New Anti-Gaming movie from religious extremists

[ThirdMarioBro]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIu3JMGxk3Q&mode=related&search=

Joe Lieberman, Jack Thompson, Religious Leaders, Pastors, and soccer moms. The whole gang is here to play aren't they.

"OMG, terrorists used a plane simulator to learn how to blow us up! We must now degenerate society and voluntarily live in the dark ages! It is our only way to protect our virtues! It's what God intended!"

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!


It's always the same old bullsh*t speech, each and every time. The pricks have no quarrel with letting their children see the military blow people's heads off on national news each and every night, but they have every issue seeing polygons go "pop" on the TV. If stores would just enforce the damned ratings system, this would all go away.

"When I started teaching at MIT 15 years ago, students wanted to be film makers. Now they want to be game designers".


People like that are hell bent to preserve the "old system", just like all the religious extremists of the past want to "protect the old ways of life" so they can suppress people and knowledge so they can then proclaim the need for leadership to "their" personal goals. They want people to live the life they led, and nothing else. It's always the same old cycle. Disturbed people do stupid stuff. It doesn't matter if they play games, watch movies, or read the Bible. Why? All of them are violent. Everything is violent. If someone is messed up, they're messed up. If they played video games, it just becomes a convenient scapegoat.

This will stir up some sh*t, then blow over and go away again. Good tactic on their part, I must admit.

[LogicDonny]

oh no.. not them again.. Do they ever give up? Haven't we heard enough from Jack Thompson.. U seen him hwo insane he can be..

[gobo]

Why don't they stick to print? Don't they know motion-pictures are THE DEVIL?!? It would be way cheaper too. I can't wait for the videogame against movies they'll be releasing after this movie against videogames. As god-fearing parents, we shouldn't have to pay a lick of attention to our kids. That's society's job! :x But, the real culprit here in our children growing up violent is fiction in general. I would teach those brats of mine the difference between reality and make-believe if I knew. But, I shouldn't have to! That's society's job! :x We need to ban plays, movies, weapons, music, toys that feature graven images, fictional literature, all forms of pornography and even those sex medications. If a couple is having trouble conceiving, then it must be god's will. Actually, I take that back about weapons. The military needs them to protect us from foreign heretics and pagans. But, they should be banned from the public! The internet has to go too! It's a cesspool of smut and filth and pornography. While we're at it, let's ban medical science. These 'doctors' are playing god, damn it! When we get rid of all of these things, our world will beperfect... because we won't have anything else to blame **** on. However, I simply won't stand by while my world is pushed to the brink of apocalypse! I'd rather sit. You can destroy the world after I die. While I could do something constructive to help, I shouldn't have to. That's society's job! :x

Sincerely god's,
European Football Maternal Parent



Sweet Hera Almighty! Now that I got that out of my system... maybe I can get some sleep! :embarass:

[Mecha Cow]

"When I started teaching at MIT 15 years ago, students wanted to be film makers. Now they want to be game designers".
Is this seriously supposed to be an argument?

[Spitfire]

"OMFG I can't read the ratings system so I allow my 9 year old to play a game where he kills police."

What idiot green lighted this piece of crap? I hate these ass backwards documentaries that basically lie. God's had his fair share of video games to. And what would you know! One of them is a first person shoot that teaches us it's okay to run around shooting goats with rocks. Also teaches us it's okay to commit copyright infringement.

[Peanut]

Here's the thing, this documentary was supposed to be about arguments on both sides of the coin. The director or whatever you want to call him even brought it up to gaming press in hopes of getting publicity, then he goes all pulls this "Video games are the devil!" bullsh*t? That's not gonna fly.

[Brian]

I am SO TIRED of people blaming video games for all of society's problems! :x

[iris]

Oh man, propaganda makes me nauseous. Lately, it's all been about why taking away the rights of the people is good for them... using scapegoats.

And I can't talk people out of being afraid of... everything! They get mad at me if I suggest that handing over power to the government doesn't actually make them safer and happier.

[Jester]

I must admit, I'm a victim of video games. One day I was walking home from school, wearing my denim overalls and my red shirt and cap. As I walked I saw a turtle. I stomped him to death and then threw it's shell at a Goomba. I later ate a mushroom...now I'm numb on my right side from the poison. Are you happy Nintendo of America! ARE YOU!!!

[Ra]

...okay...so, who wants to make a documentery on religious propaganda and what it does to illiminate all common sense in the world of entertainment as we know it?

I know it is reasonable to be afraid of death and war. I know it is reasonable to be conserned for the future of the next generation. But to just go and say "video games are the reason the world is so violent today", or "video games turned my son into a drug addict" is just a bit...well, extreame. Why the hell does the world have to live with people like this is a wonder to me...

[Jester]

It's like a video I watched in Cults class last semester in school. It claimed that TMNT and He-man were "Doorways to Satan" (The name of the video.) Upon that, the whole class groaned. The student aide (the professor was out for a doctor's appointment) stopped the tape and asked the class if our reaction could be our way of saying that they, as our professor had said "saw a demon under every bush." We all were in agreement. He admitted to enjoying Masters of the Universe. Many of the younger kids said they liked TMNT.

In an interview earlier in the series, the cults expert said the reason TMNT and He-man were "doorways" and things of his generation (such as Buck Rodgers and Flash Gorden) weren't is because back in the day the science fiction was just that...fiction. Now more and more sci-fi is becoming sci-fact and kids can't tell the difference. That also elicited a groan from the class. I think that's just the problem. Adults assume that kids can't separate the fictitious world of video games from real life, and in some cases that's true. But most of the time, it's just adults thinking kids are dumber than they are, and that's a shame.

[Anarky]

Hah, I learnt one good quote from that trailer. "Whoever tells the stories, defines the culture." I can completely agree with that, but it's not just videogames.

Sure, videogames make people more agressive, that is out of the question. It has been scientifically proven. However, it makes you more agressive in the sense of being louder and shakier and not in the homicidal sense. And this agression goes back after a while. I learnt this from a Dr. Tilo Hartmann who is actually pro-videogaming.

And I still say, videogames aren't to blame if there's a school shooting or GTA. I say videogames are just an expression of feelings. And if you feel the urge to manically shoot terrorists or counter-terrorist units in Counter Strike all day long for weeks on end, then I say there's something wrong. But not the "take the game away" kind of wrong. Maybe the player has trouble at school/work, maybe he/she gets rejected by his/her peers, maybe he/she's getting mobbed, blackmailed or whatever. That's what's wrong. Not Counter Strike per se, but the player playing it.

I mean, I've been playing various incarnations of Unreal Tournament since 1999 and I was taught how to use a gun at a very young age as a sort of sports-thing (looking back, I wouldn't do it again, but hey, I was just a kid.) I never, even when I was feeling really bad, felt the urge to go out and get me a gun to shoot people with or steal a car and rape a hooker or whatnot. Games were just that, games.

I believe it's part of a parent's responsibility to watch out for a child, this includes talking to your kid. And it doesn't begin when the kid's feeling bad. It starts way earlier. I think my mom did a really good job there. She never muttered phrases like "I'll be there for you if you need to talk". She just was there. How she knew when to be where or whether I knew where to find her, I don't know.

For short: Videogames aren't the cause, but they can be an indicator. Just look what your kid's doing, talk to him/her and keep an open relationship with your offspring. Forbidding anything won't help a bit.

EDIT: And am I the only one who feels that religion here is once more just a scapegoat to avoid the "Why"-question? "Oh, well, you know, it was God's will." And while I don't know any of the people in the trailer, I never even heard one reference to a religion in it. So I wonder if not the gamers themselves are projecting their own atheist views on the opposition, creating a similar effect as the ones avoiding the why-question. Perhaps to ignore the question as to why those people are against video games.

[Brodie]

Well, aren't Joe Lieberman and Jack Thompson right?

[Krang's Uncle]

Gamers,take a deep breath and calm down. A month from now, you'll still have your precious video games. This will blow over. No need to be as overzealous in your defense, you guys act just like "Joe Lieberman, Jack Thompson, Religious Leaders, Pastors, and soccer moms" that you so disdain when you get up in arms. Only difference being you guys/gals are on the other side of the issue.

[iris]

I don't think I'm overreacting at all. This is fearmongering propaganda aimed at further entrenching the power of certain unelected parties who already have way too much power.

Well, aren't Joe Lieberman and Jack Thompson right?

Well, in the sense that either video games had to stop being so violent, or they had to come with label warnings so that parents could be informed? Sure. In the sense that video games are Evil Thoughts shot from satanists directly into innocent nine-year-old brains causing them to turn their schools into a bloodspattered terrorist warzone littered with the bodies of NYPD cops? Er... no.

I've never liked the violent beat-em-up shoot-em-up video games. They bore me. I've spent much more time baking cookies than I have playing those video games. At the same time, I've had moments where I seriously just wanted to punch someone in the face for no reason at all, except that it would make me feel better. By the logic of this documentary, all that cookie-baking clearly made me an evil, aggressive person. They don't consider other, much more influential, factors.

[Krang's Uncle]

I don't think I'm overreacting at all. This is fearmongering propaganda aimed at further entrenching the power of certain unelected parties who already have way too much power.

Of course not. Do you think Lieberman and the league of evil soccer moms feel they are overreacting? Regardless of what the ulterior motive may be for certain people, you cant deny that a decent amount of people (the aforementioned league) feel there is a problem, much like others and you feel there isnt a problem. They arent the only ones alone in fearmongering. Go back to this comment from ThirdMarioBros in the first post of this thread:

"OMG, terrorists used a plane simulator to learn how to blow us up! We must now degenerate society and voluntarily live in the dark ages! It is our only way to protect our virtues! It's what God intended!"

Nice job of fearmongering from your own group. Its always nice to see the pot calling the kettle black.

You must of forgotten to take your deep breath.

[iris]

I hardly think TMB's sarcasm is on the level of a propagandizing documentary. One is rolling your eyes, and the other is perpetrating a slow and deliberate manipulation. Last I checked, rolling your eyes didn't make people afraid. More the opposite.

I'm breathing fine, but thank you for your concern.

[Anarky]

I generally feel that there's an overreacting on both sides, mainly to prevent the own faction to perhaps see that the others may have a point. I personally don't think either side is completely right, but I say both have points.

As I said in my first post, the walling and yelling and stereotyping on both sides may occur just to prevent yourself from looking at the other side and seeing that they're not eniterly wrong.

[iris]

There are more than two sides to every issue, including this one. Things are generally always more complicated than they look. I'm not about to get into all of it on this forum.

To answer your earlier question, Anarky, there is a reference to religion in the trailer. A man says, "violence has always been with us; it's been with us since Cain slew Abel," which is a biblical reference. And I don't think gamers are necessarily atheists. Also, the title "Moral Kombat" implies a religious point of view.

[Katie]

Propaganda. Plain and simple. I am not a gamer (I LOVE to watch someone play, but all I do is die...alot) but the very thought of anyone forcing their morals on someone else burns me up :flaming:

Once you are old enough to make decisions....you are responsible for those decisions. If you have children, you have the responsibility to teach them the difference between fantasy and reality...right and wrong, etc. There is no call for finger pointing to take the blame off the parents.

If little Joey goes out and beats the snot out of his classmate, then that is a reflection on the parenting skills, not the video game industry, the media, poor food choices, or any other lame excuse parents will find to make themselves feel better about themselves and their skills as a parent. If parents want to blame somebody for their children's behavior, they better start by standing infront of a mirror.

[gobo]

Kid with icing on her face: I didn't eat the last cupcake. Billy did!

Parent of a convicted murderer: I didn't teach my son to be violent! ...despite the spankings. It was all videogames! ...even though we never could afford them.

Immaturity just kind of blossoms in certain individuals. :ohwell: Instead of growing out of it, they just get more convincing with their manipulation.

[Peanut]

Sure, videogames make people more agressive, that is out of the question. It has been scientifically proven. However, it makes you more agressive in the sense of being louder and shakier and not in the homicidal sense.

See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t. I'd like to see this so-called proof. I've played video games my entire life and I'm quiet and completely stable. Most of these tests are pulled off by companies attempting to sway results in the favor of video games being a cause of violence. The latest one, which was made to look like male college students wanted to smoke up and have unprotected sex right after playing GTA, was proved to be a complete farce. As they completely and utterly skip over so many factors, gloss over important data, and mis-worded everything the published. They forgot to mention the fact that these dorm boys didn't say they would go do the afore mentioned activities, but that they didn't care if people did them. This very case study was used by Jack Thompson to further his ridiculous stand against games.

Anyways, people who don't play games, don't understand games. The reason we all "over-react"? because these are uneducated people trying to put ridiculous censorship on our hobby.

Ever heard of a game called Baulder's Gate: Dark Alliance II? A game about decking out your character in various levels of bad-ass armor and going through dungeons hacking and killing everything? They censored the f*ck out of it before it came to retail. You know why? Because groups were protesting some of the games content. And why? Because the company who owns the rights to Baulder's Gate and the D&D franchise, Wizards of the Coast, also made some kids card games. Not because they actually saw what was in the game, which didn't even come close to the majority of what you see on TV, but because they didn't f*cking know anything and assumed the worst. This ended up not only ruining parts of one of my favourite franchises, it actually ended the entire thing, ruined sales and ultimately brought about the destruction of the amazing Black Isle Studios, and put huge publisher/developer, Interplay, in the hole.

My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period.

[Spitfire]

When I was little I used to get mad at games I'd throw a controller*I only did that maybe twice* or I'd play another game where I could beat the crap out of people but I never attacked someone for beating me.

Like Peanut said video taped proof would be the best.

[Anarky]

See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t. I'd like to see this so-called proof. I've played video games my entire life and I'm quiet and completely stable. Most of these tests are pulled off by companies attempting to sway results in the favor of video games being a cause of violence. The latest one, which was made to look like male college students wanted to smoke up and have unprotected sex right after playing GTA, was proved to be a complete farce. As they completely and utterly skip over so many factors, gloss over important data, and mis-worded everything the published. They forgot to mention the fact that these dorm boys didn't say they would go do the afore mentioned activities, but that they didn't care if people did them. This very case study was used by Jack Thompson to further his ridiculous stand against games.

You seem to misunderstand the chemical aggressive with "I'm killing you all in a killing spree"-aggressive. Of course, Jack Thompson makes the same mistake, so you're just buying it, basically. However, you're maybe more shaky and more nervous until about five minutes after putting away the controller. Also, he says in the Audiofile that all those processes having to do with aggression are there because of human evolution, so it's not the games but the human being. And he says that nothing happens without an intention. That's all. And you're quite probably used to it. And of course, Dr. Tilo Hartmann, 31 years old whom I interviewed during a round of Quake Arena (and lost) wouldn't know anything about games, would he?

Here's what he has to say (in German) (http://www.mediaculture-online.de/Autoren_A-Z.253+M56cc3f6b2ed.0.html)

I'll translate:

Abstract:
Dr. Tilo Hartmann tells the audience in this presentation about the research to "violent games" like Doom, Counterstrike, The Godfather or similar. In so-called Ego-Shooters, the player has to immobilize the enemy with virtual weapons such as machine guns. Hartman's presentation dealt with the emotional and cognitive responses to playing these games, which were researched in laboratories. His verdict: There is an effect on human behaviour that can be proved, although it's not spectacular.

You can listen to the whole thing on the site, but it's German. He notes many times that players see a difference between game and reality. He compares the enemies in the games to "Things, like figures on a chessboard". He must be the anti-gamer in person.


Anyways, people who don't play games, don't understand games. The reason we all "over-react"? because these are uneducated people trying to put ridiculous censorship on our hobby.

I play games, thank you. I just don't post in here, because I'm not really interested in the industry and the tech and whatnot. I just enjoy me a good game every now and then and that's it.

Ever heard of a game called Baulder's Gate: Dark Alliance II? A game about decking out your character in various levels of bad-ass armor and going through dungeons hacking and killing everything? They censored the f*ck out of it before it came to retail. You know why? Because groups were protesting some of the games content. And why? Because the company who owns the rights to Baulder's Gate and the D&D franchise, Wizards of the Coast, also made some kids card games. Not because they actually saw what was in the game, which didn't even come close to the majority of what you see on TV, but because they didn't f*cking know anything and assumed the worst. This ended up not only ruining parts of one of my favourite franchises, it actually ended the entire thing, ruined sales and ultimately brought about the destruction of the amazing Black Isle Studios, and put huge publisher/developer, Interplay, in the hole.

I don't think company politics have any relevance to this discussion. If there is one, please explain it to me.

My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period.

Again, I play games. Have done it for years. Started off with the SNES and now I'm a PC-Gamer.

[Jo Dawn]

Not really blaming or anything, but maybe the overreacting is just feeding their worries.

I don't care if anyone bashes my hobbies. It's just silly. But it is true what Anarky said... Whether or not it is in a bad way has yet to be seen. It has changed people in good ways and bad. They've been doing research on this for many years, with people who DO know things about games and such. I actually did my college papers on the effects of television and video game violence in people.

Of course, it depends on the mentality of the subject right off the bat, also. So it's really hard to say. However, no one ever needs to overreact on something like a game. It'll feed their fire.

[iris]

I would like to know, what is the "appropriate" reaction level to a documentary made with the apparent sole purpose of defaming an entire industry? One that involves a Senator, no less?

Honestly, football causes much more violence in the world. It's verifiable. Just ask the sports bar crowd. People actually die because of it, sometimes in the stands at the game. So why do we let little kids watch and play football?

[jeff the cheff]

See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t. I'd like to see this so-called proof. I've played video games my entire life and I'm quiet and completely stable. Most of these tests are pulled off by companies attempting to sway results in the favor of video games being a cause of violence. The latest one, which was made to look like male college students wanted to smoke up and have unprotected sex right after playing GTA, was proved to be a complete farce. As they completely and utterly skip over so many factors, gloss over important data, and mis-worded everything the published. They forgot to mention the fact that these dorm boys didn't say they would go do the afore mentioned activities, but that they didn't care if people did them. This very case study was used by Jack Thompson to further his ridiculous stand against games.

Anyways, people who don't play games, don't understand games. The reason we all "over-react"? because these are uneducated people trying to put ridiculous censorship on our hobby.

Ever heard of a game called Baulder's Gate: Dark Alliance II? A game about decking out your character in various levels of bad-ass armor and going through dungeons hacking and killing everything? They censored the f*ck out of it before it came to retail. You know why? Because groups were protesting some of the games content. And why? Because the company who owns the rights to Baulder's Gate and the D&D franchise, Wizards of the Coast, also made some kids card games. Not because they actually saw what was in the game, which didn't even come close to the majority of what you see on TV, but because they didn't f*cking know anything and assumed the worst. This ended up not only ruining parts of one of my favourite franchises, it actually ended the entire thing, ruined sales and ultimately brought about the destruction of the amazing Black Isle Studios, and put huge publisher/developer, Interplay, in the hole.

My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period.



Well it's hard to "proove" anything, but there are some really good experiments that do show that video games lead to agression. The thing is, this is short-term agression, not a long term behavior change that would lead to violence. So yes it does lead to agression, but they aren't saying it leads to violence.

[Brodie]

Iris, maybe you didn't notice...my comment was dripping with sarcasm. You might be able to tell by the fact that I have a 360 tag in my signature, with not so non-violent games. If I believed Jack Thompson, I'd be playing The Bible Game, for PS2, not Gears of War.

[iris]

Haha... yeah, actually I figured it was sarcasm, cuz it was you... I just responded anyway. Cuz I'm like that. *shrug* :)

[Brodie]

Just making sure. Anyway.

Jack Thompson is just angry he sucked at Mario Bros way back when.

[gobo]

Jealous, is he? :P

[Peanut]

Anarky, I wasn't basing my whole post around you. I knew you'd make that mistake, as usual. It was just the first part.

And yeah, my example had a lot more to do with pointing out how uneducated, ignorant, morons jump to conclusions over sh*t they don't understand. Not company politics.

I'm also not going to argue with you about about this Tito guy. I'll just say he's one researcher and he just because he thinks one thing doesn't mean it's 100% indisputable fact. I think it's plainly obvious people think aggressively when playing a violent game, and it seems to me that's all he's saying. F*cking rocket science. Like I said, though, I'm not going to argue with you about it, I saw how childish you acted in that soul colour thread and I know there's no making you change your mind once it's been made.

I really have no argument against violent video games having effects on people, because violent things effect people, pretty obvious to anyone with half a brain. What pisses me off about the whole thing is the lack of knowledge the people making these ridiculous "games are the devil" claims have. That's all.

[Krang's Uncle]

See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t. I'd like to see this so-called proof. I've played video games my entire life and I'm quiet and completely stable. Most of these tests are pulled off by companies attempting to sway results in the favor of video games being a cause of violence. The latest one, which was made to look like male college students wanted to smoke up and have unprotected sex right after playing GTA, was proved to be a complete farce. As they completely and utterly skip over so many factors, gloss over important data, and mis-worded everything the published. They forgot to mention the fact that these dorm boys didn't say they would go do the afore mentioned activities, but that they didn't care if people did them. This very case study was used by Jack Thompson to further his ridiculous stand against games.

Anyways, people who don't play games, don't understand games. The reason we all "over-react"? because these are uneducated people trying to put ridiculous censorship on our hobby.

Ever heard of a game called Baulder's Gate: Dark Alliance II? A game about decking out your character in various levels of bad-ass armor and going through dungeons hacking and killing everything? They censored the f*ck out of it before it came to retail. You know why? Because groups were protesting some of the games content. And why? Because the company who owns the rights to Baulder's Gate and the D&D franchise, Wizards of the Coast, also made some kids card games. Not because they actually saw what was in the game, which didn't even come close to the majority of what you see on TV, but because they didn't f*cking know anything and assumed the worst. This ended up not only ruining parts of one of my favourite franchises, it actually ended the entire thing, ruined sales and ultimately brought about the destruction of the amazing Black Isle Studios, and put huge publisher/developer, Interplay, in the hole.

My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period.

This is a nice, educated response. Hope you didnt foam on your keyboard.

Do you know the video games opponents stance on games? Or did you just read that your games were in trouble and start digging the trench for a defensive stand. Ive yet to read anything about these guys wanting to take games back to the age of pong. Let me guess, you did some research and found out what their credentials are and came to the conclusion that they are uneducated. Did they not play enough Halo hours to meet your requirements? But, your in luck. The game industry has weathered these storms before, and they will again in the future. Calm down, youll still be able to play whatever games appeal to you in the future, regardless of whether its like Nintendogs or Grand Theft Auto. No need to get your panties in a bunch over this issue. Period.

[Anarky]

Okay, everyone, I think it's time to calm down and not jump on each other's throats. Yes, I am looking at everyone. Of course, you might have been calm while writing your posts, but they didn't come across that way. Jack Thompson could argue "See this section. They're all on the edge of killing each other. Videogames are evil!" and he'd stand on pretty firm ground.

Anyways, calling videogames the devil is plain idiotic. I think there are better ways to kill time, but each to his own. But both sides' claims are flawed, be it even only a little. Videogames do make you more agressive, but it's far from a point where you let your surroundings feel it. They're not made by Satan and/or his little wizards.

However I can agree with the people in the trailer to the extent that I think schoolshootings and spree killings are bad and effort should be made to prevent them. But videogames are not the disease, they're a symptom at best. I generally think both sides in this argument should simmer down a bit and actually sit on one table. If Jack Thompson weren't a raging lunatic and gamers weren't mostly a bunch of raging, cellar-dwelling loners, then I bet Jack Thompson would be up for a round of Mario Kart. The gamers could teach him, since I doubt he knows how it works. And when that happens, both sides could actually talk about stuff without starting to rage around and stereotype and make idiotic claims (yes, both sides do that).

[Peanut]

This is a nice, educated response. Hope you didnt foam on your keyboard.

Do you know the video games opponents stance on games? Or did you just read that your games were in trouble and start digging the trench for a defensive stand. Ive yet to read anything about these guys wanting to take games back to the age of pong. Let me guess, you did some research and found out what their credentials are and came to the conclusion that they are uneducated. Did they not play enough Halo hours to meet your requirements? But, your in luck. The game industry has weathered these storms before, and they will again in the future. Calm down, youll still be able to play whatever games appeal to you in the future, regardless of whether its like Nintendogs or Grand Theft Auto. No need to get your panties in a bunch over this issue. Period.

See...just...uncalled for. Completely. Where do I come off as a raving lunatic? There is a reason for our community to be angry about this. We're not overreacting. And it has nothing to do with how much time you spend playing games, it has to do with actually knowing what you're talking about. Take Jack Thompson and his stance over Bully, a game he tried to get canceled. He was calling it a Columbine simulator. He had never even seen a screen from the game. I mean uneducated in that sense, not whatever the hell you're talking about.

And really, where do you get off telling me what I should and shouldn't get upset about?

[Anarky]

Being upset and being rude and ranting around are two different things. If both sides, yes, Jack Thompson, I'm talking to you, would even show the slightest will to discuss this in an orderly fashion without constantly insulting and/or suing someone or something, this discussion would be much nicer. I'm not telling you to not get upset, but people are more likely to listen when they don't have the feeling they're talking to a pitbull on steroids.

[Krang's Uncle]

See...just...uncalled for. Completely. Where do I come off as a raving lunatic? There is a reason for our community to be angry about this. We're not overreacting. And it has nothing to do with how much time you spend playing games, it has to do with actually knowing what you're talking about. Take Jack Thompson and his stance over Bully, a game he tried to get canceled. He was calling it a Columbine simulator. He had never even seen a screen from the game. I mean uneducated in that sense, not whatever the hell you're talking about.

And really, where do you get off telling me what I should and shouldn't get upset about?

You come off as a raving lunatic here: "See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t" and here, "My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period." Your community is full of whiners that get so bent out of shape. How many times have video games been portrayed to be the source of society's ills before? And despite that, they are still here and dont appear to be going away, regardless of what some religious talking mouth says. Yet, here you go getting so upset because its happening again. Sometimes i forget that mental midgets dont make connections, so i'll lay it out for you. Politicians/religious figures have certain "wells" they continually draw from. These "wells" are how they keep their base of power in support of them. A "well" could be an issue such as immigrations, taxes, or even video games. Its hard not to be rude when youve got people ranting and raving like the lunatics they so detest.

Where do you get off telling Jack Thompson what he should and shouldnt get upset about? You and him probably have more in common than you think and would make good friends. You could play a game to see who comes up with the fastest knee jerk response to various topics.

[Mecha Cow]

Your community is full of whiners that get so bent out of shape
You might want to get off this board now.

Also, do you even know who Jack Thompson is?

[Anarky]

Jack Thompson is Bizarro-Peanut. :D

But, Uncle, please don't do that. Don't insult people like that, because you know what's going to happen.

But what I must say, I see certain similarities between the gamers' way of argumenting and those you refer to as "religious extremists". Both groups consist of raging lunatics with anger issues. I mean, good ol' Jack is his own antithesis in this way. "Videogames make people agressive... I'M GOING TO SUE YOU, PUNK!!! WWWAAAAGH!!!" It's also funny to see the gamers react. "Man this Jack Thompson's such a lunatic... THEY'RE ALL IDIOTS AND THEY SHOULD BE REMOVED FROM THIS EARTH!!! WAAAAARGGH!!!"

[Mecha Cow]

I don't think anyone dislikes Thompson for hating video games. It's him publicly insulting and making blind assumptions about an entire community that has most people ticked off.

This isn't rocket science here.

[iris]

You come off as a raving lunatic here: "See...this is just idiotic bullsh*t" and here, "My point is this, if you don't know anything about games, you have no right to an opinion on this matter, because you have no f*cking clue what you're talking about. Period." Your community is full of whiners that get so bent out of shape. How many times have video games been portrayed to be the source of society's ills before? And despite that, they are still here and dont appear to be going away, regardless of what some religious talking mouth says. Yet, here you go getting so upset because its happening again. Sometimes i forget that mental midgets dont make connections, so i'll lay it out for you. Politicians/religious figures have certain "wells" they continually draw from. These "wells" are how they keep their base of power in support of them. A "well" could be an issue such as immigrations, taxes, or even video games. Its hard not to be rude when youve got people ranting and raving like the lunatics they so detest.

Where do you get off telling Jack Thompson what he should and shouldnt get upset about? You and him probably have more in common than you think and would make good friends. You could play a game to see who comes up with the fastest knee jerk response to various topics.

This attitude of 'the gamers doth protest too much' is unsupportable, given the magnitude of the provocation, which places the burden of the American violence problem at the feet of the VG industry.

You can't see assertions like that and just roll over and go to sleep, because Thompson isn't trolling for a livid response from gamers; he's trying to convince people that he has The Answer-- that he's right. He's not responding to "ranting lunatics." You can't just say, hey we've always had videogames and we always will, so we may as well stop answering this garbage propaganda. With all due respect, that would be an incredibly naive approach. If you don't want to protect your rights, someone is always willing to take them off your hands.

[gobo]

Try limiting your 'smart' word use to three per sentence please. You confuse me otherwise. :(

But, you're right. If people stop making counter-arguments (insane or rational), government won't hesitate to ban videogames. They'll assume that no riots will break out over the issue.

[ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIu3JMGxk3Q&mode=related&search=

Joe Lieberman, Jack Thompson, Religious Leaders, Pastors, and soccer moms. The whole gang is here to play aren't they.

"OMG, terrorists used a plane simulator to learn how to blow us up! We must now degenerate society and voluntarily live in the dark ages! It is our only way to protect our virtues! It's what God intended!"

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!

PROTECT THE CHILDREN!


It's always the same old bullsh*t speech, each and every time. The pricks have no quarrel with letting their children see the military blow people's heads off on national news each and every night, but they have every issue seeing polygons go "pop" on the TV. If stores would just enforce the damned ratings system, this would all go away.

"When I started teaching at MIT 15 years ago, students wanted to be film makers. Now they want to be game designers".


People like that are hell bent to preserve the "old system", just like all the religious extremists of the past want to "protect the old ways of life" so they can suppress people and knowledge so they can then proclaim the need for leadership to "their" personal goals. They want people to live the life they led, and nothing else. It's always the same old cycle. Disturbed people do stupid stuff. It doesn't matter if they play games, watch movies, or read the Bible. Why? All of them are violent. Everything is violent. If someone is messed up, they're messed up. If they played video games, it just becomes a convenient scapegoat.

This will stir up some sh*t, then blow over and go away again. Good tactic on their part, I must admit.


I see know I'm actually going to live up to my rants and murder Jack Thompson.

Honestly, I thought this guy had just given up since two of his anti-gaming laws were overturned. This guy is ignorrant and uninformed, just like the rest of these losers. Thats why the man avoids debating with video game experts. Although he idd get skooled by Adam Sessler on the episdoe of AOTS.

[iris]

Try limiting your 'smart' word use to three per sentence please. You confuse me otherwise. :(

I did try. All that studying for the GRE done messed up my personal patois... I mean vernacular... I mean... I... arghhh. :p

[Draconic]

People aren't making it easy for me to pick a side. :(

One side hates me because I'm going to be a videogame designer, the other one hates me because I'm a Christian.

From this viewpoint, doesn't look like there's much room for me on either side. :cry:

[iris]

One side hates me because I'm going to be a videogame designer, the other one hates me because I'm a Christian.

From this viewpoint, doesn't look like there's much room for me on either side. :cry:
There's no reason to feel so conflicted. Try this on:

1. Recognize that video games do not cause violence; people understand the difference between reality and fantasy.
2. Recognize that you do not have to design violent video games. There are plenty that are not gorefests.
3. Recognize that religious views should never be enforced through law. The idea of separating church from state is one of the best ideas in government.
4. Recognize that the responsibility of teaching morality to children belongs to their parents and guardians. People do not have to buy violent video games for nine-year-olds.

[gobo]

Soooooooooo level-headed... That's HOT! :drool:

[Draconic]

There's no reason to feel so conflicted. Try this on...

Thanks, but I already accept all of that. I was mostly pointing out that I have people damning me on the right for playing/making videogames, (and no, they will be violent,) but I also have people on left who criticize me for being Christian, regardless of whether or not my views are in line with the likes of Jack Thompson. I think sometimes it's easy to blur the line of calling Christians fanatics, and refering solely to the fanatic Christians, if that makes any sense.

(I suppose you could draw parallels to saying, "Dumb White People" as opposed to saying "The White Dumb people")

[iris]

Well, I dunno. I am Christian. I am not a fanatic. Most people can tell the difference. Some people can't. There's not too much one can do about what goes on in other peoples' heads.

You know, people often think that there is either This Side or That Side to an issue. It's not true. It's just that the extreme ends are the loudest. Most people are firmly in the middle somewhere. So, in reality, you are in the majority group.

[Jester]

I've had this discussion before too. I'm a Christian, but I'm not a Fred Phelps/Jack Thompson Christian. I'm not an extremist, but a lot of people will make that assumption just because you classify yourself as a Christian.

[gobo]

And, that's the problem right there: people wanting everything to be black or white. Why can't the answer be a mixtuure? And, why black or white? Why not red or blue? Sometimes the answer doesn't fit the mold, but people don't want to listen.

[Peanut]

I don't think anyone dislikes Thompson for hating video games. It's him publicly insulting and making blind assumptions about an entire community that has most people ticked off.

This isn't rocket science here.

People just make assumptions, dude. Like Krang's Uncle said, we're all whiners. :roll: I'm sure Jack would agree.

They don't seem to understand that we don't care that these people hate or detest games. We care that they are actively trying to ruin and or put enforcements on them, while at the same time spreading the stereo-type that we're all gun-totting time bombs. It's like that one PA comic, where Tycho screams "I play violent games" to get to the front of a long line. Jack Thompson can go on ranting and raving about how bad games are forever for all I care, but when he's trying to step in and get involved in things he just doesn't understand, i.e. the whole Bully incident, that's where I, as a gamer, take offense.

His ridiculous statements on Attack of the Show, as ThemanthatwouldbeRaphael pointed out, showed just how little he knows. I won't agree that he got owned by Sessler, because that guy doesn't know jack sh*t either, and pretty much came off as an angry FF fanboy, but he did make Thompson slip up on a couple occasions and show his ignorance.

[Mecha Cow]

Speaking of PA, it's cute how Thompson and pals conveniently ignore stuff like Child's Play.

[Krang's Uncle]

Jack Thompson is Bizarro-Peanut. :D

But, Uncle, please don't do that. Don't insult people like that, because you know what's going to happen.

But what I must say, I see certain similarities between the gamers' way of argumenting and those you refer to as "religious extremists". Both groups consist of raging lunatics with anger issues. I mean, good ol' Jack is his own antithesis in this way. "Videogames make people agressive... I'M GOING TO SUE YOU, PUNK!!! WWWAAAAGH!!!" It's also funny to see the gamers react. "Man this Jack Thompson's such a lunatic... THEY'RE ALL IDIOTS AND THEY SHOULD BE REMOVED FROM THIS EARTH!!! WAAAAARGGH!!!"

Finally, someone gets it. Im not trying to bash you guys for being gamers, but i cant stand how some of you (and you know who you are) ACT like the people that do hate videogames. Hypocrites is what you are. But thats your problem. If youre offended, i really dont care. Let them prove how ignorant they are, that will damage their cause more than some idiot on a message board posting "JACK ThmopSon Wants TO TAKE awy my gaMezZZZ!!!" ever will. There are organizations that will stand up for your rights, dont act like Jack has all this power to make laws as he sees fit.

And Peanut, you are a whiner. Ive accepted it, have you?

[Peanut]

Yep. Voicing my opinion is whining. Your e-peen must be nice and big now.

I mean, you assume because I type with a couple curses that I'm a lunatic, raving around about how much of an idiot Jack Thompson is. That's just the way I type things out. I'm not screaming and yelling and getting red in the face. You assume that you know everything, which is very common on the internet.

[Krang's Uncle]

Theres a better way to voice displeasure. I dont care if thats "the way i type things out." Use some brain cells and figure out a better way to voice your stance, lil Jack.

[iris]

Krang's Uncle, you seem to have a greater understanding of hypocrisy than I. Please help me with something: What do you call a person who incessantly grouches about someone else's grouching?

No, Thompson doesn't have the power to make law. Except he does. Do you know how much legislation is written by lobbyists? Apparently not. He's not going to take out the gaming industry in one fell swoop, but he'll wear away at it if people let him.

And hello, *waves at Krang's Uncle*, I work with one of those wonderful rights-defending organizations. And I'm telling you that people need to help themselves also.

[Peanut]

Theres a better way to voice displeasure. I dont care if thats "the way i type things out." Use some brain cells and figure out a better way to voice your stance, lil Jack.

I'm a single person on a message board about a kids TV show. What I say on here will make little difference. I was merely discussing the subject with some of my fellow gamers, is that wrong? It is kind of sad to see how much my few comments irked you, though.

[Mecha Cow]

Finally, someone gets it. Im not trying to bash you guys for being gamers, but i cant stand how some of you (and you know who you are) ACT like the people that do hate videogames. Hypocrites is what you are. But thats your problem. If youre offended, i really dont care. Let them prove how ignorant they are, that will damage their cause more than some idiot on a message board posting "JACK ThmopSon Wants TO TAKE awy my gaMezZZZ!!!" ever will. There are organizations that will stand up for your rights, dont act like Jack has all this power to make laws as he sees fit.
Have you read a single post in this thread? Who here is 'whining' about people 'wanting to take away their video games'? Quotes please. I also don't see how Peanut is a hypocrite for being 'upset'. Funny how you call others ignorant. How about you stop hiding behind the fact 'naughty' words were used and actually bring up some arguments? Oh wait, you can't, because you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Please don't post again. Ever.

[Jo Dawn]

Stoooooop fiiiiiiiiiighting....

There. That was whining. ;) :P


Seriously, though. Discuss, don't start name-calling and making it personal. It's not. Thank you.

[Krang's Uncle]

Have you read a single post in this thread? Who here is 'whining' about people 'wanting to take away their video games'? Quotes please. I also don't see how Peanut is a hypocrite for being 'upset'. Funny how you call others ignorant. How about you stop hiding behind the fact 'naughty' words were used and actually bring up some arguments? Oh wait, you can't, because you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Please don't post again. Ever.

Apparently you dont understand whats being written. Ive already brought up an example this being blown out of proportion. Peanut is a hypocrite because he rails against how some people think of the gaming industry, yet he has no problem sounding like an idiot, much like they do, when hes on his rants. Thats been what ive been against from my first post on. I havent said anything about games needing to be toned down, i just want an attitude that is more constructive to not painting you and fellow gamers as losers on par with Thompson. And i posted again. What are you going to do about it?

Iris, if you work for a rights organization should know that someones rights wont just get stolen in the night and that people arent powerless. What do you do to counter slander? You get the persons stance, and you break it down with facts. You wont win over people undecided on an issue by saying they need to shut the **** up because you dont agree with them.

Peanut, your right. You, and I, are simple people on a message board. That doesnt mean your words cant influence someone. Whos to say there isnt someone one here that could set up a facts site regarding games? All it takes is some motivation and the right attitude. You already have an ally in the gaming industry. He can be countered, but you wont get an opportunity to do that raving like a lunatic against him. Really, what does that do? It only further entrenches people in their own ground, and makes any sort of compromise slip away. Just look how Mecha Cow, Iris, you, and I have hijacked this thread. This is no longer about the issue, but about how we dislike the other. Its up to you guys if you want to keep this nonsense up.

[Peanut]

But I'm not raving like a lunatic. That's the part you don't seem to understand.

And now you're saying you dislike all of us, for our opinions on this matter? Someone needs to grow the hell up.

[Anarky]

Ladies, Gentlemen, calm down. All of you.

Uncle, you did not really get my meaning. I generally agree with the gamers that Jack is overreacting and fighting something that isn't worth fighting. Just because I play Unreal Tournament on a more or less regular basis, I don't feel the sudden urge to grab me a Shock Rifle and blow people up using a cleverly executed Shock Combo. But I do feel a little shaky for about five minutes afterwards and prefer to do little to nothing in the half hour following my playing. But that's because I'm tired and not ready to kill. I'm ready to kill when I'm shopping on Saturday afternoons and when my bus is filled with old people that make us late for more than 15 minutes on a way that usually takes five.

But what I'm saying is that the gamers who argue that gaming doesn't make you run amok as soon as someone calls you stupid or there's someone saying the words "Headshot" in a crowded area shouldn't get all heated and call people names, especially not the ones who are in desperate need of ground to stand on (the anti-gaming-faction for example). They can take every single word of what you say and prove, without a doubt, that you're ticking timebombs. So, the calmer you stay, the less of a case the AG-Faction has. Child's Play and stuff are nice things, but they're, as you noticed, overlooked. So what you need to do is just stay calm, brush off everything they throw at you and be smarter than them. Because one day, you could go "If we're the ticking timebombs, why's Jack always the one yelling?" and then you could follow up with proof. Lots of it. But right now they could practically prove you're all spree killers waiting for a gun by just browsing through this section.

And I doubt videos like the one with the kid levelling up in WOW are of any help. Because that is just one idiot.

But I'm not raving like a lunatic. That's the part you don't seem to understand.
But you sound like one. And because we can't see you and Jack can't see you calmly sitting in front of the screen, drinking a glass of apple juice, we have to assume that you're foaming and smearing the word "kill" in your own feces on the wall of your room that has been made into a weapons chamber.

[gobo]

And because we can't see you and Jack can't see you calmly sitting in front of the screen, drinking a glass of apple juice, we have to assume that you're foaming and smearing the word "kill" in your own feces on the wall of your room that has been made into a weapons chamber.

*blowing soda out the nose* THAT'S AWESOME!! :lol: :D :lol:

[Peanut]

Because I cursed twice? My dad is from the East Coast of Canada. He curses every other word, but not because he's angry or a "lunatic". That sh*t tends to rub off. Where the f*ck are you people from where one or two curse words equals "raving lunatic, totting a gun, smearing the blood of children on the walls"?

[gobo]

No one said anything about the blood of children, so that doesn't cast any doubt on the possibility of you being a lunatic. Now, I shall quit watching this thread.

[Anarky]

It's not just the curses, don't be silly. It's the whole tone I imagine you using when saying out loud what you've typed. Also, swearing distracts immensely from the content of your writing. As soon as you start using curses, your writing's gone off the deep end and become a rant. And even if you don't cuss, you still can suggest a tone of voice. Just look at your writing again, from a point of view where you're assuming you didn't write it and find out how it seems to others. Because right now, while you might not be one (there, I said it again), you sound like a guy who's really two seconds short of eating your neighbour's newborn child while running around naked in your yard firing shots of an M16 into the air.

[Peanut]

I understand how I come off when I type. That's why I've told everyone, especially you, numerous times to not take my posts offensively. I can understand this Krang's Uncle yokel thinking I'm a maniac, but not you, Anarky! Say it ain't so.

[Anarky]

I know, it hurts my heart too. And while I'm at it, I have an affair with your wife and dog. And Fernando's now with Esmeralda although she claimed she loved you last week.

No, seriously. If people don't know you. And I know you're probably sitting there, drinking some soda while petting your cat, others might not agree. And the one's lobbying against you gamers will certainly take every piece of "evidence" they can get, since they don't really have ground to stand on (as you all know).

[iris]

Apparently you dont understand whats being written. Ive already brought up an example this being blown out of proportion. Peanut is a hypocrite because he rails against how some people think of the gaming industry, yet he has no problem sounding like an idiot, much like they do, when hes on his rants. Thats been what ive been against from my first post on. I havent said anything about games needing to be toned down, i just want an attitude that is more constructive to not painting you and fellow gamers as losers on par with Thompson. And i posted again. What are you going to do about it?

Iris, if you work for a rights organization should know that someones rights wont just get stolen in the night and that people arent powerless. What do you do to counter slander? You get the persons stance, and you break it down with facts. You wont win over people undecided on an issue by saying they need to shut the **** up because you dont agree with them.

Peanut, your right. You, and I, are simple people on a message board. That doesnt mean your words cant influence someone. Whos to say there isnt someone one here that could set up a facts site regarding games? All it takes is some motivation and the right attitude. You already have an ally in the gaming industry. He can be countered, but you wont get an opportunity to do that raving like a lunatic against him. Really, what does that do? It only further entrenches people in their own ground, and makes any sort of compromise slip away. Just look how Mecha Cow, Iris, you, and I have hijacked this thread. This is no longer about the issue, but about how we dislike the other. Its up to you guys if you want to keep this nonsense up.
Eh... I don't know about you, but I've been trying to stay on topic up until now.

But what are you saying? You admonish people for being antagonistic because it just makes the other side more stubborn, yet your approach is to be antagonistic yourself. You claim you want to promote a constructive attitude, and yet you make rude, judgemental statements about its participants. Please tell me how that makes sense. Was it some ingeniously orchestrated plan to demonstrate your point? :goof:

Expressing anger toward someone may lose you points with them, but it is not hypocrisy, no matter how much you want to throw that word around. Word to the wise: if you want to be taken seriously, anger beats hypocrisy hands down.

FWIW, Peanut, I don't really know you but I didn't think you sounded like a 'raving lunatic.' I'm pretty thick-skinned, though, so, grain of salt and all that. :P

[Krang]

Apparently you dont understand whats being written. Ive already brought up an example this being blown out of proportion. Peanut is a hypocrite because he rails against how some people think of the gaming industry, yet he has no problem sounding like an idiot, much like they do, when hes on his rants. Thats been what ive been against from my first post on. I havent said anything about games needing to be toned down, i just want an attitude that is more constructive to not painting you and fellow gamers as losers on par with Thompson. And i posted again. What are you going to do about it?
Despite all of your accusations, it seems that the one who is the most angry and vicious here is you. How can you expect people to have a "constructive" attitude when you have such a condescending one yourself? Any point you were trying to prove was lost long ago when you started acting like a forum troll. If you can't post in this thread without provoking people, please don't post in it at all.

[Mecha Cow]

Peanut is a hypocrite because he rails against how some people think of the gaming industry
BZZZT.

This is where your argument falls apart. Like I've said -and like you've ignored- before, people dislike Thompson because he's making ungrounded insults and uninformed assumptions and for generally acting like a Nazi - Not for being angry in general. As such, there is no hypocrisy in being angry at him. Do you even know the meaning of the word?

If you did, you would realise the only hypocrite here is you, as Krang just pointed out. You bitch and moan about people sounding like 'idiots' and 'lunatics', but sweetheart, you're the only one who has a problem here. You're the only one attacking other members.

You are a troll, and you clearly have nothing of any value to contribute to this discussion. Just go away.

[Krang's Uncle]

Despite all of your accusations, it seems that the one who is the most angry and vicious here is you. How can you expect people to have a "constructive" attitude when you have such a condescending one yourself? Any point you were trying to prove was lost long ago when you started acting like a forum troll. If you can't post in this thread without provoking people, please don't post in it at all.

Angry? The only thing im "angry" about is how people on this board act just like the lunatic they so despise. How do you guys think Jack Thompson gets his ammunition to attack games/gamers? By blowing their behavior and why he thinks it happens (by playing games) out of proportion. By cursing and screaming at him that he doesnt know anything, that only reinforces his opinion. Im not trying to provoke people, i would much rather they try to set something up to counter his claims. And i see no one touched upon that part of my last post. I guess its just easier to try and bash someone rather than to work towards making something that will help your cause. Its too bad that a differing opinion is equated to being a troll. :ohwell:

[愛]

You came in here singling people out, calling them hypocrites, when you have been contradicting yourself left and right. You're a troll and a hypocrite yourself. You can call people lunatics and idiots all you want. It doesn't make you sound any more intelligent.

I didn't want to post in this thread, because I knew it would come to this, and to be honest, I don't really see any point in continuing this thread. It will be locked soon unless it gets back on topic.

[Ecto Jedi]

They don't seem to understand that we don't care that these people hate or detest games. We care that they are actively trying to ruin and or put enforcements on them, while at the same time spreading the stereo-type that we're all gun-totting time bombs. It's like that one PA comic, where Tycho screams "I play violent games" to get to the front of a long line. Jack Thompson can go on ranting and raving about how bad games are forever for all I care, but when he's trying to step in and get involved in things he just doesn't understand, i.e. the whole Bully incident, that's where I, as a gamer, take offense.

Exactly. Just like the MPAA witch hunts of the '80s, these current tirades against violence in video games are enfuriating because they come from people who, for the most part, were never to be the intended audience for such entertainment. Who the **** gives them the right to assume that they should take it upon themselves to police and govern us? It's all a matter of opinion, but dammit, when people take their bullsh*t views and use their authority to impose their beliefs on others (especially when they happen to find themselves in the wings of government), that's when I have a problem with it. :ohwell:

[iris]

How do you guys think Jack Thompson gets his ammunition to attack games/gamers? By blowing their behavior and why he thinks it happens (by playing games) out of proportion. By cursing and screaming at him that he doesnt know anything, that only reinforces his opinion. Im not trying to provoke people, i would much rather they try to set something up to counter his claims.
Thompson doesn't need to get ammo to attack gamers. He just points the violence in the games, and then points the violence in society and links them together.

It's just like when a cross-sectional study comes out saying that people who eat lots of hot dogs also have a higher incidence of cancer, and then the news editor comes up with the headline: "Hotdogs Cause Cancer." Sounds rational, right? Even though the study didn't say that at all. It's a logical fallacy (applying a causal relationship to a correlative relationship). But people believe it because you don't need proof to convince people of something! You just have to state it in such a way that it looks like you're right.

People play violent video games in America.
People use violent actions in America.
:: Violent video games cause violent actions.

What I would like to see is evidence that Thompson looks at general gamer behavior. As far as I can see, there's no indication that he would give a widget about that, because mainly uses speficific cases. I've just been looking at his record; he has made a career at setting up straw men for the public to burn.

[Ra]

What I would like to see is evidence that Thompson looks at general gamer behavior. As far as I can see, there's no indication that he would give a widget about that, because mainly uses speficific cases. I've just been looking at his record; he has made a career at setting up straw men for the public to burn.
Same here, Iris. Thompson doesn't really seem to look at the general video gaming audience, save for the ones that have all of the qualities he needs for a good example for a "violent gamer". I have no idea if that is the truth or not, but that is just my opinion :ohwell:

It makes me wonder what he has against video games. Maybe he couldn't get one as a kid, so then he thought "If I can't get one, NOBODY gets one!" or something? *shrugs* Again, just my opinion...

[Krang]

Angry? The only thing im "angry" about is how people on this board act just like the lunatic they so despise.
Regardless of your reasoning, you're still admitting to acting angry toward other members, which was my point exactly.

Im not trying to provoke people, i would much rather they try to set something up to counter his claims.
From your very first one to the one I'm replying to, every single post of yours in this thread has been condescending and rude to the members who post here. If you think you're not provoking people, you're going to need to try a little harder.

Its too bad that a differing opinion is equated to being a troll. :ohwell:
Anarky provided a differing opinion in this thread without trolling. Go look at his posts as proof that it's possible. See the difference, or are you too blinded by anger to notice?

[Anarky]

Same here, Iris. Thompson doesn't really seem to look at the general video gaming audience, save for the ones that have all of the qualities he needs for a good example for a "violent gamer".

He does look at the videogamers. See the Penny Arcade and the VGCats incidents. Or if he doesn't look at it himself, he has someone looking at it for him. Otherwise there was little way he could have heard of those things. And yes, he needs gamers to be violent in order to have a case. Of course we know that they aren't a particularly violent bunch, so he can use every little bit of gamer violence he gets. Which basically means, every opinionated post every gamer yelling online, every little attack on him or his side is just further "proof" of his "just fight".

That's why you shouldn't get arguments on a personal or emotional level, especially when you're the ones defending.

[iris]

He does look at the videogamers. See the Penny Arcade and the VGCats incidents. Or if he doesn't look at it himself, he has someone looking at it for him. Otherwise there was little way he could have heard of those things. And yes, he needs gamers to be violent in order to have a case. Of course we know that they aren't a particularly violent bunch, so he can use every little bit of gamer violence he gets. Which basically means, every opinionated post every gamer yelling online, every little attack on him or his side is just further "proof" of his "just fight".

That's why you shouldn't get arguments on a personal or emotional level, especially when you're the ones defending.
I totally disagree with you on this one, Anarky. I think people should speak their minds, and I don't think it was too excessive in this thread. Thompson does it backward-- he looks at violent cases for any evidence that the perpetrator liked rap music, movies or shows that contain violence, or video games that contain violence. Being that many, many young people play "violent" video games, it's an easy thing.

[Anarky]

I'm not against people speaking their minds, but it's not about the "what" it's about the "how". I can say "I don't like this game because the graphics are sub-par" or I can say "F*** this piece of s*** game, it f***ing blows and looks f***ing horrible". Same thing, different way of saying it. I just think it's not the best idea to appear to be two seconds short of running amok while trying to prove that your side is not running amok.

[Draconic]

This all has to do with that time Jack Thompson played Super Mario Bros. On world 1-1 he walked right into a Goomba, and in a fit of rage he sued a 6-year-old to death.

True story.

[Jo Dawn]

Thanks. I almost spit out my drink. ;) :P