OT 80's aside, preference: 4kids 2k3 or Nick 2012?

[CansecoBat]

Sorry, had to make this thread. I'm a new poster for those who haven't noticed, or I haven't gotten to introduce myself to yet.

I just got into the Nick series, and so far it's amazing. Does anyone else feel it is the best mix cartoon wise of the character, charm, inherent silliness, and humor of the 80's cartoon ... combined with the more adult and serious elements of the 2k3 toon without coming off as un-intentionally funny as that series did due to the melodrama?

I was a huge fan of the 2k3 show up until around Secret Origins, and then it un-raveled for me, and I started to see more of the shows glaring flaws. Which started to out weigh the positives for me. Does anyone else feel the same?

Which series do you prefer and why?

I know, as a fan you can have both. I'm not negating that option, but at the end of the day if a gun is pointed to your head and you're asked what one you like better. What contemporary cartoon will it be?

[Refractive Reflections]

First I would choose the 80s cartoon, but since I can't, I would choose Nick 2012 (primarily because of the hopeful potential I saw in it during season 1), but yet it's still unfair to make this comparison because we are comparing a 7 season series (4Kids) with a series that's just starting its second season (Nick).

While the story writing and action scenes are great with 4Kids, the one-dimensional characterization (with 2K3 Leo getting the serious development and 2K3 Raph and Mikey more pigeon-holed for more humorous, superficial aspects of the series), and the intense fighting/climatic scenes that can become humorously melodramatic are what set back the series for me. The melodrama deflates a substantial amount of the seriousness the series tries to convey. Yes it has its dark moments, but with this melodrama, the gravitas just seems more hollow and empty. :ohwell: In addition, I don't care for the "Ninja Tribunal" season, and the FF and BTTS seasons are... okay.

With the Nick show, it's still in its second season, so I can't make a fair assessment of the show so far. It does balance the drama and comedy well, but the content of the drama and comedy is becoming questionable. Unlike the OT which used witty, sarcastic humor, the Nick show uses loud/obnoxious/dumb behavior and overreactions as its tools for humor (i.e. Mikey's personality), some may like that, but I particularly don't.
As for the drama, the first season did highlight brother moments and aspects of their personality (i.e. Raph's anger, Raph helping to complement Donnie in front of April in "Operation: Break Out", Raph temporarily bonding with Fishface, Mikey's potential for being normally intelligent in "Parsitica", Donnie's tendency to overthink things, and Leo's growth in learning to deal with someone like Karai) which I enjoyed, but it seems now that Donnie's crush on April has gravitated to the center focus of the Turtles, while there seems to be a "mutant of the week" trend going on. What I thought would lead to substantial character growth for each Turtle, seems to now be compressing the characters back into their stereotypical, flat roles and a growing anticipation (and the show's implicit excitement) of creating new mutants over the progression of the established characters, which is making the show a bit bland for me.


For all I know, things could change in the direction of this Nick series, so again it's premature for me to make any conclusive statement about comparing it to the 2K3 series. Plus, we've seen how (in the OT and 2K3) the tone can change in 3-5 seasons within a series... So we'll see...

[Candy Kappa]

Nick is doing a fine job so far keeping me entertained

[ZariusTwo]

Nick TMNT just isnt for me, the characters are too jokey, are prone to making too many mistakes, the freaks of the week are poorly realized with rather uncreative traits and names, Karai and April teenagers arent really all that interesting as teenage girls and fall into the predictable beats associated with that, like angst, short-sightedness, and immaturity, which in April's case, just comes across as jarring and out-of-character. The Kranng are supposed to be this insanely badass alien race of conquerors but their mannerisms and dialouge make it impossible to take them seriously compared to say, 4Kids Ch'rell

No, 4Kids may have had it's flaws, and two lousy final seasons, but it kept my attention with strong writing, great fight scenes, mature characters, complex themes, less routine episodes, and truly memorable and unique realizations of Shredder, Baxter, and Karai that werent just routine Saturday morning villain like the Nick show provides.

[CyberCubed]

I love Nick TMNT, however I give the nod to 4kids TMNT.

It was the closest we ever had to a serious action show on the level of the best DC or Marvel cartoons.

[Guitar_Raph]

2K3 for Turtle Titan & Wayne Grayson voicing Mikey.

But in my heart (or heartburn to everyone else) I always liked Next Mutation for the costume, Mikey's Sewer Hour & Raph driving a motorcycle for the first time.

[LeotheLateBloomer]

2k3, once again. 2k12 is getting better but it still has quite a ways to go.

Don't we already have a thread on this subject. Why not include the OT, this time?

[NinjaMan]

I prefer the Nick version by a landslide. The Nick Turtles are much more like teens and likeable.

[Bossa Nova]

Definitely 2k3 turtles for me. I didn't watch the 80's turtles growing up and my sole exposure to them for the longest time was through the movies. So when I started finally watch the 2k3 series (the summer before the Nick show started), I really didn't know what I was getting into so my taste for the show really could have gone either way. Turns out, 2k3 turtles are VERY similar to how I imagined them in my mind, and while not everything created during that time was pure gold, I still absolutely adore it.

Nick turtles are sadly leaving me feeling cold. And I went into this show overflowing with hope that I would just love it. But half the time the turtles feel OOC, TOO young (I think some of you are forgetting what it was like to be a teenager), and at times just plain unlikable. April is way too lost for me at this point, and the plotlines feels repetitive and not entirely gripping. Nick turtles are still cute and all, and I'll watch them because they're the turtles, but unless the show does some miraculous 180, the 2k3 show will always get my vote.

[alliance]

wat..is..4kids??

[Jester]

wat..is..4kids??
Take it from a guy who's been told he's not funny...you're not funny.

[Drose18]

wat..is..4kids??

Whats ur problem?

[Leo656]

Take it from a guy who's been told he's not funny...you're not funny.

:lol:

But nah, why's this topic come up every week now? It's like "Hey man, 'Adventures of Superboy' was soooo much better than 'Smallville', let's all talk about it! Let's compare and contrast two shows that are technically about the same thing but so totally different in approach and execution and even audience that it really isn't very interesting of a discussion! And let's have it naturally devolve into, 'The show I like makes your preference look stupid because I said so!' And let's re-run it every week so the same people get to recycle their circular logic for the benefit of anyone who hasn't seen it in all the other threads."

I mean, I know it's gonna come up, but sh*t, SO much of this lately, and it never ends well. :ohwell:

[Shark_Blade]

Nick.

More relatable characters, OT influence, breathtaking CGI, kickass theme song, human Shredder and Yoshi, best Karai, upcoming perhaps the best Casey Jones (I'm loving what I've seen so far!), etc..

Yep, pretty much.

[Technogeek29]

:lol:

But nah, why's this topic come up every week now? It's like "Hey man, 'Adventures of Superboy' was soooo much better than 'Smallville', let's all talk about it! Let's compare and contrast two shows that are technically about the same thing but so totally different in approach and execution and even audience that it really isn't very interesting of a discussion! And let's have it naturally devolve into, 'The show I like makes your preference look stupid because I said so!' And let's re-run it every week so the same people get to recycle their circular logic for the benefit of anyone who hasn't seen it in all the other threads."

I mean, I know it's gonna come up, but sh*t, SO much of this lately, and it never ends well. :ohwell:


What he said ^

[Slime State Alumni]

:lol:

But nah, why's this topic come up every week now? It's like "Hey man, 'Adventures of Superboy' was soooo much better than 'Smallville', let's all talk about it! Let's compare and contrast two shows that are technically about the same thing but so totally different in approach and execution and even audience that it really isn't very interesting of a discussion! And let's have it naturally devolve into, 'The show I like makes your preference look stupid because I said so!' And let's re-run it every week so the same people get to recycle their circular logic for the benefit of anyone who hasn't seen it in all the other threads."

I mean, I know it's gonna come up, but sh*t, SO much of this lately, and it never ends well. :ohwell:

I don't care if anyone likes 2k3 over Nick, or vice versa. This is a discussion board. The point is to discuss. Complaining about people that want to discuss why they like the show/why they don't like the show seems silly. If people take it personally than that's their problem and they shouldn't be on the boards, let alone on a computer with an internet connection.

Going back to the topic at hand, Nick. It's fun, it's thought out, it doesn't take itself too seriously while still having dark elements, and it's made by show producers that understand and love both the source material and the OT. The casting is damn near flawless and the voice acting as a result is always on point. Hell, I even like the theme song. All of the aforementioned points I just made I can't say about 2k3.

[Jester]

I don't care if anyone likes 2k3 over Nick, or vice versa. This is a discussion board. The point is to discuss. Complaining about people that want to discuss why they like the show/why they don't like the show seems silly. If people take it personally than that's their problem and they shouldn't be on the boards, let alone on a computer with an internet connection.
Leo's gripe isn't with discussing said topic...but discussing it for the 100th time in the 300th thread.

[Leo656]

'Zackly. It's just so overdone lately and usually devolves into bashing, usually involving the same few people. Nobody's opinion offends me, either, but man, how many ways can we ask this question? Nothing against the OP or anyone else's opinion, it's just apples and oranges. Other than being about TMNT the shows aren't even very similar.

Put me down for 2K3, I guess? There's stuff I like and don't like about either one.

[BubblyShell22]

Yeah, I agree with Leo. We've had so many threads about this, and frankly, I think it's overdone to say which you prefer more. For me, I do like 2K3 up to the "Ninja Tribunal" arc. Anything after that was just horrible. So if I had to choose, I'd say Nick right now, though it's questionable since season 2 has just started and I really didn't like what they did in the first episode with Kirby.

[CowabungaMikey]

wat..is..4kids??

I agree, 4Kids did a terrible job at dubbing anime... One Piece 4Kids dub... Blegh.

But their TMNT is truly amazing. Almost as dark as the original comics, and with okay voice-acting. My favorite episode is Same as it never was.

I don't know which one I prefer. But I think I have to go with the 2012 show, because that's the show I'm following know. I was too young for the 2k3 show.

[RaphAndDonnie]

The OT is my favorite, followed by 2k12, primarilly for its ballence of lighthearted moments and seriousness. I do like 2k3 through.

[Redeemer]

I cant believe so many people are going with the Nick show over the 4kids show...... 4kids will probably be might favorite for along time or until they make a tv show based off the IDW series.

Nick show is good dont get me wrong, but Im 20 not a kid just dont relate to them like everyone else.

[Garfield]

Nick TMNT just isnt for me, the characters are too jokey, are prone to making too many mistakes, the freaks of the week are poorly realized with rather uncreative traits and names, Karai and April teenagers arent really all that interesting as teenage girls and fall into the predictable beats associated with that, like angst, short-sightedness, and immaturity, which in April's case, just comes across as jarring and out-of-character. The Kranng are supposed to be this insanely badass alien race of conquerors but their mannerisms and dialouge make it impossible to take them seriously compared to say, 4Kids Ch'rell

No, 4Kids may have had it's flaws, and two lousy final seasons, but it kept my attention with strong writing, great fight scenes, mature characters, complex themes, less routine episodes, and truly memorable and unique realizations of Shredder, Baxter, and Karai that werent just routine Saturday morning villain like the Nick show provides.

This is my sentiments. Granted, I really do like the Kraang.

And I don't hate the Nick toon. it just isn't my preferred version of TMNT. Its a fun cartoon to watch every now and then but if I take it as anymore than that, than I like it a lot less. I wont get into anymore details because I know I'd just tick a lot of people off, and I just don't feel like debating right now.

4Kids TMNT is a more preferred version.

[Andrew NDB]

Nick TMNT definitely. It's a far better crafted show and is consistently entertaining, even if it's not the "real" TMNT to me at all.

The 4Kids show is rather painful for me to watch. When it's good it's decent, but it's hard to watch pasteurized, bastardized storyline "adaptations" of Mirage stories in between all the ghastly fill-in stuff (Garbageman, etc., etc.).

[Pterobat]

Actually, we had a poll a while ago about all three animated series, and 2k3 made it just a tiny bit ahead of the pack: http://forums.thetechnodrome.com/showthread.php?t=43170

I'd chose 2003 in a heartbeat. I just prefer cartoons in a more BTAS vein, and subscribe more or less to the wisdom of a guiding force for works of media, in this case Peter Laird whipping the series into shape.

Plus, it gave me a lot of cool stuff, including the best Baxter Stockman ever, the underground mutants, Ch'rell, "Insane in the Membrane", Turtles Forever,

Sure, the series crashed and burned after season four, and the filler episodes were never that great, but the good outweighs the bad.

The 2012 series just doesn't do it for me. The strongest emotion I feel towards it is apathy. I'm determined to watch every episode 'til the end, and not to intrude into any threads to complain about it, but I'm just not excited over it.

[Jester]

I Like Turtles!

Seriously don't have a "favorite." It's all just different toppings on a pizza....and I LOVE pizza.

[CyberCubed]

The 4kids series had amazing episodes. Some of the fillers were dull but other that it was probably the best written of the 3 cartoons regardless of preference.

[ironman29758]

While I grew up with 4kids and enjoy their storylines plus how they adapted the Mirage Storylines but during Fast Forward I slowly got disinterested with the series

I prefer the 2012 version. It's a great meld between OT, Archie, Mirage and 4kids with a unique spin. I like their portrayal of characters. They each have fun moments and I'm more invested in the story.

[Slime State Alumni]

I cant believe so many people are going with the Nick show over the 4kids show...... 4kids will probably be might favorite for along time or until they make a tv show based off the IDW series.

Nick show is good dont get me wrong, but Im 20 not a kid just dont relate to them like everyone else.

I'm 26 and I love the Nick show. The 2k3 series was way too heavy handed and it came off as being too bland and melodramatic. Plus I thought the voice acting was pretty bad.

I love BTAS, but I would never put 2k3 in the same category as that series. BTAS had exceptional art direction, an amazing cast of voice actors, and really thoughtful writing. 2k3 had a very "early 2000's" generic look and feel to it, the voice acting was at times cringe-worthy, and the writing seemed overly convoluted and too dependent on adapting the comic stories but in a kid friendly way. Granted, it was way darker than anything shown on OT, but not nearly as dark as a lot of the stuff on BTAS.

[MsMarvelDuckie]

I went with 2K3, as it feels more like the movies/comics to me, and I loved the darker tone compared to the OT. (Which I STILL love, but let's face it, it WAS kind of goofy!) Nick is fun, but there are thing about it I don't like, such as the EXTREME dumbing down of Mikey, April being mostly just a plot device/love interest, and the Kraang. Their speech and generic appearance and apparent lack of any real threat factor just makes me shake my head. Shredder makes a FAR better villain in the new show than they do.

[tmntpower1988]

I prefer the 2k3 series. The 2012 series is still good though.

[MrPliggins]

Hate to say I'm not really feeling the 2012 series after watching season 1. Maybe it's because I'm 35 and it feels more like a "kids show". While it is entertaining, I don't have the urge to watch it very often. I know season 2 premiered, and I haven't even made an effort to watch it.
I love the throwbacks to other versions, voice acting, and even the animation, but the overall story just isn't keeping me interested. I do like the series, but I don't LOVE it like I did with 2k3 when it was originally airing.
However, it's really hard to say this early in the game what this show's legacy will be. I'm still interested to see what's yet to come, so I'll keep watching.

[Whatswiththeheadbands?]

Take it from a guy who's been told he's not funny...you're not funny.

Here's a good idea. Why doesn't every single member here put alliance into their ignore list.

Or better yet, we should get someone to ban him.:evilgrin:

[Red Mask]

Nick has great humor and great action that flow with each other smoothly. I think it's the best written and has alot of...heart, I guess? But 2k3 is great, and I still get alot from watching it. I like its slightly more serious tone as well as the action, but it does attempt jokes and humor a good amount, and for me it almost always falls flat in that regard. Nick wins for me, it and the Mirage comics are my favorite Turtles incarnations, but I still go back to 2k3 about as much as anything else Turtles related.

[pannoni1]

I'm going to say personally Nick, due to the nice mixture of 4kids and OT influences since I'm partial to the OT much more than 4kids. It also comes at a time where the toy sales look to exceed those of 4kids' peak, which is quite remarkable since Playmates hasn't aired any commercials after the first wave. We get pizza back, one of the original voice actors full-time, and much more. I do miss the 2D animation though that the 4kids series provides and the fact that the story is much more sudden and faster-paced. But if that show provides Mirage adaptions, I'd rather just read the originals.

[Slime State Alumni]

I went with 2K3, as it feels more like the movies/comics to me, and I loved the darker tone compared to the OT. (Which I STILL love, but let's face it, it WAS kind of goofy!) Nick is fun, but there are thing about it I don't like, such as the EXTREME dumbing down of Mikey, April being mostly just a plot device/love interest, and the Kraang. Their speech and generic appearance and apparent lack of any real threat factor just makes me shake my head. Shredder makes a FAR better villain in the new show than they do.

Oh man I LOVE the way the Kraang talk and the fact that they have a hive mind. Rather clever way of combining the utroms with OT Krang.

[CyberCubed]

I wonder if after the hype of the Nick show dies down and we look back on it years later if it'll be as loved as it is now. It was the same with the 4kids show, and people only noticed its flaws after it ended.

[Krang100]

I like more TMNT 2k12 toons. Because the dark elements are turned down. The only dark element is Shredder and his two mutant minions.

In another hand, i prefer April, Karai, Raphael and Mikey 2k3 over 2k12.

April and Karai are already adults in 2k3, in 2k12 are teen. Raphael in 2k12 is a Jerkass, even surpass Raphael 2k3. Mike 2k12 is a lot more dumb. Beside, 2k3 is more close to Mirage Comics.

[Fjaj]

I like 2k3 better -

I like how it had a lot more focus, and a lot multi-part episodes. Nick has had 2 two-parters so far, while 2k3 had 3 two-parters and 2 three-parters in season 1, more if you count the mouser episodes.

It seems like they try to cram too much in some of the episodes - like they're specifically avoiding having any multi-part episodes. (Mutation Situation could easily have worked very well as a two-parter).

Also, I don't really like the "Big-Footed" art style. Most of the character designs leave much to be desired. The only one I can say I like is
Leatherhead's (Aside from Stockman's afro.)

I also like the characters in 2k3 better. Leo and Raph are OK, but Don is too wimpy and Mikey too stupid. I'm not a big fan of April either. I can put my finger on it, I just don't like her. I was kinda hoping she'd get mutated in Mutation Situation (not very high hopes, of course.)

Same goes for the villains - especially Stockman. Like Don, he's way too much of a wimp, and I REALLY hate the whole "mispronounce Baxter Stockman" thing. I hope the fly mutation will improve him at least a little bit.

The Kraang are okay, and I like their speech, but a lot of the things they do seem stupid (especially when they're fighting.)

I hope we'll get some story arcs in Season 2, especially with the Foot Clan (Return to New York!) - they seemed underdeveloped in Season 1.

I hope they get at least a little "out of this world" (or at least NYC). 2k3 definitely overdid this aspect (One of Laird's few drawbacks), but t think a little would improve the series - diversity always helps.

[gunstarheroblue]

I like 2k3 better -

I like how it had a lot more focus, and a lot multi-part episodes. Nick has had 2 two-parters so far, while 2k3 had 3 two-parters and 2 three-parters in season 1, more if you count the mouser episodes.

It seems like they try to cram too much in some of the episodes - like they're specifically avoiding having any multi-part episodes. (Mutation Situation could easily have worked very well as a two-parter).

Also, I don't really like the "Big-Footed" art style. Most of the character designs leave much to be desired. The only one I can say I like is
Leatherhead's (Aside from Stockman's afro.)

I also like the characters in 2k3 better. Leo and Raph are OK, but Don is too wimpy and Mikey too stupid. I'm not a big fan of April either. I can put my finger on it, I just don't like her. I was kinda hoping she'd get mutated in Mutation Situation (not very high hopes, of course.)

Same goes for the villains - especially Stockman. Like Don, he's way too much of a wimp, and I REALLY hate the whole "mispronounce Baxter Stockman" thing. I hope the fly mutation will improve him at least a little bit.

The Kraang are okay, and I like their speech, but a lot of the things they do seem stupid (especially when they're fighting.)

I hope we'll get some story arcs in Season 2, especially with the Foot Clan (Return to New York!) - they seemed underdeveloped in Season 1.

I hope they get at least a little "out of this world" (or at least NYC). 2k3 definitely overdid this aspect (One of Laird's few drawbacks), but t think a little would improve the series - diversity always helps.

2k3 for me .
I agree . while the 2k12 series does alot right, It misses on quite a bit of points too.
they keep shoehorning the whole donny April thing --meh.

If i was Donny, id be looking at ways to improve my main weapon from breaking , why is it that hes never tried to modify his Bo Staff?
I guess hed have too much of an advantage over his bros and enemies when if he went full "batman" on his opponents.

The enemies leave alot to be desired, i understand its for the young kids----
maybe thats it. just kids 4 and up - the next gen will dig the goofy designs. Sell that TMNT Merchandise.in which its just flyin off of the shelves, and thats all that matters i guess.
the "Big calves to feet" look arnt my thing either,
even though sped up for some decent fight choreography still look clunky on almost every character, and most of the cg faces just dont cut it.
most of the enemies (other than shredder) dont pose as much of a serious threat as there was in the 2k3 series, and as much as I try to like the new April, her new teenage thing just isnt doing it for me.
enough old man Gripes from me. ive vented enough ha.

I do like what they did with Splinter by making him a younger version and a total boss though.(when he wants to be)

[Gonstead]

2k3 TMNT, definitely.

2k12 TMNT, while not bad per se, definitely has it's problems with me.

1. The CGI can tend to look a little too cheap, especially around areas where there is a lot of water. The water itself doesn't blend all too well with the character models and makes them look like two completely different blends of mish-mashed CGI.

2. Shredder and Splinter - I feel that they are pretty underused. Also, I really don't find the 2K12 Shredder that much intimidating. Has he actually done anything other than sit on a throne and 2 fights with the turtles?

3. Too many filler episodes. I don;t mind a little filler every now and then to let the story breathe for a bit but I found myself skipping quite a bit of episodes which had no real relevance to the story and barely missing out on anything that happened before.

4. The whole Don x April thing. It's a line that should NEVER be crossed in any form of official TMNT fiction.

5. The theme song - Why exactly did we need a RAP of all things?

6. Is it me or does the music seem a bit uninspired? Not quite energetic enough and perhaps a little too quiet.

[Icebot]

Definitely 4kids for me, mainly because of the animation. I'm not that much into the CGI type and I grew up with the 80's toon and I'm used to the animation of the 80's and 2k3 shows.