Why No Venus?

[miru]

It has been said in an interview that Venus is not in the Nickelodeon show. Why was this design made? Is she property of Saban?

[ObiWanFan4life]

Because Venus De Milo is a terrible character.

[BabyTurtles]

Because Venus De Milo is a terrible character.

.....I can't find a nice way of saying it.......

so yea...I agree with this XD....

[Candy Kappa]

Venus have a lot of baggage, not to mention she is problematic as a character in many ways. One is that she removes the turtles lonesomeness that they are the only of their kind.

Venus just don't fit as a main stay of the group. Also four is already many main characters, adding a 5th and making it a odd number one would get more attention then the rest, as a "super protagonist", the special one. Like Green/White ranger in MMPR

[Lord Nightwalker]

Ah Venus. *smiles* The thing is, Venus was doomed the minute they changed the TMNT's back story and said "there was a fifth turtle with us in the bowl". Or whatever the hell it was they said. She was terrible on that show.

But. She could be reworked into a better charachter easily. So Honestly, who the hell knows? She left a bad taste in fans mouths because of the way her charachter had been portrayed, so that has to be over come before certain fans will accept her.

She was a good example of a charachter with potential done wrong.

Now, when Karai(Miwa) gets turned into a girl turtle (Foreshadowed by Splinter giving April the weapon meant for his daughter, which were fight fans like Venus was supposed to have) maybe she'll change her name?

lol lol lol lol

[TurtleTitan97]

It's because she's one of the most least liked characters in TMNT.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Surprisingly she has a small fan base on DeviantArt, what bothers is their immaturity over the topic calling Peter Laird sexist for Retconning her.

[LivingMutagen]

Pardon my French, but she's the worst f***ing character in TMNT history

[Teddy]

Because she's super lame and the worst character ever created for TMNT. That should be an option in your poll.

[gobo]

Why no Pluto?
most least liked
XD ^_^

[Shreddhead]

Ditto, to everything

[redsai4lex]

She should be brought back...
So she can have a horrible death scene :teek:

[kelligrafie]

Surprisingly she has a small fan base on DeviantArt, what bothers is their immaturity over the topic calling Peter Laird sexist for Retconning her.

The only thing that's possibly sexist is adding a 5th turtle and making her female just for the sake of diversity or whatever nonsense they portray it to be. I mean, that's just condescending to women and girls. Especially when we already have decent female characters like April and Karai.

Can you imagine if they added an orange-skinned turtle to appeal to children from ethnic minorities?

I never liked Venus. She never grew on me. I was only a kid and I can recall the great hostility I felt towards her like I have never felt towards a fictional character.

[snake]

Venus! I can't believe it! Why hasn't Ciro thought of adding Venus to the show! She could take over Aprils place and get more screen time then the Turtles themselves! Genuis! But they should save her for the Sonic crossover in which She becomes Sonics Girlfriend.

[Powder]

Miru, stop trolling.

[drgon78]

She is a horrible character.

[Ninjinister]

There are no bad characters, only bad writers.

[alliance]

wheres the 'because she plain sucks' option??

[Donatello19]

Even if she was in the new series, what exactly would she do? She basically had no personality in TNM. I feel that now that April is a teenager, there's no need for Venus (there never really was, anyway).

[Shark_Blade]

Because I don't care for her.

[alliance]

Even if this current April sucks ass i still would say absolutely not..

But this April is damn AWESOME actually so to hell with venus..

[BubblyShell22]

Because Venus is a horrible character and a huge waste of space.

[DonatelloNinja82]

Venus is just awful. Does this even need to be a poll?

[Foot Soldier Clang]

I don't hate Venus like other dromers do, but I do see her as unnecessary. She neither adds any dynamic to the turtles as a character, and barely contributed to the plots she was involved in. I wouldn't mind a re-imagining of the character, but I would also be just as satisfied if she never appeared again.

[CowabungaMikey]

I would like to see her in the show, but she's not neccesary.

[AnarkyLantern]

I would have her be a gen 2 turtle.

[kelligrafie]

Erghhh guys? :teek:

SOURCE (http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/1085086.htm)

Second picture down, zoom in.

You can see quite clearly the word 'Venus' written across a bomb. With a blonde (human) female dressed as a ninja turtle.

Apologies if this has been posted before but I only just saw a photo on facebook from April (month, not the character). I'm not sure if Argos is in the USA, but it's a legit UK company at least.

Maybe she's the anti-Karai meets sexier, actually-with-talent female Pulverizer...

[TurtleTitan97]

Erghhh guys? :teek:

SOURCE (http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/1085086.htm)

Second picture down, zoom in.

You can see quite clearly the word 'Venus' written across a bomb. With a blonde (human) female dressed as a ninja turtle.

Apologies if this has been posted before but I only just saw a photo on facebook from April (month, not the character). I'm not sure if Argos is in the USA, but it's a legit UK company at least.

Maybe she's the anti-Karai meets sexier, actually-with-talent female Pulverizer...

:o Wow.

Y'know, if Venus did appear in the show looking like that, I'd totally be okay with it.

[kelligrafie]

:o Wow.

Y'know, if Venus did appear in the show looking like that, I'd totally be okay with it.

The cosplay crew would certainly have fun there. She looks like a TMNT fangirl.

[Shark_Blade]

Erghhh guys? :teek:

SOURCE (http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/1085086.htm)

Second picture down, zoom in.

You can see quite clearly the word 'Venus' written across a bomb. With a blonde (human) female dressed as a ninja turtle.

Apologies if this has been posted before but I only just saw a photo on facebook from April (month, not the character). I'm not sure if Argos is in the USA, but it's a legit UK company at least.

Maybe she's the anti-Karai meets sexier, actually-with-talent female Pulverizer...
http://i.imgur.com/a0FV8CP.jpg

Hmm.. she looks like a blonde Poison Ivy. Her weapon is a giant bomb? Her figure and shape does look waay better than teenage April.

I think that's just a design made for the tent only though.

[Foot Soldier Clang]

That's pretty cool. They made Venus into a WWII style decal.

[gobo]

Looks like Zach's friend, Caitlyn, grew up to be a cosplay model.

[DonatelloNinja82]

:tconfuse:interesting...i wonder why she is there?

[raph27]

Sure...I'll take Venus now!:tgrin::o

[DonatelloNinja82]

Sure...I'll take Venus now!:tgrin::o

bwahahaha to your signature!!

[Refractive Reflections]

http://i.imgur.com/a0FV8CP.jpg

Hmm.. she looks like a blonde Poison Ivy. Her weapon is a giant bomb? Her figure and shape does look waay better than teenage April.

I think that's just a design made for the tent only though.

Hmmm, I wonder... and this is a random guess. But I wonder if they might make Venus start out as a human and then become a mutant, similar to Mona Lisa, and becomes some mutant salamander or turtle. Just a shot in the dark, that's all.

...But that is funny it would be on the TMNT 2012 play tent. I guess maybe the "Easter eggs" for the Nick series, are not only on the show but in the merchandise as well...? ;):lol: I have a feeling somebody in manufacturing must have put it there as an inside joke for the parents of these fan children, and that the parents would get a laugh seeing it while setting up the tent. I mean the parental generation would know who "Venus" is, more than the children who are actually using that play tent. Do you think the joke is... "The most offensive weapon for the Battle Tank (or toward the TMNT franchise) is to have a weapon named 'Venus.'"? (Since that character was a "bomb" since she was received so poorly.) Just throwin' it out there.... :lol:

Thanks kelligrafie for showing it to us! :)

[drgon78]

Not much of a fan for blondes myself so still wouldn't want her in the show.

[Karai Samurai]

What everyone else said. She sucks.

[kelligrafie]

I think that's just a design made for the tent only though.

But why would they would put it on the tent if she wasn't going to be in the show in some way.

That's a waste of ink, plus I don't see how kids today would know who Venus was unless their parents or someone had introduced them to the turtles and they were going through the back series? Most would just be aware of the current series I think.

I'm can't speak for the US but here in the UK, the other series such as the live action and '87 haven't been shown on TV for years, that I know of.

I just think it'd be a wasted in-joke y'know?

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

http://i.imgur.com/a0FV8CP.jpg

Hmm.. she looks like a blonde Poison Ivy. Her weapon is a giant bomb? Her figure and shape does look waay better than teenage April.

I think that's just a design made for the tent only though.

It's pin-up or cheesecake. Doesn't mean her weapon is a bomb at all.
But it's very odd to have sexy pin-up on a kid's tent... but this is a UK product so... I 'unno.

But why would they would put it on the tent if she wasn't going to be in the show in some way.

That's a waste of ink, plus I don't see how kids today would know who Venus was unless their parents or someone had introduced them to the turtles and they were going through the back series? Most would just be aware of the current series I think.

I'm can't speak for the US but here in the UK, the other series such as the live action and '87 haven't been shown on TV for years, that I know of.

I just think it'd be a wasted in-joke y'know?
So you're suggesting they are leaving (sourdough) breadcrumbs for older fans on a children's play tent from across the pond, just to tease or tell us that a character that a majority fanbase disliked to the point that the creators do not acknowledge her COULD appear in the new show that everyone does like?

:lol:

[Tazi]

She is in the show, the creators just renamed her to Pulverizer...

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2013/02/tmnt-the-pulverizer.jpg

http://mimg.ugo.com/201101/6/2/0/162026/cuts/venus-tmnt_480_poster.jpg

Ya... I could see it

[pingclang]

Just seeing that picture of her causes me to wanna vomit.

[Konchadunga]

Could Venus be saved with a better-written reboot? My thought is that she probably could, and if anyone could save her, Nick could, but the real question is, would it be worth it? There, I'd say definitely not.

It's one thing to take Fred Wolf stuff that is remembered fondly, but wouldn't pass muster with today's standards, and retool them so that they do, but Venus doesn't have nearly that sort of nostalgia on her side. Those who are actually fans of hers are outnumbered by those that hate her or just haven't even heard of her.

Then, the idea of a fifth turtle has always carried inherent skepticism, even for characters less abysmal than Venus. We didn't even see that much of April, even during the substantial period when she lived with the turtles in the sewer. The problem goes beyond making Venus not suck...a thing that rhymes with her name; you'd need her and all of the other turtles written great to justify disrupting the character dynamic.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Could Venus be saved with a better-written reboot? My thought is that she probably could, and if anyone could save her, Nick could, but the real question is, would it be worth it? There, I'd say definitely not.

It's one thing to take Fred Wolf stuff that is remembered fondly, but wouldn't pass muster with today's standards, and retool them so that they do, but Venus doesn't have nearly that sort of nostalgia on her side. Those who are actually fans of hers are outnumbered by those that hate her or just haven't even heard of her.

Then, the idea of a fifth turtle has always carried inherent skepticism, even for characters less abysmal than Venus. We didn't even see that much of April, even during the substantial period when she lived with the turtles in the sewer. The problem goes beyond making Venus not suck...a thing that rhymes with her name; you'd need her and all of the other turtles written great to justify disrupting the character dynamic.

I agree, and TMI regarding that second part.

[Captain PunchYouHard]

Because even 12-year-olds know enough biology to realize that turtles don't have breasts, and thus she'd be an insult to literally the entire audience's intelligence?

[snake]

Oh, I forgot, she's basically a canonical fanfic.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Because even 12-year-olds know enough biology to realize that turtles don't have breasts, and thus she'd be an insult to literally the entire audience's intelligence?

Oh, I forgot, she's basically a canonical fanfic.

Even though these points hit the mark perfectly and no one can raise a good defense, that still hasn't stopped her from miraculously gaining "Fans".

[Captain PunchYouHard]

Even though these points hit the mark perfectly and no one can raise a good defense, that still hasn't stopped her from miraculously gaining "Fans".

Furries, man. Well, scalies technically.

(I have nothing against furries. I've been reading and writing TMNT pr0n myself. But the only logical reason for not thinking a turtle with breasts is hilarious, an abomination, or both is furry.)

[snake]

Furries, man. Well, scalies technically.

(I have nothing against furries. I've been reading and writing TMNT pr0n myself. But the only logical reason for not thinking a turtle with breasts is hilarious, an abomination, or both is furry.)

Scalies? Is that some horrid new breed of Furries?

[ObiWanFan4life]

Furries, man. Well, scalies technically.

(I have nothing against furries. I've been reading and writing TMNT pr0n myself. But the only logical reason for not thinking a turtle with breasts is hilarious, an abomination, or both is furry.)

Well, believe it or not, there are people out there who legitimately like her character (And not for Anatomical reasons.)

[Captain PunchYouHard]

Scalies? Is that some horrid new breed of Furries?

It just means they identify as amphibian or reptile. Again, I have nothing against anyone's proclivities as long as no one is hurt without their consent. Just an observation.

Well, believe it or not, there are people out there who legitimately like her character (And not for Anatomical reasons.)

I bet these are the same people who think their Mary Su---um, OC is novel-quality material, or don't understand why BNF artist isn't thrilled to draw their OC free of charge.

[Heather Breckel]

It's been so long since I've seen Venus, does she have hair there or was it just the bandanna done in a way to make it look like hair?

[CyberCubed]

It's been so long since I've seen Venus, does she have hair there or was it just the bandanna done in a way to make it look like hair?

Her bandana was braided.

[Electric]

really highly doubt we'll get her. Slash is being considered the "5th turtle" in this series so i really dont think theyll have a "6th turtle". Not sad at all about it.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Not sad at all about it.

Who is? :lol:

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

Just seeing that picture of her causes me to wanna vomit.
Be glad you're not the one who Googled it...

Oh, I forgot, she's basically a canonical fanfic.
This is the best description I have heard of her.

Who is? :lol:
"Scalies" and legit Venus fans... however that happened.

[ObiWanFan4life]

I'm curious, how is the Pulverizer anything like Venus?

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

Better 5th Turtle:

PICASSO! with Fly Swatter Ninja Action!

http://www.deviantart.com/art/The-Fifth-TMNT-Picasso-37123608

http://happyorangutan.deviantart.com/art/Thanks-for-3-000-from-Picasso-85669457

(bonus points if you see my old comments for the images from 2009)

[ObiWanFan4life]

Better 5th Turtle:

PICASSO! with Fly Swatter Ninja Action!

http://www.deviantart.com/art/The-Fifth-TMNT-Picasso-37123608

http://happyorangutan.deviantart.com/art/Thanks-for-3-000-from-Picasso-85669457

(bonus points if you see my old comments for the images from 2009)

That would be a million times better then what we actually got.

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

I'm curious, how is the Pulverizer anything like Venus?

They are a joke :)

[ObiWanFan4life]

They are a joke :)

True, but one is a total Mary Sue, and the other is Totallly Superfluous.:D

[BabyTurtles]

I'm usually open to any character :3 I even liked Timothy (*puts hipster glasses on* before he was Mutagen Man)

but...I hate Venus.....I hate mary sues....and I don't wanna see her in Nick.....
(she defeated all the guys when they first met her!?)

[ObiWanFan4life]

I'm usually open to any character :3 I even liked Timothy (*puts hipster glasses on* before he was Mutagen Man)

but...I hate Venus.....I hate mary sues....and I don't wanna see her in Nick.....
(she defeated all the guys when they first met her!?)

Good to know we're on the same page. Also you won't have to worry about her appearing in the show as Michelle from Cowabunga Corner interviewed the writer of season 2 who confirmed she won't appear anytime soon. So where safe :D.

[BabyTurtles]

Good to know we're on the same page. Also you won't have to worry about her appearing in the show as Michelle from Cowabunga Corner interviewed the writer of season 2 who confirmed she won't appear anytime soon. So where safe :D.

yes!
well thats one concern off my short list~ :3

[ObiWanFan4life]

yes!
well thats one concern off my short list~ :3

What are your other concerns.

[BabyTurtles]

What are your other concerns.

hmm~ too much Don X April (want it to be toned down)
more Mikey moments.....................

...yea that's it XD told you it was short lol

[pingclang]

[QUOTE=FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza;1142061]Be glad you're not the one who Googled it...

Poor thing.:tcry:

[LeotheLateBloomer]

I'd rather no incarnation would have ANYTHING to do with the Next Mutation. The show and all of it's characters are not even worth mentioning. Worst turtle show ever! Yuck!

[saber16]

I'm fine with the idea of a female mutant turtle... unfortunately, Next Mutation was how she was introduced, so I can see why everyone isn't behind the idea of the character coming back in some way. Yeah, her being the "MISSING 5TH TURTLE" was nothing short of horrible fan fiction.

Though, if she was to make a comeback, I'm sure the character would be handled far better now than she was in the show. If the crew behind TMNT12 can find a way to fit her in the story, I'm all for it. If anyone can do the character any justice, it's them.

[BabyTurtles]

I'm fine with the idea of a female mutant turtle... unfortunately, Next Mutation was how she was introduced, so I can see why everyone isn't behind the idea of the character coming back in some way. Yeah, her being the "MISSING 5TH TURTLE" was nothing short of horrible fan fiction.

Though, if she was to make a comeback, I'm sure the character would be handled far better now than she was in the show. If the crew behind TMNT12 can find a way to fit her in the story, I'm all for it. If anyone can do the character any justice, it's them.

how bout instead of a girl turtle, we get Alopex instead! *_*

[saber16]

how bout instead of a girl turtle, we get Alopex instead! *_*

She could be a cool addition to the enemy roster. Might be fun to see her character play off Dogpound in someway.

Though, one day I would like to see Venus' character given a better treatment - I wouldn't care if she joined the team or not, in fact - would prefer her to go off and do her own thing rather than becoming the Smurffette of the group :/

[Raphaeline]

Oh, no, please, no Mary Sues :(

[Avatar Yuffie]

Show needs more girls, tbh. If Slash can enter as a fifth turtle and then let go do his own thing, I don't see how Venus shouldn't be done the same way either.

Then again Slash was simply liked more than Venus. I doubt Nick would put her there now.

[CyberCubed]

Nobody wants a girl turtle.

Mona Lisa is a better substitute.

[OrokuYoshiFilms]

Because..........because, no!

[Donatello19]

The real question is why WOULD Venus be in the show? I'd rather have Mona Lisa...

[Irishmile]

Besides being a horrible idea in the first place... its probably hard enough writing things to do for all the characters that actually matter.... For example.. notice how little April is given to do despite actually being a "ninja" this time around?

Now imagine the mess the writers would have having to come up with crap for Venus to do...

BUT yeah.. most likely she wasn't even mention a single time during the concept stages of this show... because you know... they wanted to make a good show.

[Konchadunga]

Even though these points hit the mark perfectly and no one can raise a good defense, that still hasn't stopped her from miraculously gaining "Fans".

You've got it wrong; those points are probably the reason Venus has gained fans. It's sad, but you don't need to search very far to find people who like Mary Sue's and sexualized ninja turtles. Just take comfort knowing that probably nobody capable of writing up a substantive essay about why they like Venus actually likes Venus.

[Avatar Yuffie]

Background characters who never gets to talk gets fans (Figwit from LOTR and HOWL from Korra). It happens.

Last I look Bobba Fett was popular even if all he did in Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi is stand and look cool.

You really don't need to be "deep" to like something.

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

hmm~ too much Don X April (want it to be toned down)
more Mikey moments.....................

...yea that's it XD told you it was short lol

I agree... tone down the Don/April stuff. Although I'm sure Casey in the picture will just make it worse.

Mikey already gets a lot of moments though.

[QUOTE=FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza;1142061]Be glad you're not the one who Googled it...

Poor thing.:tcry:
I know. :(

Background characters who never gets to talk gets fans (Figwit from LOTR and HOWL from Korra). It happens.

Last I look Bobba Fett was popular even if all he did in Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi is stand and look cool.

You really don't need to be "deep" to like something.
Said the guy with the Final Fantasy character in sunglasses as his icon ;)

But ya, it's true. Sometimes that's all you need... just to stand around and look cool in the background.
Bobba Fett didn't really do anything in the movies and yet he has, arguably, the largest fan following in the whole of the series.

[snake]

Background characters who never gets to talk gets fans (Figwit from LOTR and HOWL from Korra). It happens.

Last I look Bobba Fett was popular even if all he did in Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi is stand and look cool.

You really don't need to be "deep" to like something.

Only Venus wasn't a background character, nor was she cool. She was basically in your face and "I BE DA GURL TURDLE, LAWLZ."

[Avatar Yuffie]

True that. Though I think her haters simply vastly outnumbered her fans.

I'm just annoyed with the whole "Venus made fans because she had boobs" thing, alright? It's not hard to imagine her fans just simply liked Venus.

[snake]

True that. Though I think her haters simply vastly outnumbered her fans.

I'm just annoyed with the whole "Venus had fans because she had boobs" thing, alright? It's not hard to imagine her fans just simply liked Venus.

Yeah, but it's mostly female fans who always felt "left out" becuase there was no girl turtle. And now there is, so that's a majority of her fans.

[Technogeek29]

Yeah, but it's mostly female fans who always felt "left out" becuase there was no girl turtle. And now there is, so that's a majority of her fans.

Im not too oppossed to a "5th Turtle" wheather they are Male or Female. My problem is that they are usually written poorly, either Mary Sue's or cardboard that add nothing. For awhile I gave up on the 5th Turtle Schitck until Ross Cambell's Secret of The Ooze character Artemisa was introduced.
Anothing is writing a 5th Turtle itself is already a challenge as the Turtles have define dynamics and personalities. So you would have to write a character who doesn't do too much but does effect the story in a way.

Artemisa from what we know from Ross is that she's a shy worrywart. I acutally found that plausible since I could guess why she was that way. Tallest of the family (so you stand out) Only girl of the family(Now you stand out more even more) Honestly when you feel like an outcast in a family of outcasts, its no wonder you rather keep to yourself.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Venus might be a failed experiment, but in my opinion, she was an experiment that needed to happen. Maybe the idea of a fifth/female turtle needed to be executed before anybody passed judgement.

[snake]

Venus might be a failed experiment, but in my opinion, she was an experiment that needed to happen. Maybe the idea of a fifth/female turtle needed to be executed before anybody passed judgement.
^^ I agree
I'm just glad NM did it and not anything good.

[ObiWanFan4life]

^^ I agree
I'm just glad NM did it and not anything good.

Well to Be fair, there are a few things that TNM Got right.

[snake]

Well to Be fair, there are a few things that TNM Got right.

Like? Besides Raphs bike, I can't see anything else.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Like? Besides Raphs bike, I can't see anything else.

Such as the fact that it gave some of us appreciation for the other Cartoons.:D

[snake]

Such as the fact that it gave some of us appreciation for the other Cartoons.:D

:lol: You're right! It DID give us that!

[ObiWanFan4life]

:lol: You're right! It DID give us that!

You Wanna another good Laugh?

[snake]

You Wanna another good Laugh?

Sure! Fire away.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Sure! Fire away.
Watch This Press video for The Next Mutation. It's Laughable how they try to defend and justify all the bad decisions there. :D

GUOJ8_lhedY

[snake]

Watch This Press video for The Next Mutation. It's Laughable how they try to defend and justify all the bad decisions there. :D

GUOJ8_lhedY

:lol: Thats great.

'She Brings Alot Of-Of Influence To The Boys Life"

[CowabungaMikey]

Well, at least I like it....

[Shark_Blade]

"Why no Venus?"

Why ask questions to which you already know the answer?

[snake]

Well, at least I like it....

Give me five reasons why it's a good show.

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

:lol: Thats great.

'She Brings Alot Of-Of Influence To The Boys Life"

Well aren't they just so proud of themselves

[ObiWanFan4life]

Well aren't they just so proud of themselves

Full of themselves is the word I use.

[ObiWanFan4life]

I have a better question. Do any of the writers know about Venus or even like her?

[Konchadunga]

Based on interviews, at least some of them do. I'd venture to say TNM is not as obscure now as it was in the era prior to widespread Internet use, because now that TMNT is cool for being retro, fans can dig up almost anything about it. Not to say that many people have seen it, but that's likely because those who have have scared them away from it.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Based on interviews, at least some of them do. I'd venture to say TNM is not as obscure now as it was in the era prior to widespread Internet use, because now that TMNT is cool for being retro, fans can dig up almost anything about it. Not to say that many people have seen it, but that's likely because those who have have scared them away from it.

Good to know.

[n-zero]

Venus was enormously problematic-

- She came from a terrible adaption, and will always be associated with it.

- The original four all have distinct personalities based on character archetypes that interwove seamlessly. (see also: this episode of Cracked After Hours (http://www.cracked.com/video_18260_which-ninja-turtle-are-you-lifes-most-important-question.html)). Venus' "personality" was "the girl one."

- Instead of having a signature weapons, she had magic. And she took Shredder out of play permanently in her first appearance. Classic Mary Sue territory right there.

- There was the retcon that the Turtles weren't actual brothers, allowing them to fight over Venus.

-She makes Splinter a deadbeat dad, letting one of his children go missing without trying to get her back or even making her brothers aware of her existence. Compare this, on the other hand, to the IDW Universe where Splinter had the Turtles searching for Raphael every night for over a year.

Venus is a mess of a character, surrounded by a mess of ripples emanating outward throughout the turtleverse based on her involvement in it. Maybe they could radically reinterpret her, but she left too sour of a taste in most fans mouths for the name to be of any value. She has very little nostalgia attached to her, she is mostly remembered as franchise poison.

[Shark_Blade]

^You summed it up quite perfectly.

And I much prefer only the main 4 in my tmnt adventures. A fifth "girl turtle" is just redundant.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Venus was enormously problematic-

- She came from a terrible adaption, and will always be associated with it.

- The original four all have distinct personalities based on character archetypes that interwove seamlessly. (see also: this episode of Cracked After Hours (http://www.cracked.com/video_18260_which-ninja-turtle-are-you-lifes-most-important-question.html)). Venus' "personality" was "the girl one."

- Instead of having a signature weapons, she had magic. And she took Shredder out of play permanently in her first appearance. Classic Mary Sue territory right there.

- There was the retcon that the Turtles weren't actual brothers, allowing them to fight over Venus.

-She makes Splinter a deadbeat dad, letting one of his children go missing without trying to get her back or even making her brothers aware of her existence. Compare this, on the other hand, to the IDW Universe where Splinter had the Turtles searching for Raphael every night for over a year.

Venus is a mess of a character, surrounded by a mess of ripples emanating outward throughout the turtleverse based on her involvement in it. Maybe they could radically reinterpret her, but she left too sour of a taste in most fans mouths for the name to be of any value. She has very little nostalgia attached to her, she is mostly remembered as franchise poison.

Spoken like a true pro. 8)

[n-zero]

^You summed it up quite perfectly.

And I much prefer only the main 4 in my tmnt adventures. A fifth "girl turtle" is just redundant.

April fills the "fifth turtle" slot pretty well. She is also able to offer a lot to the team by being human, allowing her investigative opportunities that four giant mutated reptiles could never come close to.

[Luckyday]

^You summed it up quite perfectly.

And I much prefer only the main 4 in my tmnt adventures. A fifth "girl turtle" is just redundant.

But having Slash is fine as the fifth turtle?

[ObiWanFan4life]

But having Slash is fine as the fifth turtle?

Well, Slash is a villain in 2 of the incarnations, and isn't a total Mary Sue.

[TurtleTitan97]

But having Slash is fine as the fifth turtle?

Yeah, because Slash is actually liked by fans. Venus is not.

[Luckyday]

I just wanting to be clear that Venus itself is a problem not a idea of a "girl turtle".

[ObiWanFan4life]

Got another answer for you miru, Venus is a joke character.

[pingclang]

I just wanting to be clear that Venus itself is problem not a idea of a "girl turtle".

I have no problem with a female turtle as long as she isn't horrible. Venus was horrible. I don't why everyone calls her a "mary sue?" but she was just a bad idea. Slash is a well written villain. %100 different.

[ObiWanFan4life]

I have no problem with a female turtle as long as she isn't horrible. Venus was horrible. I don't why everyone calls her a "mary sue?" but she was just a bad idea. Slash is a well written villain. %100 different.

Mary Sue essentially means a female character that is essentially flawless in almost every regard.

[Luckyday]

Alright then. Then yes there is no point of bringing in Venus or at least not in the way she was originally created.

Personally I would some parts of her character like the magician part and splint her up in two different characters. Two characters are heavily entwined in how they came to be but are separate because the other gave her away on the day she was mutated and ever since has been raised by a chinese magician. This will not only give her own origin story but it gives a interesting spin on it too.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Alright then. Then yes there is no point of bringing in Venus or at least not in the way she was original created. Personally, I would split up Venus in two different characters that are separate from each other and but are heavily entwined in how they came to be.

Or we could just make sure anything resembling the character and her "personality" (or lack thereof.) never see the light of day.

[Panda_Kahn_fan]

I once thought otherwise, but after much reflection, I have come to agree; Venus was a waste of space, and should be forgotten. I DON'T agree, however, that there shouldn't be any girls along on the TMNT's adventures. Just have ethier Mona or Ninjara tag along on some of thier adventures as kind of an unoffical' fifth female turtle. (And I'll also say I hate it when I tell CASUAL FANS I like Mona Lisa from TMNT, they all go 'ewwww, that girl turtle'- NO! Venus is NOT Mona! Grrrrrr!)

[ObiWanFan4life]

I once thought otherwise, but after much reflection, I have come to agree; Venus was a waste of space, and should be forgotten. I DON'T agree, however, that there shouldn't be any girls along on the TMNT's adventures. Just have ethier Mona or Ninjara tag along on some of thier adventures as kind of an unoffical' fifth female turtle. (And I'll also say I hate it when I tell CASUAL FANS I like Mona Lisa from TMNT, they all go 'ewwww, that girl turtle'- NO! Venus is NOT Mona! Grrrrrr!)

Well, they both share one thing in common.

[n-zero]

But having Slash is fine as the fifth turtle?

I'm not really a fan of the fifth turtle concept as a whole, at least not as a permanent fixture. Kirby (http://www.blastr.com/2012/12/kirby_the_5th_turtle_and.php) was just as terrible a concept as Venus, just with her being a Mary Sue and him being Rob Leifeld vomit.

The difference is that I don't think Slash will be a permanent addition to the cast. He'll probably stick around for 3-4 episodes before getting stuck in Dimension X, then only showing up in Leatherhead guest appearances.

Mary Sue essentially means a female character that is essentially flawless in almost every regard.

Some of the hallmarks of a Mary Sue (or its male counterpart, Gary or Larry Stu) are :

- Bland personality devoid of flaws. If anything resembles a flaw, it is usually played as a point of attention rather than a hindrance ("I only have sexy flaws") (The only bit of personality I can remember for Venus was that she had a fish out of water plot)

- Immediately becoming the nexus of attention from the established characters, especially romantic attention. They are also commonly viewed as "special." (See: All the Turtles want to get with her, Dragon King focuses on her)

- Skills or abilities that place them well beyond the established characters (Using her Chi magic to take out Shredder permanently in her first episode, a foe who usually gave the other Turtles loads of trouble)

[ObiWanFan4life]

Well technically, Venus didn't get rid of the Shredder permanently as he appeared later in the episode "Enemy of my Enemy".

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

Another sign of a Mary Sue:

CAN THE SHOW SURVIVE WITHOUT HER?
Meaning if Venus didn't exist, how would The Next Mutation survive?
So much of that show rode on Venus as the focal point and yet she couldn't carry it herself.
If she was flawed, maybe she wouldn't be so bad... like, she killed her self a bit or her life energy anytime she used her stupid magic.
If you removed her, the show would fall apart, in all honestly.
Next Mutation was so loosely bolt together in the first place, making it already wobbly and haphazardly, that when you remove that character, the whole thing falls apart. Everything in the show that happens, arguably, is due to her inclusion, where she comes from and what she means to everyone now.

She's overpowered and defies all the "laws" and "rules" of the TMNT universe. All the heroes want her in some way, all the villains want her in some way.
She doesn't fit into the story in anyway without "stepping on some toes".
She's the "long lost 5th Turtle" or "sister" (shudder), which in itself is a cop out in this over-done reveal.

A Mary Sue is just bad fanfiction writing... For a Fan/the Author to put them self into the story through an "avatar".
This is why I really dont follow any fan fiction type deals. I have loved Dragonball and DBZ since I was a kid. Do you know how many fan fiction and how many fan-created characters there are just in that world? Ugh.

I have no problem with a female turtle as long as she isn't horrible. Venus was horrible. I don't why everyone calls her a "mary sue?" but she was just a bad idea. Slash is a well written villain. %100 different.
The franchise could really use some more females, human or otherwise.
Angel, maybe? That be a fun dynamic. Although we know Irma is supposed to come in.

Alright then. Then yes there is no point of bringing in Venus or at least not in the way she was originally created.

Personally I would some parts of her character like the magician part and splint her up in two different characters. Two characters are heavily entwined in how they came to be but are separate because the other gave her away on the day she was mutated and ever since has been raised by a chinese magician. This will not only give her own origin story but it gives a interesting spin on it too.

I think we should just... ya'know, continue to forget about her and think up NEW, far more interesting characters (see: anything new in Nick) than Venus

[ObiWanFan4life]

True, But it's just so damn fun to make fun of this character.

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

and tiring lol

I did a little expansion above.

I would LOVE to work on the TMNT in comics or anything of the sort.
And there are dozens of things to do with the Turtles still! But that's story telling.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Here me out, I'm not AT ALL saying that Venus was a good character, but I am saying that she should be remembered and used as a lesson and an example of how NOT to write new characters into a well established group.

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

lol one of Splinter's beating lessons.
"This is why we dont do this"
*WACK*

[ObiWanFan4life]

lol one of Splinter's beating lessons.
"This is why we dont do this"
*WACK*

Exactly :lol:

[312]

Peter Laird hates a lot of things..... but his anger seems to reach new levels whenever Venus is mentioned. If it was up to him she'd be completley erased from Tmnt history.

[pannoni1]

Expect to see a "Why No Scrappy?" at a Scooby-Doo board any day now. The only reason we had Venus on TNM was that it followed Power Ranger's formula of five heroes against an overloard, putty patrol, and villians of the week being that it was a Saban show. But for now, she remains the only TMNT ally that hasn't been animated. Why bring back a failed product when popular support still rejects it?

[ObiWanFan4life]

Peter Laird hates a lot of things..... but his anger seems to reach new levels whenever Venus is mentioned. If it was up to him she'd be completley erased from Tmnt history.

In a way, she kinda was.

[ninja-zero]

Don't you guys wish Venus was rewritten? Instead of being a Chinese foreigner who doesn't know the culture of modern American life very well, why not a Korean instead?

- She can know K-Pop
- Wield Steel Fans instead of orbs
- Can speak modern language as well as the turtles

[ObiWanFan4life]

Don't you guys wish Venus was rewritten? Instead of being a Chinese foreigner who doesn't know the culture of modern American life very well, why not a Korean instead?

- She can know K-Pop
- Wield Steel Fans instead of orbs
- Can speak modern language as well as the turtles

No, we wish she would never appear in another TMNT Iteration and that she would rot away in obscurity. It's for the best

[pingclang]

Don't you guys wish Venus was rewritten? Instead of being a Chinese foreigner who doesn't know the culture of modern American life very well, why not a Korean instead?

- She can know K-Pop
- Wield Steel Fans instead of orbs
- Can speak modern language as well as the turtles

Ahahahahahaaa...no.

[ObiWanFan4life]

^^ This. Honestly, why would you even ask?

[snake]

Don't you guys wish Venus was rewritten? Instead of being a Chinese foreigner who doesn't know the culture of modern American life very well, why not a Korean instead?

- She can know K-Pop
- Wield Steel Fans instead of orbs
- Can speak modern language as well as the turtles

And that would help her character hooooooow?

[ObiWanFan4life]

And that would help her character hooooooow?

Depends on how you define help.

[plasticturtle]

Because she was a bad fanfiction idea poorly disguised as a canon character. And I don't know who's bright idea it was to give a reptile breasts but I know they probably flunked biology.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Because she was a bad fanfiction idea poorly disguised as a canon character. And I don't know who's bright idea it was to give a reptile breasts but I know they probably flunked biology.

Or has perverted/undesirable fetishes.

[BubblyShell22]

I wouldn't want to see her back in any incarnation because she was just a horrible idea and badly executed.

[snake]

Is anyone sick of every fanfic put there pulling a Venus and introducing a Sister/fith turtle/girlfriend?

[ObiWanFan4life]

Is anyone sick of every fanfic put there pulling a Venus and introducing a Sister/fith turtle/girlfriend?

Amen to this.

[Aaronardo]

Because Venus De Milo is a terrible character.

Well, since I can't find a way to say this........
Yeah.... :P

[ObiWanFan4life]

Because she's the TMNT equivalent to Yoko Ono.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Venus was handled Carelessly and lazily in The Next Mutation, she doesn't feel like a real TMNT character, she feels like a rejected fanfiction.

[Avatar Yuffie]

Y'know for a person who hates this character you feel the need to bump this thread instead of using the edit button.

[ObiWanFan4life]

Y'know for a person who hates this character you feel the need to bump this thread instead of using the edit button.

My Apologies.

[Guitar_Raph]

http://mimg.ugo.com/201101/6/2/0/162026/cuts/venus-tmnt_480_poster.jpg
"I must save Donatello from a heartbeak & break up this love rectangle, er triangle between him, April & Casey Jones! Gotta put on some charm."

[Coola Yagami]

http://mimg.ugo.com/201101/6/2/0/162026/cuts/venus-tmnt_480_poster.jpg
"I must save Donatello from a heartbeak & break up this love rectangle, er triangle between him, April & Casey Jones! Gotta put on some charm."

yeah sure why not? I'd honestly like to see ANY KIND OF FEMALE MUTANT in the series at all. Seems like a mutant sausagefest so far. Or perhaps women are immune to Mutagen.

[TurtleMaster4]

I hope she is on the show, but I really don’t want her to be the turtle’s sister or have magical powers. Ninja Turtles are brothers, they don’t have a sister, and they are also called Ninja Turtles for a reason, save the magic for occasional episodes.
Other than that, I’m up for Venus returning, but in a new way!

[snake]

yeah sure why not? I'd honestly like to see ANY KIND OF FEMALE MUTANT in the series at all. Seems like a mutant sausagefest so far. Or perhaps women are immune to Mutagen.

Well, that explains April. :D

[MST3KFan]

Well, that explains April. :D

This does make me think we need some female mutants in the show to kind of even things out a bit more.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Ditto, but my vote goes to Mona Lisa. F*** Venus. (And I had the idea YEARS before Saban did it- her name was Artemis... Prophetic?! Maybe.)

[ObiWanFan4life]

Ditto, but my vote goes to Mona Lisa. F*** Venus. (And I had the idea YEARS before Saban did it- her name was Artemis... Prophetic?! Maybe.)

Prophetic indeed. But seriously?

[rayfillet101]

I think with enough time, and episodes, we could see all of these characters make an appearance. One episode will not destroy the integrity of the show...we had Pigeon Pete already, why not Venus? I think if they do show her they won't announce it. But, Karai had bad press before she appeared on the show as well. Now she is a fan favorite. I trust the team.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, but if they know fans hate Venus, they probably won't put her in the show as a permanent fixture. Maybe some sort of Easter Egg for her could happen though.

[Konchadunga]

Yeah, but if they know fans hate Venus, they probably won't put her in the show as a permanent fixture. Maybe some sort of Easter Egg for her could happen though.

It's interesting you mention that, given the panel in NYCC where someone in charge of the show (maybe Ciro Nielli, but I'm not sure), jokingly announced Venus; some of the audience cheered, some booed, but it seems obvious that he was going for shocking and relieving them. Either way, that pretty much cuts it for Venus ever appearing in this; unless her fans now persuade them to change their minds. If any Easter Egg appears, it will likely be mean-natured.

[turtletoons81]

It's interesting you mention that, given the panel in NYCC where someone in charge of the show (maybe Ciro Nielli, but I'm not sure), jokingly announced Venus; some of the audience cheered, some booed, but it seems obvious that he was going for shocking and relieving them. Either way, that pretty much cuts it for Venus ever appearing in this; unless her fans now persuade them to change their minds. If any Easter Egg appears, it will likely be mean-natured.

the guy who wrote the first episode of season 2 was also the same guy who said the joke about venus de milo being in the new show,also i heard ciro was the guy doing the storyboard in season 1 until in season 2 where he can do what goes here and there.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

Prophetic indeed. But seriously?

Actually, yes. However, it was just a "joke" sketch that I drew sometime around 91-92 (forget exactly) and she wore pink and used a whip. And yes, I am fully aware of the "kink factor" there..... :tlol::trazz::twink:

One of these days I need to hunt through some of my old artworks and stuff and see if I still have that. It wasn't the most brilliant piece of art, but it was fun and goofy!

[Taylon]

Well, so long as a 6th turtle (including Spike) and 'sister' to the boys doesn't turn out to be Karai... hmm...
No human toy of her on the horizon (correct me if I'm wrong, haven't had a chance to go through all the posts) and with a rewrite of the Venus character to retain Karai's independent spirit...
Karai eventually finds out the truth of her childhood and loses any sliver of trust in Shredder, Splinter and the turtles (in an everyone-seems-to-know-but-me type of paranoia). Then comes into contact with the mutagen and decides to break away from everyone to travel her own path, eventually becoming neither friend nor ally to the turtles but an uneasy 'member' when the end goal suits her. Oh, and she also rejects both names she's been given by her 'fathers' in a bid to regain a sense of control and renames herself...
I speculate this because Karai is the only character to fit the sister mold - April, being the first link to the human world for the turtles, would become redundant if she too became a mutant.
After the truth of Karai's parentage is revealed, it could be ONE arc to take her down to see how her character would develop in such a situation...
But that's ONLY how I'D do it if I were FORCED to HAVE to include 'Venus' in a Nick fic - I'd just rather NOT have her in it AT ALL.

[Shark_Blade]

Guys, guys,

Let's all say our prayer to our "dear" ol departed Venus, who has ceased to exist from this world since 1997. She didn't get the chance to appear in 2k3, 2007 movie, video games, etc.. and seemingly never in 2k12 series and 2k14 movie as well. She's practically the Scrappy Doo of this series (seriously google him, that annoying pup is canonically dead now).

Dear Lord,
Thank you.

Amen.

[CansecoBat]

Why No Uranus?

[FlogginMcMurryZombiePizza]

...we had Pigeon Pete already, why not Venus?

Venus exists as a bad Mary Sue to the TMNT. Always has and will be.
Pigeon Pete served an important purpose in the show. And was awarded with sourdough.

Keep Venus to NM only and let that ship sink.

Because she's the TMNT equivalent to Yoko Ono.

OMG this is so good! LOL

[Kas]

Because...


NO!

[Konchadunga]

She's practically the Scrappy Doo of this series (seriously google him, that annoying pup is canonically dead now).

I wasn't aware there was "canon" in Scooby Doo, in general. The franchise practically goes through a retcon with every new TV series. Shell; history was altered in-universe at the end of Scooby Doo Mystery Incorporated.

[CyberCubed]

The Scooby Doo series are constantly rebooted like Batman, they're not meant to all be in the same continuity.

[Shark_Blade]

Forget about continuity. Main point is he'll never be relevant again, no voice actor, nothing of importance.

http://jakeofjohto.tumblr.com/post/54715043530/can-we-all-just-take-a-moment-to-ruminate-in-how

Similar fate for Venus.

[Ecto Jedi]

I wasn't aware there was "canon" in Scooby Doo, in general. The franchise practically goes through a retcon with every new TV series. Shell; history was altered in-universe at the end of Scooby Doo Mystery Incorporated.

Did you just use "shell" as an ejaculation? You did.

[ZariusTwo]

The final seasons with Scrappy arent even that bad, particulary the New Scooby-Doo Mysteries and The 13 Ghosts of Scooby Doo

[Creativecreature31]

I never saw TNM so can someone please tell more about Venus and why she was so hated?

From what I can understand people didn't like the idea of a girl turtle and I guess she may have come across as a Mary Sue? (I'm not sure about this)

[Powder]

Being a Mary-Sue was a big part of it, sure. Also, I think it was the fact she was made to be... well, stupid, kinda? She was raised in China, so coming to NY and hanging out with teenage guys was a huge culture shock for her, which is understandable, but they played the sort of "dumb foreigner" angle. The writers had the turtles claim they were not actually blood brothers, nor were any related to Venus either, so that they could be attracted to her and fight for her attention without there being incestuous overtones, and people really resented her for that. The family by blood dynamic is important to many fans. I also think people were frustrated that the rest of the guys got a bit less screen time as a result of her focus.

& maybe, just maybe, shell boobs were off-putting. :trazz:

[Creativecreature31]

Being a Mary-Sue was a big part of it, sure. Also, I think it was the fact she was made to be... well, stupid, kinda? She was raised in China, so coming to NY and hanging out with teenage guys was a huge culture shock for her, which is understandable, but they played the sort of "dumb foreigner" angle. The writers had the turtles claim they were not actually blood brothers, nor were any related to Venus either, so that they could be attracted to her and fight for her attention without there being incestuous overtones, and people really resented her for that. The family by blood dynamic is important to many fans. I also think people were frustrated that the rest of the guys got a bit less screen time as a result of her focus.

& maybe, just maybe, shell boobs were off-putting. :trazz:

OMG SHELL-BOOBS! :lol:

And wow. So they had to erase the Turtles family history just so Venus could spread her legs for one them? :ohwell: Wouldn't it have just made more sense to not make her related to them at all? :roll:

And I do hate it as well when one character gets too much focus while the others are left in the dust.

And by the way! I FIND YOUR SIG TO BE FREAKING HILARIOUS! :lol:
Where is that from?

[Powder]

Wouldn't it have just made more sense to not make her related to them at all? :roll:

And by the way! I FIND YOUR SIG TO BE FREAKING HILARIOUS! :lol:
Where is that from?

Now that you mention it, yeah, it totally would have... I dunno why they didn't just do that to begin with. But I suppose many of the decisions made involving that series made little sense.

As for my sig, it's just something I put together myself in Photoshop. :trazz: Glad you like it!

[Creativecreature31]

Now that you mention it, yeah, it totally would have... I dunno why they didn't just do that to begin with. But I suppose many of the decisions made involving that series made little sense.

As for my sig, it's just something I put together myself in Photoshop. :trazz: Glad you like it!

I also heard that Venus took out The SHEDDER with a One-Hit KO! :lol:
That sounds so hilariously bad I'm afraid to watch that show! :teek: