New Ep Discussion: "Tales of Yoshi"

[Anarchistguy]

Hello

Since there has been no thread for this episode yet I figured I'd start it.

Enjoy :)

(Can anyone sticky this thread and correct the episode title to "Tale of Master Yoshi", please? Thanks)

I thought this was a VERY COOL episode. I never thought they'd actually put Tang Shen in this show.

[Leonardo_Warrior_Turtle]

Wow. What an awesome episode. We haven't had much of Yoshi in this show, besides stuff dealing with the Utroms. To actually see him in his younger years in Japan was beyond cool. By the way, I hope any Kill Bill fans notice what Yoshi was wearing for most of the episode. Yes, the yellow jumpsuit that the Bride wears in the Kill Bill: Vol I. I thought that was a cool homage.

Oh by the way. Remember the preview for Season 4? Remember when it mentions "Return of the Shredder!" Well, that clip from that preview is from this episode. So I'm wondering if Ch'rell will even return this season. Hmmmmm. Anyway, great episode. And interesting ending. I wonder who the Ancient One was talking to. Great setup for the next coming episodes.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/dude1983/kbfoto5.jpg

It's not exactly what Yoshi was wearing but it's close enough to be a reference to it. Are the makers of this show (and possibly Peter Laird, the creator) fans of this movie?

[phillytmnt]

warning spoilers











That was an unbelieable episode and easily one of the best this season! I been wanting to see a Yoshi story like that since the start of the show. Finally some things were answered about how Yoshi met the guardians and got Splinter.Tang Shen was even in it too. There was plenty of action and it was a clever way to include some of the mirage story in it. The only thing missing was a Yoshi and Shredder fight which would of been sweet. It looks like the Shredder clones are back!

[vagrant718]

I woke up late and miss the beginning. can someone tell me what happened up to the part where yoshi swiped the coin from the ancient one?

Anyway pretty cool episode, love the yoshi's game of death outfit. Also it's interesting how Yoshi's friend took saki's place as the other love interest.

[Katie]

I thought this was an interesting episode. we all hoped a few weeks ago that they would go more into the story that the ancient one told to Leo and, well, we got it.

Turns out Leo's quite a story teller :D A turtle after my own heart. well....ok not really, but he spun a god tale.

I loved that the incorporated Tang Shen into the show, though the rivalry got a little remake. And I loved the fact that Splinter was Her pet originally. Yoshi kept him for sentimental reasons. Can't say I'm not guilty of that *cough, four dogs, cough*

Now, what I'm really interested in is the very last scene. I knew there was more to the ancient one.....guess we're gonna find out!


And finally, the paleo preview. Donnie gets saved by a sneeze! Y'know, one of the theories of Dino extinction is that a virus wiped them all out.....so....Donnie single handedly brings on the mass extinction that wiped out the Dinosaurs :lol: and we have more Renet :roll:

Pretty good ep and lots of history that we were craving :D

[Usagi Yojimbo]

Ok good ep. but i'm confused with the one scene based on the comics. so which is true?

The movie were yoshi girl friend is killed by saki or the one in todays cartoon were yoshi friend kills his girl friend. :o

[Anarchistguy]

Anyway pretty cool episode, love the yoshi's game of death outfit. Also it's interesting how Yoshi's friend took saki's place as the other love interest.

Actually, Yoshi's rival in the comics was Oroku Nagi, Saki's older brother.

[Dan]

By the way, I hope any Kill Bill fans notice what Yoshi was wearing for most of the episode. Yes, the yellow jumpsuit that the Bride wears in the Kill Bill: Vol I. I thought that was a cool homage. Actually that was a homage to Bruce Lee's Game of Death.

[Katie]

I woke up late and miss the beginning. can someone tell me what happened up to the part where yoshi swiped the coin from the ancient one?

Anyway pretty cool episode, love the yoshi's game of death outfit. Also it's interesting how Yoshi's friend took saki's place as the other love interest.



You didn't miss much...just Donnie shorting out the power...Mikey dramatically whining about not getting TV time....Splinter lecturing about how people got along fine before TV and Leonardo starting the story....which was basically the coin swipe...

[Dan]

It looks like the Shredder clones are back! What the hell are you talking about?

[Katie]

What the hell are you talking about?


Philly was talking about those shadowy things at the end that the ancient one was talking to.....I am so curious as to what they actually are!!!

[Torrant2]

Great episode, incredible cliff hanger. Whatever the ancient one was talking to they looked like a bunch of shredders. Now we know how Splinter knew the ancient one, very cool. I wonder if he's been back to Japan himself?

[phillytmnt]

I was thinking that the figures at the end were the shredder clones because there was three of them and they all had shredder's armor. I can't wait to see where this leads too. Im guessin their plans are too send the tmnt to the future which will lead to season 5.

[XERO]

Now... THIS is what I call an episode!

I loved every moment of it. But what got me hooked was the intro of the ever-immortal Tang Shen.

Heh. The friend of Yoshi's looks like an Asian version of Moe Howard.:P

Yep. Easily the best cliffhanger of the series by far, because I don't have a friggin' clue who the Ancient One was pleading to. :lol:

[TerranigmaFreak]

Man, I loved Mikey's joke about Japan recovering from Godzilla. Because I said that joke outloud myself only to hear Mikey say the same thing.

Cool episode, and what's with all those Shredders in the end? At first, I thought it was Karai. Could those Shredders be Utrom as well?

[ZariusTwo]

Heh. Saki aint' gone after all, the Shredder clones will probably seize control of The Foot from arai and school the TMNT once more.

...Saki does that sort of thing...:lol:

[Katie]

Heh. The friend of Yoshi's looks like an Asian version of Moe Howard.:P




:lol: :lol: *dies* OMG he DID look like Moe n'yuck n'yuck.

And Tang Shen was pretty...erm...voluptuous....for an asian girl :D I can see where the guys would like her.

[Ryona]

Actually that was a homage to Bruce Lee's Game of Death.

Thank you! Someone got it right. :)

Yes, it was total homage to Bruce Lee. A TRUE warrior. Not a fake like blondie.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v358/Ryou-chan4ever/Bruce2.jpg



Anyway, I totally love this new episode! Easily one of my favorites! :D

Yoshi and Masashi were a great pair. They actually reminded me of Ryu and Ken. It's too bad what eventually happened.

I loved the fact that Tang Shen was included. And bonus! We got to see where Splinter came from! Just an innocent rat looking for food.

This episode was like watching a classic martial arts flick. Totally awesome. :D

I was so sad with what happened to Tang Shen, and I was like "whoa!" when she got killed. That was pretty dark.

It was great to see the Ancient One again, and he's becoming more and more likable and interesting.

The fight scenes totally rocked! Damn, I hope we got much more episodes like this one! :thyper:


And is it just me, or is Tang Shen the most beautiful woman to have ever appeared in the whole series? Like, wow! She's gorgeous!

[TerranigmaFreak]

The only real complaint I have was the Yoshi's final battle with Yukio ended far too quickly. I was hoping for a longer fight to be honest.

You know what's funny, after 20 years, not one person ever pointed out the Tang Shen is actually a Chinese name.

[XERO]

Yoshi pwns.

That's all I gotta say.8)

[Toonami Tom]

Awesome episode! Probably the best episode so far this season.:) It was awesome to see Yoshi's origin and how he met the Utroms. It was even more awesome to see the final showdown with his brother at the Foot HQ. Shredder was there too! When Yoshi went out the window, Shredder ducked..... so was Yoshi trying to kick Shredder or really trying to escape out the window? Probably out the window......

I think those shadows at the end of the episode are high ranking Shredder leaders in Japan. Karai probably contacted them for help.

[Aztec General]

Wow!!!!!!!

Maybe the best episode PERIOD! Everyone watching at home take note, there is nothing wrong with violence and death in a show if the appropriate emotions are displayed afterwards. People can LEARN from stories involving violence and death. Death doesn't need to be taboo. Particularly since it is the ONE thing that EVERYONE on the planet will experience at some point.

This was an extremely well written episode which better explains the backstory of Yoshi and Splinter. I'm also glad that they decided to include Tang Shen in the backstory. It also gives Yoshi, Splinter, and the TMNT further enmity towards the Shredder.

And how about that ending? What is going on there? Oooooohh....I'm curious. I'm as curious as I was at the end of "Darkness on the Edge of Town" when they introduced the shadowy Utrom council. Or at the end of "City At War" when they reveal that Saki had survived.

[tOkKa]

-->> .. NOICE !!

http://www.dvdspecials.nl/recensies/img2/game_of_death.jpg




..







:o ..waitaminnute'.. there suppsoed to be killer lizards out to eat me again next week ??

http://www.grudge-match.com/Images/raptors.jpg

[XERO]

'Tis okay, tOkKa. Just sneeze on them. You'll be fine.:P

[Masked Ninja]

This was a really cool episode. My friend got the "Bruce Lee" thing straight off. :lol:

I also loved how they took the comic backstory and incorporated it into this particular universe the best they could. I prefer Shredder as a human, but they wrote the stories around his Utrom self so well, I don't mind much anymore. And now we finally get a version of the original "battle for the lady" story.

My quote of the week: (not word-for-word, sorry)
Leo: This story is about a girl...
Raph: [makes a weird face] A girl? ...does SHE kick butt?

Whoever has this episode recorded, feel free to correct me. :P

I also liked that Yoshi vs. Whatsisbucket was really short. We didn't need too much drama... and there wasn't much time left anyway. Short, sweet fight... and then he can go home.

Yeah, I agree. Tang Shen was quite... erm, gifted. But I also agree with Ryona in that she's one of the prettier (if not hands-down prettiest) woman the series has had to date.

And that cliffhanger REALLY has me intrigued. Who are those guys? Why would the Ancient One go to plead with them to leave the Turtles alone? How does he know what they're planning? ...What do they want to DO?!

Dinos next week... yeehaw! :cool:

[Duke]

Definitely one of my favorite episodes of the new toon. It was really well written. And I was amazed at how well they were able to mergethe shredder ultrom origin of the new toon w/ the tang shen story of the mirage comics.

[Sage Ninja]

WOW I loved this episode. this was seriously great! Am I the only one who felt kind of bad for Yoshi's brother:( .

What got me was the way he killed Teng Shi (what ever her name is) I wasn't expecting that:o

Question, Did Yoshi's brother die? I had to walk out of the room during the Yoshi vs. Brother fight?

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

Great episode. Not the best, but a close runner. I pretty much knew from the begining Tang Shen would be in this, but still awesome. I loved the animation, though Mashashi's VA fell flat at times. But still, minor flaw that can be easily overlooked.

I rate this one a 9/10, deflinatley joins Grudge Match, Dragons Rising, Bad Day, Scion of the Shredder, and Outbreak as this seasons best.

Oh, and I'm glad someone else got that it was a Bruce Lee refrence, and not Kill Bill.

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

Great episode. The animation was flawless, but Masashi's VA fell flat at times, but, minor flaw. I'm glad they included Tang Shen, as soon as Leo said "this story is about a girl", I knew it was her.

I rank this episode in the category of this seasons best along with Grudge Match, I Monster, Dragon's Rising, Scion of the Shredder, Bad Day, Outbreak, and Samurai Tourist.

9/10.

Oh, and glad someone else got the Bruce Lee refrence.

[Doppleganger]

Wow great episode, I loved how they worked around Shreddar being an Utrom to introduce their version of Oroku Nagi. What I didn't like was that after 20 years he had the same ridiculous bowl cut. :lol: Still it was a cool episode. And I'm liking how they are bringing in some rarely used Mirage characters, Robyn, Tang Shen...

Was I the only one who thought this episode felt vaguely like Star Wars: Episode 3? I mean the brother turning to the darkside over a woman. Hmm guess it's just a common theme.

[blue_angel99]

BEST SHOW EVER!!!

I'm so glad they included Teng Shen into the story. I love how Leo started his story. "It's about a girl." :P I hate tragic love stories:cry: The way Musashi was looking at Shen in the rain made me so freakin nervous, I thought he was gonna rape her...mabe he did before he killed her. ( I thought this show was family friendly. This might be one of those Never see again episodes li SAINW. Stupid bowl headed freak Musashi :evil: Yoshi should have sliced the bastard to pieces. I was like WTF when I saw the ancient one taking to Shedder demons?!? When will the Foot madness end!!

As for the preview....COWABUNGA! Renet is back. She is my favorite female character. (I personally think Leo had a crush on her in the comics...Maybe he does in the new show. That would be so cute to see him crushing on her. But from what i see in the preview, maybe Donny does!!! What a player!!!)

[Aska_Badoura]

Wow. I was hoping they'd tell us this story of Yoshi's past, after the Ancient One mentioned it awhile back. I thought it would have been the next episode, told by the Ancient One, but delayed gratification is good too. I wondered if Yoshi had a Tang Shen in his past. That answers that. It was a great adaptation of the comic's backstory, with someone else to take Oroku Nagi's place, since he can't really exist here (unless Churell has some equally insane siblings... http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y73/Zakiyah/emoticons/unsure.gif nah).

I was giggling at Raph's "I'm innocent!" expression near the beginning of the ep. Not terribly convincing... :lol:

Well, since there was the obvious parallel of Leo to Yoshi, I (of course) had to find a parallel for Karai, and Mashimi definitely fit. His speech about how Yoshi had robbed him SO reminded me of Karai's position right now, and I could very easily hear her saying the same words. And Mashimi did ask his friend's forgiveness in the end. I just wish he didn't have to die for it.. I hope the parallel ends there. :ohwell:

What on EARTH was that ending about?!! Now, I've heard some tidbits about future seasons on the Argh! Studios forums, and it could be that I have an idea of who those entities were, but it could also be something completely unrelated (er, that sounded rather nebulous, I know..). I dunno... that was really WEIRD, though. And, rather than making me think of the Shredder (although obviously he may have patterned his armor after whoever-they-are's look, and I'm hoping it's not the other way around), I think of the helmet Leo saw in "Big Brawl", in the Battle Nexus hall.. okay, apparently the Shredder shops at the same armory. Those things definitely had a god-like powerful feel... I want to know more about this! Tellll meeee! :p

LOL, pardon the language lecture, but I did some research a while back on the Japanese names that show up in various Turtle-verses (of course! :D) and I had a list of possible spellings for a lot of the names. (If you know how to turn on your Japanese encoding, I recommend that, so you can see what I'm talking about.) With Japanese, there are many ways to spell someone's name, and each character can have a different connotation depending on which one you use. So I had a list of possible spellings, rather than one in particular. Anyway, "Shen" is actually not quite a valid word (blame Eastman and Laird for not doing their research ;)), but "Shin" is, and that's what I used in my name study, and I'm gratified to see that I picked the right phoneme, since the name on Shen's headstone is one of the "shin"s on my list. I couldn't decide which one to use, myself, I mean, there's 深 =strengthen, 真=truth, 晨=morning, 信=faith, among others, and they're all pronounced "shin", and they're all names. They picked 慎=humility/descretion/restraint (refinement, I think might be a good translation, I'd have to research it more..). As for her surname, "Tang" is actually a Chinese word (blame E&L again :p). There is a character, 唐, that is an actual surname, but it should be pronounced "Tou". Confusingly, 唐 is also a word, that can be pronounced "tang", meaning "Chinese", or "Tang" dynastic (since it's an imported word). But I guess whomever did the designs for the show figured they could bend the pronounciation rules a bit, since they wanted to keep the original word, rather than make it the closest Japanese pronounciation, "tan", which of course has a whole truckload of its own meanings. Anyway, it was 唐慎 on her headstone, technically "Tou Shin", but with a little tweaking, it can be "Tang Shen".
Whew. You wanted to know all that, right? :) Now I have to go find "Yukio Mashimi"... :p

Y'know, one of the theories of Dino extinction is that a virus wiped them all out.....so....Donnie single handedly brings on the mass extinction that wiped out the Dinosaurs :lol:LOL, I like that! That would just figure...

[VaughnMichael]

I am so flippin' angry!! I slept in because my alarm didn't go off *looks at roomie* does anyone have any way I can watch this? pm me if you do please sounds like an amazing episode!:o
-Putrescent

[Raph's Girl]

OMG! OMG!! Awesome awesome ep!!! Thru Leonardo we learned
alot about master Yoshi! Including that there WAS a Tang Shien. She was Ancient One's adopted daughter and Yoshi was his son so uh technically Yoshi fell in love with his sister....Either way that was fraked up that Yukio Mashimi killed Tang Shien out of revenge for Yoshi getting higher in the ranks of the guardians....Yeesh! :ohwell:

It was interesting tho that this was also the origin of Splinter. He was originally a wild rat that Tang Shien had saved from Mashimi...Yoshi named him Splinter kinda to honor Tang Shien's memory.

But WTF was up with that ending?! Who were those creatures in the shadows that Ancient one was talking to... pleading for them to spare the turtles... *blinks* :o

[iris]

LOL, pardon the language lecture, but I did some research a while back on the Japanese names that show up in various Turtle-verses (of course! :D) and I had a list of possible spellings for a lot of the names. (If you know how to turn on your Japanese encoding, I recommend that, so you can see what I'm talking about.) With Japanese, there are many ways to spell someone's name, and each character can have a different connotation depending on which one you use. So I had a list of possible spellings, rather than one in particular. Anyway, "Shen" is actually not quite a valid word (blame Eastman and Laird for not doing their research ;)), but "Shin" is, and that's what I used in my name study, and I'm gratified to see that I picked the right phoneme, since the name on Shen's headstone is one of the "shin"s on my list. I couldn't decide which one to use, myself, I mean, there's 深 =strengthen, 真=truth, 晨=morning, 信=faith, among others, and they're all pronounced "shin", and they're all names. They picked 慎=humility/descretion/restraint (refinement, I think would be a good translation). As for her surname, "Tang" is actually a Chinese word (blame E&L again :p). There is a character, 唐, that is an actual surname, but it should be pronounced "Tou". Confusingly, 唐 is also a word, that can be pronounced "tang", meaning "Chinese", or "Tang" dynastic (since it's an imported word). But I guess whomever did the designs for the show figured they could bend the pronounciation rules a bit, since they wanted to keep the original word, rather than make it the closest Japanese pronounciation, "tan", which of course has a whole truckload of its own meanings. Anyway, it was 唐慎 on her headstone, technically "Tuo Shin", but with a little tweaking, it can be "Tang Shen".
Whew. You wanted to know all that, right? :) Now I have to go find "Yukio Mashimi"... :p

LOL, I like that! That would just figure...
That's cool. Thanks. :) Usually, I'm very forgiving of the appropriateness of names in fiction. After all, people sometimes name their kids strangely. In this specific case, Tang Shen is adopted... who knows where she came from? ;)

That said, I loved that Splinter's name has a meaning beyond "bit of wood!" Anyone have thoughts on the idea that Splinter's name is kinda a reminder of a warning about blind vengeance...?

Mad props to the writers for the historical setting.

[Aska_Badoura]

That said, I loved that Splinter's name has a meaning beyond "bit of wood!" Anyone have thoughts on the idea that Splinter's name is kinda a reminder of a warning about blind vengeance...?Now Splinter and his name can gang up on Leo, should he decide to let his anger control him again. :p (No, I don't see that happening.) I did love that his name had meaning. I'm just surprised Shen hadn't already named him something else.

*blinks* Oh, but that reminds me, and I've debated this one for years...

Yoshi gave Splinter an English name? Stan Sakai, in one of his Usagi/TMNT crossovers, used an analagous character for Splinter, a rat native to Usagi's world, whose name was Kakera, meaning 'splinter'. There are other words that can mean 'splinter', but the point is, did Splinter have one of those names, or did Yoshi use "Supurintaa", which is the closest the Japanese language can get to the pronounciation of the English? That always bothered me. Maybe Yoshi decided to call him by the English name, since he was moving to America.. Dunno. I know, who cares? :p But it's interesting.

If Splinter was with Yoshi when the TCRI building opened, why didn't he remember it later? If he could learn ninjitsu as a normal (albeit exceedingly smart and gifted) rat, couldn't he remember other things?

[Aska_Badoura]

ACK! I don't know how I managed to double post, except that my internet's been acting kind of strange today... sorry! :(

[Raph's Girl]

If Splinter was with Yoshi when the TCRI building opened, why didn't he remember it later?

Who says he didn't remember TCRI? Remember it was the Utroms who took Splinter because they knew who he was.

[creativerealms82]

Very good episode.

Remember it was not mearly Yoshi getting higher in the ranks that drove Mashimi to kill, that was just the final peice. The Anchent one always knew Mashimi was trouble, that is why he only trained him reluctently. Also I believe the Ancient one's disaproval to join the guardians was more that Mashimi alone was not ready, and just planned to hold both of them back to keep Mashimi in control.

That man obviously had a lot of rage building up, he was in love with someone who only saw him as a brother, then there ws that he just became another guardian while Yoshi rose in the ranks. So he snapped and killed one of the people that he cared for the most.

I felt sorry for Mashimi, he really was not a bad person, he just thought he desurved more then he got. Of course something as simple as that can create hatred. Once he killed Tang Shien in one moment of blind hatrid there was no going back, so he went all the way and betrayed the guardians which costed him his life. Yoshi probably killed him but if Yoshi did not Shredder killed him.

[TerranigmaFreak]

LOL, pardon the language lecture, but I did some research a while back on the Japanese names that show up in various Turtle-verses (of course! ) and I had a list of possible spellings for a lot of the names. (If you know how to turn on your Japanese encoding, I recommend that, so you can see what I'm talking about.) With Japanese, there are many ways to spell someone's name, and each character can have a different connotation depending on which one you use. So I had a list of possible spellings, rather than one in particular. Anyway, "Shen" is actually not quite a valid word (blame Eastman and Laird for not doing their research ), but "Shin" is, and that's what I used in my name study, and I'm gratified to see that I picked the right phoneme, since the name on Shen's headstone is one of the "shin"s on my list. I couldn't decide which one to use, myself, I mean, there's 深 =strengthen, 真=truth, 晨=morning, 信=faith, among others, and they're all pronounced "shin", and they're all names. They picked 慎=humility/descretion/restraint (refinement, I think might be a good translation, I'd have to research it more..). As for her surname, "Tang" is actually a Chinese word (blame E&L again ). There is a character, 唐, that is an actual surname, but it should be pronounced "Tou". Confusingly, 唐 is also a word, that can be pronounced "tang", meaning "Chinese", or "Tang" dynastic (since it's an imported word).

Or as I said earlier, 20 years later and no realize Tang Shen is a Chinese name. It is a very valid Chinese name, not so much Japanese. To add a bit more history to this lesson, the Japanese "Kanji" was actually exported to Japan during the Tang Dynasty.

A minor question, are the animators of this show (Don Wu, correct?) a Korean company? I find it strange that they were so lazy with the Kanji/Chinese symbols used throughout the show. Yes, Koreans can also write Chinese, and the stuff they used in the show looks like Americans pretending to write Chinese/Kanji.

[blue_angel99]

That said, I loved that Splinter's name has a meaning beyond "bit of wood!" .

In the " Making of TMNT II" video, Laird and Eastman said that the turtles master Splinter's name is a parody of Daredevil's master whose name was stick.:lol:

[cowabunga14]

This episode was great and I thought it was better than last week's cuz it had more action. I liked the Kung Fu reference where Yoshi had to snatch the coin from Ancient One's hand. I just hope I'm not the only one who got that. Also, I liked the Game of Death homage especially since that's one of my favorite Bruce Lee movies.

I thought this episode was very intresting and I liked the dialogue and the plot. I'm glad to know how the Utroms and Splinter came about. That was also good to see Mortu and how the Guardians started out. I was happy to see Tang Shien cuz she's never really been in an episode and the same goes for Yukio Mashimi. I was also glad that Shredder and the Foot Clan showed up.

This episode made it so everyone knew more about the Foot Clan, Tang Shien, and the Utroms. I felt I've really learned some things from this episode. I liked how Yoshi' honor was incorpated in this episode. It really showed and expressed the honorable things he did throughout his life. Since this ep was better than last week's, I give it a five out of five. I really liked the ending to this cuz it was mysterious to me and it made me wonder who those shadowy figures were. Next week's looks really good and I hope Savanti Romero and Renet'll be in it cuz I haven't seen the episode that was the first appearence of those characters.

[Aska_Badoura]

Who says he didn't remember TCRI? Remember it was the Utroms who took Splinter because they knew who he was.Well, I had assumed Splinter would have told his sons about TCRI/the Utroms if he had remembered, or at least made the connection between them and the ooze, since their name was on the canister.. did he know all that, and not tell the Turtles?

And there's still the question of how they kept track of Splinter, and in so doing, learned about the Turtles as well.

To add a bit more history to this lesson, the Japanese "Kanji" was actually exported to Japan during the Tang Dynasty.I didn't know exactly when they learned the Chinese characters... interesting! I guess that's why the word is in their language at all.

A minor question, are the animators of this show (Don Wu, correct?) a Korean company? I find it strange that they were so lazy with the Kanji/Chinese symbols used throughout the show. Yes, Koreans can also write Chinese, and the stuff they used in the show looks like Americans pretending to write Chinese/Kanji.*nods* Dong Woo is in Korea (as in, the area of the Korean culture, rather than the political North/South... thing. Dunno where they are in terms of that). I have wondered about that... but actually, as clumsy as the writing looks, it's usually still readable, so it's not like they're just making up shapes. It could be that the artists aren't good with lettering. Personally, I'm terrible at it. I'll almost always use a font instead. Or they may simply not have time to refine the drawings further before the ep gets shoved out the door. But also, the people drawing the storyboards/background layouts are in America, and it could be the animators are just reproducing what they see on the page, and trying not to second-guess what the characters should really look like. I'm not sure; it depends on where in the animation process the letters appear first, and also who draws the final version.

Oh, and I made a comment last week, about April's and Angel's hair colors being odd... and I was trying to remember the third character I remember having a strange color, and this ep reminded me today: Mortu. One out of three, at the very least, is not human (for another question, why wouldn't Mortu and the others style the suits to look more Japanese, like Churell's, since they've been living in Japan?)... what does this say about the other two? http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y73/Zakiyah/emoticons/unsure.gif There's an odd question.

[Fledermaus]

Or as I said earlier, 20 years later and no realize Tang Shen is a Chinese name. It is a very valid Chinese name, not so much Japanese. To add a bit more history to this lesson, the Japanese "Kanji" was actually exported to Japan during the Tang Dynasty.

A minor question, are the animators of this show (Don Wu, correct?) a Korean company? I find it strange that they were so lazy with the Kanji/Chinese symbols used throughout the show. Yes, Koreans can also write Chinese, and the stuff they used in the show looks like Americans pretending to write Chinese/Kanji.

The show gets animated by DongWoo, but is designed in the U.S.

Very nice episode, indeed. Most of what I'd have to say has already been said, so I just give big thumbs up to the episode. Mashimi looks like a pug dog burned by acid. It's easy to love the lovely...:(

All I do have to say is that seeing young Yoshi and Mashimi beg in the streets reminded me so much of my mother. This whole episode was so close to home -- my mom was almost exactly their generation by three years.:cry: It sucked big time being an orphan in Asia, especially after the war.:( But if she weren't orphaned, tons of things wouldn't have taken place. I would never have existed and dad would have grown up a very lonely and lost baby-boomer. Yes, fate is such a strange thing.:)

Okay, so I have a few things to say.:P

Tang Shen WAS hot, and extremely well-endowed.;) But she did not look very Japanese to me... Could be lousy character design, though I wonder. I have seen Chinese girls whose faces had this unusual, almost caucasian structure... Very similar to the Tang Shen in this episode. I wonder if she was possibly kidnapped by Japanese soldiers during the war and brought to Japan to be Japan-ized -- perhaps adopted by some filthy old man, as was done not uncommonly to some children. Possibly, the Ancient One, a kind old man (although after seeing the last part of the episode, I don't know what to think about his character:o ), rescued her from a degrading life and raised her. Perhaps she opted to stay with him, since her family could well be dead due to the war. Lots of possibilities.:nod:

Lastly... why was Tang Shen wearing a mu-mu, corpse style?:evil: Would it kill them to do the smallest bit of research?:roll:

Other than that, brilliant episode.

[iris]

Would it kill them to do the smallest bit of research?:roll:
According to NHANES, research is a leading cause of death among television show producers.

[Raph's Girl]

Tang Shen WAS hot, and extremely well-endowed.;) But she did not look very Japanese to me

Well for one thing the captioning spelled her named Tang Shien. Meh... either way it's chinese for Sacred Soul/Immortal Beloved (I did some research on the name for my fan fic).

Now altho Tang didn't look quite Japanese perhaps, and this is considering the time and place of the story, she was half white? Her father could have been an American soldier. Or she was indeed a Chinese orphan or at least part Chinese or something. We don't know the surcumstances in her story like where Ancient One found her.

Either way she and Yoshi were raised together and she was technically his sister, albeit adopted one, but on the other hand she had Splinter first and therefore Tang Shien is Splinter's mother and Yoshi only took him in to honor Tang Shien's memory.

I wonder if Yukio is alive? We didn't see Shredder kill him and nor Yoshi for that matter. That would be interesting...Splinter could avenge his mommy or the turtles could avenge their grandmother...

[iris]

Either way she and Yoshi were raised together and she was technically his sister, albeit adopted one, but on the other hand she had Splinter first and therefore Tang Shien is Splinter's mother and Yoshi only took him in to honor Tang Shien's memory.

I wonder if Yukio is alive? We didn't see Shredder kill him and nor Yoshi for that matter. That would be interesting...Splinter could avenge his mommy or the turtles could avenge their grandmother...
I was wondering about the implications for the family tree. The Ancient One is Splinter's grandpa on both sides! He's the double G.

Maybe I missed something, but I got the impression that Tang Shen came to live with the AO when she was a bit older? Anyone remember exactly what Leo said when he introduced her by name?

BTW they did pronounce it like "Tang Shien." I have no clue if that's a "real" Chinese name, but that sounds even more distinctively Chinese to my ear.

[TheShowstoppa]

All I have to say is that this was quite possibly the best ep of the season. In only so many words, I cannot even begin to say how great it was. Not to mention that even though it only took 4 seasons, we got to see Tang Shen! How great was that? I especially like the part where the final battle took place, even though I wished it would have lasted longer.

[Torrant2]

I was giggling at Raph's "I'm innocent!" expression near the beginning of the ep. Not terribly convincing... :lol:


Me too, isn't it great how Splinter doesn't even have to say anything to stop his son in his tracks.

[Doppleganger]

I'm kind of wondering, the Ancient One (why don't they give this guy a name!) was seen living a life of poverty out in the wilderness away from the fringes of humanity. This episode makes me wonder. Why is that? Is it from the sadness of losing his family? Or did the trauma of losing Tang Shien and Yukio Mashimi (because I think it pained to lose him too) make him lose focus and become bad at money management? I guess it's all very trivial in the whole scheme of things but it was just a curiousity to me. He seemed to have a comfortable middle class life and yet...he gave it all up?? :| I understand he would be sad. Maybe someone can enlighten me on this point.

And yeah! What the hell WERE those things in the shadows. I really didn't see any Shreddarness to them...much but then I couldn't see much of anything to them. :/ My guess? They just might be the Foot Mystics (perhaps foreshadowing the events that lead to Season 5?). But then their are four of them.

[Masked Ninja]

I'm kind of wondering, the Ancient One (why don't they give this guy a name!) was seen living a life of poverty out in the wilderness away from the fringes of humanity. This episode makes me wonder. Why is that? Is it from the sadness of losing his family? Or did the trauma of losing Tang Shien and Yukio Mashimi (because I think it pained to lose him too) make him lose focus and become bad at money management?I wonder if it's one of those "give up material things and live with nature and be at peace" kinda things. Like... personal enlightenment or something?

As for the whole "Tang Shen" issue... She could very well be at least part Chinese. Brought to Japan, the child of soldiers, etc... and while it wouldn't happen as much in this place at this time, remember we have people named Xinyi, etc. in America, even though we don't speak Chinese. I don't think it's imperative to the story that she be Japanese, anyway.

[Ryona]

If you both remember, The Ancient One has a really nice, large temple... even though it's out in the middle of nowhere. So he's not exactly roughing it so to speak. I'm sure he just relocated away from the city.

[Doppleganger]

If you both remember, The Ancient One has a really nice, large temple... even though it's out in the middle of nowhere. So he's not exactly roughing it so to speak. I'm sure he just relocated away from the city.

I always got the impression that was a place he found. It looked to be in ruin. I really have no idea so I'll just shrug and think he wishes to live a life of poverty. ^^;

[Aska_Badoura]

I forgot, I was also going to say that I thought the whole moral lesson was rather undermined... at least as far as a clear parallel to Leo, and the lesson for him for the consequence of anger. I thought it was supposed to show why Yoshi shouldn't have acted in anger, but it seemed to better illustrate why Mashimi shouldn't have acted in anger. I'm not sure what it would have taught Leo, hearing it when he was recovering (I know, I make it sound like an illness, but I think it was, of a sort).

Lastly... why was Tang Shen wearing a mu-mu, corpse style?Okay, I'm ignorant... what do you mean?

Would it kill them to do the smallest bit of research? :roll:LOL, possibly...

According to NHANES, research is a leading cause of death among television show producers.National Hatred of Accuracy in New Entertainment Studies? :lol: (sorry, I really have no clue what that stands for... acronyms and I don't get along too well).

Well for one thing the captioning spelled her named Tang Shien.I don't like closed captioning... It helps when you can't understand what someone says (like last week, the Councilor: "...starting with his precious... art? dirt? ant? sent?" Oh! EARTH! :p), but it's miserable for learning how to spell names.

I guess it's all very trivial in the whole scheme of things but it was just a curiousity to me. He seemed to have a comfortable middle class life and yet...he gave it all up?? I understand he would be sad. Maybe someone can enlighten me on this point.Well to me, in "The Ancient One", he seemed to live in this surreal unearthly place, in a valley where it should be snowing, where there are yetis and ghouls, and much more fleshed-out surroundings than you typically see in the reality of the rest of the show. It was almost like he's living in some kind of higher plane or something. The place they all lived in in this story seemed much more earthly. I'm not sure what that means.

I really didn't see any Shreddarness to them...much but then I couldn't see much of anything to them. :/
Oh. Well, here, I traced what I could see of their sillhouettes. Does that help? ;)
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y73/Zakiyah/entities.jpg

They just might be the Foot Mystics (perhaps foreshadowing the events that lead to Season 5?). But then their are four of them. I thought there were three... two males, one with blue eyes, one with white, and a female with green eyes. I thought the one with blue eyes spoke twice. Maybe I'm wrong. (Ooh, here's a creepy thought: the eye colors seem to correspond with the more western four elements, with blue being water, green being earth, white being air, and red - that would be the Shredder - being fire. Like the Shredder's part of a group we don't even know about. I don't like that idea. Probably coincidence. Moving on... *shudder*)
On the other hand, I'm thinking I may have read something about them, but it's not very useful info anyway. And I probably shouldn't say anything; the person who wrote it said their bosses may not be happy that he let that slip. And I don't really know that this is who these beings are. I have a big mouth, I'll shut up now. :| Find it yourself at www.arghstudios.com/forum , and be quiet about it. ;)

[Doppleganger]

Thanks Aska you're a doll. :D Now I'm really curious to what it is you're hinting at. I'll see hehehe. And you're right, how does the Ancient One live in a place where there are RONSOS? :lol:

[iris]

Thanks for the caps of the mystery figures to whom the AO talked (we really do need a name for that guy). Those figures just looked like eyes on my screen... the outlines were not dscernable at all.

Have we seen that place before? Does anyone recognize it, or the style of the architecture?

National Hatred of Accuracy in New Entertainment Studies? :lol: (sorry, I really have no clue what that stands for... acronyms and I don't get along too well)
Bwah! I like that! I didn't expect anyone to get the acronym, it was just a health survey that was convenient to my memory. Should've said MMWR. Morbidity and Mortality Weekly... ain't that a great publication title? :dead: :dead: :dead: :ohwell:

[Chang'e Long]

"Tales of Yoshi" had the best animation. Yeah, World War 2 kinda sucked after awhile. Its kinda sad that these two kids (Yoshi and Yukio) were orphans. No doubt they got orphaned after the bombing. (Yeah, I've been reading up in World War 2).

The whole Tang Shen being in Japan with the Ancient One kinda puzzles me too. Tang Shen is definitely a Chinese name (I've looked up Chinese names lots of times, since most of my OCs are Chinese or Japanese) and Shen was one of those names. No doubt Tang is on the list also. I like the name, Tang. I don't know how Chinese and Japanese participated in World War 2, but maybe China did had something to do with it or something...

But I did examined her appearance closely. She did look like a cross between Chinese and Japanese (at least in my point of view). I'm starting to think that maybe one of her parents was Chinese who married someone of Japanese descent and she got orphaned after the bombing in World War 2. That kinda will make sense.

I nearly started to cry when Yoshi cried out and especially when Yukio asked his brother to forgive him. He wasn't a bad person, he was just influenced by jealousy. It proves about the saying that jealousy indeed turns people into Green-Eyed monsters. To me it seems that Yukio just wants to prove that he has something too. Their rivalry kinda reminds me of Leonardo and Raphael, except they're not fighting over a girl. Its more like that Yukio just can't stand living in Yoshi's shadow anymore. He just wants to prove something that he's capable of. Thats human understanding, right?

However, what really intrigued me were those shadowy people. I'm starting to think that these people are like the Fates from the Greek myth. The one who weaves the Tapestry of Fate, weaving the thread of destiny for every mortal on Earth. My guess is that these strange quartet had created their own Tapestry of Fate for the Turtles.

[Buslady]

Best ep of the season. I've wanted something Splinter/Yoshi/etc focused for once...(but i missed Raph's wonderfulness....i need more raph stuff hehe)

I'm really getting to like Fartso-sensei. heheh... he kinda reminds me a little bit of Takuan in raising a orphaned girl (like in the old 50's Musashi trilogy).
I liked how they mooshed the story around and fitted it to the series.

And they never pronounce her name as Shen, but Shin...so .... I take it as Tang Shin....I dont think it matters if she's Chinese or Japanese, she could be very well Chinese. It doesnt matter! Who's to say maybe she moved to Japan from China? One of Japan's greatest actors was born in China (Mifune) and repatriated to Japan.

[cormano]

i was so excited to get to see this episode yesterday and then work called at 9:30 and i had to go in :(. looks like i'll have to find it elsewhere…

[Katie]

I don't know how Chinese and Japanese participated in World War 2, but maybe China did had something to do with it or something...




During World War II, Japan invaded China and set up a puppet state. I would guess this act would have caused alot of chinese orphans...and it probably is not too far fetched to think that those orphans could have made their way into Japan.

Also, it is not unbelievable that Japan would have a population of people of Chinese decent, having imigrated there or whatnot.

[Stephen]

There seems to be a few inconsistencies with previous episodes. In "Search For Splinter" the Utroms said that this (The TCRI building) was the first time one of their domains had ever been infiltrated and in "Secret Origins" this was supposed to be the first time the Shredder had disovered the Utroms in 100 years or so.

[Ryona]

To me it seems that Yukio just wants to prove that he has something too. Their rivalry kinda reminds me of Leonardo and Raphael, except they're not fighting over a girl. Its more like that Yukio just can't stand living in Yoshi's shadow anymore. He just wants to prove something that he's capable of. Thats human understanding, right?

I thought I was the only one who saw that. Watching the episode Yukio Masashi (or is it Mashimi?) reminded me alot of Raph, especially from the first season, where as Yoshi was like Leo.
Makes one wonder what would happen if a girl got between Leo and Raph. :teek:

[Doppleganger]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt bad for Mashimi. What he did was horrible and despicable but what he felt, jealousy, is a very human thing. Anybody can be poisoned by it. He deserved the fate he he got no doubt about it but I still felt he was a rather tragic figure.

[Fledermaus]

I thought I was the only one who saw that. Watching the episode Yukio Masashi (or is it Mashimi?) reminded me alot of Raph, especially from the first season, where as Yoshi was like Leo.
Makes one wonder what would happen if a girl got between Leo and Raph. :teek:


I was wondering about this too (BTW, yes it is Mashimi, rhymes with Sashimi:P ), especially when, in that first childhood scene, the two are depicted wearing blue and red... the one in red becomes jealous of the one in blue... The guardian outfit is blue, the foot outfit black and red...

You never know.

Okay, I'm ignorant... what do you mean?

I mean it didn't look like a kimono to me, more like the generic western impression of kimono.
1. The obvious: it should be folded left over right. Right over left is only for dead bodies.:dead:
Not so obvious...
2. Kimonos are two-piece garments that are rather close-fitting (especially for women), yet should not give away the forms of the bust/waist.
3. Collar should be higher, skirt should be just above the ankles.
4. The obi just didn't look like an obi to me. It looked too much like a single, skin tight sash.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/Dierna/TMNT/TaleofYoshi/friends.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/Dierna/TMNT/TaleofYoshi/friends1.jpg

This is what I mean by mu-mu -- Japanese and Polynesian cultures both share a love of flowery patterns, except that mu-mus are more billowy and can have a lower cut...
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/Dierna/TMNT/TaleofYoshi/TangShien1.jpg

I've never seen a girl in traditional dress wear such a cleavage-revealing kimono, unless she was a geisha posing for an artist, or she was trying to entice her hubby-shnookums to... At any rate, she doesn't appear to be wearing any upper undergarments.;)
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/Dierna/TMNT/TaleofYoshi/Mashimikill2.jpg

From a distance, if you ignore the pattern, the shape of her dress looks more Korean than Japanese: the bell-shape, as well as its length reaching the ground. *shrugs*
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/Dierna/TMNT/TaleofYoshi/Mashimikill1.jpg

But, this is small annoyance in face of honorable episode.:) A very typical sibling rivalry/honor/jealousy story. Beauty in tragedy is a common theme in Japanese stories.

[Rat_Queen_Valarian]

I was wondering about this too (BTW, yes it is Mashimi, rhymes with Sashimi:P ), especially when, in that first childhood scene, the two are depicted wearing blue and red... the one in red becomes jealous of the one in blue... The guardian outfit is blue, the foot outfit black and red...

I also noticed that. I always believed that virtually any two parties marked red and blue were the most likely to conflict each other since I saw that episode of Wing Commander Academy titled "Red and Blue".

Also, someone mentioned Leo and Raph parrallels. Know what? I'm with them!

Yet someone else mentioned a weird family tree. I've been erecting one of my own. The thing is, apparently it's almost COMPLETELY Alternate Universe.

The good thing about this episode for me is it's definitely one of my favorites.
The bad thing: Tang Shen was offed too soon in the timeline! That's why my fanworks involving Yoshiko and Clan Tang have all gone AU! According to my backstory for these fan characters, Shen is the mother of both Yoshiko and the head of Clan Tang, Master Shizuka!

I give this ep a 9/10!

[TerranigmaFreak]

I don't know how Chinese and Japanese participated in World War 2, but maybe China did had something to do with it or something...

Japan invaded China, and slaughtered hundreds and thousands of people; they pillaged wherever they went; tons of women were raped, etc. They invaded other countries in Asia as well, but China was the hardest hit from their invasion. Why do you think most of Asian countries are so pissed off at Japan? Well, that and Japanese textbooks rewrite history on purpose.

I have a theory on The Ancient One. Some of you probably aren't going to like it... I think the Ancient One is in leagued with the Foot. Go back and rewatch the episode and you'll see that he says something like "There's another destiny for Yoshi" when he wanted to join the Guardians. I think he's against it because he wanted Yoshi to serve The Foot. How does he know there's another destiny waiting for Yoshi, unless he already planned it out from the start. Then again, he does have the ability to see into the future a bit. But then how could he have not forseen Yoshi joining the Guardians?

As for Tang Shen being well endowed... They've been using silicon to make Godzilla suits back in 1954 ;)

[J Legault]

This episode gets a 5/5 for the whole Hamoto Yoshi background.

This was like the first episode to ever focus on Hamoto Yoshi a lot.

It was cool to see Teng Shen involved in the story as well as the Utroms and Guardians(haven't seen them for a long time).

Now to wait and see what the hell the Ancient one is doing with what appears to be Shredder Figures. Could be the clones but not 100% sure yet.

[VaughnMichael]

I'm seeing allot of people saying these shredder esq figures could be the clones....I'll have to stop that idea right now by saying it can't be because the clones did not look alike they had been very large and mucular, hunched over and lanky, & very small with a big head.
These three figures we are seeing are all the same size...
I have a few Ideas for what it could be....like some one said before it could be the foot mystics Karai could be making everyone wear shredder outfits now lol she is crazy after all.....
It could also be that Karai has cloned her self now....she does seem to want to copy her fathers actions allot....
Or these could be shredders friends that had been waiting for him on Tanilla 5.
But the last idea is a bit out there but I would enoy seeing those so called friends of his come after the turtles.
-Putrescent

[Aztec General]

During World War II, Japan invaded China and set up a puppet state. I would guess this act would have caused alot of chinese orphans...and it probably is not too far fetched to think that those orphans could have made their way into Japan.

Also, it is not unbelievable that Japan would have a population of people of Chinese decent, having imigrated there or whatnot.

As a history teacher maybe I can further clear this up a bit. Japan invaded Manchuria (northeast portion of China) in 1931. They later went on to invade the rest of China and numerous other Asian/Pacific nations, and the colonial possessions of western powers present in the region: Britain, France, Netherlands, and US.

At the time, the Japanese government was run by pseudo-facist militarists who believed that Japan's future lied in dominating Asia and the Pacific. In order to secure themselves, and be better able to conduct their war, they alligned themselves with Nazi Germany and their facist allies. The plan was for Nazi German forces to eventually link up with Japanese forces somwhere in the MidEast. Together they would rule the Eastern Hemisphere under facist government. Thus effectively placing much of the world's populaiton in servitude under those two powers.

Like their Nazi allies the Japanese imperialist army was notorious for its policies of mass murder, rape, destruction, barbaric "science" experiments involving chemicals/biological agents, pillaging, forced labor, and brutal racist policies. As a result over 4 milliion people died under Japanese occupation from 1931-1945.

As for Chinese immigrants in Japan it was, and still is, very common. Japan had, and still has, a far better and more modern economy than China. Thus jobs and opportunity are available in Japan that would not be available in China.

[iris]

Thanks, Rat King. That's pretty much how I know the story as well. Japan's actions were destructive in many ways, and some of that destructive force still lives in the modern governments of the region. :p Foot clan nonwithstanding.


As for those beings before whom the AO was cowering... I'm not ready to assume they are in line with Shredder's purpose. My question is, why do the turtles' lives might affect them? However, it is interesting that the Ancient One tried to stop Yoshi and Mashimi from joining the Guardians.

[Spitfire]

Can anyone say Kill Bill? O_O That's all I could think when I saw his outfit. Awesome episode though! I'm glad we got to find out more about Yoshi. His voice was kinda different then it was when they showed Shredder killing him though.

So those people at the end sure don't seem to like them TMNT haha I wonder what that's all about...

[zkarlette]

I really liked the Ep but I was kind of freaked out whe I saw yoshi on a "kill Bill " outfit thankfully now I know Bruce Lee had it first ....

I think it was kind of weird of once again changing the story of the beginning but I guess it does fit the new toon , I wasnt expecting to see Mashimi kill Tang -shen at all ...

And that ending was really suspicious... I wonder If the Ancient one really has conections with the shredder why did he help Leo ..

[TheShowstoppa]

He doesn't have connections with Shredder, he went to plee on behalf of the turtles. Well... I don't think that he has connections anyway.

I forgot about the end of the show. I was just in awe at the whole episode as a whole. I will say that I honestly do think this was one of the best animated episodes of the season. Again, the end battle was shorter than it should have been, but it was still good. Unraveling the truth behind the Utroms move to New York was good.

As for the quote about Shredder not finding Mortu for 100 years, that's because when they found them in Japan, they escaped. The New York incident would have been the first time they would have been cornered without any escape pods to make them readily able to get away.

[J Legault]

Atleast we saw the reason why the Utroms had to relocate themselve to New York.

Never seen Kill Bill, but atleast Hamoto Yoshi did wore other outfits beside the robe he wore in the Shredder Strikes flashback.

[Ryona]

Can anyone say Kill Bill? O_O That's all I could think when I saw his outfit.

It was total homage to Bruce Lee. A TRUE warrior. Not a fake like blondie.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v358/Ryou-chan4ever/Bruce2.jpg



If you ever get the chance, watch Game of Death. ;)

[XERO]

And if you ever get the chance, watch the one with the bonus footage.8)

[onyx]

Best episode from the current season, and it didn't even include TMNT action!

I liked everything in this episode - animation, battle scenes, atmosphere and so on. I tend to be critical usually, but this episode was pure brilliance :)

The end freaked me out, those can't be the Shredder clones, those three were different shapes. The Foot Mystics - I really doubt it, what would they do in Japan and why would the Ancient One talk to them. Also, there are five mystics, but only three were talking to the Ancient One. I think those are new characters and I can't wait to see who are they.

Seems like there is a lot that we don't know about the Ancient One, but I believe that we'll get the same type of "history lesson" about him at some point.

[Mecha Cow]

This episode was something different, but I definately enjoyed seeing the cartoon interpretation of Yoshi' backstory. The Bruce Lee homages were funny as well. A few things kind of bothered me though.

Three orphans are raised by the same person. The two boys are 'like brothers', and they see the girl as a...lover?!

If you're in love with a girl, but she's in love with someone else, your only option is to kill the...girl?!

But I understand that it's a cartoon, and I'm not b*tching, just poking fun. :P

As for the guys at the end, my guess is that they're some kind of Foot mystics. Though for all we know they're entirely new characters. Should be interesting anyway.

[Turtleman100]

It was a cool episode. They should have fight more then that o well.

[Raph's Girl]

Seems like there is a lot that we don't know about the Ancient One, but I believe that we'll get the same type of "history lesson" about him at some point.

Yes... "Tales of the Ancient One"! Perhaps someday we'll find out exactly how old he was since in the 1960's his hair was grey and slowly turning white. Also perhaps we'll learn just WTF his real name is! :ohwell:

[Spitfire]

If you ever get the chance, watch Game of Death. ;)
Hey I should, so Kill Bill was a tribute to that too in a sense...well it was a tribute to all old Kung-fu flicks. I never got to watch any Bruce Lee films. Sad really. I should though.

[Duke]

I thought there were three... two males, one with blue eyes, one with white, and a female with green eyes. I thought the one with blue eyes spoke twice. Maybe I'm wrong.You are wrong cause there are five foot mystics. Earth, Fire, Wind, Water, and Metal (I might be a little off on the last one but I think that's right).

[Raph's Girl]

You are wrong cause there are five foot mystics. Earth, Fire, Wind, Water, and Metal (I might be a little off on the last one but I think that's right).

Aska was refering to the shadowy figures Ancient One was talking to... there were 3 of em... 1 female and 2 males.

[Aska_Badoura]

There seems to be a few inconsistencies with previous episodes. In "Search For Splinter" the Utroms said that this (The TCRI building) was the first time one of their domains had ever been infiltrated and in "Secret Origins" this was supposed to be the first time the Shredder had disovered the Utroms in 100 years or so.Oooooh. Bad. You're right. I'm looking at my notes I took on the Shredder's past a while back (yes, I keep notes, don't tell me I have no life, I know it already! :p): I did note that they'd never been invaded before... I also wrote that the Shredder accused Yoshi of working for the Utroms just before he killed him. It wouldn't need to be an accusation if he'd seen him with them, and Mashimi had told him as well. I also noted that 'Shredder's enemies "have eluded [him] for longer than you can imagine"', part of that being a direct quote from the ep. I guess you could stretch that and say he meant that he'd met up with them more recently, but they eluded capture/destruction.
Well, this kind of thing tends to happen with long ongoing stories... it's easy to forget what little incidentals have been said before at the very beginning (book series can be notoriously bad for that, since it takes an author so long to write a book usually). Too bad though. :ohwell:
While I'm looking at this, there's that incredibly interesting quote I hope they someday elaborate on: "The Sword of Tengu. The sword with which I laid villages to waste, brought castles to ground, vanquished armies. The sword that I used to conquer Japan, and give power to the Tokugawa clan." I think Tokugawa was the clan that ruled Japan during the feudal period. A puppet shogunate to the Shredder? That sounds pretty creepy. :|

I thought I was the only one who saw that. Watching the episode Yukio Masashi (or is it Mashimi?) reminded me alot of Raph, especially from the first season, where as Yoshi was like Leo. LOL, I saw Karai, you saw Raph. Interesting.

Fledermaus: Hmm. Okay, I see what you mean now. Would she be wearing a yukata, then, if she was more accurately dressed? (I get confused about casual Japanese dress, since I've usually only seen either one extreme or the other: really formal kimonos, or more-or-less western clothing) Does it seem unusual that's she's traditionally dressed, in the 60's/70's, or was that typical?

That's why my fanworks involving Yoshiko and Clan Tang have all gone AU! Don't you hate it when they contradict fanfiction you really like/have worked on? I feel as though I should have been consulted first. :lol:

So those people at the end sure don't seem to like them TMNT haha I wonder what that's all about...They seemed impartial to me. They obviously have something planned for them that the Ancient One thinks isn't so hot, but they were pretty non-committal about whether the Turtles would be hurt/live through it or not.

[Duke]

Aska was refering to the shadowy figures Ancient One was talking to... there were 3 of em... 1 female and 2 males.Sorry Aska, I read the quote you were responding to and thought you were still talking about the mystics. I should have known you wouldn't make a mistake like that. But I still can't tell how you were able to tell who was female and who was male. I guess I need to start recording the episodes again instead of waiting for the out of order DVDs and maybe I can catch some of this stuff too.

[Raph's Girl]

But I still can't tell how you were able to tell who was female and who was male.

Well I could tell since the green eyed one sounded female while the other 2 sounded very male. :P

[onyx]

Well I could tell since the green eyed one sounded female while the other 2 sounded very male. :P

Which reminds me, the only 1 female - 2 male trio that I could remember from the toon so far is the Utrom bosses (in their human form). Could that be them? Very unlikely, because they were friends of the turtles last time we saw them, but still...

Do we know how Utroms reproduce? I mean, do they need a female Utrom or something? Have we ever seen a female Utrom at all? Because if they can reproduce by themself, those three might be Shredder's heirs. They maybe are wearing his old exo-suits (remember, the one from Ancient Japan for example is different from the present day one).

[Anarky]

Okay, first of all, I didn't like this episode. It was utter bollocks, if you ask me and it seems as if the writers just ran out of stuff to tell, so they go "Oh, let's tell the kids some stories of the past while we buttrape everything we've said before." But hey, we have to watch what we get.

So, Yoshi's outfit was obviously stolen from the Bride from Kill Bill. Everybody who thinks differently is obviously wrong because Yoshi was a transvestite who could see the future. It was obvious. And if you want to see it too, just stand on your head, while the lights are dimmed and fart three times. Then you'll see it clearly. It's so easy to see. Also, he displayed his seeing abilities more than once, most notably in the scene where they first meet Mortu.

Also, Fledermaus, your concerns for Tang Shen's looks and her clothings are nonsense. We all know she's from the Negativerse, where everything's different. I mean, just eat two cans of fried beans, watch the episode backwards and turn the volume up to level 7, then you'll hear her say "I'm from the Negativerse" about twelve minutes into the episode. So it's only obvious that the Negativersians have it all differently. She has to look caucasian, otherwise she wouldn't be asian. And she needs to have her not-kimono folded that way, because otherwise she wouldn't be wearing a living person's kimono. The ancient one realized that, so why can't we do the same? Also, the pixel located at 7/4 (basic mathematical coordinate system) in the actual image of the cartoon (black bars not included) is in negative colour whenever Tang Shen is in the picture. It is so obvious.

To conclude, I want to say that I'm right and if you don't agree, you're obviously wrong. The evidence is there and it's obvious. I have spoken.

[iris]

Anarky, I kind of agree with you, as far as the sane part of your post goes. The storyline consistency if this show is usually above par, but the writers appear to have fallen on their [noses] here. I can, just on my poor memory, think of about five yawning storyline holes.

However, I disagree with you. On principle. Um… yes… see, so many things about this ep don’t fit the grand scheme that they must be insonsistent by design. The writers are throwing us curveballs to knock us off balance. Later, these so-called holes will all make sense. I’m sure, like, we’ll find out that something happened to make Shredder think Yoshi was not working for the Utroms after all. And… so on. *ahem* Yep. :goofygri:

[Barkworm]

I liked the actual story but the delivery was poor. 4Kids' amateur voice actors didn't help, either.

[Anarky]

Well whaddaya know... my brother just came home and after my raving about farting while standing on your head, he had to agree with me on that, but not on the Negativerse-point, no matter how obvious it is. And because he's very interested in japanese history and culture up to this day, he told me why she wore her kimono "in the wrong way". It wasn't the wrong way at all. It fit her profession. She wasn't a mere housekeeper, no she was most likely a prostitute. You see, back in the day, prostitution in Japan was prohibited. But, like everything that is prohibited and still demanded, it still existed. And prostitutes wore their kimono "the wrong way around" so that potential customers would see who they can ask the "How much?"-question.

Although my Negativerse-theory makes a lot of sense, I can't outrule my brother's theory about her job.

[Aska_Badoura]

Sorry Aska, I read the quote you were responding to and thought you were still talking about the mystics.No problem, Duke. I probably should have been more specific, anyway. :goofygri:

But I still can't tell how you were able to tell who was female and who was male.All of the entities spoke, and the green-eyed one had a female voice. Simple as that. :)

Which reminds me, the only 1 female - 2 male trio that I could remember from the toon so far is the Utrom bosses (in their human form). Could that be them? Very unlikely, because they were friends of the turtles last time we saw them, but still...I hadn't thought of that... that's kind of interesting. Perhaps they correspond to the Navigators, but on the opposite side of things? And I'm not really sure where the Ancient One fits in... he doesn't seem to be 'on their side', but he apparently has to/feels need to respect their decisions. Either way, these entities really give me the unsettling feeling that we don't have any idea what the Shredder was, after all. The identity of the Shredder may actually have had very little to do with Churell (a stolen persona kind of thing?). I really hope they throw us some more clues.

Have we ever seen a female Utrom at all? For what it's worth, several of the Utrom's exosuits in the TCRI arc were female, including, of course, one of the Navigators. Also, in the Vol 4 comics, a human refers to one Utrom as "she", but she wasn't really distinguishable from any other Utrom. So there's perhaps some superficial differences (voice, maybe, although not in the case of the female Navigator, but that was also the only case where three Utroms had the same voice, so I don't think that counts).

Do we know how Utroms reproduce?....Because if they can reproduce by themself... I've wondered that for a while, but I don't think it's really all that relevant (they probably don't want to go there :p). Although I'm still weirded out about the three Shredder clones from way back... I kind of wondered if they may have been Utroms (with underdeveloped brain power), or if they really were bipeds.

...those three might be Shredder's heirs. They maybe are wearing his old exo-suits (remember, the one from Ancient Japan for example is different from the present day one).
But, really, if he had flesh-and-blood heirs, what would he need Karai for?
-----

*baps Anarky* We like over-analyzing! Be patient with us! :p

Um… yes… see, so many things about this ep don’t fit the grand scheme that they must be inconsistent by design. The writers are throwing us curveballs to knock us off balance. Later, these so-called holes will all make sense. I’m sure, like, we’ll find out that something happened to make Shredder think Yoshi was not working for the Utroms after all. And… so on. *ahem* Yep. :goofygri:*blinks* I know you're being halfway-facetious, but we can hope, anyway. If Star Wars could semi-pull it off, Turtles can too. ;)

[iris]

I do hope, Aska, but at the moment it's a weak position to take.

[Anarky]

*baps Anarky* We like over-analyzing! Be patient with us! :p

What the hell is this? As soon as someone has a different, yet correct, view on things, you go "Oh, you're so silly. Hehehe..." just because you can't accept a simple solution like a future-seeing transvestite or a Negativersian. I find myself very insulted here. Have you even watched the episode? It is obvious.

Also, the Kimono-issue could tell us a lot about the household and/or the social environment of the ancient one's home. I'm not saying that they were having a brothel, but is it just me, or is it really a bit big for just four people and a dojo/living room?

[onyx]

But, really, if he had flesh-and-blood heirs, what would he need Karai for?


As far as I remember, he simply took pity of Karai and he didn't take her under his wing just because he needed a heir. After all, he's immortal (for the Earth standards), so why would he need a human heir at all? He would probably outlive Karai anyway.

[VaughnMichael]

As far as I remember, he simply took pity of Karai and he didn't take her under his wing just because he needed a heir. After all, he's immortal (for the Earth standards), so why would he need a human heir at all? He would probably outlive Karai anyway.
to take over on earth like he did with her.....like he planned all along..

[Stephen]

Do we know how Utroms reproduce?

When a Mommy Utrom and a Daddy Utrom love each other very much ..... :D

[Raph's Girl]

When a Mommy Utrom and a Daddy Utrom love each other very much ..... :D

Or rather when a mommy and daddy Utrom get drunk on Cranberry juice. :lol:

Perhaps prof. Obligato (or whatever his name is) will teach us? Yea...that'll go well...an issue of Tales of the TMNT that has an anatomy lesson of the Utroms.

[zkarlette]

I really don't think that I ant to know anything about Utrom anatomy:| ....

Now that you mention karai I wonder If maybe there is any good in the shredder to keep karai as his daughter or what would be his real motives?

[Spitfire]

I really don't think that I ant to know anything about Utrom anatomy:| ....

Now that you mention karai I wonder If maybe there is any good in the shredder to keep karai as his daughter or what would be his real motives?
Someone to rule his empire when he is away, someone to watch over his empire when he leaves for space to take over other worlds. I assumed that from what he said in the Exodus.

[Aska_Badoura]

I do hope, Aska, but at the moment it's a weak position to take.Yeah, I know... I'm trying anyway.. :goofygri:

As soon as someone has a different, yet correct, view on things, you go "Oh, you're so silly. Hehehe..." just because you can't accept a simple solution like a future-seeing transvestite or a Negativersian. I find myself very insulted here. Have you even watched the episode? It is obvious.Yes, of course, Anarky. You're exactly right. How ever could I not have seen that?

(Anyway, I do agree that a different take on things should not be stated as fact. But it's tempting to do so when you've thought over it so much. As for me, I try hard to simply present what I see. And I really hope you haven't come to this conclusion through extensive analysis. :p)

As far as I remember, he simply took pity of Karai and he didn't take her under his wing just because he needed a heir. After all, he's immortal (for the Earth standards), so why would he need a human heir at all? He would probably outlive Karai anyway.I never really felt like it was pity at all. A guy that's destroyed whole worlds, taking pity on one little orphaned girl? I suppose it could have been, but I always kinda saw her as a placeholder. Somebody had to manage the Foot while he was gone, so he'd still have a Foot when he got back (that sounded odd..). I think she'd make sure someone took over for her when she was gone, and so on, until Ch'rell (okay, I finally happened to look at the official site's FAQ, and saw the correct spelling of his name *slaps own hand*) returned. But I guess that is debatable, and he may indeed have had pity on her. Anyway... I don't know about those entities. It would be interesting if they turned out to be Utroms, but it's impossible to tell at this point (unfortunately :p).

[Rat_Queen_Valarian]

A couple of things I observed and remembered about Karai as she is now:
A) She's blinded to some specific truths, both by hatred and Shredder's lies.
B) She apparently does not have the amount of grudging respect Shredder did for certain servants/allies and enemies. Considering this, it is possible that the Mystics are our mystery bunch and, despite Karai's possession of the Heart of Tengu, have somehow even decided to challenge the Turtles on their own merits.

And like I was saying before, I would be more at ease if those writers adhered a little more to the original comic regarding Yoshi and Shen.

[R-iZZy]

I haven't touched on this episode yet. Easily, one of the best episodes of the season. It's about time we heard a little something about Hamato Yoshi. And to see Splinter when he was a little, eenie, teenie rat. I like how they used Tang Shen as more than just a prize in a competition of love between two friends. Tang Shen can be seen as more than just that, now. If it weren't for her, Splinter would be dead. So it's cool that Tang Shen has a little more importance in this show than she did in the comics.

Also, as much as I hated the idea of Shredder being an utrom, the idea was still nicely pulled. No Oroku Nagi in this origin, as we can see. But it's some guy with a Moe (from Three Stooges) cut. This origin, I can tell, was thought of deeply. Seeing as they couldn't use the comic origin, this one was pulled off, nicely.

And thanks to whoever for spoiling the clones of Shredder. I forgot all about those clones. Strange how they're being brought back into the picture. But what does The Ancient One have to do with these clones? I hope a lot of these questions are answered before the season is over.

[Anarky]

Yes, of course, Anarky. You're exactly right. How ever could I not have seen that?

(Anyway, I do agree that a different take on things should not be stated as fact. But it's tempting to do so when you've thought over it so much. As for me, I try hard to simply present what I see. And I really hope you haven't come to this conclusion through extensive analysis. :p)

Thought over it so much, huh? All you did was making some wild assupmtions, looking them up on Google, doing some shady translation-business and then you come in here, post that crap and of course you'll find people who agree with you. I mean, who the hell wants to interpret farting as "not caring about society" blablah? This constant overanalyzing sickens me. It makes me sick to see more or less sane people wasting time, effort and thought on a bloody TV show for kids, making something deeply philosophical out of it.

Following the fandom like a cult... I can live with that, but when I have to come in here every sunday reading the utter crap and overanalyzing you people produce every week, I seriously wonder if there's a place for me in the fandom. I mean, I never thought about her stupid kimono, yet you nerds say the episode was bad because she was most likely a prostitute (and my brother wants you all to know that he's not amused by you completely ignoring some actual fact) and because she only wore one piece whereas a real kimono has two blablah! It still doesn't change that it's a stupid kids' show. Seriously.

And not only that, no, you also take the liberty of spoiling future episodes for everone because of some stupid frame-analysis. Thank you very much.

[onyx]

I never really felt like it was pity at all. A guy that's destroyed whole worlds, taking pity on one little orphaned girl? I suppose it could have been, but I always kinda saw her as a placeholder. Somebody had to manage the Foot while he was gone, so he'd still have a Foot when he got back (that sounded odd..). I think she'd make sure someone took over for her when she was gone, and so on, until Ch'rell (okay, I finally happened to look at the official site's FAQ, and saw the correct spelling of his name *slaps own hand*) returned. But I guess that is debatable, and he may indeed have had pity on her. Anyway... I don't know about those entities. It would be interesting if they turned out to be Utroms, but it's impossible to tell at this point (unfortunately :p).

If your theory is right, then one question remains - he sees a little girl and he immediately decides that she has ninja talent and she will be worthy one day to rule the whole world while he's gone?

[Cure]

Thought over it so much, huh? All you did was making some wild assupmtions, looking them up on Google, doing some shady translation-business and then you come in here, post that crap and of course you'll find people who agree with you. I mean, who the hell wants to interpret farting as "not caring about society" blablah? This constant overanalyzing sickens me. It makes me sick to see more or less sane people wasting time, effort and thought on a bloody TV show for kids, making something deeply philosophical out of it.

Following the fandom like a cult... I can live with that, but when I have to come in here every sunday reading the utter crap and overanalyzing you people produce every week, I seriously wonder if there's a place for me in the fandom. I mean, I never thought about her stupid kimono, yet you nerds say the episode was bad because she was most likely a prostitute (and my brother wants you all to know that he's not amused by you completely ignoring some actual fact) and because she only wore one piece whereas a real kimono has two blablah! It still doesn't change that it's a stupid kids' show. Seriously.

And not only that, no, you also take the liberty of spoiling future episodes for everone because of some stupid frame-analysis. Thank you very much.

Well said, man. I agree completely.

[iris]

Thought over it so much, huh? All you did was making some wild assupmtions, looking them up on Google, doing some shady translation-business and then you come in here, post that crap and of course you'll find people who agree with you. I mean, who the hell wants to interpret farting as "not caring about society" blablah? This constant overanalyzing sickens me. It makes me sick to see more or less sane people wasting time, effort and thought on a bloody TV show for kids, making something deeply philosophical out of it.

Following the fandom like a cult... I can live with that, but when I have to come in here every sunday reading the utter crap and overanalyzing you people produce every week, I seriously wonder if there's a place for me in the fandom. I mean, I never thought about her stupid kimono, yet you nerds say the episode was bad because she was most likely a prostitute (and my brother wants you all to know that he's not amused by you completely ignoring some actual fact) and because she only wore one piece whereas a real kimono has two blablah! It still doesn't change that it's a stupid kids' show. Seriously.

And not only that, no, you also take the liberty of spoiling future episodes for everone because of some stupid frame-analysis. Thank you very much.
*blink* Ok... so... what would you like to talk about, exactly?

I could come here and make a series of sarcastic jokes about this show like I do with other shows I won't name... :roll: ...but I don't feel like it. *shrug*

I am grateful to everyone who posts their thoughts, insight, and tangential research notes. Changing the stupid kids' show is not the point. Exploration is the point. They invented philosophy because it's fun. Seriously.

Plus... The very act of talking about a kids' show like it's serious drama is, in a way, satirical. We all know we're not talking about Shakespeare here.

:sweatdro:

The idea that Tang Shen was a prostitute would be an intriguing story twist. Just because it didn't get replies doesn't mean the idea was ignored, it just means it didn't get replies. Apologies to your brother for his feeling snubbed.

And the whole "Shredder's clones" thing? As far as I'm concerned, that's just speculation. They showed us shadows in the show; that's foreshadowing (literally!), not spoilerizing. ...Unlike the Gamera Don spoiler that people have constantly talked about, and that I wouldn't have known about otherwise. Not that I'm complaining; it's just one of those things.

[Masked Ninja]

Frankly, I'm not concerned too much with the kimono stuff either... I'm more of a personality overanalyzer. :P But seriously, we don't treat our opinions like gospel... and, as iris said, it's fun to speculate. Some may view it as "crap" (as there are some interpretations I also don't agree with) but instead of getting annoyed, I choose to treat it as an interesting idea and move on with my life.

What would there be to discuss in the episode thread without these? "It was good; I liked it. Yoshi kicked trash. Nice to see Splinter's origin. Tang Shen had a nice role and character design. " Which is all fine and good, but you can only discuss what's [i]obvious for so long. *sigh* That AP English class must have messed with my head, but I do like to look for stuff that is only implied.

Those who don't like it don't need to stay for the "crap" we happily trade back and forth. Being snarky doesn't really help the discussion and just makes people mad. I think it's possible to be a solid member of the fandom and not care about digging too deeply, but I also think the people who do enjoy it deserve respect.

*sigh* There's my two cents, and I'm out for now.

[Anarky]

*blink* Ok... so... what would you like to talk about, exactly?

The story maybe? Like "this and that didn't add up" and "I particularly liked it when XY did ABC..." and not "Her name means "Gentle fart in the west wind when the monkey claps three times" and her kimono is not a real kimono because the flowers have three petals instead of four."

And the whole "Shredder's clones" thing? As far as I'm concerned, that's just speculation. They showed us shadows in the show; that's foreshadowing (literally!), not spoilerizing. ...Unlike the Gamera Don spoiler that people have constantly talked about, and that I wouldn't have known about otherwise. Not that I'm complaining; it's just one of those things.
Yeah... right... speculation (http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showpost.php?p=397994&postcount=54)

But seriously, we don't treat our opinions like gospel...

Read this thread and observe how people reacted when someone mentionned "Kill Bill"... "It's f***ing Game of f***ing death, you stupid idiot." How can you know? Maybe the artists have never seen GOD and thought they'd do something Kill Bill-ish. But, no, of course you know better. Everyone who doesn't agree is obviously wrong and stupid. And this is sad.

Some may view it as "crap" (as there are some interpretations I also don't agree with) but instead of getting annoyed, I choose to treat it as an interesting idea and move on with my life.

Yeah, but the "interesting ideas" are taking over. I haven't said anything in a long time, since this has been bugging me for ages now. And have you ever thought about other people having different definitions of "fun"? My fun is kicking back, drinking a beer or some orange soda and watching a new episode and I honestly don't want to see people analyzing every frame and thus destroying my kicking-back-mood. After reading threads full of overanalyzed bullsh*t I usually feel as if someone danced a good polka on my brain. And it totally ruins the episode for me.

[iris]

Dude, I think we have different definitions of speculation. I don't have any reason to believe those are Shredder's clones just because of an outline... who knows what they really are? They could be the ghosts of the past, present, and future in the Saki Christmas Special for all I know. So to me all the "clone" stuff is speculation.

Anyway...

There's plenty of crap on this forum (and in this thread) that I go ahead and ignore. It's crap to me, but not to someone else, so I just skim for the parts that interest me. The parts I pay the most attention to are the character/storyline bits... yes, even in this thread.

Discussion of certain things can make my brain hurt too. If the extra stuff bothers you so much that you can't enjoy TMNT, that's pretty sucky and I'm sorry. Maybe people should use "sickening amount of overanalyzed detail" tags the way we use "spoiler" tags. Or... something? The obvious solution is having separate threads. :ohwell:

ETA: I now feel a perplexing desire to sing the Galaxy Song (http://www.gecdsb.on.ca/d&g/astro/music/Galaxy_Song.html).

[VaughnMichael]

And the whole "Shredder's clones" thing? As far as I'm concerned, that's just speculation. They showed us shadows in the show; that's foreshadowing (literally!), not spoilerizing. ...Unlike the Gamera Don spoiler that people have constantly talked about, and that I wouldn't have known about otherwise. Not that I'm complaining; it's just one of those things.
it's not actully a spoiler because the toy of it has been shown since like last year by mirage....and is on the back of the box for the new toys like Agent Bishop.
-Putrescent

[iris]

You have a point, Putrescent, but in my experience, most fandoms consider information to be spoiler material until the actual show has been released. Sometimes even after. :p Having been roasted for spoiler transgressions in the past, I've had that made very clear to me.

[Jester]

Not sure if this "explination" for the seeming continuity gap with Splinter telling Yoshi's story and this episode has been brought up, but I will again anyway if it has: Splinter's explination of Yoshi's murder was incomplete. Where he thought that Yoshi was an innocent man, cold heartedly murdered by Shredder, only accused of aiding the Utroms. The reality is slightly diffrent, where Ch'rel knew that Yoshi was a Guardian and killed him when he remained tight lipped about it. I'm not saying there aren't other continuity holes, but this one can be explained away.

[Fledermaus]

Okay, first of all, I didn't like this episode. It was utter bollocks, if you ask me and it seems as if the writers just ran out of stuff to tell, so they go "Oh, let's tell the kids some stories of the past while we buttrape everything we've said before." But hey, we have to watch what we get.

So, Yoshi's outfit was obviously stolen from the Bride from Kill Bill. Everybody who thinks differently is obviously wrong because Yoshi was a transvestite who could see the future. It was obvious. And if you want to see it too, just stand on your head, while the lights are dimmed and fart three times. Then you'll see it clearly. It's so easy to see. Also, he displayed his seeing abilities more than once, most notably in the scene where they first meet Mortu.

Also, Fledermaus, your concerns for Tang Shen's looks and her clothings are nonsense. We all know she's from the Negativerse, where everything's different. I mean, just eat two cans of fried beans, watch the episode backwards and turn the volume up to level 7, then you'll hear her say "I'm from the Negativerse" about twelve minutes into the episode. So it's only obvious that the Negativersians have it all differently. She has to look caucasian, otherwise she wouldn't be asian. And she needs to have her not-kimono folded that way, because otherwise she wouldn't be wearing a living person's kimono. The ancient one realized that, so why can't we do the same? Also, the pixel located at 7/4 (basic mathematical coordinate system) in the actual image of the cartoon (black bars not included) is in negative colour whenever Tang Shen is in the picture. It is so obvious.

To conclude, I want to say that I'm right and if you don't agree, you're obviously wrong. The evidence is there and it's obvious. I have spoken.


Well, aren't we entitled to our own opinions, Anarky? You seem to relish in taking simple posts and blowing them out of proportion to make yourself seem smarter than everyone else. It gives you false power, to compensate for whatever you lack in reality. But I'm glad you're at least being frank with your intentions. I'm sorry if you took my analysis so personally, (or maybe you need to grow a thicker skin, because we can't have everything in this world revolve around our tastes) but as I've said before, some of us in fact do this kind of thing for a living (or at least a future). Accuracy, analyzing and seeing how an effect was brought about in a movie, a show, a sequence, matters. It makes the difference between a great show, and mediocrity.

Really, please ignore the overanalyzers if we bother you so much, and acknowledge only those who are not insane. Just like I ignore the pro-wrestling thread; I respect the fact there are a significant number of people who enjoy the subject, and I have better things to do with my time than tell others how their life/tastes/habits/views suck. If your discussion topics are “better” than someone else’s, then others will be interested enough to respond.

Ich weiss, was Sie versuchen.:blanksta: Hoeren Sie bitte auf.


*deep, deep breaths...*

Anyways, I don't think those Shredder figures seen at the end were clones. From the voices to the eye colors, to the design more than anything -- they don't at all resemble the clones from Return to New York. And if the toys to which you refer are different Shredder clones... it still doesn't make sense to me. I mean, why clones over some "mystic/psychic division", considering that the Ancient One was there, and... it seems more logical for the Ancient One, with his Oni companions, to be more mystic than science-oriented.

[Masked Ninja]

^ I may never need to talk again. :trazz:

Yeah, I don't know where this whole "Shredder clones" thing is coming from. Then again, I don't generally pay much attention to the toyline (outside of walking a bit slower when I pass the TMNT aisle in Walmart :D). They're obviously not the clones we saw earlier... those had all these wonky builds and none looked remotely female, as I recall. I think it would be cool if the Shredder-like suits meant something else... Sure, Saki/Ch'rell conquered Earth physically, but what if he fought he way up into some uber-cool mystical rank as well?

[Spitfire]

So, Yoshi's outfit was obviously stolen from the Bride from Kill Bill.
Umm no it was a tribute to Bruce Lee, as was the Bride's costume in Kill Bill
http://www.blackbeltmag.com/images/Bruce%20Lee%20Lead%20photo1.jpghttp://www.unbsj.ca/arts/english/jones/mt/images/killbill2.gif

Edit: Okay you know that then, read then post *slaps self*
http://www.cats.alpha.pl/funny/goldie1.jpg

[Anarky]

Well, aren't we entitled to our own opinions, Anarky? You seem to relish in taking simple posts and blowing them out of proportion to make yourself seem smarter than everyone else. It gives you false power, to compensate for whatever you lack in reality. But I'm glad you're at least being frank with your intentions. I'm sorry if you took my analysis so personally, (or maybe you need to grow a thicker skin, because we can't have everything in this world revolve around our tastes) but as I've said before, some of us in fact do this kind of thing for a living (or at least a future). Accuracy, analyzing and seeing how an effect was brought about in a movie, a show, a sequence, matters. It makes the difference between a great show, and mediocrity.

Really, please ignore the overanalyzers if we bother you so much, and acknowledge only those who are not insane. Just like I ignore the pro-wrestling thread; I respect the fact there are a significant number of people who enjoy the subject, and I have better things to do with my time than tell others how their life/tastes/habits/views suck. If your discussion topics are “better” than someone else’s, then others will be interested enough to respond.

Ich weiss, was Sie versuchen.:blanksta: Hor auf, bitte.

It's like you've known me for 50 years. You changed my life by giving me a good laugh.

And if you don't speak German, don't try to seem to be able to speak it. It makes you look dumber than you are.

It's pretty hard to look past the overanalyzing mainly because it's everywhere. Donnie says "I like Pizza." and some people come up with "This phrase clearly indicates that he was raped as a kid." It's like they've seen a completely different episode and took some drugs to go with it. And I want to talk about the TMNT not about some farting or childhood rapings. I don't want to know that it was not a kimono but a rag she wore and that Splinter is a drug addict from hell with three asses. For me, it's enough to know that the ancient one farts, that it's a kimono and that it's Splinter. And the stupid overanalyzing spoils the fun of the episode. It has happened that I went "Why us?" during an episode, just because I knew that some people are going "Oh, that's an indication of a love for body lotion." after they've seen it.

[Jo Dawn]

To be honest? I was bored. I didn't like it.

Of course, his tory and I don't much get along, heh... And I never really cared much about Yoshi anyway... Ah well...

I wasn't impressed.