TMNT #14. Preview/Discussion

[AlZarkovski]

Preview here (http://www.comicsalliance.com/2012/09/24/teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-14-preview/).

Only 7 pages, but... WOW!!!:o

I can't wait! I REALLY CAN'T WAIT!!!!

[ToTheNines]

Kuhn's getting worse by the issue, but both story lines have my full attention. I'll be speeding to the comic shop after work Wednesday for sure.

[MikeandRaph87]

I like what I see so far.It surprises me Krang is willinjg to reveal his origin to Baxter Stockman along with his mission.It makes me wonder though if it will end,"If I tell you I will kill you!"? Who knew an evil being like Krang had a family!:teek:

[Gyt Kaliba]

Kuhn's getting worse by the issue

I'm not the best judge of US comic art as I barely ever read them, but looking at these pages, I can agree. This is the first time I've seen the new artist's work, and I can't say I'm a fan of it, gah. It doesn't seem to mesh well with the previous artist's art style at all, and some of those facial expressions...good lord.:lol:

That said, continuing to read the story tidbits is fun, I'm still liking where that department of IDW is taking this.

[Heather Breckel]

Looking forward to the whole thing! I disagree on Kuhn, I like his blocky work and dramatic blacks. Raph looks odd on the "You..You have?" panel, but I like the rest. I really like the watercolor texturing on the Krang flashback.

[Raph's Girl]

*sings* Utrominon... dodo dododo.. :lol:

[corvus]

Kuhns art reminds me of old Hell boy comics. For that reason I love it. Has a nostalgic feeling to it. And krang is lying about his origin at least part of it.

[Zulithe]

Issue looks good! The pages showing the origin look particularly good.

P.S. Please hire Ross Campbell as the full-time artist for TMNT :p pay him whatever it takes!

[marcelangelo]

Looking forward to the whole thing! I disagree on Kuhn, I like his blocky work and dramatic blacks. Raph looks odd on the "You..You have?" panel, but I like the rest. I really like the watercolor texturing on the Krang flashback.

I agree very much on this!..I know you cant argue about taste...but it still makes me feel so bad if I read complains of that type about this art work...I love his take on it...maybe because he makes the turtles look different...somehow monstrous so that they even subconsciously feel to be strangers in this world...
I can only say I REALLY LIKE his work.
peace

[marcelangelo]

Kuhns art reminds me of old Hell boy comics. For that reason I love it. Has a nostalgic feeling to it. And krang is lying about his origin at least part of it.

yeah I thought about that in my comment above, too...;)

[Donnie]

I don't know. It seems cool, but just another issue. I guess we'll see on Wednesday. I'm getting a little tired of the Splinter lectures, because he is (on each occasion) saying the same thing in different ways. We get his point of view, we fully got it in his Micro. I don't know, it almost seems like a waste of space.

And concerning Splinter, we know he's not going to do it. Utrominon? Really?

[thelouisguy]

Utrominon? Really? I don't want to be mean but that is almost as bad as unobtainium (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unobtainium).

I guess it is better that just calling it The Utrom Homeworld (http://tmnt.wikia.com/wiki/Utrom_homeworld), but it just feels lazy. Sorry guys, I want to love it.

[Plasticplayhouse]

Kuhn's getting worse by the issue, but both story lines have my full attention. I'll be speeding to the comic shop after work Wednesday for sure.

worse...no. same, yes. i agree it does have a bit of that hellboy feeling...hellturtle :P i admit that i do enjoy kuhn's art. i enjoy some other artist's tmnt renditions better, but i like it none the less. it's different than any other tmnt art out there. smooth crisp lines, heavy over indulgent blacks, blocky renderings, overly symmetrical renderings...i find it all appealing for different reasons.

the story sounds appealing.

[frank_one]

The same old story about the once greatest warriors of the universe, their blown-up planet and the son of their leader who somehow survived with few other companions. IDW, I'm.. unimpressed. Utrominon :tconfuse:

[Toby Barrett]

So so so looking forward to Ben Bates taking on the artist duties... only two more issues after this...

[n-zero]

Why are there nipples on Krang's robot body?

[Matches Malone]

Why are there nipples on Krang's robot body?

We've traded Michael Bay in for Joel Schumacher!!!

Actually, I think those are just unfortunately placed screws... You twist those babies and Krang's body will just be unable to put up a fight to whatever's coming!

...There must have been a better way to say that.

[CyberCubed]

Honestly only Raph looks hideous, everyone else looks fine.

As for Krang my worst fears have come true. He is basically Ch'rell in this universe.

[Toby Barrett]

As opposed to being what? A long suffering, jewish mother?

[CyberCubed]

As opposed to being what? A long suffering, jewish mother?

Krang and Ch'rell are two different characters. This makes them too similar.

One is an evil alien disembodied brain from Dimension X who was exiled to Earth. The other is an evil alien Utrom brain who was exiled from his home world and then took over the mantle of Shredder.

Now look at them...they had completely different back stories.

[Andrew NDB]

Kuhns art reminds me of old Hell boy comics. For that reason I love it. Has a nostalgic feeling to it. And krang is lying about his origin at least part of it.

I kind of get a Poor Man's Mignola from Kuhn's work as well, sure. His pencils don't look too bad to my eyes, though, honestly, so I'm still wondering if he's just a dodgy inker.

[Andrew NDB]

Krang and Ch'rell are two different characters. This makes them too similar.

One is an evil alien disembodied brain from Dimension X who was exiled to Earth. The other is an evil alien Utrom brain who was exiled from his home world and then took over the mantle of Shredder.

Now look at them...they had completely different back stories.

I actually applaud IDW for this. Of course Krang should be an Utrom.

And we've been over this before, Ch'rell and Krang are pretty damn similar on paper. Breaking it down, both characters were:

* Exiled from their respective alien worlds.
* Aliens that resemble brains.
* Warlords from their home turf.
* Inhabiting a humanoid-like android body to get around.

[Cowabunga Carl]

Andrew sometimes trying to reason with people is impossible.

[CyberCubed]

I actually applaud IDW for this. Of course Krang should be an Utrom.

And we've been over this before, Ch'rell and Krang are pretty damn similar on paper. Breaking it down, both characters were:

* Exiled from their respective alien worlds.
* Aliens that resemble brains.
* Warlords from their home turf.
* Inhabiting a humanoid-like android body to get around.

And Ch'rell became Shredder, whereas Krang only temporarily took over Shredder's body in Archie.

But yes they are similar, throws a monkey wrench in the idea that Krang could have his own biological body though if other Utroms don't have one. I like the idea of Krang growing himself a body with the mutagen though.

[Venom]

It's a bit odd seeing the Oots diminished to a scant few in stasis - quite the departure from traditional lore!

The only thing that irks me is seeing Splinter holding the sai as if it were an edged blade. I'm chalking it up to dramatic effect.

Still, it would be nice to see Raph (or anyone wielding a sai) use the weapon correctly.

[Cowabunga Carl]

I'm looking forward to this issue. See how this gets wrapped up so we can get into the Slash story

[Lampy]

to splinter: DO IT!!!:x
to krang: YOU TOLD HIM?!:o
to stockman: DON'T BELIEVE HIM!!!:ohwell:
to idw: YOU DID IT!!!! I'M SO HAPPY!!!:D

[Candy Kappa]

The only thing that irks me is seeing Splinter holding the sai as if it were an edged blade. I'm chalking it up to dramatic effect.

Still, it would be nice to see Raph (or anyone wielding a sai) use the weapon correctly.

yeah, seems like it is few that know how a Sai works

[sykosis]

Kuhn's getting worse by the issue, but both story lines have my full attention.

I kind of agree but I'm excited. I started this comic series late so I have the collections, volume one, volume two and the micro-series'. I am unsure if I want to buy the comics individually now or wait until volume three to be released. Decisions decisions..

[Candy Kappa]

I like Kuhn's art

[sykosis]

yeah, seems like it is few that know how a Sai works

you stick em with the pointy end, right?

[Lampy]

you stick em with the pointy end, right?

farming tools... aren't they primarily used for disarming other weapons?

[Plasticplayhouse]

The only thing that irks me is seeing Splinter holding the sai as if it were an edged blade. I'm chalking it up to dramatic effect.

Still, it would be nice to see Raph (or anyone wielding a sai) use the weapon correctly.

i didnt see it like that. i assumed splinter has the sai poised to stab the throat with the yoku (side prong) and then use it to pull/rip out his esophagus.

[Lampy]

did anyone else notice how HUGE a transformation splinter went through in this preview? it's as if he's a whole different splinter. stricter... edgier.. more sure. i guess going one-on-one with shredder really does that to you...

[Matches Malone]

I sure hope Krang didn't just "forget" that he promised Baxter he would kill him if he failed him, which he has. Reading month to month makes these lingering questions seem to take forever even though I know they'll probably be addressed!

I do think it's interesting that Krang's backstory makes him somewhat more sympathetic, seemingly looking out for his own kind before tragedy struck. Then again, he did the same to the Neutrinos, so...

did anyone else notice how HUGE a transformation splinter went through in this preview? it's as if he's a whole different splinter. stricter... edgier.. more sure. i guess going one-on-one with shredder really does that to you...

The Splinter micro was definitely a game changer. No doubt his decision to kill The Shredder will be a very important plot point this year.

[Venom]

God, I hope the Triceratons are the reason Utrominon was destroyed! Bring on the trike troops!

[Venom]

i didnt see it like that. i assumed splinter has the sai poised to stab the throat with the yoku (side prong) and then use it to pull/rip out his esophagus.

Oh! Nice! I can see that now; good job explaining that for me. :)

did anyone else notice how HUGE a transformation splinter went through in this preview? it's as if he's a whole different splinter. stricter... edgier.. more sure. i guess going one-on-one with shredder really does that to you...

Or, he's making a point to Raphael that he knows will sink in. He's teaching Raph a lesson by getting on his level and relating to his son - the very son who has been estranged for the past year.

[FoxZerro]

yeah, seems like it is few that know how a Sai works

Including perhaps Casey's father. It shows true mastery of the weapon by Splinter if he is using it to inflict fear and intimidation into his enemy by using it in a way that would frighten them.

Those of us that know the baton isn't sharp know that Splinter doesn't have Casey's dad in real harm, but put yourself in the shoes of the drunk and tell me he's not scared straight by the action.

i didnt see it like that. i assumed splinter has the sai poised to stab the throat with the yoku (side prong) and then use it to pull/rip out his esophagus.

On the other hand, gruesome and awesome thought. Too gruesome for IDW though. If they had to obscure the shot of Honeycutt burnt to death then I doubt this amazingly described moment would happen.

[funatic]

Raph looks odd on the "You..You have?" panel

Raph in that panel: http://knowyourmeme.com/photos/210403

[Venom]

On the other hand, gruesome and awesome thought. Too gruesome for IDW though. If they had to obscure the shot of Honeycutt burnt to death then I doubt this amazingly described moment would happen.

Not necessarily; the action could be implied, leaving the interpretation open to us to scrutinze - much like we are now. :tsmile:

[Candy Kappa]

Including perhaps Casey's father. It shows true mastery of the weapon by Splinter if he is using it to inflict fear and intimidation into his enemy by using it in a way that would frighten them.

Those of us that know the baton isn't sharp know that Splinter doesn't have Casey's dad in real harm, but put yourself in the shoes of the drunk and tell me he's not scared straight by the action.

Maybe, but the TMNT franchise like many comic franchises have little experience with proper use of Sai, often protraiting it as a glorified dagger.

I'll remain a skeptic and might be positively surprised later.

[Lampy]

Or, he's making a point to Raphael that he knows will sink in. He's teaching Raph a lesson by getting on his level and relating to his son - the very son who has been estranged for the past year.

yea i see that now. normally... i don't read the previews. but i couldn't resist. i like your explanation and it makes sense... especially knowing what splinter was like as a youngster. he just seems edgier than normal.

[FoxZerro]

Not necessarily; the action could be implied, leaving the interpretation open to us to scrutinze - much like we are now. :tsmile:

This I could get behind, violence offscreen is always better. Like an 80's monster movie you get to determine how gruesome it actually is. In that case I am totally on board for Splinter ripping out Casey's dad's throat

Maybe, but the TMNT franchise like many comic franchises have little experience with proper use of Sai, often protraiting it as a glorified dagger.

I'll remain a skeptic and might be positively surprised later.

Agreed that proper Sai usage in comics is lacking. I was just trying to give Splinter the benefit of the doubt before I read the comic and see his actual intent.

[BAXTER STOCKMAN 19]

I just finished reading it. It was very intresting and now i am even more excited for next issue! Krang tells stockman his story and while he was talking to stockman the Nutrinos rebels attack and try to kill him! But Krang and his stone warriors kill them all! :D:D Krang wins agains!!!:D Then he told Stockman that he will give him another chance . He told him to work on the techndrome and that if he does his work right then he will let him live. After that we see the turtles and splinter talking about the Shredder. At the end of the issue Shredders tells to Karai that he decided who will replace her.... Leonardo!!! And he sents her ro kidnapp Leonardo and bring him to him!!!

[rx781a]

i just got it on my iphone and .....wow!(still dont really care for the art but i dont want to dwell on that) the krang story is getting better and i think that this is one of the smartest comics out there today. when splinter and raph were struggling with to choice of wether or not to kill mr. jones(the d-bag) i was truly moved. being as im in the military i have had to make that choice a few times and having to deal with the consequences . IDW has truly made TMNT mature. every issues script is thought provoking and feels like the real world.

buy this now if you can.

oh and please make ross the new ongoing artist.......please???

[MikeandRaph87]

I'm impressed at how IDW caters to all camps those that like it gritty and those who don't.Also, the combined characters and plots weaved together so perfectly. I was skeptical of this five issues in,but after that its been the best read of every month.The Leonardo recruitment being 2003 cartoon callback though that was before they ever fought Shredder.This time they know what he is about. It seems to make it very hard to pull off but IDW has surprised me above and beyond so it should only serve to work well.

What I want to know is when will the next oneshots be announced?

[CyberCubed]

I agree the story is getting really good.

Tom Waltz is doing a wonderful job incorporating elements from the cartoons into the comics.

I just wonder what fate Baxter will have....cyborg or mutant fly?

[Desslok]

Krang was completely remorseless in the way he handled the Neutrino attackers, it was quite impressive. Should be very interesting when the turtles finally confront him.

And, is it just me or did those two look like Dask and Zak? :tgrin:

[TurtleMaster4]

I'm pretty much am a anti kuhn ninja turtles art fan, but i defiantly love how he does his humans, krang, and utroms, they look pretty good! But i think he'd be best off with a human only comic, and he'd do great!

Also, i like how they introduced the utroms, but i REALLY REALLY want some peaceful utroms, I was introduced threw the 2k3's and that's like nostalgia for me! Especially those guardians.

This comic is defiantly on my buy list!

[Matches Malone]

Good stuff. One of the best issues in the ongoing in a while. They are definitely doing a good job with the Krang storyline, and seeing him take out those neutrinos without dancing around the violence was refreshing for the series.

I still think the technodrome and neutrinos look a little goofy, but the writing revolving them has been solid, so I guess I'll be happy it's not the other way around.

The Raph/Splinter storyline was a little forced, but it definitely worked for the most part. Casey moving in with the turtles is new and interesting idea, though kind of inconsiderate for Splinter to invite him to stay at April's place. Do they even pay rent?? Maybe they ought to be called the Teenage Moocher Ninja Turtles from now on..

I also love the idea of Shredder enlisting Leonardo. Though I somehow doubt it, I think an actual team-up for whatever reason would be super cool. I actually had an idea for my own kind of TMNT storyline where Shredder and Leo begrudgingly team up, perhaps over the Japanese branch of the Foot attempting to defile the grave of Tang Shen which would piss both of them off (I guess that would work better in Mirage continuity where Saki finds Tang Shen more desirable), so kind of a funny timing and coincidence. TMNT ongoing is getting good!

[DrSpengler]

Here's my review of TMNT #14 at TMNT Entity. (http://tmntentity.blogspot.com/2012/09/tmnt-idw-14.html)

I can see why publishing Fugitoid before this one might have undercut a certain dramatic reveal, but that didn't make the page any less awesome.

I'm absolutely loving the revitalized "Fred Wolf-isms", particularly on Zak and Dask eating it. I hated those two like you wouldn't believe. This was better than Christmas.

Waltz and Eastman's architecture on this title is superb, as stuff that seemd weird a year ago are proving to have been meticulously plotted in advance. Great to see Shredder's true motive behind his convuluted "disguise" scheme, though I'm curious as to how he intends to lure Leo into his service. "Hey, remember when I killed you? Good times. Wanna work for me?"

Hopefully Shredder doesn't try to pull a Ra's Al Ghul and force Leo to marry Karai. That'd just be weird.

And kudos to Waltz for FINALLY giving the Utrom Homeworld a better/real name.

[Master Splinter]

Here's my review of TMNT #14 at TMNT Entity. (http://tmntentity.blogspot.com/2012/09/tmnt-idw-14.html)

I can see why publishing Fugitoid before this one might have undercut a certain dramatic reveal, but that didn't make the page any less awesome.

I'm absolutely loving the revitalized "Fred Wolf-isms", particularly on Zak and Dask eating it. I hated those two like you wouldn't believe. This was better than Christmas.

Waltz and Eastman's architecture on this title is superb, as stuff that seemd weird a year ago are proving to have been meticulously plotted in advance. Great to see Shredder's true motive behind his convuluted "disguise" scheme, though I'm curious as to how he intends to lure Leo into his service. "Hey, remember when I killed you? Good times. Wanna work for me?"

Hopefully Shredder doesn't try to pull a Ra's Al Ghul and force Leo to marry Karai. That'd just be weird.

And kudos to Waltz for FINALLY giving the Utrom Homeworld a better/real name.

Excellent review as always Doc.

-ms

[MikeandRaph87]

Here's my review of TMNT #14 at TMNT Entity. (http://tmntentity.blogspot.com/2012/09/tmnt-idw-14.html)

I can see why publishing Fugitoid before this one might have undercut a certain dramatic reveal, but that didn't make the page any less awesome.

I'm absolutely loving the revitalized "Fred Wolf-isms", particularly on Zak and Dask eating it. I hated those two like you wouldn't believe. This was better than Christmas.

Waltz and Eastman's architecture on this title is superb, as stuff that seemd weird a year ago are proving to have been meticulously plotted in advance. Great to see Shredder's true motive behind his convuluted "disguise" scheme, though I'm curious as to how he intends to lure Leo into his service. "Hey, remember when I killed you? Good times. Wanna work for me?"

Hopefully Shredder doesn't try to pull a Ra's Al Ghul and force Leo to marry Karai. That'd just be weird.

And kudos to Waltz for FINALLY giving the Utrom Homeworld a better/real name.

I remember it being said in the beginning a two year plan was laid out. So despite my begging Tom and gang on here for Slash they already had him figured into it as well as how the reincarnation thing was gonig to work and when Krang's plan would be revealed and how it would play into Turtles In Space or Turtles In Dimension X to be more accurate! I bet year three is planned out by now as well! Knowing how far Grant Morrison planned his Batman in advance and Geoff Johns his Green Lantern I am not surprised by the planning ahead of Tom,Kevin, and gang! I would love to see early drafts and see what might have changed as issues were putout!How about that for the last page of a future issue?

As for Dask and Zak biting it,they could always just be stunned!:twink: Though,I don't care either way. Now, if Zach and Carter were apart of a gang and happen to be killed by foot soldiers...Shadow too...I am ALL FOR IT!:evilgrin:

[CyberCubed]

I bet Kala will eventually show up reimagined as a "hot babe" and act as the Turtles guide when they eventually travel into space.

[Jester]

I'm absolutely loving the revitalized "Fred Wolf-isms", particularly on Zak and Dask eating it. I hated those two like you wouldn't believe. This was better than Christmas.
I'm sure I'll love this bit. I loathe the Neutrinos. When I watched the "How It All Began" edited movie cut of the part pilot, I was disappointed that the Baxter episode was cut, but not the Neutrino episode. What a gype!
And kudos to Waltz for FINALLY giving the Utrom Homeworld a better/real name.
Real name, maybe, better....not so much. Utrominon sounds too much like the fake Kryptonite in the Super Turtles episode (Utrominium. In fact at first I read it the same, before I you know...paid attention.)

[Andrew NDB]

I rather liked the issue on the whole.

About sais, I know they're traditionally just pronged, but in my head -- and this is probably because I've seen artists at times do this -- it's never seemed out of the question to imagine that Raph would have taken his sai and sharpened the sides of the three prongs to give them bladed sides. I mean, why not?

[CyberCubed]

I think the less screentime for the Turtles in this issue worked better.

Andy Kuhn literally draws everything well except for the Turtles. It's kinda funny actually.

[Powder]

Quite a solid issue. I too think the Utrom planet name is cheeseball but outside of that, no major complaints. The Neutrino cameos were wonderful, I was both glad to see them show up AND to see them perish! Haha. I do still feel it's a bit of an OT fanwank thing these days but I guess it's just a phase. I've realized they actually seem to be adding the stuff from other universes in sections. Started out with Mirage, then/now the OT, and they're headed towards 2k3 now with Angel, the 4kids Foot logo, & Saki wanting to make Leo his second hand. I wish they'd be better blended instead of dealt with in quarters, but it's still cool.

[Matches Malone]

I rather liked the issue on the whole.

About sais, I know they're traditionally just pronged, but in my head -- and this is probably because I've seen artists at times do this -- it's never seemed out of the question to imagine that Raph would have taken his sai and sharpened the sides of the three prongs to give them bladed sides. I mean, why not?

Part of me thinks this might come from how Eastman (and others that followed suit) likes to draw Raphael holding the sais in way that resembled Wolverine's claws, as Peter Laird has noted himself. At least for me, I think that's where you get the sense that all 3 are bladed.

The Neutrino cameos were wonderful, I was both glad to see them show up AND to see them perish! Haha. I do still feel it's a bit of an OT fanwank thing these days but I guess it's just a phase.

Not a huge deal, but when Bobby/Waltz would defend their decisions to incorporate the Fred Wolf stuff, they say a lot of that material had wasted potential. I'll give them that, as there are definitely a lot of great ideas, but I wonder what the potential in the Neutrinos are. They seem to be alien parodies of 50's greasers, so I don't see what's so lost. The aspect they seem to be playing up right now is their rebellious war with Krang, but aliens at war are hardly unique to the Neutrinos. Why not use, say, a certain three-horned race instead??

[Andrew NDB]

Why not use, say, a certain three-horned race instead??

The reason I arrive at -- giving benefit of the doubt -- is: "Because there are bigger, better plans for that race than just the fodder role the Neutrinos have."

A role I don't have an exceedingly large problem with the Neutrinos filling.

[CyberCubed]

Well we now know Shredder can't be an Utrom with Krang around to fill that role.

I'd laugh so hard if Ch'rell somehow shows up later on though.

[Powder]

Wouldn't be surprised if he or the namesake made a cameo down the line.

[CyberCubed]

Would be wonderful if Ch'rell tries to cause a mutiny and take over from Krang. I hope if he appears he retains his classic red and purple scar look to separate him from the other Utroms.

[Andrew NDB]

Well we now know Shredder can't be an Utrom with Krang around to fill that role.

I'd laugh so hard if Ch'rell somehow shows up later on though.

I would be surprised if Ch'rell never showed up.

[wedestroymyths]

I really enjoyed #14.

I had a thought though. I don't want to seem critical of the series because I'm enjoying it immensely, and perhaps it's more of a reflection of my being away from comics for a while. But does the series feel too serialized at times? I like the story, and I enjoyed how #14 progressed the story, but at the same time, I feel like most of the main series issues don't have much of a stand-alone identity of their own. TV shows have been trending in the same way for a while now, so is this just how comics go?

Subsequently, I think this might be why I've tended to enjoy the microseries issues just a little bit more than the main series.

I don't know--like I said, I love the directions the story is headed, and I've enjoyed every issue, it's just that I'm rarely fully satisfied by a single issue because those single issues are more interested in progressing stories in small bits than telling a single complete story.

[Powder]

I totally agree, myself & others have expressed that before. You're not alone, most appreciate the Micro-series much more for those same reasons. It's also why many preferred Tales Of The TMNT over the main series Vol. 4.

[frank_one]

Quite a good issue, with some nice panel by Andy Kuhn. I really like how he drew Karai here, on the contrary I hate his April.

[Chinese Turtle]

what the shell?!!! only 7P?

[thelouisguy]

I really enjoyed this issue. I know the Technodrome reveal was supposed to be before the Fugitoid issue, but it works just as well afterwards. Very nice family dynamic going on; it will be interesting to have a young Casey Jones living with the Turtles. Looking farward to the next two issues, though!

I just finished reading it. It was very intresting and now i am even more excited for next issue! Krang tells stockman his story and while he was talking to stockman the Nutrinos rebels attack and try to kill him! But Krang and his stone warriors kill them all! :D:D Krang wins agains!!!:D Then he told Stockman that he will give him another chance . He told him to work on the techndrome and that if he does his work right then he will let him live. After that we see the turtles and splinter talking about the Shredder. At the end of the issue Shredders tells to Karai that he decided who will replace her.... Leonardo!!! And he sents her ro kidnapp Leonardo and bring him to him!!!SPOILER ALERT!?!

What I want to know is when will the next oneshots be announced?They should be starting up again in April 2013 after the 4 part Foot Clan mini wraps up. I am really excited to see what the next 4 will be too! Could be focused more on Krang and Stockman (depending on how much is explored in the ongoing between now and then)?

... but i defiantly love how he does his humans, krang, and utroms, they look pretty good! I agree. Pretty much every drawing of Krang is really impressive.

... I'm curious as to how he intends to lure Leo into his service. "Hey, remember when I killed you? Good times. Wanna work for me?"Just like that ;)

what the shell?!!! only 7P?Go buy the issue.

[corvus]

After all that was just revealed people are still bringing up Ch'rell? Really? He isn't gonna show up. But Krabg is lying about his origin, obviously. What gets me is utroms being from dimension x. I wasn't expecting dimension x to show up at all.

[FoxZerro]

I don't know this issue missed the mark by a wide margin for me. It all just felt so expected.

Maybe its because I read the Fugitoid book first, but even when the Technodrome was offhandedly mentioned there it didn't strike me as exciting because this is Krang of course he'll have the Technodrome or some reasonable facsimile of it. Them making him an Utrom also made perfect sense because for all intent and purposes he was the OT version of one.

Regarding the Raph/Splinter story I didn't think that Casey's father was going to be killed and it only made sense that Splinter would invite and encourage Casey to come live with them its something the series had been hinting at since the Raph Micro when Rapahel told Casey that whether he likes it or not he's part of it now and that makes him family. Again nothing really new or exciting happened here just the summation of the storyline.

Even the Shredder thing was kind of a let down. I know there was all sorts of speculation on the boards about who Shredder would want as his second in command, but as soon as the scene started it just felt so 4Kids Turtles that the dramatic reveal at the end seemed non-dramatic. I think this point was made less exciting by the first line of Ninja Notes treating Shredder wanting Leonardo to be his right hand man, like the plot twist of the century. After being less than wowed by it when I first read it in the story, then having that line celebrating it, just reinforced in my mind just how unoriginal it was considering we have been there and done that.

I'm really looking forward to the Slash story arc that is going to be starting with Issue 15 and I'm not going to let my lack of enjoyment from this book turn me off to the series as a whole. I really did enjoy that they got Zak and Dask out of the way because it means that the chances of their being an extended story with them are slim to none. Still I feel this issue lacked the overall wow factor that the other issues in the series have been able to provide.

[thelouisguy]

What gets me is utroms being from dimension x. I wasn't expecting dimension x to show up at all.Really? As soon as we saw Krang for the first time I was wondering how Dimention X would fit in.

[Matches Malone]

The reason I arrive at -- giving benefit of the doubt -- is: "Because there are bigger, better plans for that race than just the fodder role the Neutrinos have."

A role I don't have an exceedingly large problem with the Neutrinos filling.

You could very well be right about that. I guess I feel about the Neutrinos similar to how you've expressed your thoughts on Bebop & Rocksteady, in which they are inherently goofy characters. I actually enjoyed them (in doses) in the Fred Wolf cartoon because rockabilly aliens just seems to fit in with the tone of the series. Doing a serious version of them just kind of takes away the little fun appeal they had. They're taking on a more serious role in this version, but look pretty silly in the meantime.

[CyberCubed]

You guys are kidding, right?

As soon as Krang showed up EVERYONE knew that Dimension X, and to a lesser extent the Technodrome, would be brought back too.

Krang casts his shadow over all of Dimension X. Even in the Archie series where he barely showed up, most of the other aliens were from Dimension X.

[The Big Bad]

I wasn't entirely happy with the way last issue's Karai / Shredder scene made me feel that grand-daddy dearest was being awfully shortsighted, apparently basing the entirety of Karai's skill as leader solely on her combat ability. Now I'm starting to feel he's just plain incompetent. This is the person he thinks will do better than Karai?

Yes, this is, intentionally or not, a retread of a storyline from the 4Kids cartoon. The reason that worked, however, is because at that point neither Leo nor the Shredder knew much about the other, and thus could plausibly set aside the turtles' various interactions with the Foot as the result of misunderstandings. It also worked because the way the Shredder went about it was perfectly in line with what he did know. He wasn't offering to make Leo his second. He wasn't staking the future of the Foot Clan on somebody he didn't know. He just thought the turtles were competent fighters and preferred to have them work for him instead of against him. If they agreed, excellent; if they didn't, he'd just kill them and nothing of value would be lost.

Here, however, Shredder already knows enough about the turtles and their history to be able to match their past lives to their current selves. He suspects, if not outright knows, that they know who he is. Unless he plans to resort to brainwashing, he must know that when it comes to loyalty, there are scads of lower-hanging fruit. If he has to go so out of his way in order to get viable leadership, it doesn't speak terribly highly of the Foot Clan, or himself.

And just what the heck would he have seen about Leonardo that makes him the one true heir? Is it his knowledge of tactics? His proven loyalty to the Foot? The way he commands the respect and obedience of the people under him? His many years of experience? His willingness to do what must be done, even if it proves unpopular among the rank and file? His ability to admits his mistakes and to educate himself in order to adapt to the unknown? When the heck would have been able to see those? As far as we've seen, the only thing he knows about Leo that survived the reincarnation is his combat prowess, which again, is one of the least important things in a leader.

I've mentioned before that I think that a lot of the reuse of elements from other incarnations has at times been done without a clear understanding of what made those elements work, and is been done because it's been done before. If this indeed meant to be a take on the 4Kids story, rather than a story that coincidentally happens to share a fundamental core with it, then it doesn't seem terribly well thought out, at this stage of the story.

You guys are kidding, right?

As soon as Krang showed up EVERYONE knew that Dimension X, and to a lesser extent the Technodrome, would be brought back too.

Krang casts his shadow over all of Dimension X. Even in the Archie series where he barely showed up, most of the other aliens were from Dimension X.

You keep speaking for people, as if they all thought alike and you were privy to what those thoughts are. Please don't do that.

[CyberCubed]

You keep speaking for people, as if they all thought alike and you were privy to what those thoughts are. Please don't do that.

It was very, very likely to see the things people associate with Krang the most, like the concept of Dimension X. I didn't think we would see the Technodrome, but I am not surprised in the slightest its being used.

In fact pretty much all the concepts from Season 1 of the OT have been used in IDW with the exception of the Channel 6 news crew. It's pretty obvious most of the inspiration came from Season 1's first 5 episodes.

[Redeemer]

Amazing Issue, I love the micro's but I am glad be reading the on going series again. Im enjoying the storyline it keeps getting better and better, but I must say the turtles just look plain aweful. I am hoping the new perminent artist will have some awesome Tutles!
But I can't wait to see the up coming issue I am wondering how Saki will entice Leonardo

[Lampy]

You guys are kidding, right?

As soon as Krang showed up EVERYONE knew that Dimension X, and to a lesser extent the Technodrome, would be brought back too.

Krang casts his shadow over all of Dimension X. Even in the Archie series where he barely showed up, most of the other aliens were from Dimension X.

Youd think that since krang is so greatly associated with dimension x that people would not be so surprised that itll be involved in his origin. Honestly the two things that came to mind as soon as krang was confirmed to be in this comic was the technodrome and dimension x.

Amazing story so far and i like where they're going with this plot. Finally geting some 4kids into the mix aside from angel. And i especially like the combination of krang and utroms in there. It only made perfect sense to combine them and make krang one. Tom did it beautifully IMO

[Plasticplayhouse]

while i'm still on board with the comic and the story has been entertaining, i must say that there has been a TON of fred wolf dished out over the past few issues. hopefully idw doesn't tip the scales of balance. i don't mind a little of the OT influence here and there, but too much would not be good.

i'm not a hater or kuhn's art, but i'm not an absolute lover of it for the turtles either. i like it when used sparingly. overall for me it was a pretty "meh" issue due to the reasons stated

[corvus]

@The Big Bad. Shredder has always been cruel, short sighted and angry. He bases everyone's worth on combat ability. He's like the bad guy in the Karate Kid. Leo demonstrated excellent combat ability in front of him twice now.

[ToTheNines]

Leo demonstrated excellent combat ability in front of him twice now.

Shredder beat the piss out of him.

The worst thing about it though, I thought, was the fact that Shredder said Leo displayed great leadership qualities in his past life. He was like 5 years old.

[Andrew NDB]

Shredder beat the piss out of him.

The worst thing about it though, I thought, was the fact that Shredder said Leo displayed great leadership qualities in his past life. He was like 5 years old.

Come to think of it, yeah, that's a little quesotionable.

I'm OK with a Techndrome (and with Krang and Rock Soldiers prevalent, it'd be a little weird if some kind of Technodrome wasn't present), though from what we can see it doesn't seem like it's a very different design than the Fred Wolf one. If we did see one I was hoping for something visually different and more imposing, something more like the upgraded Technodrome from Turtles Forever. If there ends up being a giant blinking eyeball on top then that's just stupid.

I question the addition of Dimension X. Beyond slavish nostalgia for the Fred Wolf material, why is there any need whatsoever to add and convolute things with alternate dimensions when Krang's world and Neutrino and all that could just as easily be in another galaxy in our universe or another region of space period?

[Jester]

Depending on which continuity, Dimension X IS another galaxy in our universe. Wasn't it in the Archie books?

[MikeandRaph87]

I have to admit as huge as a fan as I am of the '87 cartoon and think its elements are neccessary in IDW I do believe that Dimension X outside the '87 cartoon is best as a nearby galaxy as it became in the Archie series. Krang and all can be aliens from another galaxy opposed to another dimension and it does not change the characters at all. It would better fit Turtles In Space, Cudley The Cowlick even Kerma having them all in space. It just seems to fit better for a more cohesive vision/revision for the sake of characters and concepts.

[corvus]

Shredder watched Leo take on an army of foot ninja, lead his brothers against him and observed him training as child. He sees him as being more valuable than Karai, it makes sense.

[Jester]

Shredder watched Leo take on an army of foot ninja, lead his brothers against him and observed him training as child. He sees him as being more valuable than Karai, it makes sense.
Hasn't Karai done similar things, that and brought Saki himself back some how?

[MikeandRaph87]

Hasn't Karai done similar things, that and brought Saki himself back some how?

One thing that I don't think has been addressed is if Saki and Yoshi were around about 1600 AD and Karai is the granddaughter of Saki was she born in the mid 1600s and taken to a Lazurus Pit(or something like that) to keep young for centuries or is she 20 something more in the late 20th century?

[corvus]

Karai couldn't beat Shredder after being given several foot ninja to lead. Leo lead his brothers against him and beat him...kind of. And I'm pretty sure Grandfather is just short for great great great great great great grandfather or whatever.

[Plasticplayhouse]

Come to think of it, yeah, that's a little quesotionable.



i dont think its far fetched. i have a 6 yr old and i watch him playing with his friends everyday. you can clearly decern leaders and followers among them. plus you figure what kind of a father/teacher spliter was...he was probably pretty rigid in his training. i feel shredders statment would be totally logical.

[frank_one]

Shredder beat the piss out of him.

Good point. Shredder then also declared himself "unimpressed". Now that we see him wanting Leo as his second in command, this all appears a bit incoherent.

One thing that I don't think has been addressed is if Saki and Yoshi were around about 1600 AD and Karai is the granddaughter of Saki was she born in the mid 1600s and taken to a Lazurus Pit(or something like that) to keep young for centuries or is she 20 something more in the late 20th century?
As I see it, she's from our century and Shredder is her great great great.. grandfather like you say. At some point she discovers the story of this legendary Oroku Saki and with the help of the Foot she takes him back to life through magic, worms or something else.

[DrSpengler]

Good point. Shredder then also declared himself "unimpressed". Now that we see him wanting Leo as his second in command, this all appears a bit incoherent.

I got the impression that he was legitimately "unimpressed" with Leo in the Leonardio Microseries. Then when Leo lead his brothers to victory in TMNT #12, that changed the Shredder's opinion; Leo proving himself "worthy", so to speak.

As I see it, she's from our century and Shredder is her great great great.. grandfather like you say. At some point she discovers the story of this legendary Oroku Saki and with the help of the Foot she takes him back to life through magic, worms or something else.

The one bit I don't quite get yet is Shredder's dialogue in TMNT #2, during the flashback scene with April.

The character is an underling doing grunt work who refers to a "master" and eventually gets his eye scarred.

This was before the Turtles were mutated, so Shredder woudl have no reason to be incognito to test Leo, obviously.

There seems to be a missing piece of the puzzle regarding Shredder's ID that I'm sure will be revealed. I'm guessing the Foot Soldiers in TMNT #2 was just a guy and Shredder was brought back from the dead using his body.

[oldmanwinters]

The one bit I don't quite get yet is Shredder's dialogue in TMNT #2, during the flashback scene with April.

The character is an underling doing grunt work who refers to a "master" and eventually gets his eye scarred.

This was before the Turtles were mutated, so Shredder woudl have no reason to be incognito to test Leo, obviously.

There seems to be a missing piece of the puzzle regarding Shredder's ID that I'm sure will be revealed. I'm guessing the Foot Soldiers in TMNT #2 was just a guy and Shredder was brought back from the dead using his body.

I love the fact that we've still got some puzzle pieces left to assemble!

I never saw that Chet reveal coming, so I know I can still be legitimately surprised.

[Matches Malone]

Good point. Shredder then also declared himself "unimpressed". Now that we see him wanting Leo as his second in command, this all appears a bit incoherent.

I don't think it's too tough to believe that while he might be sincerely "unimpressed" by Leo's actual performance, he can still be impressed by the potential. Writing about potential gives you some leeway in reasoning since he is supposed to see something others, including the reader, can't see.

Plus as Spengler pointed out, you see the turtles do something right in their first team effort against him.

[Lampy]

as i recall... during that confrontation on the roof, shredder did not even know that that was yoshi's oldest son. only during their battle in HQ did he find out. most likely all he thought was that this giant turtle was just another freak running around new york. after realizing it was yoshi's son AND seeing his leadership skills in battle... (and on top of that... what he recalls from his previous life after keeping tabs of "Leo") a huge impression must have been made.

[Vegeta]

Can't really say anything that hasn't been stated already by you intelligent folks but wow. One of the best issues IDW has released. I was getting a little bored with aprils microseries being ok at best, and splinter's long winded time with the shredder. Now though, holy crap. Patience is being rewarded

[frank_one]

I don't think it's too tough to believe that while he might be sincerely "unimpressed" by Leo's actual performance, he can still be impressed by the potential. Writing about potential gives you some leeway in reasoning since he is supposed to see something others, including the reader, can't see.

Plus as Spengler pointed out, you see the turtles do something right in their first team effort against him.
This makes sense. So he wants him as his second in command, even if he knows he'll have to train him first so that Leo's potential can "blossom" (I hope this is the right word).
Sounds good.

[The Big Bad]

@The Big Bad. Shredder has always been cruel, short sighted and angry. He bases everyone's worth on combat ability.

Well...yes and no. Sure, The Shredder has traditionally had plenty of blind spots in his various incarnations, and some versions have indeed been all about the fighting. However, about half of those are version of the character who aren't meant to be particularly competent--the Mirage Shredder was more or less a renegade who was more interested in his own thing than in actually running the NY Foot; Uncle Phil was a villain from a cartoon in the eighties; Archie Shredder was based on Uncle Phil, etc. The one version of the Shredder that was both intended to be competent and was portrayed as such--the 4Kids version--had those flaws continuously pointed out and be instrumental in his undoing, while still not allowing those flaws to overshadow the way in which he was generally very good at what he did. That version of the character also did not judge people solely by combat ability; Hun did not get where he got to simply because he was strong--otherwise he would have simply been dismissed after his string of failures--but because he was smart and all-around capable. Similarly, Karai's role was never limited to being muscle, and I think it's pretty save to say that strength wasn't why Shredhead took her in (*).

Now Tom Waltz may indeed be getting the cues for this version of The Shredder from the Mirage incarnation, which is perfectly fine. However, I also get the impression that he is trying to make this version competent, I don't think both things are compatible, particularly the way he's going about developing the character.

Shredder watched Leo take on an army of foot ninja, lead his brothers against him and observed him training as child. He sees him as being more valuable than Karai, it makes sense.

All of which may make him useful, sure. However, if The Foot is meant to be an actual crime syndicate rather than a glorified assassination squad, then its leader needs to know a heck of a lot more than how to fight, and it's knowledge Leo has shown little evidence of having, and that Karai does appear to have.

As for the idea of Leo being someone Saki wants to groom for the position of leader, I'm not sure that's necessarily much better, or even justified by the text. First, there's the fact that Shredhead has already demoted Karai, which is entirely unnecessary if it'll be years before there's actually somebody ready to take her place. Second, like I said before, the idea that only one of their enemies has the potential to lead The Foot reflect very badly on them, it suggests that Leo Is Special, which I feel is a dicey place for the series to go to.


It was very, very likely to see the things people associate with Krang the most, like the concept of Dimension X. I didn't think we would see the Technodrome, but I am not surprised in the slightest its being used.

In fact pretty much all the concepts from Season 1 of the OT have been used in IDW with the exception of the Channel 6 news crew. It's pretty obvious most of the inspiration came from Season 1's first 5 episodes.

And...? This is all true; it also has nothing at all to do with you speaking for other people without their consent, which is unnecessary, rude, and something I'd appreciate you not do anymore.

----
(*) And I do think there's a difference between 4Kids Shredder deciding to adopt Karai based on a glance and he deciding that Leo had potential here.


Which makes me wonder...if Shredhead saw that kind of potential in Japan!Leo...why the heck did he kill him, then?

[Bobby Curnow]

You guys are missing the #1 reason why Shredder would want Leo on the side of the Foot...

...inflicting as much misery as possible on Splinter.

(while also gaining a warrior of extreme potential, if loyalty could be ensured. AND keeping Karia on her toes. A little competition could be just what she needs in Shredder's eyes)

[DrSpengler]

What I don't really understand is how Shredder could weigh Karai's accomplishments as a leader against Leo's and come to the conclusion that Leo has achieved more.

Assuming Karai's statements of her worth are true, she singlehandedly led a global crime syndicate from mediocrity to power all on her own.

Meanwhile, Leo rescued Splinter and ran away before getting himself killed.

How Shredder can look at their track records and deem Leo a more worthy successor is... perplexing. Presumably, there's more credence to what Bobby just suggested; that he's more trying to teach Karai some humility and give her a little competition.

Otherwise, he's just pulling some Ra's Al Ghul levels of stupid. "You are a perfect leader in every way... except that you have a vagina. Bring me the most uncorruptable hero on Earth for he shall be my new heir!"

[MikeandRaph87]

You guys are missing the #1 reason why Shredder would want Leo on the side of the Foot...

...inflicting as much misery as possible on Splinter.

(while also gaining a warrior of extreme potential, if loyalty could be ensured. AND keeping Karia on her toes. A little competition could be just what she needs in Shredder's eyes)

That was along my lines of thought,but I was more curious as to how Shredder planned to convience Leonardo to join him after they already fought and he knows who Shredder is.

[Venom]

What I don't really understand is how Shredder could weigh Karai's accomplishments as a leader against Leo's and come to the conclusion that Leo has achieved more.

Assuming Karai's statements of her worth are true, she singlehandedly led a global crime syndicate from mediocrity to power all on her own.

Meanwhile, Leo rescued Splinter and ran away before getting himself killed.

How Shredder can look at their track records and deem Leo a more worthy successor is... perplexing.

Dude, Saki witnessed Leo battle dozens of Foot soldiers and even sparred with him briefly before dropping him off a building.

He's had time to size up Leo's character.

[DrSpengler]

Dude, Saki witnessed Leo battle dozens of Foot soldiers and even sparred with him briefly before dropping him off a building.

He's had time to size up Leo's character.

Well, he's had time to size up Leo's potential, but Karai has already gotten a string of impressive accomplishments under her belt.

I can understand that he sees that Leo has the capability of one day being a better leader than Karai, but taking the enemy teenager who has yet to really accomplish anything as a leader save one rescue mission and appointing him heir over the loyal subordinate who has already accomplished so much as leader... just doesn't seem like a logical, rational decision.

Though I'm sure it pisses Karai off to no end, which is probably part of Shredder's intentions; give her some motivation to become even better than she already is (she was already shown to be very arrogant, so he's likely trying to introduce some humility into her).

[Lampy]

You guys are missing the #1 reason why Shredder would want Leo on the side of the Foot...

...inflicting as much misery as possible on Splinter.

(while also gaining a warrior of extreme potential, if loyalty could be ensured. AND keeping Karia on her toes. A little competition could be just what she needs in Shredder's eyes)

Spengs has a point about Karai's accomplishments outweighing Leonardo's. Leo hasn't really accomplished much as a human or a turtle... except maybe actually cutting Shredder. maybe that's what impressed him? i don't know... but does Karai not show the same, if not more, potential? Bobby's reasoning makes sense in that Karai's jealousy could help her step up her game and to get inside Splinter's skin. but aside from that... i too don't see much reason to choose Leo over Karai... especially knowing Leo's loyalty to Splinter in this incarnation is almost undying. i honestly cannot see Leo taking up shredder's offer especially after his mother was slain by the same clan (by Saki's orders) in another life.

I like the homage to the 4kids series, but i would've preferred Shredder choosing Raph over Leo. I can see that ball rolling... more than Leo's anyway. A little Image anyone? Plus it would add a bit of separation between Raph and his brothers... which we all speculate is inevitable.

[Vegeta]

[QUOTE=Lampy;1004251]Spengs has a point about Karai's accomplishments outweighing Leonardo's. Leo hasn't really accomplished much as a human or a turtle... except maybe actually cutting Shredder. maybe that's what impressed him? i don't know... but does Karai not show the same, if not more, potential? [QUOTE]

Maybe shredder is just sexist. Also it can be harder to see the positives in a character that is closer to you or family when you have such high expectations for them. Nothing she does will ever be good enough for him. Plus he sees that the turtles are giving him a difficult time and will continue to grow more powerful. Most likely he sees more potential in a genetically enhanced mutant than in Karai.

[TomWaltz]

What? You folks don't think I got a plan I'm working, or what?


:tcool:

[TomWaltz]

And, to finally answer this question once and for all.

Yes, Karai calls Shredder "Grandfather" because I don't wanna type Great, great, great, great, great... GAH! everytime she addresses him.


:trazz:


Thanks, everyone, for your continued support. Issue #15 is gonna rock!

Talk soon...

Tom W.

[Lampy]

oh we know you have a plan Tom. we just really love to pick it apart, speculate, and question while everything's still unrevealed. otherwise... this forum would be very lonely. looking forward to what you have in store though.

[The Big Bad]

And, to finally answer this question once and for all.

Yes, Karai calls Shredder "Grandfather" because I don't wanna type Great, great, great, great, great... GAH! everytime she addresses him.


Which is why she should just call him "old man". :P

[Vegeta]

And, to finally answer this question once and for all.

Yes, Karai calls Shredder "Grandfather" because I don't wanna type Great, great, great, great, great... GAH! everytime she addresses him.


:trazz:


Thanks, everyone, for your continued support. Issue #15 is gonna rock!

Talk soon...

Tom W.

Issue 14 rocked you sly devil.

[Candy Kappa]

Maybe shredder is just sexist.

He is from around the feudal period :P

[corvus]

Wouldn't that make Splinter sexist too? I'm waiting for him to tell April to get back in the kitchen. But, was I the only one thinking that in the middle of splinters speech to everyone that it was the perfect moment for the foot to bust in and destroy the antique shop?

[Lampy]

Wouldn't that make Splinter sexist too? I'm waiting for him to tell April to get back in the kitchen. But, was I the only one thinking that in the middle of splinters speech to everyone that it was the perfect moment for the foot to bust in and destroy the antique shop?

i was thinking the same thing too. but i want one of the Turtles to get their butt whooped first and being thrown through a window or skylight. I don't mind it being Donnie this time. Take turns boys.:tlol:

[corvus]

Hmm what if Raph got caught off guard by a mutated Bebop and Rocksteady?

[MikeandRaph87]

Hmm what if Raph got caught off guard by a mutated Bebop and Rocksteady?


I would gleefully be caught off guard myself. I am not expecting them until #20 if we do get to see them in mutant form.


Thanks for the confirmation that Karai is the modern descendant of Saki,Tom. I do tend to think too much into things,but I blame you for that!:twink: Besides its apart of the fun!

[TomWaltz]

I would gleefully be caught off guard myself. I am not expecting them until #20 if we do get to see them in mutant form.


Thanks for the confirmation that Karai is the modern descendant of Saki,Tom. I do tend to think too much into things,but I blame you for that!:twink: Besides its apart of the fun!

Hey, if you guys are having fun, then I'm having fun!!!

[Matches Malone]

I realized that the Shredder had the perfect opportunity to abduct Leo and make his proposition in the Leo Micro. He had him in his hands! If only he had realized how awesome he was then...

Seems to lend credence to the idea that Saki mostly wants to recruit Leo to piss Splinter off, since he came up with this idea after discovering he is Splinter's son.

[corvus]

I wonder...will Leo decapitate him this time? If so I'd like at least one more face to face battle with the Shredder where he doesn't die. I find TMNT far more interesting with Shredder being dead so long as he's referenced often. I loved the fact that in Mirage he stayed dead and the turtles had to deal with him not being around, which was worse then him being around.

[CyberCubed]

I wonder...will Leo decapitate him this time? If so I'd like at least one more face to face battle with the Shredder where he doesn't die. I find TMNT far more interesting with Shredder being dead so long as he's referenced often. I loved the fact that in Mirage he stayed dead and the turtles had to deal with him not being around, which was worse then him being around.

Are you sure IDW is allowed to show decapitation?

[Lampy]

Yea would nickelodeon allow that much graphic imagery? I mean... If the fugitoid issue took out the burnt extra crispy honeycutt because it was too gruesome.... What more with decapitation? I hope that happens though.

[Toby Barrett]

Personally, I'm hoping at some point Old Shred does a swan dive with a half gainer right into the back of a garbage truck!

[corvus]

They could probably do a silhouette or something.

[frank_one]

I don't care about him being decapitated, run over by a car or eaten by King Kong, I just want him dead sooner or later.

[Lampy]

Personally, I'm hoping at some point Old Shred does a swan dive with a half gainer right into the back of a garbage truck!

I already did that joke in the other thread. :D

[corvus]

I don't care about him being decapitated, run over by a car or eaten by King Kong, I just want him dead sooner or later.

Oh come on. You really aren't hoping for Leo decapitating him in midair? I think that's one of Leos best moments and he's my least favorite turtle so that says a lot.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

Ugh, no offense anybody, but we haven't even found out how he returned in the present day yet, and people already want shredder killed?

Sorry guys,but with how inigrated he is with the story, and howmuch character development he still has ahead of him, ol' shred head's probably going to be around for the long haul. Though they may kill him six or seven years down the line.

[Powder]

That's a long ass time from now, I doubt they'll leave him unharmed.

[CyberCubed]

I think Shredder will stick around as the main villain for at least 2-3 years. Hell we're 1 year in already and the Turtles only JUST met Shredder.

[Vegita-San]

Hey, if you guys are having fun, then I'm having fun!!!

I'm loving this series...but PLEASE get a new head artist. His humans are OK, but his turtles look like crap. issue 13 i couldn't get past the buck teeth :)

[FearlessLeader]

Mostly this issue just leads me to being curious how Shredder expects to court Leo to his side. Threats against his loved ones are the only reason I can think of and they certainly would tie bonds like what Shredder seems to desire.

Even if Shredder brings the Krang into the proposition, makes Leo believe they have a common enemy Leo has seen his father's hatred for the Shredder he still I don't believe would work for him.

Maybe if Splinter ordered him to....but I don't see that happening either. Gah! I am so curious to actually know what is going to happen.

Also I can't imagine Karai would refer to the Shredder as "old man" that would be disrespectful and I am certain just further get her his wrath :trazz:

[Metropoliskid41]

Ugh, no offense anybody, but we haven't even found out how he returned in the present day yet, and people already want shredder killed?

Sorry guys,but with how inigrated he is with the story, and howmuch character development he still has ahead of him, ol' shred head's probably going to be around for the long haul. Though they may kill him six or seven years down the line.

I think issue #21 definitely resonates with fans as the death of Shredder, and with Kevin perhaps doing the art on 21 you can't help but get excited about that. I think the next 7 issues would really have to be shredder-centric to get us to that point, I think we have a ways to go before we get to that point, and I think over the years, Shredder has definitely become THEE main Turtles villain over the years in other versions outside of the original Mirage comics, he's kind of the Lex Luthor to the Turtles Superman, I don't see him being offed permanently, but that could be a good issue to get him out of the picture for a while to maybe focus more on Krang, or tackle some of the other fan favorite villains, like Rat King or Leatherhead before he returns to haunt Splinter & the Turtles once again.