Cartoon Network To Be Rebranded?

[ZariusTwo]

This recent "CN Cancelation" scare (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=198142) has resulted in some curious inquiries, most notiably this answer from a Network insider.

"Steve, I've been here for a bunch of years now, and the first thing I heard when I arrived was that Time-Warner couldn't have two animation divisions, that we were going to merge with Warner Bros. Animation. We're still here. It's true that the division is being retooled and reworked. We haven't been doing well in the ratings, like we're a distant third after the Disney Channel and Nickelodeon. But we've got several different series going, Out of Jimmy's Head, Foster's , Chowder, Flapjack, Transformers, Ben 10 and some new series in development. But no question that we're going through changes..."
"...The new head of the division is doing analyses of what kinds of shows we'll be doing, seeing if we'll do more live action, since the Disney Channel is being real succesful with their live action shows and movies. But we're still in the cartoon business..."

Kamen Rider is already one of the Network's recent aqqusistions, and the live-action Ben 10 movie was probably another test of an audience for alternatives to animation. CN wont be shut down, but it more than likely is becoming a competitive Jetix-like channel.

[ThirdMarioBro]

I would care if I didn't think that all their shows "not" originating from Adult Swim suck like a Kirby vacuum cleaner. What will become of Adult Swim I wonder? I assume its ratings suck.

[ZariusTwo]

Adult Swim's content has blown wind for all except for ATHF, Home Movies, SP:C2C 12 Oz and Birdman...and several of those bar ONE are gone. It's really an overblown, overrated "mature" channel with dated, cliched reference humour, and dick and fart jokes with the same old political or industry stabs, nothing ironic or Lynchian

I still dont see why people love to jump on the "CN sucks" bandwagon. Half of their content is nothing close to Jetix's inconsistency, or the fact that Avatar is the only show worth watching on Nick. People more than likely dont even watch the shows there thrashing on a long-term basis

Dont get me wrong, I dont like Lazlo or Fosters myself, but the Network's best draws like Ben 10 and "Grim Adventures" are more than an equal to the older days of Cartoon Cartoons.

[愛]

Is it bad that I love My Gym Partner's a Monkey? I dunno, I think it's hilarious.

[Drtooth]

Is it bad that I love My Gym Partner's a Monkey? I dunno, I think it's hilarious.

YES! :tcouch:

This is yet another reason why I hate Warners... this bullcrap, and the Loonatics Unleashed debacle, and by constantly renewing Johnny Test. It's not so much a bad show, but the creator pretty much tried too hard to make it Fairly oddparents in it's first season (since he was a head writer of FOP before the show) and once it was dropped by Warners, and animated by Cookie Jar, it has become incredibly unwatchable.

Now, what they need to do is go out and look for CARTOONISTS to make new shows. They had success with cartoonist driven things up until now (From Dexter to Grim) and to glom onto Nick and Disney's consistently terrifyingly bad Home Alone style TV shows is just killing a brilliant idea.

There are no more cartoons on broadcast. Maybe Saturday mornings... and now there's just 2 channels airing stuff, and a lot of it is just pathetic. Other than Tom and Jerry and the Batman, there's no reason to even wake up. Ever actually see Skunk Fu? It makes Viva Pinata look good by comparison. It's even the exact same style of humor, only (if possible) WORSE. And the other channels rerun junk to fill the FCC requirement of educational Children's programming. Qubo? Secret Slumber Party? WTF?!?!?

Now, I will say a Kamen Rider series sounds appetizing, but Out of Jimmy's Head? I know that it all comes down to money, but does anyone expect to make money by copying someone else and doing a worse job? Maybe you'd get better ratings if you scrapped all the current craptoons, and look for QUALITY stuff.

My Gym Partner's a monkey. It's not a cartoon show. It's a bumper sticker or T-Shirt.

[愛]

Uhhhhhh, wow. I just like the show, and watch it whenever it's on. I don't go out LOOKING to watch it. I'm not that big on cartoons made for kids. And to deeply analyze a kids show like that? I dunno what to tell you.

[ToTheNines]

Did anyone else notice that Leo is at the top of that page? I really want Cartoon Network to air TMNT every day after school, that would be a dream come true.

Anyways, it sucks to see CN going through this, I guess kids would rather watch un-inspired sitcoms and high school musical instead...

[DrSpengler]

I guess this was the inevitable conclusion. Live action has been creeping onto Cartoon Network gradually for the past year or so.

If Cartoon Network does eventually mutate into a Nickelodeon or Disney Channel clone, with hours of That's So Raven dopplegangers, I think it best they change the network's name.

I like the idea of retitling Boomerang "Cartoon Network", since watching Boomerang now is like watching Cartoon Network in 1993 (especially with the recent re-addition of the What a Cartoon Show and Swat Kats to their line-up).

[Drtooth]

If Cartoon Network does eventually mutate into a Nickelodeon or Disney Channel clone, with hours of That's So Raven dopplegangers, I think it best they change the network's name.


Firstly, I'm gonna say, they fire the guy who was in charge during the ATHF bull, and they don't fire some greed sack snot ball that wants to take one of the ONLY all cartoon channels ever delveloped and turn it into another The N. Especially since Nick is making another all the N channel.

These hideous live action shows are KILLING animation. And I remember being upset when NBC killed it's line up with a long line of Saved By the Bell ripoffs, each more pathetic than the last. There are starving cartoonists out there that need work, and to have it taken away from them because they all want to copy Disney.... it's horrible. And what's the ultimate result? They're going to be behind in the ratings ANYWAY.

CN's draws are Naruto, Fosters, and Ben 10. Hopefully the new dub of One Piece. But other than that, they have just terrible cartoons now, and they wonder where they went wrong. The solution to bad cartoons is even worse live action? Get back all the people who made the network. David Fiess, Genndy Tartikofsky, Mo Willems... and some other big name animators like John K. They have more talent in their cuticles then most of these live action crap writers have in their entire bodies. Have them all develope a series of projects and see which ones stick. If you can't get Vanilla right, don't attempt 39 flavors!

Adult Swim's content has blown wind for all except for ATHF, Home Movies, SP:C2C 12 Oz and Birdman...and several of those bar ONE are gone. It's really an overblown, overrated "mature" channel with dated, cliched reference humour, and dick and fart jokes with the same old political or industry stabs, nothing ironic or Lynchian


I really don't watch too many of them, but Adult Swim's glory days are gone. A couple odd animes still lying around, and a bunch of ATHF wannabes. Harvey, Space Ghost, Brak... all gone. The Futurama reruns are flagging, and Family Guy is in syndication now (other than the multiple rediculous edits). But it's still doing well, since there is an endless supply of high and drunk college kids that LOVE this stuff.

[ToTheNines]

I really don't watch too many of them, but Adult Swim's glory days are gone. A couple odd animes still lying around, and a bunch of ATHF wannabes. Harvey, Space Ghost, Brak... all gone. The Futurama reruns are flagging, and Family Guy is in syndication now (other than the multiple rediculous edits). But it's still doing well, since there is an endless supply of high and drunk college kids that LOVE this stuff.

Yea every kid in my high school is in love with family guy, and even some younger kids that I know. Ever since Venture Bros. and Samurai Champloo got yanked I kinda quit watching, somtimes I watch Futurama tho.

[Dr. Doom]

Metalocalypse seems to be doing pretty well.

[ZariusTwo]

Uhhhhhh, wow. I just like the show, and watch it whenever it's on. I don't go out LOOKING to watch it. I'm not that big on cartoons made for kids. And to deeply analyze a kids show like that? I dunno what to tell you.

Then you should stop watching TMNT if you think these cartoons arent anything but childrens fodder, which they clearly are not.

[Dr. Doom]

He doesn't.

[Peanut]

Then you should stop watching TMNT if you think these cartoons arent anything but childrens fodder, which they clearly are not.

Yes, they are...they're not made for adults, they're made for children...

[Jon]

Yes, they are...they're not made for adults, they're made for children...


Some cartoons may be (aimed at kids), but there are others that are aimed at both kids and adults. As well as some that are aimed at adults.

[Time Mistress]

And yet another once good cable channel implodes.:roll: It happens to all of them eventually it seems. :( Some just take longer than others.

As long as the new Transformers show is good and doesn't get screwed with is all I really care about at this point I think.

If anyone can actually salvage CN, more's the better. Why can't Boomerang be the one on basic cable these days? Sigh.

I've lost a lot of faith in TV in general these days. On the good side they say these things like the live action trend run in cycles, so it will end someday, it just sucks for those who are waiting around for the current cycle to end. So in the mean time just give me DVDs of the good stuff and let me create my own viewing schedule.:D

[愛]

I definitely do not watch TMNT. I'm a fan of the old toon, back when the concept was a joke and meant for children. I'm not into the "Raph's dark internal pain" concept that they have today.

[Drtooth]

Time Misteress has hit the mark... It is a fad. Unfortunately, it's not going to die out anytime soon, and the only way it will is when CN's bullcrap live action tweencoms to be flop even worse than the cartoons they have on now. yes, they are geared to children.... really really slow children. the Gym Partner Monkey show is dumb, but it doesn't share the same depraved dumbness that Cow and Chicken had. C&C, as rediculous and stupid as it was, enjoyed every minute of it's stupidity, and that's what made it work. Gym Monkey seems like a totally sterilized, factory made sort of stupid, and it loses all that wonder that some of the earlier shows had.

[CudleyCowlick]

CN can morph into whatever it wants as long as I can still watch Storm Hawks and Ben 10. I have hopes for the new Transformers, we'll see.

Adult Swim has been going down the crapper for a long time... there's still some good things on there don't get me wrong, I love Metalacolypse, ATHF is still going strong, and I'm just starting to get into Venture Bros, but it's just not like it used to be in the first couple years. I miss Sealab... :(

[Spitfire]

Then you should stop watching TMNT if you think these cartoons arent anything but childrens fodder, which they clearly are not.

Dude there's like 5 cartoons out there that weren't made with kids in mind and are actually good. Then there's a handful that were made for kids but kept adults in mind.

Not every cartoon is awesome, Captain Planet is not good. Recyclesaurs Rex's Power Hour does not have dark storylines. Not everything has pitch bloack undertones. I think you make this crap up sometimes.

Billy And Mandy should be renamed "Hot Topic The TV Series" because that's all it is. Cannon fodder for moron goth kids who think a show with the Grim Reaper in it is cool. "OOO LOOK BILLY IS ACTING RETARDED LOLOLOL"

[ZariusTwo]

Not every cartoon is awesome, Captain Planet is not good.

Depends on the seasons, or if you're liberal or republican (though lefties have their own problems with the show). I hate the post-DIC stuff.

I think you make this crap up sometimes.

Once again, it's people who are often full of narrow-minded crap that resort to this rubbish rather than understand the point I'm making, and pick apart only the basics of what I'm saying. Common sense should tell anyone that's not what I mean at all. You know what shows I'm talking about, the Terry Toons, the old-school Disney eras (even the 1980s and 1990s), Marvel Animation, DC etc

I'm not talking Dora The Explorer is an HBO-exclusive porno docusoap, I'm saying Phantom 2040 is an example of animation that caters beyond the limitations of the child demographic and enlightens both child and older audiences in contrast.

I dont see why people suddenly got it into their heads I was talking about Adventures of T-Rex-quality s*it, shows whose really hilarious around here...

[Spitfire]

I was never denying those points, but I see you say stuff like Billy And Mandy is that kind of show as well and I can't agree with you there. There's some series I can't see anything adult in what so ever other then a few nods.

Yes the era you mentioned was great but kids at that time weren't so fragile and there's no way series like that could be made now of days.

[ZariusTwo]

I was never denying those points, but I see you say stuff like Billy And Mandy is that kind of show as well and I can't agree with you there. There's some series I can't see anything adult in what so ever other then a few nods.

Then we'll have to disagree there. I dont watch "Grim" for Billy's behaviour, but primarily for Grim and his own troubles, he's the established victim of the series

Yes the era you mentioned was great but kids at that time weren't so fragile and there's no way series like that could be made now of days.

I also disagree, and some content has proven that. The problem is that the networks stick them in ridiculous time slots whilst being able to "maintain quality standards" that they use in pitching syndication packages, or receive virtually no promotion at all over something a little more favoured because it's "all things"

[VaughnMichael]

hmmm not good....so does that mean they will be ditching all their toons?

[Spitfire]

I also disagree, and some content has proven that. The problem is that the networks stick them in ridiculous time slots whilst being able to "maintain quality standards" that they use in pitching syndication packages, or receive virtually no promotion at all over something a little more favoured because it's "all things"

Well alright I mean what shows are as violent as oh say Batman TAS? I mean there's blood, there's actual guns that fire bullets, and there's some storylines in there that I don't think any kid would understand. The human torture mainly. I haven't seen series like that lately. I mean the new turtles series is the only thing that comes close and even that isn't that far back regressed. Got pretty gruesome for awhile like that monster who gets ripped in half in "Dragon's Rising" but noting like that.

Maybe there's some shows I haven't been watching, cause if there's something like that I'm missing I'd love to know really. I miss shows like that.

[ZariusTwo]

Maybe there's some shows I haven't been watching, cause if there's something like that I'm missing I'd love to know really. I miss shows like that.

I'd recommend some, but you seem to have an eye on current products already to criticise "Grim", how about a list first of what you follow complete with your own views thus far and I can go from there...

[Spitfire]

Sadly there's no current series I follow, mainly because I don't have cable, I hardly watch TV.

Shows I liked that have ended are
Batman TAS, Batman Beyond, The Tick, The Maxx, Spawn. I haven't seen them in years but when I was a kid I loved X-men, Spider-man, The Hulk, Iron Man, and Silver Surfer.

Really there's not alot of shows I follow but I'm very picky about what I watch.

[Drtooth]

Then we'll have to disagree there. I dont watch "Grim" for Billy's behaviour, but primarily for Grim and his own troubles, he's the established victim of the series


You know, I had trouble getting into it myself, but the episode where everyone becomes white rap posers, and Grim keeps telling them that they forgot about the old School... that won the show for me. And the Christmas special is the WEIRDEST thing I've ever seen in my life. I really disagree that it's "goth" (and In all honesty, I think Mandy is inteded as a send up of goth girls), and I just find it a fresh and delightfully silly cartoon.

That said, I also think that KND and Grim were the last bastions of greatness the network had. It's not that I don't like Ben 10, myself... I just can't get into it. I don't have cable so I only saw a couple episodes.

It seems that CN's draw is Ben 10, Fosters, Most of the Toonami line up and most of the AS line up. I think they shouldn't be too hasty until they see if Out of Jimmy's Peabrain is a success or not. I mean, seriously, I remeber liking home Alone as a kid, but these shows are rediculous.... Disney's Zach and Cody? it's like Home Alone 2 without Tim Curry, Daniel Stern, and Joe Pesci.

If I wanted to watch any of the stuff on Disney, I'd buy a Saved By the Bell box set, and watch it with the sound down listening to an old CD of really bad failed 1990's Pop Stars... all the while pounding my head with a hammer until 3/4 of my braincells die off. Same effect. These shows are made for kids, and guess what our age bracket is supposed to watch? CSI and court shows. There's little alternative (not online) for people that think "adult" tv (as if AFV and Just for Laughs are adult shows) is bullcrap anymore.

I recall a day with Animaniacs and such where the writing was so sharp, older kids and even adults thought it was brilliant. that's the key. You can make a cartoon series that appeals to BOTH kids and adults. But now it's just all about trying to grab ratings from a company that suckles too much from the teat of retarded tweenage fan girldom. What kind of girls watch this? Why, this kind of course! (http://www.homestarrunner.com/tgs4.html)

Sadly there's no current series I follow, mainly because I don't have cable, I hardly watch TV.


Exactly. Me too. There are no options for us Cable deprived people (and with this happening to CN, I'm not sure I wanna). The same judge shows still smell up daytime TV with the rotten corpse of a million Maury Povich episodes. Daytime WB gives us 2 hours of tweenage family crap with it's cancelled sh**coms Reba and What i Dislike about you...

[BubblyShell22]

About the only show I watch on CN these days is Code Lyoko. To me, that show's pretty cool with the mix of regular animation and CGI. However, that's the only show that's grabbed my interest. If that show goes off the air, then I won't be watching CN at all.

[ToTheNines]

I'm not into the "Raph's dark internal pain" concept that they have today.

Not to be mean dude, but that statement really shows that you know nothing of the current cartoon.

[愛]

I do know the "current" cartoon. I was making a joke. Thanks for being mean, though.

[Dr. Doom]

lol

Don't mind Rhen.

[愛]

You're also kinda gay, Doom. Don't bother me.

[Dr. Doom]

Brilliantly spoken. Like Shakespeare. What're you, 14?

[愛]

You're the one who had to edit their post because you resorted to calling me "dumb." Are you 11?

[Dr. Doom]

I edited it, didn't I!?

[Spike Spiegel]

I recall a day with Animaniacs and such where the writing was so sharp, older kids and even adults thought it was brilliant. that's the key. You can make a cartoon series that appeals to BOTH kids and adults. But now it's just all about trying to grab ratings from a company that suckles too much from the teat of retarded tweenage fan girldom.

There are no options for us Cable deprived people (and with this happening to CN, I'm not sure I wanna). The same judge shows still smell up daytime TV with the rotten corpse of a million Maury Povich episodes. Daytime WB gives us 2 hours of tweenage family crap with it's cancelled sh**coms Reba and What i Dislike about you...


I just don't understand it myself. If it wasn't broken why try to fix it? My dad, who was like 40 or so at the time, ADORED those cartoons. He thought Animaniacs, Pinky and the Brain, and Dexter were funny as hell. He was watching most everything CN had...even a few SpongeBob episodes on Nick. I'm glad he didn't live to see the gutter trash that is on our TVs now.

[Drtooth]

I just don't understand it myself. If it wasn't broken why try to fix it?

Because of the misconception that there's money to be had. Nothing else.

[Ra]

...again with the fighting over cartoons? As much as I love them...I don't think that they are really worth fighting for like this... :ohwell:

Honestly, I don't know what to make of all of this. Just...sit back and watch, I guess. Nothing more than you can really do... *sighs*

[Drtooth]

Hey. it's not so much fighting for cartoons as fighting against Uninspired tween garbage that would make Saved by The Bell Blush...