Do you feel the 2k3 series is under-appreciated?

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Coputer animation is here to stay and improve, if so older viewers like it or not. It's great to have three TMNT versions, each in different styles.

[Longview01]

Originally Posted by Original TMNT Cartoon Fan

Coputer animation is here to stay and improve, if so older viewers like it or not. It's great to have three TMNT versions, each in different styles.

I wrote out a reply to this and I deleted it all because I don't get your angle...its obviously aimed at me saying I don't care much for CGI but at no point did I say they shouldn't use it or that I didn't understand how people could like it at all.

Traditional animation still exists, true its pretty niche now but its still out there so I think your comment is pretty redundant

[Klunk1234]

Originally Posted by Xav

Most people born in the 80's would've been in their teens when the 4Kids show started.

They are 80's babies and 90's kids and yes, 00's teens.You are right. But Cyber is a 80's baby and a 90's kid.

Mid- 80's kids, not babies are the ones who grow up with the original TMNT cartoons, Voltron, Thundercats, etc, by early 90's they were teens.

But the topic here is: Is that 2003 TMNT series is under- appreciated? I put yes. See my comment above.

[Coola Yagami]

It's jus to forgotten. It kinds came at an awkward time, coupled with a forgettable cgi movie and games coming out when they were just getting used to 3d graphics and Konami was starting to suck. To its credit, it brought newfound awareness to the original mirage comics and brought in things that even the bay movies decided to.... somewhat use... namely black Baxter and Karai. The horrible home releases didn't help either missing entire episodes.

2012 is what's happening now so naturally it's on everyone's mind and I guess it was the right time for a second smaller turtle mania boom complete with stores full of their merchandise and a float at the Macy's parade. I honestly see way more kids into tmnt stuff now than back in the day. It felt like I was the only guy in toys R us looking for tmnt figures. Now I have to hope my figure of choice isn't sold out. And in this day and age of pop vinyls and mystery boxes and hot topic's nostalgia trip, there's an onslaught of 2012 and 80s tmnt everywhere.

It's just bad timing and the world was in a different mindset back in 03. I'm pretty sure if 2003 was released today it would have been just as successful as the 2012 or at least more than it was at the time. Perhaps with a bigger budget due to more ratings/toysales we would have avoided the fast forward and back to the sewers crap budget animation.

[neatoman]

Meh, Tom Waltz certainly remembers and draws inspiration from it, the Nick crew (possibly begrudgingly) remembers and draws inspiration from it, that's all that really matters to me.

As long as we see Hun, Bishop, Angel, Ch'rell, The Battle Nexus, etc pop up in new material, I know it's remembered where it actually counts: Amongst fans and creators.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Originally Posted by neatoman

Meh, Tom Waltz certainly remembers and draws inspiration from it, the Nick crew (possibly begrudgingly) remembers and draws inspiration from it, that's all that really matters to me.

As long as we see Hun, Bishop, Angel, Ch'rell, The Battle Nexus, etc pop up in new material, I know it's remembered where it actually counts: Amongst fans and creators.

Angel is one of the most well-written child and teenage-chracters within TMNT. Together with Archie's Oyuki.

[Leolead]

Totally. It opened the door to a more traditional TMNT going foward

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Battle Nexus

I don't like Battle Nexus. Just because the turtles kick butt, they don't need to be the greatest fighters of all times and space throughout the Multiverse, or not even on Earth. Even if it's just a sport.

Prefer Archie's intergalactic pro-wrestling then. At least there they just won a tournament, without even being considered the greatest fighters in the Universe.

[neatoman]

Originally Posted by Original TMNT Cartoon Fan

Battle Nexus

I don't like Battle Nexus. Just because the turtles kick butt, they don't need to be the greatest fighters of all times and space throughout the Multiverse, or not even on Earth. Even if it's just a sport.

Prefer Archie's intergalactic pro-wrestling then. At least there they just won a tournament, without even being considered the greatest fighters in the Universe.

But they didn't really win though, Mikey did but by complete accident.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Also, Battle Nexus felt forced because of that videogame.

But anyway, the season 3 opening with Triceratons attacking Earth was great.

[Koi]

The 2003 show I do feel is not as appreciated, but I don't believe as many people watched it as the other incarnations of the show. Hard to appreciate something not as many people grew up with and enjoyed like some of us did. Just my opinion based off of talking with other people. Weirdly enough I think more people know of the Kramp Twins then the 2003 Ninja turtle show from my conversations...

[Prowler]

Well, based on what I've read about this show being overlooked and forgotten by the general audience, I think it can be summed up in a few points:

- It aired on a not so big channel compared to the FW and Nick series. FoxBox, I believe, was the home of the 2k3 series? FoxBox which used to be known as Fox Kids in the 90s, I think. Not exactly an obscure network, but not as big as Cartoon Network and Nickelodeon. Probably not as big as Disney Channel was in its prime either? Also, maybe there are places in USA where people didn't get FoxBox?

- It came out at a time where streaming had not taken off yet. IMO, this is another factor. I mean, like it's been said, it aired on a channel that wasn't as big as other cartoon channels at the time, thus it was harder for the general audience to find it, whether deliberate or by accident. If legal streaming was around back then, then I beleive more people would have gotten into it.

- It came out before the social media craze: No Facebook, Twitter, youtube(well it debuted in 2006, and by the time the show was already in its 4th season I think). Meaning not many places online where people could talk about the show except for forums such as this one. Back then, admitting to browsing the internet all day long was still social suicide or considered a very nerdy thing to do. So not many people of the "popular crowd" had any idea of this show. It's not like nowadays where people watch tv shows and movies on their phones or can get onto the internet easily anywhere with their phone or tablet. Remember when you could perfectly live/survive without having internet at home for a month or two or perhaps even more?

- Not being as heavily promoted as the FW and Nick series were/are: This most likely ties into it airing on FoxBox. FW had a huge machine behind it which allowed it to be as successful as it was and still is after all these years. And Nick belongs to Viacom. Hell, look at the movies released during each cartoon's tenure. Notice how the 2k3 series only got one movie and it was in CGI? And not many people remember that movie asides from big TMNT fans do they? I don't remember hearing people talk much about it. Much less about Turtles Forever, if you want to count that one.

- Not being nostalgia pandering enough: This show was basically Peter Laird's wet dream. We all know Mirage isn't mainstream at all. And I don't think PL himself expected this show to become as big as the FW series was. I remember some casuals knowing about this show back then and absolutely despising it because "THIS AREN'T THE TURTLES I REMEMBER". Allow me to make an analogy with video game consoles. FW was the NES and the Game Boy combined, Nick is the Wii and 2k3 was... the GameCube.

Also, there is a reason why Viacom seems to have put the 2k3 series on the shelf while FW is more promoted.

Ofc this doesn't mean it was a random obscure show. It definitely had a decent sized fanbase, otherwise it would not have gone for 7 seasons and over 100 episodes. But it was just another cartoon that was airing at the time among other popular cartoons such as Kim Possible, Avatar and whatever DC and Marvel cartoon adaptations were on at the time. Not to mention all the popular anime such as Naruto, Inu Yasha, Shaman King, etc, ofc.

So yeah, the show is just lost in the shuffle of not only cartoon history but also of its time period and isn't the first cartoon people think of when you mention "Cartoons from the previous decade".

[oldmanwinters]

CBR ranks the 4Kids series #3 on their list of "15 Great Superhero Cartoons (that Nobody Remembers)":
https://www.cbr.com/forgotten-superh...ns/?view=lista

[CyberCubed]

The 2k3 series is critically acclaimed and shall never be forgotten!

[THGhost]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

The 2k3 series is critically acclaimed and shall never be forgotten!

It will always be with us... lurking...

[sdp]

The show always was and always will be underappreciated.

It came out before nostalgia for TMNT was cool so there were no hipster writers trying to get cheap hits off of nostalgia.

It aired in a network that wasn't as watched and yet still got 7 seasons and over 100 episodes while other shows like X-Men Evolution were so much more well known yet not as good and only lasted 52 episodes.

Viacom bought the 2k3 show because it was a package deal with the licensing rights that 4Kids owned, if 4kids didn't have merch rights then likely viacom wouldn't have bought the show. If Viacom really wanted to own the show they would own the OT, they can afford it they just don't see value and since they haven't done anything with 2k3 that shows you they don't see value in it.


Fantastic show, it may have its flaws and weird decisions because of Laird but it was Laird's baby and because of it, we got this amazing show and we'll likely never get another TMNT show that is cared for by someone as much, isn't that sad?

[CyberCubed]

Originally Posted by sdp

The show always was and always will be underappreciated.

It really isn't, the ratings for the 2k3 series were roughly the same as the Nick cartoon for most of its run.

It came out before nostalgia for TMNT was cool so there were no hipster writers trying to get cheap hits off of nostalgia.

People were very nostalgic in 2003, I was 16 at the time as were you, sdp, you know this good and well. Back then people were begging for the return of Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady though.

It aired in a network that wasn't as watched and yet still got 7 seasons and over 100 episodes while other shows like X-Men Evolution were so much more well known yet not as good and only lasted 52 episodes.

156 episodes and a movie, one of the longest running American cartoons.

Viacom bought the 2k3 show because it was a package deal with the licensing rights that 4Kids owned, if 4kids didn't have merch rights then likely viacom wouldn't have bought the show. If Viacom really wanted to own the show they would own the OT, they can afford it they just don't see value and since they haven't done anything with 2k3 that shows you they don't see value in it.

They put the show on itunes at least, and used 2k3 characters in Nick and IDW like Bishop, etc.

Fantastic show, it may have its flaws and weird decisions because of Laird but it was Laird's baby and because of it, we got this amazing show and we'll likely never get another TMNT show that is cared for by someone as much, isn't that sad?

Well the show was great, but of course it wasn't perfect and Mike and Raph's 2k3 characters got flanderized at it progressed.

[sdp]

Originally Posted by CyberCubed

It really isn't, the ratings for the 2k3 series were roughly the same as the Nick cartoon for most of its run.

Saturday Mornings were huge back then and kids don't watch much TV nowadays so Nick having the same ratings as 2k3 are not comparable. The show had decent ratings but it was blown away by Pokemon/Sonic X/Anime Flavor of the Month/etc most of the times, beating out Spider Riders is not something to write home about.

People were very nostalgic in 2003, I was 16 at the time as were you, sdp, you know this good and well. Back then people were begging for the return of Krang, Bebop and Rocksteady though.

Not as nostalgic as it is today. I mean us nerds have always been nostalgic but I'm talking about the "normies/casuals" who only got aboard nerd culture the last 7 years or so. Obviously anyone who posts here is not going to be one of them.

[CyberCubed]

Also TMNT 2k3 used to rerun on Cartoon Network too. They aired reruns of Seasons 1-4 weekday afternoons, while new episodes still aired on Saturday mornings. The show also had a huge toyline, 6 videogame releases for PS2/Gamecube and GBA/DS, etc. Tons of merch.

Also I obviously meant us hardcore TMNT fans were nostalgic at the time as it'd been 7 years since the original toon ended. Plus back then we had no idea we'd ever get a new cartoon, I remember it being a huge shock at the time. We weren't expecting constant reboots like we have now.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

Despite the hate this series gets for being 'not the OT' from one side, and being 'Mirage-lite' from the other, this series was as dark as you could get with the TMNT on a kid's series. It the series Peter Laird would've tried to have made out of the OT if he's had his way, and feels a lot like the anime that was popular at the time this series came out. Ironic, as this show was darker and more graphic than the sanitized, edited versions of animes 4kids butchered and put on western TV at the time.