1989: The Great TMNT Year(and will 2003 be the next 1989?)

[beaker]

It all keeps coming back to one thing for me when I think abou tmy love of the TMNT...that magical glorious endless concerto known as 1989. It's the year I discovered em, around the time they were on the cover of Nintendo Power. I had heard of em before, but this is when I really got into em. I got really into the cartoon, started checking out the reprinted black and white/tpb issues, getting the toys, and really digging that arcade game(IMHO one of the greatest TMNT things ever) I even remember Nintendo Power had a contest wher eyou could win a chance to be an extra in the movie. How epic that would have been to be a 11 year old in Shredder's arcade/dojo HQ hangout.

Then 1990 rolled around, and while at once bringing TMNT to out of hand mainstream Beatles/Power Rangers/Elvis/N*Sync proportions, really was the beginning of the end(for the spotlight at least) It just got watered down beyond belief. It's this reason I consider the first TMNT part of 1989, since it was filmed int he Fall of 1989...and also is the only one of the films to be of a darker edgier nature. Which was odd considering the cartoona nd Archie comic tone.

So...is 2003 the next 1989?(the last great TMNT year) Between the new cartoon, upcoming Dreamwave comic, and video games coming out...who knows? One thing, it would be a lock had that cgi film gone according to plan. *sigh* But for now, all we can do is hope.

[Wingnut]

Hope and pray man

[Karpo_007]

The best year for TMNT must have been 85-86. Let's hope that 2003 will restore the glory.

[beaker]

The best year for TMNT must have been 85-86. Let's hope that 2003 will restore the glory.

You were around as a TMNT fan back then? Dang! I think 1989 was such an exicting year for TMNT fans as it was the apex of cool and mainstream, but not super watered down mainstrem like the next year would be. I mean in the mid 80's there was just the comic, and I think an RPG game. By 1989 as I listed there were so many things to rejoice.

[Karpo_007]

No I wasn't, But You were taling about a good year, those were the best.

[Kameko]

So...is 2003 the next 1989?

:D Does this mean I get to be six years old again? :P

[Shellfox]

I have a feeling this year may leave a stain that can never be romoved from the TMNT leagacy.

But at least I may get a new Casey Jones out of the revivle

But really if it were CN doing the show I'd have more faith (yes I know I sound like a broken record) the comics may go on forever, or in few months they may not be worth lining the cage of a bird, TMNTs glory time is gone. Kids today won't really appeacate them, least not how they seemed to be desrcibed so far, chances are only the older fans will keep them alive, which I'm fine with, maybe I'm wrong, but it seems kids only care about monsters and massive distruction, the TMNT of today don't seem to give either

honestly I see this revivael in the mass media as a flash in the pan

[Karpo_007]

If by glory you mean a pokemon effect of the old show, you are probably right, that won't happen again. But this time we will get a well written action series instead of a badly writen comedy.

26 episodes have been confirmed, we should be happy we are getting even that much.

[Mondo_Gecko]

The old TMNT Cartoon was awesome. There is nothing wrong about it. Stop your bashing of it.

[Eye of Sarnath]

The new cartoon is going to rock. No question about it. So stop questioning it. Even Peter Laid thinks it's great. So it's gonna be great. Stop being so negative. Enjoy the TMNT revival. In less than a month, all you naysayers shall be DISPROVED!

[Nickokapo]

Yeah, i absolutely love the artwork, and the plots aren't half bad, tho knowing the mirage comics it might get weird here and there but nothing too extreme *coff*redsky*coff*
It's gonna rock! :evilgrin: I'm happy we're even getting 26 eps, but a second season would be good too..

[Karpo_007]

The old TMNT Cartoon was awesome. There is nothing wrong about it. Stop your bashing of it.

Nothing wrong? Well if you are saying that it is a a well written series, then you really don't know what it means. They practicly used same plot over and over again. Well the lack of continuity is part of the same problem.

Second, It lacked action. The TMNT not to mention the bad guys were practicly Klowns. Just joking around, The show hardly had any good fights.

And Im am sure that with in the Last months I have watched much more of the TMNT cartoon than you have. It is kid's cartoon, and kids doesn't really care how the writing was. Neither did I at young age.

So Im am not bashing the cartoon with out reason. Everything I said is true. It is diffrent thing if you still think it's the best thing in the universe, and say there is nothing wrong with it.

[Nickokapo]

Clowns go with 'c' buddy, and i know it's a kid's series, so it seems unfair you're looking at some big plot development when it wasnt aimed at people your age, but kids.
'sides, kids digged the plot, or else it wouldn't have lasted 10 seasons, repetitive or not, to me it had enough twists and different characters to keep me interested.
As a kid i know i loved the toon, and now i might not enjoy it as much as back then, but it still holds a place in my heart anyways, it brings back lotsa memories..

[Mondo_Gecko]

Exactly thats what i've been trying to say. I love the show becaause i loved the show back then. and watch it now is like reliving childhood all over again.

[Karpo_007]

There are well wrtitten cartoons too. Like BAtman TAS, and Justice League. And I don't hate the show, I think it still is a good kid's show. But it doesn't change the fact that Im not judging it from Kids point of view anymore.

But the new show has the potential to become something much more. A good action series with real plot. A plot that both kids and older people can enjoy.

[beaker]

It is hard to look back on somthing old like a cartoon and try to look at it with the same perspective you had when you were a kid. Thinking back with great memories is much different than going back and actually rewatching something as an older person. However I got the FHC TMNT vhs vol. 1 and LOVE that first episode to this day. Somehting epic about it. And that TMNT arcade game looks just and sound sjust as awesome to me now.

But yes, this new series, with 26 episode commitments already...looks to be a breath of fresh air and somethign special indeed.

[Karpo_007]

Well of course, the first season is a classic. Great action, good plots, and the best animation show ever had(Made by japanese) after that the show switched from action to slapstick. That's when the downfall happened.

[beaker]

Well of course, the first season is a classic. Great action, good plots, and the best animation show ever had(Made by japanese) after that the show switched from action to slapstick. That's when the downfall happened.

Why cant more people see this? In the first season, they had the best animation(of the series, I think because it was slightly more anime esque due to a Japanese company involved), the show was exiciting, they USED WEAPONS, etc. Then, like TMNT 2,3, TNM, etc season 2 and beyond just went down the toilet. *sigh*

That first episode of TMNT still is one of the coolest TMNT things Ive seen.

[Karpo_007]

That is excatly how it goes. Well the last seasons got some action back, but it was nothing compared to first season.

[Shellfox]

The shows greatest weakness- plot, action, continuing story line

Ok bear with me and I'll try to explain. To old fans these are a plus but to kids (and lets face it they are the audiance regardless of what we want to believe). Most kids today only seem to find shows interesting if they involve pokemon like monsters or massive DBZ like distruction. The TMNT will not give them this. Add this to Plot, something very few netwqork kid shows have (lets face it they are pretty much the same show over and over again in most cartoons today). Action, this is out kind of action, not the energy/mon style fighting action. Finally continuing story line, most of the younger kids I watch from time to time, can't rember what happened in the show the day before, hell if their going to remeber what happened several weeks ago

and as for seeing all 26 eps, don't be so sure, they never finished Action Mans eps, and they had severl left, but Fox just didn't air the rest. And Even if they do Fox has a nasty tendanecy to only show the end of a series once (beast Machines, RiD, Nascar racers)

[Reznorite420]

but nothing too extreme *coff*redsky*coff*
It's gonna rock!1) The red sky eps weren't "extreme"

2) You sayin' they didn't rock? I oughtta hang you :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Nickokapo]

Well, they did rock untill dregg came in :sweatdro:
And by extreme i mean an extreme use of weirdness :P

[Karpo_007]

The shows greatest weakness- plot, action, continuing story line

Ok bear with me and I'll try to explain. To old fans these are a plus but to kids (and lets face it they are the audiance regardless of what we want to believe). Most kids today only seem to find shows interesting if they involve pokemon like monsters or massive DBZ like distruction. The TMNT will not give them this. Add this to Plot, something very few netwqork kid shows have (lets face it they are pretty much the same show over and over again in most cartoons today). Action, this is out kind of action, not the energy/mon style fighting action. Finally continuing story line, most of the younger kids I watch from time to time, can't rember what happened in the show the day before, hell if their going to remeber what happened several weeks ago

and as for seeing all 26 eps, don't be so sure, they never finished Action Mans eps, and they had severl left, but Fox just didn't air the rest. And Even if they do Fox has a nasty tendanecy to only show the end of a series once (beast Machines, RiD, Nascar racers)

IF it were on cartoon network, It would have a better chance of staying. But Fox doesn't own 4kids does it? They could sell the show to another channel if fox will cancell it. And if you compare the new TMNT show to other shows that are on Foxbox, It is clearly the best of them. And they are using a lot of money to advertaise it, So Im hopefull...

[beaker]

Finally continuing story line, most of the younger kids I watch from time to time, can't rember what happened in the show the day before, hell if their going to remeber what happened several weeks ago

and as for seeing all 26 eps, don't be so sure, they never finished Action Mans eps, and they had severl left, but Fox just didn't air the rest. And Even if they do Fox has a nasty tendanecy to only show the end of a series once (beast Machines, RiD, Nascar racers)

It's sad...kids these days have the shortest attention span. All those retarded ADD kiddy anime and MTV. I remember following the entire Transformers story arc on tv in the mid 80's.

[Karpo_007]

Well It seems that the 26 episodes we get will be great. And If fox decides to cancell it, There is always the chance that someone else could buy it...

[Nickokapo]

Transformers was great...i had no idea it was japanese animated (well i knew the movie was.)
Too bad the new stuff isnt up to the level of those ones IMHO (e.g: tf rid and armada are by far not as good as the original tf :oops: )

[Reznorite420]

One other thing that was great in 1989 (but sadly not TMNT related): That's the year Nine Inch Nails officially debuted ;)

[beaker]

One other thing that was great in 1989 (but sadly not TMNT related): That's the year Nine Inch Nails officially debuted ;)

Yep, Pretty Hate Machine...by far my fave NIN album, and one of the best industrial albums period(next to Skinny Puppy's 'Too Dark Park', Front 242's 'Front by Front', and Front Line Assembly's 'Hard Wired' IMHO)

[Reznorite420]

I happen to be listening to PHM right now :D (on "Ringfinger" as I'm making this post...)

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

Hoo, boy. Am I gonna have a field day over this one.

The old TMNT Cartoon was awesome. There is nothing wrong about it. Stop your bashing of it.

Truer words have never been written. Amen to that, brother. At least somebody around here has got it right.

Why cant more people see this? In the first season, they had the best animation(of the series, I think because it was slightly more anime esque due to a Japanese company involved), the show was exiciting, they USED WEAPONS, etc. Then, like TMNT 2,3, TNM, etc season 2 and beyond just went down the toilet. *sigh*

The best animation in the history of the series was not during the first season. In my opinion, it was the worst animation. The animation during the majority of the seventh season, 1993, was the best.

Let me make one thing perfectly clear. I hate Japanese animation. Anything with an anime-style totally turns me off. Those cartoons just annoy the heck out of me because the animation is atrocious. The Turtles were, let's face it, very ugly looking during the first season of the show. The animation was, thank God, highly improved in the second season and all the seasons that followed. I, for one, am glad that the people behind the show did not keep animating the series in anime-style. It is the ugliest animation on the planet. I can't stand it.

The show did not go down the toilet, as you so eloquently put it, after the first season. The show "jumped the shark" when Dregg was brought into the picture. And that's all I need to say about that.

Well if you are saying that it is a a well written series, then you really don't know what it means. They practicly used same plot over and over again. Well the lack of continuity is part of the same problem.

Second, It lacked action. The TMNT not to mention the bad guys were practicly Klowns. Just joking around, The show hardly had any good fights.

There is more to a "well-written series" than just continuity, my friend. Sure, continuity is nice. Sure, it is good and well to have things make sense. But, again, there is more to it than that. The writing that you speak of was some of the wittiest and sharpest for any cartoon in the history of cartoons. The stories were original, even though you claim they were recycled over and over.

You want to know something? I am a hardcore fan of the old cartoon series; they don't come much more devoted than me. And guess what else? I couldn't give two cents on whether or not there was "continuity" in the series. I watched the show - and still watch the show - because it entertains me. The same things that brought a smile to my face 15 years ago still bring me joy today. I'll take the goofiness and good-natured heart of the old cartoon series any day. Stick a fork in all that "ninja action" and "real weapons" and "real fighting." I don't care for it, and I never will.

Why is the measure of the worth of a cartoon nowadays based upon the fights it can produce? By God, if those fights aren't darn-near realistic, and if those weapons aren't whipped out, then this cartoon just ain't cuttin' the mustard. Well, Virginia, some of us don't care for that. Some of us don't need it. Some of us get along just fine without it.

I can go back and watch any episode from the first eight seasons of the series, and it will still bring a smile to my face. It will still make me laugh. I hum along with the background music, and I roll around on the ground in a laughing fit when Krang unloads on Shredder for something stupid he did yet again.

Nothing will ever - and I mean ever - recapture the spirit of the original series. It started out small, was developed and nurtured along, and bloomed bright and pretty for all of us to see.

Obviously, some of us appreciate it more than others. Ninja action, continuity, real fights, and weapons up the ying-yang . . . whatever.

I'm content just sitting back and watching what we were given unfold. I'm content with an invention of Donatello's blowing up in his face. I'm content to watch Michaelangelo present the audience with yet another one of his crazy pizza recipes. I'm content watching Shredder and Krang bicker at each other like an old married couple.

That's where the magic is, people. That's why it lasted for so long.

"Quite remarkable!" - Splinter, from "Donatello Makes Time"

[That Matt Guy]

Let me make one thing perfectly clear. I hate Japanese animation. Anything with an anime-style totally turns me off. Those cartoons just annoy the heck out of me because the animation is atrocious. The Turtles were, let's face it, very ugly looking during the first season of the show. The animation was, thank God, highly improved in the second season and all the seasons that followed. I, for one, am glad that the people behind the show did not keep animating the series in anime-style. It is the ugliest animation on the planet. I can't stand it.

:lol: :lol: :lol: I'm glad to see someone on this board shares my view on anime!

Nothing will ever - and I mean ever - recapture the spirit of the original series.

I totally agree with you 100%, the new series will never have the charm of the original. 8)

[Krang]

Well said, NTCF (except the part about anime :P).

To be honest, I'm getting sick of the constant cartoon bashing going on at these forums. Shredder and I made these forums so that people could discuss and share their opinions about TMNT, not nitpick the only TMNT universe that we are even interested in. Doesn't anyone think that bashing a children's cartoon from the 80s and comparing it to today's cartoons is kind of pointless? I'm not trying to tell anyone not to post their opinions, but you cartoon bashers have made your point, and there's no need to repeat it over and over every time someone mentions something positive about the old cartoon.

[Karpo_007]

Few things: Just explain how to cartoon was well writen? It used same plot over and over again. Either Shredder looking for a powersource, or a mad scientist taking a revenge to the world. There are few well written episodes, but they are exception. If you like it, or if it makes you laugh, doesn't make it a well written series. (I admit that most of late 80's and early 90's series were like that)

And the action, well it seems you don't like the Original concept of the TMNT. The true TMNT are no Goofy pizza eaters, They are trained Ninjas who are alone in the world, and fight because they must. The First season of the cartoon Is considered best by the comic and most of the cartoon fans. It had some themes from the original concept, but sadly it was later replaced by slapstic humor. You hate the first season? Well somebody likes Next mutation. You can't argue about opnions.

Still It seems you can't be critical to the old show. No one who knows what well written means will say that the TMNT cartoon was well written. It means that it should have a good, non repatitive plot, good dialogue between characters, character development, and Yes continuity. The scripts in TMNT had also quite a few errors. Like when the Van wen't down from a bridge in REX-1 one ep. There were few episodes that had pretty good writing, all written by David Wise. But sadly those are rare.

And Finally, despite all of the faults the show had, none of those ment nothing to the kids. They didn't care if the fight scenes were badly animated, the show badly written, They loved it because it is Ninja turtles. There is something in the concept since 84 that has always made people like it. Every time the TMNT has been in TV, it has been popular. Even the NTM.

This is why I belive that Kids today will like the new show. And because of good writing and animation, so Will older people. If you won't like it because in it the TMNT doesn't eat pizza and run around the city yelling Turtle power! Be my guest, It is the Kids that matters.

[Karpo_007]

Well said, NTCF (except the part about anime :P).

To be honest, I'm getting sick of the constant cartoon bashing going on at these forums. Shredder and I made these forums so that people could discuss and share their opinions about TMNT, not nitpick the only TMNT universe that we are even interested in. Doesn't anyone think that bashing a children's cartoon from the 80s and comparing it to today's cartoons is kind of pointless? I'm not trying to tell anyone not to post their opinions, but you cartoon bashers have made your point, and there's no need to repeat it over and over every time someone mentions something positive about the old cartoon.


I haven't said a thing that isn't true... There were well written series at the time TMNT was airing, like Batman TAS. It was Made 1991, and the show has won awards for it's writing.

EDIT: Im done with my "cartoon bashing", But if some one makes arguments about my post, I have the right to reply.

[Kali]

Okay, so TMNT wasn't the Hamlet of cartoons, so what? There was obviously something about it that made it as popular as it was/is. And I'll tell you this, I could do a fair amount of nitpicking about the old comic series, as well as any other universe. And if I do, I'll be the first to admit I've been spoiled by today's cutting edge comics with their bright colors and extreme stories, just as we've been spoiled by today's top cartoons when looking back at TMNT.

There's no one path to success. Whether it be the luck of good timing that ripped TMNT #1 off the comic book shelves all those years ago, or the catering to a hungry, demanding focus group, you can't deny it. Judge the cartoons on their own faults and merits against a blank screen, not another cartoon.

You hate the first season? Well somebody likes Next mutation. You can't argue about opnions.
:P :lol: I don't know, some posters here have seemed to have made a career out of arguing about opinions.

[Nturtle]

Yeah all these arguments are starting to get kind of repetative...... :dead:

I liked the old cartoon, it was for little kids you know not people from 14 to their 30s!! The reason I like it now is partially because it is silly, and also there was some great action in the begining. But please don't bash the old cartoon so much its part of my childhood you know!!

[Karpo_007]

Yeah Kali, you are absolutely right, the comic isn't perfect either. But neither is the cartoon, thats's the whole point of this argument. Well for me it is now over, It pointles to argue about them, or even compare them, as cartoon is for kids and comic for young adults.

Let's hope the new show is something for both.

[Reznorite420]

To be honest, I'm getting sick of the constant cartoon bashing going on at these forums. Shredder and I made these forums so that people could discuss and share their opinions about TMNT, not nitpick the only TMNT universe that we are even interested in. Doesn't anyone think that bashing a children's cartoon from the 80s and comparing it to today's cartoons is kind of pointless? I'm not trying to tell anyone not to post their opinions, but you cartoon bashers have made your point, and there's no need to repeat it over and over every time someone mentions something positive about the old cartoon.The admin has spoken for me....good day, and thank you Krang. :)

[Karpo_007]

I think he was talking to all of us...

[Reznorite420]

I meant, he took the words right out of my mouth...

[Tokka-B]

I agree 100% with NTCF.......if I don't see Michelangelo talk about pizza, or Raph make a funny comment, or Leo bugging them to train, or Don making another cool invention, or Shredder having another argument with Bebop and Rocksteady, or Bebop and Rocksteady act like stupid clowns, or Krang get pissed off at Shredder, or Casey with his hockey gear, or Vernon getting yelled at by his boss or making a fool of himself, or Splinter with his wisdom and wise-cracks, or April with the intercom and turtle van, or the cool bad guys in every episode I would cry...cause that was what the TMNT meant for me...

Oh well, lets see how this new show turns out, unfortunately I don't have much high hopes for it so far... :(

[Karpo_007]

Well personally I can't understand why you just want goofy turtles and Won't give a dark, better written series a chance...

[Mondo_Gecko]

Oh man Tokka you read my mind exactly. God i'm gunna miss that stuff.

[Karpo_007]

I missed the first season while I was watching the 4th...

[themaxonline]

I always miss the third season while watching the 5th, 6th, etc. And by the 8th season, I miss the fourth and fifth seasons! heh heh heh!

[Reznorite420]

The original TMNT cartoon will always be one of my fondest childhood memories. I'll never forget the feel of getting a toy every now and then, watching an episode on TV that missed one year or another, playing the video games either at a friend's house or having my friends play them with me, going to Chuck E. Cheese's for the sole purpose of playing the arcade game, renting a TMNT video every Friday night, playing the Pizza Power game with my sister and friends, using my action figures for acting out the arcade game (even the motorcycle Foots ;) ), and just getting the overall feel of the TMNT as a kid.

At the same time, however, I enthusiastically await the arrival of the second cartoon series. Now that I am at a good age to do so, I can get hooked from the beginning! Those days in the past will come in a new form! I'll once again be going to the store to buy TMNT action figures (assuming I'll have a job soon :roll: ), DVDs (if there ever are any), or any kind of merchandise, but it'll be even better for me because now I won't have to rely on my parents!

All I'm trying to say is that I love the original cartoon universe, but I know for a fact that this new wave of "Turtlemania" will bring back that spirit for me once again, only in a different light. Who knows? Maybe I'll be browsing around pretty soon for the original Mirage issues of the comic!

[Karpo_007]

Well I loved the cartoon as a kid, I still Love the first season, but seasons 3-6 are just plain boring... Well there are few exceptions, like the Big trilogy.

[Tokka-B]

I wouldn't like a darker cartoon that much anyway...that is what video games are for... plus with the new voice cast, that I personally hate, I can't imagine any of them "dark" or whatever, they sound too young, I don't know... :(

[Karpo_007]

They are teenager... They are supposed to sound young.

[Wingnut]

Yes hence the name TEEENAGE Mutant Ninja Turtles

[Karpo_007]

Well in the new comic theyare 28, and still the title is TMNT...

[Wingnut]

But in the show they're 15

[Karpo_007]

Yeah...

[Shellfox]

I can't help but wonder what the new show will be like. We've all heard the comments and the hype, and the rare few that have seen a single ep have continuted to saw its great.

I don't buy it, not yet, a month after the show had been out may be, but right now, I can't saw one way or another if it will be worth it, or if it could even bring new fans in. Yes they saw its dark and mature, but it could suck. They saw it has plot, but it could just be the same thing over and over again with only minor alterations. The animation could suck, and what we've seen so far may be way above average.

I'm not trying to be a downer, I'm just saying don't get your hopes up just yet, the componets may be posible of giving us a good show, or it may suck beyond beliefe. Will new fans reacte to it, I can't saw, for all we know, despite whats been said its still may be heavaly geared towards them, and for all we know, what they promise may be a lie. A way to divert our attention, a way to bring in the older fans then pull the old bait and switch and give us some steaming pile of crap

[Karpo_007]

Read few of the synopses, the plot is not repeatitive..

[Wingnut]

Thank god

[Karpo_007]

And voices are good, and so is animation. I don't know what could go wrong anymore...

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

I guess I'm just going to have to further illustrate my point.

Few things: Just explain how to cartoon was well writen? It used same plot over and over again. Either Shredder looking for a powersource, or a mad scientist taking a revenge to the world. There are few well written episodes, but they are exception. If you like it, or if it makes you laugh, doesn't make it a well written series.

Unless you are a writer, you probably won't understand this. If you are, more power to you. Because I am a writer, I have always been a writer, and I will continue to be a writer. I'll give you some examples of what constitutes something being well-written.

The cartoon was well-written. I could just leave it at that. But you want a more definitive answer? Alright then, I'll give you one.

It is a plus for any story to have continuity. I don't think anyone disagrees on this. Anyone disagree, class?

*Awkward silence*

Alright then, moving along. But you have got to give the continuity you so highly covet some life. You've got to pump some energy into it. All the logic and correct dates and exact names of characters don't mean diddly squat if no one cares.

We'll take a good look at our friend, the old Ninja Turtles cartoon show. The first five episodes had continuity. The stories made sense, you could trace them back, and everybody and their mother was happy as two peas in a pod.

But how long do you think the show could have kept up that pace? Not even the best shows in television have every single story every single week with every single character all adding up to the gigantic whole. You take diversions every once in a while to break things up. Why? Because too much continuity is boring. Yes, that's right, boring.

Can you spell that, class? Can you spell boring? It's b-o-r-i-n-g.

Anyone who's a good writer knows that you can't alienate your readers/viewers with the same old stuff all the time. You have to mix it up. You have to take detours every now and then. All the great stories and all the great TV shows and all the great theater plays take Exit 365 instead of traveling on Interstate 880 all the time.

This is what the Ninja Turtles cartoon was able to demonstrate so well. And, personal comment, am I the only one who sees this?

You've got two different kinds of stories told in the old cartoon universe:

1. Mythology episodes: episodes that make up the backbone of the story. The meat and potatoes of the story. The stuff that makes sense - and smells good - and comes with an added helping of that continuity that just tastes so good with extra ketchup.

2. Stand-alone episodes: episodes that do not relate to each other. They are exclusive entities in and of themselves. They do not relate to episodes written before them, unless by acknowledgement. For example: Donatello got his degree in "Donatello's Degree", correct? This is never mentioned again until "Too Hot to Handle." These are stand-alone episodes in that they don't deal with the mythology. They don't deal with Shredder and Krang trying to conquer the world, which was the backbone of the old cartoon. But "Donatello's Degree" and "Too Hot too Handle" relate to each other to an extent. Even though they aren't essential episodes to know for the show, they still make connections in the show.

You want another example of how the show was well-written? Because I just know you're dying for one, aren't you class?

*More awkward silence*

How many characters were introduced throughout the duration of the old cartoon? How many jokes did Raphael crack? How many words did Donatello use that none of us ever understood? How many worlds did the Ninja Turtles travel to? How many different situations - dumb or not, scary or not, intelligent or not - did they get themselves involved in?

Just sit back and take a good hard look at what we were given in the old cartoon. Did you catch all the in-jokes that were thrown at you? Did you catch all the puns, funny and unfunny? Any show that can poke fun at itself is at the top of its game, and the old cartoon never failed to give subtle winks to its audience. That's clever writing. That's sharp writing. That's giving the audience something, even if they don't get it right away.

There are so many things - so many things - that I see and catch now in the old cartoon that I didn't understand when I was younger, and they just crack me up now. I have never known a show to be as sly as the Ninja Turtles was without it becoming obvious to the viewers.

You mix this big bowl of Ninja Turtles salad together - continuity bacon bits, humor dressing, character croutons, different places sliced cheese - and what do you get? You get the Ninja Turtles cartoon, all nice and freshly sealed for your enjoyment.

Was the old cartoon a well-written series? You bet your sweet shell it was. You seem to think that the only thing that makes a story well-written is continuity, good fights and weapons.

But there's more to it than that. There's more being told than you know.

You hate the first season?

I never ever said that I hated the first season. What I did say, however, was that I hated the first season's animation. The stories were all fine and dandy; but it was the terrible animation that I didn't like.

It seems you can't be critical to the old show.

Can't be critical? What's your definition of critic? I just critiqued the shell out of the show in this post. If your meaning of critical, however, means things that are bad with the show, then by all means, let me critique away.

1. I didn't like the first season's animation. I think we all understand that.

2. I didn't like how so many things were wrong with the first season that they had to be changed during the second season. I'm talking about voice changes - Burne Thompson, Vernon, Krang, just to name a few (changes that were good, however, in the long run). I'm talking about color schemes - so what color was Krang, anyway? If he wasn't pink with white eyeballs, or pink with purple eyeballs, he was dark pink, almost red, with purple eyeballs.

3. That brings us to another thing: color. How many times did the artists who colored the show screw it up? It's well-documented. You've got Raphael talking while wearing Leonardo's bandana. You've got Donatello swinging Michaelangelo's nunchuks. And it seems that characters who weren't important in the show - characters who were just side-characters in a single episode and didn't do anything important - were so poorly colored it just looked as if the artists didn't give a darn.

4. Sometimes the artists couldn't figure out what to do with their characters. Krang is a prime example. Sometimes it appears as if he's steering his android body with little levers from where he sits. Sometimes he's just a brain inside a body cavity. What, are the artists so clever that they want us to believe that Krang has multiple android bodies to choose from? "I'm feeling lazy today. I'll think I'll select Auto-Pilot Android. My tentacles just aren't up for all the work." Hence, the times in the cartoon where he just sat in the body cavity. Krang even used the line, "It's time to put on my good suit!" Oh, those artists - and writers - are as slippery as duct tape, I tell you.

Sidenote: Yes, it's duct tape, not duck tape. If this is something you didn't know, you're welcome.

Yeah Kali, you are absolutely right, the comic isn't perfect either. But neither is the cartoon, thats's the whole point of this argument.

The whole point of this argument? Never in my post did I say the old cartoon was perfect. I was just giving my reasons for why I thought the cartoon was better than what people give it credit for. If I thought the cartoon was perfect, I wouldn't have just bashed the shell out of it a moment ago.

And finally, class, one last little nitpick:

Well personally I can't understand why you just want goofy turtles and Won't give a dark, better written series a chance...

I am speaking for myself here when I say that I am willing to give this new cartoon a chance. It's not going to replace what the old cartoon did for me, but I'm willing to make a little room for it. But it's going to have to prove itself, just like the old cartoon did.

And, Karpo, I am not dogging on you here. I'm just using you as an example to illustrate my points. I know you love the darker turtles, and I know you are a resident genius when it comes to all things dealing with the Mirage Turtles, or just the comic book in general.

But when it comes to your claim that the old cartoon was not a well-written series . . . my friend, this time you are wrong.

Okay, class here's your assignment: Go take a lunch break.

"I sure hope it's pizza!" - Michaelangelo, from "The Big Cufflink Caper!"

[Tokka-B]

They sound like childish teenagers, more fit for the disney channel than anywhere else...and you expect it to be darker? The old voices sounded so much cooler, not as young sounding, gave kids someone to look up to, not down to.... :(

[Nturtle]

:blanksta: ....*gives NTCF the "longest post ever" mango, then gets out a lawn chair and a mango lassie and sits down to watch the argument*

[Karpo_007]

No matter how many new character were in it, or if it had few good jokes, Recycling plots is bad writing. Of course that isn't neccesarily the writes fault, I have heard theories that the dead lines were too tight.

Edit: I wrote before what well written show has. Major points, Good plost that don't repeat itself, Character development.

TMNT lacked on both accounts.

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

EDIT: This post is referring to a reply that Karpo sent me. It has since been edited, as was his post.

Karpo, what did I just get done saying? Apparently, you weren't listening.

I am not dogging on you in my post. I'm just using what you have to say to illustrate my points. I will use what anyone says on here to illustrate my points. We've all done it.

The thing that concerns me, however, is you. You seem to be offended when people don't agree with you. We're not all going to agree. If God wanted us all to agree, he'd have made it that way.

I am not trying to start an argument. I am not trying to start a flame war. I am merely stating my opinion, something that you seem to have a problem with.

If you don't like what I have to say, fine. I can live with that. Sometimes I don't like what you have to say, either. But I do respect what you have to say. I don't do as other people have done and go, "Karpo, you're so stupid. Why don't you just shut your mouth?"

There's a difference between liking what someone says and respecting it. I'm not sure you've figured that out yet.

And now this argument - that was never really an argument - is over.

"Well, that was a short trip." - Raphael, from "Shredder is Splintered"

[Karpo_007]

I replied too soon, and edited it out... You could have put that on top, that way it seems you were waiting for a reaction like that.

[Tokka-B]

Thanks a lot beaker, look what you created....LOL :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Karpo_007]

Well it is NTCF who takes things personally... I was just having a debate on the subject.

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

I didn't take what you had to say personally, Karpo. If anyone lost their cool, it was you. You just don't like it when someone counterpoints you.

And that's all I did. Did I bash the new cartoon? No. Did I bash the comic book? No. Did I bash you personally? You'd like to think that, but again, the answer is no. I used what you said, your written thoughts, and used them in my defense.

And, once again, this argument is done. This is the second time I've said it. If you want to stretch this out anymore, Karpo, then go right on ahead. But I have said my piece (I expect you have said yours) and what is done is done. It's in the past.

Let's move on.

"I can see this is going to be one of those days." - Raphael, from "The Big Zipp Attack"

[Wingnut]

Touche'

[Tokka-B]

Lol, I like how your quote always reflects the topic of your post....very clever

[Karpo_007]

I will. I said the argument is over hours ago beofre you made that post. Still you haven't counterpointed the two main things that are in a well written series. Those are Good non repeatitive plots and character development. Old TMNT show lacked on both.

Don't come saying what I want to think. I love to debate, I don't get offended if people disgaree with me. I m just trying to prove them wrong. Yet you have not been able to over rule those arguments, So I won't admit my defeat.

[Wingnut]

Now were gonna have an argument over who made the first "argument over post"

[Karpo_007]

No, Im just waiting how long post is coming... But untill he can prove me wrong on those accounts, I won't admit my defeat.

[Shellfox]

Read few of the synopses, the plot is not repeatitive..
read all of them thank you, and yes they don't sound repetitive, but again its the people who made them that are saying that, they aren't going to say that they made the same Ep 26 times and tried to make a story around it. Yes they all may be diffrent, but you can only do a show like this so many diffrent ways, while the plots may be diffrent chances are the shows them selves may all seem similar when they are played

Again for all we know, they just used the shows as a basis and made the show so even 4 year oolds with the attention spans of gnats can follow it. Again I have no proff of any of this, but it may happen, they are targeting kids, not 20 somethings. They tried that with Beast Machines and came up with a series while inovative and please to some fans also was full of crap

[Wingnut]

Your persistance is admireable

[Karpo_007]

I have to admit there is a point... But I don't belive it will go that far, the Dialogue heard in the voice clips was good.

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

I will. I said the argument is over hours ago beofre you made that post. Still you haven't counterpointed the two main things that are in a well written series. Those are Good non repeatitive plots and character development. Old TMNT show lacked on both.

Don't come saying what I want to think. I love to debate, I don't get offended if people disgaree with me. I m just trying to prove them wrong. Yet you have not been able to over rule those arguments, So I won't admit my defeat.

Okay, Karpo, I'm going to take you up on your challenge. For anyone who ever reads this thread, they will never forget it. We are making it a memorable one.

And, by the way, I love a good debate too. Just in case some people hadn't already figured that out.

1. Non-repetitive plots: You said that Shredder and Krang were always looking for something to power up the Technodrome. You also said that there was always a mad scientist trying to take over the world. Now I will admit - and this point goes to Karpo - that there were, indeed, many mad scientists in the history of the series. Or mad pirates or whatever the episode called for. But Shredder and Krang looking for ways to power up the Technodrome became one of the bases for the cartoon to build on.

The Technodrome needs power. Shredder and Krang don't have something to give it power. So they go to the surface - or to Mother Earth, depending upon where they were - to get something to power up the Technodrome.

That the Technodrome guzzles up energy like high-octane cars do to gasoline made it realistic. You can't expect a battle machine that huge to be as energized as the Energizer Bunny. The writers realized this. If Shredder and Krang had power in the Technodrome, they could call all the forces of Dimension X and roll over whatever was in their path.

Remember episodes like the "Big Trilogy" and "Shredder Triumphant!"? Those episodes demonstrated what the Technodrome could do when it was powered. If the Technodrome were powered all the time, the series could have ended in just a few episodes. The Turtles would have lost that war. But by making the Technodrome a liability, it infuses reality into the Technodrome.

Having Shredder and Krang repeatedly try to get power for the Technodrome was not repetitive. It was a part of the storyline that was created for the show. Things that are too powerful aren't interesting. Nobody likes something that has no weaknesses. That's just a cheap ploy. If the Technodrome had the power to snuff out the Turtles whenever it wanted, it could have. But the writers did something even better with that concept.

2. Character development: I know you're not going to buy any reason I give for character development, but I'm going to give you examples anyway.

There was substantial character development when the series went to CBS. Seasons 1-3 are not 4-10.

A. In seasons 4-10, you had Raphael becoming a comic and sing-along Turtle. We also saw what happens when a guy like Raphael gets hit with a Personality Modifying Ray.

B. You had Donatello owning his own business, a repair shop, and earning his degree at a university.

C. Leonardo's character changed as early as Season 3 when his voice pitch went higher. Leonardo also fit the sting of the Personality Modifying Ray. He also owned his own fitness gym for a while.

D. Michaelangelo went from a party dude to a party dud by the end of the series. If anything, Michaelangelo's character digreseed. Not only did he have his nunchuks taken away, he also became a party pooper. But he did have his own cooking show for a while.

E. In episodes like "Blast from the Past" and "The Legend of Koji," we get more information about the Foot Clan. That Shibono Sama guy (I don't know how to spell the name) was even mentioned in both episodes.

F. In flashbacks, we saw bits and pieces of Krang's past. We found out he and his kind were working with Dimensional travel. We find out in "Get Shredder!" that Krang was lent a hand in building the Technodrome by a character named Bezerko a.k.a. Drakus. We learned what a fullbody version of Krang looks like in "Invasion of the Krangezoids."

These are all examples of character development. Any piece of information that you find out about a character that you didn't know before is character development.

"A lot of my inventions actually work, you know." - Donatello, from "Night of the Dark Turtle"

[Karpo_007]

Repeatitiviness

Well I agree, If they had to use Shredder and Krang most of the Time, There weren't many plot choices. But they could have lost the technodrome and try to do something diffent. But they didn't, that is why it were repeatitive.

Also the mad scinetists eps... All of the mad scinetists were basicly same character. Always someone who wanted to revenge to the world... repeatitive. Well most of this happens during seasons 3-6. Season 1 wasn't like that, Season 2 had very good plots too, But in season 3, they started had too many writers. I belive that is what caused 1. The lack of continyity 2. the repeatitiviness. Still I'l have to say that almost all David wise eps were well written, but sadly he did only small ammount of episodes during seasons 3-6.


Character development

You are right, your examples aren't really good ones.. Character development is a event in a story that affects the charaters behaviour in future episodes. The show lacked this.

All these things are only true on seasons 2-7. 1 and 8-10 Have good non repeatitive plots, aswell as charater development. And almost ala of those are writen by David wise. This proves, that all of those problems are due to huge number of writers.

[Wingnut]

Wow :o

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

Karpo, I think you and I will only agree on one thing. And that is, we both agree to disagree. :lol:

No matter what Karpo says, I'm not gonna buy it. No matter what I say, Karpo's not gonna buy it either.

These are the kinds of discussions I wish I could have with people I know in real life. But I seem to be a dying breed from where I'm from. The Turtles are passe now.

Bebop: "We give up!"
Rocksteady: "Ditto."
Michaelangelo: "Hey, zoo-face, I thought you were on our side!"

From "The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting"

[Shellfox]

Ok just want to say something on the mad Scientist repetitivness. MS are usually generic, its not a TMNT cartoon thing, any time a MS is brought in to anyshow or plot in any form they are pretty much the same person, their are exceptions, but usually they are the same person, but with a diffrent gimic. Its not a TMNT flaw, its just how its done

[Karpo_007]

Karpo, I think you and I will only agree on one thing. And that is, we both agree to disagree. :lol:

No matter what Karpo says, I'm not gonna buy it. No matter what I say, Karpo's not gonna buy it either.

These are the kinds of discussions I wish I could have with people I know in real life. But I seem to be a dying breed from where I'm from. The Turtles are passe now.

Bebop: "We give up!"
Rocksteady: "Ditto."
Michaelangelo: "Hey, zoo-face, I thought you were on our side!"

From "The Foot Soldiers Are Revolting"

Heh probably true, But that is a good way around saying that you can't counter my arguments... Come on! You must think of something! :lol:

[Wingnut]

Well i nominate this for TMNT debate of the year :D

[Ninja Turtles Cartoon Fan]

Heh probably true, But that is a good way around saying that you can't counter my arguments... Come on! You must think of something! :lol:

Karpo, I did counter your arguments. I gave you valid reasons for the repetitive storylines and character development. But you're just too stubborn to see that. :P

Sounds a lot like someone I know.

*NTCF glances in the mirror*

"You don't watch much TV, do ya?" - Raphael, from "The Starchild"

[Reznorite420]

Gimme an "L"...gimme an "O"...gimme a "C"...gimme a "K"...gimme a "THIS THREAD"...

[That Matt Guy]

Why don't you two just agree to disagree? :D

[Mondo_Gecko]

OH THANK YOU OH THANK YOU NInja Turtles Cartoon Fan!!! Well Played. Game Set Match. YEAH-HA

It's basically Simple. Don't Bash The Old Cartoon, It Was Awesome, Amazing, Animated. You want any more words.

If you want someone with well written stories and continity i suggest you get HBO and get the Sopranos or get the West Wing.

[Tokka-B]

Well, that was a good debate! Lets have another, except this time I want in! :)

[Wingnut]

Bloddy good debate chaps

[Karpo_007]

Well maybe we should just call it even.... Yeah it seems you are as stuborn as me... :lol:

[Nturtle]

Well maybe we should just call it even.... Yeah it seems you are as stuborn as me... :lol:

Exactly, geez I've never in my time here seen an argument like that and I get the feeling we'll being several such arguments later on as the new show develops :P

[Karpo_007]

Heh maybe...

[Tokka-B]

Oh yes we will.....Oh yes we will...... :evil: :wink:

[Reznorite420]

I can see it all now:

Newbie comes in here commenting on how stupid the "new" TMNT universe is, a die-hard fan on here has to tell him that it's not really "new", just never shown in a cartoon world before, newbie doesn't believe him/her, fan tries to get in-depth in the explanation, newbie says something along the lines of, "Uhhhhh, what universe are you from? The ninja turtles started out as that corny but loveable cartoon...don't try to tell me otherwise"....the rest rolls from there.

[Anarchistguy]

Well of course, the first season is a classic. Great action, good plots, and the best animation show ever had(Made by japanese) after that the show switched from action to slapstick. That's when the downfall happened.

I know that too well! Let's just hope it won't happen again in the new cartoon.

[Karpo_007]

I can see it all now:

Newbie comes in here commenting on how stupid the "new" TMNT universe is, a die-hard fan on here has to tell him that it's not really "new", just never shown in a cartoon world before, newbie doesn't believe him/her, fan tries to get in-depth in the explanation, newbie says something along the lines of, "Uhhhhh, what universe are you from? The ninja turtles started out as that corny but loveable cartoon...don't try to tell me otherwise"....the rest rolls from there.

The die hard fan will probably be me :lol: I can imagine that scene hapening...

[Reznorite420]

You and anarchistguy are very likely candidates for the "die-hard fan" :D

[Karpo_007]

The new cartoon will probably bring lot's of new members here, So something like that is is inevitable.

[Tokka-B]

I am guessing any NEW fan is going to like this show....

[Karpo_007]

Hopefully yeah...

[Nturtle]

Yes the idea I guess is draw in a new generation of fans

[Shellfox]

Bring new people in, Good or Bad? Again that all depends on how the show is done, I won't go into details, because I've given my fears, but my question is this, of the shows that are out now in this time bracket, on networks how many of them are good in your eyes? Because the chances are the new show may follow that trend. If their are more good shows so to may be the TMNT, but If you believe that the vast majority of the shows suck, be ready for the TMNT to do like wise. And lets face it, TMNT and Fox are already on thin ice depending on who you ask

[beaker]

All I know is two things...

1) It's hillarious to see people say they hate absolutely anything anime related(obviously ruined on the crappy anime shown on kids tv) yet dont see that from all the concept designs and stills weve seen...the new TMNT are at least somewhat influenced by the anime style. As I said, people who hate anime will eat it up with a spoon it its incorated into an American cartoon.

2) Loved the original cartoon in the late 80's...got out of it in the early 90's. What I remember was very cool. Ya gotta remember, its all perspective...looking back with grownup eyes on something again...ie: going back now and watching old tapes, it might not be as grat as you remember...but memories are always there of the glory days.

[That Matt Guy]

It's hillarious to see people say they hate absolutely anything anime related(obviously ruined on the crappy anime shown on kids tv) yet dont see that from all the concept designs and stills weve seen...the new TMNT are at least somewhat influenced by the anime style. As I said, people who hate anime will eat it up with a spoon it its incorated into an American cartoon.

Well, I never have liked anime. Even back when people called it Japanimation I thought it was stupid, so Pokemon and all the cutesy garbage did not ruin it for me. But you are right about how most people who don't like anime will love it when it is used as a platform in an American cartoon, but not me.

[Karpo_007]

Bring new people in, Good or Bad? Again that all depends on how the show is done, I won't go into details, because I've given my fears, but my question is this, of the shows that are out now in this time bracket, on networks how many of them are good in your eyes? Because the chances are the new show may follow that trend. If their are more good shows so to may be the TMNT, but If you believe that the vast majority of the shows suck, be ready for the TMNT to do like wise. And lets face it, TMNT and Fox are already on thin ice depending on who you ask

That possibility was there, But from what we know about the show now, It probably won't suck. Animation seems great, Plots (acording to synopses) Ar great, and dialoue based on the few clips we have heard seemed good to. There are few things that can go wrong now.

[Reznorite420]

All I know is two things...

1) It's hillarious to see people say they hate absolutely anything anime related(obviously ruined on the crappy anime shown on kids tv) yet dont see that from all the concept designs and stills weve seen...the new TMNT are at least somewhat influenced by the anime style. As I said, people who hate anime will eat it up with a spoon it its incorated into an American cartoon.AHEMMMMMMMMM!!!!!!!!

I'll have you know that I'm NOT basing my beliefs soley on the "kiddy" anime like Pokemon. I've seen all sorts of other, higher level "anime" on the market, and none of it appeals to me at all.

Besides, I consider "anime" a STYLE of Japanese animation. By that I mean it's possible to have stuff made by Japanese animators yet not have that full-fledged "anime" look to it. Season 1 of the original TMNT cartoon is an example, and so is this upcoming series. When I talk about "anime", I mean the style of animation that has the characters with big eyes, the rather unfluidic motion, and the overexaggerated shapes of everything.

Thank you, and good night.

[Tokka-B]

Well, if you want to see someone debate anime with animation here is link:
http://www.animeondvd.com/specials/articles/rf001.php

Be aware that although this guy says he isn't biased, he really is...Oh, and you may want to grap a coke or whatever because it is a kinda long read... :wink:

[Sparvid]

*forces anyone who "hates anime" to watch Ghost in the Shell* :P

[Supermik]

For me the best years for TMNT are 1987--->1993, i love these cartoon series!

I dislike the cartoon series after the first movie (1994--->1996). :dead:

But i dont' think that the new 2003 series restore the glory... :( (maybe in our generation :wink: )

I saw the new picture on the official web site, i dislike them, they're so different from 1987... :dead:

Also if i think in the children who watch on tv the new series will love the Turtles...

[That Matt Guy]

*forces anyone who "hates anime" to watch Ghost in the Shell* :P

I'm sure I would hate it. :evilgrin:

[Wingnut]

*Forces Matt to watch Patlabor and Bubblegum Crisis :evilgrin: :evilgrin: *

[beaker]

So based on this blind hatred of anything anime related(which Im assuming would include modern Disney animation, most comic books out on the market, and other animation on tv) Im guessing you folks are already offput by the upcoming cartoon? I dont get it...
if its anime it sucks, but if its packaged in an Americanized way...oh well then its ok dokie?

Now I maybe the biggest anime fan this side of Neptune for two decades...but I will agree...MOST ANIME SUCKS! That crappy unfluid missing frames of animation, big eyed, speed line garbage. Heck I am so unimpressed by most anime. So much of it in the 80's to early 90's was automatically unbearable. Further, I just know everythign from Speed Racer to Pokemon has given anime this 'cheap' look to it.

However...I submit the following epic, crap in your pants glorious multi million dollar efforts that are light years beyond what your idea of 'anime' is: Akira, Ghost in the Shell, Neon Genesis Evangelion: The End of Evangelion movie, Blood the last Vampire, Vampire Hunter D, Metropolis, Cowboy Bebop the Movie, Perfect Blue, Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away,
Jin-Roh, Ninja Scroll, etc. I find it most ignorant to write off anime as cheap kiddy crappy animation til one has seen some of these...as these films are truly extrordinary in visuals and vision. Believe me, if all anime was Dragon Ball Z/Fist of the North Star/Pokemon quality animation I'd be declaring anime as garbage too.

But to say one hates anything anime, then says they like the TMNT makes zero sense...as Im very sure Eastman/Laird were at least somewhat influenced by the manga comic style; as well as the upcoming show...which looks to be somewhat anime influenced.

[Karpo_007]

The western animation has borrowed a lot from from Japanese animation. The biggest diffrence is, that in western animation the characters are more realistic looking. Im not a big anime fan, But I think that Akira is the best thing ever animated.

[HorseTechie]

*forces anyone who "hates anime" to watch Ghost in the Shell* :P

I'm sure I would hate it. :evilgrin:
Oh no... I bet you'd love this one, especially if you're into nekkid female mechs.

I am rather fickle about many kinds of anime too. The overly simplified chibi stuff they do many kiddie shows with drives me nuts... however, Medabots and "SuperDeformed" variants of TFs and TMNTs can be downright hilarious.

But if I had my choice between the overly exaggerated anime (with sweat drops and blurred motions) and really nicely drawn anime movies Like Akira and Ghost in the Shell... I go for the really nicely drawn stuff! Manga Production movies rock!

I can't stand this newer form of cranked out in mass production form of anime that hardly allows room for creative originality. Yeah.. when it boils down to it, the kind of anime that sez the eyes and hair HAVE to be drawn like this, and the legs are so long, the fingers are so elegant... it gives me the Fits to realize how confining that is. I rather learn how to draw using my own original techniques than to draw to adapt to someone elses standards. :roll:

[Nickokapo]

the rather unfluidic motion, and the overexaggerated shapes of everything.

Thank you, and good night.
Heh, go watch cowboy bebop the movie, i doubt there's anything unfluidic or overexaggerated there :roll:

[beaker]

Oh yeah, for as much absolute horrible garbage there is in anime(and I'll be the first to admit it! 75% of anime looks cheap to me) there is such masterpieces as Akira, Ghost in the Shell, Blood the Last Vampire. They even have lots of World War 2/Post World War 2 animes like Grave of the Fireflies, Jin Roh, etc. All good stuff.

And Spirited Away, oh man...I havent felt that exhilarated since I saw Never Ending Story in theatres!

Finally, in theatres soon(at least limited releases) is Patlabor the Movie 3, and Cowboy Bebop the movie...both worth checking out. Last year the only films to get theatrical releases was Metropolis, Escaflowne(Which sucked animation wise), and Spirited Away...so slowly but surely.

I just get a kick out of how 'Westernized' anime is all hunky dory for the folks who hate anime.

[heretic888]

I saw Princess Mononoke and thought it was quite good. Ninja Scroll is cool, too. The Lodoss Wars series is excellent. I loved Curse of the Yoma.

[Reznorite420]

Deviating from the anime argument (and I pity those who wasted their time trying to convince to watch at least one thing anime...nothing will change my mind)...I'd like to get back to the whole 1989 topic:

It just hit me one other "cult" movie that I happen to like that was released in 89: Weird Al Yankovic in UHF. I happen to be listening to the theme of the movie as I post this.

[beaker]

Deviating from the anime argument (and I pity those who wasted their time trying to convince to watch at least one thing anime...nothing will change my mind)...I'd like to get back to the whole 1989 topic:

It just hit me one other "cult" movie that I happen to like that was released in 89: Weird Al Yankovic in UHF. I happen to be listening to the theme of the movie as I post this.

Youre right...noone convince ANYONE to watch the new TMNT Fox cartoon since its anime inspired!;)

As for UHF, that is definately one of the best films of 1989 next to Back to the Future 2, Batman, and Indiana Jones 3.

[CyberCubed]

Yes it was, yes it was.

[Powder]

Really, Cici?

[TurtleTitan97]

Did CyberCubed really resurrect a thread just to respond to a comment from 13 years ago? That is just dumb with a capital D.

[turtlefanforever]

This was a question that needed to be answered. The statute of limitations passed, the confidentiality agreement is over. Cybercubed finally breaking the 13 year silence. This is big news folks. Glad we finally have answers.

[shuriken]

LOL that was great. Did Cubed search in the depths of the Technodrome and respond to something from 13 years ago or is there something we're all missing?

[MrPliggins]

You guys must not have seen UHF. Definitely warranted. ;)

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

It's interesting to see how the 2003 carton was judged already before start. But I don't think 2003 was a great as 1989 when it came to fandom peaking.

[ZariusTwo]

In a completely pointless exercise, I've went in and checked the post history of some of the members in this thread to see when they last posted.

[CyberCubed]

I always wondered what happened to Karpo 007. He used to be the most active user here and he was a huge Mirage fan and as an impressionable teenager at the time I used to take everything he said quite seriously. He used to educate people how different the original cartoon was from the Mirage comics, and how the 2k3 series was going to be more like Mirage. He hasn't made a post since 2005.

I tried to follow in his footsteps to educate people on TMNT history.

[Jephael]

I always wondered what happened to Karpo 007. He used to be the most active user here and he was a huge Mirage fan and as an impressionable teenager at the time I used to take everything he said quite seriously. He used to educate people how different the original cartoon was from the Mirage comics, and how the 2k3 series was going to be more like Mirage. He hasn't made a post since 2005.

I'm guessing the dude got a grip on reality, moved out of his parents' house, found a nice young woman to settle down with and moved on with his life.

[Candy Kappa]

I'm guessing the dude got a grip on reality, moved out of his parents' house, found a nice young woman to settle down with and moved on with his life.

Unlike the rest of this forum, who is still stuck in mom's basement, eating Cheetos and downing the Dew.

[shuriken]

^^ Damn. S**t got dark quick:lol: