Splinter is Kind of a Jerk (and an idiot)

[Konchadunga]

I've been noticing this for a while. The Nickelodeon Splinter is a fun character, in large part because he's so subversive. Past versions of this character got the occasional snark in, but everything they did seemed motivated by wisdom. Now, we have a younger Splinter with a fun-loving, adventurous, and mischievous personality, and I like that, for the most part.

Yet at times, Splinter seems more like a merciless gadfly than a loving father, and it gets on my nerves. I could bring up the "if-Splinter-is-much-tougher-than-they-are-why-doesn't-he-help-them-fight-their-enemies" point, but that's been common to every incarnation, so I won't. Nonetheless I can't forgive them for the instances where Splinter is willing to risk their, and even his own well-being just to teach the lesson of the day.

Exhibit A; the widely (and very deservedly) despised episode, Turtle Temper: Immediately after the pilot that started with Splinter overprotective of the Turtles and ended with the worry of letting out evidence of the gang's existence, and proving it brought Shredder to New York, a jerky man films them, and Splinter actually obsesses more about teaching Raphael to be nice to him than taking away the evidence quickly. I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Maybe Raph's temper was excessive, but teaching him to hold back absolutely should not have been a priority at the time. Splinter should have told them, get that phone at all costs, but really, they wouldn't even need to exhaust all costs; there are plenty of ways to extract something forcefully from somebody without doing any real harm to him. Faint praise for that horrid episode, but at least it seemed to show that Splinter was wrong, in that his advised method of being nice about the phone completely failed.

The problem is that he never learned that he was wrong, which brings us to Exhibit B: More recently, this same garbage has repeated with Splinter's new lesson of learning to adapt. So New York is in trouble, the Turtles are the only ones that can save the day, and yet our "loving father" decides then is the best time to teach the Turtles not to rely solely on their weapons of choice. Some last-minute training on that before a dangerous mission wouldn't be amiss, but to make the mission itself the training, at a time Splinter could see that the Turtles obviously were not ready, is all kinds of cruel and stupid.

I can forgive a lot in children's cartoons. I get that they're not meant for adults who type logical essays and have matured moral standards. Yet it's for that very reason I absolutely cannot forgive children's cartoons giving children a role-model whose logic and moral standards are just abysmal. This is the sort of mind-rot idiot moral guardians accuse pop-culture of spreading, and 90% of the time, their criticisms are garbage, but the 10% of time they're not; that just is going to give them fuel for their fallacy.

So to anyone at Nick reading, please shape up. It's not a problem that you want to make a more fallible, interesting Splinter, but if that's the case, some time you need to knock him off his high horse and make him regret some of his dumber decisions.

[Martin]

Yeah he is fairly inconsistent throughout the episodes. I can't name off the top of my head all the times that he's pissed me off, but the worst by far was the one you mentioned from 'pulverizer returns'. Forcing them to use weapons they have clearly not been trained to use in life or death situations doesn't seem to be a very wise decision.

Also, I don't really understand why he doesn't get involved in any of the fights the turtles have. I mean, it's technically his fault Shredder wants his children filleted to begin with, so why not help? At least he could have helped April when she was being chased by Karai. My guess is that they've made him so much of a badass that he is the equivalent of a rat shaped chuck norris; he would unbalance things. However, in other iterations they had the excuse of him being too old to be out helping the turtles all the time; but in this one? IDK, I guess he is just lazy.

I kind of wish he was more like IDW's splinter. Over there, he hangs out with the turtles in plenty of occasions :ohwell:

[CyberCubed]

Splinter rarely got involved in fights in the original cartoon either. Every time Shredder and Krang came up with a new scheme Splinter would stay home aside from rare occasions.

[miru]

In the Mirage comics, Splinter was much worse.

[alliance]

damn writers..

[oldmanwinters]

I have been curious as to why Splinter seems to be so reluctant to actually go up to the surface himself. 4Kids Splinter was the most reluctant to give the turtles permission to go topside, but he was also the most willing to go after them if he sensed they were in trouble.

I'll be curious to see if Nick show ever explains why he prefers to stay in the lair all day and night.

[BabyTurtles]

totally disagree I like this Splinter
and think half the time something goes wrong is the turtles fault for not listening to him in the first place.

Splinter admits his past mistakes and tries to make sure the turtles don't do the same. so in Raph's case, he didn't want him to be blind with anger and let that dictate his decisions.

though in Panic in the Sewer he admits he was causing the turtles to be even more afraid than they should be and apologizes.

I think Nick is doing a great job (the Pulverizer returns episode was the only time Splinter was acting a little weird though, but thats okay...it happens)

I have no idea why Splinter doesn't want to go to the surface, but I'm sure there is a good reason

[Bauer536]

I've been noticing this for a while. The Nickelodeon Splinter is a fun character, in large part because he's so subversive. Past versions of this character got the occasional snark in, but everything they did seemed motivated by wisdom. Now, we have a younger Splinter with a fun-loving, adventurous, and mischievous personality, and I like that, for the most part.

That's the same reason why I enjoy this Splinter.:tcool:

Yet at times, Splinter seems more like a merciless gadfly than a loving father, and it gets on my nerves. I could bring up the "if-Splinter-is-much-tougher-than-they-are-why-doesn't-he-help-them-fight-their-enemies" point, but that's been common to every incarnation, so I won't. Nonetheless I can't forgive them for the instances where Splinter is willing to risk their, and even his own well-being just to teach the lesson of the day.

As much as I want Splinter to help them, the show is called Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Mostly, it's about the turtles and focuses on what they do in action. Splinter is just a supporting character like April. At times, he's there for them, and others, he's not.:twink:

Exhibit A; the widely (and very deservedly) despised episode, Turtle Temper: Immediately after the pilot that started with Splinter overprotective of the Turtles and ended with the worry of letting out evidence of the gang's existence, and proving it brought Shredder to New York, a jerky man films them, and Splinter actually obsesses more about teaching Raphael to be nice to him than taking away the evidence quickly. I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Maybe Raph's temper was excessive, but teaching him to hold back absolutely should not have been a priority at the time. Splinter should have told them, get that phone at all costs, but really, they wouldn't even need to exhaust all costs; there are plenty of ways to extract something forcefully from somebody without doing any real harm to him. Faint praise for that horrid episode, but at least it seemed to show that Splinter was wrong, in that his advised method of being nice about the phone completely failed.

Now, this I will disagree with you. He probably didn't want his sons to take such a risk in case of danger. I mean, it wasn't Splinter's plan to stop Shredder at the harbor. That was Raph's (and both Leo and Don agreed to it). If Raph went to take brute force without being nice, something else would have happened. Either the recording would be destroyed, or Vic would still find a way to expose them. I had no problem with Splinter in this one. I mean, this show is for kids. Obviously, this episode was supposed to teach kids a lesson in dealing with insults. The episode is not as bad as some of you claim to be. Only here, but not outside the forums. I liked "Turtle Temper." It was a good Raph episode.:tcool: Do I agree Splinter's idea failed? Not really. Maybe he's just ignorant of the surface, only making the turtles look better.

The problem is that he never learned that he was wrong, which brings us to Exhibit B: More recently, this same garbage has repeated with Splinter's new lesson of learning to adapt. So New York is in trouble, the Turtles are the only ones that can save the day, and yet our "loving father" decides then is the best time to teach the Turtles not to rely solely on their weapons of choice. Some last-minute training on that before a dangerous mission wouldn't be amiss, but to make the mission itself the training, at a time Splinter could see that the Turtles obviously were not ready, is all kinds of cruel and stupid.

Now, this, THIS, I will agree with you on. Jeremy Shipp wrote "Turtle Temper," but I really enjoyed "Panic in the Sewers" and "New Girl in Town" (and "Cockroach Terminator").:tlol: However, he's not the strongest writer of the staff. Even if the Pulverizer was annoying in "Pulverizer Returns," it was the weapons switch that had me the wrong way. I thought it was stupid that this was happening at the same time. Besides, if anything could be a weapon, then why can't they be used the same way. I hate coming somewhere where someone says that the turtles suck without their weapons. Really? Leo used ninja stars at the most opportune times, and they worked. Mikey used a beehive to hit Baxter, and that worked. And how can we forget - The turtles used freakin' bows and arrows at Kraang droids!:tmad: How was this lesson necessary when they already use other objects as weapons? This episode, I'm sad to say, was poor writing (except for the brotherly interactions).:twink: What Splinter did was cruel and stupid. He really must not know what happens in the city. We never even seen an episode where he observes humans.

Okay. I need to know. Is this the beginning of the Nick TMNT hate? I can see why Ciro Nieli left this place. Some of you guys are never satisfied. You always have to find something wrong. Yes, I do the same, but this goes too far. What I thought Splinter did in the last episode so far wasn't smart, but that doesn't mean he's not Splinter. He's still the wise and loving father we know and love. He's just, what's that word? Cynical.:twink:

[BabyTurtles]

Okay. I need to know. Is this the beginning of the Nick TMNT hate? I can see why Ciro Nieli left this place. Some of you guys are never satisfied. You always have to find something wrong. Yes, I do the same, but this goes too far. What I thought Splinter did in the last episode so far wasn't smart, but that doesn't mean he's not Splinter. He's still the wise and loving father we know and love. He's just, what's that word? Cynical.:twink:

I think our problem is...we have too much time on our hands...waiting for the new episodes to air XD......

[Gwydion]

I will definitely agree with you on Splinter's actions in Pulverizer Returns; I already discussed this in the talkback thread, though, so I'll leave it at that.

I would have to disagree on Turtle Temper, however. I had no problem with the lesson he was trying to teach Raphael. I don't think he was trying to diminish the fact that getting caught on video was really bad - he was clearly upset about this. He mentioned that they needed to get the phone back, and as the old saying goes "you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar". He was trying to teach Raph to control his anger, but I don't think he was against them using other means to get the video if it ended up being necessary. Did being nice work? No, but that's still no reason for Raph to lose his temper and go berserk; there were still plenty of other ways they could have gotten the video.

Overall I really like this Splinter. He has had the occasional hiccup (like in the PR episode), but that's bound to happen when you have multiple writers on any project. It's not like Splinter is the only one who has his "bad" or "poorly written" moments (I'd argue most of the main cast has already had at least one), but maybe it stands out more because he doesn't get as much screentime as the Turtles and he's the parental figure.

I think our problem is...we have too much time on our hands...waiting for the new episodes to air XD......

Agreed! LOL

[Powder]

]Okay. I need to know. Is this the beginning of the Nick TMNT hate? I can see why Ciro Nieli left this place. Some of you guys are never satisfied. You always have to find something wrong. Yes, I do the same, but this goes too far.

Stop looking for problems where there aren't any. Jesus H. Christ. Get on some anxiety meds you paranoid looney toon. People are just trying to make discussion, if you want to see nothing but ass-patting why don't you go to the forums for little kids? The turtles are a 30 year old classic property, no matter who's at the helm, there will always be scrutiny, analyzing, speculation, etc, just as much as there will be praise and love (which there has been no shortage of here). These are what fandom forum topics are made of. With no new episodes for a while, people are looking for things to talk about. Exploring a character, what makes them tick, is what fans do.

[BabyTurtles]

Stop looking for problems where there aren't any. Jesus H. Christ. Get on some anxiety meds you paranoid looney toon. People are just trying to make discussion, if you want to see nothing but ass-patting why don't you go to the forums for little kids? The turtles are a 30 year old classic property, no matter who's at the helm, there will always be scrutiny, analyzing, speculation, etc, just as much as there will be praise and love (which there has been no shortage of here). These are what fandom forum topics are made of. With no new episodes for a while, people are looking for things to talk about. Exploring a character, what makes them tick, is what fans do.

hey! don't be harsh man it's uncool.
you can disagree with him, but you don't need to say unnecessary things

[CyberCubed]

hey! don't be harsh man it's uncool.
you can disagree with him, but you don't need to say unnecessary things

He's right though, we're supposed to analyze and critique aspects of the show. Obviously little kids won't notice these things as they're too young, but adults usually analyze shows and characters.

There's nothing wrong with it.

[BabyTurtles]

He's right though, we're supposed to analyze and critique aspects of the show. Obviously little kids won't notice these things as they're too young, but adults usually analyze shows and characters.

There's nothing wrong with it.

I never said he was wrong, I just said he didn't have to say the mean things he said in his post.

and back to Splinter, I'm an adult and I understand that it's okay to analyze....but theres such thing as analyzing too much.

though I'm not gonna stop anyone from debating about it XDD

[RaphAndDonnie]

Overall I really like this Splinter. He has had the occasional hiccup (like in the PR episode), but that's bound to happen when you have multiple writers on any project. It's not like Splinter is the only one who has his "bad" or "poorly written" moments (I'd argue most of the main cast has already had at least one), but maybe it stands out more because he doesn't get as much screentime as the Turtles and he's the parental figure.


Yeah pretty much this. I think they're trying to mold Splinter into his definitive form. Like they haven't officially decided on what they want him to be like but they have a general idea.

[ShredderX633]

I've been noticing this for a while. The Nickelodeon Splinter is a fun character, in large part because he's so subversive. Past versions of this character got the occasional snark in, but everything they did seemed motivated by wisdom. Now, we have a younger Splinter with a fun-loving, adventurous, and mischievous personality, and I like that, for the most part.

That's the same reason why I enjoy this Splinter.:tcool:

Yet at times, Splinter seems more like a merciless gadfly than a loving father, and it gets on my nerves. I could bring up the "if-Splinter-is-much-tougher-than-they-are-why-doesn't-he-help-them-fight-their-enemies" point, but that's been common to every incarnation, so I won't. Nonetheless I can't forgive them for the instances where Splinter is willing to risk their, and even his own well-being just to teach the lesson of the day.

As much as I want Splinter to help them, the show is called Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Mostly, it's about the turtles and focuses on what they do in action. Splinter is just a supporting character like April. At times, he's there for them, and others, he's not.:twink:

Exhibit A; the widely (and very deservedly) despised episode, Turtle Temper: Immediately after the pilot that started with Splinter overprotective of the Turtles and ended with the worry of letting out evidence of the gang's existence, and proving it brought Shredder to New York, a jerky man films them, and Splinter actually obsesses more about teaching Raphael to be nice to him than taking away the evidence quickly. I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Maybe Raph's temper was excessive, but teaching him to hold back absolutely should not have been a priority at the time. Splinter should have told them, get that phone at all costs, but really, they wouldn't even need to exhaust all costs; there are plenty of ways to extract something forcefully from somebody without doing any real harm to him. Faint praise for that horrid episode, but at least it seemed to show that Splinter was wrong, in that his advised method of being nice about the phone completely failed.

Now, this I will disagree with you. He probably didn't want his sons to take such a risk in case of danger. I mean, it wasn't Splinter's plan to stop Shredder at the harbor. That was Raph's (and both Leo and Don agreed to it). If Raph went to take brute force without being nice, something else would have happened. Either the recording would be destroyed, or Vic would still find a way to expose them. I had no problem with Splinter in this one. I mean, this show is for kids. Obviously, this episode was supposed to teach kids a lesson in dealing with insults. The episode is not as bad as some of you claim to be. Only here, but not outside the forums. I liked "Turtle Temper." It was a good Raph episode.:tcool: Do I agree Splinter's idea failed? Not really. Maybe he's just ignorant of the surface, only making the turtles look better.

The problem is that he never learned that he was wrong, which brings us to Exhibit B: More recently, this same garbage has repeated with Splinter's new lesson of learning to adapt. So New York is in trouble, the Turtles are the only ones that can save the day, and yet our "loving father" decides then is the best time to teach the Turtles not to rely solely on their weapons of choice. Some last-minute training on that before a dangerous mission wouldn't be amiss, but to make the mission itself the training, at a time Splinter could see that the Turtles obviously were not ready, is all kinds of cruel and stupid.

Now, this, THIS, I will agree with you on. Jeremy Shipp wrote "Turtle Temper," but I really enjoyed "Panic in the Sewers" and "New Girl in Town" (and "Cockroach Terminator").:tlol: However, he's not the strongest writer of the staff. Even if the Pulverizer was annoying in "Pulverizer Returns," it was the weapons switch that had me the wrong way. I thought it was stupid that this was happening at the same time. Besides, if anything could be a weapon, then why can't they be used the same way. I hate coming somewhere where someone says that the turtles suck without their weapons. Really? Leo used ninja stars at the most opportune times, and they worked. Mikey used a beehive to hit Baxter, and that worked. And how can we forget - The turtles used freakin' bows and arrows at Kraang droids!:tmad: How was this lesson necessary when they already use other objects as weapons? This episode, I'm sad to say, was poor writing (except for the brotherly interactions).:twink: What Splinter did was cruel and stupid. He really must not know what happens in the city. We never even seen an episode where he observes humans.

Okay. I need to know. Is this the beginning of the Nick TMNT hate? I can see why Ciro Nieli left this place. Some of you guys are never satisfied. You always have to find something wrong. Yes, I do the same, but this goes too far. What I thought Splinter did in the last episode so far wasn't smart, but that doesn't mean he's not Splinter. He's still the wise and loving father we know and love. He's just, what's that word? Cynical.:twink:

Wow Bauer those are some good points and let's not forget Mikey's water balloon that saved their shells when the Foot were going to dump Chlorosophonic acid in the sewers. I guess it wasn't Splinter's fault as much as it was the writing that made things confusing.

[ShredderX633]

Besides at least this show is WAY better than Pokemon in season 1 now that one you guys can sink your critical teeth into as I did. That season has so many plotholes, logical mistakes, poor writing and common errors that people get in shock when they realize how unbearably horrid the original season was. It even has the most continuity errors I've ever seen in a Japanese show ever made.

[The Sewer Lord]

Now, this, THIS, I will agree with you on. Jeremy Shipp wrote "Turtle Temper," but I really enjoyed "Panic in the Sewers" and "New Girl in Town" (and "Cockroach Terminator").:tlol: However, he's not the strongest writer of the staff. Even if the Pulverizer was annoying in "Pulverizer Returns," it was the weapons switch that had me the wrong way. I thought it was stupid that this was happening at the same time. Besides, if anything could be a weapon, then why can't they be used the same way. I hate coming somewhere where someone says that the turtles suck without their weapons. Really? Leo used ninja stars at the most opportune times, and they worked. Mikey used a beehive to hit Baxter, and that worked. And how can we forget - The turtles used freakin' bows and arrows at Kraang droids!:tmad: How was this lesson necessary when they already use other objects as weapons? This episode, I'm sad to say, was poor writing (except for the brotherly interactions).:twink: What Splinter did was cruel and stupid. He really must not know what happens in the city. We never even seen an episode where he observes humans.

Not to mention Donnie fought Rockwell without his bo staff and Raph beat Donnie without his sai.
Also, FINALLY someone else like "Cockroach Terminator". :)

[Powder]

Besides at least this show is WAY better than Pokemon in season 1 - people get in shock when they realize how unbearably horrid the original season was.

You really need to stop acting like you speak for everyone else in the world.

[The Sewer Lord]

The first Pokemon season was horrible.

[BabyTurtles]

The first Pokemon season was horrible.

awww I liked it :D

....then again I like all pokemon seasons XD......

[Candy Kappa]

it's just a case of having their cake and eat it.

They want a younger Splinter, but the show is not called Splinter & the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

I haven't had any issues with Splinters lessons. Don't fight fair, you can lose then. Don't let anger cloud you, but channel it for something better. Don't think, act. Anything can be a weapon. The man (rat) is far from a jerk or an idiot, he combines many of the good aspects of the previous Splinters.

I do hope they explain why Splinter don;t go up to the surface, maybe he is scared of it now that he is a mutant. He might be ashamed of his appearance.

[Konchadunga]

In the Mirage comics, Splinter was much worse.

Correction: He was much meaner. Yet Mirage Splinter knew what sort of character he wanted to be; his original motive was revenge, and so given that he could just achieve it, there would then be less motivation to staying in hiding or making a huge effort to put one's best foot forward.

This Splinter just flipflops. He urges being nice, despite being irritable and deprecating himself, he goes from overprotective to reckless depending on the episode, he cannot decide on what his priority is.


Now, this I will disagree with you. He probably didn't want his sons to take such a risk in case of danger. I mean, it wasn't Splinter's plan to stop Shredder at the harbor. That was Raph's (and both Leo and Don agreed to it). If Raph went to take brute force without being nice, something else would have happened. Either the recording would be destroyed, or Vic would still find a way to expose them. I had no problem with Splinter in this one. I mean, this show is for kids. Obviously, this episode was supposed to teach kids a lesson in dealing with insults. The episode is not as bad as some of you claim to be. Only here, but not outside the forums. I liked "Turtle Temper." It was a good Raph episode.:tcool: Do I agree Splinter's idea failed? Not really. Maybe he's just ignorant of the surface, only making the turtles look better.

To shell with that. Insults should be illegal, you don't let loose lips slip when you're at war, and I sympathize with Raph. This episode felt like a bunch of hippy-dippy garbage; the likes of which is unfortunately becoming stylish again in today's society, but I'll get off my soapbox now. Also, even entertaining the notion that trying to be nice first was a good idea, Splinter should not have trusted Raph to do it; he should have kept him home and let the calmer turtles handle it.

Okay. I need to know. Is this the beginning of the Nick TMNT hate? I can see why Ciro Nieli left this place. Some of you guys are never satisfied. You always have to find something wrong. Yes, I do the same, but this goes too far. What I thought Splinter did in the last episode so far wasn't smart, but that doesn't mean he's not Splinter. He's still the wise and loving father we know and love. He's just, what's that word? Cynical.:twink:

"Hate?" Where? By whom? There was a lot of animosity directed at this show since way before it was released. After that, sure some people hated it, but they weren't the majority. As for me, the thing that first dampened my fandom of this show was deluge of filler-episodes, but I don't hate it at all, and I'm sure most don't, either.

[Shark_Blade]

His thinking might be flawed but his intention was good. That's what makes it appealing to me, it's believable.

[drgon78]

I really like this version of Splinter and too be honest he very rarely ever went with them on missions in other versions of the series, so why start now.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

He is the most different Splinter, not so frail and Yoda like.

[BubblyShell22]

You have to realize that Splinter isn't the perfect parent. No parent is in today's world. Parents are allowed to have flaws and make mistakes as they're only human. They want the best for their children, but sometimes their lessons aren't always the best way to learn, and the kids have to learn on their own. That's what this Splinter is doing. I agree that the weapons switch wasn't the best lesson, but Splinter meant well in what he was trying to teach them. That's what parents do. They aren't always right in some things, but they mean well when they try to teach their kids something. I think this show is reflecting on that nicely.

As for why Splinter won't go up to the surface: I think it's a combination of bad memories from the tragedy and his mutant form. However, I think he will go to the surface eventually.

[Coola Yagami]

I agree with Splinter's 'let **** slip' advice in Turtle Temper. After all, how did 2K3 Mike defeat 2K3 Raph? With insults. How does Spider-Man beat most of his enemies? Insults. Insults in a fight can be distracting, piss you off, and make you lose focus and basically fight like an idiot, in which the more highly skilled guy can take advantage and take you down.

Also I always felt Splinter was more accepting of the fact that he's a freak of nature now and shouldn't be running around among humans anymore and just chooses to retire his life in the sewers. The turtles are still in the overeager teenage stage of their lives so they're more 'the shell with that' and wanna go to the surface as often as possible.

[DonatelloNinja82]

You have to realize that Splinter isn't the perfect parent. No parent is in today's world. Parents are allowed to have flaws and make mistakes as they're only human. They want the best for their children, but sometimes their lessons aren't always the best way to learn, and the kids have to learn on their own. That's what this Splinter is doing. I agree that the weapons switch wasn't the best lesson, but Splinter meant well in what he was trying to teach them. That's what parents do. They aren't always right in some things, but they mean well when they try to teach their kids something. I think this show is reflecting on that nicely.

As for why Splinter won't go up to the surface: I think it's a combination of bad memories from the tragedy and his mutant form. However, I think he will go to the surface eventually.

Well said, Bubbly. I like this Splinter, too. He is definitely different from other Splinters. I like this one's sarcasm. Yes, he makes mistakes, but overall he loves is sons. He's also one of the most tragic Splinters. I think Splinter starting as Hamato Yoshi and becoming a mutant is more tragic than being a rat first...but this Splinter has it worse than OT Splinter did. I believe this has a huge impact on his actions and behaviors. I don't think he has ever come to terms with being a mutant and is reluctant to go to the surface because of that.

[ShredderX633]

You really need to stop acting like you speak for everyone else in the world.

I never said I was speaking for everyone I'm only trying to help others understand the legitimate issues in franchises so they don't become obsessed with it. We have seen in the past and sadly even today how insane fans over a franchise can ruin and destroy a series. Like how G1 fans mourning over Optimus's death caused the end of G1 or how anal He-man fans assaulted the MYP series all because it looked too "anime" like. I'm just at least making a statement for people to read so they don't make a mistake that could coincidentally destroy the very thing they love.

[ShredderX633]

The first Pokemon season was horrible.

Thank you for understanding my point. There's nothing wrong with liking it, but if someone says the new series is ruining the show, then they're clearly unable to accept the fact that their show they grew up with isn't all that much better. Remember if a show is going to be based off a game or anything for that matter, make it look like you did your research. The Nostalgia Critic made that point clear and this is what old fans need to accept.

[CyberCubed]

The difference with Pokemon is the anime was always designed to be repetitive from day one. The only difference is the first season in Kanto was the first time we were seeing everything, so it felt much more fresh. By the time the Johto seasons started the show went into its repetitive rut that followed in every arc after.

[Candy Kappa]

I agree with Splinter's 'let **** slip' advice in Turtle Temper. After all, how did 2K3 Mike defeat 2K3 Raph? With insults. How does Spider-Man beat most of his enemies? Insults. Insults in a fight can be distracting, piss you off, and make you lose focus and basically fight like an idiot, in which the more highly skilled guy can take advantage and take you down.

I'm pretty sure the lesson wasn't about not using insults, but don't lose your focus when someone insults you. Like Raph did, losing his focus when Vic was insulting him.

I still think Splinter would approve that the turtles do the same against an opponent. Because seek victory not fairness.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

Okay, I can look past the previous 'lessons' that Splinter taught them, but the 'switch waepons/no weapons' thing during combat, when thier lives were in danger and the Pulverizer complicating things, was stupid, just plain stupid. Besides leaving the four at a disadvantage where they could have died, Splinter may just be indirectly responsible for creating one of the turtles most dangerous enimies during the coming season.

[BubblyShell22]

Actually, I think Mutagen Man is going to be an ally for the Turtles, not an enemy. I agree that Splinter made a mistake, and maybe he realized that himself in time. That's what makes him so realistic. He's flawed and certainly isn't perfect.

[ShredderX633]

The lesson with switching weapons wasn't a bad lesson as they were getting pretty cocky by that point. It's just the timing was terrible and it should have been used in a filler episode and not the Pulverizer Returns. I will admit I don't really like how overconfident they are in this series as they were never this full of themselves before, but that's just one of the very few complaints I have with this series. They did make April FINALLY involved in the plot for once and that's one huge step up for any tmnt incarnation.

[raph27]

Why all the hate for switching and taking away weapons? You do know they have fists right? And feet for kicking? I don't think it was a stupid Splinter thing, personally I thought it was kinda dumb that they couldn't even use the weapons.

[Avatar Yuffie]

I really don't mind Splinter's bouts of anger. I find it a fascinating character flaw.


Exhibit B: More recently, this same garbage has repeated with Splinter's new lesson of learning to adapt. So New York is in trouble, the Turtles are the only ones that can save the day, and yet our "loving father" decides then is the best time to teach the Turtles not to rely solely on their weapons of choice. Some last-minute training on that before a dangerous mission wouldn't be amiss, but to make the mission itself the training, at a time Splinter could see that the Turtles obviously were not ready, is all kinds of cruel and stupid.

Ok, what part of "the Turtles are beating up bottom barrel mooks and getting themselves too complacent" part did the show not tell you? Around this time, they're pretty confident fighting Xever, Bradford and Shredder (as seen in Enemy of My Enemy, and they didn't even have Leo backing them up). Splinter just merely pushed them out from their comfort zone. And last I look, they did well with random stuff they picked up as a weapon, which is the point of the lesson.

I know fans want Splinter and April to show up more, but they're not the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

[Shredded]

Well.. for the weapons switch, what I gathered was that Splinters main concern was that the turtles were growing over confident.. again!

What happened the last time they grew over confident? Shredder almost killed them! So Splinter wanted to teach them some humility ones again, and teach them not to be so confident in their current position, things can change pretty quick, and he knows that.

He knows he wont be there to pull them out and protect thim for-ever, so he wants them to grow as much as possible while he can still help them when they really need it.

At least that's how I see it.

[Martin]

Switching weapons in theory isn't a bad idea, the problem was that they clearly had no idea how to use other weapons beside their own. I fail to see how it is a good idea to make them face life or death situations with a big handicap. You want them to learn how to use new weapons? Well, how about you teach them how to use them before throwing them into the frying pan :ohwell:

[The Sewer Lord]

Okay, I can look past the previous 'lessons' that Splinter taught them, but the 'switch waepons/no weapons' thing during combat, when thier lives were in danger and the Pulverizer complicating things, was stupid, just plain stupid. Besides leaving the four at a disadvantage where they could have died, Splinter may just be indirectly responsible for creating one of the turtles most dangerous enimies during the coming season.
I agree with this.

[kelligrafie]

Splinter seems to impart his wisdom via Chinese proverbs. Which to me, can be interpreted a number of ways depending on who is receiving the advice.

Don't forget Splinter knows each of the turtles intimately, he has lived with them for 15 years (in this series). We haven't (aside from the fact they're not real blah blah blah).

Without wanting to get too deep and psychological, the turtles may glean some hidden meaning from whatever Splinter says, that won't be immediately obvious to us viewers?


And in regards to making them fight without weapons before a battle being dangerous, I'd say that the turtles are in danger 24/7 now that Shredder has aligned with the Kraang. With or without weapons. If they don't face an enemy minus weapons now, it'll happen at a later date. Splinter simply forced the timing of it.

Without wanting to change the subject, it reminds me of the argument between Harry Potter and Dolores Umbridge during DADA where he states, "If we're going to be attacked, it won't be risk free." I feel it's the same principle here.

[Bossa Nova]

Switching weapons in theory isn't a bad idea, the problem was that they clearly had no idea how to use other weapons beside their own. I fail to see how it is a good idea to make them face life or death situations with a big handicap. You want them to learn how to use new weapons? Well, how about you teach them how to use them before throwing them into the frying pan :ohwell:

Pretty much this. Someone else has already pointed out that the turtles are in fact very GOOD at using whatever's at their disposal to use at weapons when in a pinch, but when training with each others weapons it wasn't just random crap laying around. It was an actual other weapon, something they know has a specific way to be handled and used and they were trying to go about using them in such a way. Obviously in this version Splinter hasn't taught them all at least the basics in each others weapons, and I doubt he would have been happy if they just wound up randomly throwing them at each other either (like they did at Tim at the end of the episode), so I don't really know what he expected of them. To just randomly, instinctively know how to use double swords when you've only been training with nunchucks your whole life? Please.

[Dudette]

Switching weapons in theory isn't a bad idea, the problem was that they clearly had no idea how to use other weapons beside their own. I fail to see how it is a good idea to make them face life or death situations with a big handicap. You want them to learn how to use new weapons? Well, how about you teach them how to use them before throwing them into the frying pan :ohwell:

I fully agree with you on this.

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

Of course, I can't say anything for certain about Splinter's teaching style. Just wondering.

[crd2082]

Eh, I wasn't bothered by Splinter making them fight with no weapons.

As he said during the episode, they had grown complacent. At the start of the series they were returning home battered and bruised. Now they fight the Krang, the Foot and Shredder and come home without a scratch. I believe Splinter had a good feeling that even if they fought without weapons it wouldn't make much difference, and it didn't.

Hell, Donnie was able to take on Dogpound, Fishface and some foot soldiers WHILE keeping Pulverizer out of harms way without much trouble and without his familiar weapon. What was important for this lesson was learning how to adapt to not having weapons. A valuable lesson. And it was better that they learn it now when they were facing something they felt they could handle than the alternative.

What bothered me more than that was the fact that none of them knew how to wield another turtles' weapons. I mean NO idea. Leo should not have had as much trouble as he did with Donnie's bo staff for example. Tripping over it, really? Watching Mikey spin Leo's katanas around like nunchaku was hilarious though.

[raph27]

I know! That was practically the ONLY flaw in the episode for me.

[RskimB]

considering how much "younger" they make this Splinter versus any other incarnations I'm wondering what is stopping them from having Splinter fight alongside the turtles.

[The Sewer Lord]

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

I think so.

[Candy Kappa]

I fully agree with you on this.

What did strike to me as odd was that if the turtles are learning the art of ninjutsu from Splinter, doesn't ninjutsu include at least bojutsu and kenjutsu as a "must" in the training program. The sais and nunchucks are optional, but they all should be able to fight well with Donnie's Bo and at least so-so with Leo's katanas.

Of course, I can't say anything for certain about Splinter's teaching style. Just wondering.

According to Bujinkan yes, Bugei juhappan is according to them mentioned in the Togakure-Ryu scrolls, and are used in modern teachings of Togakure-Ryu. Historical accuracy? dubious, but Splinter is a modern/pop culture Ninja.

[victory_angel]

I don't think of Splinter as a Jerk. His sons are fifteen, so I think largely he stands back and lets his sons try and figure out things on their own with out daddy having step in and save the day. He knows he's not going to be with them forever so when that day comes they would be able rely on one another. And he also doesn't want them to repeat mistakes that he has made or that other people have made.

Some examples being Metalhead- There is one part where Raph makes a rude comment about Donnie's weapon while Splinter is in earshot. Splinter however doesn't comment because 1. Donnie is fifteen and any issues he has with his brothers is old enough to deal with on his own. It would be more of an insult for Splinter to step in a defend Donatello because that would be saying he is incapable of standing up to his brothers.

New Friend, Old Enemy carried and Never say Xever had two halves of the same lesson. So the full lesson is "Win no matter what it takes, but don't stoop to the level of your enemy."

Pulverizer returns: It's already been covered that the weapon chooses you just as much as you choose it. So the weapon in that case would only trust you as much as you trust it. So while the obvious lesson of that exercise is to learn to adapt to what is unfamiliar.There is the unspoken lesson of learning from each other that the Turtles never consider.

Buyakashowdown- The lesson of "With the world at stake you must complete the mission no matter what or who you have to sacrifice." Sounds rather hypocritical for someone who has repeatedly stated that the Turtles are the only precious things he has left. Since it sort of sounds like he's saying "Go ahead and abandon someone". But in reality it's more like "Between saving an individual such as one of your brothers and the lives of numerous innocent people. Save the numerous innocent first." As Captain Kirk has stated-The needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few.

Mutagen Man unleashed: Private lesson for Donnie that he shouldn't force April to like him. This lesson was meant an early intervention to keep Donnie from falling down a path that would end up destroying him. What caused the lesson in the first place is Donnie had been jealously ranting about how April obviously likes Casey because he's human and other such things. Splinter more then likely over heard this and that sends up some warning bells because the Shredder could not accept the fact that Teng Shen loved another man and let his jealousy consume him. Even his statement of "For one so brilliant the obvious seems to allude you" felt like he was saying "You should listen to yourself."

[plastroncafe]

You mean the Mystical Asian Stereotype isn't a 100% fleshed out wonderful character?

Well color me shocked. SHOCKED!
And I say this as someone who finds the Nick version to be the best of the incarnations.

The show is more through the kids' eyes than it is through the Adults, which is why I think Splinter comes across as an absentee father.

[BabyTurtles]

IDK.....he's not perfect (which I'm glad he isn't)

I like him this way...he's trying to be both a sensei and a father.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, same here. I love Splinter and how he's portrayed. Parents are allowed to make mistakes too, and Splinter has done this at times. He even admitted to it in "Panic in the Sewers" when he stated that he was the reason the Turtles were too scared to go up to the surface and that he'd been holding them back.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

I was just talking about Splinter and his role in the new Nick show and I was even going to open a thread.

TBH I think he is actually really irresponsible, he lets the turtles do pretty much what they want. He lets Don experiment on un tested and un staple compounds at the tender age of 15, who has absolutely no qualifications or practice in that area of expertise. Leo still is not a strong leader at this point in the show, and some what inexperienced, yet he puts the fate of the world on his shoulders and almost sends him to his death while he was panning on sitting in his cosy little sewer and doing nothing. Keeping Timothy in their home is just plan daft, he should be in a proper facility, with qualified doctors/scientists, not some 15 year old who has no experience in that field.

At the end of the day they are only 15 and taking on to much, without adult supervision. We all make mistakes but he needs to play a bigger role in what they get up to.

[Shark_Blade]

He's a flawed but realistic portrayal of parent/father so far imo. The best.

I like that he's strict and puts out punishments on the boys. And physically, he's very ideal - the tallest of them all, towering his children, dominating them. A feel of authority above all.

[Ashwolf]

He lets Don experiment on un tested and un staple compounds at the tender age of 15, who has absolutely no qualifications or practice in that area of expertise. Leo still is not a strong leader at this point in the show, and some what inexperienced, yet he puts the fate of the world on his shoulders and almost sends him to his death while he was panning on sitting in his cosy little sewer and doing nothing. Keeping Timothy in their home is just plan daft, he should be in a proper facility, with qualified doctors/scientists, not some 15 year old who has no experience in that field.

At the end of the day they are only 15 and taking on to much, without adult supervision. We all make mistakes but he needs to play a bigger role in what they get up to.

being a leader, u gotta deal w/ the pressure sometimes, even if it is all or nothing/life altering

as far as don goes, it wouldn't be don much if he didn't learn new science tricks along the way

if tim was in some facility, that pretty much would be the end of him cause all those qualified doctors and scientists would keep him locked up 4 as long as they wanted or needed

in all honesty from the way I see it, yes, hes giving them more freedom than in the past, there r moments where im surprised he didn't go aid them at least in the background but it might be part of his condition from mutating but it doesn't change how hes teaching them

[Technogeek29]

He's a flawed but realistic portrayal of parent/father so far imo. The best.

I like that he's strict and puts out punishments on the boys. And physically, he's very ideal - the tallest of them all, towering his children, dominating them. A feel of authority above all.

True OT Splinter seemed very laxed and the Turtles weren't strangers to the surface which lead me to believe they've been up there several times before April came along.

2K3 Splinter was very over protective to the point the Turtles became afraid to go against his orders after their first venture to the surface. Going top side didn't really become a thing for them until episode 6.

Of course I'm surprised as rowdy as the 2k12 are they didn't do sneak to the surface as well.

[victory_angel]

Of course I'm surprised as rowdy as the 2k12 are they didn't do sneak to the surface as well.

It's possible they've gone to places outside the city for supplies and stuff.

[TheBlueTurtle1]

being a leader, u gotta deal w/ the pressure sometimes, even if it is all or nothing/life altering

as far as don goes, it wouldn't be don much if he didn't learn new science tricks along the way

if tim was in some facility, that pretty much would be the end of him cause all those qualified doctors and scientists would keep him locked up 4 as long as they wanted or needed

in all honesty from the way I see it, yes, hes giving them more freedom than in the past, there r moments where im surprised he didn't go aid them at least in the background but it might be part of his condition from mutating but it doesn't change how hes teaching them

Leo at this point is not a very strong leader atm. Think of the 2003 Leo, very strong and decisive in his leadership. Nick Leo still needs to grow in his experience. I am sure he will get there, and I suppose he is the longer he is leader, but not ready to have the pressure of saving the entire world at the end of season 1 lol.

[Shark_Blade]

Hey, he tried. He even sacrificed himself and that shows courage. :D

[BubblyShell22]

Yes, he did, but I don't think he was ready for it to happen anyway. He still has a lot of growing to do and will probably face more challenges in his leadership as season 2 progresses.

[JH24]

He's a flawed but realistic portrayal of parent/father so far imo. The best.

I like that he's strict and puts out punishments on the boys. And physically, he's very ideal - the tallest of them all, towering his children, dominating them. A feel of authority above all.


That is one thing I like in Splinters portrayal, as viewer there are sometimes moments you can agree or disagree with his decisions but Splinter definitely seems to follow a caring but strict/consistent upbringing for the turtles, in the way he interacts with them, trains with them, etc. All from a position of discipline and authority.


One thing I sometimes wonder is how "strict" Splinter acts as a parent, at times the turtles seem almost genuinely "afraid" of him.

There was that little scene with Leonardo "you're going to laugh your whiskers off when you hear this one". Leo's pose and look on his face when he was corrected said a lot.

[BubblyShell22]

And they should seem afraid of him as he demands respect from them and obedience. Have you ever done something wrong and were afraid to face your parents when the time came to do so? That's the way the Turtles are, too, and that's very realistic to how a human teenager would feel if they had to confess to something they'd done to their parents.

[Ashwolf]

Yes, he did, but I don't think he was ready for it to happen anyway. He still has a lot of growing to do and will probably face more challenges in his leadership as season 2 progresses.

I agree but there r times where u cant just sit back and watch, u gotta do even if not ready 4 facing

[Luckyday]

At the very least, he might be a elitist. At it's worst, the relationship between them at times is a hollywood cliche how drill sergeants would act around their own children.

[Shiro Kame]

I think Splinter doesn't go with them because he doesn't want to see them die and go through what he did when he lost Miwa and Tang Shen died.

[BubblyShell22]

Well, I think it was that and the fact that he didn't want Shredder to know where he was, and he was afraid of facing him after all that had happened.

[blindturtle02]

He might also be training himself to let go of his boys little by little. That's tough for any parent to do, especially this guy who probably relives losing his wife every single day as well as in nightmares. I suppose he could constantly play mother hen but maybe this is something he feels he has to do for himself as well as the turtles in order to overcome that fear of losing them. You can't constantly smother those you love. There comes a time when you've got to let go and trust them to make the right decisions. Sure you can still be there to give advice and support, but I guess stepping back and giving your kids room to grow is all part of being a parent. I imagine it's probably terrifying for Splinter, as it undoubtedly is for most parents. He's probably still growing himself. You really never stop learning lessons until you leave this world. I kinda like the fact that he's still making mistakes now and then. Feels more believable.

[BubblyShell22]

Wow. Well said, BT. I couldn't have put it better myself, and I agree wholeheartedly with this assessment.

[blindturtle02]

Wow. Well said, BT. I couldn't have put it better myself, and I agree wholeheartedly with this assessment.

Thanks Bubly. It's just fun speculating about the motives of these characters. Climbing inside the noggin of a TV show character is a bit more difficult than that of a novel but topics like this are great reading. That no weapons bit had me puzzled for a while and still does to an extent. I enjoy it when Dromers point out stuff like this because like the characters themselves that weave their own tapestry, so too do all the opinions and speculations of the folks on this forum. This topic certainly got me thinking about why Splinter does what he does and has gotten me watching him even more closely especially since the season 2 premier.

[BubblyShell22]

Yep, getting inside the characters' heads is a great thing to do and to speculate about why they are a certain way. Definitely agree with that.