Quality of the US old toon DVD's VS German

[saul]

Hey guys,

If any of you are looking for the best quality picture to watch the old toon, I have to say that the picture quality on the German releases is considerably better than the US versions.

I don't know if it's a mastering issue or what, but the US versions have a very grainy pixelated look to them. This always seemed wrong to me. But when I noticed some shots of Planet of the Turtleoids from the German DVDs on another post, they seemed so much better that I figured it would be worth it to order and compare.

For me, it's almost like watching the show for the first time, like how it was meant to be seen. You see, growing up I never had cable, so I had to watch the show through bad TV antennae reception. So it's wonderful to finally see everything so clearly, without a layer of grain (although there is still minor DVD artifacting, but not nearly as bad as in the US version).

The German DVDs actually contain 2 versions of each episode: German and US. Why? Because the German version was edited for content (nunchucks I guess). So, there are no 'alternate audio tracks.' It's simply 2 different files. Since German is PAL (region 2), I ripped the DVD on my computer and just kept the US version files. I prefer watching files off the computer anyway, as it's faster than loading through a DVD player.

I've also noticed that the sound seems better on the German version. The bass sounds fuller and richer, and the overall sound has more presence.

I ordered the "Box 1" (25 episodes from season 1 to 3) from the german ebay (ebay.de), translated with google chrome, and it was pretty easy. Just found a seller who shipped internationally. I had tried ordering from Amazon but it was too confusing. It was about $30 after shipping and everything. Not bad for 25 episodes.

PS: I haven't watched the Laserdisc versions yet, but I'm guessing the German DVD's would still win out on picture quality, although I hear that sound quality on Laserdisc is better than DVD since it's not compressed. We'll have to wait till I get a Laserdisc player though to settle this...

[hudemx]

About the german Quality:

KSM was asked last year when they rereleased Box 1 as a 3 Disk Set instead of a 5 Disk Set if they would remaster the Episodes like they did with they He-Man, She-Ra, Galaxy Rangers Rereleases before. They responded by saying that they already remastered all episodes of TMNT they released on DVD (both german & english) because they had to "minimize" the Filesize to get 10 episodes (5 german, 5 english) onto one Disk.

So yeah, they episodes were remastered in picture and audioquality by KSM, which are known in Germany for their special remastering techniques which allowe them to get 13+ half-hour episodes on 1 DVD without loosing any Quality.

We could still compare the german Sets with the US Lionsgate Sets, sadly I only own the german Sets, but if anyone has the US Sets and posts some Images include Infos from which episodes they are, I would provide the german ones ;)

[pannoni1]

About the german Quality:

We could still compare the german Sets with the US Lionsgate Sets, sadly I only own the german Sets, but if anyone has the US Sets and posts some Images include Infos from which episodes they are, I would provide the german ones ;)

Check out the screencaps thread, as tone-master has posted some high-quality DVD images that are good for comparison. Many members have the episode scene in mind as well. You can clearly see some wear/faded color on many of these pictures as a result of dust/friction on the tape masters. I feel that the Laserdisc version maybe of higher quality since those were optical and pressed when the master tapes were still fresh.

http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=9523&page=151 This page has "Krangenstein Lives" and "Turtle Tracks" included.

[Drose18]

I have the US dvds the quality is what you would expect, full screen but a little stretched. Fun fact! On the volume four dvd it says they do kung fu instead of ninjitsu!

[saul]

Here's some comparisons from the 1st episode.
I don't have the American DVD's from season 2 and 3.

Of course, this isn't the same as seeing it in motion. When watching it, the German version is smoother, with the solid colors looking more solid and smooth, rather than grainy as the US one does.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43402383@N04/7411725008

http://flic.kr/p/chX2LL

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43402383@N04/7411725008/
http://flic.kr/p/chX2LL

[saul]

2976

2977

I can't seem to display the images here. Sorry about that.

[pferreira]

All we need now is for someone to find out who did the UK 20th Anniversary set and how it compares to the KSM and US DVD sets. However I have a feeling that the UK DVDs are ports from the KSM release of Box 1 probably because they're Region 2 already so easier to copy.

[hudemx]

All we need now is for someone to find out who did the UK 20th Anniversary set and how it compares to the KSM and US DVD sets. However I have a feeling that the UK DVDs are ports from the KSM release of Box 1 probably because they're Region 2 already so easier to copy.

I can tell you that they used the LionsGate Version and "PAL"ed it themselves and not the KSM Port ;)

Alright: Here are som Screens from the "English Track" on the german DVDs of Turtle Tracks (Screenshots from the US Set from tone-master21)
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jlgb-6-1679.jpg
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jlgb-7-8f14.jpg
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jlgb-8-c9f0.jpg
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jlgb-9-45c4.jpg

[saul]

What program did you use to take those snap shots? The German version looks stretched vertically.

I'm playing my files with VLC and taking the snap shots with it too. It also looks like the resolution is higher, unless you're shrinking the pictures.

Here's my version of the Raph shot:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/43402383@N04/7415628254/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/43402383@N04/7415628254/

EDIT: I just noticed that this Flickr site is adding JPEG artifacts to the image that really aren't there in the original file.
How are you displaying the images? Are you uploading them to another site?

[hudemx]

What program did you use to take those snap shots?
I use Media Player Classic.
EDIT: I just noticed that this Flickr site is adding JPEG artifacts to the image that really aren't there in the original file.
How are you displaying the images? Are you uploading them to another site?
I use the german Site http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/ which uploads the Images just like they are ;)

[pferreira]

It's odd the UK got the US masters and not the KSM masters since it would have been easier to port the versions that are already in a Region 2 format. Judging my the screenshots and I do find it hard to tell but the KSM captures show slightly more colour and are slightly sharper, less fuzzy than the Lionsgate ones.

One of the problem with remastering Ninja Turtles episodes is that however well you do it at the end of the day it depends on the original source material. The animation in Ninja Turtles was never consistant. Season 3 had about four different animation companies working on those episodes so even the best standards set by KSM aren't going to look great when we have episodes that upon the original broadcast had dull colours, off key animation and a picture roughness. Take a look at episodes like Mean Machines, Mutagen Monster and 20,000 Leaks Under the Sea as well as a lot of the European Vacation episodes.

[PizzaPower]

while you guys in Germany might have got better picture for the DVDs im just happy they released that at all :)

[saul]

I just got another DVD in the mail, and decided to do a screen cap comparison of Plan 6 From Outerspace... especially since it was released twice in North America.

http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/thumbs/jor2-2-c81e.png (http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/jor2-2-c81e-png.html)

As you can see, the German version is larger and smoother. Of course a still image isn't the same as watching it in motion. When watching the North American versions the layer of grain/artifacts is more apparent.

[oldmanwinters]

Oh well, maybe us poor deprived Americans can get the best transfer on the inevitable re-release. :ohwell:

[gobo]

Only skimmed over Box 1 so far. The PAL speed-up makes everyone sound like they've been inhaling helium.

[saul]

Only skimmed over Box 1 so far. The PAL speed-up makes everyone sound like they've been inhaling helium.

The pitch change is easily solved with this program called "ReClock": http://www.videohelp.com/tools/ReClock-Directshow-Filter

What I did is I ripped the .VOB files to my computer, and I play them through Media Play Classic. With ReClock installed, it asks me if I want to adjust the sound/frames. Sounds great and looks great.

I really can't imagine us getting a higher quality version of the show unless they re-do it for BluRay. Not that I'm getting my hopes up for that.

I'm considering re-selling my DVD's now that I have backups. If any of you guys would like Box 1 and 3 without paying for expensive german shipping charges and exchange rates, let me know.

[Luke795]

Do the Germany dvds have any bonus features like interviews? What is the difference between the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Box 1 3 DVD set and Box 1 5 DVD set?

[gobo]

O_O There's a 5-disc S1 set? :x

[Luke795]

O_O There's a 5-disc S1 set? :x

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles - Box 1 (5 DVDs)
http://www.amazon.de/Teenage-Mutant-Ninja-Turtles-DVDs/dp/B001NOY9D6/ref=sr_1_11?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1342338819&sr=1-11


Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles - Box 1 (Episoden 1-25) [3 DVDs]
http://www.amazon.de/Teenage-Mutant-Ninja-Turtles-Episoden/dp/B005EJIIQU/ref=sr_1_2?s=dvd&ie=UTF8&qid=1342338819&sr=1-2

[hudemx]

There's no difference (don't be angry gobo)

It's all the same, excapt the fact that instead of 5 Disks, there are now only 3.
I compaired the Quality months ago on a german DVD Board: It's the same.

KSM is well known in Germany for rereleasing DVD Boxsets in smaller Sets but still put out the best Quality.

[gobo]

So, it's not a lower bitrate then? Relief! ^_^

[saul]

Is there a way to prove that the bit rate and quality is the same between the 3 disk set and the 5 disk version of season 1?

I noticed that the files I ripped from my 3 disc season 1 "Box 1" set were all about 433MB, whereas my "Box 3" set was about 950MB and noticeably better quality with less artifacts.

What is the file size of the 5 disc version episodes? Do you know? Are there screen caps?

[Newton Gimmick]

Yeah those transfers look cleaner on the German DVDs. Not a huge deal, but a shame that foreign DVDs are slightly sharper.

[pferreira]

Yeah those transfers look cleaner on the German DVDs. Not a huge deal, but a shame that foreign DVDs are slightly sharper.Yeah but it's still in English. ;)

[saul]

Found a good image from one of the best eps, The Big Blow Out, that shows the "grain" on the North American release:

http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jor2-4-a87f.png

EDIT: more German DVD pics from Leatherhead ep in this thread: http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=9523&page=203

[oldmanwinters]

The German Technodrome; it's... so clear... so BIG... I wants it!:tmad:

[GodzFire]

What do you expect? Lionsgate didn't do 1 ounce of cleanup or remastering for the release, they just took whatever crap they had for the source and released it. It's really pathetic.

[gobo]

Is there a way to prove that the bit rate and quality is the same between the 3 disk set and the 5 disk version of season 1?

I noticed that the files I ripped from my 3 disc season 1 "Box 1" set were all about 433MB, whereas my "Box 3" set was about 950MB and noticeably better quality with less artifacts.

What is the file size of the 5 disc version episodes? Do you know? Are there screen caps?
I have a sneaking suspicion that the 5-disc set does have larger filesizes. The only way to be certain is to have someone who has it to verify for you. I got the 3-disc as well. Originally, I thought this 'PAL speed-up' phenomenon was causing the eps to sound chipmunky. But, in my marathoning, I'm noticing that ep 1 was the correct pace. The other four eps of season one are a minute short, however.

More info on that as I get to it...

[Jester]

gobo, do you have individual releases of the 1st 4 episodes that were released with the 25th Anniversary TMNT?

[gobo]

No. Why do you ask?

[Jester]

Just wondering if the quality of those are any better than the regular season 1 release. I may have to check myself. :D

[gobo]

Well, this video editing sure is a pain in the shell. I set my output to MPEG-2, stretched it to the length of the corresponding ep on the R1 disc, and the output still came out crappy. It was jagged. The pitch of the audio didn't shift back down. And, the A/V sync was WAY off. :evil: So not happy. >_<

[saul]

gobo -- what's this video editing you're doing?

I've ordered the 5-disc set, so I'll be able to compare soon here.
Oh, and the great thing about this "reclock" program is each time I open a file with Media Player Classic it asks me if I want to adjust it. So if an ep sounds fine I just let it be, and if it sounds too sped-up I enable the reclocking.

Eventually I'll probably use some video editor to put these high-quality german eps on a blu-ray set for my personal use. Something like this:

http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jor2-9-45c4.png

[gobo]

Eventually I'll probably use some video editor to put these high-quality german eps on a blu-ray set for my personal use.
Pretty much what I'm trying to do. But, since it would be more convenient to play 'em on the projector via laptop with this 'reclock' you mentioned (to save me time on my über-marathon (http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=36359) I'm attempting to get finished by Nick's premiere) I think I'll work the kinks out of that process some other time. I'm thinking it's a simple case of trying to make too many changes in one render. I always figured a VOB was just a renamed MPEG-2, but I figuure that's where I messed up. VOBs can contain subtitle streams. I'm all but certain an MPEG-2 can't.

[saul]

So I finally got the 5-disc version of Box #1... and here's a comparison shot:

German 3-disc VS German 5-disc:
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jor2-a-d3d9.png

As you can see there is more artifacting (like JPEG "noise") on the 3-disc version. The 5-disc set files are around 780MB whereas the 3-disc are around 440MB average. I'd still have to recommend the 3-disc German version over the North American release.

Season 1, ep 1, German VS NTSC:
http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jor2-b-6512.png

If anyone wants the German Box sets (all of season 1-3 + European Vacation), send me a PM.

[oldmanwinters]

gobo -- what's this video editing you're doing?

I've ordered the 5-disc set, so I'll be able to compare soon here.
Oh, and the great thing about this "reclock" program is each time I open a file with Media Player Classic it asks me if I want to adjust it. So if an ep sounds fine I just let it be, and if it sounds too sped-up I enable the reclocking.

Eventually I'll probably use some video editor to put these high-quality german eps on a blu-ray set for my personal use. Something like this:

http://www.bilder-hochladen.net/files/big/jor2-9-45c4.png

lol, nice job.

VHS hi-fi Blu-Ray disc! The latest and greatest video format!

[gobo]

So I finally got the 5-disc version of Box #1
What's the filesize difference, Saul? And, are eps 2 and beyond their appropriate durations?

[saul]

What's the filesize difference, Saul? And, are eps 2 and beyond their appropriate durations?

The 5-disc set files are around 780MB whereas the 3-disc are around 440MB average. So it's about a 340MB difference.
And I just gave it a quick look, but it sounds like ep 2 and beyond are all PAL-sped up, and sound about a semi-tone higher.

[Luke795]

How many episodes are on each disc of the 3 disc box set?

[Lance_Steele]

I am currently in Germany and I would like to know which store can u find the set. Saturn or Mediamarkt?

[hudemx]

I am currently in Germany and I would like to know which store can u find the set. Saturn or Mediamarkt?

Both should have them - how long are you in Germany? Maybe you have to order them if they're not in Stock...

[AleXviD]

Guys, where can I find episode list of German releases? I already have R1's Seasons 1-3 and don't really feel like double dip.

[Lance_Steele]

7 years.

I just might do so.

[gobo]

How many episodes are on each disc of the 3 disc box set?
ATM, the only 3-disc version I'm aware of is Box 1. It has 9 uncut English and 9 edited German eps on disc one. There are 8 each on the other two. All dual-layer discs...

[gobo]

Tried watching the German DVDs with Reclock the other day. Didn't do a lick a good. :ohwell:

[bwwd]

Hi guys does anyone have this set of 22 DVDs? Its german gesamt edition and Id like to buy it if resolution is bigger than 640x480, is it pal 720x576? Does anyone have this set and some info about its quality and resolution ?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Teenage-Mutant-Turtles-Gesamt-Paulsen/dp/B01I08HU1U

https://images-eu.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61TEjvD9eZL._SR600%2C315_PIWhiteStrip%2CBottomLeft %2C0%2C35_PIStarRatingFIVE%2CBottomLeft%2C360%2C-6_SR600%2C315_SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg

[pferreira]

Hi guys does anyone have this set of 22 DVDs? Its german gesamt edition and Id like to buy it if resolution is bigger than 640x480, is it pal 720x576? Does anyone have this set and some info about its quality and resolution ? This is an import mate, no BBFC logos. It's most probably a repackage of KSM's DVDs from some years ago this thread refers to. In other words good quality compared to the US ones.