Which was Darker: 2K3 or Red Sky?

[miru]

Tmnt's Red Sky seasons were pretty dark. So was 2k3. But, which one of the two was darker? I'd have to say 2K3.

* The evil mutants in the Red Sky seasons were much like those from earlier seasons except more threatening. In 2K3, they were mindless monsters.

* In 2k3, people actually died! (i think some characters may have died in the Red Sky seasons as well, like Dregg)

* 2K3's Shredder wants to destroy the world, not conquer it.

[ToTheNines]

Red Sky was a joke.

[Original TMNT Cartoon Fan]

Red Sky was a joke.

Season 8 was actually good. The show should end with "Turtle Trek". 2003 is darker.

[pannoni1]

Red Sky only went as far as destroying an iconic building (Channel 6), but nobody was presumed dead. There were still some fourth wall humor in those late seasons that was nearly absent in 4kids, even though that had slightly more pop cultural references on average per episode. Music/soundwise, they are about the same in terms of seriousness, but I'll give the edge to 4kids for a higher use of serious weapons and the lack of silly nonhuman enemies/vehicles in Red Sky such as the Bat-Men and the Dreggnaught.

[snake]

2k3, red sky was the dying point of the series.

[CyberCubed]

Red Sky was great, but it was basically TMNT-lite.

[ryukenden]

The fighting in Red Sky was rather tame compared to the 2K3 series to be honest. It was even tame compared to Season 1.

[RaphAndDonnie]

2k3, definetly.

[Icebot]

Hard to choose. In Red Sky, the sun never comes up and it's never day time but that happens once in a while in 2k3. Yet there are a lot more deaths in 2k3.

Didn't High Tech also die at the beginning of season 10 of the old toon?

[Pterobat]

2k3, of course.

The Red Sky episodes really didn't change much beyond the art style and shuffling/adding to the cast. The characters acted the same, the BS&P restrictions seemed to be the same, etc. It was only superficially dark.

2003, on the other hand, had some genuinely intense stuff. It was still a show for kids, but it had much more power and atmosphere than the Red Sky did, not to mention envelope-pushing stuff like bloodless impalement and of course, "Insane in the Membrane".

[Lethal Lullaby]

2k3 hands down. :tsmile:

[snake]

Hard to choose. In Red Sky, the sun never comes up and it's never day time but that happens once in a while in 2k3. Yet there are a lot more deaths in 2k3.

Didn't High Tech also die at the beginning of season 10 of the old toon?
No he didn't die.

[Coola Yagami]

2k3, of course.

The Red Sky episodes really didn't change much beyond the art style and shuffling/adding to the cast. The characters acted the same, the BS&P restrictions seemed to be the same, etc. It was only superficially dark.

2003, on the other hand, had some genuinely intense stuff. It was still a show for kids, but it had much more power and atmosphere than the Red Sky did, not to mention envelope-pushing stuff like bloodless impalement and of course, "Insane in the Membrane".

This. So much this.

Red Sky was not all that dark. It was just a bit more serious with less corny stupid storylines, no mad scientists and such. The TMNT still said silly jokes as they fought, Raph was still reduced to just throwing his sais all the time and all the monsters and mutants were overly cartoony and colorful to be dark or scary.

[ZariusTwo]

2k3 is the clear winner here. Red Sky was still MONDO tame compared to Batman: TAS, Exo Sqaud, and other edgier cartoons of the 90s

[DonatelloNinja82]

No doubt in my mind...2k3 was darker.

[ssjup81]

2k3 is the clear winner here. Red Sky was still MONDO tame compared to Batman: TAS, Exo Sqaud, and other edgier cartoons of the 90sIt's an unfair comparison, though. The original toon was being aired on network television. The other shows were on cable and more independent networks.

Of course 2K3 is darker by comparison as well as the shows you mentioned.

Bottom line 2K3 was allowed to be darker compared to the Red Sky eps.

[Refractive Reflections]

I'm a huge OT fan, but absolutely 2K3 WAS darker because the themes were darker.

The Red Sky of course removed the OT slapstick humor, but the other changes to make it "darker" were more cosmetic when you compare it to 2K3.

[Fugitoid Jones]

This is hardly a question; 2K3 was much darker. Red Sky was dark in terms of appearance, but 2K3 was much darker in terms of content.

[ABrown]

Red Sky was a joke.

I don't understand why people hate the red sky episodes so much. Those were far and away my favorite episodes of the series.

But to answer the question, I would still have to say that the first five seasons of the 4Kids series was darker than the red sky episodes.

[Refractive Reflections]

I don't understand why people hate the red sky episodes so much. Those were far and away my favorite episodes of the series.

I don't think most of us "hate" or "despise" the Red Sky episodes, I think those words are probably best suited for the 3rd TMNT movie or those abomination sing-a-long videos of the Turtles.:lol:

I think when the OT series set the bar so high, especially with the first few seasons (hey, it's what launched Turtlemania! :D), the Red Sky seasons just seemed...well...disappointing compared to the early seasons and fell short despite the well-intended efforts to update the OT series. The Red Sky seasons were clearly taking elements from Batman (the red sky, and angular faces), X-men (mutants vs. humans), and Power Rangers (alien warlord Zedd [Dregg in TMNT]) and in the process it distorted the unique OT tone to a point that seemed too vague from seasons 1-7. That's why some of us see the Red Sky as a little off-putting because it appeared the series was playing "catch up" by borrowing so many elements of more popular cartoons at that time (mid 1990s) rather than having it's own originality (to improve itself) that we loved in the earlier seasons.

[Pterobat]

I dislike them because they're dull, and they're such a transparent and lazy attempt to "keep up with the times".

[CyberCubed]

If Season 8 was a full 26 episode season I think people would have loved it.

[Coola Yagami]

If Season 8 was a full 26 episode season I think people would have loved it.

Not if it was more of the same..... we needed more of the characters too. Facing Lord Dregg and his lame crew every episode was boring. Yes, Shredder and Krang were repetitive as well... but we still had Baxter, Leatherhead, Rat King, and so forth. Other than the H.A.V.O.K mutants, all we had was Dregg, Dregg, Dregg.

[CyberCubed]

Not if it was more of the same..... we needed more of the characters too. Facing Lord Dregg and his lame crew every episode was boring. Yes, Shredder and Krang were repetitive as well... but we still had Baxter, Leatherhead, Rat King, and so forth. Other than the H.A.V.O.K mutants, all we had was Dregg, Dregg, Dregg.

Season 8 was before Dregg so it would have likely brought back Baxter, Leatherhead, etc. for more eps.

[Jephael]

To be honest, I don't think either the original toon's last three seasons or the 4Kids series' first few seasons were dark. They both were obvious attempts at making the TMNT seem grim and gritty, but all they really did was make the characters look like a bunch of drama queens!

[CyberCubed]

To be honest, I don't think either the original toon's last three seasons or the 4Kids series' first few seasons were dark. They both were obvious attempts at making the TMNT seem grim and gritty, but all they really did was make the characters look like a bunch of drama queens!

The characters looked like drama queens by not being stereotypically happy all the time?