New clip? Leo and Raph arguing before the fight.

[Leonardo_Warrior_Turtle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4p_JlReTEMs

[-Savannah-]

I really like how much that the producers have evolved each character's personality. It makes them more believeable in their motives and outlooks.

By the way, nice video!

[Tortuga Joe]

That clip was so good, Raph and Leo's voice acting was really intense, and like what Savannah said, I loved how well their personalities seemed to have been developed. I really like how Leo's voice has turned out for this film, it's so much different a Leo than we've heard before. Way more take charge, and kind of agressive too. Solid clip.

[johnnyblaze]

what I love about that clip is how frustrated Leo is. Its like he is at a point where he does'nt knwo what to do. Not to mention his asking Raph why he hates him for trying to be better for them was a great line to throw in. It kind of speaks volumes because it seems like Leo just wants to know why Raph hates him (even though we know Raph does'nt hate him, he just hates how he acts sometimes)

[theredgnome]

Go Raphael!!

[Warhorse]

^Becareful, you could start another one of those whose is bigger wars that's going on between the two most dynamic characters in the TMNT universe.

[Magdoiln]

~ Yay! The TMNT are fun, coooooolll and yet they are funny!!!! ~
lol Why did i sing that. I'm waiting for the DVD to come out in stores on july 10th. My god i can't wait to watch it!!!!!

[theredgnome]

Originally Posted by Warhorse

^Becareful, you could start another one of those whose is bigger wars that's going on between the two most dynamic characters in the TMNT universe.

My bad! I'm just excited. That's all.

[Rooish]

Man, I freaking love what I've seen of Leo's portrayal. The most easy-to-relate to Leo yet.

[AquaParade]

Ya, Leo's character really shines here, as well as the dialouge going on. I could do without the "I'm better then you" line, but we all say things we dont mean when were angry, and thats kinda how I see Leo right now. I refuse to pick a side , besides, this is probably going to be one of Leo's best incarnations yet. He really does sound agressive. I was questioning his voice acting when I heard it on the pc demo, but he sounds great here.

[jignat]

I kinda like that "better than you" quote , b/c it makes sense that it could be said in the heat of the moment.
Also, it shows Leo is not this saintlyperfect/goody 2 shoes character that he seems to be portrtayed as iin past incarnations.Hes human err turtle just like the rest of us.

[Fledermaus]

Originally Posted by jignat

I kinda like that "better than you" quote , b/c it makes sense that it could be said in the heat of the moment.
Also, it shows Leo is not this saintlyperfect/goody 2 shoes character that he seems to be portrtayed as iin past incarnations.Hes human err turtle just like the rest of us.

I think it would have been a lot slimier if Leo had found a more intelligent way to say "I'm better than you" without actually saying it -- and hence give Raph better motive to settle the dispute in a physical fight. In real life, it would not be difficult to verbally shoot down a simple "And you know something..." (We wait anxiously for something that'll really cut us to the quick. We wait for something specific, maybe something a little subtle. Something personal, because the personal things that our family members know hurt the most.) Instead, we are given the laugh out loud, "I'm better than you." Better HOW? Better at being a flipping dick? Better at beat box? Does Leo say he's a better brother, who is responsible and actually gives a rip about something other than his ego? No. He's just "better." Why the hell doesn't Raph put Leo's fat foot into his mouth? The situation begs for it. Raph could score another point for himself. I'm sure my younger brother, jealous/resentful of the attention and support I got, would say I'm better at.... (insert scathing insults here.)

Leo should have said something specific and true that Raph would be sensitive about. THEN, because all possibility of witty retort has been obliterated, the fists and sharp metal objects are summoned by the forces of nature.

And that is why that scene frustrates me.

[triplexxx]

Instead, we are given the laugh out loud, "I'm better than you." Better HOW? Better at being a flipping dick? Better at beat box? Does Leo say he's a better brother, who is responsible and actually gives a rip about something other than his ego? No. He's just "better." Why the hell doesn't Raph put Leo's fat foot into his mouth? The situation begs for it.

Spoiler:

He does.
He shatters Leonardo's swords, beats him down, and leaves him to get captured. And Leonardo's ego problem is nothing new, that's one of the most significant things he has in common with Raphael. Heck, Michaelangelo has been known to be show off, and Donatello has gloated about his intellect before too "I am so good". All the turtles have shown to have egotistical at least every now and then.

[Fledermaus]

Originally Posted by triplexxx

Spoiler:

He does.
He shatters Leonardo's swords, beats him down, and leaves him to get captured. And Leonardo's ego problem is nothing new, that's one of the most significant things he has in common with Raphael. Heck, Michaelangelo has been known to be show off, and Donatello has gloated about his intellect before too "I am so good". All the turtles have shown to have egotistical at least every now and then.

Haven't seen the movie yet, was drawing only from the clips which have been released, but thanks for spoiling me. (I only highlighted the first five words... and I thought, okay stopping there. Then I reply, and stupid me, there are all the words you wrote spoiling the scene. ) Anyway, my point:

When I used that expression, I meant verbally, not physically. I tried to prove that there needs to be more incentive for physical rather than verbal resolution. I'm sure the fight is awesome. I'm not convinced of the transition into that fight. I believe all the tension until Leo says those lines and Raph doesn't throw them back at him with a quick retort that winks its eye at the naked foppishness, the immaturity of "I'm better than you are!! Nah nah! *sticks out tongue*. He could say one easy line that truly takes advantage of Leo's mistake at being vague and then proceed to stab his eye out with a sai, or whatever he does in the next scene.

I'll let it go. It really doesn't make sense to me. Then again, I haven't seen the movie and you have. So I'll let it go.

[Rooish]

What weirds me out is that it really doesn't seem that Leo says it in the heat of the moment. He yells for a while, then stops, looks at Raph, and says quietly, "I'm better than you." That seemed pretty calculated. And lame. He's trying to start a fight, I think. He wants to whoop Raph's ass as much as Raph wants to whoop his.

[Draconic]

Oh snap!
Only 3 days...

*waits impatiently*

[johnnyblaze]

Originally Posted by Rooish

What weirds me out is that it really doesn't seem that Leo says it in the heat of the moment. He yells for a while, then stops, looks at Raph, and says quietly, "I'm better than you." That seemed pretty calculated. And lame. He's trying to start a fight, I think. He wants to whoop Raph's ass as much as Raph wants to whoop his.

what I find interesting is

Spoiler:

that when Raph puts up his hands to fight Leo apparently tells him not to do this. Sees kind of like a change of heart when he realized what was about to go down. I can't confirm that but I read that from someone who saw the film

[Rooish]

Originally Posted by johnnyblaze

what I find interesting is

Spoiler:

that when Raph puts up his hands to fight Leo apparently tells him not to do this. Sees kind of like a change of heart when he realized what was about to go down. I can't confirm that but I read that from someone who saw the film

Spoiler:

I heard that too, and it confuses me. Leo tries to stop Raph ("You don't want to do this") once Raph whips his sais out. I like Leo, but I didn't like what he did there. It was manipulative; he victimises himself in this scene, and makes himself seem like the good moral one by telling Raph that he doesn't want to fight. He antagonised Raph in what I saw as a quite calm, calculated challenge--"I'm better than you"--and then he acts like he doesn't want to fight. He's basically starting a physical fight and then putting the blame on Raph.

[Brandatello]

that was awesome.....

[johnnyblaze]

Originally Posted by Rooish

Spoiler:

I heard that too, and it confuses me. Leo tries to stop Raph ("You don't want to do this") once Raph whips his sais out. I like Leo, but I didn't like what he did there. It was manipulative; he victimises himself in this scene, and makes himself seem like the good moral one by telling Raph that he doesn't want to fight. He antagonised Raph in what I saw as a quite calm, calculated challenge--"I'm better than you"--and then he acts like he doesn't want to fight. He's basically starting a physical fight and then putting the blame on Raph.

Spoiler:

I can understand how it can be seen that way but the impression I get is that he realized he crossed a line big time and wants to take it back, even though he truly believes what he said. (ofcourse I have to watch the film to see exactly how it plays out) Plus someone mentioned that Leo holds back during the fight during certain point, pulling punches and stuff like that. it seems to me like he realized he is making things worse and can't get out of it before hell breaks loose between he and Raph. His losing could be the big lesson he needed to learn--respect his brothers, respect his family. If he wants their respect, he's got to give it back.

I'm eager to see the two of them after the fight. I noticed clips from commercials where Leo is in what looks like Winter's manison and the other 3 land next to him ready to fight and Raph looks at Leo and smiles. Then there was another one where they are all standing around Raph pumps his fist in excitement turns to Leo and they give each other a pound. scenes of them getting along and fighting with each other instead of 'with' each other i'm hoping will be a highlight. it seems like that fight was all they needed to vent and to get off their high horses.