The definitive version of splinter

[Vegeta]

I'm sure this has been done many times but my search button won't work on my phone so I apologize. So who is your ultimate version of splinter? He has always been my favorite character outside of raphael. At the risk of using too small of a sample size, I'd say the 2k12 is my favorite. He's strong, sarcastic, wise, and hilarious. Outside of him though the first movie's version is the voice I hear when I read the comics. The "I am here my son" scene with raph always stuck with me. I love every version of him but I was curious to hear your guys. If this thread is annoying feel free to link me to an old one.

[zodiac brave]

mine are yours, lol. movie 1 splinter is a huge part of my childhood memory and nick splinter is exactly how i wish 2k3'dve been. he's pretty perfect.

[Loudo]

2k3 and Archie Splinter are my favorite, because they actually get involved in the story, instead of staying home while their sons do the dirty job.

The other Splinter were kind of just there. If they had been replaced with flashbacks of them telling their pieces of wisdom, nobody would have noticed the difference. :lol:

[Vegeta]

2k3 and Archie Splinter are my favorite, because they actually get involved in the story, instead of staying home while their sons do the dirty job.

The other Splinter were kind of just there. If they had been replaced with flashbacks of them telling their pieces of wisdom, nobody would have noticed the difference. :lol:

Really? To me every version have their quirks and differences. It is nice to see the 2k3 version getting his hands dirty.

[meta ray mek]

I'm p. gonna have to go with Nick!Splinter for now. While it might still be too early to tell, he already strikes me as an interesting character with nuance to him. Not to mention he's got a biting sense of humor/wit, and has a fair balance of disciplinarian sensei v. protective-but-caring father going on. Plus, I like the 'Splinter mutated from Hamato Yoshi' backstory, as it makes his connection to the Turtles a bit more believable, imho; so the fatherly angle makes the most sense in this version. He's got lots of potential, and I honestly can't wait to see where the show takes him from here.

Having said that, I'm slowly making my way through the 2k3 show, and that one is pretty fascinating, but the painfully obvious 'Young/middle-aged White guy imitating old Asian guy' voice tries my nerves every initial time he speaks in an episode. =I

The 80's version I have vague memories of, but I liked him a lot as a kid. But looking back at it, he just kinda seemed "there" and didn't really get to do much outside of a handful of episodes.

The 2007 movie one, for what little screen time he had, was adequate. Makes me miss Mako like something fierce, tho'. =(

Never seen the live action movies or Next Mutation, or any of the comics for that matter, so I can't comment on those.

[TurtleTitan97]

For me, it's a tie between Nick Splinter and 1st movie Splinter. Like others have said, I like his sense of humor and how he's wise. I also love his tragic backstory. 1st movie Splinter is one of the best parts about the original movie, and my favorite part is campfire scene, and where he says, "And most of all, I love you all, my sons."



The 2007 movie one, for what little screen time he had, was adequate. Makes me miss Mako like something fierce, tho'. =(



Agreed. Mako was a great actor. Loved him as Aku in Samurai Jack and Uncle Iroh in Avatar: The Last Airbender.:tsmile:

[Cryomancer]

Mirage really, but 2k3 is also pretty great. Nick/IDW are interesting as they give him the ability to actually get angry sometimes, which seems like it hardly ever happened before, outside of battles. Also it lets him be fallible in some way, which generally makes him into a more complex character, so that's nice too.

[Jester]

Any of the "Hamato Yoshi is Splinter" Splinters. Probably Archie followed closely by Nick, then IDW.

[Drose18]

2k3 by far i always like it when splinters the pet

[Pterobat]

Logic would suggest that the Mirage Splinter, being the first one, would be the most definitive. However, I've only read the Mirage comics in bits and pieces (so far).

With that absolutism out of the way, hmmmm....probably 2003 Splinter. As much as FW Splinter is my favourite on a sheer emotional level, he just can't cut it when it comes to an objective evaluation.

The main problem with FW Splinter is that his fatherly aspects are seriously downplayed, so as to be almost absent (key word being "almost"). That's a key part of the Splinter "type", and without it being central, something is missing. FW Splinter is also a little too perfect.

2003 Splinter has the fatherly side, and the same intelligence and wisdom that also is important to the character. I'm not too fond of Darren Dunstan's voice for the character, but I can learn to look past that.

For the record, I have no preference for what species Splinter started life as, since there are pros and cons to both scenarios.

Honorable mention goes to Archie Splinter, who might have started with the same problems as the Fred Wolf Splinter, but had an air of sophistication that came from more than just being surrounded by sillier characters--his knowledge of world cultures made him feel like a real renaissance rat, and he lent gravitas to most of the situations he was in.

Sadly, it wasn't until the very end of the run that Archie Splinter benefitted from the "Toddler Turtles" kind of stories, which do help to shape Splinter's fatherly image, even if you are always a father no mater how old your kids are.

[ToTheNines]

This is tough for me since Splinter is my favorite TMNT character, period.

I'd go ahead and say movie Splinter. He really nailed the wise master and fatherly aspect, plus he was still a hell of a martial artist. Granted they had to use some clever camera work during his one action scene... so his brief face off with Shredder wasn't too remarkable, but he still threw his ass off a building lol. And I loved the bow & arrow scene from Ooze.

And I agree that Yoshi being Splinter makes a little more sense, but that still doesn't lock any of those takes as "definitive" for me.

Only Splinter I dislike is from TMNT 2007. He pretty much pitted Raph and Leo against one another if you analyze what was really going on. He made ridiculous rules for his sons that really carried no rhyme or reason, and gave shaky advice.

Never seen the live action movies

No offense, but what the fug?

[Jester]

Yeah...of the "Splinter is Yoshi's Rat" Splinters, Movie Splinter, especially TMNT 1's Splinter is great. Has some of my favorite scenes in TMNT history.

[Shark_Blade]

OT Splinter is pretty much what I grew up with. He's tiny, brown and seems fragile yet wise.

But for the definitive version, I'll go with Nick's Splinter. He's as strong and wise, but the sheer size and height of him, towering above the turtles makes quite a staggering difference to me. When it comes to discipline, he uses a cane (which is good for the soul from time to time). He can fight Leatherhead too, effortlessly. Respect.

And he's the funniest. Some lines out of my head:
- "This is very difficult. I shall meditate on it." (1 second later) "It's Leonardo."
- "The first rule of ninja is to do no harm. Unless you need to do harm, THEN DO LOTS OF HARM."


Lol

[Bossa Nova]

I have to go with 1st-3rd movie Splinter, followed closely by 4th movie Splinter as they are obviously very similar, but I find his depiction in the 4th film a bit younger and more willing to fight. As awesome as he is in the Nick version, I really prefer him as much more elderly, and the classic 'wise Master'. For some reason it's just weird to me to imagine him out and about fighting as much as the Turtles, and I love the dynamics of four sons who have been protected by their father their entire lives who are now all old enough and capable enough to do the same in return.

His 4Kids interpretation I can take either way as he's a lot like how he was shown in the 4th film, though a bit more sarcastic which was obnoxious at times, and I'm still getting acquainted with him in both Mirage and IDW comics so I don't know enough to really form much of an opinion. I suppose I would have to say Nick's version is my least favorite, but seeing as I love his character no matter what, it's not like I hate him or anything. But I think the fact that I VASTLY prefer him as starting life as an ordinary rat and not Yoshi probably has something to do with it as well.

[Andrew NDB]

Definitive Splinter? As in, not "What Splinter did you like watching on the teevee when you were growing up as a kid?" Then it's not even a matter of opinion.

The Splinter from the source material. Mirage Splinter.

[Shark_Blade]

I'm curious why some people like the rat origin story than Hamato Yoshi one. I understand it's faithful to Laird and Eastman's first comic, but seems pretty unlikely that a rat merely mimicking a human can master the art of ninja.

[Candy Kappa]

I'm curious why some people like the rat origin story than Hamato Yoshi one. I understand it's faithful to Laird and Eastman's first comic, but seems pretty unlikely that a rat merely mimicking a human can master the art of ninja.

or how turtles can do martial arts stunts encapsulated inside their plastron and carapace?

[Andrew NDB]

I'm curious why some people like the rat origin story than Hamato Yoshi one. I understand it's faithful to Laird and Eastman's first comic, but seems pretty unlikely that a rat merely mimicking a human can master the art of ninja.

The main reason? Because it makes the way the mutagen works a sham. And I don't like things in my TMNT comics to be a sham.

Second reason? It's been mentioned numerous times that Splinter was never a normal rat... even pre-mutation. We just never got the story behind it.

[JoshDA7X]

Yeah...of the "Splinter is Yoshi's Rat" Splinters, Movie Splinter, especially TMNT 1's Splinter is great. Has some of my favorite scenes in TMNT history.

I agree! "I made a funny!"

I also like the Nick Splinter for the reasons Shark_Blade mentions above. Those and the ninja egg bomb - "Michealangelo said you needed me"

[Vegeta]

Definitive Splinter? As in, not "What Splinter did you like watching on the teevee when you were growing up as a kid?" Then it's not even a matter of opinion.

The Splinter from the source material. Mirage Splinter.

I feel splinter doesnt have as much personality in the comics because hes just not in them a ton. Outside of idw of course where there is a lot of splinter. Not to say I dont like him in mirage i just dont feel a personal connection with him like in other versions of the tmnt.

[Andrew NDB]

I feel splinter doesnt have as much personality in the comics because hes just not in them a ton. Outside of idw of course where there is a lot of splinter. Not to say I dont like him in mirage i just dont feel a personal connection with him like in other versions of the tmnt.

That's fine (though it could be argued that maybe you're not supposed to have a "personal connection" with him in the Mirage TMNT)... however the thread is not asking, "What is your personal favorite Splinter?"

[Jester]

True but some times original doesn't always mean definitive either. Some could argue the one iteration that best captures Splinter as both sensei and father is the most definitive.

[Vegeta]

That's fine (though it could be argued that maybe you're not supposed to have a "personal connection" with him in the Mirage TMNT)... however the thread is not asking, "What is your personal favorite Splinter?"
Touché sir.

[Yorae]

To me, 4kids!Splinter is the definitive Splinter. I just think his character was fleshed out really well through the series that when I think of the character I sort of alway return to the 2k3 version as reference.

Nick!Splinter is creeping up the definitive ladder too.

[zkarlette]

Any version except NM...

[Zulithe]

"rat first" versions of splinter have their charm but I think I slightly prefer "human first". A rat mastering a martial art from his cage pre-mutation doesn't work so well in my mind. Was Splinter a lab rat prior to being Yoshi's pet? Who knows, that could explain some things, but afaik that has never been explained.

I also prefer versions of the origin where the turtles mutate into babies or toddlers, not straight into teenagers. This way splinter has time to bond with them and time to train them. It also allows a lot of time to tell stories during this period where they are still training long before they meet April. This is a big chunk of TMNT history that could be explored.

IDW origin solves a lot of these problems with Splinter being an intelligent rat pre-mutation but it only works if you don't mind the reincarnation aspect, which for me adds a layer to their origin and characters that doesn't feel as authentic to what TMNT is or should be... but I realize I have some bias here having growin up with the 80s turtles.

I guess Nick Splinter is one of my favorites from an origin POV. I like his character, but he needs to get more involved in the plot, not just sit at home while the turtles go on adventures. If they can work that out he could end up being the ultimate Splinter in my mind. 1990 live action movie Splinter is another favorite of mine. I may not prefer "rat first" versions as much but I do love that origin scene.

[meta ray mek]

I guess Nick Splinter is one of my favorites from an origin POV. I like his character, but he needs to get more involved in the plot, not just sit at home while the turtles go on adventures. If they can work that out he could end up being the ultimate Splinter in my mind.

Yeah, I'd love to see that particular Splinter do a little bit more. Granted, we've only 13 episodes at this point, more or less been used to establish everything, so hopefully he'll become more active in the remainder of the 1st season, if not the second. (Especially if certain fan theories about Miwa's fate are true, then there's an opportunity for him to become involved in the plot more)

(And frankly, while I'm not exactly holding my breath for it, I really hope he gets to do something major in this week's episode, but that's just me.)

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Honorable mention goes to Archie Splinter, who might have started with the same problems as the Fred Wolf Splinter, but had an air of sophistication that came from more than just being surrounded by sillier characters--his knowledge of world cultures made him feel like a real renaissance rat, and he lent gravitas to most of the situations he was in.



Splinter in the 1987 show seemed to have that to, if you watch Vacation in Europe.

[BubblyShell22]

Well, I feel that 2K3 Splinter and Nick Splinter are the definitive Splinters for me. Both have their fatherly sides as well as good fighting skills. I really want to see Nick Splinter fight more though, and I hope he does. That's what I loved about 2K3 Splinter. He was willing to join his sons in battle to protect them.

The movie Splinters were okay, but I can see how some would feel 2K7 Splinter was too harsh. He really did pit Leo and Raph against each other and put too much pressure on Leo for him to be an effective leader. Mako did a great job though.

Haven't read the comics, so I can't comment on those.

[pannoni1]

I actually like them all equally, as it seems that Splinter is the biggest constant (besides origin) in terms of personality and character development. Even outside of 4kids/Archie, most Splinters have been involved in the action, from Movie 1 splinter finishing off the Shredder, battling Shredder in "Shreddered and Splintered", "The Incredible Shrinking Turtles", and even in a fight scene already in Nick. My idealized Splinter would be brave enough to fight more than just occasionally, treat the Turtles with respect, and have a good origin story, no matter if he was Hamato Yoshi or not.

[Loudo]

What about a collage? :D

The Definitive Splinter for me would have:
2k3 Splinter's strong father figure. (He's one of the few Splinter I find convincing in this role. OT and Archie Splinter call the turtles "my friend", Mirage Splinter raised his sons to send them to fight to the death, and 2007 movie Splinter acted more like a clan leader.)
Archie Splinter's wisdom and knowledge of the world. (All Splinter are wise almost by definition, but while the other Splinter are all "mystical mambo jambo", Archie Splinter is knowledgeable about real world things, like different cultures and religions.)
OT Splinter's voice. (I think it's the best one out there.)
Nick Splinter's sense of humor. (I can't deny it, Nick Splinter is very funny. All Splinter have their moments, but he's the only one who actually makes me laugh, instead of simply amusing me.)
2k3 Splinter's involvement in the main story. (The other Splinter usually stay at home. And when they do help their sons, it feels like a deus ex machina, it's like the writers only remember about Splinter when they need to save the turtles from a danger they can't overcome on their own. Or conversely when they need a male damsel in distress. 2k3 Splinter, on the other hand, features in lots of episodes where he doesn't save the day or needs to be rescued. Archie Splinter is very active too, but since I feel the Archie turtles are seriously lacking in personality, I think he steals the spotlight too much.)
Mirage Splinter's encounter with the Rat King and his cause of death. (If Mirage did anything right with Splinter, it's these two scenes. Of course, I'm also fine with Splinter not dying at all. XD)

I think that's pretty much it.
I personally prefer Splinter to be Hamato Yoshi's pet rat instead of Hamato Yoshi himself, but the origin story is not that important, if it's well done.

I'm still conflicted about what look I should give to Definitive Splinter.

[Pterobat]

See, now this is an interesting way to go about it. I wasn't quite comfortable with my choice, and one reason is that the different versions of Splinter aren't that different. Making one uber-Splinter might be a better way to bypass that. :)

The term "definitive" is tricky, though. I think it *should* partially be a personal question, because otherwise we just list the original incarnation of the character and call it a day, without having an interesting talk about it.

It's a scary thought for creators of fiction, but sometimes a later version of a character will become larger in the eye of the culture than the original one was, making it harder to determine who is "definitive". It's not the case with Splinter, but it's fun to discuss the issue.

[Avatar Yuffie]

I like the mutant Hamato Yoshi origin.

2k7 Splinter has a special place for me. I have been away from anything TMNT related because I was in college, had other stuff going on, thought I was too old for this, so on. I only watched that film because of Mako, who voiced Iroh when I was an Avatar the Last Airbender fan, and felt I should watch it out of respect for the guy, as Splinter was literally his last role. If it hadn't been for him, I wouldn't return to TMNT. So he has my thanks.

But my favorite is Nick!Splinter. He's actually moving from "understanding wise father figure who can do no wrong" trope established in the two cartoons with his shades of controlling nature and anger that was really just buried under the surface (I like the implication that he had Raph's temper in his youth). Unfortunately he has very few active moments, and only his snark made his appearances for me to look forward to.

Definitive... well, I'm not that picky? I don't have "This is Master Splinter" spot going on there (well except for Movie 3, that poor Master Splinter puppet).

[Icebot]

For me, it's 80's cartoon Splinter.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

What about a collage? :D

The Definitive Splinter for me would have:
2k3 Splinter's strong father figure. (He's one of the few Splinter I find convincing in this role. OT and Archie Splinter call the turtles "my friend", Mirage Splinter raised his sons to send them to fight to the death, and 2007 movie Splinter acted more like a clan leader.)
Archie Splinter's wisdom and knowledge of the world. (All Splinter are wise almost by definition, but while the other Splinter are all "mystical mambo jambo", Archie Splinter is knowledgeable about real world things, like different cultures and religions.)
OT Splinter's voice. (I think it's the best one out there.)
Nick Splinter's sense of humor. (I can't deny it, Nick Splinter is very funny. All Splinter have their moments, but he's the only one who actually makes me laugh, instead of simply amusing me.)
2k3 Splinter's involvement in the main story. (The other Splinter usually stay at home. And when they do help their sons, it feels like a deus ex machina, it's like the writers only remember about Splinter when they need to save the turtles from a danger they can't overcome on their own. Or conversely when they need a male damsel in distress. 2k3 Splinter, on the other hand, features in lots of episodes where he doesn't save the day or needs to be rescued. Archie Splinter is very active too, but since I feel the Archie turtles are seriously lacking in personality, I think he steals the spotlight too much.)
Mirage Splinter's encounter with the Rat King and his cause of death. (If Mirage did anything right with Splinter, it's these two scenes. Of course, I'm also fine with Splinter not dying at all. XD)

I think that's pretty much it.
I personally prefer Splinter to be Hamato Yoshi's pet rat instead of Hamato Yoshi himself, but the origin story is not that important, if it's well done.

I'm still conflicted about what look I should give to Definitive Splinter.

I would say 1987 and Archie Splinter usually have the same personalities. 1987 Splinter also semmed to know a lot of cultures (see Vacation in Europe, but yeah Archie explored more of this), and they both started as Hamato Yoshi, and Archie was originally adapting the show.