming it can be and how people who go through it tend to want nobody around, so they should have shown him looking for her on his own.

Donatello
- I wish the show's writers hadn't abandoned the Pulverizer plot, there was potential for something very good here: Splinter told him that by training him, he was responsible for anything what could happen and as we all know the worst happened. Donnie never got to redeem himself here.

Raphael
- What I loved about him was although he's very much a manly man, he also had a feminine side and when Mona Lisa came around, he pretty much was the "Girlfriend" in that relationship. There could have been more hints to his softer side in the early seasons.

Michelangelo
- I'll state it right here and now: Greg Cipes was THE man for the job, perfect casting. With Mikey I'd bring out his uncertain, angsty side that he had more. There have been plenty of episodes in which he's confronted with the fact that BECAUSE he acts like a goofball, people don't take him seriously. I would have more of his serious side.

Splinter
- There was too little about what happened after Shredder murdered Tang Shen and took away baby Miwa. They should have made an episode where him leaving Japan and arriving in New York was being shown, the closing of a chapter. Perhaps with the Foot Ninjas going through the remains of the house and finding Tang Shen's body but not Yoshi's and telling Shredder about it.

Shredder
- I would have made him a more three dimensional character, showing that there was more to him than just revenge and vendetta. There should have been an episode which shows him raising Karai, what kind of parent was he to her? Likewise, there should have been an episode which shows Saki training Chris Bradford, how did those two meet, how long did Shredder train him and what was Bradford taught?

Karai
- There should have been more of the "There's no honor in this." side of her personality, perhaps showing her in a more intimate setting, what was her living quarters at the Foot Clan base like, we were never shown. Also, there should have been episodes which show her training with Tatsu in japan and how she and Shinigami became friends, were they trained together, we don't know.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

April O'Neil, Baxter Stockman, Fishface, Irma, Karai, Kirby, Pulverizer = Keep them 100 % Human all the time. Only mutate Dogpound once.

Make the Neutrinos humanoid, not microscopic.

Not making Wingnut and Screwloose comic book characters coming alive.

[Metalwolf]

@JH24

I wouldn't have given April any powers either. I think I would have just left her as the normal 'everyone' character, who through her is the proxy which we discover and learn about the Turtles. Giving her powers just makes me feel like they didn't know how to make a normal female character interesting.

[Warhorse]

Mature Mikey up. Damn, he's supposed to be a teenager and he acts more like a toddler.

I also started to lose interest when 2012 started to do the same thing as in 2k3, made it the Leonardo show and his bumbling brothers. Don't get me wrong, I like Leo, and he's probably my second favorite in most incarnations, but they are going way overboard in 2012 and 2k3 with how he's the only one that can take on Shredder and Karai. Poor Mikey ended up not being much of a threat, and I just wished we could get an animated version similar to the Mikey we saw in the 1990 movie.

[FredWolfLeonardo]

I would've made the Kraang a bigger threat.

Despite them being the one's responsible for everything going into motion (even the evolution of humans), they are brushed off far too easily and treated like comic relief to an extent.

The season 3 middle two parter had the turtles warp their whole army into Dimension X, after which they never make any meaningful appearance or impact, despite still being out there.

Its this one thing, along with Ciro's talk about the script about a Kraang themed special, which makes me hopeful that we haven't seen the last of the 2012 turtles.

[PApagreg]

Oh boy I got a lot to say

Leonardo-I actually like this Leo but found his hypocritical stance on vengeance to be off putting. Have him struggle with the idea of vengeance in season 5, I'm not saying make him go full Punisher but its kind odd how he showed Shredder's head like a trophy but told Don that him wanting revenge on the Don is a bad thing never mind the fact they have anti mutant weapons

Raph- Not much to say but lay off the physical abuse and the whole leaving on my own thing got old by season 4

Donnie- 86 the whole Apriltello thing or at least don't make Don a creepy stalker in the 1st two seasons because boy that was hard to watch.

Mikey- I HATE this incarnation of Mikey, for some reason the writers thought it would be a good idea to have him be as smart as Billy from Grim Adventures and he is just unbearable most of the time, seriously how many episodes do we see him mess with Donnie's dangerous equipment/chemicals. Half the time I wonder how he even lived to see 15 with all of his limbs attached because of how stupid he is. TLDR I would add 50 IQ points and not make him the turtle equivalent of Patrick

April- The whole Kraang thing was interesting but I wish her powers were a bit more passive in nature and giving her telekinesis kind of made her feel a little too OP and made her feel too much like Jean Grey. Also speaking of powers I felt that the later seasons focused too much on that and not enough on her character/personality with the exception of City At War.

Casey- Pretty much my least favorite version of the character which is a shame because he showed so much promise at the start. I said it before but we should've seen Casey interacting with his family at least once since it was his motivation and it would've add some dimensions to the character also make him waaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy less obnoxious and annoying.

Splinter- Actually like this incarnation but have him more proactive when it comes to Shredder and needs to check his 6 more.

Shredder- Most people say that he is the most three dimensional Shredder and I don't see it, he feels too much like a 1 dimensional character focusing only on killing Splinter which got old by season 3 and despite his "love" for Karai he barely treats her any different than say Bradford. So I would have him similar to IDW Shredder as a character who despite having a personal relationship with Splinter still wants to expand his empire and do other things.

Karai- I like this character but didn't enjoy how she was basically ping ponged by two opposing forces in late season 2 and season 3 also thought her mutant powers were dumb. So I would keep almost everything except for the whole snake mutant thing and have her actually join the final fight against Shredder.

Hun/Alopex- I said it before but this series has the Young Justice effect in that they have well loved characters make an appearance but don't do anything with them. So I would have Hun have some sort of rivalry with Casey and have their relationship and development grow over the course of the series as for Alopex have her appear in season 3 and actually be somewhat of a recurring character.

Xever- Did my boy dirty, one of my favorite Shredder Lieutenants and has a fighting style we never seen in any iteration. Unfortunately though he had to turn into Fishface and his design as a mutant was just awful and those comically giant switchblade knives aren't helping either. So personally I would drop the whole Fishface angle and have his persona Mr X used more in the series

Bebop & Rocksteady- Even though I enjoy their IDW iteration I didn't care for this version, mostly because they had no chemistry and it felt like they were only friends because the writers decided to give some fan service to the OT show without realizing why OT Bebop & Rocksteady worked as a duo. So instead I would probably have them act as a third party because it never made sense to me why they would still work for Shredder, especially when Rocksteady is already an arms dealer which means he has some sort of following also I would make their relationship more professional because again I never understood why they became buddy buddy as the series went on.

Baxter- NO FLY BAXTER, also like Bebop and Rocksteady I think it would've been better if he was another party or at least independent and goes from faction to faction like 2k3 Baxter and have him more confident and cocky as the series goes on. Another thing is that I wish we got more "Baxter Gambit" episodes with him trapping his enemies into death traps sort of like Arcade or Jigsaw.

Tigerclaw- Thought he had a somewhat of a cool design but felt too much like a creators pet. Personally I would play more into the hunter aspect of his character and make his fight scenes reflect that. Rarely have him get up close with his enemies and either attack them from a far, ambush them or set up traps. Don't get me wrong this happened numerous of times in the show but I felt it was too few and far between. Also have him act more like a professional mercenary and have him leave the Shredder when the mentioned gets too crazy and mutates himself. Also NO JETPACKS because my god that was cringe.

Bradford/Dogpound/Rahzer/Whatever- Have him be the Hun of the series in that he will do everything to please the Shredder and have Shredder call him his closest friend/ally because it really didn't make sense when he referred that position/title to Tigerclaw

Kraang- Admittedly I wasn't that much of a fan when it came to the Kraang but even I felt that they were rarely treated as dire/important as Shredder despite them being responsible for human evolution. I personally would erase the human evolution aspect to the lore you can have them on Earth for a long time but the the whole being here since the dawn of mankind is just too much for me. Not much to say except give them more of a presence and like FredWolfLeonarndo said don't brush them off.

Purple Dragons- Give them interesting designs and personality

Irma- Keep her human

Timothy/Mutagen- Give him some sort of an ending whether it be him turning into a villain, him coming to terms into being a mutant, turning into a human, or whatever actually give the character some sort of resolution.

[Hockey Boy]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

but they are going way overboard in 2012 and 2k3 with how he's the only one that can take on Shredder and Karai. Poor Mikey ended up not being much of a threat, and I just wished we could get an animated version similar to the Mikey we saw in the 1990 movie.

You remember how Michelangelo effortlessly schooled that foot recruit in that “nunchuck-off”, it highlighted how a nunchuck took more skill and dexterity than everyone else’s weapon, and that Michelangelo seriously might’ve been smarter than Leonardo and Raphael and just puts on a clown act to cover up the fear of losing his father.With this idea being brought up during the pizza delivery scene with Mike turning away and changing the topic when Don brings it up, with that culminating in him openly sobbing at the campfire?

And then how Michelangelo will never be allowed to be this competent or layered again because the people in charge of the property think funny must equal vegetable at all times

[Hockey Boy]

More focus on the other turtles accomplishing things, lately it feels like its the Leonardo show but its TEENAGE MUTANT NINJA TURTLES
Leonardo
-Enough of this Leonardo is the best most spiritual best fighter awesome super special ninja ever” nonsense
No creepy Karai love story, she’s a human and his adopted sister, its too weird, man.

-Donatello
No creepy April love triangle.

-Michelangelo
MICHELANGELO
IS
NOT
DUMB.

-Raphael
not much, except maybe tone down the ridiculous love story with the salamander

-April
No stupid ass ultra badass jedi dark Phoenix Mary sue ****.She could easily just be a great Kunoichi in her own right
No stupid krang conspiracy with her being the super ultra special lady, thats lame

-Casey
No stupid love triangle
He should be much less of a wimp in combat, maybe beef him up physically to justify him hanging out with the turtles in combat
No weird “how do you do fellow kids” speak like “dope” and stuff like that
Actually SHOW his family.
Stop with the “only hockey stick now and forever” wheres the cricket bat, baseball bat, cmon!

-Splinter
He shouldn't keep beating the **** out of his sons over nothing.

Thats about it.

[neatoman]

Let's see here:

• Leo: More or less what's expected, could be a bit more calm and collected.
• Raph: More or less what's expected as well.
• Don: Expected, could be less... Creepy...
• Mike: Expected but not desired, I don't like the cartoons insisting on making him loud and stupid, he ought to be more of an emotional center than an annoyance.
• Splinter: Makes sense for what they were going for, I wouldn't make him the father of anyone but the turtles. Also he'd be a animal from the start, which applies to all mutants if I had my way, keep that in mind.
• April: Might as well be a new character, April might have been a lot of things but never a psychic half-utrom. Even when regarded as a new character, her progression should have been more clear, as presented she makes huge leaps forward with little shown on screen.
• Shredder: Kind of expected. It made me realise why 4Kids made him an Utrom and IDW an immortal avatar of the destruction god, it's kind of awkward to have the main villain in a series like this just be some guy with a hate boner, he's not really as big of a deal as the show wants us to think he is.
• Casey: Expected but not depicted in the best way.
• Karai: Like I said before, don't like having mutants start out as humans or Splinter being anyone but the turtes' father. Even so, there should be an internal conflict of moral, affection and loyalty that just isn't there. The fact that she turns on Shredder the moment the truth is confirmed seems a bit too sudden for me.
• Baxter Stockman: Should also just stay human, if there's any character I hate turning into a mutant it's him, **** you if you actually like seeing him as a pathetic fly. He should be more assertive and vindictive.
• Fugitoid: Expected but not quite right with the backstory.
• Bishop: Could obviously be a new character.
• Hun: Visually off and should have been in more episodes.
• Renet and Savanti: Expected, except from the part of them being from the future instead of the 79th dimension. I thought the point was they existed outside of time.
• Usagi: Expected.
• Jei: Not sure, I get that his ****ed up tendancy to kill anyone he thinks is "evil" (basically everyone he comes across) couldn't be a thing in the show.
• Rat King: I don't understand why they removed his mysterious nature and made just another bad guy. He should be more ambigious.
• Leatherhead: Kind of expected. Him going berserk when hearing "Kraang" is a pretty dumb depiction of his rage issues.
• Utroms: Don't understand why they were seemingly replaced by "The Kraang", aside from maybe giving the ooze malicious intent.
• Slash, Mondo, Mona Lisa, Mutagen Man, Punk Frogs, Muckman, Joe Eyeball, Wingnut, Screwloose, Chrome Dome, Traag, Granitor, Pizza Face, Dregg, Wyrm, Armaggon, Bellybomb, Antrax, Scumbug and Hot Head: They're a bunch of toy/FW/Archie creations. There was very little of value in the original characters anyway, so it doesn't matter how much they changed them, they're not exactly essential or even interesting in the first place. The parts about weird character arcs and other writing related issues do still apply however.
• Bebop and Rocksteady: Same as above but... I especially wish they had been left out, if there are any TMNT characters that should not be given more attention it's Bebop and Rocksteady, please just let them fall into obscurity.

As for the new characters, can't exactly complain about deviation obviously but the flaws in writing applies to any character that happens to fall victim to them.