Is TMNT thriving because all other action cartoons are being canceled?

[CyberCubed]

Does anyone else think the reason all little kids are watching Nick's TMNT is because a lot of other action shows are being canceled?

If you haven't heard the sad news, both Young Justice and Green Lantern are confirmed to be canceled by CN after the remaining episodes air.

Thundercats was canceled after one season. Spectacular Spiderman and Wolverine & the X-men were both canceled after 26 episodes. Avengers ended after 52 episodes.

And the only other superhero show airing with new episodes confirmed is Ultimate Spiderman, which everyone agrees is crap. Other than, "Beware the Batman," there are almost no other action/superhero shows going to be in competition with TMNT for a while.

So to keep count:

1. Young Justice = canceled
2. Green Lantern = canceled
3. Spectacular Spiderman = canceled
4. Wolverine and the X-men = canceled
5. Avengers = canceled
6. Thundercats = canceled

While it makes me sad that all these great superhero shows are being canceled, it makes me wonder if it'll lead to the longevity of Nick's TMNT, because kids will probably want to watch at least one action show instead of all the usual comedies that both CN and Nick go for otherwise.

[Ninjinister]

It's thriving because it's f**king good and has people handling it that care. The other hero shows have handlers (not writers/artists whatnot... the people that make decisions on renewal) that don't give a poop.

The official word on YJ and GL getting canceled, today, is a terrible scar I'm still trying to bear, though. Especially since the last episode of GL was so damn amazing on so many levels that I was wondering how they'd top it next season :/

[Cure]

Especially since the last episode of GL was so damn amazing on so many levels that I was wondering how they'd top it next season :/

Well, you don't need to wonder about that anymore.

[CyberCubed]

I suppose we should be lucky that Nick owns the TMNT IP 100%, rather than just co-funding the show like Fred Wolf or 4kids.

Nick spent $60 million to purchase TMNT from Mirage, so here's hoping we get a nice long run out of this show. My hope is 7 seasons, but my dream is to see it be the first TMNT cartoon to reach the milestone 200 episode barrier.

If the show keeps up with 26 eps per season, we'd get there by around Season 8 or 9.

[Vegeta]

the nick remake is better than all of those cartoons imo. I like thundercats, but the remake (minus the good animation) was pretty crap. Nick's show has good writing so it should have a nice healthy run

[Powder]

Humans are out, turtles are in. ;)

[Shark_Blade]

TMNT wins because their show is THAT GOOD. ;)

[BabyTurtles]

I still can't get over the Young Justice thing.....but all those hiatuses......

Nick seems to be handling TMNT with alot of care :3 hopefully it continues :D

im not sure the cancelations of the other shows are helping nick
but I just think TMNT2012 is just plain good :3

but now with all the canceled shows...it might help TMNT.....I know I'm gonna be a little more obsessed since young justice and green lantern are going to be over soon....

[drewizzle88]

Trying to look at it from a kids standpoint, it has fun and entertaining episodes, always introducing new things and characters, really kick ass CGI, and has some fun toys.

Going into the Nick cartoon I had pretty low expectations, wasn't a fan of CGI cartoons, thought the turtles feet and wraps were going to look stupid, new voices to get used to, I figured I'd dislike it to be honest. But once I saw the final product I was and am impressed. Absolutely love this series and I hope it coninues on at this high quality for several years. Can't wait to see more of Splinter, the Kraang, Leatherhead, now the rat king as well, heck yeah. I hope we see more of metalhead at some point too. I'm just really excited and there's a lot to look forward to.

[Vivi]

I think it's the other way 'round - the shows are being cancelled because not enough lil kids are watching it. The ones that do will probably continue to do so up until the cancellations.

[tmntpower1988]

As people have already mentioned it's because TMNT 2012 is just awesome. It's the only reason I started watching TV again.

[Yorae]

I think that with the cancellation of these shows kids have fewer options, and that helps boost the viewing for TMNT, but we cannot assume this is the sole or main reason for the cartoon thriving.

As many said before, it is a good show. Well thought out, well paced, well written, well designed and well animated. The character models grab the eye and are certainly appealing to kids.

[NinjaPug]

You bring up a really good point CC. I will start by saying I'm not too worried about the future of TMNT due to Nick's 100% ownership and it's toyline. However, I am very concerned about the future of action adventure cartoons like this. It's been weird to see so many great shows from popular franchises pulled after 1-2 seasons. The Avengers and SSM were pulled because of the Disney acquisition of Marvel. A new head of Marvel TV wanted his own version of Spider-Man and the Avengers. I'm worried that the new Avengers Assemble show will be done in the same crappy way as USM. The other shows just didn't have the ratings. Will a similar show in the same timeslot have the same bad performance in the future? Based on what the younger generation is watching now, probably. Especially if the channels they are on continue to make baffling scheduling moves (long hiatus, last second preemptions, timeslot changes to Sunday at midnight)

It's a sad day when you only get 1 season of Tron Uprising and Green Lantern but a crappy show like USM that has a childish cut scene every 60 seconds gets to live on. Now I'll never get to see Tron being repurposed into Rinzler or the introduction of the Black Lantern Corps.

[Bauer536]

I think Young Justice (even though I wasn't a fan of it) should have not been canceled. So what if the toys don't sell? If people like it, they like it. Don't keep crap on if nobody really cares for it. Yes, I am mad at the executives down at CN and their incompetence. I feel bad for you Young Justice fans. It deserves another chance. It's stupid they're doing this.:tgrumble:

As for Green Lantern - yeah, I saw it coming. I felt it should have been canceled. Not only did it not have a toy line, but its show got bizarre at some point, and just boring. That's why there's going to be another Batman show, so it won't bore kids. I don't know, but the new Batman show doesn't look that strong to last. Honestly, Cartoon Network better make a separate network like Boomerang and call it "DC Nation" so all kinds of DC toons will exist instead of two. Disney should start doing that with Marvel. Make a separate channel based off of Marvel superheroes. That could work.:tidea:

Now about TMNT. I think it's doing just fine, not just because it's doing well, but because kids are watching it (especially the ones who watch Spongebob first). Plus, it seems the toys are selling. If it's not Avengers or Star Wars right now, it's the turtles.:tsmile: Also, it's got heavy advertising, and it looks like it's getting a lot of attention.

Just to add - to anyone who want this show to go for several years, I hope that means at just four or five seasons. I mean, Nick already has a contract that ends at 2015, which means it could last at three seasons, unless the contract is renewed. I think it should be at four seasons. Here's why - We could get over 100 episodes if possible, but four because their are four turtles in the team. I mean, three seasons won't mean one is excluded, but I just think it would go with the franchise.:twink:

And to Cybercubed: I know you want it to go over 200 episodes. That's your wish. But let's be realistic. I don't think it will go that high. Plus, the minimal the series, the better the cartoon is. If it goes on for too long, God only knows we'll be getting something as bad as Fast Forward or Back to the Sewers. So three or four seasons may keep the show at a high note. Just saying.:twink:

Plus, where does it say Tron: Uprising is canceling. I've heard nothing about that. Besides, that's on Disney XD.:tconfuse:

[Zulithe]

Thankfully since nick owns TMNT and it isn't licensed we can look at Nick's other shows to see trends and determine how and when they are likely to shut the show down... and all signs point to it having a very long life. After all the money they spent to acquire it they are working really hard to make sure it is a success.

I do think other shows folding is to TMNT's betterment though. Those viewers are going to want something to look forward to and TMNT can easily fill the superhero void for a lot of young fans. But is it doing so well as a direct result of this? No, I feel it is merely an added benefit and not a deciding factor at all.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

People here are saying that the reason TMNT isn't canceled is because it's 'good'. They clearly are forgetting that TV shows get canceled because their toy sales run dry. Nick TMNT is a pretty new show and kids are running out to their local Target or Toys 'R' Us to buy their favorite turtle.

In fact, most of the cartoons on Cybie's list were very good. Better than 95% of the junk on TV today. Superhero cartoons have been doing pretty darn well as of late.

Let's take a look at why cartoons have been canceled.

1. Young Justice = canceled
2. Green Lantern = canceled

:(:(:(:(:cry::cry::cry:
I'm not sure why these shows are being canceled, but it's probably because toy sales were running low and besides, Cartoon Network treats its shows like horse poop.

Spectacular Spider-Man

Spectacular Spider-Man had lots of trouble. It originally aired on CW4Kids, and after a year of never-ending reruns it was moved to another obscure station, Disney XD. Also, Marvel bought Disney around here. Sony (owner of Spider-Man) and Disney are direct competitors, though I'm not sure if that affected anything. Not to mention, SS was in part canceled because a NEW Spidey cartoon , Ultimate Spider-Man, was being made. If anyone's seem an ep, you know it's terrible.

4. Wolverine and the X-men = canceled

The show was expensive to make (those character designs were GOOD) and the action was too little. Didn't make much of a profit.

5. Avengers = canceled

Actually, it was only canceled so that a new Avengers show could be made - Avengers Assemble. It's target group will be dumb little children. And it will be a copy of last May's blockbuster film.

6. Thundercats = canceled


No idea. I've never seen this show, though I've heard it's good.

[ToTheNines]

It's because the show has something everyone age 2 to 32.

It's vivid, colorful, has whacky characters, lots of jokes, plus action, more action, continuity, running mysteries, and heartfelt moments.

Also, the stand-alone nature of each episode makes it highly accessible. I love Young Justice to death, but even me at 21 and after watching every episode multiple times, I still would get a little lost on certain things (mainly because of the long and frequent hiatuses CN would put it on), so kids probably didn't bother with it. Especially not after the bastards never reran the show.

[Zulithe]

I really just feel like marvel and dc cartoon shows are really tired, they keep rebooting the shows with replacements and i'm tired of it. I don't even watch them anymore. I wish they would give some of these franchises a break and stop running them into the ground. DC and Marvel should create something new for a change.

[chrisdude]

Plus, where does it say Tron: Uprising is canceling. I've heard nothing about that. Besides, that's on Disney XD.:tconfuse:
Tron: Uprising isn't cancelled, per se, but it hasn't been renewed. And it spent the second half of its season airing Sunday night at midnight. On the Disney channel, that's pretty much a middle finger. Disney, apparently had a commitment to run 19 eps, but I think they gave up on it a long time ago.

It was the only other show I followed week to week...

[BabyTurtles]

the fans for young justice and gltas are going ballistic XD

they are getting lots of support even from other fandoms

I don't know if young justice and gltas are going down (at east not without a fight)

[TheSkeletonMan939]

I don't know if young justice and gltas are going down (at east not without a fight)

Of course they're going down, and with a bunch of screaming fans too. Spectacular Spider-Man, The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes, and Wolverine and the X-Men were all well-written, intelligent shows, but greedy people running the companies didn't care and flushed them all down the potty.

And even today people mope around, wishing that Spider-Man could have gotten a third season or whatever.

[Andrew NDB]

I think Young Justice (even though I wasn't a fan of it) should have not been canceled. So what if the toys don't sell?

Because the people that make these cartoons aren't non-profit organizations. And if you're hoping for long-term, quality shows on an adult level as an adult while looking at shows for little kids... that would be a mistake.

[Berserker]

I'm not sure why these shows are being canceled, but it's probably because toy sales were running low and besides, Cartoon Network treats its shows like horse poop.

I thought the days of toy-driven TV shows were over. I was under the impression video games, phone apps, and online app tie-ins were more lucrative these days.

[ZariusTwo]

the nick remake is better than all of those cartoons imo.

Good as the Nick show is, that's just B.S form a blind TMNT loyalist. Spectacular and YJ are leauges above it. You'd know that if you actually watched them.

[Jephael]

I really enjoyed Spectacular Spider-Man since there had been quite a few years since the 90s Spidey cartoon was on TV. However, I never could get into Young Justice because I wanted to see more Teen Titans and the Bruce Timm/Paul Dini DC world.

[Ryanator008]

Yu-Gi-Oh Zexal isn't cancelled. Also Power Rangers isn't dying anytime soon.

[Ninjinister]

Good as the Nick show is, that's just B.S form a blind TMNT loyalist. Spectacular and YJ are leauges above it. You'd know that if you actually watched them.

Unless SSM got better in the second season (that I never even knew existed until it was over), I'm going to have to disagree. While the best Spidey series ever, I felt it got way more praise than it deserved.

However, I never could get into Young Justice because I wanted to see more Teen Titans and the Bruce Timm/Paul Dini DC world.

That is an incredibly stupid reason to not want to watch something.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

I thought the days of toy-driven TV shows were over. I was under the impression video games, phone apps, and online app tie-ins were more lucrative these days.

Where do you think Nick TMNT gets its money from? Practically no one is going to buy the $60 season on iTunes. I don't see any video games anywhere, nor any apps. Just toys.

[Kidatheart]

I think TMNT will be around for awhile due to the range of age group this seems to be attracting. I'm a father who watches it with his kids and likes the show. I was a big Spider-Man, GI Joe, He-man, Thundercats, etc. fan as a kid and I can tell you that I expose my kids to the re-makes of any of them that come out. They have really only loved one, TMNT 2012. So, just because adult fans are interested and they have a fandom following, that fandom has to be large enough for a decent profit to be made, regardless of how great the writing or artwork is/was. Good writing for adult audiences, doesn't really translate well at times to kids 2-8, which these animated shows are targeted towards by indication of their time slots etc. Now, I'm not a comicon sort of person, not a big fanboy per say, but could the writers of some of these shows that fail perhaps try to broaden their watching ages too much? Perhaps the super fans on sites like these actually influence the writer to make it more adult action driven and little kids don't need to be exposed to heavy action at a young age. As a parent, you see what too much 'action' scenes do to a kid at play time and from talking with other parents, restrictive viewing of action cartoons seems to be a popular trend. Now, I know, there is no blood and guts etc., but to some even the little scenes in TMNT 2012 fulfills this weekly quota. I think TMNT will survive just because of the nostalgia of parents remembering their childhood turtles and watching it along side with their kids.
IME, Toys DO sell in this age bracket by evidence of my living room and bare wallet, so if this demographic doesn't 'get' the show, the show is doomed to fail. The Turtles add a bit of childish comedy to the show and Mikey being the 'party dude' he is, the kids have a character to relate to. Leo being a leader, Raph being the muscle and dealing with anger issues, and Donny being into 'geeky' computer gizmos gives everyone something to enjoy.
As a side note, I was never into GL at all, even as a kid. X-men seems to be more adult orientated now a days, focusing mostly it seems on wolverine, which I collected all his comics as a kid though. I was how ever really disappointed with the cancellation of Thundercats. I did not even see an episode air, it was cancelled in the first season and didn't bother to air up in the North here at all. I have seen a few episodes, and although the setting seems to be dark (it could have used a bit more colour), I would have watched it. My kids didn't love it, they watched it with me, but wasn't asking to watch it again. So, that brings me back to my original point, it seems if the kids don't watch, the show gets cancelled.

[Ryanator008]

I think TMNT will be around for awhile due to the range of age group this seems to be attracting. I'm a father who watches it with his kids and likes the show. I was a big Spider-Man, GI Joe, He-man, Thundercats, etc. fan as a kid and I can tell you that I expose my kids to the re-makes of any of them that come out. They have really only loved one, TMNT 2012. So, just because adult fans are interested and they have a fandom following, that fandom has to be large enough for a decent profit to be made, regardless of how great the writing or artwork is/was. Good writing for adult audiences, doesn't really translate well at times to kids 2-8, which these animated shows are targeted towards by indication of their time slots etc. Now, I'm not a comicon sort of person, not a big fanboy per say, but could the writers of some of these shows that fail perhaps try to broaden their watching ages too much? Perhaps the super fans on sites like these actually influence the writer to make it more adult action driven and little kids don't need to be exposed to heavy action at a young age. As a parent, you see what too much 'action' scenes do to a kid at play time and from talking with other parents, restrictive viewing of action cartoons seems to be a popular trend. Now, I know, there is no blood and guts etc., but to some even the little scenes in TMNT 2012 fulfills this weekly quota. I think TMNT will survive just because of the nostalgia of parents remembering their childhood turtles and watching it along side with their kids.
IME, Toys DO sell in this age bracket by evidence of my living room and bare wallet, so if this demographic doesn't 'get' the show, the show is doomed to fail. The Turtles add a bit of childish comedy to the show and Mikey being the 'party dude' he is, the kids have a character to relate to. Leo being a leader, Raph being the muscle and dealing with anger issues, and Donny being into 'geeky' computer gizmos gives everyone something to enjoy.
As a side note, I was never into GL at all, even as a kid. X-men seems to be more adult orientated now a days, focusing mostly it seems on wolverine, which I collected all his comics as a kid though. I was how ever really disappointed with the cancellation of Thundercats. I did not even see an episode air, it was cancelled in the first season and didn't bother to air up in the North here at all. I have seen a few episodes, and although the setting seems to be dark (it could have used a bit more colour), I would have watched it. My kids didn't love it, they watched it with me, but wasn't asking to watch it again. So, that brings me back to my original point, it seems if the kids don't watch, the show gets cancelled.

Good point.

[Drose18]

Does anyone else think the reason all little kids are watching Nick's TMNT is because a lot of other action shows are being canceled?

If you haven't heard the sad news, both Young Justice and Green Lantern are confirmed to be canceled by CN after the remaining episodes air.

Thundercats was canceled after one season. Spectacular Spiderman and Wolverine & the X-men were both canceled after 26 episodes. Avengers ended after 52 episodes.

And the only other superhero show airing with new episodes confirmed is Ultimate Spiderman, which everyone agrees is crap. Other than, "Beware the Batman," there are almost no other action/superhero shows going to be in competition with TMNT for a while.

So to keep count:

1. Young Justice = canceled
2. Green Lantern = canceled
3. Spectacular Spiderman = canceled
4. Wolverine and the X-men = canceled
5. Avengers = canceled
6. Thundercats = canceled

While it makes me sad that all these great superhero shows are being canceled, it makes me wonder if it'll lead to the longevity of Nick's TMNT, because kids will probably want to watch at least one action show instead of all the usual comedies that both CN and Nick go for otherwise.

Its thriving cuz I can GUARANTEE there is not one kid these days who watch super hero shows other than ultimate spiderman and TMNT

[meta ray mek]

I have to be bluntly honest: if it wasn't for GLTAS, I wouldn't have given TMNT a second bat of an eyelash.

Granted, that only happened because of the sudden/forced hiatus for GLTAS and I was left sitting bored out of my skull on Saturday mornings (since I had now found my Saturdays completely free after I got my current job), but the point still stands.

To be honest, I'm not sure why TMNT is succeeding, or at the very least, doing well. I bristle at some of the DC Nation fans blaming/taking their anger out on other shows (and I have seen TMNT caught in the crosshairs at least once), despite the fact TMNT was on a whole hour or so after the DC Nation block, so it's not like it was taking away viewership.

At the very least, I'm thankful TMNT is guaranteed at least one more season. Whether or not Nick still has enough confidence to greenlight a season 3, well... that remains to be seen.

p.s. I'm gutted about GLTAS' cancellation, but not in the least surprised. This IS Cartoon Network. They were the ones who screwed over Sym-Bionic Titan, Thundercats, and Transformers Animated, after all.

[Bauer536]

Like I'm saying, 3 seaons or 4 would be just enough for this series. 100 episodes or so will do.:tsmile:

[CyberCubed]

Like I'm saying, 3 seaons or 4 would be just enough for this series. 100 episodes or so will do.:tsmile:

No it won't. The TMNT lore is large enough for the series to go on a large number of years, as well as the new ideas Nick comes up with.

We've never had a TMNT cartoon make less than 150 episodes, we should expect the same here.

[Bauer536]

No it won't. The TMNT lore is large enough for the series to go on a large number of years, as well as the new ideas Nick comes up with.

We've never had a TMNT cartoon make less than 150 episodes, we should expect the same here.

I guess, but I feel it's just your wish of having 200 episodes. No matter what happens, your life won't be ruined if it's at least 100 or 150.:tsmile: I mean, do you really want a lot of seasons for TMNT and not anything else? What if the writing becomes bad, or what if we have another Fast Forward or Back to the Sewers? You see my point here?:tconfuse:

[TheSkeletonMan939]

I guess, but I feel it's just your wish of having 200 episodes. No matter what happens, your life won't be ruined if it's at least 100 or 150.:tsmile: I mean, do you really want a lot of seasons for TMNT and not anything else? What if the writing becomes bad, or what if we have another Fast Forward or Back to the Sewers? You see my point here?:tconfuse:

CyberCubed wouldn't care if all the episodes in the future had nothing but Donatello picking his nose. As long as they added up to 200, he'd be happy.

[Drose18]

Like I'm saying, 3 seaons or 4 would be just enough for this series. 100 episodes or so will do.:tsmile:

No the finish line for a tmnt show is 10 seasons.

[Jephael]

The TMNT lore is large enough for the series to go on a large number of years, as well as the new ideas Nick comes up with.

We've never had a TMNT cartoon make less than 150 episodes, we should expect the same here.

I swear this same conversation has come up so many times I can feel my eyelids getting whiplash! CyberCubed, I know you like to speculate, but for the love of God could you please live in the moment and quit looking into the distant future?

CyberCubed wouldn't care if all the episodes in the future had nothing but Donatello picking his nose. As long as they added up to 200, he'd be happy.

I can see this show's version of Michelangelo doing that, but not Donnie.

[Cure]

I can see this show's version of Michelangelo doing that, but not Donnie.

Way to miss his point.

[Jephael]

Way to miss his point.

I got the point, but I was just pointing out it doesn't sound like something we'd ever see that character doing... unless we got another Turtles Forever type story where they're depicted as moronic goofballs!

[meta ray mek]

For what it's worth, CGI is not exactly as cheap in comparison to traditional animation (and even that's not chump change either), especially when you start adding more assets (both characters and environments; I learned this from my Art of Clone Wars book and reading Giancarlo Volpe's blog during the early days of GLTAS). I don't know if that would be a limiter on the overall number of episodes TMNT would get -with or without sugar daddy Nickelodeon-, but it's something to kinda keep filed away, just in case.

[zkarlette]

Another thing to keep in mind is that nowadays, kids spend most of their time on the computer or playing video games instead of watching cartoons or playing with toys. They don't appreciate these things the way we used to.

[The Stryker]

What monsters. Using modern technology instead of watching cartoons obsessively.

[Kevin G]

I wonder how Beware the Batman is going pan out ?

[CyberCubed]

For what it's worth, CGI is not exactly as cheap in comparison to traditional animation (and even that's not chump change either),

You're got it backwards, CG animation is MUCH cheaper than 2D animation for a show like this.

Young Justice's type of animation for example is much more expensive than TMNT. The whole reason Nick went with the CG route is because its cheaper and easier to produce after they finish all the character models and sets.

[zkarlette]

What monsters. Using modern technology instead of watching cartoons obsessively.

I was just thinking reasons for cartoons losing audience, I didn't say video games are bad.

[Konchadunga]

I was just thinking reasons for cartoons losing audience, I didn't say video games are bad.

That rationale simply does not make sense when you consider that the Fred Wolf show had numerous video game adaptations that only enhanced its popularity. Even the prevalence of far worse video game adaptations of other things in the 1980s didn't serve to undermine the popularity of such things. Video games and cartoons were extremely popular in the 1980s; it isn't an either/or thing.

Part of the difference today might be that as omnipresent as pop-culture was in the those days, it wasn't too "wide." There were still only a few networks, with a limited amount of stuff that could fit on them altogether, so things that got on occupied every ring and had product placements, tie-ins, etc. Back then, everyone knew who the TMNT, the Ghostbusters, Mario, Sonic, and Vanilla Ice were. More recently, the amount of available TV channels has exploded, and accordingly not every person sees the same stuff. I was an enormous Pokemon fan in the 1990s, for example, but I had never seen Family Matters or Animaniacs. Now, the Internet has made the alienation of media bigger than ever.

Still, nostalgia runs deep in the Internet generation; in fact the advent of video hosting has amplified it; nothing is truly "off-the-air" anymore. It is perhaps one of the very few things that allows for some sort of cohesive popular culture these days, which explains why IDW has snapped up four of the enormous mass-franchises from the 1980s to adapt (and the only reason I'm not counting My Little Pony as a fifth one is because it's the G4 ponies), and as such I think a new TMNT show has a better chance at success than most other action cartoons.

[chrisdude]

That rationale simply does not make sense when you consider that the Fred Wolf show had numerous video game adaptations that only enhanced its popularity. Even the prevalence of far worse video game adaptations of other things in the 1980s didn't serve to undermine the popularity of such things. Video games and cartoons were extremely popular in the 1980s; it isn't an either/or thing.

Part of the difference today might be that as omnipresent as pop-culture was in the those days, it wasn't too "wide." There were still only a few networks, with a limited amount of stuff that could fit on them altogether, so things that got on occupied every ring and had product placements, tie-ins, etc. Back then, everyone knew who the TMNT, the Ghostbusters, Mario, Sonic, and Vanilla Ice were. More recently, the amount of available TV channels has exploded, and accordingly not every person sees the same stuff. I was an enormous Pokemon fan in the 1990s, for example, but I had never seen Family Matters or Animaniacs. Now, the Internet has made the alienation of media bigger than ever.I suppose this makes sense. But it doesn't explain how I can get up on a Saturday morning and not find cartoons. The network channels aren't running them, Nick just runs reruns until like 10:30. And I don't know what Cartoon Network does because they're Cartoon Network...

Still, nostalgia runs deep in the Internet generation; in fact the advent of video hosting has amplified it; nothing is truly "off-the-air" anymore. It is perhaps one of the very few things that allows for some sort of cohesive popular culture these days, which explains why IDW has snapped up four of the enormous mass-franchises from the 1980s to adapt (and the only reason I'm not counting My Little Pony as a fifth one is because it's the G4 ponies), and as such I think a new TMNT show has a better chance at success than most other action cartoons.TMNT... uh, Dr. Who?
What are these IDW things from 80s you speak of?

[Andrew NDB]

I think the TMNT CGI cartoon will do all right for a while to come on its own merit, but even if not, Nickelodeon/Viacom spent a pretty penny to acquire TMNT with the primary interest to produce this thing... so unlike the dime-a-dozen kind of stuff they generally produce that may or may not turn out to be hits, with TMNT they have a 63 million dollar invested interest in it being successful. So they would hesitate long and hard before cancelling it.

[Vegeta]

Good as the Nick show is, that's just B.S form a blind TMNT loyalist. Spectacular and YJ are leauges above it. You'd know that if you actually watched them.

Not blind nor a loyalist. Just don't care about these shows. Nor did anyone else I guess since it's gone.

[CyberCubed]

Not blind nor a loyalist. Just don't care about these shows. Nor did anyone else I guess since it's gone.

You've got to be joking. Young Justice was one of the most loved superhero cartoons in a long time. Its better than a lot of old DC shows too.

[The Stryker]

But how did it do in the ratings and merchandise sales?

[ToTheNines]

But how did it do in the ratings and merchandise sales?

Not terribly actually. The main reason behind Young Justice not being renewed lies in the strange politics of Time Warner.

DC Comics, Warner Brothers (and in turn Warner Brothers Animation), and Cartoon Network are all owned by Time Warner. Yet somehow, Cartoon Network still has to pay pretty hefty licensing fees for their DC shows. This is why they only have 1 or 2 at a time now and also why they're all pretty short-lived, unless they end up being insanely popular.

[CyberCubed]

Until the next show gets canceled after.

[zodiac brave]

TMNT... uh, Dr. Who?
What are these IDW things from 80s you speak of?

transformers, gi joe, ghostbusters...and tmnt....


Its thriving cuz I can GUARANTEE there is not one kid these days who watch super hero shows other than ultimate spiderman and TMNT

:trolleye: yeah...okaaaay.

Also, Marvel bought Disney around here. Sony (owner of Spider-Man) and Disney are direct competitors, though I'm not sure if that affected anything.

everything you typed here is just incorrect. disney bought marvel, not the other way around and sony only owns the movie rights to spider-man. marvel/disney STILL OWN one of their most lucrative characters. so they are NOT direct competitors and it had NOTHING to do with anything.

also,

I think it should be at four seasons. Here's why - We could get over 100 episodes if possible, but four because their are four turtles in the team. I mean, three seasons won't mean one is excluded, but I just think it would go with the franchise.

sweet reasoning, bro. makes TOTAL sense.

sigh...*facepalm*

[TheSkeletonMan939]

everything you typed here is just incorrect. disney bought marvel, not the other way around and sony only owns the movie rights to spider-man. marvel/disney STILL OWN one of their most lucrative characters. so they are NOT direct competitors and it had NOTHING to do with anything.
also,
sweet reasoning, bro. makes TOTAL sense.
sigh...*facepalm*

Whoopsie, I meant to say Disney bought Marvel. Not in a million years would Marvel be able to buy Disney. My mistake.

And according to Greg Weisman the two companies certainly are competitors. If you want proof I can find his exact words for you.

Sony owned the movies and that specific cartoon. Disney wouldn't have liked Sony to be running their own Spidey cartoon when they owned the character. Cuz Disney is greedy like that.

[Konchadunga]

I suppose this makes sense. But it doesn't explain how I can get up on a Saturday morning and not find cartoons.

Yes it does, because now that there are whole channels devoted to cartoons, a time-slot devoted is obsolete, and Saturday morning is when most people would rather sleep in.

[chrisdude]

transformers, gi joe, ghostbusters...and tmnt....I did not know there were Ghostbusters comics...

[DonatelloNinja82]

I am definitely going to miss GTLAS...it's a well written show with great characters. I love the chemistry between them all. I have loved watching Razer's path to redemption and his struggles there in. Last week's episode was intense and so emotional...I dont know why they have cancelled this show :(

[ToTheNines]

I did not know there were Ghostbusters comics...

They're awesome. Pick up anything written by Erik Burnham.

[pannoni1]

With anime the only real competition in terms of action, TMNT has found a way to expand its fanbase, and shall continue to do so as long as the press remains good. Unlike the 4kids cartoon which felt so unlike the original series that it alienated many of that show's fans along with the fact that the fanbase was busy going through college and looking through careers, the Nick series, while action-based, allows to have more comedy since more cartoons with that style are popular. It helps that Nick owns the entire rights of TMNT to use classics along with pitching with Playmates/LEGO for merchandising. Viacom is one of the largest media corporations, and even the Nickelodeon name evokes nostalgia among '90s kids like me which is another way of bringing about the kids. The strong social media presence and decent online following also continues to promote fans. It also helps that TMNT had mega-fad status unlike the others which tend to have just a cult fanbase.

There are just so many new shows that appear on different formats in this age of ever-expanding options. Shows that you see an ad for once and then it vanishes through your mind where you won't remember it again. TMNT is special since its on a major cable network and achieved fad status at a time when there were relatively few options available, and the Turtles are indeed back!

[ToTheNines]

This thread is ****ing retarded.

[Lethal Lullaby]

This thread is ****ing retarded.

No... yeah it is.

[k_lala]

Well it helps that Nick owns TMNT. I'm really upset about Young Justice. I'm happy about this new show, however the 4Kids one is still my all time favorite.

[Sword Slicin' Leo]

probably because there are 2 seperate generations seeking them

[AnarkyLantern]

I wonder how Beware the Batman is going pan out ?

It's hard to speculate until I see what is or isn't offered at toyfair.

I am definitely going to miss GTLAS...it's a well written show with great characters. I love the chemistry between them all. I have loved watching Razer's path to redemption and his struggles there in. Last week's episode was intense and so emotional...I dont know why they have cancelled this show :(

I'm going to miss it and yJ as well but I can't imagine GLtas' toyline never getting picked up at retail (prototypes showed up on eBay) and YJ's getting cancelled did not help. As good as a show may or may not be, it comes down to toy sales.

[Jester]

This thread is ****ing retarded.
Yeah, I'm amazed at how long it's gone on, too.

[Powder]

Yeah that's why I mentioned him first. Haha but seriously. Green Lantern has never been cool

Are you seriously using 'gay' as an insult? Mods (and civil people) aren't too fond of insensitive ish like that.

[chrisdude]

I wouldn't bank on any Batman, Spider-Man or X-Men cartoon to last more than a couple seasons. X-men Evolution was around for a while, but really none of that stuff has worked since the 90s...

[CyberCubed]

That's because DC and Marvel end their own shows once they have enough for syndication. I'm sure both Superman and Batman Beyond would have lasted longer.

TMNT seems to last as long as toy sales and ratings allow it to.

[chrisdude]

That's because DC and Marvel end their own shows once they have enough for syndication. I'm sure both Superman and Batman Beyond would have lasted longer.

TMNT seems to last as long as toy sales and ratings allow it to.
I assume you mean Superman: The Animated Series, which was 90s. And Batman Beyond carried over the same talent from the 90's Batman cartoon.

[CyberCubed]

I don't really see much difference between 2000 era cartoons and 90 ones, other than most 2000 cartoons airing on cable.

[Jephael]

I don't really see much difference between 2000 era cartoons and 90 ones, other than most 2000 cartoons airing on cable.

Yea, but try watching a Spider-Man or Batman cartoon from the 1980s.

[CyberCubed]

Yea, but try watching a Spider-Man or Batman cartoon from the 1980s.

80's shows yes, most are dated. In a way I think the original Turtles aged the best of any 80's show.

[Vegeta]

Are you seriously using 'gay' as an insult? Mods (and civil people) aren't too fond of insensitive ish like that.

No. I was saying green lantern sucks.

[Jester]

No. I was saying green lantern sucks.
By saying it's "gay." That's what he means. It's not cool to use gay as a synonym for bad/sucky.

[DonatelloNinja82]

It's hard to speculate until I see what is or isn't offered at toyfair.



I'm going to miss it and yJ as well but I can't imagine GLtas' toyline never getting picked up at retail (prototypes showed up on eBay) and YJ's getting cancelled did not help. As good as a show may or may not be, it comes down to toy sales.


I wish they had come out with toys for GTLAS! I'd love a Razer.

[Ryanator008]

By saying it's "gay." That's what he means. It's not cool to use gay as a synonym for bad/sucky.

That's an opinion and please stay on topic.

[TheSkeletonMan939]

That's an opinion and please stay on topic.

To stay on topic in one of CyberCube's threads is to ask the wind to stop blowing.

[ZariusTwo]

80's shows yes, most are dated. In a way I think the original Turtles aged the best of any 80's show.

I'd say M.A.S.K, Thundercats, Muppet Babies, and She-Ra also stand up.

[zodiac brave]

That's an opinion and please stay on topic.

lol. no its not. you used gay to describe something in a negative fashion, when "gay" generally, in this day and age, means homosexual.

its actually fact...EXACTLY NOT opinion.

so that, on top of thinking little of gl:tas, speaks volumes, heh.

[Jester]

lol. no its not. you used gay to describe something in a negative fashion, when "gay" generally, in this day and age, means homosexual.

its actually fact...EXACTLY NOT opinion.

so that, on top of thinking little of gl:tas, speaks volumes, heh.
Exactly. It be like if I said, "I don't like this thing. It's so black!" or "Asian." or "Mexican." or "Honky."

[CyberCubed]

It's time to get back on topic.

Ultimate Spider-Man sucks so that show is no competition for TMNT. I can see the new Hulk and Avengers show failing too.

Beware the Batman is literally CN's only action cartoon since they're also losing Clone Wars.

[Avatar Yuffie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2MVxoM-FIA

BNC did point out the real reason is the teen/adult fans aren't up early to watch them on a Saturday morning and the kids would be more in tune with the Turtles more.

CN just can't switch away Adventure Time/Regular Show/Amazing World of Gumball night time slots for the DC cartoons.

[Ryanator008]

Exactly. It be like if I said, "I don't like this thing. It's so black!" or "Asian." or "Mexican." or "Honky."

Ummmm excuse me? You said "It's not cool to use gay as a synonym for bad/sucky." That's an opinion. End of discussion. Your entitled to it, but it has no place in an argument. Now once again, please stay on topic.

[snake]

Ummmm excuse me? You said "It's not cool to use gay as a synonym for bad/sucky." That's an opinion. End of discussion. Your entitled to it, but it has no place in an argument. Now once again, please stay on topic.

I know your new here, but don't argue with jester. And who made you a mod and put you in charge to tell everyone to stay on topic?

[DonatelloNinja82]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2MVxoM-FIA

BNC did point out the real reason is the teen/adult fans aren't up early to watch them on a Saturday morning and the kids would be more in tune with the Turtles more.

CN just can't switch away Adventure Time/Regular Show/Amazing World of Gumball night time slots for the DC cartoons.

I'm always up that early, lol...I'm a mom. Saturday mornings were actually exciting for me again with good cartoons to watch. Made me think of childhood Saturday mornings :/. But I won't knock the new DC Nation shows before I see them. I am interested in the new Teen Titans show...it is supposed to be goofier than the original though, correct? I wonder if they will get the same voice actors?

[sdp]

What is sad is that just 3/2 years ago it seemed that action shows for boys were making a huge comeback, after appealing to girls for so long all major networks had stuff for boys lined up, Disney bought Marvel and they mentioned a ton of Marvel shows. CN mentioned they were getting serious with DC and announced YJ/GL and we had BATB and DCNation, we had Thundercats/Voltron all making a comeback. TMNT was bought and going to air on Nick as was Power Rangers and new Avatar. There was The Hub and the new Transformers and GI Joe shows and I'm sure I'm forgetting other stuff but it seemed like a kids dream of awesome looking action shows. And fans of those franchises had plenty to look forward to.

Now out of those...it seemed Marvel had finally figured out how to make awesome cartoons like DC and Disney basically reboots them all into versions no one cares about. CN cancelled all those shows we were hyped about and now we have to look forward to new ones because they didn't pan out like they wanted..hell the didn't even give some of those shows a fighting chance..The Hub is now known as that place that airs new My Little Pony. So basically all we have left is TMNT/Power Rangers/Clone Wars/Avatar. CW is finishing this upcoming season on Disney and who knows what Disney will make after that but seeing what they've done with Marvel I don't feel optimistic. Avatar I'm not too familiar with the new show or how it's been doing, I know it was renewed but fanfare doesn't seem anywhere as high as during TLA..and TMNT and PRs are the only ones that seem to have the next few years secured because of their pricetag to acquire them but even then a combination of bad ratings and low toy sales and they'll get rid of them quickly.

[snake]

What is sad is that just 3/2 years ago it seemed that action shows for boys were making a huge comeback, after appealing to girls for so long all major networks had stuff for boys lined up, Disney bought Marvel and they mentioned a ton of Marvel shows. CN mentioned they were getting serious with DC and announced YJ/GL and we had BATB and DCNation, we had Thundercats/Voltron all making a comeback. TMNT was bought and going to air on Nick as was Power Rangers and new Avatar. There was The Hub and the new Transformers and GI Joe shows and I'm sure I'm forgetting other stuff but it seemed like a kids dream of awesome looking action shows. And fans of those franchises had plenty to look forward to.

Now out of those...it seemed Marvel had finally figured out how to make awesome cartoons like DC and Disney basically reboots them all into versions no one cares about. CN cancelled all those shows we were hyped about and now we have to look forward to new ones because they didn't pan out like they wanted..hell the didn't even give some of those shows a fighting chance..The Hub is now known as that place that airs new My Little Pony. So basically all we have left is TMNT/Power Rangers/Clone Wars/Avatar. CW is finishing this upcoming season on Disney and who knows what Disney will make after that but seeing what they've done with Marvel I don't feel optimistic. Avatar I'm not too familiar with the new show or how it's been doing, I know it was renewed but fanfare doesn't seem anywhere as high as during TLA..and TMNT and PRs are the only ones that seem to have the next few years secured because of their pricetag to acquire them but even then a combination of bad ratings and low toy sales and they'll get rid of them quickly.

Clone wars on Disney xd is going to be horrible, CENSORSHIP ahead! Just like naruto, then there going to forget about clone wars and stop airing it.

[CyberCubed]

Did that new Voltron show end too?

[NinjaPug]

I'm not sure if Clone Wars has much life left in it anyway. They will have produced 110 episodes when the current season ends (season 5). Lucas said he wanted to do ~ 100 episodes. Some of the stories this season haven't been good either (younglings vs pirates, droid mission).

I will say that the episode this weekend was awesome though. Just not sure it has more than a season left story-wise.

[snake]

I'm not sure if Clone Wars has much life left in it anyway. They will have produced 110 episodes when the current season ends (season 5). Lucas said he wanted to do ~ 100 episodes. Some of the stories this season haven't been good either (younglings vs pirates, droid mission).

I will say that the episode this weekend was awesome though. Just not sure it has more than a season left story-wise.

Longtime clone wars fan speaking ( since the first episode)
And I think the quality of the seasons went down after season 3. Some good in season 4 thought, the darkness on umbra story was good as was darth mauls

[ZariusTwo]

I'm always up that early, lol...I'm a mom. Saturday mornings were actually exciting for me again with good cartoons to watch. Made me think of childhood Saturday mornings :/. But I won't knock the new DC Nation shows before I see them. I am interested in the new Teen Titans show...it is supposed to be goofier than the original though, correct? I wonder if they will get the same voice actors?

Yes, it has the original voice cast, but isnt canon with the old show.

[sdp]

Talking about Clone Wars, I have to mention again how the show looks radically different from the first season to the current one. The difference is as big as the original reboot show. If the Nick's show can make that leap in CG during the length of the show, I will be very happy, because right now I do find the CG (especially among humans) very lacking.

Did that new Voltron show end too?

Yes, only had one season and it didn't have great scheduling and basically no promotion. While Nick seemed excited about having it at first after acquiring TMNT and more specifically Power Rangers they stopped caring about having Voltron and was left out to die. The fact that it didn't look very appealing in the first place didn't help but apparently it's a pretty decent show and the few fans were disappointed that it didn't have a second season.

I'm not sure if Clone Wars has much life left in it anyway. They will have produced 110 episodes when the current season ends (season 5). Lucas said he wanted to do ~ 100 episodes. Some of the stories this season haven't been good either (younglings vs pirates, droid mission).

I will say that the episode this weekend was awesome though. Just not sure it has more than a season left story-wise.

Well people thought this season would be the last because of the purchase but apparently they'll do S6 and they'll probably wrap all those things in this one. I'm not too sure they'll change CW's a lot but any future SW tv shows will probably have a similar fate to Marvel's current cartoons.

[Teen Titans]Yes, it has the original voice cast, but isnt canon with the old show.

They never said that, they just said that it wasn't going to continue storylines from the original show or have new story arcs since it was mostly a comedy show. But the show should easily fit in the TT canon, it's not like TT was the strictest show when it came to continuity. All the DC nation shorts fit perfectly without a problem. I'm sure the show will be filled with easter eggs for fans, and we'll see characters from the show. It just won't be action oriented or have heavy plots.

And while it's sad we won't see plots continue, I'm ok with that because to me S5 ended perfectly, while I'd love more that's a great place to stop and just hearing the original cast in new comedy skits will be a blast.

[CyberCubed]

Nah, even the voice actors were surprised the show had no continuity and wasn't like the old one. Teen Titans go is a comedy series with NO FIGHTING and no storylines. Its basically a chibi gag show stretched out to two 11 minute segments.

Most fans of Teen Titans will probably view this series as a bastardization of the original.

[cryan]

Makes me wonder if Scott Menville(Robin from Teen Titans) will be in the new TMNT series.

[Donatello19]

Here's a crazy idea. Maybe it's "thriving" because it's a good show.

[Ryanator008]

I know your new here, but don't argue with jester. And who made you a mod and put you in charge to tell everyone to stay on topic?

Can only mods do that here? Is that like an unwritten rule?

[Ryanator008]

Here's a crazy idea. Maybe it's "thriving" because it's a good show.

You'd be surprised how little that matters anymore. It's sad. Just look at Spongebob.

[snake]

Can only mods do that here? Is that like an unwritten rule?

No but you don't have to be the guy who constantly tells everyone the rules and what to do,

[snake]

You'd be surprised how little that matters anymore. It's sad. Just look at Spongebob.

That is sad:tcry: even more when Spongebob gets higher ratings then tmnt