Canon vs. Fanon

[Bossa Nova]

The last thread I found on this was from 2009, unless there's some huge thread discussing this that I just stupidly missed somehow through my search. Anyway.

I'm not entirely well versed in the community aspect of the TMNT fandom, and I'm especially interested in the areas of where canon meets fanon. As a fanfic reader/writer, it occurred to me that some elements I read from one story to the next may actually just be well known fanon ideas, as opposed to actual canon information, and I would have no way of knowing.

So I'd really like to discuss any popular fanon ideas there may be out there floating around aboutthe turtles, common cliches that have popped up so many times that they're pretty much expected, or anything of that sort. I know in many other fandoms this is pretty usual, yet I'm curious about it as I don't seem to have stumbled upon as much of that sort of thing when it comes to the TMNT (or maybe I have and just haven't realized it).

[gobo]

Canon vs. Fanon
Ganon could crush them both. :trazz:

[Mondo Geeko]

Does people injecting themselves into the story as a 5th mutant turtle count?

I guess that's more of a trope.

[Roseangelo]

I rather dislike how people have taken to giving them all the surname Hamato.

[sdp]

Well the community isn't big enough and too divided for there to be a lot of fanon sadly, however there is indeed some fanon out there.

TMNT Vol.3 (Image) it's basically fanon that this volume is in continuity with the Mirage comics most fans agree or seem to be fine with this idea, two fan made comics with people and ideas who worked on the image series were made to bridge the story of Vol.4 with Vol.3.

Lotus Blossom in the OT is considered to be Karai in the OT, this isn't widely accepted but more than a few of us have expressed this idea. Karai being created before and her origin only being similar to the 2k3 version of Karai seems to detract more people from thinking she is.

Those are the only ones I can think of at the moment.

[Bossa Nova]

I rather dislike how people have taken to giving them all the surname Hamato.

May I ask why? I admit, this is actually one of the few things I did realize to be fanon (thanks for the reminder!), and I personally think it's rather cute :tsmile: Will probably use it myself for my own work.

[oldmanwinters]

I rather dislike how people have taken to giving them all the surname Hamato.

Didn't they introduce that idea in the 4Kids cartoon?

I'm all for the "family" element to the dynamic, but I always thought that was taking the bond a little too far. It feels like I'm getting beat over the head to be reminded that the Turtles & Splinter are "family."

[Roseangelo]

Didn't they introduce that idea in the 4Kids cartoon?

I'm all for the "family" element to the dynamic, but I always thought that was taking the bond a little too far. It feels like I'm getting beat over the head to be reminded that the Turtles & Splinter are "family."

I don't recall it specifically being part of the 4Kids series, but it's possible it showed up somewhere official once or twice.

Oh, now that I think about it, was there an episode where Don wrote a letter and used Hamato on it? Maybe in Fast Forward?

Anywho, your reasons are pretty much the same as mine. They got along just fine without a last name for plenty long; no need to introduce one now.

[gobo]

All four turtles were announced at the Battle Nexus as etc Hamato. I agree that this just isn't enough to make it worth pseudonyming yourself "whatever Hamato", but it's trendy for fanficcers.

[ToTheNines]

Oh, now that I think about it, was there an episode where Don wrote a letter and used Hamato on it? Maybe in Fast Forward?

Donny wrote a letter to Michelangelo Splinterson in FF.

That bugged me big time, awesome as "Timing is Everything" was.

[Roseangelo]

Donny wrote a letter to Michelangelo Splinterson in FF.

That bugged me big time, awesome as "Timing is Everything" was.

Ah, you're right. That's even worse. Otherwise it was the best FF episode.

[Jester]

I still hold DNA is Thicker Than Water as the best....:P

[gobo]

I still hold DNA is Thicker Than Water as the best....:P
Why? Just because it was? You need a better excuse than that. ;)

[Genesis]

I rather dislike how people have taken to giving them all the surname Hamato.I rather disagree. "Hamato Leonardo" shuld only be called such by people who actually know Splinter's... shall we say, lineage, such as the Battle Nexus daimyo. I don't think it should be excessively referred to, but I like it being their "legal" names.

[Powder]

Disagreeing with someones personal opinion... doesn't work.

[ZariusTwo]

Fanon ideas are now starting to gain a little traction, particulary with people reassociating themselves with the OT due to the DVDs etc. Fanfics are emerging which try to somewhat justify the canocity of Turtles Forever (which has a bit of a "Forever Red"-esque reputation when it comes to continuity) and plug the gaps between season ten and that. The 'shipping of Donatello/April seems to have spun off into a canocial thing for the new Nick show too (though it thankfully seems to be one-sided)

[BubblyShell22]

I like their last name being Hamato as it gives them a family dynamic. I just figure that maybe Splinter would give them that last name since it's a family name. I always refer to them as the Hamato clan in my stories and will continue to do so because I enjoy the idea of it. It's okay if you don't like it though.

Another fanon idea is that Leo can't cook to save his life. I've seen this in many stories.

Mikey is an emo baby. I've seen this too many times to count. Authors make Mikey seem "weak" and "abused" just because he's the youngest of the four. Nothing could be further from the truth. Mikey is a capable fighter, but sadly authors tend to forget that.

Don is the doctor of the group. Yes, I've been guilty of using this myself, and it seems to be a common theme. I would think that all of them would have some medical knowledge at one point or another.

Raph and Leo hate each other. Another thing that ticks me off to no end as we've seen that Leo and Raph really do care for each other in many ways.

[Genesis]

Disagreeing with someones personal opinion... doesn't work.Oh, you know what I meant, silly Powder man.

[pannoni1]

I've seen people consider TNM as Fanon to the first three movies given that it continues the live action universe and that Shredder remains a joke in East vs. West like he was in SOTO. I feel like that universe has the most potential to grow in terms of fanfics since we had a second season of TNM cancelled and perhaps have Karai and the return of Shredder brought back since it never appeared that Shredder fully passed away in the live action multiverse.

The "88" Turtles in Turtles Forever I feel is simply fanon since it doesn't use the original production company but can take place in several portions of the series, most likely Season 3 or perhaps after Season 10 since it was always possible that Shredder, Krang, Bebop, and Rocksteady were still alive and the Channel 6 building was rebuilt.

The OT has lots of portions of the series where many fans have presumed that certain episodes take place before/after a different episode than the order that is indicated on most sites, most notably the European Vacation episodes. They are only considered fanon though since it is not exactly clear or official when the events actually take place (any time after Plan 6 From Outer Space and before White Belt, Black Heart). You can say the same with "Leonardo is Missing", airing after "Rock Around the Block", yet unrecognized as canon.

Tales of the TMNT and Micro-series are usually considered Fanon with their main counterparts, but are still cannon within the interseries themselves, since they are separate from the main title yet still contain a "fan continuity" as shown on this forum. You can say the same with any specials or guest appearances in other comics, such as Usagi Yojimbo.

The bottom line is that the creators and crew determine the canon as they are released or announced, while us fans create the fanon.

[Venom]

Mezcaal, Raph's wife in the Future Turtle Archie comics, was thought to be Ninjara's either granddaughter or greatgranddaughter.

[CyberCubed]

Many see both the Next Mutation and the 4th movie as loose continuations of the original movie trilogy.

[Killer Moth]

I rather disagree. "Hamato Leonardo" shuld only be called such by people who actually know Splinter's... shall we say, lineage, such as the Battle Nexus daimyo. I don't think it should be excessively referred to, but I like it being their "legal" names.

I'm not opposed to Hamato as a surname for the Turtles if a fan goes there. Mirage Yoshi needs any acknowledgement he can get (after all, his death propels the whole story). And yet, for personal preference, it's simpler and easier to go only one name, because the Turtles are unique from usual convention. Or, "I like my Turtles with only one name, like Cher or Prince." Not the best defense, but it's the only time I'll make such a connection. Forgive me, but I must take it.

It's easier to pore over such details, as we now can do that with the rise of the internet. If a given show doesn't share necessary details for whatever reason, it's up to the fans. On the other hand, As I had linked to that El Goonish Shive strip, ranting about the Force's midi-chlordians, several weeks ago -- it answered a question no one asked. Although, that strip was about a canon explanation, as opposed to a fanon explanation (which when rejected in canon, that's called Jossed, I believe).

It also depends on what the fanon is, as we saw what happened with Rat King. Could we do any worse than what Mirage ulimately devised? Which is why I tend to go with, "ignore stupid canon." But, hey, his 2003 origin was pretty cool.

It's a good topic -- I must think more on this.

[Genesis]

I tend to go with, "ignore stupid canon."Typically the safest way to go for the sake of your sanity.

[Logan]

Splinter being more than an ordinary rat could be considered fanon, since the idea was never inked on paper by PL.

[gobo]

Aside from him mimicing Ninjutsu from his cage, right? :P

[Logan]

Aside from him mimicing Ninjutsu from his cage, right? :P

The unwritten story was supposed to explain that, if I recall what Andrew said correctly.

[Candy Kappa]

Splinter being more than an ordinary rat could be considered fanon, since the idea was never inked on paper by PL.

It's in the RPG in Splinter's bio, so it's more expanded universe then fanon, similar to the expanded universe to the star wars movie.

It just didn't go anywhere.

Fanon would be if someone playing the game and later makes a short story featuring what makes Splinter unique.

[Loudo]

I don't like the Turtles using "Hamato" as their surname, because I don't think it makes sense for Splinter to consider Yoshi his father.

Hamato Yoshi never considered Splinter to be his son, because he died before Splinter's mutation.
And why would Splinter call Yoshi father? He was his owner, yes. His master, yes. But his father? I think it's stretching it.

I like Splinterson a lot more. Because the Turtles do consider Splinter to be their father. I think it's only logical for them to choose a surname that symbolizes that bond.

Anyway, since the Turtles don't have ID cards and are outcasts, I think they should only use their surname (whatever it is) when it is necessary.
Donatello making up a surname when he needs to send a letter makes sense. The Turtles constantly referring to themself as "Hamato Leonardo" and so on (like I read in some fanfictions) is just annoying and out of character.

(Of course, in continuities where Splinter is Yoshi, Hamato as the Turtles' surname is perfectly fine.)

[Powder]

...Splinterson? Yeah, you do read fanfiction.

Many people think of their pets as children of sorts, and I imagine if animals are far more mentally competant than we know, they may very well see us as surrogate parents. As caretakers who love & provide for them, that's basically what we are, anyway. So Splinter taking the hamato name is not far-fetched.

[Loudo]

...Splinterson? Yeah, you do read fanfiction.
Actually, as it was said above, Slinterson is used in the 2003 cartoon. I didn't read any fanfiction that used Splinterson.

[Allio]

Fanon I liked... The 87 turtles were taken out for Turtles Forever between season 7 and 8, so that way the more serious turtles kind of rubbed off on the turtles and cause them to be more serious in the red sky

my head canon

Dimension X is the turtle universe where the turtles were never born