TMNT 2007: Leo vs Raph: Who's Really better?

[TMNT101]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpLM34dIrDU
First off, I'm equally a fan of Leonardo and Raphael. After watching this, it questions who is truly better. I mean, Raphael had Leonardo pinned down at the end of the fight. However, if you watch it, Leonardo kicks Raphael by the edge of the roof and lunges with his sword, nearly stabbing Raphael. Now, Leo could easily have slashed to the left and killed Raphael. But with the context of Leo not wanting to fight Raphael, he pulled his sword back instead. Some may say I'm speculating too much into it, so I'll ask. Who is proven to be truly better?

[snake]

Neither. I didn't like the 2007 movie much, so I can't pick one.

[TMNT101]

Neither. I didn't like the 2007 movie much, so I can't pick one.

I don't watch it a lot. But, I don't mind watching Leonardo & Raphael beating each other up, going all Alpha Turtle on each other.

[snake]

I don't watch it a lot. But, I don't mind watching Leonardo & Raphael beating each other up, going all Alpha Turtle on each other.

I liked the battle, that's about all I liked in the movie. Oh yeah! And I liked Bigfoot :D

It should've had more focus on Mikey and Don. But I think that even Leo and Raph, that turtles who got the most screen time, didn't have much personality.

( other then the regular stuff, Raph= angry, Leo= leader, serious, Mikey= jokester, Don= Techguy)

[TMNT101]

I liked the battle, that's about all I liked in the movie. Oh yeah! And I liked Bigfoot :D

It should've had more focus on Mikey and Don. But I think that even Leo and Raph, that turtles who got the most screen time, didn't have much personality.

( other then the regular stuff, Raph= angry, Leo= leader, serious, Mikey= jokester, Don= Techguy)

Yeah, this flick was all about Leo & Raph. They should've had Don in love with April and have him & Casey compete for her love. LOL

[snake]

Yeah, this flick was all about Leo & Raph. They should've had Don in love with April and have him & Casey compete for her love. LOL

Still better then the Stone Warriors and Max Winters! But honestly, I'd love for the film to pick up where Turtles 3 left off as a live action film, not set in its own universe and animated.

[Bmaga123]

Hard to really compare in this fight since they are using different weapons. One would think 2 katana's would give a huge advantage to Leonardo. The only way would be a fight in hand to hand combat with no weapons. I voted Raphael because he is my favorite turtle :twink:

[TMNT101]

Hard to really compare in this fight since they are using different weapons. One would think 2 katana's would give a huge advantage to Leonardo. The only way would be a fight in hand to hand combat with no weapons. I voted Raphael because he is my favorite turtle :twink:

Well, they did fight hand to hand prior to using weapons and Leo beat Raph in that part. Click the link in the top post and it has the chase, the fist fight and the weapons fight.

[snake]

Hard to really compare in this fight since they are using different weapons. One would think 2 katana's would give a huge advantage to Leonardo. The only way would be a fight in hand to hand combat with no weapons. I voted Raphael because he is my favorite turtle :twink:
You forgot the nightwatcher gear, giving Raph a defensive advantage.

[TMNT101]

Still better then the Stone Warriors and Max Winters! But honestly, I'd love for the film to pick up where Turtles 3 left off as a live action film, not set in its own universe and animated.

I never got to see Turtles 2 or 3. I just saw the 1st live action Turtles movie a couple weeks ago.

[snake]

I never got to see Turtles 2 or 3. I just saw the 1st live action Turtles movie a couple weeks ago.

The next two are more lighthearted, but when you see all three you'll have the same opinion as me.

Did you like the first one?

[Bauer536]

As far as fighting goes, it's Raphael. However, with self-control and levelheadedness, it's Leonardo. I chose Leo because he really said "I'm better than you" as a responsible brother, not as a ninja. That's how I look at it. Either that, or it's what FearlessLeader pointed out - Leo was heartbroken after Raph told him that the turtles were fine without him. I liked the movie, but this talk about who's better sometimes gets on my nerves. Who cares? They're all leaders in their own way.

[snake]

As far as fighting goes, it's Raphael. However, with self-control and levelheadedness, it's Leonardo. I chose Leo because he really said "I'm better than you" as a responsible brother, not as a ninja. That's how I look at it. Either that, or it's what FearlessLeader pointed out - Leo was heartbroken after Raph told him that the turtles were fine without him. I liked the movie, but this talk about who's better sometimes gets on my nerves. Who cares? They're all leaders in their own way.

I'd vote for Leo anyway, he didn't start the fight anyway.

[TMNT101]

The next two are more lighthearted, but when you see all three you'll have the same opinion as me.

Did you like the first one?

Yeah, I did like the first one. I figured the next two movies weren't as serious. I watched Screwattack's Death Battle with the Ninja Turtles in a 4 Turtle free for all and it showed a clip of Mikey throwing a large piece of stone like a Frisbee. I'm guessing that's from The third movie?

[TMNT101]

As far as fighting goes, it's Raphael. However, with self-control and levelheadedness, it's Leonardo. I chose Leo because he really said "I'm better than you" as a responsible brother, not as a ninja. That's how I look at it. Either that, or it's what FearlessLeader pointed out - Leo was heartbroken after Raph told him that the turtles were fine without him. I liked the movie, but this talk about who's better sometimes gets on my nerves. Who cares? They're all leaders in their own way.

I only look at who's better very rarely. I typically don't care in the big picture. It's just one of those little side things to do to add variety to the topic of Ninja Turtles. All done for curiosity purposes in terms of opinions. I understand about annoyance from those who obsess about who's better.

[InsaneZane]

search up Ninja turtles death battle on you tube, it explains exactly why Leo would've won if he wanted to in the 2007 fight

[snake]

search up Ninja turtles death battle on you tube, it explains exactly why Leo would've won if he wanted to in the 2007 fight

Leo DEFINATLY would've won, but he has to much restraint and couldn't hurt his own brother.

[Refractive Reflections]

For this 2007 movie, Leonardo would have most probably won because he has a cooler head in fighting, and could out-wit Raphael. Yes, Raphael could easily beat up Leonardo in a strength contest (which is why the katanas broke), but since Leonardo is able to not let his emotions overtake him, he's able to easily see the "whole picture" and its possibilities/solutions in the fight/battle. Raphael's intense emotions gives him more of a restrictive "tunnel vision" in trying to destroy whatever it is that's in front of him.

[shredderhead]

It´s difficult to say who´s better than the others really... Everyone of them (including mickey and don) has it´s own advantages... To be true I think Raph, Leo, Mickey or Don have the potential to be the better fighter. You may say that this is the easier answer, but for example.. Raph is the strongest of his brothers and takes his fury to a battle, making him even more fearless and on the other hand Leo is extreme devoted to ninjitsu what makes him mentally strong and a very good fighter too...
I disagree when you say that Leo didn´t brought all he got into the fight, because if so he wouldn´t have charged raph, like raph did too (just a thought)..
And the part you say Leo could slice raph, personally I think that´s impossible because TMNT is not the heads off style or blood style xD, so if he tried to do so, raph would have dodge it :lol: (kidding but true)..
To finish, if I had to bet in the winner I would say Raph, because in that fight they were both mess up mentally and that´s kind of raph´s world..

[Shred87]

I just watched the death battle YouTube video, what is the video game they keep flashing to? Is that the sega version of turtles in time?

[Slade]

It´s difficult to say who´s better than the others really... Everyone of them (including mickey and don) has it´s own advantages... To be true I think Raph, Leo, Mickey or Don have the potential to be the better fighter. You may say that this is the easier answer, but for example.. Raph is the strongest of his brothers and takes his fury to a battle, making him even more fearless and on the other hand Leo is extreme devoted to ninjitsu what makes him mentally strong and a very good fighter too...
I disagree when you say that Leo didn´t brought all he got into the fight, because if so he wouldn´t have charged raph, like raph did too (just a thought)..
And the part you say Leo could slice raph, personally I think that´s impossible because TMNT is not the heads off style or blood style xD, so if he tried to do so, raph would have dodge it :lol: (kidding but true)..
To finish, if I had to bet in the winner I would say Raph, because in that fight they were both mess up mentally and that´s kind of raph´s world..

I pretty much agree with this. I try not to think of who is better either. I can be Raph biased though, but at the same time, I know people can be Leo biased as well. It's easy to say Leo would have won or I've seen people say he actually did win, but on a mental level. That's fine and all, but in the combat part of the fight, and from the movie itself, Raph won.

[CowabungaMikey]

Leo. He coulded kill Raph in this movie, but he didn't.

[InsaneZane]

I just watched the death battle YouTube video, what is the video game they keep flashing to? Is that the sega version of turtles in time?

I'm not sure, i think its tournament fighters for snes

[tmntfan4ever]

You forgot the nightwatcher gear, giving Raph a defensive advantage.
I do agree on that tho I felt it made him able to manuever less and kinda made him slow in his movements compared to Leo. Not to mention it made him have less visibility which gave Leo the upperhand during the hand to hand combat but during the weapon portion Raph got the upperhand.

[Candy Kappa]

Why does this so often pop up, we gotta have at least a dozen and a half threads about this topic by now.

Power of the writers, why does Batman beat Superman, cause the writers wanted it.

Leo had Skills and Raph had brawns, in that fight brawns won. (yet Raph lost)

[snake]

I do agree on that tho I felt it made him able to manuever less and kinda made him slow in his movements compared to Leo. Not to mention it made him have less visibility which gave Leo the upperhand during the hand to hand combat but during the weapon portion Raph got the upperhand.

Don't forget the chain, Raph could've easily used that to protect every angle of himself.

[BabyTurtles]

I don't think any of the turtles are better than the other....it kinda just depends on the situation....

I mean Raph beat Leo in the movie, but he was letting his anger and strength do all the work, which helped snap Leo's katana

..but that same anger and strength was the very thing that made him lose against Mikey, who taunted him into defeat without lifting a nunchuck XD in 2003


...I don't know....I can't choose...it depends....

Raph is a better fighter than Leo, but that doesn't mean he would win...

[Leofan26]

If we are talking about the 2003 Leo, he had far more training and more leader ish skills by that time and knew how to use his swords, he'd train with them a lot. I know, I know I'm a Leo fan but I'm also going by what I know from the shows I've seen, I think Leo would have the edge.

2012 Leo, it'd be more close :)

[shredderhead]

If we are talking about the 2003 Leo, he had far more training and more leader ish skills by that time and knew how to use his swords, he'd train with them a lot. I know, I know I'm a Leo fan but I'm also going by what I know from the shows I've seen, I think Leo would have the edge.

2012 Leo, it'd be more close :)

You can´t say for sure if 2k3 Leo had far more training than this Leo or not :P hehe

[MsMarvelDuckie]

I'd honestly have to say Leo is "better"- at least all around. Granted, he lost in that fight, but that was mainly due to his shock at having his katanas snapped by Raph's sais. If he hadn't been so surprised and hesitated, he COULD have used that moment to regain a level playing field, and maybe even gain the advantage. But Raph didn't completely "win" that fight, either. He let his anger get out of control and almost killed Leo, which is why he actually ran off afterward. He realized what he was doing and how close he came to going too far. And I think he also realized that THAT'S what made Leo "better". His self-control. Raph's certainly stronger- that's never been in question, IMO- but his rage makes him weaker in many ways.

[shredderhead]

I'd honestly have to say Leo is "better"- at least all around. Granted, he lost in that fight, but that was mainly due to his shock at having his katanas snapped by Raph's sais. If he hadn't been so surprised and hesitated, he COULD have used that moment to regain a level playing field, and maybe even gain the advantage. But Raph didn't completely "win" that fight, either. He let his anger get out of control and almost killed Leo, which is why he actually ran off afterward. He realized what he was doing and how close he came to going too far. And I think he also realized that THAT'S what made Leo "better". His self-control. Raph's certainly stronger- that's never been in question, IMO- but his rage makes him weaker in many ways.

Raph did win that fight (completely).. What would have happened if something went that way or not, I can´t say. Raph did let his anger get out of control and almost killed Leo (like Leo could have done it if the fight had ended differently, they were both mess up).. The point is that Raph started that fight proving that is temper is not the most suitable for leadership (so you have a good point after all :D, but about the whole movie, not the fight) and by that he shown more then ever that he needs his brother Leo, because even not saying we can see that raph cares for his brothers too much..
The way he managed to express himself was by letting his anger rage him to fight criminals that he miss to do with his brothers (to run away from his real problem, missing Leo). The worst point of the movie is that its topic let Mickey and Don away most of the time...

[DaVinci]

I thought it was weird that Leo let that weapon lock happen. He knows how sai are used against swords. Why didn't he kick Raph out of the lock?

As for the poll, I voted Leo. He was winning pretty easily before he saw who he was fighting.

[BabyTurtles]

I thought it was weird that Leo let that weapon lock happen. He knows how sai are used against swords. Why didn't he kick Raph out of the lock?

As for the poll, I voted Leo. He was winning pretty easily before he saw who he was fighting.

true....but Raph's suit is kinda bulky....and seems harder to move in.

it probably made him a little slower.


(I'm not sure if it did....but thats what it looked like to me :D)

[Cipher]

While it's probably the best version of "Leo vs. Raph" in the franchise, it isn't really more conclusive than anything else.

Raph one, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's better, not only because winning one round of anything doesn't necessarily imply higher skill, but also because he was fighting with deadly aggression while Leo was not.

So, we don't know. The real winner is the audience because that scene is freaking beautiful.

[shredderhead]

While it's probably the best version of "Leo vs. Raph" in the franchise, it isn't really more conclusive than anything else.

Raph one, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's better, not only because winning one round of anything doesn't necessarily imply higher skill, but also because he was fighting with deadly aggression while Leo was not.

So, we don't know. The real winner is the audience because that scene is freaking beautiful.

I completely agree with you, except for the aggression part because that´s their style of fight, raph has a "deadly aggression" style while Leo doesn´t so that doesn´t seem like an advantage, it´s just their normal way of being...